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tv   The Stream 2017 Ep 182  Al Jazeera  November 15, 2017 5:32pm-6:01pm AST

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during a visit to the saudi capital last week the iranian president hassan rouhani is also accusing saudi arabia of meddling in lebanese affairs turkey's presidents in doha for talks with the cattery m e a wretch up typer the one has been a major supporter of doha since june when four arab countries cut ties and imposed the blockade on tuesday that the saudis that bloc had no desire to end the crisis the us secretary of state has called for a credible and impartial inquiry into the rangar crisis he's met a young son suchi in naypyidaw he described the scenes of what happened to the rating at the hands of the security forces as horrific six hundred thousand have fled to neighboring bangladesh the un has renewed its arms embargo against eritrea but it says previous restrictions may have been violated by the u.a.e. and foreign arms companies u.n. monitors say saudi arabia and the u.a.e. have a military presence in eritrea as part of the campaign against the rebels in yemen
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using eritrea as a base is not a violation but the u.n. is warning that any weapons falling into the hands of the country's president would break the embargo australians have a guest to same sex marriage and a change in the law is expected soon more news on the web site al jazeera dot com up next is the stream following that come here with the great i will see you tomorrow bye bye. documentaries that open your eyes at this time. hi i'm femi oke a i'm like a bailout and you're in the stream live on al-jazeera and you tube today it should be illegal for american companies to boycott israel now state governments across the united states have vowed to protect israel's economic security but could so no
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make his commitment to one of the us is closest allies ultimately compromise free speech this b.d.s. movement is in many ways more frightening because what they're saying is they're not making a physical attack they want to make an economic attack and it's not just radicals who are willing to build tunnels they're going to mainstream businesses across the world to generate a corporate. a corporate anime is real and we cannot allow that to happen here or. if you boycott against. you if you do thank you you will be going. with the program thank you thank you thank you very own. sank you thank you very.
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well that was new york governor andrew cuomo in june announcing his decision to prohibit state agencies from participating in the palestinian lied. sanctions movement or b.d.s. but critics of b.d.s. say it unfairly targeted israel and in the past two hears at least twenty other u.s. states have adopted similar measures paralyzing companies accused of activity by pass an anti b.d.s. legislation is also being proposed at the federal level drawing shot condemnation from civil liberties union rights groups who say such laws violate that free speech by criminalizing st have a listen to what. to say at. this or perceives b.d.'s as having have very serious strategic impact on its entire regime of oppression because that's where and as well as we do see the south african president as very important we see the u.s. civil rights movement and the power of boycotts and that movement and affecting
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serious change at academic level the cultural level and increasingly i think anomic level of israel's isolation is increasing around the world they see the writing on the wall and so do we is that an observable fact that statement that israel's isolation is increasing all the absolutely why else do you think israel treats p.t.s.d. as a strategic threat and allocates hundreds of millions of dollars to fight the movement music that intelligence services and dictating policy to some governments that they want to punish people as activists threatening churches and trade unions and social movements and solar. so what are the consequences for supporting boycotts of its businesses joining us to discuss in chicago we have team a highly she's director of palestinian and legal which specializes in the protection of palestinians solidarity movements levinson is the chairman of the new dress in israel commission hi there mark and i did say that fosters cultural and
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economic cooperation between new jersey abby israel from dallas texas charles pullman is an attorney and founder of why israel matters that's an advocacy organization i don't set we have to do it now josh is the policy director at the u.s. campaign for palestinian rights however what he's got to having here. b.d.s. has been going on for quite some while now i've read decades what do you think its impact has been what do you know its impact has been on israel well d.d.s.'s many elements to it and anything that is legitimately free speech and is a free exchange of ideas between students business folks educated successor that's all fine b.d.s. is not about that the b.d.s. movement is primarily its goal is to diligent in my state of israel and really eradicate the one jewish state in the entire world but our legislation and the federal legislation is not about that the federal legislation charles and others
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can talk about that like comment is well new jersey legislation we're interested only in economic and business conduct there is nothing about free speech in our legislation we have so we focused on a limited boycotts of companies do business with israel and free speech there are no prohibitions on free speech or legislation not you wrapped up your entire argument in about forty five seconds well done for that but i was really curious about what the impact of b.d.s. has been on. well the fact is that israel does see b.d.s. as a threat and that's because it's a growing movement it's a human rights movement it's a grassroots movement and it's a wait for people of conscience to make a difference on this issue that has been completely intractable our us government i'm conditionally supports israel in all that it does it's now fifty years of
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military occupation seventy years since the refugee crisis started and so people will want to do something about it and this is a non violent way of making collective change so the fact is that where we see israel and its allies. understanding that these kinds of movements can make a difference just as the boycott against apartheid south africa made a difference just like the montgomery bus boycott so let's make made a difference i would expect really important to see that that this is that intention that boycotts are artefact political change on this issue deem i was so let me just disagree there are multiple avenues to express oneself there are numerous countries in the world iran turkey sudan except for there are all human rights violators somehow the b.d.s.
