tv Inside Story 2018 Ep 84 Al Jazeera March 25, 2018 8:32pm-9:01pm +03
if he doesn't appeal will have to be extradited within ten days if he does appeal then we're looking at a process that could last around about two months it would be highly unusual if extradition is refused between two european countries germany does have to decide whether mr putin mom will get a fair trial if he is sent back to barcelona and one would expect that that will be just a formality and that he will in fact be be extradited at some point and all the headlines hundreds more rebel fighters and civilians have been evacuated from the syrian region of eastern ghouta government forces a close to controlling all of what had been the last rebel stronghold near damascus following a month long offensive. just one group jaish al islam is still holding out and they are believed to be close to a deal now as well al shabaab has claimed responsibility for a car bomb that killed five people in somalia several others were injured in the blast which happened near the parliament in the city of mogadishu the united
nations is calling for an end to a brutal war on children in yemen it says the number of severely malnourished yemeni children has doubled over the course of the three years civil war both saudi arabia and iran who backed different sides in the conflict been accused of blocking or delaying humanitarian shipments. and the victims of friday's shooting spree in southern france have been on a palm sunday mass in the town of treb families of the four people who were killed sat in the front row for this over the top stories much more coming up in the news hour in twenty five minutes time inside story is next.
leave now oh you'll be jailed israel's ultimatums more than forty thousand african refugees the move to expel them prompted thousands to protest in tel aviv so the deed poll taishan is a case of national security or a racist agenda this is inside story. welcome to the show i'm sam is a band israel has until monday to provide further details of a controversial plan to expel thousands of african refugees mostly eritrean and sudanese to a third african country the supreme court set the deadline earlier this month suspending the deportations meantime on saturday more than twenty thousand people took to the streets of tel aviv to protest against the mass expulsions the united
nations also criticized israel for its hardline approach prime minister binyamin netanyahu has said the flood of migrants was worse than quote attacks by sinai terrorists the refugees are being offered three and a half thousand dollars and a plane ticket to leave the country or they face being locked up indefinitely a final solution that will take the refugees inside israel and gives refuge to everyone that meets. the. israeli government is doing nothing ok. to please people in this room amount in sound a little everyday. they don't give a little world. they don't give them every little. any. education and health i think it's safe to say.
let's bring our panel into the show then we have joining us from tel aviv money in hot on an asylum seeker from sudan an activist at the african students organization in israel also a student at the hebrew university in jerusalem studying economics and political science from jerusalem on skype gil hoffman a knesset insider and chief political correspondent at the jerusalem post also from tel aviv whites and a human rights lawyer and one of the petition is in the historic supreme court case challenging israel's anti infiltration law welcome to you all if i could start then perhaps with the money what happens then march twenty sixth monday the deadline expires for the government to respond to the petitions against deportations what happens then hi thank you for having me so there's only two choices in the world there so i'm seekers has to choose to go through that too
indifferent to jail or to be or to be deported to the third country saw which was of them are very difficult options because. no one wanted to go to jail on the second option is the surge country the problem is with those countries is that the they're denied to have such agreement was there was israel to do receive african asylum seekers we have already know the consequences of those who have been deported or those who are introduced to both of those countries they had to flee again to seek for a save countries saw so i you know some of you worried money your own fate might happen come monday paracel enlarged but as as as a person who fired for his own people yes i'm so worried because those stars those of sudanese are
a trance or if it is who could face this two options. that's really painful for me ok let's take the question perhaps to our south is there really no other third alternative money and said that people might be facing on monday the choice between deportation or jail is there no chance perhaps that this can end in a different way where we certainly hope so otherwise there will be the protest within yesterday in public outrage against this very bad policy and racist policy. but before the jail and the deportation to the fair country what will happen is that people thousands of people will lose their visa people have to renew the visa two months or four months and no they will not be able to do the visa because they're supposed to leave to wonder which is so called the failed secret country if there is an agreement with and if they refuse to go because one day is not safe for them because one that doesn't record as having any we're going to say they're not giving them any rights they may face the loss of their visa not being able to we
knew it and then not being able to walk and maintain themselves and this is sadly another option that is on the table. but we certainly hope i hope in winning hope that we will be able to stop this you to kill us ignore in full policy what how do you hope you'll be able to stop it then i putting your faith in public pressure and action or in the courts. intervening to stop this policy everything is connected with another option by the way if a wonder will say no if one that will say we are not accepting people from detention facilities would refuse to cope with policy that hurts our borders the african asylum seekers in israel this will put an end to this to this attention and deportation policy so we beg plead to wanda not to cope with the detention and deportation policy is really saving this is one option that option is that they in the public pressure the international pressure the international community and the public pressure here in israel will make a change because i think we started to see a shift we started to see people like
