tv This Is Life With Lisa Ling CNN September 30, 2015 6:00pm-7:01pm PDT
>> can't wait to see that. thank you for being with us. that does it for us. we'll see you again at 11:00 for another edition of ""ac 360" and the season premiere of "this is life with lisa ling" starts right now. "ac 360" and the season premiere of "this is life with lisa ling" starts right now. when you touch someone, the fire of the spirit of god is felt by that person, by that child, by the thing you're handling. >> there are few figures in vent recent history as the polygamiest leader warren jeffs. he controls the ladder day saints known as the flds but walls and zion are starting to come down. in growing numbers, members of his flock are starting to question and break free. four of warren jeff's children
have recently left the flds and are making shocking allegations. tonight, two of them are telling their story on camera for the very first time. revealing the kind of man their father was before he became the the profit. >> i want people to know the truth. >> i wish we would have opened up about it a long time ago. >> when a man like that becomes profit, what happened? >> he can hide his sins behind the title of profits. ♪ ♪ .
utah is so majestically beautiful it's often referred to as god's country where mormons finally settled and ultimately divided over their stance on porl mar plural marriage where the church and beyond polygamy, there is another tenant, guided by the book of moore mrmonmormon, the one living man on earth has the power to relay the word of god to the people and in 2002 all that power was handed to warren jeffs. as profit, warren ruled with an iron fist. he used the banner of religion to permit underaged marriages and coverup horrific abilities including child wives. in 2011 he was convicted on two
counts of sexual assault of a minor and given a life sentence. these are the crimes the world knows about. but there is a new layer to the story that reveals much more about warren jeffs and the religion he ravaged. more and more people are starting to leave the flds and two of them are here in salt lake city and want the world and people back in the community to know something about their father. becky is warren's fourth child. and while most of his immediate family remain devoted to the flds, she left it all behind nine months ago. >> in the flds so many people said you have the neatest father in the world and now i just think if you only knew. >> to the flds she's a traitor to her faith and father. for most of her life, becky has avoided the outside world but
today she's finding a place in it and invited me to her home. are you becky? how are you? >> good. >> good to see you. >> at 31 years old, becky is starting over. >> you've completely walked away from the flds. >> uh-huh. we were always told when people posttized, evil spirit comes over them and they just do bad, bad things but i haven't experienced that yet. >> what's it like, becky, to be the daughter of one of the most notorious people in recent american history? >> wherever i go, if people find out my name, the first thing is how are you related to warren jeffs? i said he's my daughter. to me he's two different people. i don't like that one side one bit. i love the other side. but after all he's done, i don't know if he can ever be that again. >> for years, becky has mourn the loss of father she once
knew, the one that sang, danced and made her and her brothers and sisters laugh. >> this is us just eating breakfast together. >> today she keeps those memories close and wants to show me a side of warren that's never been seen. >> this looks like you guys are singing. >> yeah, we're playing a game called here we go around the mulberry bush. >> which one are you? >> the red head, messy head. >> shows the good times we had with him. saved all these birthday cards he gave me. he gave his children a card every birthday. and made us feel special. >> so this is all throughout your life? >> yes, all throughout my life. these are all before he was profit. i still get a warm feeling when i look at them. my father loved me. >> no matter what, do as the profit teaches. you look a lot like your father in this picture. >> yeah, a lot of people have
told me that. >> how does it feel to look at all these photos now? >> when i look at pictures with my father, it hurts my heart because he did so much good and yet so much bad. >> it's a pain that has haunted becky since childhood. warren's abuse of the innocent began long before he became the profit, he found his first victims at home under his own roof. >> when i was really young, probably between the ages of four and six, and it was at night and he came in my room and i kept saying father, do you know what you're doing? are you aware? i was thinking there has got to be a reason because he teaches these strict principles of morals and everything but just scared me. i tried to convince myself it didn't happen but all my life it would come to my mind. i never told anybody. >> why didn't you tell anyone? >> because father knows best. to me, he was so perfect i kept
telling myself, this is an accident, something is wrong. it is not a father daughter relationship, sexuality is the not. but i didn't feel like i could speak up, only he could have his say and i had to go with it and carry on. >> this is the first time becky has publicly opened up about what her father did to her when she was just a little girl. it's common for child victims of sexual abuse to suppress traumatic memories, keep quiet and internalize their secret and for decades, becky did just that until she learned she wasn't alone. >> okay. here is picture of me holding roy. >> roy jeffs is becky's younger brother and he, too, knows what it's like to keep a secret. >> what i've seen of roy is a boy that has tried with all his might to please his father and never could be completely
accepted by him. father excluded him from the other boys and i didn't ever know why. >> the reason my life has gone the way it has is because of what he did to me. so you're a small business expert from at&t? yeah, give me a problem and i've got the solution. well, we have 30 years of customer records. our cloud can keep them safe and accessible anywhere. my drivers don't have time to fill out forms. tablets. keep it all digital. we're looking to double our deliveries.