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movement is focused only on israel i'm sure you're aware that palestinians in israel have levels of educational attainment literacy medical care per capita income that really seeds those in almost every other arab country so and actually landmark that there are sixty laws that discriminate against palestinian citizens of viscera you cannot deny the longstanding human rights violations that almost any human rights organization has very well documented and i thank you. that palestinians had not had not achieved freedom equality and justice in their structure let's talk about it this is how the second wave of opposing opposing israel's longstanding occupation and the united states has unconditional support for it so demon mark i want to go with tara i'm going to start to see you charles but i want to get in there because there's a tweet out from someone this is for this in mind who echoes really what mark you
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started out by saying that pro israel authorities are afraid of b.d.s. he says because they think the movement hi to the ultimate goal of undermining and dismantling the jewish state but he goes on to disagree with that notion he says i think the b.d.s. movement is the most ambitious empowering and promising palestinian led global movement for justice and rights and has a capacity to challenge israel's colonial rule he says and apartheid he also says and a morally consistent effective and intelligent manner so charles i want you to weigh in here this is a nonviolent means of protest what do you make of it well why don't we why don't we go back and talk about what the real aim of the us if you look at what b.d.s. campaign has published and it's three the first one is that what it calls the colonialization of. all arab players it doesn't say the west bank it doesn't say gaza it doesn't say the golan heights all your plans because the palestinian
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leadership considers all of israel to be. if you really drill down into what b.d.s. campaign is about it's about enduring israel as a jewish state and nine the jewish people their own sovereignty in fact i have heard the founder of s. state students for justice in palestine here and i was at a meeting i attended where he spoke where he explicitly said he's not in favor of two states he's only a paper of once that. what b.d. has unfortunately doesn't seek is to improve the lives of the palestinians and to see peace between the israelis and the palestinians so that the last thing the east and justice and equality for both people in their region of the world so now that we've talked about what it is our audience has a better understanding of the two sides of that debate i want to move over into a point raised by our guests a little bit earlier into the legislation and the federal act that could
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potentially impinge on free speech some say this is what the a.c.l.u. has to say about that have a listen last seeking to suppress boycotts of israel are deeply misguided and unconstitutional from the montgomery bus boycott to campaigns to divest from apartheid south africa have played an important role in this country's history and in one thousand eighty two the supreme court made clear that political boycotts are completely protected by the first amendment the state cannot penalize people who participate in b.d.s. campaigns simply because it doesn't like their message. so josh these laws that are seeking to suppress boycotts freedom of speech issue absolutely because as was noted by the american civil liberties union and brian in that video the supreme court of the united states has ruled that economic actions to affect social change are protected forms of first amendment political speech so when we hear advocates
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of the anti b.d.s. legislation say oh well we only want to go after business activities not political speech business actions are of form of political speech and what we're seeing in congress today is some of the most draco new legislation on any issue ever introduced in congress because the federal israel anti boycott that would actually imprison individuals for up to twenty years if they are furnishing information to or it vance saying the objectives of an international organization boycott what as you look like right it's everybody this is not what this legislation is in response to is the u.n. next month in december will be putting out a list of israeli companies based in illegal settlements in the west bank in east jerusalem and global corporations that are complicit in support those settlements so what this legislation is trying to do is trying to punish anyone who supports
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the aim of this u.n. list and basically attempt to legitimize israeli settlements and take away our right as civil society actors to use every non nonviolent means in our disposal to try to end israel's human rights abuses that your we just that's not correct at all i'm not sure which supreme court case you're referring to in the well if you don't bush and the first quasar american they are going to write but clear board was a complete prohibition on free speech and boycotts the legislation issue both federally and. in new jersey the state i'm involved in we're prohibiting economic conduct there is no prohibition on free speech speech any business can hate israel any business can hate whoever they want what they can't do is they can't discriminate in the conduct of the a business if you discriminate in the conduct of your business that is prohibited and the supreme court and and a whole number of state legislative efforts have clearly stated that that is
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permissible to prohibit can i add something that i did so it should i never have the same to get from i was so i wouldn't stay up to speed the same speed that we're at and just show you something here from the jerusalem post it annoyed becomes the first state to list company sponsored business due to b.t.s. so there is. a movement among certain states in the united states for them to penalize anybody who said that you know us movement when did this start to happen the state legislation to i'll come back to because i know you're very relevant to this as well i just want to just baby step our way through this. when did this start to happen when did states start to have anti b.d.'s legislation. well we originally saw anti p.t.s. legislation after the american studies association passed an academic resolution in two thousand and fourteen since then we've seen twenty three states now actually
