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tv   Erin Burnett Out Front  CNN  October 20, 2011 8:00pm-9:00pm PDT

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last, let zak galifinakis have the last word with live with the purple onion. >> i hate to be gross but the only time to yell out, i have diarrhea, is when you're playing scrabble. >> he's right, of course, the world is only worth 12 points but you get 50 for the word bingo which is using all of your letters. 62 minimum, not counting the premium of squares may be good for the scrabble club i'm thinking about starting. that's it for the ridiculous. >> that's "360." erin burnett "outfront" is next. we're on the front line in tripoli, moammar gadhafi's shot dead today. libyans celebrating through the night. we'll follow the oil money tonight and the bottom line on gadhafi's death. is this proof that american power is rising? power is rising? let's go "out front." -- captions by vitac --
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"outfront" tonight, gadhafi is dead. libyan dictator moammar gadhafi killed today after 42 years of rule. we have video in tonight from misrata that shows the body of moammar gadhafi. the video is graphic. it is disturbing and it is not appropriate for all viewers. in the video which we are going to show you now, several fighters are seen surrounding the corpse shouting slogans. they're shouting allah akbar, god is great. others saying the blood of martyrs are not in vain. he has wounds on his face including one on his forehead. gadhafi was reportedly killed by a bullet to his head near the hometown of sirte. we'll show you another video taken as he was dying or after he died. this is also gruesome. >> the transitional council released this information. he was captured wearing an undershirt and trousers and they took a dna sample while they say his blood was still hot. hair samples were taken as well. some of the hair, though, was found to be artificial. samples from his face and armpit were taken to prove to the national transitional council that it was, indeed, gadhafi.
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gadhafi's was a journey from revolutionary hero. many in libya cheered him. he became a despotic strong man responsible for bombing pan am flight 103. libyans are celebrating tonight and the whole world is watching because libya is a powerful country. it is home to the largest reserves of oil in africa. with the latest, dan is in tripoli tonight. we're still learning new information. we just saw disturbing videos of how gadhafi was captured and killed and information is still coming in. what can you tell us? >> reporter: well, the ntc are very keen to put their side of what happened out to the media. we've been briefed by them. they're telling us that gadhafi was basically captured, as you saw on that footage. he was alive and injured, they say, shot in the arm. they tried to get him to hospital, but in the process of taking him to hospital, the
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vehicle he was in came under fire and they say he was killed in the crossfire, shot in the head and confirmed dead before he arrived at hospital. we've got details and what happened as part of the autopsy and they took dna samples to confirm his identity, but they are very keen to dispel any objection that he was deliberately killed by the ntc soldiers that took him. there were earlier reports suggesting he'd been shot in the head by his own pistol by presumably the soldiers that captured him. he was simply caught in the crossfire that they wanted to bring him in alive. >> dan rivers, thank you very much. celebrations are ongoing in tripoli tonight. the big question though now is what's next? i met moammar gadhafi in tripoli a couple of years ago and he was a strange man. as part of my reporting there, i spent time with a man called abu zadorda. he was part of gadhafi's right hand man during the original revolution. he was captured a month ago by
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rebel forces and when i met him, he had giant dioramas to build new cities in lybia. he wanted to move the 140 or so tribes to these new cities and force them to live side by side in apartment buildings because the tribes hated each other that much. tribal identity remains paramount in libya. george friedman sent time there and he can answer the big question of what happens now. founder and ceo of stratfor global intelligence. can they do it? >> it's going to be awfully difficult. they haven't run a country democratically for 42 years. the tribes are at odds with each other. gadhafi had a substantial amount of support in the country, it took seven months to bring him down. those supporters may well fight back. there are weapons used all over the country. and this looks more like baghdad in 2003 than a celebration. >> so do you think that would mean the united states or someone would need to be involved for quite a bit longer to ensure stability, not just
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for the country, but also the oil supply? >> well, i mean, it's very obvious that nato overthrew gadhafi. it was nato that did it. now nato has a country. the question is what does nato have to do about it? gadhafi is dead, his regime has been displaced and now they have to engage in nation building. we haven't had a very good record in nation building and no one wants to invest in it and we don't want to send troops there. the problem we have now is we won. so be careful what you wish for. you might get it? >> george, thank you very much. a sobering reminder of just what we may be facing. we appreciate it. the challenges are huge, but the reason the world is invested is because the opportunity is huge as well. libya, quite simply is loaded with oil and money.
