tv Legal View With Ashleigh Banfield CNN December 3, 2015 9:00am-10:01am PST
and around this county were able to find these two suspects and bring them down. so we're going to hear from the police chief, the sheriff's department and the fbi. different federal agencies also helping out here which gives us insight into the different angles being pursued. what do we know about the people specifically involved, the suspects, the man and woman who shot up a holiday party, killing 14 people right? the context is important. that's the deadliest mass shooting in the u.s. since new town. there had been con jeck sure early on by investigators we may not know exactly what drove them to murder ever. we do have some answers. we have new information that's coming in. here's what we know right now. we know their names, syed farouk, tashfeen malik, 28 and 29 years old, known to be husband and wife. marriage came under curious circumstances, may have involved travel abroad. reports about that that are still being chased down by
investigators. we know the male suspect was there because he worked for the county health agency. he was at the party. something happened at the party. he left. it is described by witnesses at the scene as being somewhat of a hostile situation. what happened next is for sure, he returned, he returned with his wife and they were heavily armed in a way that suggests planning, that even if something happened at that party, the eventual attack was not simply spontaneous. military wear, tactical military garb on them as well. this isn't something urgent, this is about the upcoming presser, so don't worry about that. they had long guns. they had handguns. they had a potential explosive device. again, that goes to the spont in aty versus the planning of this. they had passed off their 6-month-old child to the grandmother, saying they had a doctor's appointment that day, which was obviously not true. all of these factors go into the investigation of what's going on. president obama has been speaking about this.
he did it during an interview with cbs and he just did it again recently. here's what he had to say as a point of focus. >> at this stage, we do not yet know why this terrible event occurred. we do know that the two individuals who were killed -- were equipped with weapons and appeared to have access to additional weaponry at their homes. >> all right. there's no question that president obama focuses very heavily on the fact that guns were here, that this is another mass shooting. there were two yesterday. there have been 355 this year alone. to the president, that speaks to a pattern that is not replicated by another developing country. the investigators are looking far beyond the means to the
motives here. the former head of the police in redlands, california, also cnn's victor blackwell, anchoring for us from a different part of the location, where the home was that started the entire chase. victor, first, just to get a sense. that's where it all changed. they went from being on the search to being in the hunt. what happened there? >> well, certainly, when officials were told by the san bernardino police chief, jarrod burguan, got some information, a lead, that this address was connected to syed farouk. officers traveled here. they noticed a black suv with utah tags, slow down, kind of pass them at a really slow pace and then race off and then the chase was on. it didn't last very long. about a quarter mile. that's where everything ended with that shootout with about 20 police officers. syed farouk, 27 years old and tashfeen malik, 28 years old, both died in that vehicle. there was something thrown out of the vehicle.
at the time, it was thought it was a pipe bomb. later determined to be fake. but let me give you an idea of what's been happening here since. there was a search overnight for explosives. inside this town home, in a vehicle outside, no explosives found that we've been told of by officials. but we have seen the fbi here all morning inside, outside the home, starting the search for evidence, to get answers to the question why. just in the last few moments, we've seen members of the regional forensic computers lab leave here, of course looking through any laptops, any desk tops, any hard drives or thumb drives or cell phones that could lead to the larger question why. and are there other people supporting these two, because it took a lot of time and a lot of preparation to get that tactical gear, the weapons, the ammunition, and to plan the massacre that they carried out yesterday. they're not using the term premeditated, but it is quite difficult to believe. i'm sure you're hearing from lots of law enforcement officials that this was
perpetrated or -- the catalyst of it was simply an argument at a holiday party. he went home, got his wife, shot 31 people, killing 14 of them. >> right. from the beginning, that has looked to be just an improbable situation, victor. because the information and the reporting is confirming that. if we can bring in justice correspondent evan perez. we're getting information now that authorities after looking in that house, as victor was suggesting, they were getting in there, finding information that leads to a different picture of this, that takes us far away from the idea of anything random in this and to what specifically the intentions of this man and his wife were. what have we just learned? >> well, chris, i think it's really more a complicated picture is kind of what the president said just about an hour ago. we do know that law enforcement officials do believe that there are indications that syed farouk was radicalized. they believe that could be part of the motivation for why this shooting took place yesterday in
san bernardino. they still believe there might be some indication of a workplace motive, some kind of workplace beef, that at least may have triggered or played a role in what happened yesterday. so some kind of hybrid explanation of what happened yesterday. we do know that officials have found indications that he was in touch with and had communications with one -- at least one terrorism suspect, somebody who was being looked at by the fbi and that the fbi was already investigating and that there was some communications over the phone, by social media, that are now being analyzed, simply to try to figure out whether or not that also played a role in this radicalization and what might have -- what occurred yesterday. we also know they're looking at some overseas communications. we don't know whether that indications that anybody was ordering what happened yesterday to occur. again, there's no indication of that yesterday. we do not know of any international terrorism links. again, that's something the fbi is trying to chase down and make sure they understand exactly how that fits in.