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enacting this kind of legislation and the fact is that the legislation. look to kansas for instance each each state has slight differences but. the legislation imposes blacklists they are actually having states looking at people's political speech to dermott to turn to determine whether or not they boycott is some states have requirements that people who contract with the state certify that they don't boycott israel this is an ideological litmus test on state benefits i said we're talking about as you said you can a teacher who can take an education and then he has already come straight to you know there are if there wasn't some were not absences he didn't is one example then gemma come right to you david no one example is a teacher at powell finish up well the teacher who is. who the a.c.l.u. is representing who filed a lawsuit can't engage in a teacher training program because she decided based on her church's. why can't
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resolution that she is boycotting her palestinian rights that is one of the whole time for a moment so we we've had you open i've had a child she's a little doing it and you're also going to explode at a single day to hide it or will that just i need to correct something to address that the federal bill that's pending is simply an extension of the export of ministration our it was passed in one nine hundred seventy nine and the penalties that george mentioned that have been in place for several years and the export of ministration there has passed in response to the airport so just outside down a little bit just explain to me how it is the boy caught at the idea behind it is to do. simply the ok ok it is take stand the existing law that's been in place since nine hundred seventy nine two boycotts called for by the international organizations including that you do it and they and the european union and that's
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all it is it doesn't it isn't a new law it is an extension of an existing law because of the and i semitic enabling legit resolutions that are being passed unfortunately today by the e.u. condemning israel for everything under the sun and they are going to cry yes and i have to say that i care now that the existing law had actually some success again let me just interject just so that i can help everybody out and keep following this so there's a free speech meant about the right to boycott there's also an argument it's not to talk about that let me clarify and the other thing that i mean let me finish my sentence is also not all right about b.d.s. being i want some magic markets may not. well i happen to believe that b.d.s. is anti semitic i believe its goal is the eradication of the state of israel the one jewish state in the world but i really don't want to focus on that in this
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discussion i want to focus on the legislation which there are too many missed statements going on here with the legislation let me talk about new jersey's legislation which i was primarily involved with new jersey's pension funds contain about seventy five billion dollars worth of assets the trade relationship between the state in new jersey and the state of israel has averaged one point three to one point five billion dollars over the last seven or eight years there is a fundamental economic basis and rationale for the state of new jersey to want to know that companies that want to receive investments from the new jersey pension funds are not boycotting one in new jersey's most reliable and valuable trading partners there's an economic reason and rationale for it and that's what the legislation is based on the legislation does not prohibit any free speech i may disagree with demon and josh on what goes on in in israel or what goes on in
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college campuses and we can have that debate another day i'll be glad to come back but on the issue of this legislation and the federal legislation all it does is it prohibits boycotts of israel you don't have a right to boycott israel and then say i demand to have the state of new jersey invest in me and it's no different i'll just say one more point here it's no different it's called the source of the nation again if you have that land raisers it's cause i've never seen one that it is i don't know why she was there and i made his eyes are boycotting israel and let's have a lot of conversation on our way from moscow how straight toward it mark i read in the expression jod listen i said it may i finish my point you are not allowed in the united states of america or in the state in new jersey you cannot discriminate against citizens based on the color of their skin. based upon their religion based upon their ethnicity or based upon their sexual orientation you cannot require a new jersey to invest in
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a company that discriminates on any of those bases you jersey are addressing. let me ask you what your stature has been to me and let's be clear about this jury as you know it is that your strawman is sort of going to just because i can't get everyone's talking at each other it is how i am just going to jump in and i am just saying i'm tired of everybody how tight for a moment we're going to take us so i'll bring you the send because there's a lot of use like this is adam he says this seems like an obvious breach of the first amendment another person who would agree with him stephen shalom of a member of the jewish voice for peace says we oppose the recent anti b.d.s. legislation for two reasons one because the laws violate our basic constitutional rights and to because they are designed to help israel carry out its ongoing oppression of palestinians there is someone who pushes back against that though this is your gene he's a professor at northwestern university school of law he says these state laws aren't on a constitutional just as a state can say that it won't do business with companies that boycott people