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the country has the largest oil reserves in africa, 46 billion barrels and it has the fourth biggest natural gas stash in the continent. in fact, it has the world's large of the reserves of so-called light sweet crude oil. that is the kind that american refineries prefer. the bottom line, saudi arabia's oil isn't as good as libya and each though libya isn't producing that much oil due to the revolution it's amassed $170 billion in oil money. much of that was frozen during the revolution. ramadan is with the group made up to make sure assets coming back to lybia is spent the way they should be. i hear the guns going off as people still celebrate there, joining us from tripoli tonight. can you tell us the bottom line? do you know where all of the money is or what the right amount is? is $170 billion a fair number? >> thank you for having me. and there is a lot of celebrations behind us and you
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can hear the gunfire. the numbers are an approximation. i think it's more closer to 160 and that's the frozen assets, for example, investments in africa it's much more difficult to account for everything, but there will be a process of accounting for all these investments and assets. >> do you have enough money now to run a country? to pay the government workers, to make sure people can come to work and do their jobs and function as a country? >> well, we have a temporary financing mechanism and the financing mechanism was established by the country to basically unfreeze assets and be able to spend it after the u.n. sanctions.
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we currently are in the process of unfreezing assets from both canada and holland, from the netherlands, and the amount is close $3 billion and we'll use that to pay fuel bills and salaries and things like that. >> i'm curious, the transitional council of which you're a part says it can get oil production back to half a million barrels a day pretty quickly. in one year, that would be $18 billion. and a big question that america has and nato is whether libya intends to pay america back the $2 billion joe biden says america spent and perhaps to pay nato as well for their involvement. will you? >> excuse me. i didn't catch the last part of
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the question. >> i was saying does libya intend to pay back nato and the united states for the money they put into helping over the past year? >> oh, okay. so currently, the current government is basically a caretaker government. i think the issues and questions like this should be addressed by legitimately elected government and that should happen in a very short period of time. i am sure the representative government will make the right decisions. >> mazin, you were living in the u.s. for a while. you were a businessman here. you went back to libya to be a part of a new government, to go back to your country. do you think libya can get beyond these tribal differences we've been hearing so much about? do you think democracy is something that will function and that can come out of this? >> yes, of course. today is basically a historical day. i turn the page on the gadhafi era, 40 years of a struggle that ended with the end of this gadhafi era and now we have a new page and we look forward to democracy, justice and human rights. i'm very optimistic that we will have a democratic, free country.
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>> all right. mazin, thank you very much for taking the time to join us. i know it's late tonight, but still very busy in tripoli. mazin ramadan joining us from tripoli. the housing market is in big trouble and it will take a big job to help and senator chuck schumer and mike leigh think they've got one. >> 97% of pakistan's population is forbid tone drink. why can't we resist pakistani beer? >> and pat buchanon to talk about libya and the presidential campaign. "outfront" next. ♪ [ cellphone rings ] cut! [ monica ] i have a small part in a big movie. i thought we'd be on location for 3 days, it's been 3 weeks. so, i used my citi simplicity card to pick up a few things. and i don't have to worry about a late fee. which is good... no! bigger! bigger! [ monica ] ...because i don't think
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the number tonight, 40. that's the number of pages in "preparedness 101, zombie pandemic." it's a graphic novella published by the cdc. not that sexy. the story is a new disease turning people into zombies. preparing for an emergency while combatting viruses. it was written after "zombie apocalypse" went viral in may. all right. now today's big idea. the world and america needs a stronger american economy right now and bold ideas to build a greater america. today, two senators have a creative plan for housing. democratic senator charles
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schumer and republican senator mike leigh today proposed giving foreign buyers a residence visa if they pay in cash at least $250,000 on a primary residence and half a million total on property in the united states of america. currently, the biggest investors in the american residential market hail from canada, retirement and then, yes, china, mexico and uk also on the list. and the top destinations are, with a couple of exception, troubled real estate markets, including california and florida and arizona. senator charles schumer is one of the sponsors of the measure. senator schumer, it's good to have you with us. i want to start with the big question, how much of an effect will your plan have on housing prices? >> i think it can have a significant effect. we calibrated it so that actually the lowest amount of house that someone could buy and live in was $250,000. in many markets, that's about at the median and there are many foreclosed homes still at that level, and even when the market