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city, 22-year-old roy jeffs is enjoying a freedom he's never known. >> the first movie i watched was in 2012. i was still in the flds. it was in secret. i scoped out the theater and made sure there was nobody watching me. all right. >> have a great day. >> will do. >> i felt like i was a really bad person but it was kind of fun. [ laughter ] >> in many ways, roy's life is stranger than fiction. he, too, is the son of the profit, warren jeff's 11th child. before his sister becky, roy was the first of jeff's kids to flee. did you tell anyone that you were leaving? >> no. if you tell anybody, they will be all over you trying to get you to stay. i didn't want them to change my mind. >> why did you want to leave? >> there was just no more hope anymore. i mean, as hard as i tried to be a good person or to follow their
rules, i could never be good enough. >> three months ago, roy and becky reunited in salt lake. the city where they grew up. >> it's taken a bit to get to know each other again. >> i knew him as my little brother that i took care of. >> it's a memory that becky and roy share right here in salt lake. at the base of little cotton wood canyon sits an abandoned house in a suburban neighborhood this is becky and roy's childhood home. >> as a little kid, i can remember early mornings weeding in the guarden. >> my favorite memories are the mountains and reservoir we swam? >> you-all lived here before you father became the profit. what was he like back then? >> pretty normal. he would take us up the canyon hiking and go on picnics every once in awhile. >> at the time, warren had seven
wives and 20 children. on the outside, the family appeared happy as roy says, a normal polygamist family but some of these children were suffering in silence. >> one of myer earliest memories were of him sexually abusing me. i was 4 or 5 years old and thi is where he did it. he said never do this and he did it to me. he made me feel like i had done something bad. >> i remember father saying to me, becky, you're acting different toward me, and i remember feeling like i feel different towards you. now when i think about it, i relate it to the sexual abuse. >> what was it like for both of you living in this house with him knowing what he had done to you? >> i just thought that was a
mistake. i didn't allow myself to dwell on that all the time. >> i always felt like he was perfect. i never held him accountable for it at all. >> when did you-all share what had happened to you when you were kids to each other? >> it was almost immediately. >> i let him know you're not the only one in this. >> and how did you feel when you found out? >> angry inside. i knew it happened to me and then to know it was a brother, too. >> and to also be two-faced to us and appear to be such a good person. >> yeah, that's the hardest part. >> before warren became profit, he was principal of an flds school in st. lake city for 22 years. here he perfected his image as a family man with good morals and religious conviction.
in 1998 warren's father the profit closed the school and called upon his flock to commune in short creek and flds compound on the utah arizona border. warren moved his family and four years later after the death of his father, was named the next profit. >> he had a sense of power after he became the profit and automatically started taking control of people's lives. started marrying my grandpa's wives. >> did anybody say anything about it? >> no, no, because we were taught he did right all the time. we were ought to not socialize, to not gossip, to not talk about what was going on. >> and why was that? >> honestly, now, i think it was to help my dad be able to do what he wanted to do. >> he realized he had so much power, what should i do with this power? i can do anything i want and it
went clear the wrong way. >> by the time warren was through, he married up to 80 women, 12 under 16 years old. to the fundamental mormons, plural marriage is a principle of pafaith. marrying children is not. when he started bringing in 12, 13 year old wives, what are you thinking? >> why don't you be a father to these daughters than be a husband to these young girls? >> do you think he used his role as profit to -- >> oh, yeah. >> -- to justify -- >> i think he did. he did not have other men marry 12-year-olds, only he married 12-year-olds. >> for becky and roy, these girls were once cloassmates and friends but now they were supposed to call them mother. >> there was one of them i went to school with. >> how old was she?
