tv Fareed Zakaria GPS CNN October 4, 2015 7:00am-8:01am PDT
this as our goal and they may well ask why climb the highest mountain. why 35 years ago fly the atlantic. >> reporter: why indeed. what would we find if president obama renewed call to visit mars. what would be there? hello obama, want a latte. >> liftoff, we have a liftoff. >> thanks for spending your sunday with us. this is gps, the global public square. welcome to all you have in the united states and around the world. we have a terrific show for you today starting with an important interview with benjamin netanyahu, the prime minister of israel. on syria and russia and vladmir putin. >> we don't want an adversarial relationship.
>> on the iran deal. >> check your enthusiasm at the door. >> what options are left for its biggest opponent? >> trying to encircle the noose of death. >> on peace in the middle east. >> there's only one way to get a peace process beginning. you've got to sit down and negotiate. >> also, former u.s. president bill clinton and the man who has been called the bill clinton of italy. that nation's prime minister. finally, you've seen the pizza pulling ramp. i will introduce you to rat who is far more impressive. first, here is my take. vladmir putin has been able to
act forcefully in syria not because he's bolder or more decisive than barack obama but because he has a clearer strategy. he supports his ally and fights those enemies. buy comparison washington and the west is confused. who is america for in this struggle. we know whom it's against. also all the other jihadi groups fighting in syria, the al qaeda affilia affiliate. it's also opposed to the hezbollah forces. russia's move is not as brilliant as it's being made out. it's a desperate effort to sure up one of the kremlin's only foreign allies and risks making russia the great satan. at least putin has a coherent
plan. the united states by contrast is closely allied with the iraqi government but finds itself on the same side as the militant sunnis in syria. the syrian kurds close to turkey, moderate forces and a small number of moderate syrians. if you consider the major groups vying for control of damascus, the united states is against almost all of them which makes for clarity but strategic incoherence. the american army could easily defeat isis. here's the fundamental problem. then it would own realize in syria. who wants to govern that territory, protect the population and be seen by locals
as legitimate? we watched you try to run iraqi towns and we will not make america's mistake. if one looks back over the many american interventions around the globe, one factor looms large. when washington allied with a local force that was capable and viewed as legitimate, it succeeded. without such locals all the outside effort, aid, fire power and training can only do so much whether in afghanistan, iraq or syria. if obama's goal is a peaceful multisectarian democracy then it requires a vast american commitment on the scale of iraq. if not, washington has to accept reality and make some tough choices. the two big ones are whether to stop opposing assad and whether to accept syria has to be
partitioned. let's be honest, if assad falls and jihadis take damascus, that would be worse than if assad stays in power in damascus. that doesn't mean requiring support but requiring him to create an enclave in syria of the kind that's already forming. even if the civil war ends and a country called syria remains, these groups will not live intermingled together again. the west has combined max mallist efforts with minimalist efforts. it's the yawning gap between those two that's making putin look smart. for more go to cnn.com/fareed
and read my post this week. let's get started. israel's prime minister was in new york this week to deliver a fiery speech on thursday to the u.n. general assembly. on friday i sat down with him to talk about many topics all hot buttons of the u.n. this week, syria, isis, the iran nuclear deal and the future of middle east peace. >> pleasure to have you on. >> good to be back. >> you have painted situation that israel faces that is pretty tough. i'm now looking at what's going on in syria. i see iran all in to try to defend the assad regime. i see hezbollah strained, str s stressed reports they have lost hundreds of fighters. aren't your enemies drained and
bleeding right now? doesn't that give you some space in security terms? >> well, that's not exactly what we see. what i see is iran pushing into lebanon, into hezbollah as they're fighting for assad. they're putting inside lebanon the most devastating weapons on earth. they're trying to turn iran's rockets that they supplied hezbollah into precision guided missiles that can hit any spot in israel. hezbollah is putting in anti-craft missiles that can shoot down our planes. we see a different picture. i made it very clear what our policy in syria is. i haven't intervened in the
syrian internal conflict, but i've said if anybody wants to use syrian territory to attack us, we'll take action. if anybody is trying to build a second front against israel, we'll take action. if anybody wants to use syrian territory to transfer lethal weapons to hezbollah, we'll take action. we continue to do that. >> donald trump says between assad and isis, he thinks assad better. is assad better for israel? >> i don't know who's better. you've got assad, iran, hezbollah, isis, these rebels and those rebels. now you have russia. i don't know what's better. i draw red lines and any time we have the intel we just keep them. we do not let those actions of aggression against israel go unpunished. >> do you think that russia's
involvement is potentially stabilizing or destabilizing? >> i don't know. i think time will tell. i did go to moscow and spoke very candidly to president putin and just told him exactly what i just told you. i said these are our policies. we don't want to go back to the days when russia and israel were in an adversarial position. i think we've changed the relationship. it's not like the one we have with the united states. nothing will ever equal that. we certainly don't want an adversarial relationship. we agreed in a few days time our deputies chiefs of staff will meet to arrange decdeconflictio. in syria i've defined my goals. they're to protect the security and my people. russia has different goals, but they shouldn't clash.
