tv CNN Newsroom With Brooke Baldwin CNN March 27, 2015 11:00am-12:01pm PDT
in the u.s. military didn't necessarily believe him. much more coming up later today as well. barbara, thank you. that's it for me. back at 5:00 p.m. eastern in the situation room. cnn news center coming up next for international viewers. for viewer unless north america "newsroom" with brooke baldwin starts right now. hi there. i'm brooke baldwin. you're watching special breaking news coverage of the downing of germanwings flight 9525 as the world on this friday is reeling from the news investigators believe it was the co-pilot who deliberately took down this plane killing himself and everyone on board. today, another shocking development. here's what we know. medical documents showing there was something wrong with this 27-year-old co-pilot man by the name of andreas lubitz and confirmation he knew something is was wrong. police raided his flat in
germany making a disturbing discovery. >> we have found a letter that indicated that he was declared by a medical doctor unfit to work. so we have reason to believe that he hid his illness from the company he was working for. >> the prosecutor found a note from a doctor. not just thrown away in the guy's apartment trash can, ripped up thrown away in the trash can. stating this pilot was quote, unquote, unfit to work on a number of days including tuesday. tuesday was the day lubitz apparently decided to lock his cabin out of the cockpit and
silently steer this air bus 320 into did french alps. a move that seems to be predetermined. new data showing minutes before the crash, the auto pilot was reset from the cruising altitude to 100 feet lowest possible setting. we do have our cnn reporters spanned out across the world to the crash site itself to the american flight sentcenter where this pilot spent time training. first to you will at this pilot's apartment in germany. investigators aren't saying specifically what this co-pilot's medical condition was, but we are getting information are from the medical center hospital that treated him not once but twice recently. what are they saying? >> reporter: the university medical center is saying they saw lubitz as a patient in february. again he came back on march 10th
and received a diagnoses. he was receiving treatment since february got the diagnosis. the medical center made a point to say they were not treating him for depression. a lot of news reports locally here and around the world speculating depression may have been the cause of this. the medical center said point blank that's not the case. when you look at the pictures of this young man like this one in the picture, 27 years old. you see him running a marathon. this is clearly a young man by all accounts in good shape. running trails and a lake near his apartment. yet something was wrong. neighbors and business owners in this area thatnteracted with him tells us this comes as utter shock to them. >> when you saw his face in the newspaper and on television what was your reaction? >> translator: we recognized him immediately, my boss and i. he seemed quite normal.
we're all speechless. >> reporter: also brooke in the apartment here where i'm standing investigators found the ripped up medical note excusing him from work on the day of the tragedy. they found no other indication no indication of political views or good-bye note. month other clues as to what may have prommed edprompted this. >> the unfit note in his waste bin and no suicide though the as of yet. thank you will in germany. a lot of revelations today raising questions. our medical examiner with transport canada faa. he's a cognitive psycho therapist. also we have commercial pilot, former federal prosecutor and attorney. to both of you, welcome. fred let me begin with you. if you were a pilot and declared
by a medical professional -- and we moe it wasn't depression at this one particular hospital he was treated for -- but you're deemed unfit to fly. what are possible conditions that fall under that heading? >> there's a number of conditions under the faa regulations which buy all of us whether a commercial pilot or private or airline transport pilot. you have an obligation to alert the faa of medical conditions which you are aware about your ability to fly the airplane. for years if you took medications you had to surrender your medical certificate. they don't take your license. you cannot fly. in the u.s. it's different. >> could it be anything from learning you have lung cancer to much smaller medical diagnosis
to anything in between? does a lot fall under the unfit to fly category? >> sure. we categorize a lot of health problems by organ systems. in this case we don't know what he was suffering from. relationship difficulties alcohol, stress, post-traumatic stress anxiety depression. there's a wide range of mental health issues that can can affect the performance of a pilot. it depends on the pilot's willingness to disclose to the health care professional and the health care professional themselves to see someone is in difficulty. >> as a pilot it's your responsibility to disclose this to your employer and airline. the risk is you're grounded not getting paid for flying planes. i wonder if a lot of pilots
