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tv   Squawk Alley  CNBC  November 21, 2016 11:00am-12:01pm EST

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over to you. >> definitely a national story now, jackie, thank you so much. it is 8:00 a.m. at snapchat headquarters out west, 11:00 a.m. on wall street, and "squawk alley" is live. good monday morning, welcome to "squawk alley," john ford, kay kayla tausche. roger mcnamee, good morning to you. facebook today, mark zuckerberg detailing the social network's plan to fight fake news. in a post over the weekend, "the
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problems here are complex, both technically and philosophically. we believe in giving people a voice, which means erring on the side of letting people share what they want whenever possible. we need to be careful not to discourage sharing of opinions or to mistakenly restrict accurate content." but the goal here, roger, is to somehow label fake news as such, work with fact checkers. can this be done? >> you know, i believe it can, but i think, carl, it's not a complete answer. i think a big challenge that facebook faces is that the underlying principle that it uses to run its algorithms is people are the best, you know, your friends are your best source of information, that you want to use your friends to filter the things around you. unfortunately, there's an unintended consequence that comes from that model, which is people like to hang out with folks who have similar points of view. and over time if you only hang around with people who believe the same things you do, your point of view becomes much more
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rigid, and that will be true even if your point of view is about something that's demonstratively false. so what facebook has been doing unintentionally is to re-enforce this sense of enclaves with common views and then making those views more extreme by essentially filtering out everything that didn't conform to your friend's point of view. and that's a fundamental problem much bigger than fake news. >> and roger, this is john, so it seems that also part of facebook's problem is that it's relying on our better angels, kind of this idea we're going to rely on individual users to point out fake news. we're going to trust that people aren't going to necessarily spread fake news, but their fix, reading between the lines of what zuckerberg is saying is they are going to find new ways to flag what's not accurate, make it easier to do that to say, hey, this story is fake, i'm going to alert facebook.
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also they are going to be more stringent about related articl s s standards. right now the junk i see, it runs the entire gamut. is that a good enough fix, or do they have to employ more technology or maybe even more actual people? >> so, john, i think that is precisely the question, because i think what we're dealing with here is that people actually like facebook the way it is, because it makes them comfortable. you know, there was a time not so long ago when there were, you know, shared values and common information sets. the days when walter cronkite did the evening news, pretty much most of america had at least no matter what their perspective on politics, there were some things everybody knew to be true, and now we do not have that, and so i think no matter what facebook does, because it's re-enforcing these so-called filter bubbles around people, that, you know, even if we tag all the misinformation, you can't really get away from this principle where facebook's
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economic model is built around re-enforcing people's biases, and, you know, that is a political challenge for the country, and it's not just facebook. let's be clear. step back for a moment. technology broadly defined has made this problem worse. it didn't create the problem, but it's hard to imagine trump getting elected if facebook, twitter, and google hadn't operated the way they did. you know, again, i don't blame them. i simply say they made -- they effectively provided the infrastructure that extremists use to enflame opinion and create perceptions that were not accurate. >> they say it's not their job to meddle in people's views, they are just the conduit for people to share content, but is there a bigger problem of these companies not responding, not acting until there is really widespread outrage? >> well, you know, kayla, that's a great question, because i think the challenge that we face right now is that, again, people are super comfortable with being
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around people who don't disagree with them. and -- or people that agree exactly the same things, so i understand the argument that it's not facebook's job to police that, but we have produced this incredible animosity. we're about to have thanksgiving this week, and a lot of people are going to go home to families where there are other family members who disagree with them on either the election or whatever the issue is, and i think there's going to be widespread shock. i think there's a tremendous amount of dread in the people i know because their families are split on really fundamental issues and neither side has been exposed to the other side, and it's all going to happen at thanksgiving. and, you know, i think it's going to be really ugly. >> yeah. i've seen -- >> i think healthy. healthy, though, right? we need that conversation started. >> i've seen relationships frayed this week on facebook, though. it's not -- because people with opposing views were friends on
