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tv   Legal View With Ashleigh Banfield  CNN  May 7, 2015 9:00am-10:01am PDT

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this nuclear threat. they want to respond to the charges for instance of the assassinations or the executions, rather, of senior officials. they want to get a message out, that's what they'll do. >> all right, jim sciutto, thank you for joining us and thank you, all, for joining us. >> "legal view" with ashleigh banfield starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- hello, everyone, i'm ashleigh banfield. welcome to "legal view." the life and death face for dzhokhar tsarnaev. the defense may rest its case as early as today. the vote from the jury has to be unanimous. even if one juror decides against the death penalty, we're going to show you where he'd spend the rest of his life. it is the super max in florence, colorado, known as alcatraz of the rockies. make no mistake, the setting may
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be picturesque, but it is no room with a view. tsarnaev would be locked up 23 hours a day in a sound proof cell. with four-inch wide windows. no roommates to be had. but sharing the prison with him, this cast of characters. a wide cast of notorious murderers and terrorists. including unabomber ted ca kaczynski. shoe bomber richard reid. oklahoma city bombing conspirator terry nicols. 9/11 conspirator zacarias moussaoui. and former fbi agent and russian spy robert hanssen. our deb feyerick is live outside the courthouse in boston. correct me if i'm wrong, is his attorney try to convince the jury if they decided against death and instead went for a life sentence, that this would be a horrible life? >> well, that's exactly what they're trying to do.
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the wing you described is the h wing, that's where the worst of the worst are kept. although it's not a done deal whether he would be sent there, chances are good he would. whether he receives these sort of special restrictive measures that are extremely harsh or whether he's put in general population, either way, it is very difficult. and the prosecution on cross examination now trying to point out, look, he may not be getting a lot of privileges, but the few privileges he will be getting, like being able to write letters to his family, are certainly things that the four victims can no longer do. that he took that away from those families. so, the defense is still trying to save his life. there's been talk that they're trying to get the death penalty abolitionist sort of back on the stand. her point of view is unless you yourself can put your finger on the butter and pull that switch, then you should not go for the
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death penalty. i have to describe dzhokhar tsarnaev who is sitting in that court. his hair is longer. it is significantly more disheveled. his beard is longer. his family had testified earlier in the week. he seemed to have a connection with them. he looked tearfully at them. there's been a string of characters vouching for what an incredible person he was before this crime took place. and whether they were able to reach him because he's shown so little emotion or whether he was able to connect in a way he now realizes it's done, it's out, it's over, whatever he gets, whether it be the death penalty or life in prison. it's very interesting to watch his demeanor. because he just doesn't care. >> well, he may not care but he's about to care because his life is about to change radically for the worst. deb feyerick, thank you for that. i want to take a legal view now. defense attorney joey jackson and cnn analyst dan yny sevelas.
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whenever you see the pictures, it looks like a big brightly lit clean glossy strict prison but it's a lot more. >> danny and i were speaking about this and in visiting our clients in prison, whether it's a super max or not, i mean, you know, it's not a place certainly that you want to be. now, you compound that with going to a jail like this where you had people who are the worst of the worst. you described who those people were. terrorists, traitors. and it's really designed, really, to make you mentally nuts. you're in a room all by yourself 23 hours a day. one day out. you have a window, four inches, you know, where you look outside. concrete desk, concrete chair. so certainly a place -- >> and neighbors like that. >> a place you wouldn't want to be. >> this comes from a lawsuit that's been filed by some inmates who i'm sure very few people have sympathy for, but i want you to read what some of
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them have been sort of -- i want to say -- the solid, the solitude has led them to do. one inmate cut off both his own earlobes, chewed off his finger, sliced through his own achilles tendon and pushed staples into his face and forehead. this many coming from "the new york times" assessment lawsuit. amputated his own pinky, cut it into pieces and swallowed it with soup. and then another inmate swallowed some parts of his own prosthetic leg and lawyers say that prison officials refused to provide a replacement. which meant he had to just sort of drag himself around the cell. listen, danny, there have been other inmates who said i live in the equivalent of a bathroom. it is that small. the toilet is in there. it only switches once every five
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minutes. i live in a toilet. is that a great argument for dzhokhar tsarnaev's lawyer to tell that jury? >> well, it is, in the sense it would make the jury satisfied that he is being punished if he's going to stay in a place like that. even though that's really not the purpose of presenting mitigating evidence. but it is helpful to a jury if they're thinking, well, will it just be a walk in the park if he's at super max? >> club fed. >> when we talk about some of those horrific cases, you have to take a look at why we punish to begin with. there's several reasons why we do. one of course is retribution. one of the others is separation from and protection from the rest of the population. in other words, keeping them away from where they might do harm either to prison officials or to the public at large. and when we're dealing with these kinds of criminals, at super max, not the run of the mill robbers. they're not drug dealers so much as they are national criminals with -- that present real threats to national, maybe international safety.
