tv CNN Newsroom With Poppy Harlow CNN December 5, 2015 1:00pm-2:01pm PST
even curvier. but what's next? for all binge watchers. movie geeks. sports freaks. x1 from xfinity will change the way you experience tv. 4:00 eastern, i'm poppy harlow joining you in new york. thank you for being with me. we begin this hour with the latest on the investigation into the san bernardino massacre that killed 14 people and wounded 21 others. president obama's national security team meeting with him today, briefing him, telling him again so far there's no indication that this husband and wife shooter team were part of a larger terror network. looking at an image of the female shooter's pakistani
identification card, it was issued before 2013. perhaps the best clue so far of what their motive could be, though, is from isis, the terror group in a radio message today saying syed rizwan farook and tashfeen malik were isis supporters but stopped short of calling them official members. stephanie elam is live for us in redlands, california, outside where the couple was living, plotting this, raising their 6-month-old daughter at the same time. why is this i.d. card, stephanie, of tashfeen malik, why is that important? >> well, poppy, we're learning a lot more about tashfeen malik and there weren't a lot of images about her once the news broke and we heard the identities of these two shooters, so now we're getting to know more about who she was and knowing she was residing in pakistan and also solidifying her age, according to this document. this is a state obtained government document that she would have here representing she
was from pakistan and it shows she was there prior to 2013. it also shows us that she was -- would have been 30 next year, and there's a lot of questions surrounding malik, simply because of the issue farook grew up here, her husband, he worked here, went to college here. this is an environment where he had spent his life. so we know that he was american. the question is, did he get radicalized because of who he married, and there's also this issue of the facebook post that we believe malik posted just before the attacks happened here in san bernardino pledging her support to the leader of isis and this is the reason why we believe she was, you know, a follower but not necessarily a direct report of isis here. so this is why we're starting to build more of a picture here about her potential relationship and her belief system and how it may have impacted the decision this couple made to do what they did. >> and stephanie, it was the facebook posting, right, that
she made according to law enforcement that has led the fbi to now call this a terror investigation, is that right? >> right. and it was under a different name, and it was posted and taken down by facebook, but this investigation around that exact wording of saying that we are supporters and we give our support to this leader of isis, so that is the reason why the tone of this investigation has changed now to a terror investigation. >> all right, stephanie elam, thank you very much live for us in redlands, california. i want to examine closer what we do know, what we don't know about why this massacre was carried out. cnn security analyst juliette kayyem with me from boston. let's talk about that, the fbi says in the last 24 hours this is a terror investigation. you were with homeland security. walk us behind sort of how that determination is made and more significantly, how that changes how they investigate it. >> well, so the decision that it
is a federal terrorism crime means that the fbi will be lead investigators, and it means that the entire sort of tool box that the fbi has, much more so than a california police department, means that they can reach out to the cia, they can reach out to foreign intelligence agencies, sorry, i'm losing my ear piece, and that they can do a much more extensive global case. what it also means, though, is that they clearly have motive as it regards what animated this and that the motive may have been political in nature. none of this should come as a surprise given what we now know about the evidence. the decision to go after them for terrorism is really gives the fbi primary jurisdiction. >> and look, because they are both now dead, all of what they said and wrote beforehand is critical. the associated press today reporting that the nsa surveillance program that was shut down just a few days before these attacks, right, means that
investigators have only been able, juliette, to obtain two years of phone records instead of five years. is that significant, in your opinion? because she's only lived here for two years. >> that's exactly right and i think it's significant only to the extent it is a coincidence that four days after the nsa program ended that there's now this new sort of legal regime that requires the federal government to now ask at&t or, you know, other telecommunications companies for information. there is, though, i want to make this clear because this will be a huge political debate, right now there is just simply no evidence that even with two years or five years, that they were under any surveillance whatsoever. so the big question isn't whether they could have figured this out under a bulk surveillance rule. the question is, how did no one pick up anything if, in fact, they were being radicalized by