a barrier to myself until and that and else saying maybe that kids will be deported in the first stage and people who came to israel as man or worse and grow up in data in your study in the u.k. should system you will not be deported as well and more and more groups hopefully protected for the time being from the deportation but we have to keep pushing because we have to keep to put to put pressure with the international community with the public opinion and also the courts yes because what is and is doing is against international law you know it and they should have commissioner for refugees say it loud and clear that this shows this a is against international law because one they denying having any agreement with israel because they've been so secret and because people that are shipped from is that have no safe and legal status in the countries they're shipped to or i'm going to come back to you in a moment assaf to pose to you the counter opinion to the suggestion of israel is doing something illegal but before we do that has to go to gil he might actually do
that for us i want to get your perspective gil on whether you think government policies starting to change on this issue as a result of some of the public protests and public pressure we've seen so first of all i want to clarify or not a spokesman for the israeli government and the producers tried to get a spokesman for the israeli government to come on the show for that perspective and that won't be here i'm a political analyst and yes the government. it's checking various different solutions to this problem no one wants there to be crises and people hope that the muni in the end his friends are going to be ok but they enter the country illegally and this country has a responsibility to make sure the people who are citizens and the people who are in this country legally will be employed they don't have a responsibility to ensure the people who have heard the country illegally will be employed and take jobs away from the poor people of this country so while i'm certainly not a spokesman for the israeli government i understand the political realities
netanyahu represents the likud party which is a party that traditionally represents the israeli underclass and so while there is pressure there was a very large rally on saturday night in tel aviv tel aviv is seen as kind of. disconnected from the rest of the country in many ways and and not really a place that is the base for the likud and the people who are the likud does record on television are people who've lost their jobs these migrant workers or have their neighborhoods that don't look as good as they used to look because of the migrant workers so there's so much internal pressure within the likud party on the politicians on the right to expel these men were having been talking about children the very beginning only about the actual men migrant workers not people who are married not people lay down roots that i still think that the bulk of the expulsions so we'll let that happen all right let's take that point back to
a salve if you look at the statements of some of the government ministers like the minister of education of taliban and he says the government will give asylum to refugees and only job seekers are going to be deported what's the problem with that policy defenders of the government might argue every government has to take care of its own people and security so it is so there is no problem with that. or maybe the only problem that is that it's not will. he is it has less to have percent of the population as a something else thirty seven thousand people the vast majority of them are coming from sudan and editor was that islam is not deporting people to the kind of origin because of the situation of the human rights violation and genocide in darfur in the nuba mountains and a dictatorship so israel if there were more king migrants as netanyahu and bennett are saying there could be shipped back to their countries of origin but if it is going to go under as a failed country as a safe and cuddly so-called is the first evidence that we are dealing with refugees
and asylum seekers and of walking migrants the second evidence is that a coalition with some underworld i mean asking a so all old organ the same goes for the needs and the local mission rates are extremely high over seventy percent and eighty percent of the delicate mission of asylum seekers in israel is less than half percent only twelve people out of sixty five people that came in you do for them to have and for the seven thousand that are here to day work on us as a few g.'s it's less than health percent of the health percent that is here anyway and when you look at the war you see significantly higher recognition rates so all that i have coming to is in on the general if it is not coming to everyone else so again it doesn't make sense and we should treat the problem as if these if we were dealing with migrant workers they would be shipped back to the comes forward and if we are dealing with refugees and asylum seekers from a return to done they should get their rights according to refugee convention here and now one of the lies is that it's because of economic because they take jobs or to poor israelis but the fact is that most of them are walking jobs that is ladies
refused to do like clean dishes or less thought and pains and so on and even they slowly government when it decided to deport them at the same decision decided to take more people in from the philippines and other places to compensate for the loss of mental will they quit body deportation saw even this is a pure and obvious lie all right so a lot of issues to pick up on their on before we do that can i go back to money just to put. this in perspective and tell us a little bit about your story did you enter the country quote unquote as the term not that we're indorsing it illegally did you flee violence and come as a refugee tell us a little bit about what you've gone through to make it to where you are today yes saw a i will answer this question and also i want to talk to us to want to reply to to our politico analysis from draws on that he said we are the country illegally.