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is somewhat lower, everyone knows you scoop up demand at a little bit higher end of the market it raises prices everywhere. >> so how many buyers, do you think this will bring in? >> well, no one know, but we do know similar programs when people invest in america and people are entrepreneurs and create ten jobs in america are well oversubscribed, america is still that lady with the torch and there are millions and millions of people around the world, many who have some means, who want to come here. so if you say you'll get a visa, you'll never become a citizen. this is not a citizenship path, but you'll get a visa if you live here and spend your money here and spend your taxes here, there will be a whole lot of people who do it. >> is the goal just to improve housing prices? because i know you're saying this isn't about citizenship and if you get well-educated foreigners to buy property and they might decide to stay and have a leg up in doing so and it helps with those highly educated
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foreigners that some want to come to america. >> the number one goal which is to help the housing market which is the biggest anchor in the economy and the number two goal is to get the economy going and they have to spend a great deal of money here and they'll pay taxes here. so it will be a net increase in revenues and it will help get the economy going. if they want to start a business and do things like that, yes, they can apply for visas to do that as well and they, of course, are more likely to do that. >> we did an analysis today. they did -- who buys property in america. canadians wanting to retire, the biggest group, but the second biggest group comes from asia and specifically we're talking about china. do you think increased chinese investment in real estate in america is a good thing? >> i do. i think having money flow here to america is a very good idea.
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i've never been against foreign investment. it creates jobs here. if we can create the housing market, and if we can kick-start it with this program, and i've talked to leaders in finance and leaders in housing and leaders in banking. i spoke to warren buffett today and he thought it was a great idea, and i think it can be something of a difference. no one is saying it will be a cure-all the minute it becomes law, but it will help significantly. >> this looks like a little bit of both. >> people don't think mike leigh and chuck schumer would be on the same side of much. now the big political questions, will it fly in congress and will president obama get a boost from the killing of moammar gadhafi? after all, in the past year alone, he's overseen the capture or deaths of several top terrorists including osama bin laden and anwar al awlaki from al qaeda and the overthrow of three dictators.
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here now to weigh in, cnn contributor david fromme, joining us from vancouver tonight and from washington, jen saki, former deputy communications director for the obama white house. great to have you with us. i want to start with the schumer-lee housing bill. it was a part of the proposal. do you think the obama white house is going to sign on? >> well, the most important thing we can be doing for the economy right now is considering every creative idea that was put out there and this is a good example of thinking outside of the box to get a creative look at what we can do and it doesn't add a dime for the deficit and it doesn't cost taxpayers a dime, so it is something that people will take a close look at. there's a lot that we need to do in the housing market. so this is one step that should be considered as we look at what we can do for the economy. >> david, can this pass?
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>> i hope not. i don't think it's a very good idea at all. i applaud the creativity behind it. if you're going to auction off residence visas, i don't think $250,000 is the price, i don't know why you would want to reward people who invest in the overbuilt economy and not in the sectors where capital is most required. it doesn't do anything to lift the debt burden of the household sector. the job here is to not raise the price of real estate so that people's debts become more bearable. the object is to reduce the burden of debt and to do that you need a very expansionary monetary policy. this is, perhaps, a way of dealing with the federal reserve's insufficient action, but it's not the right answer. i applaud the thinking process, but the answer is wrong. >> well, i applaud your optimism that the fed can get even more expansionary, but let me move on to the next topic, obviously, the story of the day, gadhafi's demise. there was criticism of the president's decision to be involved in libya at all. a lot of criticism. does he feel vindicated today?