>> you have often spoken out against aggression, particularly against small countries. one place you have been studiously quiet is russia's, what many people call aggression against crimia. when asked you said i have a lot of my plate. what is your view? >> we went along with the provisions this the american government put forward. i think it's very clear we don't approve of this russian action. i think we're also cognizant of the fact we have the, woe're bordering russia now. israel is strong country. it's a small, strong country, but we also know that we have to make sure we don't get into
unnecessary conflicts. we have a lot on our plate. i went to moscow to make it clear that we should avoid a clash between russian forces and isra israeli forces. that's about as responsible and statesmanly as we should act at this point. >> what's your view of putin? >> there's mutual respect. it doesn't mean that we have mutual coherence of interest. it's not the relationship we have with the united states of america. it never can be. i think it's important that we make every effort right now to avoid a concussion. >> when we come back, i'll ask prime minister netanyahu the iran nuclear deal what if any options he has left.
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back now with my interview with benjamin netanyahu. let me show you a chart. you presented a graphic when you came to the u.n. and detailed what was dangerous about iran's quest to enrich uranium. you said this was the key, how much enriched uranium they had. this is the line you put. this is chart put out by the white house. they say you're right, that iran was at this point, the red line that you described. they say with this deal before the sanctions are lifted, iran
has to destroy 98% of its enriched uranium. the line would have to be drawn way down here. i'm asking you, are they right? >> look, i'm not going to rehash the deal. i summarized our main opposition. >> are they right? i ask experts and they yeah. if iran does what it's required to do in the first year, it goes way down. >> there are a will the of questions that will remain open on this question. there's one that isn't. after your 10 and your 15, all these limitations are lifted. therefore iran will be free to get to the point where it's at the threshold level. the nuclear, indespiensible to
make an arsenal. i don't want to rehash this. i was very clear about that. i said, okay, now that it's done, let's look forward. let's keep your feet to the fire. let's make sure they keep all their obligations under the nuclear deal. that's the first thing. second thing let's block iran's other aggression. they're trying to encircle ids real with a noose of death. they are sending weapons in iraq, afghanistan, they're all over the place and yemen. let's bolster those forces to and stand up to iran's aggression and none is stronger, none is more reliable than israel. i look forward to discussing president obama's offer to
bolster israel security when i visit the united states in november. the third i think i said, let's tear down iran's global terror network. they're over 30 countries establishing terror cells in the western hemisphere. we have no disagreement about blocking iran's aggression and working against terrorism. i think that's what we should focus on. >> last week bill clinton said he thought your speech to the united states congress at the invitation of john boehner was unprecedented. i asked him was it unwise. he said you'll have to ask prime minister netanyahu. was it unwise? >> i'll ask you a question. if the president of the united states thought a deal wads being forged that would endanger the security of the united states, wouldn't you expect him to speak
up after every place, at every forum. the answer is of course you would. that was my obligation. i don't think we should rehash this but i think we should focus on what we do agree must be done now. president obama was calling me up at the time that the deal wads being debated. he said i'd like to talk do you about bolster's israel's security about maintaining the qualitative military edge and preventing things from going into iran's boxes. would you like to do that now or would you like to do it later. i said i'd like to do it later, a day after. today in my conversation with john kerry this is the day after. we we began that conversation. our minister of defense will be coming to washington to meet secretary carter in a few weeks. after that i'll meet president obama. i look forward to discussing this with the president. i think it's a very important stage to help us face the challenges that we face.
