tv Piers Morgan Tonight CNN October 29, 2011 6:00pm-7:00pm PDT
>> a preview on the next "cnn present ous ". >> priests accused of sex abuse. >> do you think the neighbors know about it? >> an alarming investigation, how they could be living in your neighborhood. an all-star cast, a controversial play. how a 30-year-old playwright is challenging the way we remember the last day of dr. martin luther king's last day of life. he was a businessman had changed the world, an ipod, a phone and an internet communicator. >> who is the real steve jobs? >> he's a risk taker, charismatic. >> brilliant and abrasive.
>> he would if somebody said something stupid instead of saying i'm not sure i agree with you, he'd say that's the stupidest blank, blanc, blank thing i have ever heard. >> and we might just change the wave you look at a legend. >> your time is limited so don't waste it living someone else's live. >> and top chef. a global empire and tv career. this is "pierz morgan tonight." steve jobs, a real fire storm, it's top of the charts, selling like hot cakes and you expect all that pause steve jobs is one of the great american business icons in history.
it's a fascinating book. and when i plucked out some of the adjectives you use, petulant, selfish, rude, on knocks, i'm not surprised. nothing surprises me he would be all those things. i would add a genius. can you be a genius without being all these things? >> i used to work for ted turner and i think every one of those a adjectives applied to him. and steve, everyone who loved them would always tell you about the steve story about the time he bit their head off but i'd try really hard to make people understand. he actually got people to do things that they never thought they could do just by inspiring them and sometimes berating them
but i think people understood it of them. >> he came to you a number of years ago and said you've done einstein, you've done kissinger, i want to you do my book. i guess the natural reaction is we didn't know he was sick with cancer, though he did, would have been presumptuous maybe. what was your reaction when he came to you? >> i said, hey, you're my age. in 20, 30 years or so i'd like to do an biography. it wasn't really until 2009 that i figured out and his wife told me you ought to do it now. that's when he just had his liver transplant. and of course i said yes, i'd love to do it and i think he had trepidation and second thoughts. >> a fascinating time to sit
down with him, a man who probably knew he was dying, man who has very bad pancreatic cancer, he's trying to few things. you say in the the book he tried too many alternative treatments and probably could have saved himself if he hadn't done that but typical of the man i would guess. >> i'm not sure he would have saved himself and very typical of the man. there's two sides of steve jobs, sort of this rebel, counterculture, child of the hippie period. he's always trying alternative new things but also the scientific technological geek. so he's doing the most advanced forms of medicine and he's studying both of these as he decides how to treat himself. i think that, you know, he never really thought, i don't think, that the cancer was going to catch him. up until almost the end he thought he was going to stay, as he put it, one step ahead of the cancer. he was doing targeted therapy and every time the cancer would
mutate, he'd find a new bullet in the way to stop it. so, you know, even though he was facing his mortality, even though even before he had cancer he used to talk about life, you're born and you die, i think that magical optimist being thinking he had up until the end he thought he was going to beat the cancer. >> you had a remarkable amount of time, over 40 interviews that you did with steve jobs, which is probably more time than anybody's had i would imagine with that brain outside his immediate family and closest friends. the obvious question to me was did you like him? >> i did. >> was he likable? >> he was compelling and likable because when you first meet him, you're afraid, okay, you've heard all the tales and i saw it every now and then. i'd be walking around with him, whether it was in a restaurant or a hotel or in a group of people. he would, if somebody said something stupid, instead of saying i'm not sure i agree with
you, he'd say "that's the stupidest blank, blank, blank idea i've ever heard." >> you heard him do that. this is where i've had a problem the way he was. you can have people in two camps, those who are polite to waitress and those who are rude to waitresses. and you tell a story how you've soon him be rude to waitresses. for a guy with power and wealth to be rude to a girl wagt a table, hard to like that type of person. likable? >> there are certain types of behavior, after a while he'd say that woman didn't really want to be waiting on that table. if you want to judge everybody
by politeness, you probably wouldn't find a whole lot of geniuses in the mix. >> was he driven by perfectionism? >> i think he had an artistic sensible, like picasso or bob dylan, driven by a power of perfection and almost a poetic sensibility. as i said a moment ago, there's that emotional, sentimental, romantic side of him and the business side of him and i think he was driven by connecting the two. whatever he did, even when it came to being tough on the people around him, that instilled such a loyalty and a passion that, you know, it was a bonding thing. he said that's the price of admission for being in the room. i get to say you're full of it, you get to say i'm full of it and we create the best team. >> i get that. i worked for rupert murdoch. when you work for those people,
they are all those adjectives i read about steve jobs but liz work harder than everyone else, they're creative, take risks, gamblers. >> you just described steve a risk gambler, charismatic, compelling. i got chewed out. one time i really got chewed out is because he said i'm going to have no control over this book, i'm not going to read it, he said i don't want it to feel like an in-house book. you're going to put this evenings in there i'm not going to like but that's good because it's not going to feel like some commissioned in-house book. but then there was a covered design, a publish are put out in a catalogue. he looked at it and he said in very short, snippy words that it was the worst thing that he had ever seen. and it had some merit to it.
