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tv   Reliable Sources  CNN  November 22, 2015 8:00am-9:01am PST

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thanks to all of you for being part of my program. monday you can catch my isis documentary. this week, all this week has been a barrage of disturbing news streaming across our screens. from paris and brussels to mali and lebanon, to halifax and hanover and the campaign trail at home. fear is poison. fear is a crippling poison.
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there is a threat that governments are taking seriously. is the media doing its part to put things into proper perspective. you just asked the questions on gps. we switched seats here. thanks for sticking around. i want to talk about the breaking news we're hearing from iran this morning. we're hearing from iranian authorities that the jails washington post journalist has been sentenced now. they're not saying for how long. we know the post is trying to get more information. it seems to confirm last month news that he had been found guilty of espionage. it's been condemned all around the world. what does this tell us about iran. what does this tell us that they are saying he's been sentenced to remain in prison for an
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undetermined amount of time? >> first it's outrageous. he's not committed no crime. he's a very good reporter. we asked him about it. we were sad in way. he admitted he did not have any control over it. it tells you very conservative still opposed to any kind of dealings with the u.s. because iran is such an unreliable rogue actor on the world stage, it's a good thing they will be 18 months away from having material rather than the two months before this deal was
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struck. >> i want to start with what president obama. overreacting that invading is what isis wants. >> if you think about it, we don't really know what isis wants. they don't even bother to issue demands. they're weak. they want to show they are strong. what they're trying to goad you into is an overreaction. it's trying to get the israelis to round up all palestinians and create an us versus them situation. the sunnis try to do, they goaded the shiaa government into
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over reacting. that's what isis is trying to do. create a world between muslims and non-muslims. here is what president said at a press conference earlier today. >> can't beat us on the battlefield so they try to terrorize us into being afraid and changing our patterns of behavior and panicking and abandoning our allies and partners and to retreating from the world. as president, i will not let that happen. >> that's similar to what you're saying. it's it dissatisfying and when we hear congressmen commentatorr answer it's because that answer is disfieing. >> these people have done something so outrageous that you
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want to do something. it's not just fear. it's the desire for revenge. >> it's a very basic human emotion. >> these guys never win. you just have to have patience and remember what you have is the combined power of the world's largest countries, particularly isis, which doesn't have a regional power sponsoring. you have to be patient. you have to wear them out. what we have to do is to provietd context, which i think cnn has done a lot of by giving people an understanding of what's going on but also what
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the broader context is. what the response to isis is. we've down 8,500 air strikes against isis around. >> if you polled americans, they might not know how many air strikes have been conducted to date. you look at current pollings, that many americans believe there's an imminent threat of a terrorist attack on u.s. soil. most of the time when the polls are conducted there's no attack afterwards. that's been true for years and year. s. >> we were scared witless by al qaeda. you grinds it down. the other area where there's this gap between knowledge and fear is on the whole issue of refugees.
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if you ask how many syrian refugees we taken in last year, how good is the vetting process. i'm not sure on this number. i think it was 36. we took 36 syrian refugees in last year. in other words, we have thorough vetting processes. >> i was thinking about today, november 22nd in 1963, president john k. kennedy assassinated. think about how walter kronkrite delivered the news. it was a time there was relatively little information and few news sources. we're much better off to have a wealth of news sources. sometimes the world seems more confusing, facts seem less available than they did 50 some years ago when this country was shocked toitss core by that
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assassination. it's the difference as opposed to having the access of information and seizing on it, using it to make decisions. >> we're drowning in information but we're searching for wisdom. that's to pull back and have some sense of perspective. you always had to calm people down. >> who were your reliable sources? who do you turn to when the world seems to be so chaotic? >> one of the great recourses, i have a lot of people around the world i talk to and try to get a sense of what's really going on. they don't think it's completely defeated yet. you get more of a real sense. the great recourse is history. look back. it seemed to cripple britain.
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they bombed the hotel room. at the end of the day the forces of civilization in my view overwhelm these forces of barberism. it just takes time. these guys only have to be right once. we have to be right a thousands times a day. in the end they have no answers to the modern world. >> thank you so much for being here this morning. appreciate it. >> thank you. >> your documentary is airing tomorrow night, monday at 9:00 p.m. it's an important part. i recommends it. coming up, few more guests put this weekend into perspective. the question is the coverage making things better or worse? let's look at something from just this morning.
