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tv   The Lead With Jake Tapper  CNN  April 14, 2014 1:00pm-2:01pm PDT

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reat griffin underwad was 14. thank you so much for joining us. i'm don lemon. "the lead" with jake tapper starts right now. the man accused of shooting and killing three people at two jewish centers will be charged under hate crime laws. why would he not also be considered a domestic terrorist? i'm jake tapper. this is "the lead." and the national lead. we'll be joined by a man who lost both his father and his nephew in an instant. the world lead. the focus for flight 370 finally, finally moves under the water. do they have something to go on? was the co-pilot on his cell phone right around the time the
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plane vanished? also in world news, eat my exhaust, say the russians. the russian jet over the black sea at a time when tensions in ukraine are dividing moscow and washington. and what was the director of the cia doing in ukraine's capital this weekend? good afternoon, everyone. welcome to "the lead." we'll begin with the national lead. a missouri man will face hate crime charges for allegedly killing three people at two separate jewish facilities. moments ago the tapes were released as it happened. >> four or five shots have been fired into the front door. there's a male with a shotgun. and 12 shots have been fired into the door. >> we just had another call. 123rd and nall. subject shot a female in the
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parking lot. white said dal, male with shotgun. >> 73-year-old frazier glenn cross is accused of shooting three people. he has a long history of spewing anti-semantic venom, including at the moment of his arrest. the feds say he will not only face murder charges but hate crime charges as well. >> we have now determined that the motivation behind this was a hate crime. we've learned that the acts that this person committed were the result of beliefs and his -- were a result of beliefs that he had and he was trying to hurt somebody based on their ethnicity, race, religion. >> yesterday was the day before
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passover which begins this evening. cross was caught with at least three firearms. investigators say that he bought his guns through a separate straw buyer, which means he never went through background checks. investigators have now released the names of all of cross' alleged victims. none is actually jewish. 52-year-old terry lamona was a catholic visiting her mother at the community center. reat grif fin underwood and his grandfather had driven to the center to take part in a singing contest. joining us is william corporon who lost his father and nephew in the shootings. on behalf of me and all of my viewers, i'm so sorry for your loss. how are you and your family dealing with this unspeakable
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tragedy? >> minute by minute. just coming together, trying to cope and deal with it as best we can. this is one of those things you never think is going to happen and now we're planning for two funerals. it's horrific. >> what went through your mind when you first learned what happened? >> my brother-in-law called me and just had a few words on the phone, kind of frantic, and said something about my father being shot and he would call me back. just disbelief and panic and it was a few more minutes before i immediately tried to call my dad and, basically, he didn't answer. after a few minutes, i don't even know how long, i got another call and talked to my mother. probably 20 minutes later and
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found out he was dead and started making plans to head up here to kansas city with my wife and young daughter and we came up last night. >> it's clear that your methodist faith is very important to your family. is it helping you make sense of any of this? is it providing comfort at this horrible time? >> no. it makes -- it's making no sense of it at all fbut it absolutely provides comfort. there is evil and no one in my family believes that god is doing this to punish us or cause us harm. you know, evil people do evil things and what we will rely on is our faith to get us through this knowing full well that it's only by the grace of god that we're going to be able to pull
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together and come to grips with what has happened and rely on each other to get through this. i mean, we've got huge holes now in our family that will never be filled. we're just going to have to do our best to continue my father's legacy, to continue the legacy that reat was certainly destined to live and just do our best to carry on. >> tell us about reat and tell us about your father. >> well, reat was just so wonderful. 14-year-old, very bright. straight a student, loved to sing, loved to perform from a very young age, loved to be in plays, very musical, very musically gifted. many, many friends, so many friends have come together, his friends. you know, he and my father were only here because he was trying out, auditioning for this
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scholarship competition of some sort. i'm not sure exactly what it was. he had already earned a couple of spots this summer for some local theater. so he really was doing well with that and just a freshman in high school. my father, i don't even know where to start. i'm not sure i'll ever be able to measure up to the man he was. i'm certainly going to try. he absolutely was a faith and family first and that's not putting words to that. he absolutely was. he and my mother moved up here into kansas city to be closer to my sister and her husband and my brother and his wife and their children a few years ago, so they could be closer to grand irn whic children, do be involved in their day-to-day activities. my father was still a practicing physician. as a matter of fact, he should have been seeing patients today.