after yelling at me for a while, i'm holding the phone like this, he says i'm not going to keep cooperating unless you let me have some input into the cover. i thought for maybe one second, one and a half seconds, sure. but i saw that sort of artistic passion. >> it was a very clean, apple-style cover. if you were designing a book cover for the head of apple, it would be that. >> it just shows how bad we were at the time. >> and he was right you think? you just said so. >> yeah. >> i like that cover. to me it instantly grabs you. >> it's like an apple product. >> it's clean and fascinatinfas. >> you know johnny ives. he says the drives toward simplicities means you really have to understand the depths of something. you can't just remove a lot of buttons and then it becomes simple. and that was the essence of the
johnny ives-steve jobs sense of living. >> it doesn't sound like he was the world's best engineer. i've always thought about steve jobs and i felt this strongly when he died and actually his genius it seemed to me partly was marketing. and cynical and ruthless. when i saw these first models come out, you really deliberately left a few things off that everyone would want. but they would know the moment he put them on the next version of that model, they'd all rush out and buy that, too. and that is brilliant marketing. but it's manipulative, it's cynical. >> steve said he's 50 times better than any engineer that steve jobs has ever met.
so wozniak has created a blue box that allows you to rip off the phone company and they're giving it away. steve jobs says, no, no, i can put a case around it and remarket it. lookly when woz comes up with brilliant design using the microprocessors and juicing them up to do great this evenings but it's jobs who says we're going to get a case for it, a power supply. >> it's a brilliant piece of engineering. what jobs brings -- either if you have one or the other, they would never be as great -- >> when you say lennon and mccartney, there's a part in the book i love and a moment i had with steve in his living room where they're listening to the
tapes he had of "strawberry fields" being created. and john lennon is doing it and mccartney is riffing on it with him. i don't know if you've ever heard it. and they'd hit a wrong cord and they'd rewind. steve would say that's exactly what i love doing at apple and with woz. we'd almost have it done and then we rewind and make it more perfect. i think woz and steve were that way, johnny ives and steve were that way, lennon and mccartney were that way. >> when we come become, we'll tack about what i think drives steve jobs and that's his extraordinary upbringing and as a i don't think man and what happens next in his search for his real parents and gripping part of his life. so if i didn't know better i'd say you're having some sort of big tire sale. yes we are. yeah. how many tires does ford buy every year? over 3 million. you say you can beat any advertised price on tires?