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>> well, i think first things, it is a victory for democracy. this is a victory for the people in the middle east. i don't think he thinks of it as vindication, but there's no question that without the president's leadership and courage of conviction that gadhafi could still be in power and if you look at the alternatives and inconsistency of people like mitt romney, he was for it before he was against it before he was for it and this is highlighting the kind of leadership that the president exhibits and what people will be facing next year. >> all of the presidential candidates weighed in today. will this move anything in the polls? >> i doubt it. not for very long. congratulations to the president for the success. let's hope it works out better than the overthrow of hosni mubarak, and prime minister of britain who did much more of the heavy lifting that took many more of the political risks. we'll know later how this has worked out.
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all we know today is that a dictator is dead and we don't know much about the future of libya, but they didn't reelect george h.w. bush and they didn't reelect winston churchill. once it's behind us, voters will focus what will happen next. >> there are question marx on that, domestically and internationally, everywhere. pakistan's only legal brewery. yeah, there is one. is celebrating today and we can't resist this one. what does gadhafi's death really mean for america? will we ever recover the billions we invested in the cause? and the latest from the conrad murray trial. the state rests. what does the defense need to do to get him off? accept it. you can't change the way banking works. just accept it, man. free ? doesn't close at five ? try nature. it's a bank. what do you want, a hug ? just accept it. hidden fees, fine print, or they'll stick it to you some other way. stay with the herd, son. accept it. just accept it. accept it. just accept it. accept it. if we miss this movie, you're dead. if you're stuck accepting banking nonsense, you need an ally.
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and now a story we cannot resist. pakistani officials have announced the country will begin exporting beer and spirits starting next year. this is a really big deal because alcohol exports have been banned by pakistan in the islamic republic since 1977 and the consumption of alcohol is forbidden to the 97% of the population which is muslim. when we were in karachi last month, our crew could not get alcohol in the one hotel that supposedly allowed it. the news of alcohol exports was celebrated by the murree brewery, the only legal brewery in pakistan which has, until now, been forced to produce beer and spirits only for consumption by foreigners who actually have to sign something stating they're not muslim and by pakistani minorities. we could aren't even get any while we were there.
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the family who owns the muree brewery says -- pakistan is known for a lot of bad things. it's time for us to be known for good thing, too, like our beer. when we heard about the story we really wanted to try the beer, but as you can imagine it's tough to come by something that cannot legally be exported, but there's a way. we found a man named nizar khan in upstate new york who has been trying to bring murree brewery to the united states for years and he had a can of it if we sent a courier to albany to get it. so we did it. they also make something called big apple drink, so that's b-i-g-g, apple drink and here is the beer. classic lagger and i called pakistani restaurants and here it is, illegal beer. we just couldn't resist. still up front, "the outfront 5" and the dictator is
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dead. what do you know for sure about the new leaders? >> we know for sure that they don't control much of libya. the troops on the ground were doing pretty nasty stuff. the state rests. >> when dr. murray agreed to treat insomnia with propofol, who put dr. murray first? >> what the defense needs to do to save conrad murray. and suicide of a super power. >> we're headed down the road to greece. >> all of this "outfront" in our second half.
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we start the second half of hour show with the stories we care about. we focus on our own reporting, do the work and find the "outfront" five. moammar gadhafi reportedly shot in the head, killed near his hometown of sirte. libya has a lot of challenges, but also opportunity. the country has the largest oil reserves in africa, the fourth biggest natural gas stash on the planet and get this, it's got the world's largest reserves of so-called light sweet crude oil, and that's the kind american refineries use and our cars love. bottom line, it's better oil than saudi arabia's. the national transitional council hopes to use oil production to rebuild the country. no word yet on whether they'll pay back nato or the u.s.. eta is seeking a democratic resolution. the organization is blamed for
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hundred of deaths in spain and france and considered a terrorist organization by the united states. we spoke to the president of the associations of victims of terrorism and she says her work will not be happy until eta disbands formally. "outfront" called democratic leaders to ask if the amendment had democratic support, they told us no comment. republican kelly ayon of new hampshire, with the goal of keeping terrorist trials in military tribunals. defense secretary leon pannetta and attorney general, eric holder strongly oppose the amendment. groupon is cutting back the size of its ipo to $10 or 12 billion according to reuters. it's down from earlier. expectations of as much as $30 billion. the plunge is partially blamed on less interest in groupon.