again, the thing that the fbi is trying to make sure they do is not foreclose any of these possibilities. we know that they found, for instance, some kind of homemade bomb lab. we know they found a backpack at the scene of the first shooting, chris. and apparently this is where he made these bombs. this is something that he had rigged together with a remote control car, and was intended to detonate yesterday and did not happen. we don't know exactly why that did not happen. these are all the pieces the fbi is putting together. indications radicalization, however, is what has moved the fbi and the president to make this an fbi investigation because there are indications this is where this is going. >> right, fbi, atf, jttf, the joint terrorism task force. multiple agencies being involved. it's making more and more sense why. evan, thank you. let's bring in former chief jim beerman here. thank you for being with us.
you didn't want to betray the trust of what you had known and been told but now that we're reporting it we can get some better context on this. if there's evidence this guy was radicalized, that goes to why the authorities are looking at who else knew and how did he learn to do what he did with that bomb. was he a lone wolf, self-radicalized? we know that online hate magazines generated by bad guy groups often teach you how to do things, like how to use toys and cell phones as detonators. maybe that's why it didn't work, because he was teaching himself. you say they were looking in that house for a reason and they found things. >> the investigators have been working all night long. they know a lot more today than they did yesterday about what their motive was, who these people were and who they may have had contact with. so i think we're going to hear in the press conference coming up here some very specific things that will tell us more about what the motive was and, as tragic as this incident was, it was horrific, it looks to me like the police intervention
probably forced out a much more tragic outcome. >> look how they scrambled. what usually happens, if this is radicalization, if this is kind of that typical hateful terrorist attack, they usually stay there, try to do as much bad as they can, and take themselves out when they're outgunned, try to blow themselves up sometimes. here, they fled. now what does that speak to? not having what it takes to fulfill their mission or that they weren't really prepped by anybody and maybe this was a lone wolf. let's put the information we have to some better minds. we have cnn's jim sciutto. we have former fbi agent jonathan gilum. former cia operative bob baer and explosive expert tommy may. we've been looking at this overnight together. from the beginning, we've been hearing whispers this was about where else this extends to. now that we're hearing they believe he was radicalized, the
question becomes how and perhaps by whom, right? >> no question, listen, the sad fact is, it's very easy to become radicalized today. the paris attacks, i was told by french investigators, the radicalization process today, typically in the past, their experience had been, it would take months, now it can happen in two or three weeks. it's happening so quickly it's hard for them to keep up. we don't know how long it took here but it just speaks to the difficulty in tracking this kind of thing as it happens. and we know groups such as isis and others have a very powerful social media presence, they've been fantastic at magnetically attracting recruits to this extremist cause. that's one thing. you heard the president say just a short time ago this possibility it was terrorism. the president saying that from the oval office often unless there was something to back that unand we're seeing now one reason why that may be. again, as evan perez was reporting there, law enforcement, counterterror
officials, still see the possibility of some possible mix of those two motives. perhaps joined with extremist motivation. it would be rare, it would be odd, but there are a lot of rare and odd things, about this case, namely that you had a husband and wife carry out this bloodshed. what we're learning is fairly alarming. >> all right, jimmy, thank you very much. let's go from that piece of the puzzle you put together. bob, let me bring you in. then this becomes about, well, how effectively can you be self-radicalized? what are we seeing, what happened here, that speaks to how well or not well these people did what they wanted to do, what do you see? >> i've got the impression so far with the facts that have come out that these people were trained. you can't self-train yourself in something like confronting the police in a gunfight. you almost have to do that in a training camp. that's what disturbs me, the
fact they were aware of police reaction time, they got in, mmitted the violence and got away. they used home made devices to break contact with the police. i can't tell you what they were gog to do. they were going to go back and maybe try to detonate that explosive, that remote controlled -- but now that the signs of radicalization are out there and their technique, this has all the hallmarks of a preplanned terrorist attack. i'm sorry, it just does. whether they were inspired or -- >> don't be sorry -- >> yeah, i mean, i hate -- i'm out on a limb like this, but i'd say it's international terrorism. does it really matter if they're inspired -- >> well, directed -- >> let's just go where the evidence finds it. no need for apologies. this is what you do for a living. let me bring the chief back in here. when we're looking at what they did, these guys ran out of this situation. >> right. >> and then they stuck close to the area. that does not speak to an intelligence plan, does it?