>> if two years from now, i ran has destroyed 98% of uranium and iraq facilities have been rendered inoperable, will you call president obama and say maybe this worked a little better than i thought it did? >> i'll be the happiest person in the world if my concerns prove to be wrong. the opposite can also happen. i think the issue right now is it's a practical question right now. it's not an ideology question. what happens when they are absolved of any restrictions which is the main point i've been making. they get all these restrictions lifted regardless of their policy. >> you get 15 years with a non-nuclear -- >> assuming they don't cheat.
you're also assuming they would have gone and continued in face of very strong sanctions and a military threat. we can argue that but that's not my purpose now. my purpose is focus on what we do agree on. we absolutely agree on the need to block iran's aggression in the region. that was never part of the deal that you let them have free reign. the second thing is how to bolster israel's security. other allies that are facing the same iranian threat. i also draw attention to their global terror network. these are things we can concentrate on and we agree on and we should cooperate on and we will cooperate on. >> when we come back, did any lingering hopes for middle east peace just blow up at the u.n. this week. i'll ask the prime minister when we come back. become the only thing you think about.
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anymore. you mentioned it in your speech. i want to ask since it does feel like the peace process is dead, if it ever had much life in it, about his son. >> his son. >> his son, there's a couple of reports that talked about new york times report where he gave an interview and he said i'm not for my father's plan. i think the peace process is dead. i done want a two-state solution. i want a one-state solution. i just want rights. i just want political rights. if you're not going to give me state, give me political rights. they want just political rights. will they get them? >> well, i think that the right solution is a demilitarized palestinian state. we have a jewish state.
we should have mutual recognition of these two-nation states and provisions on the ground by which israel can defend itself by itself. i think that's preferable to the idea of a unitary state which i don't want. i think the reason the peace process doesn't move forward is because the palestinians have two provisions there. one is you've got to renounce terrorism and act against it. unfortunately that's not what they're doing. we had a young mother and young father brutally murdered. the president is yet to denounce this. the rare occasions that we have and we do have on certain occasions acts of terrorism by jews, we all go there like gang busters. we condemn it. we do everything we can to find them, and fight them.
i expect him to do the same. you've got to come and sit on the table. >> why not use this opportunity to make a bold counter offer not just a process one but an actual proposal for a palestinian state? >> i've made several offers. his offer and my offer obviously don't cohere. >> he said the problem is you're building settlements -- >> i think is problem is he's inciting terrorism. he's spreading lies. i have complaints. he has complaints. there's only one way to get peace process going. you've got to sit down and negotiate. in the seven years that i've been sitting in the prime
minister's office in israel, we haven't had seven hours he's willing to talk. it's not because of me. i'm willing to have this conversation. he's not. >> he said you're creating facts on the ground. >> so is he. >> last question. you talked about terrorism against palestinians, terrorism by israels. the president of israel says wonders, he posed this question, why is this cultural of extre extremism flourishing in israel now? do you think there's an atmosphere that's allowed this to flourish? >> no. the what does the mainstream do about it? in our case we go wild against them. every part of our society united against any example of terrorism in our mix. what i see is the president
calls public squares in honor of mass murders. it's tragedy, i think, for us and the palestinians too. the culture of peace, the culture of acceptance and diversify for women, for christians, gays and so on is very much engrained in our culture. we don't educate our people that we have to destroy the palestinians. for that we have to sit down. i think that's one order of the day. the other order of the day is what i said before. we have to protect ourselves against the rising tide that is threatening all of us. israel is there. it's standing in the breach. i appreciate the fact that despite our disagreement on the iran nuclear deal, both the supporters and opponents, they all agree now we have to strengthen israel. i think that's the best