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facebook, which sort of flies against your theory that we all hang out with people just like us. >> well -- no, i think that point is fair. i'm saying the vast majority that we see is something that re-enforces our prior biases and i think you're right, when the two sides touch, which doesn't happen as often as it did before technology provided the social environment, i do think that you see that friction and, agreed, the same thing has been happening to me, and i actively seek out points of view different than the ones i hold at any time, because that's how you invest, but in truth i think most people are comfortable not doing that. >> it's going to be an issue we're going to deal with for years. in the meantime, no love at apple for oppenheimer. analysts calling out the iphone maker saying apple lacks the courage to lead the next generation of innovation, namely artificial intelligence, the cloud, and messaging. oppenheimer will be more than reliant than ever on iphone. shares have been all over the
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map in the last few months. is this fair, roger? >> i think the headline is click bait and the conclusion is correct. the large numbers make it almost impossible for apple to outperform the market materially, and it's just reached a scale where hypergrowth is going to be very hard, but i think accusing them of not having the courage to lead a.i. is ridiculous. first of all, a.i. is just -- it's almost a catch-all term for every new computer project that doesn't actually have a use case, and, you know, at the end of the day apple's doing, i think, some very, very interesting things. are they doing all the things they could do to maximize growth? you know, i don't know, but it does look to me as though it's a market performed stock. if the market does well, apple is going to be a good stock to hold. in a rough market it will be better than average because of the yield, but at the end of the day, you know, i found arguments like that more about generating press coverage than about actual
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information for investing. >> here's my problem with it, what's good for the goose should be good for the gander. if you're arguing apple is overreliant on iphone, isn't google overreliant on advertising on search? youtube is doing well and the ads they have in youtube get constant mention, but between search, beyond search and youtube, which is quite an old google product at this point, one could argue all this other stuff, these driver-less cars, the robots, all this other stuff they've invested in, well, they are overly reliant on youtube and search, but nobody seems to be worried about that. how do analysts know a.i. is actually going to turn out profits in the near term or even in the medium term? >> well, john, i think that's a very, very, very insightful point, because at the end of the day, the challenge we face as technology investors is we're coming off the mother of all product cycles with smartphones, and there really is nothing on the horizon, even, you know,
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one-tenth as large. you look at something like virtual reality, which is a concept i think will, in fact, produce a really significant business opportunity, by comparison to smartphones, it's timing. and you look at a.i. and people can't even tell you most of the use cases. there are lots of ideas that you might apply it to, but nothing where you sit and go the customer must have that. and some of the early efforts, as in with, you know, driver-less cars, have exposed some of the flaws and the reasoning underlying a.i. and i would argue that the issues with facebook's algorithms point to different kinds of problems in a.i., as well. so i look at this and go, right on, you know, but markets are that way, right? people choose the stocks they want to like at any point and time and when there are more buyers than sellers, they go up, otherwise they don't. >> the wait is over on the east coast. snapchat spectacles arriving in new york city after a lengthy tour out west. the company's vending machine
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located across the street from the apple store, close to central park, and it's scheduled to remain open until new year's eve. the machines are still the only way to buy those $130 spectacles. roger, people have been tracking down this machine everywhere from big sur to the grand canyon. is this a marketing gimmick or a real foray into hardware, do you think? >> kayla, it is a genius marketing gimmick. no matter what else it is, it is an extraordinary marketing gimmick. i look at that snap and i have nothing but admiration for it. when they turned down the offer from facebook a number of years ago, like many people i thought that was ill advised and was going to result in a lot of tears. and it turns out not only did they have the last laugh, but at the moment they really -- they have captured something in the, you know, the ziet geist out there that is different from other technology companies, and