there's only has to protect his own people on his own borders i agree with that but none of this claims are one of the standards of a general convention. to like nor if india has to be legally then you will get protection because once you are you are fleeing your country you are does looking to us save players and you are not you are not even thinking to have documents or papers so i would like to serve like first of all my only story i as our wives. like it was really a miracle that there survived when the jungle with militia attacked or a village that time i was twelve years all this was the first time does because i was born to a sudden a cynic group in darfur after then when i got accepted to the adversity i became to
to be a political activist again as though. the radical islamist. government in sudan on my my life was really in danger actually they wanted to to arrest me there as many of my friends loading my brother and that's the reason i flee i fled my country i don't care you to allow me to present you going perhaps that's your hosing argument that some might say well you went through a horrible experience but you were able in the end to be processed through these israeli system and to stay in the country is the system not working are we over exaggerating hyping up the issue of deportations if people who do have legitimate reasons to be in the country like yourself can be allowed to stay or do you say to that absolute yeah actually of the claim of the government is that all of us are not refugees and all of us all of us are not asylum seekers but like they ever not
checking or asylum seekers i ask for for example i asked for my asylum seekers five years ago and one month no actual five years and one months i arsalan i asked for my asylum in two hundred five of of march two thousand and thirteen and up today i got no response. and they're not saying even if i'm a refugee or not saw you know it's it's a bit rude ridiculous to say that no one is is is an asylum seeker or no one is or if it is once you are not answering their asylum request saw. ok let me let me get the perspective of a who i point out is not a government spokesperson we know that gail but just to get your perspective because you do have a slightly different one perhaps than some of the other panelists on the show it doesn't come down to this issue of whether the government is just simply labeling
too many people as job seekers regardless of their situation so sammy drills interest rates bureaucracy and it's unacceptable that doesn't only affect migrant workers or asylum seeker affects everyone in this country will suffer from it and this is just one example of it and yes there is a process where the people are asking to be labeled refugees if they are and go through the legal procedures and that's going very slowly and so these protests if they have any impact at all look at perhaps have an impact on making sure that that process will be expedited but you don't hear any example there is a particular targeting of people who come from the african continent compared to people of european descent who come from other parts of the world and whole so may have so we say visa issues. you don't see the particular targeting i mean just to give an example the figures from the u.n.h.c.r. . according to a november seventeenth statement two thousand and seventeen said quote there are
some twenty seven thousand five hundred eritrean seven thousand eight hundred sudanese in israel and since israel took over refugee status determination in two thousand and nine only eight eritreans and two sudanese have been recognized as refugees by the authorities the statement went on to remind israel that it's a party to the nine hundred fifty one refugee convention is there not an element of targeting perhaps you know how about the bureaucracy is some people seem to be suffering from it worse than others while you know certainly those numbers are terrible and i myself have asked questions about those numbers to the politicians in order to get answers. and what they've told me is that the numbers with the jordan georgians and the ukrainians are quite similar that you've got twenty thousand georgians and ukrainians that are last couple years have been expelled from this country and they're as white as snow so it's not an issue of race.
