tv Erin Burnett Out Front CNN January 12, 2015 4:00pm-5:01pm PST
transportation and london madrid. now we're having a conversation in the post snowden era about how to increase security. we got to step back and say the world is difficult. >> we got to leave it there, guys. thanks for watching. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com "outfront" tonight, breaking news in the arrest in connection with the paris terror attacks and more accomplishes on the loose. plus new surveillance video shows one of france's most wanted terrorist entering turkey on her way to syria. the international manhunt is on and my guest tonight, a jihad turned cia agent. his meetings with the muslim clergy that inspired this attack. and good evening, i'm erin
burnett. "outfront" breaking news. a new arrest in connection to paris attacks. reuters is suspects ties and the brothers of course are behind it. al qaeda's recruiter in europe tied to two of the terrorist. a western intelligence source says the whereabouts tonight unknown. france on the highest state of alert searching for more possible accomplices terrorist from last week's attacks. more than 13,000 troops are deployed as there is no doubt more accomplices are out there and an international manhunt is on for the wife of the kosher supermarket amedy coulibaly. this is her going for her
passport. it's believed she crossed into syria the day before the husband was killed in a shootout in the kosher supermarket. people rally for peace, leaders joined the march in participate and the white house acknowledged it made a mistake. >> i think it's fair to say we should have sent someone with a higher profile to be there. >> unusual for them to come out like that. they did, though, and addmitted they thought it was a mistake. i want to start with breaking news. what can you tell us about the accomplices? >> reporter: well i'll tell you it's been a burning question since the minute the gunmen stormed into the officers on this street last week. were there others involved? we got that answered with certainty today. the french prime minister saying highly likely there was another accomplice. police sources, perhaps as many
as six unclear whether that's accomplices or associates of attackers but now we have another name a frenchman trying to cross from boll cargaria to syria. this shows that there was a web behind these attacks still at large and that helps explain why you have such a massive police presence military presence around france tonight. >> and jim, you know incredible that there is just this fear that they don't know how many there might be just in this one group, never mind other groups that i know they are concerned about. we've been hearing about a key al qaeda recruiter who recruited many and has been connected to two of the terrorists in last week's attacks and officials don't know where he is either, right? >> reporter: i know. it's incredible. this is jamal bagul.
he was then put on house arrest unclear where he is right now. this firms up the ties to al qaeda. we knew that the attackers here at charlie hebdo claim ties. this now draws a connection to core al qaeda in pakistan which is again, alarming certainly not just for france showing these groups active here but for the u.s. because these are the groups that the u.s. considers most likely to attempt to carry out on attack on u.s. soil. >> pretty stunning but the punishment for such a planning when you talk about the embassy attack is house arrest. jim sciutto reporting live from paris and new details about the man that carried out the deadly attack at a kosher supermarket and his companion. this is what police thought he was with with. they thought perhaps she fled with hostages but now they say, she actually was thousands of miles away.
miguel marquez has our report. >> reporter: hayat boumeddinee believed to be escapeed to syria this picture taken january 2nd days before the coordinated attacks in paris shows boumeddiene, the more radical of the couple. he told cnn's jake tapper french intelligence agents recorded a 2010 telephone conversation in which she called coulibaly not a serious man, he only thinks about having fun. coulibaly seen here killed while rushing at police after murdering four jewish men at a kosher deli. prosecutors say evidence points to coulibaly shooting a jogger the same night of the attack by the kuoachi brothers.
>> everything is pointing to the fact that this was coordinated before hand between coulibaly and the two brothers. he had the weapons ready to go. >> reporter: coulibaly the only boy in his family of ten children. his parents muslim but not religious. he distanced himself from family. they are reviewing this video of coulibaly for possible leads. he declares his allegiance to isis. you attack isis we attack you he says. you can't attack and not get back anything in return. coulibaly who had a string of robbery and drug charges was according to his lawyer introduced to the kouachi brothers by this man plotting to blow up the u.s. embassy in paris. in 2010 coulibaly and the
kouachi brothers were in an attempt to free a terrorist from prison. coulibaly got out of prison in 2014. his racialism home grown unlike the kouachi brothers that trained in yemen. he took a trip to malaysia with his girlfriend hayat hayat boumeddiene. >> there could be more coulibaly and more kouachi attackers out there. >> this is the big question are there more coulibaly strikers out there? when he was holding hostages in the deli tried to call someone encouraging them to strike. that person didn't but police agencies around the world are on alert for just such another attack. >> thank you very much.