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i don't know where it's going to lead, but i will say that they have the magic right now. and, you know, what the stock is worth is anybody's guess, but it is really clear to me that they are going to get everybody's attention and when they do the ipo, i suspect it will be, you know, well subscribed. >> guys, what i think is interesting about snap that we don't talk about as much is that it's this l.a. company, not silicon valley, and what they've done with content is curate it and craft it in a way they thought differently about it than the likes of a facebook or a twitter. they dive into content immediately, the spectacles are all about content creation. you're not talking as much, i think, about fake news on snapchat because snapchat is working with certain specific types of outlets to curate the content that's available on that platform. now, no way they are distributing millions of these spectacles through vending machines, so yes, it's mostly a
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gimmick, but they are telling a story about snapchat, and that's the important thing here. >> and john, there's a really powerful point that you just made. this is a company located in los angeles. if we think about amazon and amazon web located in seattle, there was a long period of time when silicon valley was wildly better as a producer of great tech companies than the rest of the country. maybe two standard deviations better in terms of the percentage of successful tech start-ups coming out of the valley, and, you know, the reality for the rest of the country is they can do it, and silicon valley, there's still way more money and people, a lot of energy here, but the hit rate has come down so much that it no longer stands out as the place you have to be if you want to create a technology company that, you know, if you work hard enough and have a great idea, you can do it pretty much anywhere now and snapchat, i think, does confirm yet again that observation. >> well, they certainly were confident in their own value as we pointed out before, turning
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down that offer, which at the time seemed like a lot of money, roger. >> seemed like a lot of money, right? >> good to see you, thanks, roger mcnamee from elevation joining us today. breaking news from chicago, new details on the planned worker strike in o'hare. phil? >> carl, if you are flying in or out of o'hare over the thanksgiving holiday weekend, you can breathe a little easier. the service employees union reptding some independent contractors at o'hare airport, approximately 500, announced they will not go on strike over the thanksgiving holiday weekend. they are going to wait until tuesday the 29th, so a week from tomorrow. if they can't come to an agreement to increase pay and benefits, then the approximately 500 workers, cabin cleaners, people who escort passengers in wheelchairs to planes, baggage handlers will be going on strike tuesday the 29th. good news for several hundred thousand, well over a million people flying through o'hare
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over the five-day stretch from wednesday through sunday. carl, back to you. >> good news, thanks so much, phil. when we come back, the trump cabinet continues to take shape. we'll check in with former white house chief of staff jeff bolton. an exclusive with marine le pen and later cofounder hanie ngata joins the show talking about tech under trump and more when "squawk alley" comes back. i've invested a lot in this game
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today's meetings include tulsi gab bard, mary fallin, rick perry, and elaine choi. what should we expect from the trump team? joining us this morning is former white house chief of staff to president bush josh bolton, director of the international economic policy advisory firm. josh, it's good to have you. good morning to you. >> good morning, carl. >> i'm curious to know your reaction first to the setup between bannon and reince priebus. is that seem traditional and workable in your view? >> it doesn't seem either traditional or workable to me. i was concerned when i saw that the announcement of bannon as senior adviser and priebus as
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chief of staff suggested that they would be co-equals. if what that means is they will be co-equal advisers to the president with full access to the president's ear and so on, that's great. but i think the white house can properly be run only by one person, only one person can really set the president's calendar, can say who does and doesn't get access, what issues he considers, and very importantly, only one person can speak for the president when he's made a decision, and i think that needs to be the chief of staff. so it's still workable if they are co-equal advisers. it's not workable if reince priebus is not fully empowered to be chief of staff and do the job that i believe he's very capable of doing. >> do you believe he is a capable chief of staff? >> yeah. he's -- he doesn't have executive branch experience, so he'll be on a steep learning curve, but he certainly knows washington, he knows the political scene well. he's got a very good demeanor.