captains and co-pilots, keep this to him or herself because you want to continue working. >> well you hit a good point. as a pilot, you're loathed to tell faa about these things. interestingly enough the united states navy did a study years ago where they looked at things to affect your ability to fly an aircraft. it was good things as well. being married, having a baby. rules require you to do this. if you don't report this kind of thing and ultimately lose your experience. you can lose your job. there are penalties for not complying. the problem is the motivation to comply can be murky sometimes. >> listen we have hip pa here in the united states. i can go to a doctor and my condition isn't i did as a rule--
isn't divulged. i go to a doctor they say you're unfit to fly. i go home chunk that in my trash bin because i want to keep getting paid. how is it that head kal professionals don't report to the airline to let them know i've just seen a patient that shouldn't be piloting an aircraft? >> definitely not a perfect system. it depends on the pilot's willingness to disclose. as ted mentioned, it's difficult if your career is on the line. you're going to withhold and conceal feelings and thoughts. >> of course you are. >> it comes down to question of kind of relationship that the pilot or co-pilot would have with their flight surgeon and doctors. in canada and the united states
and international organization has documents to disclose to the flight surgeon and regulatory agencies when there's a deficit in performance. it comes down to a relationship. if you have a problem with your heart, i can do an ekg and that can be helpful because you can't withhold electrical information from your heart. when it comes to the mind it comes down to the relationship that that pilot has and the willingness of the pilot to disclose whether they're a pilot. >> sounds like it. ted and randy, thank you both very much for coming. you got it. coming up next we'll take you inside the cockpit simulator to show you what the co-pilot can did in the
final moments to keep the pilot out. why did he interrupt his training to become a pilot? we are live outside the american training facility he attend theed. any moment now, amanda will find out if she will be found guilty of murdering her roommate. you're watching cnn special live coverage. stay right here. forget about it. tylenol was ok, but it was 6 pills a day. but aleve is just 2 pills all day. and now, i'm back! aleve. hi, i'm henry winkler and i'm here to tell homeowners that are sixty-two and older about a great way to live a better retirement... it's called a reverse mortgage. call right now to receive your free dvd and booklet with no obligation. it answers questions like... how a reverse mortgage works how much you qualify for the ways to receive your money...and
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cockpit of every commercial plane flying around the world. he cannot imagine why a pilot would do this but he knows how. a retired military and commercial pilot, he says he's flown thousands of hours in the a 320 cockpit, one of the safest high-tech passenger jets use around the world. he like all pilots has used the switches hundreds of times. >> unlock you pull up and hold it. a light comes on and says cockpit is open. if i release, it goes back to normal position. >> norm is locked. >> that's correct. >> there's a key pad entry on the outside if you know the code. if the person inside switches to locked the key pad won't work five minutes.
there's another override that goes beyond five minutes. >> i can override the key pad and hold in the locked position. he cannot use the key pad or get in. >> to keep your co-pilot out, what do you have to do? >> if he knew the keyboard pad to get in i hold the lock. he cannot get in. >> can you manually fly this and hold the lock button? >> yes, easy. >> that's a purposeful act? >> very much so. >> again and again we fly through the scenarios in auto pilot and manuel. both managed to crash the plane. both had to be deliberately programmed or flown into the ground. what does that suggest to you as his determination? >> he was very determined. that was his goal. he had a mission or goal to kill himself and everybody on board. we deal with terrorists and people that aren't supposed to be in the cockpit. this person is supposed to be in the cockpit. that's scary.
>> we know the mechanics of it. the question of why is what is so hard to understand. cnn, las vegas. >> thank you so much. i want to talk more about this cockpit. we do have this photo. this is the actual cockpit from this germanwings flight 95 a 25 taken by the airplane enthuse enthuseist. this is a plane he was on before it crashed. back with me commercial pilot and federal prosecutor of fatal jet incidents. christina, first to you. a lot of people are tweeting us questions. one is why didn't germanwings have this two person cockpit rule which by the way that changed today? >> that's right. there are a lot that had this protocol before today. one reason is there's no requirement under safety procedures to have this protocol
in place. here in the u.s. we do have it in place. the question is why didn't the europeans? the simple answer is there's no one body of european aviation that a really has any teeth to enforce uniformed protocols across countries. this has been a big issue for a number of years. now we have the german aviation authorities coming out saying all german airlines have to have two people in the cockpit at all times. the canadian interior minister said the same thing for those airlines in that country. now other airlines are going to reevaluate this procedure. one of the reasons the u.s. may have been more stringent because 9-11 had such a big impact psychologically. the u.s. led the way with really forceful protections when it came to the cockpit.