>> either that or it speaks to a change in tactics. i think we should be very concerned about what these folks did. it has significant implication for policing in the united states. >> how so? >> so we've got this discussion going on about the difference between a guardian and a warrior mentality. yesterday, you saw police officers acting clearly in that warrior mind-set. they were taking rounds and they're going to give it right back. but we live in a democratic society. we want democratic policing. we want to build trust and confidence in the police across our communities. and doing that in a way that doesn't offend people. at the same time we're trying to protect the community from incidents like this is going to be very complicated. especially if the self -- if this turns out to be an incident of self-radicalism and those people have changed tactics where they're not going to blow themselves up, but they're going to hit and run like they did here, i think this creates huge problems for the police and change in tactics and training. >> another point of potential, potential sophistication. john gilliam, is the weapons. we know this guy who's now dead,
he bought a couple of the handguns himself several years ago. that time frame is probably going to wind up being relevant. secondly, the long guns were bought legally, we're told. i'm holding up quote fingers for a reason. he didn't buy them. probably good reason why he didn't. i don't think you can buy those ar-15s in california. the law has gotten more sophisticated. they'd have to be grandfathered in around 2001, 2006. the former chief jim bueerman is shaking his head. they wouldn't have been able to be registered here. the question is, where did they get them? the authorities are saying they know who bought them. they don't believe he's connected. how did he get his hands on his weapons? >>t's a good question. that's going to be something that's another piece of this puzzle. i'm going to go, you know, straight -- go ahead and say this. i'm going to agree with bob baer. i think we have enough evidence now having just left 2 1/2 years ago from the joint terrorism
task force, i'm going to say this is terrorism, based on the information we have now, that you can clearly see this is a group that is organized and that takes the ideology from fundamental islamic jihadism and they're using the tackics they've used in the middle east. now employing women in their attacks. so what we have to look at now is further this investigation, these links that they'll find. where did these guns come from? a lot of times when these sales work, they're not necessarily advertising to the people they know. if they acquire guns from them, they may or may not know the person they got them from may not know they were going to use these in a nefarious way. the other thing that desperately needs to be looked at now, did they belong to a mosque, if that mosque is -- is being investigated for anything, and if there's any sources inside that mosque so they can see if radicalization is going on inside there. this is the movements that we
have to start taking now. and let me just -- i just want to say this one thing. this country was settled, it was not conquered. so what we have is a mind-set that does not fit correctly in the, with the mentality of these warriors that are coming over here trying to attack us. as the chief was just talking there a minute ago, as we adjust our mind set to realize that the rest of the world doesn't necessarily live like we do, we'll then be able to set up good tactics for law enforcement. and people will realize that they have to come up with their own tactics when something like this happens. and expect law enforcement to come in. know they're going to have to put their hands up, know how they'll be treated. if businesses just cast this stuff aside, they're going to be the next victim quite possibly. >> you know, it's always a tricky conversation. you don't want to scare people. so much of being american, of being free, is living the way you want, and you never want to put in someone's head that while
you're going to have to do certain things a certain way but you know what, the realities are what they are and the risk is real. we keep seeing these in different context. at some point, it does become part of the new normal. let me come to you on this, the idea of a man and woman being involved. multiple shooters already, that takes us back to columbine in terms our history, our experience with it here. but the idea of women becoming more involved in the actual violence and assaults of of this islamist extremism, what do you think of this? and the reports this guy may have gone somewhere else and been married to this woman and then brought back for this? >> well, i'm not going to disagree with this panel. let's put it all in perspective here. let's -- i'll use the term circumstantial evidence. because we're 24 hours into this. law enforcement, they have a lot of work still to do. but just looking at the circumstantial evidence. this individual bought these
weapons legally according to the atf 2 to 3 years ago. several years ago, al qaeda was looking for people with clean backgrounds, clean records, so they could freely travel when they were targeting the aviation industry. i talked with america west, to their pilots, we talked about this routinely. a guy has a clean background. able to purchase firearms legally. let's move a couple years ahead. this event yesterday at the holiday event, i believe, was just a catalyst. this individual was planning this event, had prestocked weapons, had built bombs, and let's talk about the bombs that he built particularly. these were crude devices. nothing dramatic. but they did use a tactic right out of the al qaeda in the arabian peninsula inspire magazine, their number 12 issue,
in march 2014, where it talks about using toy car remotes as its initiator. the same article also talked about targeting events with large gatherings of people, not the buildings. so we've got all of this happening. we've got the event. he goes to a holiday party. reportedly leaves mad. comes back with his wife, i believe that this being the catalyst, they had some other target, some other plan in mind. they shoot up the event. they leave a package behind with a remote control device. now, our technique for active shooters situations is to hunker down in place, barricade in place, and that works well. until we see this evolution in the process of a device where they have now had the means to leave the event and initiate it remotely. now, the device didn't work. i'm being told because of some design flaws. they leave, they go back to the house, probably to resupply.
so they had some bigger plan in mind. and this has been in the works for a while. now, i'm not saying they're associated or affiliated with al qaeda, but we've seen a lot of self-radicalization, and with the boston marathon bomber used this whole technique, the "inspire" magazine. this is all the circumstantial evidence we have right now. workplace violence, terrorism. i would not lean towards workplace violence other than the catalyst. >> well, it seems we've moved past that. as you say, it may have been an incent yary moment for the guy, maybe a deeper thing that led him to the planning. it's good to have the panel, the former chief as well, because he understands the policing techniques involved, specifically in san bernardino. we have more information come in. right after the break, we have another piece.