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>> extraordinarily deadly people. listen, you and i, both of you and i, we're going to have another conversation about the eighth amendment challenges to this kind of incarceration. >> cruel and unusual punishment. >> the cruel and unusual punishment. you may feel like these guys deserve it but we do want to be the saddam husseins of the 21st century, the people that go to the tower of london? it is essentially a dungeon and drives people to do -- >> they're not getting a lot of sympathy. >> they sure aren't. guys, thank you for that. coming up next this may be the biggest terror network on the planet. it's called the internet. jihadists all over social media are plotting, even advertising, their every move. so coming up next, what are americans doing to counterbalance this? to counterattack? to get them at their own game? that's next. why weigh yourself down? try new aveeno® sheer hydration. its active naturals® oat formula... ...goes on feather light
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three years before he tried to shoot up a texas event designed to offend muslims, he described his religion as, quote, a weapon to be used against satan. a video produced to raise money for the mosque that sims son joined in phoenix takes on grim new significance in light of last sunday's failed attack in which only simpson and his roommate/accomplice nadir soofi were killed. have a listen to this. >> if i see you, a form of weaponry to go out in the real world and use that weaponry to shield you against the -- >> the fbi is interviewing fellow mosque members, family
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members, friends as well and associates of both men and some of those people are openly sharing what now looked very much like warning signs. nadir's own mother, for instance, tells "the wall street journal" that she learned back in january that soofi had bought an ak-47 and she says she was horrified by it. long before that, soofi sent his mother dvds of the american-born al qaeda preacher named anwar al awlaki whom an american drone took out in yemen in 2011. the fact al awlaki was killed, she said, quote, instigated a deeper passion for his teachings. end quote. online teachings from al awlaki and dozens like him, the focus today of a heari ing held by th senate homeland security
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committee. the former jihadi took the question of the day from new jersey senator cory booker. >> we have a government that's spending millions and millions of dollars on old school forms of media and, as you said, very crude social media efforts. what do you imagine could be done if we were going to do an effective social media online countermessaging effort? >> thank you very much. you know, in some kind of defense to the center for strategic communications, they have a strong group of people. they're trying to contest the space. and they're trying to do something. and i get that. yes, crude is a very polite statement. look, at the end of the day, if you want to fight back against recruitment of 15-year-old kids, you need to work with 15-year-old kids. when i see my own kids showing
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examples of what affects them and what motivates them, it tells me that this is exactly what you need to do. >> we're lucky now to be joined by the man that just appeared before the senate committee. he joins me live from capitol hill. mubin, i was fascinated to hear that answer you just gave. if you want to countereffect the online recruiting methods towards 15-year-old kids, you've got to target 15-year-old kids. can you talk a little more deeply into the point of exactly what methods do you think would work, going into schools and start teaching about jihadi wars? >> well, i think, i mean, these kids are a product of social networking. i can say i grew up when there was no internet. there was what were called bulletin board systems. one of the first things i downloaded was the anarchist cookbook. these kids today, they're born and bread in this environment.
