tv Inside Story 2017 Ep 330 Al Jazeera November 28, 2017 2:32pm-3:01pm +03
city has been holding talks with me on mar civilian leader on sun sochi but the head of the roman catholic church did not mention the word rohingya a military crackdown has forced hundreds of thousands of rohingya muslims to free me i'm all for neighboring bangladesh in what the un has described as ethnic cleansing. were not by phone those who released but the. peace is based on respect and dignity and the rights of every member of society and for every ethnic group and its identity to be respected under human rights and the democratic order no individual or ethnic group should be excluded everyone can offer a legitimate contribution to the common good and the great work of reconciliation in the national integration of religious communities and their differences must not be a source of division. at least nine hundred people have been killed in syrian government is strikes in eastern go to the assad government has increased strikes ahead of the eighth round of geneva talks they were meant to begin on tuesday but the government
delegation says it will not arrive in geneva until wednesday and the french president has called on europe and africa to increase corporation to crack down on trafficking groups and money and people smugglers need to be penalized he is in burkina faso us part of a three country africa tour those are the headlines on al-jazeera inside stories next. the protests then the resignation of government in pakistan has stepped down after days of destructive protests and accusations of blasphemy it was organized by a new political movement so how powerful groups like this is inside story.
hello there and welcome to the program i'm nora caro protest leaders in pakistan have cooled off a three week capsule after a government minister resigned it was a victory for the protest leaders who'd been demanding zite hammad step down over the wording of a palm entry they accused him of blasphemy the ministers apologized saying it was a clerical error. pakistan political boss he led by the scala hussein lisbie says the change in wedding represented a softening of the state's position towards the mahdi set were banned from identifying as muslim in pakistan in one nine hundred seventy four so lots of the scuffs with our guests in just
a moment but first this report from come on and islamic law. this is the epicenter of a protest that began twenty two days ago but it was the borstar damned by the government security forces deployed to protest that intersection called fred. that changed everything the writing then spread across the country for him the law minister daughter dying but educated few know tens of thousands of supporters are now gathering at this point which will be remembered for a long time to come and ignore judge the law minister i've already paid a price but did it not getting predicted them against their country didn't do your minister who had failed to deliver and fair to saw that problem it sure did it or dysfunctional government in islamabad it cannot control anything and it all. gone mostly in league now why it's going to dig heavier direction from what
happened here they're going to lose support and hard line which are the point drop robbing it seems it may be the beginning of the end of the ruling party. atmosphere. blasphemy is a highly contentious issue in pakistan and there have been a number of high profile cases in recent years since one nine hundred ninety at least seventy three people have been killed over alleged last with us according to an al-jazeera tally in april michel khan was stripped beaten shot and then thrown in the second floor of his university dormitory after being falsely accused of blasphemy. the who's a christian was convicted and sentenced to hang in two thousand and ten after an argument with a listening woman over a bowl of water two prominent politicians who tried to help her with both assassinated she remains on death row and have been many bassman latest attacks
over the past few years forcing some minorities to flee the country. well it's now talk to our guests here in doha interviewed achmad an investigative journalist and academic in lahore joining us via skype akhmed rushy to rise to an author on the book taliban militant islam oil and fundamentalism in central asia and in london nadia relief and protection manager at amnesty international a very warm welcome to all of you thanks for being here with us on inside story first was give an idea of what's actually happening in pakistan at the moment where the protesters may have ended their citizens but are they going to be coming back out onto the streets. well i think it's. much deeper roots that the question of religious tolerance. the government apologized about the role. that it took a change the wording. to learn about. the
cumulation a program to build up to the election next year. in the. mental part. of the corporate military united of course but there's a lot of speculation that some of the party that been. military particularly. the leader. of a militant group that piped in kashmir i was responsible for the mumbai probing into. it made great from her correct and. it will be starting a religious movement also. group. this country by protests you know actually.
in. the room. but the number of people. so maybe if i started to get an idea of her students and the things if this group is so small and such a fringe group how do they manage to be so successful how does it manage to hold seize to islamabad in other cities for three weeks when the ruling party's policy since it took over the government has been to wait out the crisis they would not handle the friend his his his. cabinet ministers would not handle the situation and would not address the issues then just read it out and try to find where around it and that's what didn't work previously and it didn't work this time as well but now there will be a cost be a huge cost which will basically impinge on backpacks on was to make no odds
future showing in the elections and even in the build up to that it may cause you know desertions within the party and it will be. of course pakistan was to make the mass has still some time to going to continue doing till the election date is announced and the term is complete it's really a dysfunctional government and it hasn't been able to address much of the issues that we are facing recently will look more at the impact this is had on the ruling party in the government just a moment not here first of all that was able to bring you in here because a sense oblivious protester about this change to the electoral law whether or not that was the protestors endgame is something we'll also look at but just talk us through why these changes course so much upset. the change was as you know relating to the end of the cause or it was relating to.