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all right, we're here in san bernardino as part of the continuing coverage of the mass shooting here. 14 people murdered, 17 more injured, many fighting for their lives in local hospitals. the analysis on the investigation is obviously about motive but specifically what went into this. it looks like it was planned by every way you would focus on the analysis. maybe it was set off by what happened at this holiday party. certainly, there was plenty that happened before it. we have new information on it right now. cnn can report that the male suspect in this case, who was killed by police after the murders here, had traveled to saudi arabia at least twice. we can report that in 2013, he went there for hajj, you know what this is, that's the muslim spiritual trip, he went there and did that. but what else may have happened during that time? there's other reports going out
there about other foreign contact that this man may have had. his wife, who did the shooting with him, wound up coming here into the country, she was born in pakistan, came in on a fiance visa. she wound up getting a green card and becoming a citizen because she was now a wife of an american citizen. but what else may have been going on there? that is the question investigators are looking at and now so shall we. let's bring in jim sciutto, former fbi agent jonathan gill yam, former cia operative bob baer, former atf explosive expert anthony may and former police chief here in red lands, california, jim bueerman. jim sciutto, when we hear about this, we've been processing this information all night, what does this take investigators too, in terms of what these trips could mean? >> we, a couple things. this is the pattern that u.s. law enforcement officials have been warning about, looking out for, for some time, which is an
american, radicalized, either overseas or via the internet, who carries out an attack on this soil. there is information there might have been combined motives. there are indications part of that notmotive was extremism. you have precedence for that radicalization happening without any foreign travel. groups such as isis and others have been powerful about motivating young men, whether in north america or in europe, to act, even without that foreign travel. but listen, you and i saw the importance that that foreign travel can play as we covered the paris attacks just a couple weeks ago because several of the attackers there, in adition to being europeans, a lot of media contact with these groups. that's very different than going to saudi arabia for the hajj. it may be he went there and the radicalization happened separate from that. that is certainly a line they're
looking into. in addition to phone contact and social media contact he had with known international terrorism subjects. so, you know, what we're seeing here, chris, is, it appears, that realization of a danger that folks have been warning about for some time here in the u.s. and it's sad to see. it's something that they've known about. they've known this potential. we may very well have seen that play out yesterday. >> bob, maybe -- bob baer, maybe this is part of the reason that we're hearing people in the intel community say, look, don't bother me about the refugees coming in here, it's about who's already here, who are citizens, and what do they do to themselves or what do others do to them. what do you see in this information, especially the wrinkle about the wife, that she's brought in here on a fiance visa,en th that's not wh should raise the eyebrow, but then winds up being part of the attack, not support, not an aide, but part of it? >> what we've seen so far, she
was radicalized as well. clearly, you know, sacrificing in effect her baby, handing it off, 6-month-old baby. she was a committed, let's put it this way, terrorist. she was a believer. the connections with saudi arabia don't surprise me at all. the saudi, the average saudi, is absolutely opposed to the united states fighting the islamic state and al qaeda. they hold us responsible for the death of muslims. would be easy to go back to saudi arabia and someone would suggest, go home, make an attack, a random attack. the americans are our enemy. >> now, bob -- >> yes, go ahead. >> bob, let me stop you there for a second because, you know, if you were at the cia right now, i don't know that i'd be hearing that from you. you get a real mixed message about saudi arabia from the u.s. government. they're our friend. they're helping us. but there's always this undercurrent of others who say, you know, they're really the head of the snake, they fund a lot of these things.