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they're incubated in this environment. they live and breathe it. i have kids of my own. as young as 4, 5 years old, they were already online or interacting with some kind of computer system. i think we need to understand this is the environment in which they're born and bred and work with individuals who know what works. >> what else did you tell those senators? i mean, that answer was very, very clear and very, very practical. and you could actually see something coming of that. but were there other things that you told those senators that's just a little more nuanced that takes a different way of thinking, that could guide congress or the american people to understand there's a different way of beating these jihadis at their own online game? >> there were other panelists as well. colleagues of mine who i know, and they're very, very intelligence, who said look, the government will not be able to do it if they cannot respond at the speed of social media. even the senators who were there
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understood this is not something for a bulky institution to do. it's going -- it's really going to come down to people at the ngo level, muslim communities, whether it's a public school approach, this is the way it's going to work. >> and what about the conversation that you and i had just yesterday on this program? and that was the counterpropaganda campaign. because right now, what we see a lot of, if you see something, say something. it's almost becoming like white noise. isn't there so much more that the american government and authorities throughout every state can be doing to counterbalance these slick sexy videos that have sad troubled people following them, you know, with their lives. >> yeah, you know, one of the other comments was that if you want to develop a messaging that appeals to teenagers, you need to work with teenagers to develop that messaging. it can be done as a high school
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project. it can be done at the high school level. we have talent in the west that would blow away these videos. yes, they're slick, they're sophisticated. that's because of all the, you know, compared to the old media styles that people are using, of course, i mean, it's going to look like it's amazing. if you look at what most kids are using anyway and what most kids can themselves produce, we can actually do something. but i'm struggling to understand why we haven't done that so far. >> it's good to talk to you. especially in the role you're playing today. live in washington, d.c. before our senators. looking forward to talking to you again. thank you. coming up next, a federal court has just ruled that the national security agency in the united states has just gone too far. too far when it tracks your phone records in the name of national security. so is this a win for the aclu and what about you, where do your rights fit in?
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national security agency program that may have collected records of your cell phone calls. i know everybody was really fussy about it but turns out it really was not authorized by congress and it is not allowed under the patriot act. here's the big one. it is not legal. that's not me saying it. it's actually what a federal appeals court just decides today.
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agreeing with the aclu who filed this claim and have been trying to shut down the data collection by the nsa in the lower courts. there's just one more thing here too. it's just a few weeks now before congress even decides to keep that part of the patriot act alive. if it seems confusing, i know the perfect person who makes it real simple, his name is paul callan and he's a legal analyst. so if i get it straight, the patriot act to the nsa said, you're good to go, we have the law and the language. go ahead, collect the metadata on people's cell phone calls that you need in your effort to fight bad guys who want to kill us. all of a sudden, an appeals court has said not so fast, not so fast at all. >> not so fast at all is right, it's a fascinating decision, because it's about 76 pages in length analyzing privacy rights of american citizens, the need for national security. a nod to edward snowden in the
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decision in which the court says this only came to the attention of the american people as a result of snowden's leaks. they then go on to analyze and say the following. when the patriot act was created by congress enabling a lot more surveillance in the united states to stop terrorists. >> good intentioned. >> good intentioned. >> they never said specifically that you can go to the telephone companies and gather this, what's called metadata. now, what's metadata? they're not listening in on the contents of your call. >> they find out who you called, what time, that kind of thing. >> by looking at that, they can tell a lot of things. for instance, if you were calling a suicide hot line. if you were calling a terrorist in another country or in this country, they would know that. so it reveals information about people. >> a lot of stuff that we consider to be very private. so just technically speaking, this second circuit appeals court has said you can't do it, you won't do it, so unless you go back to the drawing board,
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congress, and rewrite the patriot act to make it more expansive, then you can go ahead and do it and we'd be good with it? >> well, what the second circuit has said is you have to stop doing this. you have no right to do this. that is, gather this metadata. and we're sending it back to the district court, the lower court. remember, this is a federal appeals court but a very prestigious one. and they're say to the local judge who decided it, a manhattan federal judge, we're sending the case back to you to implement our decision. meaning, this is illegal. they have to stop doing this. and you, judge, in the lower court, implement it. now, i don't know what's going to happen in the lower court but you could have an order coming down banning the u.s. government from doing this. >> today, it's business as usual but as soon as that district court judge gets this back in his or her chambers, then that's going to be the time when we might find out stop and you can't collect this anymore. right now, it's business as
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usual today. >> that's correct. >> we'll have you back when we figure out what's going on to but then this whole thing up. coming up next, you probably know him, he's pretty famous for a lot of things, tom brady. and now tom brady's under attack and he's fighting back. his agent is sending out the statement arguing that that 243-page deflate gate report, it ain't right. it's tainted. it's biased. it's missing key facts. it's filled with tragic flaws. so, is it? you'll find out next. [ female announcer ] when you're serious about fighting wrinkles, turn to roc® retinol correxion®. one week, fine lines appear to fade. one month, deep wrinkles look smoother. after one year, skin looks ageless. high performance skincare™ only from roc®.