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>> hey, i watched when the world trade center came tumbling down. i watched in jersey city, new jersey where thousands and thousands of people were cheering as that building was coming down. thousands of people were cheering. >> the police say that didn't happen and all those rumors have been on the internet for some times. >> it did happen. i saw that. >> you saw that with your own eyes? >> it did happen. there were people cheering on the other side of new jersey where you have large arab populations. they were cheering as the world trade center came down. i know it might not be politically correct to talk about it but there were people cheering as the building came down, as those buildings came down. that tells you something. it was well covered at the time. >> there is not evidence to back up what donald trump is saying.
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it just isn't. we've looked for it. it's not there. let's talk to three expert who is can put this into proper context beginning out in phoenix this morning. the senior vice president of news and editorial director at mpr. in washington, director of the school of media and public affairs at the george washington university. thank you fg being here. let me start with frank in washington. let's get directly at this issue with donald trump. it's an example of an unreliable source. you were the washington bureau chief. is there any evidence to back him up? >> no. he talks about is this politically correct to talk about it. drop the word political. is it correct? he claims to have seen something that either happened or it didn't.
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there is no conspiracy in the media to hide anything. donald trump needs to be called on something if he speaks incorrectly. he has spoken incorrectly. i recall no such thing. there were cheering crowds around the world. that's true and that was ugly. i do not recall anything like that in the united states. certainly not thousands of people gathering and cheering. >> seems these ideas bubble up from internet comment threads whether from the far left or far right. let me go out to michael in phoenix. you run the news organization. you have to make decisions every day about how to cover these issues. >> we have to call them on it as george attempt to do. it's become more and more difficult to stop that information in a world where
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information rattles around in speed of light. it was a long time ago. it is our job to try to straighten the facts out and remain calm the more hysterical the situation becomes. you were saying fear is an appropriate and wise reaction. >> it's a survival mechanism. i think people make a mistake. the orbvious is to exploit feari
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was in washington when paris happened. did i feel a sense of concern. if i get on an airplane tomorrow and fly to los angeles, yeah. i think unless the political process first understands that the fear is understandable response so it can put in perspective. min he started out by telling the public some really unpleasant things about military defeats. e said i know you got bombs raining on you. for instance, if you could tell the public fast, this is the vetting process for refugees. they don't walk in here. it's a two year or year process. that will help. to dismiss it is a mistake.
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>> michael, let me ask you about the coverage of the refugee situation. there was something here at cnn this week, correspondent was issues pented for a tweet. she later apologized for the tweet. i think here at cnn is she violated the policy against correspondents expressing a political point of view. how would you have handled the situation? >> the rules are quite similar. nobody on the staff of npr is allowed to express political points of view or opinions in social media or on the air. >> there was a lot of people who was saying she was expressing a
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basic moral value. what would you have told your journalists? >> well, i understand it was of criticism. one other seems to be that cnn actually had a double standard and there were lots of opinions being expressed but she was cited for this one. i noticed you in your own article said that hosts had a certain amount of leeway or certain hosts. i don't know whether that's true or not. to be honest i listen to npr more thanwatching cnp. that wouldn't be the npr policy. that's a big debate in journalism. we have an obligation to provide
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people with facts. our job is not to tell people what to think. it's to give them the information to think about. when ever one of our journalist strays over that line it fogs the situation. i think npr and cnn are correct to have rule against expressing political opinions. >> particularly on twitter i would just add unedited forums like facebook is different from a cnn op-ed. i want to bring you back later in the hour. after the break glen greenwald says the american media is rooting for war. why the recent attacks in mali and lebanon may be equally tragic but aren't getting equal coverage. we'll bring the panel back a about that. machine or, as we say at unitedhealthcare insurance company, go long. of course, how you plan is up to you. take healthcare.
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tcount on someone's kid mistaking me for santa. i'm so sorry. come on sweetie. it's okay. and knowing right when my packages arrive. introducing real-time delivery notifications. one more reason this is our season. . did you feel a lurch. were these comments fear mongering or proper media coverage? >> new york city is probably the number one most desirable target among jihadist worldwide. >> these are people living among us and that's the biggest threat. >> the fbi has arrested more than 70 isis sympathizers. >> you put together access to guns, you can go anything you want up until you commit an
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actual crime. once you've done that, all we can do is put the police tape out and collect the bodies. >> isis is finding support here every day. >> what happened in paris was described as france's 9/11. some media critics are sounding the alarm now. joining any mow is glen greenwald. thank you for being here this morning. >> thanks for having me. >> you said this week the media is trying to stoke that id part of your brain. the part that wants fiercer military action against isis. you said the press is hungry for war. how do you back up that assertion?