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so, you know, he was robbed of that and people helping in his line of work were robbed of his healing hands and there are thousands of people all across, you know, oklahoma and the midwest and people whose lives that he's touched that i've heard from, that have been in touch with my mom and friends and family and the outpouring has been absolutely tremendous. my father leaves a huge legacy of community and of healing and it's just unbelievable that al sensible, stupid act can cause so much hurt and grief and pain and while we mourn his loss and reat's loss and certainly the other woman, we by no means want to discount in any way that, while we certainly mourn their loss, this week as it is easter week, holy week, we're going to do our best to celebrate their
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life as best we can. >> will corporon, god bless your family during these trying times. >> thank you very much, jake. >> not only was the suspect a member of the nazi party of america in the 1970s, he was founder of the carolina knights of the ku klux klan and later founded the white patriot party and spent three years in prison on weapons charges. he appeared on the "howard stern show" where they did not have to work hard to get him riled up. >> what is the biggest problem with the jews? >> they control the federal government. they control the mass media. they control the federal reserve bank. and with these powers, they are committing genocide against the white race. >> let's bring in heidi. frazier glenn cross has been on
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your group's radar for a long time. tell me about that? >> yes, we've been tracking him since the early '70s and the '80s. he's a hardcore anti-semite and white supremacist and basically his life work has been hating jews. we sued one of his groups for paramilitary activity and for harassing african-americans back in the '80s. and in revenge for that, he actually targeted our founder, morris dees for assassination. >> do you think he should be facing terrorism charges instead of just hate crime charges? >> i think that's a really good question, jake. because the fact of the matter is, when we look at domestic terrorism in the united states over the last several years, most of the threat here is coming from white supremacist
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like cross or from people who really hate the government and i have a feeling that the charges would probably be more hefty or at least this incident would be described as domestic terrorism if it had been islamic extremism and we need to take these kinds of threats much more seriously. because this really is terrorism. frazier glenn cross spent his entire life trying to destroy minorities and jews. this was a political attack, just like an al qaeda attack would be. >> you sounded the alarm about this man for decades. do you feel like law enforcement heeded your warning seriously? >> i don't think there's been enough emphasis on this particular threat. we've been very critical of the department of homeland security's intelligence efforts, for example, on this front and more needs to be done. the fact of the matter is, these domestic terrorists are hiding
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in plain sights on these forums. he's been producing rants almost nonstop for a decade on a site with 12,000 posts and we should probably be spending more attention to people on these forums for the potential of violence, like what happened yesterday. >> heidi, thank you so much for your time. we appreciate it. coming up, the next phase in the search for flight 370 after days without any more pings, the investigation moves under water. is the search small enough to find the black boxes? plus, new details about the pilot's co-pilot. it was turned on roughly a half hour after the plane's last communication. where investigators picked up the signal. that's coming up. [ children yelling ] [ telephone rings ] [ shirley ] edward jones. this is shirley speaking. how may i help you?
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a u.s. official tells cnn that a cell phone tower may have actually detected the co-pilot's cell phone around the time of disappearance. the official says there is no indication that the co-pilot was making a call but this could mean -- could mean that the plane was flying low enough to obtain a signal from a cell tower. we'll explore that possibility with pamela brown. at the same time, investigators on australian's "ocean shield" search are waiting to find out if a sample taken from an oil slick downwind of the search area is a match for flight 370. all of this while sonar technology on loan from the u.s. navy has finally been deployed to scour the sea floor. our rene marsh has all of the latest. >> reporter: a strategy shift in the search for flight 370's black boxes. >> it's time to go under water.