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i'm back on the road safely. and i saved you money on brakes. that's personal pricing. >> today for the first time ever i'd like to let mcintosh speak for itself. >> hello, i am mcintosh. it truly is great to get out of that bag. >> steve jobs in 1984 invented the first mcintosh computer. he looked so dashing there, didn't he? i remember that launch. i was feeling so excited because there was the showman. this man was not your
conventional geek. >> he choreographed everything about that. i think that one of the things he sort of invented along the 20,000 others was that notion of the product launch where the clouds part, the light shines down and the crowd sings hallelujah. >> it was like michael jackson doing a show, it was like that only with computers, making it an event, marketing it, promoting it. what i want to get to with him is how much was driven by the fact that he was basically abandoned at birth, he was given away by his real parents. and reading the book, it had come a crusade for him to find his real parents. >> i remember walking in his old neighborhood. heap said i went across the street and sat on this lawn and
lisa, who lived across the street said to me so you've been adopted, that means your real parents didn't want you, you were abandoned. he said i went back into my house and i saw my parents and i was crying and these are a salt of the earth couple that had adopted him and asked about that. and they said, no, we specifically picked you out, you were chosen. so he says to me that part of growing up wasn't just feeling a little bit of a hole like do i really fit here because, you know, i wasn't born into this but feeling chosen and special. i think there was always a little bit of a hole in him. he would tell his college friends in the early day of apple i feel something's missing of me. that why he does go on the quest to find his birth mother. >> and he's successful.
tell me about that. >> he gives up after he couldn't found his mother but he sees on the birth certificate of the name of the doctor in san francisco. he calls the doctor, it was a doctor for a shelter of unwed mothers and the doctor says all my records were destroyed, i can't tell you who your mother was. but that's not true, the doctor was actually lying. and that night the doctor wrote a letter and said to be delivered to steve jobs upon my death. and then the doctor died pretty soon thereafter. it was very coincidental. the letter comes to steve and says here's your mother. he finally tracks her done in los angeles and see says you have a sister in new york. it's one of those tales no one could have written. >> what is more extraordinary is when he begins the search for his father and in the end he never actually had anything to do with his father but it turns out by a freakish coincidence that he's met his real father
and the father was like, whoa, i met steve jobs. >> his sister, who he meets, is an artist. he loves that she's an artist and he says we have to go on this quest to find the lost father. he's not all that interested but she's able to track done the father who had been born in syria and had moved to california. there he is running a coffee shop in sacramento. mona goes to see him and steve says don't tell him anything about me, i don't want to have anything to do with this guy who abandoned you, abandoned your mother. he says i wish you could have seen me earlier when i ran this great restaurant, everybody used to come there, even steve jobs. so mona is taken aback.
she doesn't say anything. she doesn't say steve jobs is your son. he looks how shocked she is and he says, yeah, he used to come, he was a big tipper. mona tells steve and he says that balding syrian guy, that was my father? forget it, i don't ever want to see him. >> amazing story. >> couldn't make it up. >> did they have any type of contact at all? >> no, no. i think i've heard that the father has said he sent text messages but, no, there was no contact. >> what do you think that did to steve jobs? he obviously had this huge curiosity about his real parents. do you think he felt father toward his father in particular? >> i don't think he felt anger. i think he just didn't wanting in to do with the guy, he had abandoned the father, abandon mona. i think he was deeply connected to what he called his real
parents, the parents who adopted him, he didn't want to hurt him. paul jobs taught him how to do design and be a craftsman. even as a kid when steve didn't want to go to the same school, they scraped money together to buy a home so he could go to a different school district court. >> it was ironic that steve himself has a girl friend, he makes her pregnant and then he abando abandons, same age. >> and;s2÷ heap said i also -- , when it hit me, what a coincidence. steve of course takes responsibility for his daughter after a while. >> it was ten years. >> well, after the paternity test he then pays for her schooling and upbringing.
in the first ten years he's not that close to her but she's a good kid, spunky good kid, good writer and by the too many she's 8 or 10 years old, they're forming a good bond and she moves into his house. there's an arc to it and the people that steve, you know, had trouble with eventually they all bond with him. and certainly in her life she and all four of those children were very bonded to them. >> you can talk about the genius of apple as an institution in america, the part he played in making us all think differently. my mother made the best toffee in the world.