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>> the lesson that was learned after the 9/11 attack was allowing political and military intelligence officials to make all kinds of claims without scrutinizing is really destructive thing to do. it leads to things like torture, guantanamo. i think you've seen that exact behavior but even worse from the overwhelming majority of the media since the paris attack. >> even worse. >> i think that cnn is unfortunately led the way in this. you've had one intelligence official with the cia or formerly with the cia after the next, gone on air and say all kinds of extremely dubious claims that print journalists have documented are totally false. >> you're specifically talking about encryption. >> talking about why this terrorist attack happened, about more powers needed and the need
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to go in and attack and attack isis with ground troops as well. i think that's the other aspect is there's really alarming anti-muslim climate cultivated in this country not just by republican candidates like donald trump talking about making them carry id cards and putting them in databases and closing mosques but by the american media itself. i think the worst example were two cnn anchors who told a french muslim political activist that he and all other muslims bear responsibility for the attack in paris because all muslims must be responsible. >> there is a difference between asking questions and making statements. you say they told him that. they were asking a series of questions. >> no. no. they made statements when he was on and after he left. they said the word responsibility comes to mind. it's time for people like this
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to accept responsibility. >> aren't you cherry picking a bit? aren't you cherry picking from 24 hours of television coverage. >> cnn have had multiple tapes of john brenham, zero push back. a cnn reporter said why can't we take these bastards out, pushing the president toward war in syria. this is the kind of opinioning that coming from cnn all the time. you're allowed to demonize muslims. >> i thought he was trying to express what folks in america are thinking and feeling now. that dissatisfaction with the president's response to isis. is it not appropriate for the
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press the hold the president accountable if that way by trying to express the public's mood, anger? >> i think it's totally appropriate for the cnn host to express their repugnant opinions. i think it's appropriate for jim ac acosta to voice what people are saying. >> you're saying let's hear all opinions. the message that's sent is you're free to stoke antimuslim animosity in the united states. >> i hear what you're saying. i haven't heard anti-muslim
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rhetoric on this network the way you're describing. i hear what you're saying. >> you watch that interview. >> i did. that caused convulsion around the world. >> there's always call for people like you to hold republican presidents accountable. he was cohold holding a democrac president accountable. >> i support what he did. i think what jim did is great. i think it's great that christiane can go on and demand that the president can attack isis with ground troops. that's journalism criticizing politicians. the fact that cnn singled her out and bunnished her doesn't show the objectivity required of cnn reporters.
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demenfending muslims is not allowed. >> i think we've seen a lot of variety of coverage. i do want to share this. i think the folks that have to make the news judgments have one view of it. some journalists have other views of it. the people in charge have to enforce these rules. >> this is the problem with this claim of objectivity. you have cnn journalists expressing all kinds of opinions. >> i guess we could debate it all day. i tend to agree with you about
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the idea that journalists in some cases should show more of their opinions through their writing, through their comments on television, et cetera. i think it's different when it's an unedited tweet. i appreciate you being here to express that. >> thanks for having me. appreciate it. >> thank you. coming up, reaction to glen's comments plus the misinformation that's been out there. all the misreporting about isis. i want to ask what journalists can do to clear up what's a fog of war situation. that's next. [eerie music] i am the ghost of cookies' past...residue. gross. well, you didn't use pam. so it looks like you're stuwith me! bargain brand cooking spray leaves annoying residue. that's why there's pam. ok, wehere's dad. mom. the twins. aunt alice... you didn't tell me aunt alice was coming. of course. don't forget grandpa. can the test drive be over now? maybe just head back to the dealership? don't you want to meet my family?