chilling when you look at the signs, so many things known and not able to stop this. "outfront" tonight, our coal done -- condolences for you as you're going through the mourning process of this event at your home. i know you went to the white house today and met with president's top counter official. do you know at this point who ordered or orchestrated these attacks? >> no. one of the questions that we have is to know al qaeda or the assault of a professional quarter for the attacks or simply that they gave some moment assault of general guidance to attack french interest. at this stage, we don't know what was the network and where, whether there was a network, how the network was working. >> now the french prime minister today said and i want to quote him, he said he has quote no
doubt there are accomplices to the attacks at large tonight. that is something that is very terrifying. do you think another attack is possible? >> well you know we -- the president -- the french president said we are not over with this threat. in a sense, we have been fearing such an attack for sometime. we have hundreds of young french who have come to syria or to yemen who have been military trained, so we have thousands of people so at any moment we're fearing anybody could go [speaking foreign language] and it happened. >> and let me ask you about that. i know french authorities were watching both kouachi brothers at some point. they were on the american no-fly list. did the united states share all of its information with you in
advance? did you know everything the united states knew? >> by definition i don't know because i'm not working in the intelligence field, but what i know and what actually president obama told me is that the intelligence sharing between the two countrys is working well. there is always room for improvement but we've been working very well. >> let me ask you about the key question. part of the problem is both brothers were known to french intelligence at some point in time you know in part because of involvement in trying to free a terrorist and perhaps because of travels and they went off the radar because they weren't blatantly violating the law but traveling to syria and to yemen. but they dropped on the terror priority list. tonight we have more than 18,000 french police and troops that are trying to protect sensitive locations. i know that you and france believe in free speech like here in the united states but i
guess the question is when you're aware of people going to places like syria or yemen or trying to free a terrorist, you know they did those things are you considering just detaining them saying, you know what? this free speech thing is great but if someone is involved, we're going to detain them we're not going to risk this happening again? >> first, if you remember with the 9/11 you know afterwards it's very easy to see, to say well actually you should have seen the attack coming. you know afterwards it's always easy to put the pieces of the puzzle together. so maybe some mistakes have be committed. there aban inwill be an investigation of that. we have youth in france and you can't arrest them because of their opinion. we are democracy. at the same time you can't monitor them 24/7 because it would mean those are thousands of policemen. so it's very complicated in this type of threat how to face the
challenge. >> i mean i guess it's hard. i understand what you're saying but in a sense it's admitting that there is no way. you have to accept this could happen again. >> well, i think, you know i think it was the head of the m i-5, the british secret service said an attack against the uk is highly likely. i think that every head of secret service throughout the world could say the same right now. >> today the white house spokesman josh earnest, it was an unusual move. i know you heard it but he admitted the obama administration should have sent someone else. it was a big deal for administration to admit a mistake. did they apologize? >> no and they didn't need to do it. the president came to the french embassy, the secretary came to the french embassy and made several moving public decoloration,s. the controversy is very real but the french up ins are reporting
the controversy as an american continue rersroversy because in france it didn't recite any feeling. we failed this report of the americans and that matters. >> jewish schools and synagogues are getting extra protection from french forces last year we reported 7,000 jews left france for israel in response to a rise for acts. prime minister netanyahu said to french jews quote, the state of israel is your home. that's got to be something that hits you both ways. it's you know in a sense it's a slap to france and where jews can be safe there. can you protect the population? >> i'll be a bit personal because i've been ambassador. personally i'm devastated by the idea that some of my friends are going to israel because they feel they don't feel safe in
france. it would be a major political human failure of the french republican if you are not able to protect the jewish come patriotspateand we'll do our best to face it. >> all right. well ambassador i really appreciate your time and thank you. an incredible difficult time for you. next cnn's exclusive video of where one of the kouachi brothers lived, the under wear bomber and a jihadest meetings with the al qaeda leader that may have inspired the paris attacks. mortin storm is out front and people trapped outside the kosher supermarket. the ordeal in their own words "outfront." daughter: do you and mom still have money with that broker? dad: yeah, 20 something years now. thinking about what you want to do with your money? daughter: looking at options. what do you guys pay in fees?