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because of their race or sexual orientation mark just as you were saying and indeed many states have such rules they can also say they consider boycotts of israel to be an impermissible form of discrimination josh that argument when you make of it well first of all the professor from northwestern is actually an israeli settler who has written a lot of these. bills that are fundamentally unconstitutional so i would take what he says with a huge grain of salt but this is not about discrimination this is about taking moral action in support of human rights the fact that there are jewish people who live in israel is immaterial to the discussion it's not about the religion of the people who live there it's about what the policies of that government are toward the palestinian people and for seventy years israel has engaged in a separate and equal regime of apartheid. against the palestinian people b.d.s. is nothing more than a moral response on behalf of globally concerned citizens led by palestinian civil
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society to redress that injustice and to try to ensure that palestinians are finally denied their long long they finally achieve their long denied rights and won't you know i do and i'm really yes but illegals are designed to do is to try to quash the movement to try to take the heavy hand of government and to tell american civil society that you can boycott this but you cannot boycott that and that is fundamentally antithetical to our constitutional right. when the supreme court case in the eighty's a clear board did not grant a blanket first ever right or clear born in fact involved black citizens who were boycotting white businesses who were discriminating against the blacks and that's all what journalist constitutions of my day all say and what i am someone like because i'm ready to tell someone if i also came because revealing this is an
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international audience and so you know i want to talk about theirs yes and let me just say this with you set some blackness a boycott supporters. kind of because i want that. no i don't even know what that headline means israel is not setting up the un is setting up a black. b.d.s. is setting up a black this i can show it to you they publish it but let me talk about texas variable because what texas said was that if you engage in this criminal jury business conduct with regard to israel and a business is engaging in their conduct in the state of texas there's no obligation to do business with you and it's simple not just you know does it hold on hold up wait wait it's just about little c.l.a. when wait let me just finish out terrorism passes and is not treated now i think yes i'll say finish up quickly tells me something we've got less intimidates left in the centex texas legislation to not ban b.d.'s it doesn't ban hate speech it doesn't ban boycotts people are free to engage in and they have in fact palace i'd
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legals website even acknowledges they can continue the boycott all it says is a state of texas hold on that state of texas has no obligation to support a business that is engaging in blatant discriminatory and i semantic acts towards an ally of the united states which is consistent with federal law so i want to just want to play this video because i want to get our community and this is one more example from the state of maryland this is kareem. particularly after the maryland state legislature failed to pass anti p.t.s. legislation this past summer it was absurd for governor hogan to issue an executive order preventing state entities from doing business with churches or community social services groups because of their position on israel if this is a discrimination based on political beliefs than what is by issuing this executive order status boycotting the boycott or making it very clear that the state of
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maryland is complicit in israel's violations of palestinian human rights. they might just about thirty seconds to answer running out of time what comes next. this what comes next is this is your leap political speech that we're talking about we have got to protect our rights to engage in these kinds of boycotts to affect social political change which is exactly what the supreme court case that was referred to. so we have got to go into a post this kind of legislation that infringes on our ability to act collectively where our governments are refused to do anything about the fifty year old talking about he is able to imagine anybody here in just i was talking about and. we talked about being in and out of it. it's a delight to have you on the under house and just say it's amazing how fast the show goes when you've got veteran people debating an issue we really appreciate you
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talking about b.d.s. and. general registration and you come from different perspectives on this i'm reading present your different perspectives i have the last comment to you tube live so for us as companies and people to be allowed to make decisions that are in line with their value you'll find many and i always online at hash tag thanks for watching everybody. is hosting the international primary health care conference two thousand and seventeen under the title healthier communities brighter future from the seventeenth through the nineteenth of november two thousand and seventeen primary health care corp the first step to your family's health. the new era
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in television news. and those inside it is a toss to do things in secret that are unless we had actual victims who had survived torture detention and saying this was the cause of my arrest if you would . just stay but would you have stood by this conviction that everyone has a deep reservoir of common but a to have if you give them the opportunity and wonderful thing stopped to look at the actual distance there's at least twenty thousand or hinder refugees who live here we badly need at this moment near the ship until president hosni mubarak has resides donald trump is going to be the next president retaliation we're back out again go back she finally canisters of gas subsidies to be doing that best to prevent the behavior getting anywhere in the skip recorded. by having me achieve something that never happened before.
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