>> 14 then. there was probably in all close to ten that were right around my age and younger. >> and what did you think about the fact that he had these wives that were 11, 12 years old? >> then i thought it was cool because they were cute and i was 14 and they were 12 and i -- you know, naturally had a crush on them. >> but these girls now belong to his pafather and if warren sustained specked disobedience, he would send the offender away to repent. there were no exceptions, even for his son. >> i was so honest with my dad he knew everything about me. i would tell him about temptations i was having towards the mothers. these are girls younger than me e and i'm 14. he said because you're looking at my wives and being tempted toward them, then i want you to go away from that land. >> roy was torn from his birth
mother and sent to live with a cousin 500 miles away. >> i didn't realize how much i loved her and how much she meant to me until after she was gone. >> roy's mother is warren's third wife. he hasn't seen her in four years. all that remains of their relationship are a few photos. >> he didn't allow any phone conversations so she would send me mail. she had that picture taken and she sent that to me. >> of ybviously hard for your m as well. could she protest? >> she could but there would be consequences. >> do you think you'll ever see her again? >> i don't know. i don't know. >> roy and becky have in many ways be orphaned by their faith. there is no way to know exactly where their mothers are, but one possibility is short creek,
still home to the flds. even today, it's a place that warren tightly controls from prison. and becky wants to show me for herself. what are your thoughts right now as we embark upon this place where you used to live? >> on one hand, i don't want people to think i'm out to get them or do something against them because that's what some people are going to think. i wanted to get the message across that things aren't how they seem. look like this.
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only from xfinity. becky and i arie heading to short creek, a place she hasn't seen in nine months. does everybody know four of warren's kids have left? >> it's pretty well-known by now. >> what do you think that means to them? >> i think it would make them very curious why would they leave? they had everything. they are children of the profit, why would they leave? >> it's estimated 5,000 flds members live here, an area that encompasses two towns. at first, short creek feels like
any other small town but it doesn't take long to notice a difference. these are such big walled off compounds. >> when you're in there you feel like you can't live your life freely without being watched out time. >> i'm noticing all the windows are closed. >> yeah, it seems like they would be on red code lockdown right now thanks means everybody shut your blinds, lock the doors, stay quietstay seclud secluded, don't be seen but that's a security vehicle coming to check on us. hi. >> do you think all these trucks are monitoring what we're doing sm. >> i think that people have called each other and security is out watching just to monitor the situation. they don't know what's up. >> security and secrecy is designed by warren to maintain control over his flock including his own children. when becky turned 18, he married her off to a man 12 years her
senior who already had three wives. at first, she protested but over time, they fell in love and had four boys. becky had envisioned a simple, happy life but all that changed after warren's arrest. from his prison cell, the profit dictated harsh revelations that would affect everyone. he banned marriage, school, even toys. if the faithful didn't obey, they risked punishment and no one, not even warren's own kin were immune. in 2011, warren declared becky's husband no longer in good standing with the church and told becky to take her kids and leave. >> i thought, i can't do this because my boys love their father so much. we got to do what the profit says. so i wiped away my tears and said okay, i'll start packing
up. i didn't even give him a hug good-bye, i shook his hand and said thank you for all you've done and left. >> do you knowhy he was cast out? >> he could hold his own and be somebody and that is a threat to father. >> becky was removed to order any evidence her husband existed. to cut him out of every photo. today she has no pictures of the two of them together from their past. >> would you say that your father cast out anyone he thought he couldn't control? >> at first i didn't think that. i just thought if that person is cast out because they are wicked until it came so close to me. >> but warren's control over becky's life wouldn't end there. a few months later, warren declared becky a bad mother. he then took three of her children away and commanded her to retreat with her eldest son to what is called a house of repenitence. >> we were given strict rules
when we got there. we were nl supposed to communicate when he got there. >> like prison. >> one day i totally lost it and broke down and truly convinced myself i must be a very wicked person. >> becky confessed her brokenness to her father but he showed in mercy. he took away her eldest son and sent her childless to live in colorado and repent. >> we took pictures and i said i'll smile for this picture because this will be my funeral picture. i'm going to kill myself. i am. there is nothing to live for. >> becky's sister revealed something about her father that would change everything. >> one day my sister starts bawling and bawling and i said what's the matter? my sister said from the ages of about 8 to 17 he had sexually abused her. we both cried together.