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>> reporter: and possible new evidence. >> an oil slick in the search vicinity. we'll investigate those to the conclusion. >> reporter: it's been six days since the last pings were detected in the south indian ocean. searchers believe the pinger batteries are probably dead. so they've retired the pinger locator and launched bluefin-21. the underwater vehicle will skin the sea floor for wreckage. >> i'll caution you to not raise hopes that the deployment of the autonomous underwater vehicle will detect aircraft wreckage. it may not. >> reporter: bluefin is concentrating on a roughly 500-square mile where the pings were detected. but the process is slow. it takes two hours to reach the ocean floor, 16 to scan the area, two hours to return, and about four hours to download data, which includes
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high-resolution 3-d maps like this. the other development, an oil slick discovered nearly 3 1/2 miles away. a sample was collected for testing. but if it's believed the jet ran out of fuel, could the slick really be from flight 370? it will be days before results are in. the surface search for debris continues more than 1300 miles northwest of perth. with 11 military aircraft, one civil aircraft and 15 ships. but this part of the search could wind down this week. >> the chances of any floating material being recovered have greatly diminished and it will be appropriate to consult with australia's partner to decide the way ahead later this week. >> reporter: day 38, the first attempt at looking at the floor of the south indian ocean, what houston calls an area new to man. the ocean floor in this area is not sharply mountainous. it's more flat with rolling
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hills. there's also a lot of silt on the bottom that can be layered and deep. of course, that could complicate the search for wreckage. jake? >> thanks, rene. a lot of new developments. let's bring in rob mccallum, david soucie, author of "why planes crash." rob, let's start with the bluefin-21, this underwater drone of sorts. even with a narrow search area, this is not going to be quick. explain how the bluefin mission will work and if it captures something that could be the wreckage, how that data gets to those above the water. let's ask that to david soucie. >> well, i'm not sure i'm qualified to answer that with rob sitting here next to me. he seems more qualified to answer that question but as far as how it goes, it's supposed to get down and get a swath but i understand that rob might have
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some questions about it. he knows something about the depth ability of that bluefin-21 and we've been talking about some concerns we have about the ability to reach that depth. >> let me ask you this, then, david. do you think they waited too long to switch to the bluefin? >> you know, i was thinking that at first because i was real certain that that battery wasn't going to last more than 35 days and they kept going on day after day and i felt so empathetic for the families, trying to get some information. but after thinking about it some more, i can understand why angus houston did not want to -- he wanted to exhaust every possibility. so it didn't ever come back to him and say, you just didn't give it enough time. he's doing this slowly and methodically and it's frustrating. it's frustrating for us and those families but i think he's doing it the right way. >> david, there have also been discussions about whether they are going to continue the aerial search after the next few days. the planes looking for debris.
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at this point, i don't even know how many days we're into it, 38 or something like that, do you think it's useful at all? do you think it's possible that debris would be helpful so far after the incident? >> well, it probably would be helpful but the primary clues in an accident like this is not from the floating debris. it's primarily used to get you to the accident site. so at this point i would find it justified to abandon the aerial search. what we do find is going to be so far spread, i'm not sure it's going to give us much good and i'm very confident that they are going to find something below that with the bluefin and we're going to be looking at wreckage and get some clues there. i think there will be plenty of clues down there at the ocean floor. >> the australians say this is all they have in terms of pings. the four pings and narrowed search area. i guess it's possible that nothing is going to come of this search with the bluefin, even if
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it searches for months and months and months. then what? >> well, that's possible. but man, i don't know where you start then at that point. if there's nothing down there, you know, they've exhausted so many different options, so many different capabilities, they've extended the search to areas far beyond what we ever would have expected it to be. so if there's nothing down there, i think it's time to go back and relook at the inmarsat data, possibly fly that route with another aircraft exactly and see if it really is that inmarsat data is accurate. there is data to go back to but i think this is the best shot and i'm still pretty confident that we're in the right place. >> david soucie, thank you so much. we've lost our signal with rob mccallum. our apologies to him. when we come back, making a statement in the black sea. a russian fighter jet is getting really close to a u.s. navy ship. what the pentagon is saying about this provocative maneuver.