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"outfront" analyze said the number of visitors to the site thanks to this story, they showed the visitors dropped 23% from june to last month. a lot of competitors for groupon. and it has been 76 days since the u.s. lost its top credit rating. what are we doing to get it back? as we just said, the fate of libya is far more than the head of the dictator. who runs more from the entire world? fareed zakaria joining us enroute to dubai and route to tehran. i wanted to start by asking you about moammar gadhafi's son, the
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person who his heir apparent, it is unclear if he's alive or dead tonight, but if he's alive, does it change the the arithmetic of the risks and who will end up leading libya? >> i don't think it changes the actual arithmetic on the ground. the site was a creature of gadhafi. this is a one-man regime and a one-man cult and you have the background for the support in the country, and the support among the armed forces of the intelligent services to have ever run, in the circumstances he is in now. >> fareed, what do we really know about the new leaders? we've all seen the reports that the transitional government has tortured prisoners and well known that there's a history of tribal splits, to say the least and there have been reports that groups like al qaeda are in the leadership there. what do we know for sure about the new leaders? >> what we know for sure is that they don't control much of libya, by which i mean a lot of these reports are really about groups on of soldiers that have done bad things and it is not clear if they're by the council. many of the people of the council are educated people, pro-western and some of them were within the gadhafi regime and then left because they felt they wanted a better future for libya, but many of them are simply frustrated that they have very little control.
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it is a kind of a free for all and some of the groups on the ground are doing pretty nasty stuff. >> does this mean that america will not be able to disengage? is america's mission not done? >> i think the administration has been pretty disciplined about not getting overinvolved and providing support, crucial support and support that allows the libyans to handle it and they've brought a pretty clear line that says we don't own libya. they would be able to stay at somewhat at arm's length and it doesn't descend into complete chaos which at this point doesn't seem likely. >> fareed, thank you so much. we appreciate you taking the time and safe travels.
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fareed will be interviewing iranian president mahmoud ahmadinejad and you can see that on "gps" sunday at 10:00 and 1:00 p.m. eastern. one group of people have more reason than anyone to celebrate the death of gadhafi, and that's the families of the victims of pan am 103. brian flynn's big brother j.p. died that day on his way home for christmas. i appreciate you taking the time. how do you feel today? >> funny, when i heard this morning what had happened, and my wife said no, gadhafi's dead and he's captured, no, he's dead and i had this sense of excitement. and i think if it wasn't tied into the end of tyranny and the freedom of the libyan people, i don't think i would have had a visceral reaction of excitement. >> and it is the joy and celebration that we're still seeing there tonight. >> they have ever right to. the libyan people had the courage to do it and the united states, under trying circumstances and a lot of criticism, the obama administration stepped up and said we'll support the libyan
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people and help them win their freedom. >> does this give you resolution? gadhafi is now dead. >> right. >> it's been two years since the convicted bomber megrahi was sent back to libya. he is supposed to be dying. he's still alive. and the libyan ambassador of the united states says they're not going to extradite him and this is the new transitional government? does that make you angry? >> we've been trying to do what we could to lobby to change things and change policies and we're not going to stop the fight. we'll go after him and to get megrahi to serve his time out in prison. for the better part of 20 years, people want to push it aside and move ahead and today we should all take a moment and realize that the head of the snake has been cut off. gadhafi has been killed, but there are still parts of the snake that need to be held accountable, including megrahi and other parts of the gadhafi regime.