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he's well liked across the town, so he can be a very successful chief of staff, but only if he's empowered by the president actually to run and control the white house. >> let's talk about the treasury department, josh, because you recruited hank paulson to be the secretary of the treasury. currently we're looking squarely at steve manuchin for that job. nbc news reporting jamie dimon of jpmorgan was never under consideration. what do you think about his qualifications for that job? >> i did recruit hank paulson, and i knew him and i knew his reputation, and, you know, he's the gold standard on wall street. so i was -- i worked very hard on behalf of president bush to persuade him to come into the administration at considerable financial and, i think, personal cost to himself, he's a patriot and i think the country was much better off that he did it.
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manuchin i don't know, but somebody with wall street and market experience is really important to have in the treasury department. one of the -- i think one of the disastrous things that might have resulted from a clinton presidency is go along with the warren wing of the party and assume anybody with actual experience in the markets ought to be banned from the treasury department, so i think it's good news they are giving serious consideration to people with real experience in the markets. that doesn't mean they are going to give wall street banks a pass on regulation or anything else. it does mean they know what kind of regulation is appropriate and most importantly folks like paulson and i hope manuchin know how to handle a crisis. >> josh, this day and age, how important is diversity when rolling out your cabinet? how much thought goes into the
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order in which you roll out these cabinet nominees and the complexion of those cabinet nominees, whether it is trying to appeal to your own party's base or the idea of trying to bring the country together? >> from an ordinary transition, the composition of the cabinet is really important. i know for the bush administration president-elect bush didn't think just about the individuals he was selecting. that was the principle focus, is this person the best qualified person to do the job, but he was also thinking about the overall team, what signal does it send, if it's all old white men, that's going to undermine confidence in the administration from a lot of places. so if the trump transition is following previous transitions, they are thinking about the whole team. clearly, in the way that they are handling the interviews with
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the potential cabinet officers now, they are thinking about the impression they are giving. i think they are doing a good job of reaching out to some unexpected places and i think hopefully giving folks a lot of confidence that the president-elect is open minded about bringing in a diverse set of views and folks who are experienced, not necessarily, you know, members of his original campaign team. i think they are doing well with that, and i think they are surprising people. >> right. but as kayla mentioned, the dimon news was something the market had certainly gotten warm to. now they are being backed off, how should the market evaluate who's a serious candidate within the transition team and who's simply a trial balloon for balloon sake? >> you know, there are different styles to announcing cabinet appointments. in the bush transition, we kept
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everything completely secret, and then sprung the announcement on the press, you know, sort of one at a time. the obama people, they kept it quiet, but they floated the names of likely candidates a day or so in advance just to see what kind of reaction they got. the trump people are doing it totally differently. they are -- and i think sort of refreshingly, they are just parading people in the front door and showing a wide diversity of views. so i don't know exactly how the markets ought to interpret it, but like i said, i think the willingness of the trump administration, despite a lot of heated rhetoric and anti wall street rhetoric during the campaign, i think folks ought to be relatively comforted that they seem to be prepared to put aside some of the most extreme rhetoric of the campaign and consider well qualified, serious people for posts like treasury, state, and so on.