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now a cnn exclusive, tonight we're learning new details about the life of one of the gunmen involved in the terror attack in france. the older kouachi was a student in yemen that befriended a nigerian man that later was known as the under wear bomber that tried to blow up an american plane on christmas day. video of the dorm where the two terrorist lived. >> reporter: the streets of yemen where said koua a chi and
cherif may have learned the same thing at the same time. both perpetrators of the paris shootings were in country for about three months from april 2011. here said over multiple trips from 2009 studied arabic played football with children sometimes and made some very high-profile friends. briefly, sharing a room with umar farouk abdul mutallab who tried to blow up a plane in 2009. where in 2011 kouachi met this researcher. [speaking foreign language] just little bit down there and lived at that place. >> reporter: he shows our producer the institute lodgings where he says the paris gunmen
and the underwear bomber shared an apartment together for about a week or two in 2009 but said he remembers what kouachi told him about the underware bomber. >> very quiet person and rarely talked to people. >> reporter: those former lodgers are now office space, the school closed down. despite this link to one of the most famous attempted bombers of the last decade somehow quiet kouachi later fell off the french intelligence radar. >> he was very nice guy. very cheerful. >> reporter: the senior official thinks young erer cherif may have attended an islamic school where he may have attended al qaeda camps. serious and dazzling warning
signs coming too late for those they murdered. i should point out yemen officials we talked to are struggling to present a unified time the brothers yes, the brothers plural spent in yemen. it is after all a failing state but remarkable to see the volume of warning signs, said there between 2009 and 2011 briefly the roommate of one of the more noted failed bombers of the past decade the underware bomber and cherif there attending training camps. a lot of warning signs and questions for the french and western authorities to be answering. erin? >> that's for sure. thank you. you heard the french ambassador say all of it pieces together but it's much harder leading in. those are questions that will be under investigation but now morten storm is out front a former jihadist and worked for western intelligence as a double agent. storm helped the cia locate the
terrorist killed by a u.s. drone strike in september 2011. he is believed to have inspired the kouachi brothers and they wanted to avenge his death and the christmas day underware bomber to blow up the plane and the tsarnaev brothers. he wrote "my life inside al qaeda and the cia." because storm remains a tar get for al qaeda, we're not disclosing exactly where he is in the united kingdom. i appreciate you taking the time to be with with us and be out and speak. i know you met with him many times in 2006 you were part of a close circle. we have video when you met him and working as a double agent. give than you met him so many times, you knew him, what was it about him that made him so effective at recruiting people? >> he had, first of all, the
english language and malsstered the language and had that charisma that few had. he could connect with people and was humble and when he did talk about something related to islam, he would refer back to the -- use the references from the koran and the profit sayings and all that. he was a very scholarly person and know what he was talking about and knew how to reach people's minds. >> it's interesting when you talk about his charisma. when you were with him and he was trying to have you operate for him to recruit people how specific was he? did he want you to try to help recruit people europeans like the kouachi brothers? >> yes, indeed. why was working as an agent, he obviously wanted us -- he ask me specifically to recruit brothers
from europe who had clean passports and send them to yemen to receive the training and again to the european countries and become sleeping cells, and that is exactly what happened in france is what he wanted to do. and he had to be people or brothers who are not known at the authorities and who had to act like normal as if they were normal citizens when they return back again. that's the way that they operate. >> do you think that there are others mortin, now doing the same thing trained by or inspired by his death who are waiting to attack? >> absolutely. we know there are many hundreds of them who returned back to europe and possible even north america and the only problem some of them have is to prepare themselves for this attacks. so maybe to get the weapons is difficult for them in europe.