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moussa koussa is now in qatar and was one of the early defectors and he should be held accountable. >> it's interesting to point out that sometimes people have a desire to see things gone. bad guy gone, good guys in. you have a family -- every year, your family gets together in honor of what happened. this year, it's going to be different? >> it's funny. the families meet every december 21st in arlington cemetery and what's been great about that, it's not just the family members and a lot of people of the justice department and the state department and people who worked in congress showed up every year and they're the people that inspired the rest of us and showed us great dedication to our cause. it will be a memorial service and it will be solemn, but i'm thinking maybe there's a way to add a little bit of champagne and celebration to it, because we believe, in a small part, that we did what we could to help the libyan people and to help free them and to bring down
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gadhafi. >> brent, thank you so much. i hope you get to enjoy the day and enjoy that time even though i know it doesn't change what happened and you certainly have a fight ahead of you. >> thank you very much. >> thanks again. now to the outer circle, we do it around the same time every night. the michael jackson trial can conrad murray possibly get off. pat buchanan joining us and the title of his new book -- hmm. we will be back. i had no idea what to choose. until i found pronutrients -- a new line of supplements from centrum, who i totally trust. omega-3 supports not only my heart, but my brain and my eyes too. probiotics helps with my digestive balance and my immune function. and fruit & veggie has antioxidant properties. new pronutrients from centrum helps make nutrition possible.
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it's just a crazy scenario, that's how the state's final witness describes the defense theory that michael jackson injected himself with the deadly dose of propofol. dr. stephen schaeffer, who literally wrote the book on propofol use, testified conrad murray caused the death of michael jackson because he was negligent in his care. >> when dr. murray agreed to treat insomnia with propofol, he put dr. murray first, not michael jackson. this is the fundamental violation. the patient comes first. that did not happen here. >> ted rollins was in the courtroom and has the latest. ted, you were there, and obviously some heated debate on the demonstrations of propofol use. what's your take? >> there ws an incident today,
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erin, and the first time we saw dr. conrad murray react to anything. he was visibly upset in front of the jury. his defense attorneys objected. when the prosecutor -- propofol which the state alleges murray used in an infusion into michael jackson, when it was sealed before he touched it, the judge sent the jury out of the room and ended up hashing it out and when the jury came back it was explained exactly what happened to the jury through a stipulation, but dramatics in court today. >> ted, any idea who the defense will call as witnesses? they're getting ready to start. what surprises do you expect? >> well, no surprises. schaeffer was an outstanding witness for the prosecution because he really laid out their theory of what happened. to combat that, they'll use dr. white, who is world renowned in
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propofol and anesthesiology. they'll start tomorrow with the cross of schaeffer. i don't expect they'll try to attack him because he was a very solid witness. >> thanks very much. we'll see you then. now to the outer circle, we do it around the same time every night. we try and reach out to our sources around the world and tonight, we begin in greece, where one protester died today after anti-austerity protests turned violent, this as they approved another round of budget-cutting measures. the protests seem to be getting angrier and more violent. what can the government do to calm the situation? >> reporter: erin, people here are hurting. they're saying they're being squeezed to the very point of their existence and yet lawmakers have just voted for more very painful cuts because they say it's the only way that they can prevent this country from going bankrupt. that is why you're seeing this kind of anger on the streets, with masked men throwing rocks at police, tear gas in the air. lawmakers are caught between a rock and a hard place and society is being pushed to the breaking point. erin?
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>> thanks very much. we will see what will happen. obviously, there is a crucial meeting for the eu this weekend on a bailout for greece and the european banks and that will matter big time for greece and global markets. now to syria where more government troops were killed in a firefight with dissidents according to a human rights group. arwa damon is in beirut tonight. and i'm particularly curious as to how moammar gadhafi's death is playing in syria. >> reporter: erin, more than a dozen people were killed in syria as the crackdown continues, but at the same time activists say they took to the streets in celebration, celebrating the death, and warning bashar al assad that he needed to be careful because he was about to be next and they vowed the protests would continue, planning, again, on
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having massive demonstrations take price friday across the entire country. erin? >> arwa, thank you. now to thailand where the worst flood in half a century has kill 320 people so far. max foster is in london. the floodwaters are inching toward bangkok. there have been reports of people in the northern parts of the city dying. what are residents doing to prepare? >> reporter: erin, the thai government has a terrible dilemma. the dams and levees are under so much pressure from the floodwaters that they have to open the floodgates to relief the pressure. residents are aware of this and trying to get out of the way. they're grabbing bottles of water from stores and driving their cars to higher ground. and officials are expecting the floodwaters to hit northern bangkok on friday, erin. >> all right. thank you. we'll keep monitoring that situation. now we'll go back to libya. is the death of moammar gadhafi proof that america is the world's only super power?