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>> well, it's certainly an important window to look through with you, josh, we appreciate your time. thanks so much. >> thank you. >> former white house chief of staff josh bolton. a news update on mylan. meg? >> more on the congressional focus on mylan. senator chuck grassley saying mylan has declined to testify at a senate judiciary committee december 30th, this on the settlement mylan made over charges that it overcharged medicaid for rebates on the epipen, saying the obama administration, this is chuck grassley, is, quote, dodging accountability for an expensive problem, one way or another he intends to get answers. so far the department of justice have also declined to testify at this november 30th conference, so it will be interesting to see how he intends to get answers. back to you. >> thank you, meg. coming up, michelle caruso ka brcabrer cabrera's interview with marine le pen, looking to follow in the
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footsteps of brexit and donald trump. and hany nada on investing, china, and more. "squawk alley" continues after this break. the time to choose your medicare coverage begins october 15th and ends december 7th. so call unitedhealthcare to enroll... in a plan that could give you the benefits and stability you're looking for, an aarp medicarecomplete plan insured through unitedhealthcare. what makes it complete? it can combine medicare parts a and b, which is your hospital and doctor coverage with part d prescription drug coverage, and more, all in one simple plan for a low monthly premium or in some areas, no plan premium at all. an aarp medicarecomplete plan offers you benefits like an annual physical, preventive screenings and most immunizations all for a $0 copay. you'll also have access to a local network of doctors and much more. you can get routine vision and hearing coverage,
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the election season is over in the u.s., but it is just getting started in europe. there are a whole series of referendums and votes coming up, starting with italy and austria this coming saturday. there are a number of populous candidates running. political observers say when all is said and done, we may, in fact, see a more trumpian europe. michelle caruso-cabrera sat down with one of the candidates, marine le pen of france. hey, michelle. >> reporter: and she's long been considered a fringe candidate, carl, never getting above 30% in the polls in the lead up to the spring election coming, however, now nobody believes the polls anymore in the wake of brexit and in the wake of donald trump. many political observers here, including marine le pen herself, think it's quite possible she could be the next leader of
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france. >> translator: it's true that the election of donald trump is a massive return to the people. it's a return of the nation in a world in which we consider that the nation was a thing to move past. unquestionably, we had some points in common with donald trump, because we hope for independence for our country, a return of power, and a calming of relations around the world. >> what do you think of his idea to build a wall? >> translator: the wall already exists. it already exists. the reality is, that the united states cannot put in place disswasive immigration policies since the united states already does not deliver in ways as generous as france does with subsidies and taking charge of illegal immigrants. if it's the only way to prevent these illegal immigrants from continuing to lower the wages of american workers, because that is the reality, those that advocate the massive immigration, it's not for humanitarian reasons.
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it's for economic considerations, and it's the american public that has suffered the consequences, so i think it's pragmatic on his part to put in place methods of stopping illegal immigration. france won't need to use this. it's enough that we cut the vacuum pumps of immigration. all these social services, all the housing, the free access to schools, et cetera, but the united states can't do this. everyone takes the measures they deem necessary to put an end to something that i think harms the prosperity and security of the american people. >> financial markets are watching marine le pen very, very closely because one of her key platforms is, she wants france to abandon the euro. for so long, carl, we talked about the financial risks to the euro because of greece not being able to pay its bills, perhaps portugal, but now the risk is political, and she is ground zero. back to you.
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>> really important interview, michelle. michelle caruso-cabrera in paris with marine le pen. brings us to the close in europe and the uk this morning. let's get back to seema modi at hq. seema? >> politics certainly a focal point for the european investors. interesting to see stocks trading at record highs, but in europe the major index is down 18% from its all-time high, although we did see two straight weeks of gains, a lot having to do with the currency. the euro, though, interestingly enough, snapped its ten-day losing streak as the dollar parody talk continues. citigroup predicting the euro will tumble in the next six to 12 months on these policy divergence talks between the fed and the u.s. the fed and the ecb, i should say. today's aren't being attributed to german chancellor merkel's announcement she'll run for a fourth term in office amidst of this rising populist view across
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europe. merkel is seen as the driving force of keeping the euro together, but she is seeing pushback from the right, already won key state elections, the main election in germany is likely to be in september of 2017. now, elsewhere, the elevated political risk in italy ahead of the december 4th referendum is resulting in investors scaling back their exposure to italian assets, close eye on the bond markets. in the equity space, italian banks continue to underperform their european peers on rising uncertainty on what happens if prime minister matteo renzi does lose this vote and the impact on the financial sector, which is in desperate need of raising more cash in the coming months. as i end this, take a look at italian stocks. the major index is higher today, but still down 24% year to date. in fact, the worst performing stock market in europe so far. guys, back to you. >> we'll be talking about italy
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a lot for the coming weeks. seema, thank you. when we come back, its technology is found in some of the world's most popular cell phones. how they are helping companies understand human interface trends. and later, instagram is taking on snapchat and periscope with two new products. competition heating up. we'll be right back.