an amendment to the election law in pakistan and it caused a lot of upset because it was seen as though the government was softening on its on its. take on the image the issue in pakistan now it didn't have very much to do with the blasphemy laws but the blasphemy laws were used as a ruse to spark up religious sentiment and that's what the really dangerous thing around everything that's happened in the past three weeks and a little bit longer has been is that the blasphemy laws as we know have been used. by religious by a religious parties by a lot of different people not just against religious minorities but also against the. largely sunni majority in pakistan also and they have been used for political reasons have been used for religious motives they've been used for personal motives but now we have seen that on
a very large scale they have been i know that you know i was there she had said that it was a small protest and it was but the ramifications of it and are very very very big i just want to know whether the government was actually trying to soften its stance on the bodies because they're not recognized as muslim in pakistan was the government trying to take a small step between the towards being more inclusive more tolerance. it's very difficult to say what the reason was for the change the government has said that it was a clerical error they've issued they've started an investigation into why the changes are took place and that's one of the things that were signed upon in the agreement that the government signed with the protesters today they said that they would release a report of the inquiry so it's very difficult to say what the reasons were but whatever those reasons were that they don't give a religiously motivated by a land group the right to hold an entire capital hostage in many ways i was in
islamabad myself a few days ago where there was a massive lockdown it was very difficult to enter but from rather twenty or thirty of an old road twenty there were massive road blockages people couldn't go to work people will stop from going to the hospital and a little child also died because he couldn't make it to the hospital in time he was he was caught up in the in the traffic jam caused by the protest so this kind of holding a country to hostage for and demand and issuing threats against citizens of the country against sitting government ministers it's just an exception unacceptable and it shows that the government was unable to essentially uphold rule of law and it sets a very very dangerous precedent in terms of what might follow it essentially shows that the government is weak the state can't enforce its writ and that anybody can essentially just come and use a blasphemy laws as a ruse and and and hold many people hostage i mean the law minister stepping down
it's a big absolutely i mean we all say situation where are we where we think groups like this holding the government or whom ever they choose to hold where the justice ministers or just individuals on the street to ransom using the blasphemy law. yes but i think you know much. remember bill are two of the ruling party of grimaces lot is the prime minister to resign minister and i didn't. really nation a minute. the same group trying to get i'm not permitted. to reside and i didn't back to the demonstration still continuing because they want the minister to regard. only a. shop will. be well i really.
don't know a lot of pressure on the guy on the box or even particularly still the acting head of the ruling even though he's not prime minister. to about election. the problem is to wait until. there will be elections. which he'd like to do in a large group meet you try to drag out. the political opposition the religious. state and the military to wait that long. they won't come to an election. presumably. to fight election looms you've been doing the build up of the good and the military is an interesting point i want to bring that and none of it in the army spend most of sunday negotiating with the government before getting involved in that thing the
protest as why was it so hesitant first of all the military. primarily has been tamely spread out and they were careful to go and gazing in another front which is many domestic secondly the divine never. political government invokes military into domestic issues they would look at it from a national security port perspective and for them this china pakistan corridor is a vital. security issue that they have to deal with particularly regarding down south in baluchistan did did some of the concerns were genuine some of there were that the political government cannot make military escort a scapegoat for the problems that they don't address over the past and diet term the police that they were trying to use was ill equipped the moralize don't properly trained and there was no strategy then the government goes on and switches
off blocks all the televisions gentles tells them not to air anything they go off at the same time social media so all of these things were creating pressure on the military to deliver and be seen as part of what's going on and military wants to stay clear of this political mess on one side the open and sort of the critics will say no military was behind it they were trying to instigate and they were there was a pat on the back behind these fringe group which of course i agree is a very small will not have a major impact on. for itself but eventually destroys the whole. scenario for pakistan in future so they did their decision was that we would not be engaged in a situation where there could be bloodshed and they could be remick of it and if occasion for militaries on image which has been busy with visited stan and also in baluchistan and also at the border on india actually if we have.
we government a weak willing posse can peel them and rely on the military support well i think. according to. the government because of the million to restore. you know taking over without imposing martial law everyone. you know exactly what the minute. i mean they went. to protest. but the military. backed. government and deeply annoyed the government will. if you like. i mean the government had to come.