i thought i'm not the only one molested. he's done it to her. it must be something that was in his nature. that's all. where does it end? if he had this in him, how can i trust him? how is he really our profit? >> how many people do you think your father has hurt? >> every single member in there. literally every single member has been affected. >> every adult i know of has a personal message of correction from him. >> today in short creek, life is on hold. in 2008 the world watched as federal agents raided warren jeff's texas compound and discovered evidence of his heinous crimes. warren jeffs is four years into a life sentence but those who still poll low him seem to be locked into a life sentence of their own. >> as things look now, they are just going to grow old waiting
for something to happen. >> why is that? >> because the profit has said that only he can perform marriages because the lord has only given him the right to do it and so nobody is getting married. nobody has gotten married since the day he was captured and put in prison. >> what happened if your father dies in prison? >> i'm sure that he's already told somebody to take over if that happens, probably be one of his brothers. >> his brothers are running things now? >> yeah. >> lisle jeffs has been in the news lately. he's warren's brother and enforcer responsible for relaying warren's messages to the people and carrying out his orders. he even declared his own son tom an apost tate. becky hasn't seen tom in three years but tonight she's ready to share her story with him. >> hey, tom, how are you?
>> good. >> you remember this one. >> hey, thomas. >> how are you doing? >> good. >> like becky, tom recently left the flds and is also viewed as a traitor by his father. >> he told the whole family i was an apost tate and i did nothing to him. >> why exactly didou leave? >> i got sick of all the restrictions and after i left the church, i still believed warren is who he said he was and i had all the respect in the world for him but i finally got a lawyer and he put all the evidence in front of me. it disgusts me. >> becky, do you want to share anything with tom? >> he molested some of us when we were little and then, you know, my sister, she dealt with it constantly, so of course, we can't support him. >> yeah.
i mean, to find out that's the man we were supporting, how could this have happened all these years and nobody know about it? i mean, it's -- it messes with your head. it does. when i first left, i thought i made the worst decision in my life and now i come to find out, it was the best decision i ever made in my life. >> i want people to know that he sexually abused some of his children so that they realize when he accuses them of i'm morality and sends them away, it doesn't mean they are guilty of it. i imagine that's how he's trying to hide his own sins, by pointing at others. >> how many kids do you think your father molested? >> i don't know, sometimes i think 10, 20. i hope it's not more than that.
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at home. >> hey, how are you doing? >> good. >> good to see you. >> you, too. >> is that the lord's voice? >> tom wants to get out of town but due to financial constraints, lives in colorado city where he can't escape warren. >> every day as early as 6:00 a.m., tom's neighbors listen hours of his teachings. are most people in colorado city listening to this now? >> they are probably not listening to the very same thing but they are all listening to --
>> to him? >> to him. >> when i hear his voice it's a constant reminder how he lied to us and he's not a revelation and not from god and he's a pedophile and needs to be treated as such. >> so ironic when they consider you the enemy and they are listening to a child molester, pedophile. >> exactly. there is no way to follow a man that does that. it's disgusting and wrong and i'm glad he is where he is. >> tom isn't the only one living here whose faith has been shattered, increasingly, people are removing the profit from their lives and tonight a group of former flds members invited me to a meeting to hear why. in the crowd, there are people who are cast out by warren. others who left on their own accord. >> given what you know now, do you think warren jeff should have been profit to begin with? >> no.