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i'm melissa lee.
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here's your update at this hour. iraqi troops have taken over a village near mosul. they were closing in on a road that links the syrian and iraqi parts of isis' self declared caliphate. france's interior minister said police foiled a plan isis militant attack. seven people of french, moroccan, and afghan or again were arrested. in a letter made public by the vatican, pope francis said while there's no question abortion is a grave sin, there is no sin that god's mercy can't reach and erase. and treacherous and snowy driving conditions stranded many drivers in upstate new york overnight. cold air and abnormally warm lake ontario creating a lake effect snow ban. one to three feet of snow is expected to fall through the region tomorrow. that's your update this hour. let's get back to "squawk alley." >> thanks so much, melissa. president-elect donald trump
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standing by his criticism of the united states trade deals. so what does his election mean for china and silicon valley? joining us now, hany nada, cofounder and managing founder at ggp capital. good to see you. >> good morning. >> campaign talk was tough on china. talk about tariffs, talk about ripping up the tpp. but since the election we haven't heard so much about that, and a readout of a conversation between trump and china's president xi said simply they established a clear sense of mutual respect, so how is china receiving the election? >> i think it would be interesting to watch over the next few months. obviously, the u.s. has been a world leader in global trade and if we step away from that role, china is the most likely candidate to take that role, so there's a bit of give and take to see how this is going to shake out, but i remain optimistic how china is going to do and how the u.s. is going to fair, unless we get to the extremes, whether it's protectionism or completely open trade. >> many of the topics and the
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rhetoric from the campaign are now thought of, hany, as just sort of a first negotiating position. talk about a potential 45% tariff on exports from china. if that is not realistic, what do you think would be realistic? >> you know, i don't know. i'm an eternal optimist, obviously, so i think a lot of this was rhetoric, saber raveling. i think when you come down to it, hopefully overall business merits win. global trade is good. it's created lots of jobs in the u.s., created lots of jobs overseas and helped the overall economy of everyone, so i'm going to be optimistic we're not going to see any crazy levels of tariffs. i think the intermingling, intertwining of trade between the u.s. and china is far too valuable to china to mess it up. >> hany, lots of optimists now, as there should be, as president-elect gets ready to take office, but what are the
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real moments you're going to be watching to see how this is going to go? are there specific moments where decisions have to be made? is it whether the u.s. labels china a currency manipulator or not? what are these sign posts that are going to determine whether this is going well or not? >> so, look, i think the way that i look at this is that if the u.s. starts doing extreme measures on trade, it's going to elevate china's stature worldwide, and my guess is you'll see a lot more investment going into china because of that than the u.s., so it's going to hurt the overall economy. once everyone sits down and looks at the effects of these, calmer minds will prevail. some of the risks and some of the things i'm watching for on the u.s. side is this extreme pressures, limits on export and import, things like that that come up to me would be a sign that maybe you want to invest your money elsewhere. >> hany, there was a big deal over the weekend of a company that you are very familiar with,
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draft kings and fan duel, and what is the thesis behind this deal that a bigger company could fight regulators in a stronger way? eliminating some costs since they were both trying to outspend each other on advertising, what was the catalyst that led this to happen now? >> first, i think there is tremendous amount of consolidation happening in the tech industry right now. i'm currently aware of seven transactions, two announced, draft kings and a company in europe. there's five more on the docket that are happening. this is probably the highest level of activity i've seen in my 17-year career here at ggv, so there's something going on in the macro environment that's compelling and giving strategic buyers much more risk tolerance to acquire companies. so i think there's a lot happening in the tech space right now or around mna and you'll see more and more of it coming. specifically around draftkings,