there was a lot of thought given to what are the alternatives to get in the cockpit? that may have been why the u.s. was a little more thoughtful about a back-up getting into the cockpit. >> okay. interestingly we also -- one of our cnn employees was on a germanwings flight this morning and reported hearing the captain come over the loud speaker and insure passengers on the plane and say we have you know we'll always have two people in the cockpit. people are poking holes in this. even if you had the instance the pilot left the cockpit. a crew member has to sit in the cockpit with the co-pilot. if you have a co-pilot intent on taking the plane down who's to say the co-pilot wouldn't take the flight attendant out of the equation? >> correct. that's always been the counter
argument that someone who is committed to doing harm the first fatality would be the person in the cockpit. i floated that to a couple of friends of mine. they said they're not there to stop them. they're there to open the door to let other people come in to help them. after the egypt air flight 990, southwest airlines adopted a policy they would never allow one person to be in the cockpit for that reason. as your reporter indicated after # 9-11 faa made it a rule you can never have one person. it's not guaranteed if you have two up there you're going to be able to stop it. it's another level of protection. when you're a pilot, you want another level of safety. >> to know if you need to get the door open you can. thank you so much. >> thanks. any moment now. just a heads up to all of you. amanda knox will soon learn her
fate what the court has decided whether or not they'll uphold the murder conviction in the death of her roommate. should she be extradited and forced to go back to italy? we'll discuss that next. we're live outside the training facileity where the 27 the-year-old co-pilot had his training and why he took a break in his training. we'll have that. so i did what he did i went pro with crest pro-health advanced. my mouth is getting healthier. my teeth are getting stronger. crest pro-health advanced gives you a healthier mouth, and is superior in these key 5 areas. this is going to go well. i know it. i guess all toothpastes aren't the same. this is my body of proof. proof of less joint pain. and clearer skin. this is my body of proof that i can fight psoriatic arthritis
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we will take you back to breaking news on flight 9525 in memos. first we have to talk about amanda knox the woman convicted and quitted accused of murdering her roommate. we could learn any moment whether italy's high court will uphold her conviction and require she return to the country to serve 28.5 year
sentence. knox who's back in the states living in seattle has vowed to never willingly return. she talked to chris cuomo and said she'll definitely fight. >> you'll appeal? >> yes. >> you'll stay here? >> yes. >> what happens if the supreme court confirm this is ruling and the case is closed and you are guilty? >> you know from this whole experience especially in prison where you have to take everything day by day, right now i'm having to take everything step by step. if i think about everything that i could possibly be facing it's way too overwhelming for me to even conceive. >> cnn senior legal analyst jeff joins me. she told someone else if they
tried to extradite her, they would have to pull her kicking and screaming to prison. what are the odds that italy high court upholds the conviction? what are the chances the state department would do that? >> for starters it's the state department. extra diction can get very complicated. the odds may be fairly good the state department would order extra diction. the state department is concerned with international relations. one of the issues they're always concerned about is will we get reciprocity? will italy continue to cooperate with us? when we want prisoners back from italy. the other issue is that murder is clearly an extraditable offense. there are legal arguments available to amanda knox. one of them is that this would amount to double jeopardy that because of the way the way the
italian courts are structured she has been tried twice for the same crime. that's something prohibited under the treaty. she has that legal argument. it's not an easy one. >> so okay then, let's take it a step further. to obviously try to make good because of international policies et cetera if there's an american in italy and the state department approves this, what would happen? would someone come banging on her door in seattle and say we are taking you kicking and screaming back to italy? >> not at first. these orders are not appealable. you can't go to court directly to challenge an extra diction order. you can file what's called hit of habeas corpus. a distribute judge might order a stay while he or she weighs amanda knox's challenge. ultimately there's the possibility that a police
officer will knock on her door and take her away. if an extra diction order is uphold that's like an arrest warrant. that is something that authorizes the u.s. government to take you by force if necessary from one country to another. that's what the stakes are here. >> we're wait ago for heads up from high court in italy whether or not they'll uphold the conviction. thank you so much jeffrey. more on breaking news. cnn is live outside the american trainer center where this german co-pilot learned to fly. one of the questions we're asking is why was there a big interruption amidst his training becoming a pilot? also as investigators are busy searching his home is there anything to the fact his doctor's note that deemed him unfit to fly was ripped up found in his apartment wastebasket? a lot to talk about today. stay right here.