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welcome back to "the lead." in other world news, call it too close for comfort. a russian fighter jet made a dozen low-altitude passes over the "uss donald cook" in the black sea in what could be most direct confrontation between the united states and russian forces in years. the plane appeared to be unarmed but the pentagon is still calling the fly-by provocative. guess who was in kiev this weekend? john brennan. that's what we have learned from
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jay carney. meanwhile, the crisis on the ground threatens to spill over. pro-russia protesters, that's what we're calling them now, have had control over the police headquarters and are refusing to blink as the ultimatum from the ukrainian government passes without apparent consequences. nick paton walsh has been following all of this from donetsk, ukraine. it seems that they didn't have a lot of teeth. what is the situation where you are right now. >> reporter: you're right, jake. we are seeing minimal sign of the ukrainian government and law enforcement in this area at all. people in there are no longer worried about the siege at all. they said we saw a ukrainian military helicopter passover the center of donetsk and this held
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out by the interim president if the deadline for disarming wasn't met by the pro-russian protesters. we have another one 48 hours ago which passed with an aborted attempt at a security operation to free the town of slovyansk where much of the violence has been focused. there are reports now, some on russian media, of ukrainian armor movements happening in this area but we have not seen any substantial efforts. a remarkable admission from the white house that cia director john brendan did in fact come to kiev. that will feed the russian claims that they are pushing extraordinarily hard for state-backed media, that somehow the west is fueling this, backing this when they say that russia is behind it. when you look at the coordination of what is happening here, there are no signs of russian involvement, something other than these local
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protests must be calling the shots here. jake? >> nic, this jet nearly buzzing a ship, do you think the area is getting ready for an armed confrontation? >> reporter: it's a surreal time to be in ukraine. i've been covering this for over a decade. we're seeing such tension being fermented here. the anger is quite remarkable. we have these 40,000 russian troops across the border and overshadowing everything here. if the ukrainian government moves in with any sort of force at all, everyone is very worried about the ukrainian government, damned if they do, damned if
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they don't. they may sway the territory here entirely and if they don't -- if they do move, they run the risk of the russian military coming in heavy handedly. it's a lose-lose and i don't know what nato can do either. jake? >> nick paton walsh in ukraine, thanks. now both the guardian and washington post have won the higher honor in journalism for it. the pulitzer prize. no reporters were named but several played a role, including nsa edward snowden. as for snowden, he's presumably still in russia where he has been granted temporary asylum. the bost"the boston globe" also
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breaking news of the boston marathon bombing one year ago tomorrow. sources say the co-pilot's phone was picked up by a cell tower but why were no passenger folks picked up as well. these members of congress are no strangers to tax problems of their own. a first on cnn investigation coming up. i have low testosterone. there, i said it. how did i know? well, i didn't really. see, i figured low testosterone would decrease my sex drive...
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mysteriously shut off. so we're learning that this is unusu unusual, the fact that the phone was on. it's standard operating procedure for crews to shut off their phones. the fact that the phone appeared to be on and appeared to connect with a secell tower in the area where the plane turned around, it tells that the phone was on and must have been supplying at a low enough altitude for the cell phone to connect with the cell tower. there's no indication that an actual phone call was made. >> does that mean that a call wasn't made or they don't know? >> they don't know. he could have attempted to make a phone call and just because there was communication between the tower and cell phone doesn't mean that he could have made a call that connected. the cell tower, as far as we know, only picked up the co-pilot's cell phone, only
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picked up the co-pilot's cell phone, which suggests that his was the only cell fophone actuay turned on and not on airplane mode. >> do we know whether he turned it on and whether it was on the entire plane? >> that's a good question. we don't know if he turned it on during the flight which, of course, would be telling if he did or if it was on from the moment the plane took off. so those are, of course, questions that the investigators are asking. they've searched passengers' phone records and the crews' records and no indication that a phone call was placed. >> if everybody was alarmed, a lot of phones would go on. we only know of this one? >> we only know of this one. that's interesting. it's sort of curious, if you will, the fact that the cell tower only picked up one phone and if other phones were turned on, it likely would have picked up those phones as well.