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one of the big debates in journalism is about the way we talk about isis. on msnbc this week lawrence o'donnell called out the press. stop calling him a mastermind. you can call him the ring leader. you can call him the organizers of attacks but not glorifying this homicidal maniac who flunked out of high school. is he right? can a word make such a difference? it's been debated here at cnn. let's discuss the ethics of this. jeff, what is the appropriate call. is it mastermind? is it ring leader? does it matter at all? >> it matters a bit. i'm not sure it matters that much. i think the point is to not make these people 20 feet tall. i've seen a couple of analysis
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and it said it did not take an evil mastermind genius to pull it off. i noticed new york times article that referred to islamic extremists. we know this is enormous argument. why won't the president label this. why does hillary clinton call them jihadists. what's the game here? i think the substance of what's going on matters a lot more than the words. i think journalists ought to be careful. >> let me ask you about something we saw online. a lot of press critics and consumers claim it was much more focus on paris than an attack in beirut a day or two before then. this weekend, friday, we saw what happened in mali. there's other attacks in kenya.
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there is a hierarchy of news. do you agree? >> i wouldn't frame it that way. i think as human beings, i would hope we could hold all life sacred. none of us would view ourselves as all powerful enough to judge the value of any life against some other life. i don't think that's what journalists are doing. every day in a hundred ways journalists make choices about what to cover and how much to cover it. >> why did paris get so much more attention than beirut? >> well, let me just finish the thought. the death of a pope gets a lot more attention than the death of a b movie actor unless they were president of the united states and helped to end the cold war. we're always ranking events. beirut was a terrible event. it did get quite a bit of coverage on npr and our colleagues at public radio international did a truly heart
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moving piece the morning of the paris attack about a fellow who fl threw himself on a bomber. he was killed. he saved his daughter and many other people in that busy area. that was all said before the paris attacks. it is true that the attack in paris for many, many reasons received more attention attacks. paris is the world city. there's probably no place on earth that more places connect to. i won't pretend they got equal amounts of attention. it's clear looking back that the downing of russian jet liner, the attack in beirut and the attack in paris were part of one very large story which was the assertion by isis of a kind of
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world power that we hadn't before, we being western intelligence and others, expected of them. >> let me go to frank on this. in the wake of the breaking news there's so much misinformation. i'm thinking about reports of the takers. the eiffel tower going black. a woman killed in the raid was mistakenly said to be europe's first suicide bomber. the new york post was not at all alone on this one. turns out it was a male, not female in that case. >> there's not much you can do if they're telling you
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information that's not right. they have to attach this information to the sources. it has to say this is happening. i want to go back to a point made earlier. what the media should be spending its time on, what news rooms should be preoccupied with and whether you want to pick at words, that's fine. the bigger issue here is how are you going properly contextualize this story. what is news? news is that which is unusual, unexpected and significant. paris had all of those things. it broke out and made itself separate and apart from what has happened in lebanon and iraq. however, however, the media need to do a much better job at looking at how they frame these issues because there was a very thoughtful piece in the atlantic because an npr piece was called out. those who lost their lives much of the beirut coverage referred to this. it was put in a context of war.
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we have to do, we the media need to do a much better job at presenting the public with a more complex nuanced careful look at these things that put them in context. >> jeff, i see your disagreeing. >> i don't disagree. i think there's a broader point. you have a 1300 year scism in the islamic word that divided tribes in ways that made no sense. you have a saudi arabia that people are urging come in, their our allies. one of the most dangerous, intolerant fuels of this kind of anger, i would like to see in terms of coverage that as much as possible, i understand the limits of time and space that on a 24-hour news network those underlying facts keep being put before the public so they can put isis in the frame that makes
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some sense. >> jeff, michael and frank, thank you for being here this morning. been a wonderful conversation. up next, are refugees terrorists? those words being put together in the same sentence. we're going to pull out our red news, blue news glasses to look at the coverage critically, next. the best of everything is even better during red lobster's ultimate seafood celebration where new seafood combinations like the new grand seafood feast are stepped up, spiffed up, jazzed up... yeah, this stuffed lobster tail, handcrafted brown butter scampi, and jumbo hand-battered shrimp
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but one day brian gets snapshot from progressive. now brian has a rate based on his driving, not theirs. get snapshot and see just how much your good driving could save you. cue stephen colbert. >> the question of whether to let syrian refugees into this country has become the new political issue completely overshadowing the old political issue, whether to let mexicans into this country. >> this issue has been getting the red news, blue news treatment meaning what you hear about refugees depends on who you're hearing it from.