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recently australia announced a bold new curriculum for its schools. when children are about 12 years old they will learn how to write computer programs. coding will be given much more prominence in the curriculum in contrast to history and geography which will be removed as stand alone subjects. in japan, humanities and social science departments are the closing or scaling back at 26 national universities according to the times higher education. before we start firing all the history professors let's examine
the ideas behind these moves. it's true that today's high-tech economy needs people who are computer savvy. a group that's been pushing computer science in schools estimated it will be 1.4 million computer jobs in the u.s. but only 400,000 computer science students to fill them. it's smart and rewarding to understand how computers work. succeeding at work and in life is more complicated than simply learning to code. in my book, in defense of a liberal education i showed how important the liberal arts were to teaching creativity, analytic thought and the joy of learning. all of which help you in the tech world. think of steve jobs. a recently released book called humans are underrated explains that studying the humanities
could be as valuable as a science degree in the future, perhaps even more so. he points out that it's anybody's guess which jobs will become automated next from driving cars to preparing food. human beings will always insist on some jobs being done by other human beings even if computers are capable of doing those jobs. these jobs that will emphasize social interaction are going to be the jobs of the future. humans are social animals. he points out the need to interact with others is connected to our very survival. that's why we would prefer to see a real doctor rather than a computer or choose to work in teams with other humans, not just with computer monitors. those who thrive at interacting with others, he calls them relationship workers will be the most valuable people in the future. more so than the knowledge workers of the 20th century who might be replaced by a computer. the demand for relationship
workers has actually already been on the rise. jobs involving human interaction like nurses and lawyers went up by nearly 5 million in the u.s. according to the mckenzie global institute compared to transaction jobs and production jobs which went down. what is the best way to educate our children to become relationship workers? science and technology disciplines are still crucial but far more than engineering or computer science the humanities strengthen the deep human abilities that will be critical to the success of most people. reading fiction with complex characters and stories train us to observe others and empathize with many people which is why many medical schools are require their students read fiction to become better doctors.
coding is important, computers are important but the jobs of the future and life in the future will be about how technology interacts with human beings and for that you need all kinds of knowledge, scientific as well as humanistic. next on gps, president bill clinton and the man who has been called italy's bill clinton.
italy's bill clinton. it was a terrific wide ranging conversation. i want to show you the best parts. i asked for an overall analysis of just how bad things look in europe today. >> unfortunately, europe is state of disintegration. it started in 2008. it continues to progress and it's become non-linear. the -- you have multiple, at least five or six crisis. >> what are the main ones? >> you started europe crisis at the root of it all.
it came to fruition if greek crisis at the beginning of 2010. you have the ukraine situation and there's also an external threat namely from putin's russia. this external threat ought to unite europe because everybody has to pull together to resist and to stand up to it. >> i asked the prime minister if
russian threats would cause europe to find some common ground and common identity and coalesce and unite. >> i think it could be tragic mistake consider europe against russia. i think we must defend integrity of you rain. i think we must continue in support to the government. if we think the future of europe is created identity not in our values and our ideals but against russia, i think this is tragic mistake. we want only when we decide to open the borders, not close.