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so why it was on, we just don't know. it doesn't tell us who was alive, who was dead and what the motive was but it certainly is curious. >> interesting. another data point. pamela brown, thank you so much. let's bring in our panel of experts. keith is part of the u.s. correspondent for four winds on- consulting. captain, i want to start with you. how unusual is it for a pilot to have his phone on in flight? >> it's pretty unusual but not heard of. normally we have a four push check list which is the last check list that you do before you push the plane back. that's normally the time that the pilots look at their phones and put them into airplane mode or turn them off. every once in a great while you'll see a guy that will forget to do that and keep his phone on and he'll find his battery drained by the end of the flight. the way that you can find that out is you can tell which cell towers are listening to that
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phone and connecting with that phone during the taxi out and takeoff of the plane and that should be a fairly easy thing for the authorities to do as when the jet took off. they can tell when the airplane was cleared for takeoff on the runway. if cell phone towers were hitting on the phone at that point, he just left it on. if it was not being hit and he turned it on sometime during the night, that would be another clue. that might tell us something further down the road. >> interesting. keith, what do you think is the next logical step in this investigation? >> well, i think, jake, what do we know? we know that the cell phone affiliation from penang correlates with the pings from the inmarsat. those are things that we know. things that we don't know, this odd sort of thing that no other
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planes were on the plane, 30% of people forget to turn on their phones or don't comply. in asia, you have an ov over-proliferation. that seems odd to me. that sort of stands out here. >> what would it indicate to you? what would it suggest to you? >> i think we've got to see further investigation. we've seen piece parts. we're seeing pieces of information come out over time. i think what we're going to see as this investigation continues is dribs and drabs of information as they go back through the data and follow new leads. i would be surprised to learn that this is the only phone on. >> if the transponder stopped working due to a mechanical issue but the co-pilot's phone would work, isn't it odd that he wouldn't have made a mayday phone call?
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>> there are many backup systems and communication devices available to the crew. you have to remember, they had two -- at least two operating independent radio or voice communication. they had one operating for acars communication and the transponder for radar signal and communication. and for all of those things to be shut out, to stop working means either a massive electrical failure, which is highly unlikely with an aircraft with that many backup systems or something else that we can't even imagine right now which really points to the fact that it is very important that we find this airplane because these are some clues that don't -- aren't normally uncovered in the normal safety systems research that we do. >> keith, how can investigators use this new information to piece together what happened? if you were in charge of the investigation, taking this data point, that the phone was on, what else would you now be
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looking for? >> well, i would want to see the records from the phones that are associated with the other passengers on that manifest, as the pilot pointed out, we're going to be able to see that. those phones would be affiliated while it was taxing off outside from where it could communicate with the cell phone towers. that would tell us a little bit more about this idea that we have this single phone that affiliated. so that would be the first place i'd go. >> keith, captain john, thank you so much for joining us. i hope that malaysian government officials heading this investigation are listening. coming up, this just in, what do you say to another world leader after one of his military jets throws a little chin music at your ship in the ocean? plus, responsible for writing the tax laws yet several members of the powerful house, ways and means committee have
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had tax problems themselves. our cnn investigation is coming up.
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welcome back to "the lead," our money lead now. tax day is tomorrow. i don't know if you need any reminding. but while americans are scrambling to find out that their 1099s are in order, you can expect the ways and means committee would know how not to run afoul of the irs. but as our own chris frates reports, some of the lawmakers continue to face tax problems of their very own. >> reporter: the powerful house ways and means committee is responsible for writing our nation's tax laws but at least eight of the committee's 39 members have faced tax problems of their own. take new york congressman tom reed. he's been late paying his property taxes not once, not twice, but 46 times since 2005. according to county records, he racked up more than $6200 in penalty and interest on more than $100,000 in taxes. on this stunning lakefront
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property and this corning home, reed missed a combined 16 tax payments in nine years. these four buildings had a total of 20 late payments in the past eight years and the list goes on. >> what happened? why were you late on your taxes? >> well, it's just like a lot of people. these are things that just happen and they were paid in the allotted time. >> reporter: but reed is a member of congress writing our tax laws. >> this is real property tax bills which is different than what the ways and means committee does with income tax. we're paying them within the allotted time and that's it. >> reporter: reed likened to missing a utility bill, saying that while he was late and paid penalties because of it, the taxes never went unpaid. >> it's outrageous. >> reporter: steve ellis is with taxpayers for commonsense. >> nobody wants to feel like a
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chump and if they see their tax payers are not paying their bills, it's going to make them wonder why they are paying theirs. >> reporter: for years he fought state tax officials, refusing to pay $1.4 million in backed income taxes, interest, and penalties. he designed requests for an interview. but the ohio tax commissioner disagreed writing in the ruling that his fellow republican failed to act in good faith. he finally paid his bill. another, pat tiberi, instead of hiring employees for the 2008 and 2010 cam ppaigns, he hired consultants as independent contractors and avoided the payroll taxes. the republican said the practice was above board.
