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tv   Newsnight  BBC News  January 5, 2017 11:15pm-12:00am GMT

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you're a foreign country outside it and you conclude agreements with the european union if you want to and it wants to. also tonight, jill saward who died today made history when she waved her anonymity as a rape victim so she could re—educate britain'sjudges. leading lawyer helena kennedy talks about the difference she made to the law. and this. we mustn't be late for the six o'clock whistle. whistle sounds band plays remember when a day's work actually came to an end? would you, too, like the right to disconnect your e—mail after hours and just relax, just like in the good old days? that's what the french have decided to do. can we really go back to all that? do we want to? good evening. the appointment of sir tim barrow as britain's eu ambassador was designed to calm the waters after the turmoil of his predecessor's abrupt
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resignation and harsh words about the government's muddled thinking over the brexit negotiations. but what about the other side of the negotiating table? is there clarity there? until last week, jonathan faull was britain's top man in the european commission, who worked closely with the eu's chief negotiator michel barnier — he's been speaking to our political editor nick watt. what's he been saying? jonathan faull has been an eu lifer until retirement and he has put some questions over the uk core calculations for the brexit negotiations. as we were hearing, he has said he doesn't believe uk can buy privileged access to the single market. we reported a few months ago that senior whitehall officials were eyeing this idea because the uk cannot accept the core principles of the single market which is accepting free movement of people and the jurisdiction of the european court ofjustice. whatjonathan faull is saying,
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you are either a member of the single market, in which case you accept its rules, or you are a foreign country and you negotiate an agreement. in the second case he's also casting doubt whether the uk can place and that the brexit negotiations will begin —— casting doubt over the uk assumption that the brexit negotiations. he says david cameron made that calculation and at what happened. but he says that michel barnier believes in defence cooperation and he will want to have some sort of embrace with the uk. you have been following the appointment of michel barnier, what have you learned? interestingly, michel barnier is quite relaxed about what is going to be a nine—month delay by the uk in triggering article 50 and his view is, thanks very much, plenty of time for the eu 27 to get their ducks in a row,
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and i also get a sense from brussels on mixed views on this idea of having a transitional deal to tide the uk over when the divorce negotiations are over. so ivan rogers resigned this week, of course. it gave him such a headache. there is an appetite for a transitional deal in brussels, but massive strings attached, you would have to abide by those core rules of the eu in that transitional period. i've been talking to friends and former colleagues of michel barnier and this is my film. a venerable tradition is enjoying something of a renaissance in europe. the grand tour has been revived as the eu's chief negotiator on brexitjourneys from capital to capital to agree a common front. in contrast to the agonising in britain which lost its eu ambassador this week,
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michel barnier has so far achieved rare unity on his travels amongst the remaining member states. he will want to be constructive no doubt, but he will want to secure the best possible deal for the 27 member states of the european union. a deal which maintains their integrity and their fundamental principles governing their internal market. but who is pitching up in those eu capitals? is michel barnier a european federalist out to punish britain or a deal—maker who will work hard to avoid a train crash brexit in which the uk falls out of the eu in a disorderly fashion? well—dressed, utterly charming, speaks beautiful english, everything is right about him, apart from his views on the european union, but i thinkjean—claude juncker picked him deliberately to not see
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sense and to play hardball with the united kingdom. newsnight has embarked on its own more modest grand tour of europe to find out who the real michel barnier is. his story begins in his backyard in the french alps where he organised the 1992 winter olympic games, one of his proudest achievements. to the paris elite the olympics marked him out as a mere provincial politician. he was not a traditional french politician and he had not been to the right schools and even at times they were a bit sniffy about him. and said things, he's a ski instructor or something,
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as if he didn't merit these high—leveljobs. perfectly plausible, given our national differences, in a british cabinet, in a job like a ministry of transport. i'm not being condescending, but you know what i mean, he would not be home secretary or foreign secretary, although these days... within a few years of his triumph at the olympics he made his first mark the european stage as the europe minister. he made some useful acquaintances. michel barnier hails from the gaullist tradition in france which is suspicious of what it regards as the anglo—saxon world view. but he is no die—hard gaullist. his brussels breakthrough came
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in 2010 when michel barnier landed one of the biggestjobs in the european commission as internal market commissioner. this gave him oversight in the city of london, prompting howls of outrage. frenchman, city of london, he will be out to turn it into rubble, but of course he didn't. dealing with him, in the aftermath of the crisis, very keen to talk about the failure of anglo—saxon capitalism, because he knew that played well in continental europe. two years later when i was leaving the treasury, he was more aware ofjobs and growth, and when you started to put arguments about regulation and the impact onjobs and growth, he got that.