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i'm going to show you the back first because i'm in love with it. it's stainless steel, it's really, really durable, it's beautiful. and this is what the front of it looks like. boom. that's the ipod. i happen to have one right here in my pocket. >> steve jobs announcing the introduction of the ipod ten years ago. apple became the second biggest company in the entire world.
it became a company that was global in both its brand in terms of its power, its influence and he really did teach the world to think differently, didn't he? >> the amazing thing about the ipod is here's a personal computer company and it had finally clauped iwed its way bah the beautiful design and he discovers now we have to think different again. and he says we're going to do devices, devices that will make your computer sort of the hub of your digital lifestyle, it will be for music and phone and everything else. he takes apple in the againing of 2000 in this whole new direction. >> i guess what's so satisfying for him, the story is steve jobs
building up a lot, being cut off at the head, thrown out, discarded and goes off and has this amazing success in hollywood and comes back and takes over the company when it's dying on its knees and turns it into the biggest company of its type ever seen. >> it's one of those dramatic tales, cast out, returned from the wilderness. when he comes back he says we now have to focus. they were making mcintosh, 9600, 9400. ho said, no, we're going to make four machines. that's it. once he got that focus done, they would take the management retreats, take his top 100 people to an off site retreat and then they would fight over what are we going to do next? and after all weekend after hundreds of suggestions, they'd put ten on the board and cross
off the bottom three and say we're going to focus on the top three. and the big change is whether he decides now we're going to go into consumer devices and does the ipod. >> how important was his wife in his life? >> you know, everything about steve is the connection of sort of the romantic sort of ethereal, poetic side of steve and smart, sensible side and she's the connection. >> i want to read a line from the book "we didn't know each other 20 years ago, we were died by our intuition, he swept me off our feet, years passed, kids came, good times, hard times but never bad times." . it's a great line, very romantic. >> we were sitting in his living room right before his
anniversary and he pulled out his iphone and read that to me. this is is what i'm going to write, the same to her, and i'm going to put the peck turs from our wedding day 20 years ago in it. and he was reading at that and all of a sudden he is crying. he's a deeply, intensely emotional person. when people talk about whaent he hard to live with as a family guy, hard to work with as a business guy? yes, but how many people have marriages like that that are incredibly tight, faithful in which they really sort of fit together both the sensible side and the poetic side. >> it shouldn't be some he's all fantastic. this should be what he's really like. she knew what he's really like. she knows he's difficult. >> you always say you want to know. he said he wanted something that didn't feel in-house and a lot
of friends would say -- she would say, okay being tell him about steve because i want all sides. of course now that he's gone, you know, it's hard. >> have you had a reaction -- >> no. >> nothing at all? are you surprised? >> no, no. i've been in touch. i just don't really want to talk about what their different thoughts might be. >> i don't want to push you but i imagine it's because they've not been massively enjoying the negatives in the headline, even though i as someone who didn't know him don't see them as necessarily negatives. if that makes any sense to you. >> they knew him well. i think it a very emotional time for everybody. >> let's take another break, come back and talk about what turned out to be the fight of his life, a fight he eventually lost against cancer and what you think as his biographer, what you think he would like his
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inner voice and most important have the courage to follow your heart and intuition. >> steve jobs giving the address at stanford university. we've seen that many times since he died. it's a very prophetic statement. you put in the book the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world are the ones they do from apple's own "think different" commercial in 1997. that's what he was in many ways. he was the great maverick. when it came to his illness, do you think he ever really appreciated he was going to die or did he exude an heir of infallibility to you? >> i think that he understood mortality even before he got cancer. and there are so many people who remember him as a young man saying, you know, we all are going to die, the arc of our life is this way. and he told people he thought he was going to die young. and he said it was liberating. he said it allows me to follow, as he did at stanford, my
intuition and my passion. i do believe that once he got the cancer, he was so focused on the great treatments he was getting based on, you know, t g targeted therapies that he thought he would be the first person to outrun the cancer like that by staying one step ahead of it. >> i have a quote by johnny ives. we'll discuss it after this. >> bold, crazy, magnificent ideas or quiet simple ones, which in their subtlety, their detail they were utterly profound. >> i mean, so right and very moving. they had such an extraordinary relationship together. >> there was a wonderful tale when johnny was doing the first imac, the one that looks blue, translut ent and it hopped on to
your desktop. johnny says he wants to put a little handle recessed into the top. you never really use a handle, you're not moving a desktop around but he intuitively felt his mother was afraid of computers and the handle gives you permission to touch. and he said -- he presented it to the engineers. they said, no, that's going to cost too much, it's pointless. the minute he says it to steve jobs, boom, steve gets it intuitively. johnny sometimes said steve would act as if some of jeanohns ideas were steve's but he said if he hadn't had agreed with his ideas they would have died.