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hydro boost. from neutrogena. a pro football quarterback is used to taking big hits, but super bowl winner tom brady is getting hit real hard from the entire league. and its front office. he's calling the nfl's report on the football pressure scandal disappointing and also flawed. that's the report that determined brady probably knew full well that he was playing with an underinflated football during a division championship game back in february. the report even detailed some text messages between equipment managers joking about how they deflated some of the balls to help their own quarterback's performance. legal analyst mel robbins is here. i suppose we should call it deep in the heart of patriots
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country. you're in boston, girl. i can't believe you wrote what you wrote. tom brady's agent sent this out. he said, the wells report omitted nearly all of tom's testimony, most of which was critical because it would have provided this report with the context that it lacks. and yet you write so eloquently that the wells report got everything wrong. it almost sounds like the same thing but you're totally arguing a different angle here. what's wrong with the report? >> well, what's wrong with the report, ashleigh, is that the report doesn't go far enough. the report uses what is actually civil legal language, which is the preponderance of evidence, and it kind of basically concludes that, hey, it's more likely than not that this happened. when, in fact, the 243 page report is an indictment that is full not only of text messages and time lines and all kinds of arguments, ashleigh, but if you look at the back of the report,
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if you look at page 114, there is a 68-page, very technical, scientific and statistical takedown of the patriots ideal gas theory defense. which is basically, hay, when the temperature drops, the pressure changes. they depunked it. not only did they debunk it, they said, concluded, ashleigh, to a 99.6% probability, that they cheated, that this was done by human intervention. so i'm disappointed in this report because the language is so light footed. they should have come out and said we have irrefutable evidence that the patriots cheated. and the two knuckleheads that were work in the locker room, we've got their text messages back and forth with each other and with tom brady. and it shows that they all knew what was going on, ashleigh. >> hold on, those two knuckleheads, you name them, jim mcnally and john jastremski, i
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hope i pronounce that right, what did they say in text messages that was so damning? >> well, mcnally refers to himself as "the deflator." >> oh, that's bad. >> and the other guy is clearly "the fixer" and he's talking about the fact he's going to give him long needles this weekend and when they says, i'm going to give you the needles, which he's going to be sticking into footballs to deflate them, mcnally, the deflator as he refers to himself, says, okay, make sure you've got tennis shoes and you've got the stuff that i want that's autographed. so there's this back and forth where they are clearly arranging to deflate balls. the mcnally who's going to deflate them is told he's going to be paid off with size 11 tennis shoes and autographed jerseys and they joke around and say, okay, great, because if you don't, i'm going to make these balls, which of course are much bigger and more inflated than the football. >> that's pretty damning. >> what else is pretty damning,
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ashleigh, that if you turn -- >> before the next thing, i want to read your own words in the op-ed today. the wells report may use leg legalese that sound like probable cause but make no mistake, this is not a criminal matter in a court of law and different rules apply in business. are you saying the nfl has a different standard and it needs to stick by it and heads need to roll? >> yeah, i mean, look, in the scheme of life, is this a big deal? of course not. in the scheme of right and wrong, the patriots cheated. and they broke the rules. and they did so flagrantly. yes, goodell does need to do something. they have more than proven it's more likely than not. they have irrefutable evidence. here's another piece. take a look at the facts. read the report. then use your common sense. tom brady, the super star quarterback, three days before the investigation kicked off, he claims that he doesn't even know who these two knuckleheads are. and then, surprisingly, spends
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55 minutes on the phone with one of them, over three different mornings. >> oh. >> now, do you think that the star quarterback is going to give his personal cell phone number to an assistant equipment manager that he claims he doesn't know unless he's in on it? of course not. look at tom brady's own behavior. >> it sure doesn't look very good. your piece is fantastic. i can hear your voice in the piece. so thank you so much. and we'll talk soon, mel. >> great to see you. >> always great to see you, mel. up next, police and prosecutors are supposed to be on the same side. but all bets are off now in baltimore where police say those charges that were filed in freddie gray's death are not backed up by the facts from the police.