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so a very sharp politician. to some, the silver haired and suave frenchman had a rather high opinion of himself. some british ministers or people who have dealt with him thought he was rather vain and i remember someone comparing him to david mellor. saying, walking down the corridor in the treasury he would stop and look at himself in the mirror and comb his hair. his track record in brussels and as a leading french politician made him the natural choice as the european commission's chief brexit negotiator but his appointment prompted fears that britain would have to negotiate its way out of the eu in french. ever the diplomat, michel barnier addressed this in his
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first public outing. english or french? since that appearance, jean—claude juncker has embarked on a nifty bit of brussels footwork to have michel barnier upgraded to become the eu's overall chief negotiator on brexit. crucially he is of the project, he is a true believer in the religion of building a united states of europe. he is the man they will trust. i wonder, is he looking to get the best possible deal for german car manufacturers, french wine producers, who so badly need the british market? is he going to say, we are not worried about exports, we just don't want to be seen to be giving the british a good deal because if we do that other countries will follow? one of the most senior brits to have served in the european commission questions the idea that theresa may will eventually be able to sideline
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michel barnier and cut a political deal with angela merkel if she is re—elected. we should look at the negotiations which took place before the referendum where some similar thoughts were expressed and turned out not to be fully realised. the fact is, they will decide. they will decide. we must hope that we can get as decent a deal as possible but it is ultimately going to be decided in paris and berlin and the other member states. jonathan faull is doubtful about one idea doing the rounds in whitehall. can you buy access to the single market? it is not something which is on sale in that way and i find that rather extraordinary. you are a member of the single market as a member of the european union or you are a foreign country outside it and you conclude agreements
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with the european union if you want to and it wants to regarding the way in which your goods and services and capital and people move around. or you don't and you have a few international rules which apply and that is it, that is the choice to be made by both sides. but the veteran brussels official who has just retired after 38 years service believes the uk does have one card. michel barnier, you should remember, has done a lot of work in recent years on defence and strategy issues and he believes the uk is absolutely crucial to the defence and security of europe, the continent. and franco british cooperation in defence and security matters is extremely important and he will want and all europeans will want a way to be found for that to continue. for michel barnier, the grand tour
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will come to an end this spring when theresa may triggers the formal start of the brexit negotiations and at that point he will find himself across the table in brussels from his former europe minister can spot david davis. in private david davis believes there are two michel barniers, the hardliner who frustrated the british approach in a meeting last year, but they are expecting him to be a flexible deal—maker when the negotiations are underway. one of his oldest political allies warns britons to work hard on building a political relationship with him.
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but who will do nothing to undermine his cherished european project. over the past 30 years, many women who have been raped and particularly those whose ordeal made it to trial, have one woman to thank for improvements in the way that sexual violence
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is dealt with by the police and judicial system. jill saward, who died today as the result of a stroke, was the first rape victim to waive her anonymity. aged 21, she suffered terrible sexual violence at the hands of two men who broke into her home, a vicarage in ealing, west london. she had no problem being described as a rape victim, saying that it enabled her to challenge politicians to work for change. her case was also infamous for the remarks of the judge mrjustice leonard who opined that the trauma suffered byjill saward "had not been so great." this after repeated rape and anal rape. in a moment, i'll be speaking to the qc helena kennedy aboutjill sawa rd, but first here she is speaking tojenni murray four years after the attack. they held a knife on my chin. i'm not sure whether it was a carving knife or not but it was a relatively big knife, held it on my chin. and said that he was going to cut my throat. did you believe him?