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>> and you feel like you followed the irs? >> absolutely. we have a tax lawyer. that's a reason why campaigns are so expensive. we have a cpa who does our filing, we have tax lawyers that are on call to make sure that we follow the letter of law. >> reporter: tax issues by other ways and means members run the gamut. paul ryan had to pay a fine for understating his income to the mundane indiana republican todd young paid $1500 after a mortgage escrow mix-up to the outrageous irs problems causing $2.5 million for buchanan. and perhaps the largest was charlie rangel. he failed to pay taxes on his rental income from his swank villa in the dominican republic.
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we checked out every member of the committee, both democrats and republicans. and while some of these tax issues could happen to everybody, others are more egregious. the fact remains that 20% of the men and women in charge of writing the national's tax laws have had tax problems themselves. jake? >> chris frates, thank you for that. the pentagon is calling the move provocative. what did president obama say to vladimir putin about the fighter jet coming very close to a u.s. navy ship? their conversation just ended. we've got the details coming up next. peace of mind is important when you're running a successful business. so we provide it services you can rely on. with centurylink as your trusted it partner, you'll experience reliable uptime for the network and services you depend on. multi-layered security solutions keep your information safe, and secure.
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welcome back to "the lead." i'm jake tapper. breaking news on the crisis in ukraine. we learned that president obama and russian president vladimir putin spoke on the phone. the chat comes after the news that a russian jet reportedly flew way too close to a navy warship in the black sea, making a dozen low level passes on the
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"uss donald cook." senior white house correspondent michelle kosinski has more. what are we learning? >> reporter: we get a summary first from the white house and then the kremlin and their vastly differing accounts about what went on in that phone call. it almost seems like it's an entirely different conversation. that's what happened last time president obama and putin spoke on march 28th. this time we know that the phone call took place. we're just hearing the summary from the kremlin and they are saying that the protests that have been going on beyond crimea and into ukraine, as the kremlin puts it, the kiev's authority inability and unwillingness to take into account the needs and and the russian speaking populations within that area. blaming it on kiev, basically, saying that they haven't done
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enough to cater to the people there and take their rights into account and the kremlin called america's use of the term meddling, accusing russia of meddling in ukraine, they called that inaccurate. and that the kremlin called on ukraine to craft a new constitution that would focus on those other populations within ukraine. well, the u.s. take -- we don't have the read-out on the phone call just yet. we expect that very soon but the u.s. is seeing this entirely differently and increasingly over the last couple of weeks, we've seen the obama administration use much stronger language in defining that situation. we haven't seen additional action. in fact, today the press secretary was just barraged by questions from reporters as to why the u.s. hasn't taken further action against russia because, you know, clearly the situation is escalating. in fact, we know that president putin spoke to president yolanda
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france today and the white house said that russia has been involved in a campaign to undermine and destabilize the ukrainian government. that's pretty strong language and that's been continuing, jake. >> michelles cou kosinski at th white house, thank you. now i turn you over to wolf blitzer in "the situation room." three major stories we're following. a new phase. the search for flight malaysia flight 370 moves deeper under water with an unmanned sub. why was the first officer's cell phone turned on? growing crisis. violence growing in ukraine. what did president obama just say in his phone call with vladimir putin? family's grief. a woman who lost her father and son speaks out at anmo