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i think the thing i'm most excited about is what's going to happen to the product of the company. right now companies have been spending a lot of time getting up to regulatory standards, making sure products are robust and consumers are protected but the next leg of the school is how do you take that 3 million users or so into the 60 million potential fantasy users out there, so i think there's a lot of growth to go and combining the companies will help the product and consumers get a better experience. >> in a lot of states, hany, you need regulatory certainty for that to happen. the company had some big wins in new york, to name one, but when do you think we'll get certainty for this industry? >> great question. i think 2016 was a very difficult year for the industry. i think we've come out -- we're coming out of 2016 in a much better place. there's now a number of states that have said daily fantasy sports is legal and not gambling, and so i think you're going to see that continued legislative momentum happen over the next year to year and a half
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and hopefully will get most of the states to say yes, this is not gambling, this is fantasy sports, this is different, skill gaming and i think we'll be over that and i think we've seen momentum in the last nine months that have given us clear direction as to that trend. >> well, we'll certainly keep watching it. hany, always good to see you. >> thank you. >> hany nada from ggv. when we come back, facebook's instagram announcing two new features this morning that's putting snapchat and twitter on notice. first, rick santelli, what are you watching? >> well, i'm watching the dow up 48, i'm watching interest rates up, i'm watching the dollar index get closer to unchanged. you know what, i think we've finally turned the corner on bad is good. do you remember when we had bad data but the markets were supposed to respond because of the fed, that that was good? yeah, it's over, but the new chapter may be a little nerve racking and that's what we're going to talk about after the break. world ugly and messy. they are the natural born enemy of the way things are.
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let's get to that. rick santelli with the santelli exchange, rick? >> carl, perfect timing. we are new highs in the s&p 500. listen, i read a lot, i get a lot of e-mails, i try to stay on top of the markets and all the various views out there. my read is the toll keepers and the top keepers are, you know, portfolio managers, fund managers, economists, strategists. there certainly seems to be a nervousness out there, and it doesn't really make sense to me, but i still understand. as i said, the economics of less trumping the economics of more. it seemed as though the certainty of less made many more comfortable the toll keepers than the possibility of more. seems quite topsy-turvy, but most of these roads do lead to the fed and their policies. consider this, the fed did a lot of things with the notion they had to. that was the reason. they had to, because the gridlock in washington wasn't giving us any fiscal programs to
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give better growth to the economy. let's face it, we've gone through the phase and there's a lot of things important to not only viewers and investors, but everybody who lives in the united states. there's big social issues that are important, there's big economic issues. this is going to be in many ways the beginning of the new administration, probably focused on the economic side of the ledger. consider interest rates and housing, for example. most experts believe that the rise in rates, which is predicated on the notion of fiscal growth policies put in place that we haven't seen in a long time is a big negative. i question that. we've had record historic low interest rates and housing is healed but not to the extent it was before the crisis. to me there's been many big investors out there that have gone into housing and kind of put the scales out of whack, so to speak. listen, good growth means potentially higher paying jobs, and that will trump the notion of interest rates crawling up from historic low yields.
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on deficits, i just had a guest, danny johnson, who's concerned about deficits and interest rates. even though we have record deficits for many years, 2008, 2009, 2010, in terms of budget deficits, funneling into a close to $20 trillion national debt. difference is the fed. the fed doesn't have quantitative easing or the policies that made bad actually good. everybody should relax out there, because no matter how growth policies tun out, it's better to have them and try them than to any bring them up at all with regard to the markets. kayla, back to you. >> all right, rick santelli, thank you. when we come back, developing the touch technology behind those products we use every day. touch screens, biosensors, fingerprint scanners, you anytiname it. that on the other side of this break.