>> it seems to me we have gotten to a point where because technology and media and a certain degree of means allow people to see a better life and to find way to leave their countries, they can get -- they're not taken any anywhere so you have 60 million people around the world trapped in this no man's land. how do we solve this? what happens? >> i'll do my best to answer that. if you think about what george said and what the prime minister said, wasn't so very long ago that europeans were killing each other in large numbers. the european union itself is a miracle. the eurozone assumed great economic significance as long as the economy was growing. as soon as it turned down the problems became apparent.
in times of insecurity, negative identity politics tend to trump positive identity politics. the european idea requires a level of security, personal and collective security to embrace. it doesn't mean it's not worth fighting for or that the battle is over. we didn't repeal the laws of human nature. we didn't all of a sudden elevate human consciousness overnight. this is a long battle. i'm with you, it's worth fighting for. >> can i ask you one corollary? do you think that issue of negative versus positive identity when you have slow growth is true in america as well? >> absolutely. absolutely. you get these -- that's the
republican presidential debates. you have people who live in cold country who lost 20,000 jobs before barack obama took the oath of office responding to mr. trump saying that if i just throw the immigrants out who are undocumented and stop the chinese products from coming in, you'll be honky dory. they are physically isolated where employment peaked in 1920, 95 years ago. nobody has done anything for them. if this is worth fighting for let's take this thing piece by piece. i don't think you should give up on the european dream nor do i think you can get it back as it was in the hay day of the '90s,
overnight. you have to bill it back and you have to realize this is really terrible. compared to what? what europe was in the 1940s? i don't think so. what it was in the 1870s? i don't think so. we can't get away from each other so the world will be defined by positive identity politics or negative identity politics. in insecure times the negative has the advantage. you win a long, long battle. next, something completely different. the world went crazy recently over the so-called pizza rat. i say these rats should be the real heroes. they can actually save lives. big day? ah, the usual. moved some new cars. hauled a bunch of steel. kept the supermarket shelves stocked. made sure everyone got their latest gadgets. what's up for the next shift? ah, nothing much. just keeping the lights on.
(laugh) nice. doing the big things that move an economy. see you tomorrow, mac. see you tomorrow, sam. just another day at norfolk southern. ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ to help those in need. here to volunteer when a twinge of back pain surprises him. morning starts in high spirits but there's a growing pain in his lower back. as lines grow longer, his pain continues to linger. but after a long day of helping others, he gets some helpful advice. just two aleve have the strength to keep back pain away all day.
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yesterday marked tend of the united nations general assembly debate. it's landmark year for the u.n. that's celebrating its 70th anniversary. what country was the first to sign the u.n. charter on june 26th, 1945? the united states, china, united kingdom or switzerland. stay tuned and we'll give you the answer. ferguson has produced a fascinating, deep and rich biography. the book is 1,000 pages long and ends just with kissinger's
appointment. admittedly this is like candy for me but i found myself deeply interested despite the detail. now for the last look. brutal battlefield, sinking ships are a few of the obstacles refugees face during their journeys to europe. they're also facing potential threats that have been lying in wait for decades. facing border closures and fewer paths to germany, they're traveling through croatia to get through their promise land. if they stray from paths there danger awaiting thanks to 51,000 active land mines left over from the balkan war. removing that many mines may seem like an impossible fete, well it isn't. lost month the government of
announced it's land mine free. the men and women who cleared the mines had help from an unlikely source. these giant mdr, mine detection rats went through extensive training to help the human friends sniff out mines. in under an hour they could check an area that would take a human two days to cover. to think last week the world of twitter was impressed by rat that carried a slice of pizza. we think these rats should go viral instead. the correct answer to the gps chance question is b. china as the first victim of aggression by an access power, unquote was given the opportunity to sign the charter first. 49 other countries also signed that day.
happy 70th anniversary to the u.n. tune in next sunday as i'll be talking to more of the world leaders who are in new york for that general assembly. thanks to all of you for being part of my program. i'll see you next week. good morning. reliable sources will begin in a moment but breaking news it's only getting worse and worse in south carolina as historic rainfall is causing catastrophic flooding in parts of the southeast with 15 inches of rain in some spots. there are dams breaking, bridging buckling, whole buildings collapsing and the local national weather service announcement calling the amounts mind boggling. these are live pictures of wis in columbia. they have been doing exemplary work all morning. the anchors begging people not to venture out for the exact reasons you're seeing now. people in apartment buildings unable to leave because the flood waters are s