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baltimore police are challenging that case being made against six officers involved in freddie gray's death. sources are telling cnn that that big police investigation that was delivered to the state's attorney does not support some of the charges that were filed against them by that baltimore state's attorney. joining me live from baltimore is cnn's suzanne malveaux. this is pretty damning stuff. there's a list of things that the police report says does not match up with the state's attorney. let's just start with the knife. the entire police report, not just the lawyers, every so often, a lawyer has come out and said they think that knife was an illegal knife. now the entire police report has said that knife was illegal. what else is it saying is creating a discrepancy? >> so we'll talk about that
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knife, right. first of all, under state law, the switchblade is illegal to have. but what you see and what's coming here from the attorneys who are talking about the specific knife that they believe freddie gray had and they're asking actually, in a motion, to see that knife, it's a spring assistant type of knife and they say under baltimore city code it's much more expansive about what is illegal. they say that knife is illegal that was in freddie gray's possession. and that makes a difference. they say that means these officers had probable cause to arrest freddie gray and that the charge for false imprisonment just wouldn't stand, that that is not going to actually be something that will be able to stick because of the specific kind of knife. so that's the first one. the second thing is they say the autopsy report does not support the notion this was a homicide. and the third thing they talk about here are the evidence that they have in the police
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investigation. they say this evidence points much more to a case that would support manslaughter and certainly not second degree murder. so u got a lot of problems. the fact you've got some leaks here that are coming from not just the attorneys who represent at least two of these officers in that motion to see the evidence, the physical evidence, but then you also have some individuals who are anonymous officials who are now leaking this information from the police investigation. saying, look, this is not going to support the kind of charges coming now from the prosecutor's office. as you know, ashleigh, there's a legal process it has to go through before we get to the point where there are any indictments. it could change. these charges could change. >> look, it just changed for me. yesterday, we talked about, you know, individual lawyers for those accused officers saying they thought that knife was illegal, which would effectuate a destruction of the entire case against a couple of those officers. but now having the police report actually say it, not just lawyers looking for good
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defenses, the actual police report that was delivered to that state's attorney the day before she came out on that stand and announced those charges, at the same time, not saying that police commissioner had only heard about this just minutes before. i sure hope she's got a strong case so that it doesn't fall through the cracks and create an inferno in that city. suzanne malveaux, thank you, appreciate it. up next, freddie gray isn't the only young man to mysteriously die in police custody. a family demanding answers in savannah, georgia. a whole new case. a whole new set of facts next. i don't want to live with the uncertainties of hep c. or wonder whether i should seek treatment. i am ready. because today there's harvoni. a revolutionary treatment for the most common type of chronic hepatitis c. harvoni is proven to cure up to 99% of patients
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see car insurance in a whole new light. liberty mutual insurance. in addition to freddie gray's death in baltimore, we're also following another case of possible police brutality in savannah. a 21-year-old college student died in police custody. as martin savidge reports, there's still no public explanation of how it actually happened. >> reporter: in the beautiful old city of savannah, a small group gathers to ask a potentially ugly question. what happened to matthew? for his family, the calls of matthew's death remains a mystery. but it sh not be. >> reporter: the 21-year-old college student was studying computer science. friends describe him as bright and much loved.