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bottom of the hour. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. officials from germanwings apparent company said they did not though the co-pilot should not have been at work the day he crashed the plane into the french alps. a police search at his apartment turned up evidence and a medical letter which was found cut up and in the trash bin in his apartment saying he was unfit to work. work records show he was fit to fly. where's the disconnect? what happened here? an examiner with 28 years experience spoke earlier to my colleagues john and kate. >> if you do not come forward with the truth, is there my kind of safety net to detect it within the system?
>> well it's -- that's a very good question. i think that the issues that are placed on the pilot with respect to a $25,000 fine if they lie. if there is an accident down the line they may not be insurable which is another issue these pilots need to keep in mind. there's no strict psychological screen. we ask general questions. how is their health? anything stressful in their lives? it's the self-reporting that's so critical in this. >> lubitz began working for the company in 2013. part of the training involved time in the united states. sarah is in the town of goodyear arizona west of phoenix. part of his training was there. let's begin sarah, how long was he at this facility in arizona?
>> reporter: according to the company, he had to be here at least six months. in order for the company to say you're ready to fly, each of their pilots have to train here at least six months. we have been walking around campus here. there are pilots from all over the world that come here to train. there are dorms here. people do stay here when here for training. there are small planes here. these are the planes pilots still train on to this day. this facility has been here some 40 years. for decades, it's had a connection to phoenix. you may be asking why phoenix, what is here when a pilot is coming from germany? what's here most of the year 365 days particularly here, look at the skies. clear skies, don't have big weather problems generally.
you can just about fly every day of the year. they like to have that option. they also have a lot of space, big facility here. they can house quite a few people here as well. as far as what happened when he stopped because we do know he stopped training at some point. no one so far has come out with the information as to why he stopped training. we know he started training somewhere around 2008. that training was stopped somewhere in 2009. we don't know if it was stopped while he was here on campus in arizona or when he went back to germany. we know according to a former trainer who worked here a couple of deck cause of deathades ago, he said things haven't changed much. students come here out of what we consider high school in the united states. they are the brightest of the bright. these are considered good jobs in germany and around the world. there's a lot of training that goes on here.
they end up doing 300-400 hours of training here at this facility. >> all this information. why would someone do this? sarah, thank you very much in arizona. as this evidence here is mounting blaming the co-pilot for the crash, those that knew him can't believe what they're here hearing. an acquaintance said he always looked well. >> very healthy guy. doesn't smoke. i can't imagine he was mentally ill, depressed and sad. he doesn't seem like it. i was shocked when i hear that. >> we also know officials from the can dusseldorf hospital clinic that saw him in february and march said that reports of treating him for depression are baseless quote, unquote. agent at the dea and global
security group with more on this investigation, david. lots of questions for you. first, the fact that investigators have found no suicide is note. it appears to be mass murder situations is that common? >> it is common. there are many many mass murder situations where there are no notes found. they're making statements by actions. sometimes they're not intent on suicide. in this case it appears he was. sometimes it's mass murder suicide to avoid capture. who knows what the factor is. it's not uncommon not to get a note. >> there's reports there was a girlfriend. i imagine she's on the list. who else? anyone that knows him any way, shape, form. those that are closer family members, friends, pilots he flew with. these people will be interviewed to see if there's something that was missed.
this gentleman on the screen -- >> all these people. no red flags on the surface. their they're looking in his apartment. what are they looking for? what's the number one treasure trove potential for an item there? >> first thought is get to his hard drive. see what he was searching on the internet. you can imagine. when you're home alone cruising the internet it gives someone else later on a great look into your state of mind. let's say he was researching former mass murders. maybe he had an ongoing dispute with his girlfriend. instant messages will illuminate to that issue. other things you may look for, narcotics, prescription drugs. maybe he was treated for depression schizophrenia, something worse. those may unlock the key to what was going on with this guy.