so it has been a longer time but there is no doubt once they become desperate and run out of time they use knives and we've seen that for the last few months in france. >> and morten what would he have promised recruits? i mean obviously, in all of these cases they have to be willing. they seem to want to get away but they were ultimately willing to die for their cause as they saw it. how did he get recruits to be willing to die? >> it a part of the faith. it's a part of what they believe in. they believe that there is no other thing that can reward them higher than to die asz as marchers. they were actively running away to create more destruction for france and more death. so basically, they wanted to die at the end. they knew that. that's why they ran into the bullets and never give in or give up so.
>> and morten we have a video of you in august of 2013 an isis video. they are firing at enemies of islam is what this is saying. i know you helped lead the cia to him. now we've sewn what happened to people whose names are on al qaeda's list or "inspire" magazine. how fearful are you for your life? >> i can't live in my own country. i can't tell you or anyone elsewhere i live. only very few people in this world know where i live and my life is in danger. there is no doubt about it. >> we appreciate the taking the time to talk to us and tell your story. his story is incredible, how he went down the path for jihad and believed in it and saw the light and helped the cia and western intelligence take down one of
the world's most dangerous terrorist. his story area tonight at 9:00 eastern. we hope you will watch. next amazing stories of survival from people held inside the kosher supermarket. >> plus cherif kouahii as a young rapper. it's not just something he d. it's being used to recruit extremists. our special report. can this decadent, fruit topped pastry... ...with indulgent streusel crumble, be from... fiber one. fiber one streusel.
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tonight an international manhunt for the wife of the kosher grocery store attacker. police believe hayat boumeddiene was a suspect but the 26-year-old was not in france at the time which is raising questions how boumeddiene was able to leave, get to pain and as you see in this video, surveillance video at tour kirk customs make her way to turkey. from there she would likely we believe cross into syria hours
before the deadly siege. fred the more we learn in hindsight you say well gosh, this connects to this to this how could this be missed? how could that happen? >> reporter: absolutely, to list her as a suspect even though she's been out of the country, there is no explanation and one of the things french authorities are saying is there was big failures failures. one thing that troubles them most is they didn't know where she was. when coulibaly committed those acts they just simply lost track. while the french seem to have lost track of her, the tour kirkurkish
authorities found her. once she landed she was immediately tracked and tracked all the way from istanbul to the syrian boarder where then they finally lost trace of her. so there is a lot of tough questions that french intelligence will have to be asked and certainly something where the government is already saying they might be in need of reforms here to make sure something like this doesn't happen in the future. >> fred how certain are authorities actually that she's even in syria? that's a big question here with the kouachi brothers. they say we know they were in yemen. we don't know. do they know she's there and are they at this point able to find her? >> well, i think at this point in time their assumption is she is in syria but i don't think they can be 100% sure. the turkish government is sure she went into syria and last spotted in a town close to the syrian boarder, one from which
many people leave to syria from turkey so that is their assumption she would go there and if she has gone to syria, it would be virtually impossible for any intelligence service to get ahold of her for french law enforcement because she's in an area that presumably is controlled by isis and it would be difficult to reach her and if they did, they would see if the risk is worth the reward erin? >> thank you very much. now our national security analyst bob bear. the woman we're talking about, she was with a man, married to a man with links to terror groups and she herself had over 500 phone calls with a companion of the kouachi brothers so there was a clear link. we understand that these are links they could have been aware of because of the excellent french surveillance of phones how was it that she was able to leave france for syria really undetected undetected? >> well with, first of all, it's unclear to me what sort of watch
list she was on. she hadn't committed a crime. she hadn't gone to jail. she wasn't identified as somebody who would carry a gun for the french. she was probably a secondary target and having talked to the wife of the kouachi brothers you know it doesn't really make you a suspect in what she apparently did was very quickly change cell phones when she got to turkey i understand she bought a new cell phone. it's a signal may not be for certain, they detected in syria. nobody told the turks she was on the way. what we have to remember erin, all this meta data is good after the crime is committed. you talk to anybody that's dealt with this and yes, contractors are making billions of dollars in the software but the end of the day you really can't predict who will commit a crime and who will