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that was not the man police describe when they showed up new year's day at this gas station for a disturbance. surveillance video captures the struggle between he and his girlfriend. a police report says the woman's face was bruised and her nose was bleeding. police say he refused to let her go and fought back. he started to resist apprehension in a violent manner. at the jail, things got worse. according to a statement from the county sheriff's office, he became combative during the booking process. injuring three deputies including a female sergeant who suffered a concussion and broken nose. eventually, authorities say he was restrained. his supporters describe something else. >> he was injured, hand coughed to a restraining chair and tased. he was left unattended and he died. >> reporter: four months later, there is still no public explanation of how the 21-year-old died. how does that happen? there has to be an answer.
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the family has hired attorney mark o'mara, a cnn legal analyst who once represented george zimmerman in the death of florida teen trayvon martin. >> we don't know what it said. >> reporter: according to authorities, several video cameras captured the struggle in the booking area but that video, like much of the investigation, remains under wraps in the hands of the d.a. which, in a statement, told cnn, the district attorney is currently reviewing the file, a spokesman said, and would not elaborate on what was within the file or a time line on when, if a decision to file charges would be made. meanwhile, his supporters delivered a letter to the chatham county attorney demanding documents and videos from the case, calling for transparency. as for the alleged jekyll and hyde personality, his family says he was diagnosed with bipolar disorder three years ago and he was having a medical emergency at the time of his arrest. his girlfriend says she told
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that to police and asked that he be taken to the hospital. instead, he was taken to jail. his family says that made all the difference between life and death. martin savidge, cnn. >> joining me now from orlando is the lawyer you just saw in that piece, cnn legal analyst o'mara. thank you for being with us. i'm not going to ask for analysis. i'm going to ask for facts. sorry to talk to you under these circumstances. i am struck by some of the facts we know. that is he broke the nose and gave a concussion to one of three deputies who were injured during his arrest. i can understand that someone who's that violent would be restrained and would be handc f handcuffed and even perhapsed tased. is the problem that he was unattended or is the problem that he was restrained? i'm not sure where your case is going.
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>> we don't know. 125 days since he was kied. i said killed because he was in the care and custody and control of chatham county police department or sheriff's office. we know that he had a manic swing of a diagnosed bipolar disorder. not only did his girlfriend tell the police that, she actually gave him the medication documenting his bipolar disorder to show him he was, in fact, suffering from that. instead of taking him to a hospital, they take him to jail. i don't have any evidence of the officers being injured at all. what i'm asking for is transparency. we need to know why matthew died and we need to know what the cops did wrong that led to his death. we know he was tased. we know he was restrained. why don't they tell us, 126 days into it, why they did what they did and what they failed to do? >> that makes perfect sense to me. why all this secrecy. i always expect you get things and it's not always timely. here's the other issue, plenty
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of bipolar people walk among us and just being hand coughed, restrained and that'sed would not lead to their death. in a causation issue, could his actions and his amped up state led to his death as opposed to his being hand coughed and tased and then being left unsupervised. ? where are you going to find the causation as to what killed him? >> bipolar does not kill you. >> correct. >> now, maybe when you are in a bipolar swing and you upset one, two or three police officers, maybe they kill you. that's what i want to find out. if he was in that restraining chair, why he wasn't attended to with proper medical care particularly since they knew about his bipolar disorder. i just want to know what happened. the family cannot have any closure while they hide the facts of the case. it took miss mosby 11 days to find out what happened in baltimore. it took less time for mike brown's death to the grand jury decision in ferguson. we don't have the first piece of
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information from a system that seems to be hellbent on denying us information. >> all right. mark, we're going to continue to follow this story. when we do get more information, we certainly want to talk this through with you. thanks so much for being with us. >> thank you, ashleigh. coming up, grisly scenes. that's what set the scene when the trial of james holmes resumed. you'll find out about it next. at chase, we celebrate small businesses every day through programs like mission main street grants. last years' grant recipients are achieving amazing things. carving a name for myself and creating local jobs. creating more programs for these little bookworms. bringing a taste of louisiana to the world. at chase, we're proud to support our grant recipients, and small businesses like yours. so you can take the next big step.