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no, not really. i mean, i was trying to calm the situation down by reacting the way i thought they wanted me to react, not arguing with them, not protesting. but it wasn't the blade edge of the knife that he had. and it was on my chin and i thought, if you're going to cut my throat you're not going to get very far with a knife on my chin. and i could be that flippant, because it didn't really seem very serious then. yes, ok, it was a burglary. it wasn't very nice to be burgled, but we'd live, we could cope with it. when did it begin to be serious? it began to be serious when man two took me upstairs and bought me into this room, the spare room, basically. and told me to undress. he called me a slut, slag, bitch, cow, things like that.
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i turned off emotionally. because i knew that was the only way i could get through it. how do you do that? just let my body takeover and function as a machine. i don't know how you create a barrier, but i did create a barrier where everything turned off. and has rarely surfaced again. there are a couple of times when there must have been emotions still there because i could pray that i wanted to get through it alive. and pray that i would still be able to have kids. you're being forced into a situation where it should be loving and totally giving. you just have nothing, absolutely nothing, you are stripped of everything you've got and you are forced into the situations and to do things that are totally alien to you. and to do things that you have no control over. and because it's a power struggle, really, more than anything.
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the man wants the power. and takes that power. and you have no control. helena kennedy qcjoins us. how shocking was it for people to hearjill saward give her own testimony? because they pled guilty. at that time, in 1986, we were still having trouble getting this taken seriously as we wanted and this was an example of that. whyjill saward was so important was that she really nailed this thing, the chap that only committed burglary got a much higher sentence than those who had committed
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burglary and had raped her. as she was presented as having survived this trauma intact and presented a good face to the world, somehow it was something that should benefit those who committed the crime. the idea that property offences carried heavy sentences compared to the rape of a woman. the idea of waving anonymity. that was incredibly courageous. in one way, you could say that her life was not taken over by the rape but it was defined in some degree by it. it couldn't ever be less traumatic for other women but she meant that there was more support for other women. some survivors of rape who do talk about it, who do go public, they feel that it becomes the defining thing,
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and they don't want that. in a way, she accepted it in some ways that it made her the person she was. it was important that she gave voice to what she had experienced. she actually phoned me at the time i was interviewed because i was one of the voices that was heard on this subject at the time because i was very unhappy with the way the court was dealing with women in the criminaljustice system, she heard me speaking on the radio about it, or television, she phoned my chambers and i called her back. she wanted to know what she could do to help with the campaign. the thing i was very keen on was that we should have proper judicial training. judges did not understand this. he really didn't.
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probably ten years later, in the 1990s, after i had become a queens counsel, i did a murder trial in front ofjohn leonard. sometimes as does happen when judges are on the circuit, he invited us in to have lunch with him and his wife at the end of the trial and he said to me, you gave me a hard time over the vicarage rape case. i said, well, justice leonard, it was because i really did feel that the judiciary were not understanding this at the time. he said, i got it wrong. that was the interesting thing. he should have said that in public. i wonder about the question of anonymity. we go backwards and forwards. is there a sense if women spoke out more it wouldn't feel like a different crime? something that has stigma around it.
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just a straightforward act of violence. it is an act of violence that is more horrific because it to pieces something we keep for intimacy, keep for something precious in our lives. that is why it has that other dimension to it. for those who are raped, mainly women, i know there are male experiences and children, of course, but it is mainly women, they feel it is partly about humiliation. jill wanted to campaign about the level of sexual assault because she was forced to do other things. other things were done to her. it wasn't just rape in the traditional sense. she was forced to have oral and anal sex. she wanted that changing definition.
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of a burglary and so on. for many women, it happens in privacy. they may have been drinking. so all the other things around often militate against the woman getting justice and we have to do something about this business of saying that some women are worthy and others are not. we have to getjustice for all. thank you. how does president obama leave america on the world stage? in the run up to the inauguration of his successor, he's been trying to cement his legacy. today, he sent a letter to the american people. in it, he highlights some of his foreign policy achievements, including the withdrawal of most us forces from afghanistan and iraq,
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the building of a counter—terrorism capability to take on is and preventing foreign attacks on us soil. so, how strong is america's military power and influence after eight years of president obama? here is our diplomatic editor mark urban. this was what obama's surge in afghanistan looked like up close in 2009 — but it, like the drone operations he ramped up in neighbouring pakistan, claimed lives, but hardly turned
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