whether it's the saudi family or some of their cousin, that there's a real division of friend/foe in that country. are you saying this points to that as well? >> it's complicated. as we were speaking, i've been getting texts from the middle east saying the saudi royal family is not long for this world. they're trying to hold back this radicalization of the saudi street. they're doing their best, you know, the interior minister, the crown prince is on our side clearly, but they can't keep the lid on this volcano and they can't keep track of all the radicalized militant, you know, warriors, if you like, that are being created, that are going to syria, going to iraq, fighting with the islamic state, coming home, radicalizing other people, especially american citizens who go on the hajj and they're also, you know, giving them money and training. i'll go back to this again, chris. i spent 21 years in war zones. the last thing on my mind is being approached, you know, being attacked by the police or, you know, tracked by them, is to pick up a weapon and shoot back. these people were committed. they're not just -- it's not a
workplace shooting. i don't see it at this point. >> so let's move past that. jonathan gilliam, let me bring you in. if the guy was an american citizen, which will know he was, he goes abroad. he had weapons before he went abroad. if he gets something else in his head, winds up coupling up with somebody who shares his own sense of inhumanity, how do you see that in terms of a repeatable threat? >> well, you know, this is a good question here. it's a great example, when jim sciutto talked earlier about how experts have been saying that we need to look at certain things for a long time, you know, in 2003 to 2005, i was a part of a group that went all over the country doing threat assessments as special forces operators for the department of homeland security. and we were screaming this stuff. saying, we have to look at soft targets, we have to look at events, we have to look at the tactic of using females or
children. what i find now is we are actually trying to catch up, even though we were screaming that before, security in a lot of ways here is done like the airline industry, where they wait for an incident to happen, and then they start, you know, trying to catch up and create new tactics and new standards. i think what bob was talking about earlier there, when he was in the cia, going over and looking at these groups, the cia forward-thinks a lot more than the law enforcement does inside the united states. i think it's time we start moving in that direction. >> all right. anthony, let me bring you in. what does that mean? it's not just what you do and what you focus on, it's how. if this is suggestive or instructive of anything, what happened in san bernardino, what do you see that being? >> well, i'm sorry, you have to repeat your question there. >> it's not just what you focus on in terms of your defense and
anti-terror techniques, it's how you do it. if you take a lessen from what we're learning in san bernardino, what is it? >> well, the lesson is this. what we're seeing in just about every mass shooting of late is explosive devices being utilized. now, the typical scenario is a s.w.a.t. team will go in, clear the facility, looking for bad guys, looking for victims, and then usually, if a suspect package is found, they'll pull out or stop, a bomb tech will go in. we're changing. we're evolving. for the last 12 months, we've been working on a program called the tactical bomb technician. basically integrating the bomb tech in with the s.w.a.t. team on the first entry. as they're moving through a building, if they see items like they did yesterday that are suspicious in nature, it doesn't halt the operations because the bomb tech is there, he's going to handle it as the s.w.a.t. team goes on and does their mission. we're evolving in our tactics as
they evolve. >> all right, fellas, stay with me. i want to take a break here. we do have this presser coming up where we're going to get all of the authorities involved in this right now to give us the latest sense of information. stay with cnn's continuing coverage. when we come back, we'll get more pieces to the puzzle. i'm only in my 60's. i've got a nice long life ahead. big plans. so when i found out medicare doesn't pay all my medical expenses, i looked at my options. then i got a medicare supplement insurance plan. [ male announcer ] if you're eligible for medicare, you may know it only covers about 80% of your part b medical expenses. the rest is up to you. call now and find out about an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan, insured by unitedhealthcare insurance company. like all standardized medicare supplement insurance plans, it helps pick up some of what medicare doesn't pay. and could save you in out-of-pocket medical costs. to me, relationships matter.
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call now to request your free decision guide. and learn more about the kinds of plans that will be here for you now - and down the road. i have a lifetime of experience. so i know how important that is. part of cnn's continuing coverage of the mass shooting here. 14 people had their lives stolen from them by two shooting suspects. a man and a woman. 17 others are still fighting for their life with different degrees of injuries in local hospitals. we're awaiting a presser from the san bernadi diardino police, the sheriff and the fbi. there are many agencies, federal agencies, involved in this. want to bring in former chief jim bueerman here. it is interesting and instructive how not only the local police work so quickly but
how many different assets came in to make this takedown possible. >> right this region had a long history of working together. the relationship between the federal agencies, the local agencies, the county, the city police, has been great. it has been that way as long as i can remember. >> not to fearmonger, but we both remember a time when something like a lenco bearcat, a police force asking for what seemed to be military equipment, was very controversial, but we saw two bearcats used yesterday to pinch this suv. it seems as though times have changed. not to mean we're losing, not to mean the bad guys are taking over, but times have changed in terms of the threat and the need for how you respond, true? >> i think we're also getting better about talking about the use of the equipment. it is not the equipment that's problematic it's how the police use it. if you use an armored vehicle in a nonviolent protest, that's
problematic. if you use it in an active shooter situation, i don't think anybody has objections. the challenge for police departments is to message why we have that piece of equipment, make sure everybody understands we it's going to be used, and we're holding ourselves accountable when we use it. >> sometimes in these investigations as we're waiting for this presser to come, and we do expect there to be some information. let me take a breath on that right now. there's a good chance we're going to hear why they feel this male suspect was radicalized. >> right, i think that's what we're going to hear. they've been very busy. they've been working throughout the night. this has been a nonstop investigation since that first 911 call. i think they're likely to reveal a lot of why they believe -- >> sometimes you put your focus on what you still need to know. given the situation. it's nmotive, who else could be involved, where it takes you. the what is the guns.