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reliable information has been overwhelmed by misinformation. this viral picture was retweeted hundreds of times. it said remember the man who killed four marines. he was a refugee. not true. neither is this one. it shows the boston marathon bombings say just say no to importing more ref psychiatugee. they were not refugees. they arrived here on touring visas. whether you think zero should be here at all, this kind of trickery should tick you off because it messes up the entire depate. let me show you an example of the rhetoric getting lead of facts. this is donald trump on an instagram video. >> syrians are being caught at the southern border like i said. they're going to be pouring in. we don't know who they are. could be isis. we need a new president fast. >> where did trump get that information? it seems like he got it from the
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conservative website which said, confirmed, eight syrians caught at the texas border. headline makes it seem ominous - but it wasn't true. the department of homeland security said the people were not caught. they turned themselves in. they were two families. >> two syrian families being detained at the moment in texas. the department of homeland security saying they presented themselves at the mexico-u.s. border in laredo. two men, two women, four children. immigration is now processing them. >> anything is possible but common sense could suggest they are asylum seekers, not threats to america. what i've noticed in lot of red news coverage is a casual connection between refugees and imminent danger. they will talk about people fleeing danger. then they'll talk about how we might be in danger in our homes. they don't have to link the two directly in order to instill fear. how blue news sources respond to
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all this? there's been this temptation to dismiss anyone else's concern about importing terror. there's even been mockery. it says gop politicians sound like racist internet trolls. by invoking the r word, racist, that column comes across as intolerant which is what the writer is accusing the republicans of being. what do we end up with? we end up with people talking past each other reading different stories and then coming up to different conclusions. we end with with a red news blue news world. the story behind the scene. what led to where this american flag went viral. she's join me next to talk about that. milk has 8 grams of high-quality protein. which could be the difference between just living life. and milking it. start every day with the power of protein and milk life.
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don't see many people on cable news like saba ahmad. you definitely don't see this. she's wearing the traditional head covering worn in publicly some muslim women made out of the american flag. her appearance was an effort to challenge an idea by donald trump who says he would consider shutting down some mosques. she's here with me. i wanted to ask you about that fox moment. it went viral. was that your idea? >> no, it was actually very last minute. i bought the scarf here in time square. at the very last mini was watching the show. i wanted to show my pateti patriotism. >> the makeup room ladies always
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know. >> and she told me today, pink looks good. >> i wanted to ask you, in the short time i have left on the program this hour, if you've seen a lot of his islamaphobia in the media. >> i think it's an opportunity for us to solve and i think the reason i'm reaching out to republicans and conservatives in particular is because our islamic faith values align a lot with them. it can be like a teaching moment for america and hopefully we'll get through to all the major news shows and change the anti-islamic sentiment environment in the united states. >> do you blame the reporters and the anchors more or the politicians they're covering? >> across the board. >> hard to differentiate. >> i work in washington, d.c., and you see that all the time. there is so much anti-islamic
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hysteria. when i show up in congressional hearings, people are just oh, my god, they have a specific view of muslims. when we show up, it just changes their mind. and i think it changes the game. >> as with everything in life. thank you so much for being here this morning. we'll be right back with more "reliable sources." big day? ah, the usual. moved some new cars.
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hauled a bunch of steel. kept the supermarket shelves stocked. made sure everyone got their latest gadgets. what's up for the next shift? ah, nothing much. just keeping the lights on. (laugh) nice. doing the big things that move an economy. see you tomorrow, mac. see you tomorrow, sam. just another day at norfolk southern. it begins from the the second we're because, healthier doesn't happen all by itself. it needs to be earned every day. using wellness to keep away illness. and believing a single life can be made better by millions of others. as a health services and innovation company optum powers modern healthcare by connecting every part of it. so while the world keeps searching for healthier we're here to make healthier happen.
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six days a week. usually around 5:00, maybe 6:00 every day. "state of the union" with jake tapper starts right now. a world on edge. an international manhunt underway for the surviving terrorists and new fears that it is not over yet. what might isis have planned for america? plus, the heated battle over syrian refugees. >> to bring them into this country is suicide. i call it the trojan house. you can't do it. >> republicans attack the president's plan to take in thousands of syrians. >> he sees the world as he likes to see it as a fantasy. i see the world as it really is. >> republican presidential candidate chris christie joins us live. >> then president obama unleashed. >> what i'm not interested in