>> he seems almost inhuman some ways in giving employees credit. what drives that aspect of steve jobs' character you think? >> i do think by the time he create what is is now apple in his top team, he truly appreciated each and every person on that team and l he's talking about tim cook, johnny ives, fuller, he really had a deep love for what they did. i think early on he just had this way of thinking which is you give him an idea and he says that's stupid and i week later he'd say let do that idea and that would be his way of processing it. in the end the ideas got done and he made even with the early mcintosh each and every member of that team signed the inside of the case. he said you were the artists. real artists sign their work. >> what would he have been most
proud of? >> besides the obvious thing that he had four great kids and loved his family, the thing he most wanted to be remembered for was creating a company where people can flourish. he said i grew up in silicon valley but where you depend on the creations of people before you and you want to put certainly back in the stream of history. he said a lot of companies, they disappear after a couple of generations. only by building a lasting company can you build lasting innovation connected to technology. >> preposterous as it seems at the time that i want the man who did the biography of einstein to right about me, do it seem like that today? >> i'd put him in the line with ford and ben franklin. you can start with einstein but
somewhere in one of those orbits you have to have steve jobs. >> i agree. >> thank you. >> coming up, his shrinking waistline and serving salads to those 1%ers. that no one notices you?" and i'm like, "doesn't it bother you you're not reliable?" and they say, "shut up!" and i'm like, "you shut up." in business, it's all about reliability. 'cause these guys aren't just hitting "print." they're hitting "dream." so that's what i do. i print dreams, baby. [whispering] big dreams. fore! no matter what small business you are in, managing expenses seems to... get in the way. not anymore. ink, the small business card from chase introduces jot an on-the-go expense app made exclusively for ink customers.
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best loved chef. he has a new book. he joins me now. welcome, sir. >> thank you very much for having me, sir. >> are you actually italian? >> i'm an italian american. >> do you feel italian? >> i do in that after studying college and figuring out the restaurant business from the american perspective, i moved to a tiny little hill town near florence, which is where i learned to speak italian. >> are you fluent? >> completely. [ speaking italian ] >> your restaurants appeal very much to what michael moore would say is the 1%.
how are you seeing the economy impact on those people? >> i have 19 restaurants, nine of which are around new york city, we have everything from a pizzaeria. what i must point out from traveling around the country a little bit and knowing my friends in the business, it seems new york city and los angeles are a little insulated from the full fallout, even if a real number is more like 90 and 10 and we're lucky enough to be in place where because there's tourism and people not just relying on their own jobs, they're here in new york to try food, try theater. think the theaters are still doing pretty well. it works for us. >> you're a fiery individual, you know, you like to be passionate, lose your temper, you're a good businessman, you get things down, you employ
people, you're successful. if you were running the country, would what would you do to fix this malaise? >> i'm not sure. the base of the problem right now is that truly more than any other time before are we truly 50/50. it both sides. and the republicans and that guard prepare themselves in a way to present it more like a really successful advertising campaign and they're also in every knife fight with a knife. i think obama came in with a really great idea and i love him but he came into a knife fight without a knife. at the end of the day our politics need someone to get in there and you have to fight for every inch. all the time. you can't take a break. >> and especially in new york. it war every day on these streets, isn't it? you're competitive with each other, the restaurant business is thriving but incredibly
competitive. you must wake up and want to kill your rivals in a business sense. obama seems like too nice a guy sometimes. >> the beauty of new york city is if even if 3 million people hate you, there's 5 million left. you don't have to create a focus group successful restaurant. can you just have a point of view. if it's big enough and wide enough that people appreciate if -- some people come in and say i want you to play opera, well, then get your own damn restaurant. we play rock 'n' roll because it fits. >> you also have the world's, i think, most long suffering wife and i'm going to show you why. look at this clip. >> what about the sh reek response? >> i would sh reek if i saw you going down the street.