i think we may have skipped over something. he bought these two handguns a few years ago. why did he wait, we may never know. the two long guns. my understanding is you can't buy those in california. >> no, you cannot. >> so we know they were bought legally. the authorities told us that. by somebody else whom they don't believe is connected to the shootings, but help me understand that, chief, because they didn't buy them legally here, right? there's a sophistication grandfathering policy 2001 to 2006 for an ar-15. unless it was done then, and it doesn't seem like it was, then it wouldn't be legal here. that means somebody bought them somewhere else and these two got them here. that's something that has to be looked at, doesn't it? >> there isn't any aspect of this that doesn't need to be looked at. whether it's the guns, who they may or may not have been connected to. that speaks to is there something else out there, is there somebody else waiting to do something. i think this is different. i'm not a counterterrorism expert. from a policing perspective, i find this very interesting that
after they knew the police, they had just killed a bunch of people, they are engaged in a pursuit and run and gun battle with police, why were they coming back to the same place? i don't know we'll ever know. just the different significant implications. i suspect for the counterintelligence community. it has implications for local policing who are always going to be the first responders. >> there's this frightening analysis we're going through here in this story of were they running or reloading, trying to get back to the house where one of the responding officers was to get other things, other equipment? we'll know more when we hear from local authorities. they've been searching that house. we just got a two-minute warning. you mentioned something else, about the terms of mentality in how we investigate these situations. how should people see that shift? what does that mean for citizens like me? >> i think it's important to
know the police have the ability to act as warriors when they need to. there's the bigger issue, what the president's task force talked about. the notion of guardians which is the highest level that a society gives to the group of people who protect them. it speaks to more than just running and shooting and cooking and booking and all the things we might think about in the warrior side of policing. it's more about being responsive and fair and impartial in our policing and that's where the guardian piece comes in. it's a huge shift from warrior to guardian where guardians can act in a warrior mode like they did yesterday. >> we're getting information that suggests these two knew what they were doing. the idea you pick up an ar-15 and start shooting it, that is naive. you need to know how to use a weapon like that. it's not simple. the local leaders are moving up right now. as soon as they get ready to speak, we'll stop. but one last point on this. what we saw yesterday, you don't learn in the academy to do what
those men and women did yesterday. when they took up after an suv that had somebody with a serious weapon inside shooting at them initially, that speaks to a new type of behavior by police. what did you see? >> a bunch of gutsy police officers. these guys were heroes. any one of them could have been killed. >> one was injured. >> they didn't hesitate for a moment. they went as fast as they could, charged as hard as they could to protect people. i'm very proud of what these guys did yesterday. >> a lot of rounds were expanded. they needed to do that to stop the threat as soon as they could. they're assembling, getting ready to go. as we see more and more in these situations. there are bigger crowds around the microphone and that's because there are more and more assets and agencies involved. local, sheriff, state, federal. they're going to start. let's listen in. >> good morning, everybody. my name is jarrod burguan, j-a-r-r-o-d, b-u-r-g-u-a-n. we have the congressman and the
counter supportive officer joining us this morning as well. i want to start this off by reiterating how incredibly tragic this is, and we've got a lot of families that are devastated by what happened here. and we need to be sensitive to that. i want that put out to those families, that our prayers are with them, we're here to support them any way we can. some updated numbers. same as yesterday. we have 14 people confirmed dead inhis incident. the number of wounded has risen from 17 to 21. they're being treated at various local hospitals. we were asked yesterday about the number of officers that responded. we're still compiling the total number of officers that responded here at 11:00 when the initial call of the shooting went out. our rough count right now is about 300 officers from local county, state and federal
agencies that responded for the initial active shooter component of this and helped deal with the crime scene here. many of those assets also moved and were part of the investigation and the officer involved shooting that followed. here at the scene, at the regional center what we have total is we believe the suspects when they entered fired somewhere between 65 and 75 rounds from their rifles at the scene. we did locate the one pipe bomb that was actually three pipe bombs combined into one that had a remote control, car type of remote control device that appears to have not worked in this case. there were also four high capacity .223 rifle magazines dropped by the suspects and left in there as evidence that has been recovered. i can confirm that the suspects were wearing the black-style tactical gear we talked about yesterday. they were not wearing ballistic
vests. bulletproof vests. what they did have and what people may have confused is they had tactical-style vest that held equipment and magazines and ammunition and that sort of stuff. sorry? yes, ld bearing gear. on the officer involved shooting that took place a couple of hours after the incident. we talked yesterday about how that came to be. how we ended up at that point in the investigation and what we were following up on. on the officer involved shooting that occurred, we had seven police agencies that were involved in that shooting including our department, the sheriff's department, i think we had 14 of our police officers involved, and then there were various other agencies, all part of the other local task forces that had come to assist. the seven agencies involved, we had 23 officers that fired their weapons at the suspects. law enforcement fired approximately 380 rounds at the suspects. both of them were killed here at the scene. the suspects are believed to have fired about 76 rifle rounds
at the officers at the termination of the pursuit. 76 is our number we have right now. however, on them, on their person, on their body and in the vehicle, they had over 1,4 1,400 .223 caliber rounds that were available to them and they had over 200 9 mile meter rounds. we talked about yesterday they had the .223 assault-style weapons rives and they had 9 millimeters on them. 1,400 .223 rounds, 200 9 millimeter rounds. >> on their person? >> on their person or immediately in the vehicle, around and available to them. let me get to a few others. we had two officers injured in that incident. one of them was a police officer that sustained a gunshot wound to his left leg. he was taken to a local hospital last night. he is probably going to be
released this morning, if he has not already been released. his injuries are not life threatening. i did visit with him in the hospital. he is in good spirits. we also as of this morning learned there was a second deputy that was also injured in the incident. sustained some cuts to his leg. we believe probably came from broken glass or shrapnel. we're not exactly sure. two officers were injured in that exchange. the house in redlands that became part of the focus of this investigation yesterday. i will confirm that the search that took place revealed that there were 12 pipe bomb-type devices found in that house or in the garage so that house. there were also hundreds of tools. many of which could be used to construct ieds or pipe bombs, and in addition to that, they had other material to have produced some additional bombs as well. there were another 2,000 9 millimeter rounds found at that house.