outside groups. >> you're right. he had no criminal record, there were no red flags, not on the radar of authorities at all. there was a very disturbing new report out from george washington university focusing on extremism and what it shows is this unprecedented level of support for isis within the united states. we're talking about several thousand u.s.-based sympathizers. you've got more terror related arrests in this country in 2015 than any year since 9/11. you're looking at the map where the red states, minnesota, new york, highlighted with the most sort of isis related arrests in the country. that number's at 56 this year. what do you make of these numbers, and why triple the amount of isis arrests this year than last year? is it just better law enforcement or is it a bigger problem? >> i think it may be a combination of both. i think right now, and for the last year when we've started to see some of these cases, the fbi's attitude is simply if you
sort of play with isis, if you are interested in isis, if you're curious about isis, we are opening a case. so what people have to remember is that the increase in cases is essentially because the fbi, you know, is now looking at these cases and saying there's no such thing as flirting with these people or sort of toying with them online. it is also as importantly a message to the outside world. if in the long term, because we have to think long term now, how are we going to minimize the threat, if in the long term we want to make it clear of members of any community that might be interested in isis or members of the muslim community that might be looking at what isis is doing, what the fbi is saying by being so public about these investigations is, we are watching. and i actually think that's a good thing. you want the fbi to serve as not just the people that come in after something bad has happened, but also as a deterrent, so those numbers may look shocking in isolation, but they actually reflect a strategy
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york highlighted. 56 total this year. why? >> a variety of reasons. it is something people are being drawn to. the other reason is isis is adept at using social media. we looked at 7,000 pages of legal documents. a third of the cases they were 21. makes sense that they are using social media to recruit. >> you said the rprocess is
highly individualized. we had law enforcement officials saying that radicalization is much quicker, some people are being radicalized in two to three weeks. is that what you found? >> we have seen the process shortened from a few years to a few months and even sometimes a few weeks. each person is different and humans are very complex. but with the use of social media you are able to get your information and propaganda on demand. if you want to listen to a lecture or the latest isis video you can type on a keyboard and get it quickly. you are able to reach a recruiter on line. >> let's talk about minnesota.
i am from that state. you have an issue with some in the somali community being targeted there. you have parents and community members trying to combat that. talk about that as a case study. >> 2007 to 2009 you had two dozen kids that went from the minneapolis lot of that was relationship built. looking at it now it's building off the same relationship. so the individuals that went to somalia prior, there's still a relationship. what we saw in this case was, the first wave went over to syria and then they call back their friends through facebook and said, come join us. >> so, is it being effectively combatted in a case like minnesota? >> it's very difficult to do. this is the million dollar question, you know, what do we do on the front edge, what is the reconvention effort here?
i did counterextremism, so i spent a lot of time many minneapolis meeting with family members of people who joined al shabaab and died over there, what do you do when you have a kid that you're worried about, the current efforts are you do nothing, hope it's a phase and grow out of it, or tell the fbi and talk to your loved one through a prison bar for the next 20 years. we need to find a middle space so we can bring those kids back into the fold. >> absolutely, no question about it. the average age of the recruits, you said, was 26 years old. what about the other characteristics that you think they share? >> yeah, so that's the biggest take away from the report, there's a diversity in terms of the profile. they are old, young, rich, poor, there's high school kids, three individuals from denver, college-aged kids, not necessarily a profile when it comes to isis. they tend to be male, 40% were converts when you looked at the legal system when the average is 23%, so little off on that, but for the most part there's not a
profile other than they tend to be younger. >> and 86% male, right? >> uh-huh, absolutely. we've seen examples of women joining terrorists groups, ten this year alone. >> ten this year alone. thank you very much, fascinating report. i'd urge everyone to take a closer look at it out of george washington university. thank you for being with me. >> thank you. coming up next, the very latest on the breaking news out of miami beach. today a deadly police shooting all caught on tape. the target, an alleged bank robber, we will show you the disturbing video, tell you what police are saying in response next live from miami. stay with us. the pursuit of healthier.
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we've got breaking news this hour. police officers involved in a shooting of a man in broad daylight today in miami beach. it was all caught on cell phone camera. a warning, what we are about to show you is very graphic, very hard to watch. there on the ground in miami beach, you've been poring through the video, you've been talking to police. twofold question here, what do we know about the shooting? >> reporter: this started with a alarm at bank of america that started just down the street from where the shooting took place. the suspect was armed with a bomb and that he had passed a note to the teller before he left the scene. when police arrived on the scene they were told that the suspect was just down the street. here's what the miami beach police chief said happened next.