>> you're like a latter day james bond. the shades, gwyneth paltrow. >> let's not pretend she's my wife. chris wasn't there, he was busy working on a recording. >> do you pinch yourself sometimes? you're a working class lad worked his way to the top. there you are in the car with gwyneth paltrow with this business empire. what do you think sometimes. >> life smiles upon those who smile upon life. there is a component of luck to being in the right place at the right time. you have to be able to capitalize when luck shines away on you. i've been lucky and worked hard and we're go a good position to all the people suffering out there, the ones who lost their jobs, their homes, whatever, what message to you give them? what do you tell these people? >> i say the best way to do it is at least 20% of the time try to find a way to do something
for somebody else who hasn't asked you to do it because that builds your karma account. keep your head down and keep in the game and don't be daunted by what seems to be a long-term setback when in fact if you're careful and pay attention, it might be a short-term setback. we're in tough times. a lot of people need to re-evaluate what they're going to do for the next 20 years. maybe being in the banking industry or something that hasn't worked in the industrial business may not work. as i can see from looking at it, the auto industry has come back from the brink of disaster and wrangled production back into american hands. we're good at doing stuff. it's when we launch ourselves only into the service industry we would slowly fadeaway. we have too many. people here to be all service people. we need to producetings and make things here. >> we'll come back and talk to you about your book "sempl family meals." i can only cook one thing,
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each with a glass of the local wine. this could take years. >> i want to come with you. >> you can. that's your new abc show. that's the way i want to die, a sort of two to three-year gastronomic orgy. >> one thin wafer, boom. >> what a way to go, i this i. what's been the best meal you've ever had, the one if i said mario, you've got four hours to live, you can have one meal again. >> i had a remarkable meal at the sushi stand at the skeejee market in tokyo that was so remarkable in that it was everything fresh na i had just seen. it was served at 4:45 or 5:00 in the morning. the only thing missing was my family. i'd have to have my family right there, and we would be in great shape. that remarkable kind of procession of remarkable flavors that so spoke of everything that
i had just seen and how they put it together in the simplest way and how much it paid off on the tongue was remarkable. >> cooking at its essence should be simple. you can't go for the fancy gastronomy. if you ask me, i would much prefer to have simple food presented simply. this book's perfect, "simple family meals." what's the concept of this? >> there's two kind of concepts going at the same time. the most important one is that people sit down at the table as often as they can. in this hectic time with text messages and voice mails and e-mails and a thousand ways not to pay attention to the people, even the ones you're in the same room as, the idea that americans are moving away from each other at quantum rates is because they don't really spend anytime where they remove all of that electronics and just have a conversation. when you talk about what builds
confidence in your children, when you have regular meals with them, you're allowed to share both your success and lack of success on certain things in a way that allows you to know you're empowered to move forward even in lack of success. and the meal is the most logical and normal time to get people together. so this book kind of breaks the seasons as opposed to four into 12. every month as a different mantra. each one has a pain course, three pastas, five vegetable dishes and a dessert and a soup. if you think about it, you don't have to make all those at once. sometimes the way to lure people in your family back to the table is by creating something they really love. so create a family dish and a kind of tradition. instead maybe of going seven nights which i like, maybe just sunday or monday. choose a day when you open up the table, everyone gets something they really like and they spend time and perhaps even more significant than that is when the dishes are dirty and you finish. instead of rushing forward to get onto the next thing, make sure everyone sits will for 15
minutes and just languishes over each other's company without necessarily having anything to do. >> i don't want to offend you in any way, but you are half the man you used to be, mario. what's happened to you. >> 20%. >> disappearing. how much weight have you lost? >> i lost about 50 pounds from the time we worked on the spain series which i believe was at my biggest. >> too much paella? >> too much of everything. >> did you have a moment where you said enough. >> i saw the first screening of the show and said i can't believe how biggie am. my trick has been to eat almost the same things, try to eat a little bit more significantly and cut the portions in half. >> i don't think you should lose much more. >> i'd love to lose another 30. >> i am always terrified when i see a skinny chef. it doesn't look right to me. >> i still won't be skinny. >> a size zero chef