and people who say it's an issue of race or just trying to hurt israel ok it's not an issue of race i'm wondering assaf there when perhaps government officials senior religious officials make statements as the prime minister did comparing all saying that a flood of illegal migrants from africa was worse than attacks by sinai terrorists all the sephardic chief rabbi itzhak you're also of stoking control the see when he referred to black people as monkeys does that add up in the public psyche to create a very different environment for asylum seekers from the african continent. so i think that in this league are these really similar said lee similar to other countries race is an issue in many countries and black people have more difficulties than than white and here they have difficulties not only being black but also being on jools in a jewish state a and walking with an asylum system that is not functioning on purpose if you ask me but definitely not functioning and everyone can agree on that
so the combination of not being able to ask asylum and get a response in a reasonable time and be taken as a refugee as an any idea based on the ward being blix who can easily be you can easily identify them and they can be identified what creates this political tension because we have tripled the amount of african asylum seekers that held just illegal undocumented walking migrants and that extended the reason stayed over to the visa but nobody's talking about i mean the media in nobody's making a big deal out of feet and yes the kolo is an issue here also if you're suffering from racism in some issues and it's well known and it's said but it's said to him feel disconnected from the races in my eyes and not in accordance with the oddity but the issue here i think more than anything else is that israel is not a following there is a future convention and the obligations we took on a no sense because we i mean underworld we have the biggest crisis that if you
question since the second world war was sixty six million asylum seekers of displaced people and in islam we have less than fifty seven thousand of them and only twelve now were ten few months ago were there can as a few jews it doesn't make sense or it's not because of iraq was the ok of policy ok we've got about four minutes left so i want to try and give two minutes to each of gil and many will go ahead and i want to say something in just a couple of minutes sure i mean you brought up extreme things on one side extreme on the other side of the people who are. at the rally that there was a holocaust survivor was comparing the what the people have been through the migrant workers to the holocaust and. you know that's just an extreme way of getting their point across and i don't think either side is particularly helpful in persuading the masses when you make these kind of extreme arguments i think that it's much more persuasive when you have money and people like him explain their side and then you have people on the other side like ethiopian immigrants to this country who say i've lost my job because i was only willing to work for minimum
wage i was only willing to work eight nine hours a day these are people who are moving to work sixteen seventeen eighteen hours a day for half of minimum wage and it's just not fair and and point to other countries that have taken much more extreme steps countries in europe donald and what he's doing we don't need to be a comparison in israel brecht britain for another reason including the refugee issue is leaving the european union and they're taking far more extreme ups israel's choosing between peoples and handling the situation the best way possible as hard as it is. ok the best way possible israel is handling the situation i'm curious to get your take on that money do you feel particularly demonized and some of the people that you speak to because they come from the african continent or of african descent yes actually. this is. yeah this is this is true but
i would like to say like we've fled such atrocities like genocide honest and a cleansing in sudan where the government of sudan is killing innocent civilians without nor isn't just because there are african origin for me i can't compare what israel is doing and what our government is doing back there but again i would like to say like israel is is a democratic country a modern country and they really can protect us until we will go be able to go back to our countries and i would like to say like we saw actually the government the policies of the government to work towards us. which are really unfair. they're the only hope that we have as a as african asylum seekers in israel is this really public because from here there's a huge difference between the government policies and the israeli citizens they're actually non-racist i mean there's really public there are amazing people on
the demonstration of yesterday actually prove that they are. like thousands of israelis who support the being of asylum seekers in israel who are supporting. to have. and clear our policies toward asylum seekers on another side we have like the unfair government policies towards us because the question is. what's like what's going on in sudan or editorial is it a normal this is the question i ask always because no one can ignore that what is going on in darfur or noble mountain or blue nile is a normal situation there's a dorsai going on there so there's well it's country should give us a ride to live so it should give us. a bit degrades of human being or or if
it is and i guess the they have the ability to do that thank you or write in a fascinating discussion but i'm afraid we are winding down now so it is time to end the show and thank our guests very much for their participation money in her own gill hoffman and our staff whites and and thank you too for watching you can see the show again any time by visiting our website al-jazeera dot com of a further discussion head over to our facebook page that's facebook dot com forward slash a.j. inside story you can also join the conversation on twitter handle there is at a.j. inside story from me sam is a bad man the whole thing in here for now is go by. my .
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