over 2,500 .223 rounds found at that house, and -- there were 2,500. there were several hundred 22 long rifle rounds found there. with that, i'm here to talk about the specifics of the investigation and what we discovered evidencewise. i think the fbi has comments to make a little later in this. do you have any questions for me? >> do you believe they were planning another attack? >> we don't know. clearly, they were equipped. they could have continued to do another attack. we intercepted them before that happened obviously. >> any other suspects you want to talk to? >> the investigation is still going on. i don't think we're prepared to talk about other people we might be looking for. we are confident that the two people that were involved in the shooting here are the two dead suspects that we have at the scene and we do not have any credible information to indicate there is an immediate threat to anybody in the area or anybody in the region. can't hear everybody. brian. >> the remote control car that was with the pipe bomb, can you
elaborate what that was? >> i'm not an expert on it. it's my understanding somehow it was three pipe bombs that were attached together. somehow attached to this remote control car. it was designed that the remote control device would somehow trigger or set that device off. we don't know if they attempted to do that and it failed or what the story is. >> -- car that was driving, that was moving -- >> it was found in a bag there at the scene. >> -- terrorists by social media -- >> i'm going to let the fbi address that. the go pro is not confirmed. we don't have any information there were any go pros on them or any cameras of any sort that was on them. >> -- interviews with all the eyewitnesses, can you tell us exactly what happened in the room, and do you still believe there was some dispute and they left and came back? this seems very much preplanned. >> so we have people in the room that indicated the suspect was
in the room, during the early part of this meeting or party-type event. it was a county public health christmas holiday-type gathering luncheon is what it was. he was part of that. he was there early on and he left. we did have some initial information that he left under some kind duress or as if he was angry. we also have somebody else say that, you know, he just kind of disappeared. we don't know where he went. we will confirm that he was there early on. >> do you have any motive for -- >> we still don't have the motive. >> had they gone in the building, targeting anyone in particular? >> the building this took place in, i'm sure you all have aerial views. this took place in the southern most building on the property. the doors that they entered were located on the east side, so they entered from that parking lot into those east doors, which went directly into the room, which somewhere the shoot being, where the shooting took place.
>> -- left the party and then -- >> they sprayed the room with bullets so i don't know there was any one person they ultimately targeted. they killed 14 people there. >> what was the -- >> -- any indication -- >> any idea how much time elapsed when he supposedly got in this argument, left, any idea where his wife was -- >> i have to apologize. i meant to follow up on that question and i failed to ask that today. yesterday, we had information that it was anywhere from 10 minutes to 30 ins. i'll try to tie that up by later on in the day. >> it's hard to believe that is spontaneous. >> we had said yesterday there appears to be a degree of planning that went into this. nobody just gets upset at a party, goes home and puts together that kind of elaborate scheme or plan. there was some planning that went into this. >> is there any indication, please, sir, is there any indication of how long they had been stockpiling -- [ inaudible ] >> i don't think we are far enough into the investigation to
really be able to say what that pattern has been or what they've been doing over the last several months, the last several years. >> did he have a grudge against his co-workers? >> not that i'm personally aware of. at some point later today, we'll probably have a comment from his employer and the county to talk about these issues. >> he was no longer employed, right, why was he invited back? >> to my understanding, he was still an employee of the county. >> where did he buy the gun from? >> the guns were legally purchased. the two handguns were purchased by him. the rifles were not. but those are components we are still following up on. all four guns were legally purchased. >> can you talk about what exchange -- [ inaudible ] >> i'm sorry? >> -- criminal record -- >> there's no criminal record he had we're aware of. >> -- getaway car, we're told
there was a utah license plate, any idea how it was acquired? >> it was a black ford exclusion -- expedition, i'm sorry, a black ford expedition. it was a rental car. he rented it three or four days ago. it was actually due to be returned yesterday. that's why it had utah plates, but it was rented locally. >> -- about his travels overseas, is there any information that something was planned on that trip -- >> i'll let the fbi discuss that. those are things they're working on. >> chief, have you been able to identify all the victims and notify next of kin? >> our plan today is a press conference throughout the course of the day. sheriff mcmahon and the coroner's office will start releasing the names of the victims. we've been working throughout the night to get identity of those folks and make notificati notifications. we will put those names out fairly soon. we'll probably get some pictures out for you as well and move the
media a little closer to the scene for you. we'll come back and do a press conference later on. throughout the course of the day, we anticipate we'll start releasing the names of the victims. >> -- the county employ ears the victims -- >> i do not know if they all were. several of them, we believe, are. >> -- yesterday, you talked about the results of -- [ inaudible ] -- how you see them being able to -- >> you know, i read an article by one of the reporters in the press -- i'm sorry, she talked about the resiliency of this community. everybody knows san bernardino has been hit hard economically. but this is a pretty resilient community. we will survive this. we've had an enormous ground swell of support from our neighboring communities and well wishes that have come in. i do know there's a candlelight vigil planned later tonight. i believe it's at the stadium on e street. i think you'll see evidence there of a tremendous amount of support and people are going to