not. that's the problems with police. the french police are the best in europe. they got great surveillance teams and worked against me. i've worked against them. they are pan tasfantastic. i don't think we should lay the blame at the steps of the french but rather in the faith in the computers and meta data which isn't enough to catch these people. >> ambassador row made that point when you look back 200, he said look we'll investigate it because it looks bad now but height sight is 20/20. the question i have though, and we know this. france has one of the best counter intelligence programs in the world but when you look at these brothers it raises a broader question maybe about policy right? when i asked him look why not detain anyone whose been in yemen or syria or doing, you know involved in trying to free a terrorist as these brothers were and his answer was there
are thousands of young rad kiting in france because of the freedom of ideas we can't detain them all but they have 18,000 people sitting around for a possible attack and in a sense you feel like a sitting duck. is it time to say look we have to give up freedoms detain more people even though we don't know what they are going to do? >> look erin my opinion is and this shooting from the hip is a couple more of these attacks is exactly what they will do. they have a terrible immigration problem in france. it's a very insular society. my children went to school in france and they were americans, of course but they were considered second class citizens. i understand what the north americans face there and i don't see how the french can turn this around on a dime and i think the fact they there are 10,000 french troops out in the streets tells me they are very scared and with reason. you do have to wonder whether
they can defend their jewish population. it a real problem. terrorism hit the shores of europe in a major way. >> and of course as you point out, horrific anti semantic angels to it. thank you so much bob bear. in that kosher supermarket where five were murdered we have dramatic stories of survival. their acts of bravery helped end the standoff. we are all witness. they are survivors. she recalls the terrifying moment amedy coulibaly stormed the store. >> i saw him enter, without pity he was there to kill people. [ gunshots ]. >> translator: he had a knife and a handgun. we were sitting and at the right
there were two corporationss. >> he can be heard talking to the hostage when is a radio journalist calls the store. coulibaly wouldn't answer questions but he didn't hang up. [speaking foreign language]. >> the kosher grocery store is under siege for hours. inside people hide for their lives. >> when people came down stairs running, i went toward the cold room and i opened the door and many got in the cold room with me. >> he become as a hero among them. >> i switched off the light and switched off the freezer. he asked us to come upstairs or kill everyone down stairs. >> while some hostages stayed hidden in the freezer, he follows the instruction and manages to escape through an elevator. the hidden hostages will be rescued by police. he says they asked us to come out with our hands on our heads
they said to climb up stairs and not look on the floor because there was a lot of blood on the floor. i tried not to look i looked straight ahead and took the lady with the baby and left with her. the gunman dies in a shootout with police but four innocents are already dead. the horror of it all unfolding on television screens. it's a miracle that we're all still here me and the people in the fridge. the world witnessing it. >> and next, cherif kouachi was a shooter but once he was a rapper. a special report on how jihad rap is a recruiting tool and a vicious terrorist group, their attack too horrific to
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with disturbing new details about the terrorist brothers behind the charlie hebdo murders, cherif kouach irs was a rapper. his hip-hop career never took off but jihads use rap culture to recruit. jason carroll is out front with the special report. >> reporter: years before cherif kouachi became radicalized years before he took part of the murders, he was a petty thief and an aspiring rapper. in 2005 france 3 television featured him in a documentary about recruiting young islamic extremists. in it it says kouachi prefers
rap and pretty girls than attending rap but there are rap videos supporting jihad popping up all over the internet. ♪ ♪ >> reporter: they have named like blow by blow created by one who ended up on the u.s. terrorist list. while some may not be from organized terrorist groups terrorist organizations do post and use the videos as a recruiting tool. >> this is an effort i think, to make these groups more approachable to potential recruits in places like britain or france or america susceptible to rap videos but might feel that the beheading videos we've seen in the past are too extreme. ♪ ♪ >> reporter: one man officials think may be connected to a beheading, a former british