>> anything you read into the fact that apparently the doctor that gave him the sick note saying he was unfit to work. he had thrown it away in his trash bin in his apartment. he cut it up and threw it away. is that a sign of anything? >> maybe anger toward that doctor that says you're mentally unfit to fly. we're assuming it's mental reason. he enacts out in anger. >> we don't know. we have to be clear. >> the whole idea the doctor says you're not fit to fly, take this to your boss and make sure they take you off rotation. that's insanity. i think that ultimately led to death of 150 people unfortunately. >> david, thank you very much. next one proposed plan to avoid the intentional crashing of planes by pilots is is planes without pilots. would you be comfortable being on a plane without a pilot? that's next. shopping online... ...is as easy
as you're hearing, all these reports investigators are saying the intentional downing of the airliner you might be wondering could more be done from the ground to keep pilot or terrorists from crashing a plane? in this case the co-pilot was deemed unfit to work. a website that has activated data says someone dropped the aviation. i've got tom forman and former faa safety inspector david
soucie. tom forman you're up first explaining to me one potential idea. >> one potential idea is to say there's technology that can do this. it exists in big names like boeing google, bae. a lot are experimenting with this. the idea to control a plane there the ground would have applications now. maybe in argo planes planes in hassouszardous circumstances like tracking hurricanes. it's really tricky. there's unanswered questions about how safe that would be. >> so here is where i turn to you david soucie. i have to wonder if you have the possibility to override say for example in this case a, if you have the co-pilot turning
the knob down to 100 feet. the person on the ground has the chance to override that and turn it back. >> that's a complex thing to do. you have the weight of is automation doing the right thing or pilot doing the right thing. i buy on the side of the pilot. i see the need might exist. the pilot has to have the need to go down to 100 feet. the if he can't, he may not be able to randland at sea level ever. if he's at a higher land and says i want to go down override it. what's the chance he does perhaps want to land and it overrides and he goes up into another aircraft's area. >> i keep thinking of miracle on the hudson. sully reaching into his pilot instincts and pulling that off.
that was manuel. imagine someone on the ground trying to override. who knows what might have happened. >> that's like automatic brakes on cars, they bother me. if it brakes for me and a car is coming this way. i want to get this way. i try to disarm those on my cars. >> jump in. >> you may talk about two different things. one is fully robotic that automatically does things. the other possibility is a human based system that's not on the plane. basically you have ground controllers that says if you have a plane doing something really unusual and won't communicate and tell us what's going on then they take over. sully says i've got an emergency and going to land on the hudson. they say go ahead. if a plain starts circling and they won't answer a, they then say that plane is under our control and flying it somewhere else. >> not long ago was the boeing
auto pilot, blop. faa didn't approve it. it created more vulnerabilities than it did add things. >> the vulnerability is up in the air. drones are having problems. the problems are too high to be acceptable in commercial aviation at this point. >> thank you very much. let meturn me turn now to the victim's family members. the company has commissioned flights and buses to the crash site for grieving relatives. the father of one of three americans on board said although he is grieving he doesn't feel anger towards the flight's
co-pilot. >> i don't feel anger. i'm really sad for the father parents of that young pilot. i can't imagine what they're going through right now as well as our companions here. they're all feeling, hurting. we don't feel anger. >> as each day passes we're learning more about the lives lost on this flight. carol friday was a maternal health nurse from australia i can't. paul had finished first year of college in uk. two very accomplished german opera singers.
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>> i'm daily stories of fighters. a little kid with cancer or a hardworking father. i really hope that my songs connect with people. i want to bring them encouragement. >> dr. gupta, cnn reporting. we don't on. i'm brooke baldwin. top of the hour. you're watching cnn. our breaking news coverage of the germanwings 9525. here's what we have today. another shocking development about the 28-year-old co-pilot that investigators believe deliberately took down the plane. here's what we know. he ripped up documents found in the home of 27-year-old andreas lubitz. >> we have found a letter that indicated he was declared by a medical doctor unfit to work.
it was found, slashed in a trash bin. we have reason to believe that he hid his illness from the, from the company he was working for. >> just to repeat that if you couldn't hear the prosecutor. he was saying this note from a doctor was found ripped up and thrown this the co-pilot's apartment trash can stating this co-pilot was unfit for work unfit for duty. a number of days including tuesday, the very day lubitz apparently decided to lock his captain out of the cockpit. with no apparent confirmation he steered this air bus to the french alps. the move seems to be predetermined. new data shows minutes before the crash, the plane was set cruising altitude