>> went inside the barbershop, he was urged to come out. after a period of time, he had armed himself in the barbershop with a straight-edge razor and after a period of time he came out, took his shirt off and came out. and he was challenged by the officers in the street, and at some point during that confrontation he did raise his hand with the straight-edge razor in it, and he was shot. >> reporte >> reporter: now, the man who shot that disturbing cell phone video says that police appeared to have been trying to calm down the suspect for about five minutes before they fatally shot him. the officer who discharged his weapon is a six-year veteran of the force. we know that there is police body camera video available, but police at this point are not releasing it. poppy? >> live for us in miami beach, thank you very much.
as soon as we have more information on this shooting or nor video angles, dash cam video, we'll bring it to you, of course. as we just saw there, police departments around the nation often do have these assault style rifles like the ar-15. it is the weapon that is frequently used also by shooters in mass vicious attacks like what we saw in san bernardino, california. families now in agony wondering how they can carry on without their loved ones. i was in san bernardino this week covering the deadly rampage. the ar-15s were found on the shooters after they were killed in the shootout with police, also ar-15 style guns were used in aurora, colorado, and newtown, connecticut. with me now to talk about the business behind them, they are incredibly popular. not only are their sales soaring, gun sales across the board. >> totally across the board, not only are the ar-15s popular, but they are also available.
if you look at the major national gun retailers like cabela's, bass pro, those guys advertise ar-15s right on their website and one analyst that we spoke to says, listen, even if the national retailers stopped selling those guns, about 80% of those assault-style rifles are sold by small mom and pop shops, so it's so dispersed and so popular that it's going to be really tough to take -- ever really talk about taking them out of our system. >> the front page editorial of "the new york times" calling for a lot more gun control actually suggests and says these weapons shouldn't be sold and people who have them should return them. to the government, incredibly controversial, but you had this fascinating interview with the ceo of walmart and talked about the changes they were going to make, now they've made it. >> they've made it. he was very specific when i interviewed him about the kind of customer that walmart wants to serve. take a listen.
>> our focus as it relates to firearms should be hunters and people who shoot sporting clays and things like that, so the types of rifles we sell, the types of ammunition we sell, should be curated for those things. >> so about two months later walmart comes out and says no more assault rifles on our shelves. now, interestingly, walmart said it had a lot more to do with slumping demand than any political. >> they weren't selling? >> that's what walmart says, but, of course, it won't release the data, which we asked for. >> of course, because everywhere else noted they are selling. cnn money had a fascinating article about fbi background checks. i think the number was somewhere around 20 million background checks for guns this year, which is a pretty good indication of gun sales, somewhere near a record. >> absolutely right, we're on track to hit a record this year and as you point out, fbi background checks are a proxy for gun sales. not only that, black friday this year hit a record for the most
background checks in a single day. it outpaced the last record that was hit in 2012 just a week after sandy hook, because a rush of people went out to buy guns thinking that president obama's gun reform would actually pass. >> that's what we see, isn't it, time and time again, sales go up after mass shootings. >> yeah, it's really disturbing and sad, but very true, and this year -- look, we don't even need to look at background checks. if you look at wall street, these stocks are on a tear, the manufacturers of these guns are some of the best performing stocks out there this year. wall street is not stopping backing these guys. we'll have to see, mayor bill de blasio saying we should divest from these holdings, so maybe that will have an impact. >> see how long that takes or -- how long that takes. thank you very much. much more on cnn money. next we're going to talk about how are these guns actually changed, because that's what we saw in this attack in
california. law enforcement now says one of the semiautomatic rifles was changed into a fully automatic assault weapon. how does that happen? former cia official joining me next. this holiday season, get ready for mystery. what's in the trunk? nothing. romance. 18 inch alloys. you remembered. family fun. everybody squeeze in. don't block anyone. and non-stop action. noooooooo! it's the event you don't want to miss. it's the season of audi sales event. get up to a $2,500 bonus for highly qualified lessees on select audi models. came out today thousands of people to run the race for retirement. so we asked them... are you completely prepared for retirement? okay, mostly prepared? could you save 1% more of your income? it doesn't sound like much, but saving an additional 1% now,
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all right, bottom of the hour i want to talk about how the use of ar-15 rifles like christina and i just talked about, how that use by murderers impacts law enforcement, the men and women who risk their lives day in and day out to protect all of us. joining me now, former cia operations officer and counterterrorism adviser joshua katz, thank you for being with me. very disturbing to learn the two ar-15s used by the shooters in california this week were altered, altered law enforcement says, from semiautomatic to fully automatic weapons. i didn't know you could do that. walk us through how you can do