rapper who may have traveled to syria to join isis. his pather erfather in u.s. custody held on terror related charges and a former german rapper this went by the stage name deso-o dog and changed his name after converting to islam and has been featured in extremist propaganda material. he has written extensively on the subject. >> why do you think rap music seems to be the music of choice? >> they are saying that they are the good guys fighting for justice for people who are oppressed, and rap is also and has been historically a form of getting that idea across to people. >> reporter: music industry insiders say jihad rap videos are on the very extreme edges of the genre. >> whether jihad rap or gangster
rap i'm upset about how rap is being used in any way that is harpful harmful and hurts people. >> this seems to go against anything they would expect from recruiting when you think about what people think about the lyrics violent sex acts and things depicted in some rap. >> yeah well certainly islamic teaching would not be in support of many rap videos or music or western pop music for that matter but what you're seeing here erin, is you're seeing these people in their own ways interpreting islam for their own purpose posts getting around the religion so they can then rap and post videos and as for the terrorist organizations that are using these rap videos they are essentially basically doing the same thing. they will do whatever they can to recruit people any way they can. >> jason carroll, thank you very much. incredible. you heard he was a rapper maybe you did think it was the side
bar to the story but something bigger. >> one of the most feared terror groups boko haram. we're next. which generously lowered its price and tipped off the house which used all that energy to stay warm through the storm. chipmunk: there's a bad storm comin! narrator: the internet of everything is changing how energy works. is your network ready?"
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>> boka haran terrorists have not stopped butchering and murdering innocent people in indescribable ways including a new attack in northern nigeria that took the lives of up to 2,000 men, women and children. nic, when i saw this tactic i had to read it a few times, because i couldn't believe that even this group would be capable of doing something so vial strapping children with bombs and the militants a safe distance away detonating the children amidst a crowd. what can you tell us? >> reporter: it is horrific isn't it. how can anyone even conceive this type of idea.
the terrible thing about this is it gets worse. because this happened to a girl who was believed to be about 10 years old in a market on saturday. on sunday boco haka haran did it again. bombs strapped to the girls. they get close to the security checkpoint at the market and somebody remotely dead natdtonated the explosives. when they go into the nearby villages when it attacks the villages it kills the older men and women, but captures some of the young girls and young boys to use them in these types of attacks because they can't get into the markets themselves. so they stoop to this level of depravity, absolutely horrific. and you had the attack into the new year. hundreds of boco haram, witness
witnessing the deaths and looting of the towns, several thousands of people believed to have been killed according to eyewitnesses erin. >> nic, you're talking about three little girls in just two days. and what it sounds like they're reporting, i know in some of the conflicts in africa you hear about young boys who get brainwashed, are too young to understand and they participate, it's hard to use these worz with children of this age, but free will. but this isn't what's happening at all, these are prisoners, they kill their families take them hostage and then just send them in. >> reporter: unwilling human bombs, absolutely there's no other way to describe it. treating these children as walking vehicles to deliver an explosive. it's hard to imagine how people can come up with that. let alone come up with it but then carry it out, push the
button and kill these children. never mind the people around them. >> lack of any kind of humanity in that. nic robertson, thank you so much. as he said live this evening in nigeria. we'll be right back. kid: hey dad, who was that man? dad: he's our broker. he helps looks after all our money. kid: do you pay him? dad: of course. kid: how much? dad: i don't know exactly. kid: what if you're not happy? does he have to pay you back? dad: nope. kid: why not? dad: it doesn't work that way.
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she's now in hiding her story is an incredible one. who is she. we have a special report tomorrow night. thank you for joining us tonight. set your dvr to record "outfront" so you can watch us anytime. see you at the same time tomorrow. "ac 360" starts now. the question right now, are there more members of the terror cell than just these three who are dead and the woman on the run. the answer could be yes. we are also learning more tonight about the lengthy paper trail the killers had and their terror connections they apparently made long before their deadly rampage last wednesday. we also learned as if we didn't already know after spending the week there, just what paris strong means. this is what it looked like in the city yesterday. a unity rally drawing more people than turned out to mark the liberation of paris during the second world war. it was that big. said one french commentateor today, they want us to lie down we stand