up with not. particularly humiliating because it included the recognition of the limited the release of all the productive police that erected. i think government will have to pay for all the damage. to the local in the structure. conceded anything they want everything that i didn't mean for you many a thing. now you are always saying a rise in popularity for these hardline religious groups yes and i think what's also really worrying is i mean yes as emma said a lot of it is linked to the elections it's a lot of it is linked to the growing popularity of these groups and also the take down of the pm and then government but what's worrying is how the government is peddling has been peddling and agenda that actually assist them that actually helps
them along so. the government ordered that on the behest of a high court judgment from islam that all blasphemous social media material must be taken down subsequent to that text messages were sent across all its citizens saying that saying that if you if you read any blasphemous material that that it should be reported now this kind of thing is very unhelpful because essentially what it does is that it gives power to vigilant moms' it gives power to people like the groups protesting to take the law into their own hands and we've seen this happen time and time again except it the frequency is now growing we saw this and. as we also see and you know amnesty is recorded this extensively that once somebody is actually accused of blasphemy it doesn't matter if the accusation is correct or incorrect the mere accusation is going to land that person
and his family and his lawyers and anyone else associated with them in a lot of trouble. and. the dangerous aspect of this the government doesn't clearly realize but this is now haunting the government itself the law minister you know that will be provided with security and with protection and along with him with his family with anybody who protects him but this is a larger problem and the government should tackle these laws. immediately because unless that happens more and more space is being given to these groups by actions that they've been helping that they've been helping to order it this intolerance is going to be the the law minister at the tail pier of this group the process of the protest said that it would not issue a fatwa against the law minister is he safe that's a big question mark i don't think he's safe i don't think whatever he has he has sent out a video message and that many it just needs
a couple of weeks to go in somebodies property and through all and set it alight that's it and then life for him will not be very secure they should basically as my colleague in london was saying relates with the village part of the political parties today. ha meant to morrow they could be done himself or somebody else from the people's party are imminent and sparty and vendée are in a position they try to take leverage out of these controversies and would not really gather in the parliament and it vent inside the parliament the only issue that is concerning is protecting whole bugs and doesn't do much with saudi arabia and hurt iran because there is a lobby but in general the issues that really concern a common man do not get of a collective voice within the parliament for example this issue should have been addressed right after michelle was killed in the shower but this this did not
happen and it continued to linger on and we saw a major mission by the blockade and the image issue and exports and all that like everything was it was lost and on party which is the ruling party suffered there is no political you know of consensus within the political parties that these are the issues we need to handle above a beyond political benefits and point scoring. i do agree with that is there anyone in pakistan that is willing or is trying to keep this sort of rising extremism in check well you know something like the back to me lurked frankly nobody really i mean the army made it clear. to. anyone. you know again. i mean i do remember. after the killing i think i'm. ready. because the bodyguard accused the governor. shot him. really. well.
and later i think. this group arose. and. if. many are blind to. it do you really. think. nobody would really take a. body being accused of. that and the problem let me a political level we don't have a single politician willing to really stand up and be counted on. the middle class if you like. middle class educated people are left. any. objection to the type of exchange. where all the
moderate voices in pakistan him the more to voices are not represented in political parties every political party comes up with the same kind of faces every time and there is no real democracy or representation of people and still the election laws need reforms the election process needs defining and the media needs to. or and follow up the story and that has been the tragedy partly to being a journalist i can say that after michele there was not enough pressure from media on. the stood to really ensure that the elaborate process of police reporting and the way it should be if there is a blasphemy reported it should not be a you know if there is a sin mechanism that is never in place and just that if you are socially is seen as a blasphemer one has to be feminist to face the consequences that could be enforced that the procedural issues are not in tact not being enforced and eventually people
take it in their own hands that's why moderates that ever they are they are trying to divert trying to participate in political process but there is no political way as for example imran khan's party which was seen as a clean party justice be illegal whatever it has got the same faces from the other political parties baptized by imran khan and then now they represent his party which is just the same minus imran khan all parties are the same so there is no such voice for the moderates who really understand and who pay the price common man in the street pay the price paid the price who could not go to work who could not open his shop so not i do you fear that we're just going to see a pakistan that grows more intolerant i do fear that is it's been a very depressing and very. i mean i'm very sad today to see the government
completely capitulating to the demands of these protesters as i was coming in to the studio also heard about money being given to these protestors by the military i think that. was of the rangers i'm not sure either of the two but one of one of the things that that is really worrying is the fact that these blasphemy laws are in place as you know my colleague in doha said it's true that at the moment it's a be a man and government it could be someone else it was a p.p.p. government with samantha's here a few years ago it could be anyone else and while some government minister somebody meant areas might agree that the blasphemy laws either need to be amended or the procedures see it was need to be put in place a little bit more strongly so that the misuse of these laws can be can be curtailed they would actually go ahead and make these amendments in law and policy because if they feel for their lives if
a full of things like what has happened in the past couple of weeks happening to them so it's really you know it's a really tricky thing where you have but you may have some people who are on side who believe that these laws need to be put in place where citizens of the country need to be protected but they're not been interested in x. and those are the consequences we can see that quite clearly many thanks to all three of you for joining us today for this discussion we will have to leave it document here in the studio i can't rush it and the whole i'm not in london. and thank you too for watching you can see the program again any time by visiting our website that's al-jazeera dot com and a further discussion to go to a facebook page that's facebook dot com for slash a.j. inside story you also join the conversation on twitter at a.j. inside story from me and the whole team head by and i.
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