that, how easy it is, and what additional threat that poses to law enforcement. >> well, poppy, i think it's important to say that the attackers, these terrorists, they tried to alter them, they tried to change a semiautomatic league weapon into an illegal automatic weapon. they were unsuccessful in doing that, and i think what that goes to is, it goes to the intent here. they had really planned this out and they had -- this attack was so incredibly personal, so incredibly planned, that they even went to the lengths of trying and they were not successful of altering that weapon. >> can you do that? can you alter them successfully? >> with the right training, with the right equipment, you can do just about anything. you can in certain instances, but it takes a trained gun smith in order to make that work, and there's very few people -- you can't just do it in your
kitchen, although people try and it is absolutely illegal. it's illegal for a very good reason. >> over -- this is a new government accountability office report, right, just came out this week. what it shows is over 2,000 terror suspects on the u.s. terror watch list have legally purchased guns in this country from 2014 to -- from 2004 to 2014, so in the last decade. what's your reaction to that? these are people on the no-fly list by the government but they bought guns legally. >> right. so we have to revisit the fact that the no-fly list, unfortunately, really needs to be revamped because there's really no -- there's no due process there. it's really -- it's not a formalized process. so you or i could be on the no-fly list for a lot of different reasons, none of which actually makes you or i terrorists, but we need to have a better communication plan for
how we deal with people that are on lists like that and who want to buy firearms if they are going through the process. we need to take a look at them, do they deserve to be on the no-fly list or not, but if you're on a list like that, as long as the list, and we're doing the best things that we can to ensure only the bad people are on that list, we need to prevent people from gaining weapons and blanketly. >> is there a frustration amid the rank and file that these weapons, these high powered assault rifles, are on the street? i ask because when i was in california the first night after that attack and standing in redlands, california, in front of the home of the shooters, i mean, there was -- it looked like a tank pretty much that the redlands police department had that they were driving finally away from the scene. they have sort of military grade
equipment to deal with what frankly civilians can now have when you're talking about these rifles. >> well, i think that the police are really looking for the training and the equipment to be prepared for anything. so the main frustration and worry for law enforcement now is what is the situation that they are walking into? what can they do, because their first action has to be to protect the civilians and innocent people there and they risk their lives every day. we just need to make sure we are giving them the intelligence and the tools in order to be able to counter whatever it is that they come across. >> joshua, what do you think it says about the state of the world today and the country today that we have police that need to be armed with this kind of military style equipment on the streets of, you know,
suburban los angeles? >> well, i think that the threat has been changing, and the threat is, especially in los angeles, we see there's a lot of gang violence. gangs have a lot of different tools at their disposal, so police all the time have to counter that lots of different threats, and again, what i would go back to and say is that the training is the most important part. if we're giving our law enforcement the training and the background that they need in order to quickly respond, they will be safer, and in a lot of times the equipment, the gear, is really secondary and should be secondary to the training. >> joshua, thank you very much, joshua katz, former cia, appreciate the expertise, thank you. >> thank you, poppy. still ahead, new details we have gotten about the woman, the wife who took part in the san bernardino mass shootings. her name and the fbi looking into whether she was the one who
radicalized her husband. what we know about their relationship, how they compare to other couples that have been inspired by isis. our heros don't fly, they soar. >> i don't see barriers, i see solutions. >> connecting with the communities along the way helps re-establish your faith in humanity. >> love you. >> love you, too. >> don't give up on yourself, because you're still worthy. >> see the stars come out and celebrate the change makers. >> we all love to pay tribute and this is a way we really can. >> people living the work they are doing every day. >> going to be really, really inspiring. >> welcome to "cnn heros." >> please join me in honoring cnn hero. >> there's no time to waste. >> top ten cnn heros of 2015. >> it's an honor to be
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this holiday, i can count on my going off list.again, and knowing right when my packages arrive. so that's two things. introducing real time delivery notifications. sign up at myusps.com soon after the san bernardino shootings, investigators started looking at possible ties to isis, and now isis is claiming that this married couple were, indeed,
supporters. the terror group making that declaration today on their official radio station, and if the shootings are determined officially to be a terror attack by the fbi, well, they would be the worst terror attack on u.s. soil since 9/11. brian todd looks into how isis inspired radicalization is in america right now and its growing appeal to women. >> reporter: the 27-year-old female attacker was born in pakistan and later traveled to saudi arabia at least twice, according to a saudi official. she met psi psyed rizwan farook there. she was a housewife, but traditional, often wearing a burka. >> in terms of fasting and prayer five times a day, she chose not to drive voluntarily. >> reporter: online dating profiles thought to be his, farook expressed his desire for a girl who wore a hijab.