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our next guest is a former gop candidate. he has a pretty strong view on that. he's author of a book called "suicide of a super power, will america survive until 2025?" i spoke to pat buchanon before the show began tonight and i asked him if america scored a victory by killing gadhafi. >> i think we did score a victory that gadhafi is gone and it fits with the thesis in my book that tribalism is very much of the way of the future because of the killing of him in his hometown where the tribe is, it will be torn apart tribally. so i'm not sure how great a victory it is to the united states in terms of what is coming because i think what is coming could be very costly for the united states. >> 140 or so tribes in libya. >> 140 tribes in the eastern section of libya, as you know. that is the area where per capita they have more recruits for al qaeda than anywhere else.
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>> what about the arab spring? >> one, it's a good thing that the despots and tyrants go and the noxious forces and benevolent forces rise. i think you see them rising now across the middle east. look at what's happening to the christians there. 17 millions left. they're being% cuted, murdered and massacred. >> you see that in egypt. >> and the a syrian christians and in iraq and across the entire region. >> do they prove on one level when you talk about suicide of a super power, the democracy, and the freedom and the ideals that are the american dream are more alive and well than they've ever been before? >> any number of people have the idea in their hearts of being free. but when the shot goes down, mubarak has gone down. when the christians to beirut, what's going to happen?
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the christians in syria are scared to death. >> what about america, though? that america provided the power of nato. >> america is the number one military power and will be indefinitely in the future. but the truth is, erin, we're coming home from the world. you have the smallest number of troops in okinawa than you've had before. they are going to be coming home from germany. and they should. the super power is in retreat which i think is a good thing but not for mankind. it's a good situation for us.
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we have to fix or own situation. deaf a deficit for years and we're on our way to greece. >> so you think the one way that the two sides can agree on, the only thing they've agreed son not cutting entitlements but they have seemed to agree that we can cut the defense. >> you can't borrow from the persian gulf to give to the persian gulf. i think we need to start looking out for america first. >> we're going to hear more from pat buchanan when we come back. the presidential campaign, his dream ticket and what really is the american dream. fore! no matter what small business you are in, managing expenses seems to... get in the way. not anymore. ink, the small business card from chase introduces jot an on-the-go expense app made exclusively for ink customers.
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is america really losing its status as a superpower? pat buchanan came out front before our show began and i asked him about the rides of china and the quick of our time, is the world big enough for two super powers, america and china? this is what he had to say. >> i do believe this. we are going to have the american unipolar world, a single, last super power. that is definitely over.
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china is an emerging super power. by 2020, it will be the dominant power in asia and an emerging super power. >> if we're not dead by 2025, though. >> what concerns me is what has happened here at home. we seem to be disintegrating under one god, indivisible. and the terms we're using on each other, i mean, i'm on cable as you are. every day someone is calling someone else a racist. weapon didn't use those terms on each other, even during the civil rights era. >> that's true. your book has a chapter called "the end of white america." it's a startling term. i'm curious what you mean. isn't the end of white america, as we see the rise of hispanics, a good thing, that anybody can succeed here, no matter your religion or color of your skin or whatever?
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>> a little concerned, the majority of people looking like you is coming to an end, pat. so what is wrong with that is the idea when whites are minority in this country in 2041 and hispanics are 150 million, what is going to hold us together as we don't share values over what is right and wrong and whether equality means quality of rights or quality of rewards. >> the american dream, the spring, the arab dream. that's what holds us together. >> the society is in mortal conflict. i was with richard nixon in 1972. before you were born. they were the poorest people you've ever seen. now, much of the tyranny has
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been lifted and it's an equalness in china. millionaires and billionaires, as barack would say, but it's freer. >> but equality. >> before we go, who do you think is going to be the republican ticket? >> romney-rubio. but i would get into ohio because if they break out of there, they will have problems. they like mitt, but i'm not sure that they love him. missing you every day. >> i miss talking to you from wall street. right. >> all right. thanks to pat buchanan. what was the most amazing when pat was talking about the rise of china, when i was visiting libya, all the countries training vest there, the most amazing takeaway, all


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