>> no. >> in the church, he was totally wonderful. we had no clue there was anything that he was harming us with. we don't feel abused there. >> when did the lightbulb go off for you? >> i found out about his confessions. so disappointed and such an emptiness and loss. >> there was a period when warren started assigning men to much younger women. did you know this was happening, and if so, what did you think? >> i think to this day the majority of the community never pictured 12. we pictured 16, you know, and i understand that in the majority of society, that's really bad, but it wasn't totally crazy in our culture. >> what about the men who were being assigned to girls 14? >> we didn't know about it. >> there are allegations that warren molested kids when he was a principal. if people had known about what
he had done before he became profit, do you think people could have followed him? >> no. >> no way. >> absolutely not. >> no way. >> i don't believe so. >> we have to have high morals. the principles that we're raised on require that. >> but if they know that warren was a pedophile, how could they continue to stay? why don't they leave? >> if you don't do what he tells you, you're going to be cast out. >> warren was very clever in this concept of if somebody starts to get smart on him, get rid of him. he just followed, didn't have a mind of our own or do anything except what we were told. the price was too high to pay. >> when do you think it will collapse? >> the it will continue to be one by one as men come to some resolution in their heart with what they want to do. >> people are left hanging
without information. they are stuck in a time warp. they don't progress. how do you break that? that's the big question. ♪ ♪ >> but one person in town is trying to expose the flds to the outside world. ruth olson is an advocate for a non-profit called holding out help and today showing me the challenges of getting out. why is it important for you to have a presence and be on the ground here? >> the church has broken down people to where they feel like they can't trust anybody. we try to establish ourselves so they can feel safe. >> do you have any idea how many people you've helped? >> i've served hundreds of people here. >> ruth and i are on our way to a secret location to meet a 17-year-old girl still inside the flds. ruth is bringing her a computer and movies, windows to the outside world.
who is this girl we're going to meet? >> she is a minor and not able to get out yet on her own. she has a very low education in that she would so like to further that and be part of high school, do sports, things like that but the problem is is that she can't get out. she's just afraid of one, she doesn't want to go to hell and that's what their religion teaches if she leaves and two, is that she may never see her parents again. >> is this a big risk meeting and exchanging money for things she wants like money for a computer? >> yeah, taking a really big risk. warren hardly needs a reason to kick somebody out. >> so this girl sent ruth a text saying, telling her the car she's in. so we just saw the car that she said she was in. and it disappeared. i saw it go that way.
there she is. >> okay. i'm going to go talk with her first. >> okay. >> so the girl ruth is meeting is parked right to my right. we don't want to shoot her car because we don't want the vehicle to be identified but ruth is now asking if i can at least meet her and she might agree to have a little chat on camera but it's very, very risky so we'll see. these are the movies that ruth is giving her. "horse camp" and "princess bride". >> she's going to pull up and get out. so she's going to come up. >> hi, how are you? i'm lisa, nice to meet you. i've seen this, this is a great movie. you're going to love it. >> here is the big box, do you want me to open it? >> i have a box.
>> you're okay? >> yeah. >> what would happen if this is discover snd. >> i really don't know. >> are you having a lot of confusion about things right now? >> yeah. >> well, it's freedom is nice. >> see ya. >> bye. >> do you think she was nervous talking with us now? >> yeah, i think she was. >> you're exposing her to the outside world. >> exactly. exactly. >> but i feel like it's my obligation to help them see more options out there and if they want out, then we can get them out. >> the fact the young flds girl still communicates with ruth indicates she's curious about the outside world but that might not be enough to propel her to leave. it's a huge risk. i wonder if things would be
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at age 15. >> to be a perfect person, i had to work all the time. my father felt more like a dictator than flather. he was always giving outcome bands and rules. there wasn't a father come bands and rules. there wasn't a father son connectio connection. >> rejected by his father and sheltered from the outside world, roy got used to being alone. it's a feeling today he still remains comfortable with. >> i almost like the feeling of being alone where i'm not judged. i just push people away. i don't like letting people in my life that much. >> in many ways, ex flds are like refugees from another country. everything outside of their former world is brand-new. >> i had my first glass of wine
last week. learned how to swim yesterday. >> wow. and would you just not have been able to swim. >> we were taught not to. >> why? >> we were taught that the devil has control of the waters. any waters. >> what did you think of the outside world and the world that everybody else lived in? >> i what did you think of the outside world and the world everybody else lived? >> i thought it was corrupt. that was the picture he painted. i was amazed at what the world actually is. just having a few people who care about me is what's keeping me going. >> now when roy is down, he has a place where he's welcome. this is the home of a woman who is operating an underground railroad of sorts. >> hey, i have an update on a possible home so i want to go through your intake briefly. >> tanya is the founding director of holding out help.