the fbi asked directly if it was tashfeen malik who influenced syed rizwan farook. >> i don't know if she influenced him or not. >> i very much believe she influenced him. we look at female fighters and recruits, we tend to read her through the men around her, whether it's a boyfriend or a husband or a cousin, you know, that is a reason for her support for the islamic state or any other political movement. and with this case we're being forced to sort of re-examine that. >> reporter: the couple wouldn't be the first bonnie and clyde inspired by terrorists. the widow of paris supermarket gunman was, according to his former lawyer, the more radical one in the couple. she is now believed to be with isis in syria, as is sally jones, the widow of a top isis operative believed to have inspired the only isis instigated attack so far on american soil. the foiled attempt in may to
shoot up a prophet mohammed cartoon drawing contest in texas. in a sobering new report on isis sympathizers inside the u.s., lorenzo at george washington university says many of the supporters are women who are adept at social media. >> paradise in arabic, so you do see women are more prolific than men, they tend to write more, they tend to post a lot of things, they tend to have a lot of accounts. >> reporter: those accounts are used for propaganda and the recruitment of other women, but it's not clear right now who might have radicalized tashfeen malik. a source close to the saudi government tells cnn she was not on any saudi watch lists or on suspicion for extremist activities. brian todd, cnn, washington. >> thank you very much. joining me now, cnn contributor casey jordan. you just heard what brian said, not on a saudi watch list, the
couple was not on any u.s. watch list or radar, frankly, at all. you said about tashfeen malik she may have been the one who was driving this bus out of control. why do you think that? >> well, she's in the driver's seat literally and figuratively. you know, women don't want to believe that another woman could be cabpable of this, but she wa foreign born, syed was born here. >> we've seen that before. >> but we see he gets a mail order bride and as soon as she arrives, he quits going to mosque. that's the last time people saw him, so his life seemed to change once she arrived. there is conjecture maybe this was a part of a long-term date bait on her part. for years she was thinking i've got to find a man to get into the u.s., got to look normal and have a baby, that way i can stay off the watch lists. >> what do you make of the fact they dropped off their 6-month-old daughter, this child will grow up with no parents, they dropped her off at
grandma's house before carrying this out. what's the mindset behind that? >> without parents and a legacy of knowing who her parents are and what they did. this is why i talked on the internet with tons of women and asked is there a mother out there who could do this to her child, no, she clearly had zero maternal instinct. you can chalk that up to the flux of hormones to postpartum depression or psychosis. you really can't. this is clearly they decided to spare the child's life, but the plan or the plot had to have been in place probably before she was born. >> tried to escape. they were trying to get away with it, frankly. it seems to be increasingly difficult to identify these radicalized people because of how they blend in. i was in california on the ground, a neighbor told me they were, quote, so normal. the landlord who rented them this townhouse described them as timid. >> yes. and that's probably their true nature, because people who are
radicalized usually have a huge void in their life, either emotional or psychological, they feel alienated or alienate themselves and the void needs to be filled somehow so when they find somebody else like mooiind this is america, the american dream, we're not getting ahead, they feed each other and that's how it blows up in their head, we can get this done together as a partnership and that's what makes it possible. we've never seen anything like this before, but we probably will again. >> what about the working theory among some law enforcement officials that this was a hybrid attack, yes, there was a radicalization component, but also this workplace grievance component. do you think the latter part should be given any -- >> instigated that before i knew anything, because i'm very careful and responsible about not jumping to conclusions. the indicators were at the very beginning it was a workplace attack. we do not see -- first of all we thought it was three people, didn't know the last name of the shooters and so on.