come together and support. as far as the officers, everything that i've seen and all the officers from my department i've contacted, they're doing extraordinarily well. as the chief of this agency, i'm proud of the way our folks responded. not only the initial response here and the help we got from our local and regional partners but for the way they also engaged in that officer involved shooting and chasing down those suspects. extremely proud of the way they handled that. >> chief, were you officers wearing body cams? >> -- guns legally purchased but is it legal to have those long guns here in california -- >> i think there's some question still about whether they were california legal or not. we have not gotten to the bottom of that. i'll let atf address that later on. we do know at this point the four guns were purchased, appear toe a legal purchase, appear to be registered. >> were your officers wearing body cams? >> none of our offers have body cams. i don't know about the other agencies. i'm not sure where the child is.
i know they had a 6-month-old child. i don't know exactly where she is. >> can you possess that much ammunition legally? >> i don't think we have restrictions on the volume of ammunition. you may educate me on that but i'm not aware -- >> anything on the ammunition that was illegal other than -- >> off hand, i'm not specifically aware of anything that was against the law there. >> chief, can you tell us about the search of the redland home, seeking a not imotive, and who there? >> the suspect -- both suspects were listed on the rental agreement for the property. as i said yesterday, i don't know we can definitively say they were living there or if they were living elsewhere and what exactly that house was used for. the house became a focus of the investigation based upon information that we had from witnesses that identified him as an employee that was there that they thought was potentially involved. it was follow-up we had done connected to that person that took us to that house, led us to that vehicle, which resulted in
us, in the following and pursuit that happened. obviously, once we were involved in that, the house became a primary focus. we took our time in securing it, making sure we went in that house, secured it safely. that's where we discovered the other pipe bombs. i think some other evidence, computer evidence, cell phones, have been recovered from there and various other places. i think there's a lot of helpful information we've gotten from a number of areas. >> meaning those people who gave you help, have they been able to provide you with any kind of accounting, how many people were going in and out of that house? is there a pattern of men coming, going? >> we have heard the rumors you have heard. we got the information. i think we're still trying to verify that. as i said yesterday, information that went out yesterday is likely to change today. already wounded number has changed. i want to be as accurate as we possibly can. a lot of that type of stuff ends
up being speculation. i'd like to confirm it before we say it. >> is there anything you can talk to us about what light that has shed on what these people -- >> there's been a number of electronic items from thumb drives to computers and cell phones that have been taken. i don't think we've completed the analysis. i don't know what if any they've completed yet. real quickly, the fbi is here, he has a few comments. i'll let him come up here. >> chief, was there any surveillance at the building? >> it's my understanding there was no specific surveillance inside the room where the shooting took place. we are, however, in possession of surveillance cameras from the area and we're going through that evidence. >> good morning. i'm david bawdy, assistant direct of the fbi in los angeles. i want to focus on two points. first off, again, our hearts and our prayers are with the families of all these victims of these very heinous act. secondly, i ask you to be
patient. we are trying to give you little bits as we can, as we ascertain more and more facts. as you can tell by this investigation and the media response here today this is not your average investigation. we have multiple scenes. we have many victims. and it will take time. there are a tremendous number of assets and resources being applied to this investigation. my focus as a fact finder who works for an investigation that is really fixated on facts is i would much rather be slower and correct with the information that comes out to you than fast and incorrect. it's incredibly important for us. the integrity of this investigation is absolutely paramount as far as we are concerned, other than taking care of the victims. so we are applying a number of federal resources. we are continuing to work very, very carefully with our partners here at san bernardino sheriff's
department, san bernardino city police department and the atf. these resources are being applied for a number of reasons. i give you an example of some things we're doing today. we flew in a team to do some -- from washington to do some re-enactment, reconstruction of the crime scene. we have continued collecting evidence and are continuing to collect evidence at the multiple scenes. we are going to fly some evidence back to our laboratory in washington, d.c. today on a plane. that's because we want expedition analysis of that evidence. the digital media is incredibly important because we are trying to determine the motive. we cannot rule anything out at this point. we're hoping some digital media exploitation will assist us. again, it would be irresponsible of me and it would be way too early to speculate on motive of