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it is day eight of the trial for james holmes, the young man who admitted to shooting up a movie theater during a midnight showing of the new batman movie. admitted it sort of. wants to be found not guilty by reason of insanity. these are the 12 people were talking about. the 12 who were killed july 20th, 2012, not to mention all those who were injured. the mother of one of those victims is jessica redfield ghawi. she told us she feels no sympathy for holmes or his parents. jessica was 24. she moved to denver to pursue her dream of becoming a sportscaster. and jessica's mother, her name is sandy phillips. she's planning to attend this trial every day. this is a trial that could last
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4 to 6 months. >> we all know from the testimony being given by victims and survivors what we're hearing is about the death of our children. with each description of what row they found a body, of the position they found a body, we know who that person is. and it makes sitting through that testimony extremely difficult. but we're here for the duration. and we're not going to let anyone forget it's about the victims and the survivors and not about the killer or his family. it's extremely hard when you hear that you're supposed to have inpathy or sympathy for the person that butchered your children. i can't do it. i won't. i will be here every day to
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remind every one of you that it's about our children and our loved ones that were killed in there. there is no justice. they could give us our children back. that would be justice. can't do that. there is no justice. this could all be over tomorrow. if he would plead guilty. and get it over with. but they've already made it very clear they're not willing to do that. so we get to sit through this kind of thing, walk through this hell every day. >> and that is what it's like being a family member having to sit through a trial. those who survived have been testifying too. one by one, they're telling their stories of how they were injured and how they learned the news that their friends and loved ones were killed. >> i asked him where alex was. and he shook his head. >> shook his head yeah, shook his head no?
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>> shook his head no and then looked at the ground. >> our reporter joins me from outside the courthouse in colorado. i just don't know how those family members and those victims can sit through so much of this testimony. then there were the photographs. the photographs that have been paraded out of the crime scene, of blood spattered on the movie screen itself. what's happening in there today? because it's morning where you are. >> it's been less emotional today and really more technical. it's still been interesting, as we saw the first physical evidence brought out by the prosecution in those plastic crime scene bags to show the jurors evidence like a couple of rifle cases, an green t-shirt, a couple of bag s that were pulle out as well as batteries all found outside the vehicle. we also saw pictures today taken outside the theater just outside the exit door. they have a picture of a rifle lying on ground with blood spatters around it.
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presumabl presumably, that was one of the three weapons. one was a handgun sitting on top of the suspect's vehicle. another handgun inside the passenger side door pocket. they also showed us images of all the ballistic gear they found in and around the vehicle and pulled off of holmes. a helmet. a tactical vest. as well as ballistic chaps and arm protection. one thing that was very interesting was some car jacks or i guess metal spikes you could call them that were found on the driver's side seat where they said those are the type of devices that you could throw outside the car, the kind another vehicle would drive over and pop the tires. so we have a whole bunch of different evidence the prosecution has now presented and it's continuing to come out in bits and pieces. we've heard from 55 different witnesses and we're only two weeks into the trial. >> the car jacks, those metal spikes, that tells you that he thought someone would chase
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after him because what he was doing was wrong and that is what they have to prove to get him because right now he says he's not guilty by reason of insanity. then why the car jacks? then why the ballistics? why the protective gear? thank you for watching, everyone. wolf starts right now. hello, i'm wolf blitzer. it's 1:00 p.m. in washington, 6:00 p.m. in london, 8:00 p.m. in riyadh, 2:00 p.m. friday in pyongyang. wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us. we start with the debate over social media and terror recruiting. this morning, we heard from senators and counterterror experts in an important hearing up on capitol hill on strategies and failures in the u.s. intelligence community. up first, the effect of social media. >> the minute those individuals who are really serious about it go offline, we go dark. we lose our capability of follg


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