i still think that's the million dollar question, why his colleagues. that you don't see much. you don't see terrorists picking on the people they know personally. it's usually the symbol, the symbol of the american dream. why not go to a big box store or the statue of liberty? >> they knew this was a soft target, only building of the three that didn't have a key pad to get in. >> i actually think they had a different target in mind, others have said this. got the rental car and had the bombs, but the bombs were at home, unsophisticated. i actually think that some altercation, i've heard somebody insulted his beard at the party and that's when he went home, got his wife, dropped the baby off, came back, left the bombs there. the bottom line is, he got offended and decided it happens here, now, today, and happening against my colleagues because somebody deeply offended him. >> casey jordan, thank you very much, taking us into the mind, some how, some way of these killers. coming up, a closer look at the victims, the victims of this
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the holidays, 14 families are now making funeral arrangements to say good-bye to their loved ones killed in the attack this week in san bernardino, california. nine men, five women, mostly colleagues at the county's department of public health, all of them being missed terribly just days before the holidays. jake tapper reports. >> they were cherished family members, best friends, parents. 14 people between the ages of 26 and 60, who spent their final day celebrating together. kissing their loved ones good-bye in the morning, never believing they wouldn't come home. >> the thought that was running through my mind was just, no, no, no, no, this isn't true. >> ryan reyes drove his boyfriend daniel kaufman to the regional center wednesday, as he did most mornings. kaufman ran a coffee shop there, where he trained disabled employees. kaufman was taking a break on a bench outside when he was killed. >> he meant the world to me.
he meant the absolute world to me. yeah, sorry. >> many of the victims were parents, leaving behind at least 18 children whose worlds are now changed forever. >> overall, she was like an amazing person, like, she was so nice. like, she always liked supporting me in everything i did. >> bennetta bet-badal had three children. her family and friends said she came to america from iran at age 18 to escape religious extremism. >> we just find it just sadly ironic and horrible that a woman that came to this country under these circumstances would find herself gunned down by religious extremists. >> michael wetzel leaves behind six children and his wife rene. a friend speaking for the family told cnn how rene learned of his murder. >> the last group of survivors came and he wasn't in it, they told her that if he wasn't in
there, he was gone. >> robert adams had always wanted to be a dad. he and his wife welcomed a little girl just 20 months ago. on a fundraising page set up for his family a friend posted, "he was 100% in daddy land." his family says he cherished every moment with his daughter. 27-year-old sierra clayborn and yvette velasco were cherished daughters, as well. yvette was an intelligent, motivated, and beautiful young woman, her family said in a statement. on facebook, sierra's sister wrote, "my heart is broken. i am completely devastated." the family of the youngest victim is, too. aurora godoy was just 26. she leaves behind a husband and a 2-year-old son. this community and the families of all the victims will need tremendous strength to move forward. a trait many learned from their loved ones. >> i'm doing okay, because what else can i do? i have to stay strong.
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tand that's what we're doings to chat xfinity.rself, we are challenging ourselves to improve every aspect of your experience. and this includes our commitment to being on time. every time. that's why if we're ever late for an appointment, we'll credit your account $20. it's our promise to you. we're doing everything we can to give you the best experience possible. because we should fit into your life. not the other way around. 5:00 eastern, 2:00 p.m. in san bernardino, california. i'm poppy harlow. joining you in new york. we begin with that massacre in san bernardino this week. we have now learned that investigators will only be able to access two years of phone records instead of five for the couple who carried out the
attack. that is because, coincidentally, the nsa's program gathering information expired four days before the attack. president obama's national security team advised him today the investigation so far has not turned up evidence this couple was part of a larger terrorist web. isis, however, did praise syed rizwan farook and tashfeen malik as, quote, supporters, stopping short of describing them as members. that declaration of support happening on isis's own radio station today. let's go straight to stephanie elam outside the couple's home in redlands, california. a few critical things here, a, what you saw inside the home yesterday when you were in there, and then this image. this image of the wife's pakistani identification. why is that important to investigators? >> right, well, let's start with the i.d., poppy, and the reason why we are interested in this identification, this is an i.d. you would get from the state, this is a government issued i.d. from the government of pakistan of tashfeen malik and