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. >> it's been three months since the s&p hit a new all-time high, but we did it just a few moments ago. ticking above 193.81. a lot of that thanks to what oil is doing today. some of the big winners, guys, include chesapeake, marathon, concho, hess, murray. anything related to materials or energy today. definitely a tail wind for stocks. >> indeed. exciting to watch. especially given all of the aft aftershocks from the elections that people were afraid of. moving on. our next guest comes from the company behind the first touchpad adopted by apple. dell and other pc makers where,
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today synapsis makes phones and tablets to driver displays and biometrics in automobiles, among other things. rick bergman, the ceo. good morning, rick. >> am go. >> so i'm wondering, rick, how do you keep the world from moving into post-touch mode the way we've moved into post-keyboard. i don't mean that we're not going to interact with technology at all by touch, but the margin, the innovation havt been in keyboards for a while. it seems a lot of people are moving to voice now. >> we don't sit still with touch. touch has been around. we continue to ino vyonovate a e bit more. you want the absolute best experience. things like moisture performance now are very important. we had something like hover
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several years ago. we continue to innovate and bring new incremental performance to touch. >> rick, how long before on our phones we no longer have this home button here or a button for fingerprint sensing. how long before we're just touching a spot on our screens and the entire face of the phone becomes a screen? i know you talk about that a bit, but timeline-wise is it the next generation of premium smartphones, the iphones, and samsung galaxies where we should expect to possibly see that technology? >> well, certainly it's a major inflexion point in the industry where you want to have that entire screen to have display, and as part of that that means you have to get rid of the bevel area as well as the home button. you'll start to see phones with that type of technology in 2017 and certainly synaptics is there to lead that revolution. >> outside of smartphones, rick, we've become familiar as consumers with using touch at
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atm's and airline key ocioskkio are there other industries slow to the uptake that you think could benefit from this technology now? >> well, any screen that you see people now want to interact with the touch. it's almost annoying if there's a screen somewhere. one example would be automotive. it moves a little bit slower than certainly the consumer markets, but we're seeing rapid adoption of touch technologies and advanced display technologies in automotive. >> rick, apple had moved away from putting touch into mac screens. they've done the touch bar on the new mac book pro instead, which leads to the questions around when is it inappropriate to put touch into screens? you just said that it's appropriate all the time, but what sorts of pushback are you seeing? what sorts of scenario where maybe that's a screen that you don't want to touch? >> to be honest, i can't think of a scenario where you don't
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want that additive experience. as i said, especially the younger population, they've grown up with touch screens, and they just expect when you touch it, that there's going to be some type of interaction, so there is some small incremental cost to add touch, and it might be the only scenario where you get really low-end type of platforms. i think as any user, we can all think of where we've had that experience where you are banging on the zreen ascreen and nothin happening, and ultimately you do want touch. >> we'll see if apple comes around to that point of view when it comes to macs. rick, from synaptics, thank you for joining us. >> thank you very much. >> as we go to break, not just the s&p today, the nasdaq also hit a record high, and the dow is within 15 points or so of its own. we'll be right back. ♪ okay, so you launched your bank's app. now what? how will you keep up with the new demands
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>> speaking of black friday, some tech companies have gone shopping early. symantec snapping up lifelock. symantec up on that news a little better than 4%. they've been on a little bit of a run. their pc-based legacy security had not been sebing them well, but they are up. oracle also announced a smaller acquisition of dyn. >> interesting that lifelock had been trying to sell itself. originally thought to be a private equity target, but now going to a strategic instead. what can symantec get from this? >> it's a little bit more of a focus on what's going on now in terms of security in the cloud.
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people's passwords. not just on the pc itself. that company is led by hillary schneider. former yahoo executive who made good in the security business. guess it can be done. >> the yahoo -- is impressive. they've made their way into a bunch of different spaces. we'll watch the markets this afterno afternoon. let's get over to headquarters and "the half." >> i'm melissa lee in for scott wapner. top trade this afternoon. the trump rally continues. the s&p just hit a new high. energy really screaming today. up more than 2%. with us this hour joe terra nova, steve weiss, sarat, and john najarian. also with us jeff curry, the global head of commodities research at goldman sachs. we'll get to jeff in just a moment. first to the guys. we have to talk energy stocks.


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