she's ruth's counterpart in salt lake and they call her when they're looking for a place to land outside of short creek. tanya and her team have helped thousands of ex-flds transition into the real world. >> the crazier that warn jeffs was getting, we quickly realized we were going to have an onslaught of people and that's what happened in the last three years. >> to roy and other exiles, tanya has become like a surrogate mother. >> tanya, she's everything to me. she's been there for me ever since i've left. she's helped me through a lot. >> the one gift i've always wanted to able to give to roy is to be reunited with his mother. but the further i get into this, i realize it may never happen. he comes to me with pretty dark stuff. it's so important for me to say let's work through that
together. >> all right, gang, it's burger time. >> whoo-hoo! >> tanya and her family have embraced rim and others like him. tonight four young men join tanya and her family for dinner. >> is there anything you guys miss about being there? >> i miss my family. >> do you think you'll ever see your family again? >> i'd be real surprised. i don't know. i guess we'll see how it turns out. >> it's been nearly a year since becky gathered her four boys and fled the flds. two year ago she reunited with her husband in a suburb of salt lake city and today becky and her boys are rarely apart. they're a team of survivors who
not only have their whole future in front of them but finally have each other. what's it like to be out here experiencing freedom with your boys? >> i don't ever have to worry that they're going to be taken away from me again. there was always a worry. >> the boys seems like they're having fun all the time and climbing trees. >> yeah. >> like could they even do this? >> they weren't supposed to. >> what were some of the things that you guys couldn't do? >> we couldn't run around, nor could we laugh. that's what i minded. they didn't let you even watch videos and they wouldn't let us even look at a picture of father. >> is there anything you miss about living there? >> no. if they gave you toys, they would take them out and burn them or something. >> you couldn't have like sponge bob or teen-age mutant ninja
turtles. >> he doesn't know who that is. >> you don't know them? >> no. >> is life better than you had? >> it's better than that place. >> i'm happy you're free. >> we would have never unless mama came home and was like, okay, let's just go. >> what happened was so devastating. for them to want to share the details with the outside world just shows to me an extraordinary amount of courage. the sudden loss of pasture became a serious problem for a family business. faced with horses that needed feeding and a texas drought that sent hay prices soaring, the owners had to act fast. thankfully, mary miller banks with chase for business. and with greater financial clarity and a relationship built for the unexpected, she could control her cash flow, and keep the ranch running. chase for business. so you can own it.
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. becky and roy's lives have long been dictated by the religion demands of their father. now that they're in control of their own futures, they're making their own decisions about what to believe and where to go on sunday mornings. >> it's not the church you're part of, it's not the family you're part of, it's who you are, it's what you do. i feel like i'm not accountable to anybody but god and that is so much simpler. >> if you could say anything, say something to your father,
what would it be? >> father, will you please back down and let the people know that you are not the prophet. stop trying to be the leader and just be our father. even if you're just our father in prison, i'll respect you if you'll just do this. i wish i could say that to him. each of us children, we know what you've done. you can't fool us and tell us everybody's guilty of things when you're guilty of these things yourself. for him to go all those years and he probably thought, oh, good, nobody ever found out. i want to tell him we know now, father. we know. please step down and let the people be. >> please stop hurting families. ripping children from their parents. i just say i love you and please
tell people the truth. breaking news, donald trump one-on-one, the mogul who wants to be your next president topping the newest poll tonight and telling me this -- >> well, i do like to win, don. >> this is "cnn tonight," i'm don lemon. an in-depth interview with donald trump. and tough talk from donald trump on putin and president obama. >> putin probably doesn't respect our country so much because he's gone through so many years of obama, but he doesn't respect our president. it's a real problem. >> plus trump on the art of the deal. i