tv At This Hour With Berman and Bolduan CNN April 14, 2016 8:00am-9:01am PDT
>> hello, everyone. >> it is debate day in america. or you could also say fight night in new york. we are live at the brooklyn navy yard, the site of tonight's democratic debate right here on cnn. you're looking right now at live pictures of where tonight's action is going to take place. the final face off for hillary clinton and bernie sanders before tuesday's potentially make or break primary here in new york. both sides have been hitting each other harder than ever on competence and policy. >> but by current republican standards, that would be patty cake. overnight cruz told cnn trump staffers act like union boss thugs. let's start with joe johns inside the gorgeous debate hall. joe, lay it out for us. >> reporter: so we just wanted to give you a little bit of an idea, john, about this stage and where this event is occurring. the event space is the dugou
greenhouse in brooklyn navy yard. this is the center of attention where hillary clinton and bernie sanders will stand and deliver. to my might is the moderator's table. that is where wolf blitzer, my colleague, will be speaking and asking questions as he has so many times in previous national political events. and over there is, if you will, the co-moderator's table. that's eroll lewis and dana bash. a lot to talk about here. this is the ninth debate this cycle among the democrats, and a lot has happened over the last 24 hours as well as the last two weeks. these candidates going back and forth on everything from fracking to wall street, who is more qualified to be president of the united states? so they will have a lot to talk about. they've also been talking about immigration over the last 24
hours, and even reaching out to the minority vote in new york city. as you know just yesterday hillary clinton appearing before al sharpton's national network, and as a matter of fact, bernie sanders is going to be appearing there just this afternoon. so a lot to talk about and discuss tonight, and it all happens right here. back to you. >> all right. joe johns inside the debate hall here at the brooklyn navy yard. thank you so much, joe. joining us right now to discuss what's at stake tonight and what is the state of play is hillary clinton's campaign manager, rob by. thank you so much for joining us. >> it's great to be here. >> thank you. we're going to talk about tonight. let's talk about last night quick. let's compare to images. i want, for our viewers, images you know welcome pairing hillary clinton, her rally yesterday against bernie sanders, his big rally, 27,000 people turning out last night in new york. those crowds that you see right there. now, i know you guys have set up
your events to be smaller and more intimate. that's something you've talked a lot about. i'm not going to talk about the enthusiasm gap, but would you prefer to be the image on the right or the image on the left with 27,000 people waiting hours to come to your event at this point? >> well, i would prefer to be the candidate who is winning the popular vote, and that's what hillary clinton is doing. she has a lead over sanders of over 2.4 million votes. she is winning the delegate contest by a bigger margin than president obama ever was in 2008. we feel really good about where we are right now. we're going to keep work hard to earn every single vote. >> but the crowds are impressive as a student of politics, 27,000 in washington square park is a good picture, yes? >> first of all the park service is saying it was significantly smaller than that. they're saying it might have been a third of the number that the sanders campaign is quoting.
but what matters in this race is the voice of the voters, and hillary clinton is winning the primary contest, and the more people that vote in the contests, the bigger the turnout, the bigger she wins by. that's what we're focussed on. our job is to win people's votes and the delegates and then win the nomination. >> also, something else happened last night. we want to get your take on that. a supporter of bernie sanders speaking, warming up the crowd said this in front of that crowd last nigh listen. >> medicare for all will never happen if we continue to elect corporate democratic whores who are beholden to big pharma and the private insurance city instead of us. >> now, that guy, paul song apologized and walked back, more importantly, bernie sanders, he also calls the comments inappropriate, insensitive. there's no room for language like that in our political
discourse. your campaign was very outspoken about this remark when it happened last night, and going through this morning. now that bernie sanders has talked about it, remarked about it and said there's no room for it, is this over? >> well, i'm glad that senator sanders finally decided to disavow it. i think all democrats should disavow language like this about any elected official, let alone democrats that are fighting hard for working people every day. you know, hillary clinton took on the insurance companies before there was obama care there was hillary care. she took them on and got knocked down and kept fighting until 8 million kids in this country got health insurance. so to use this kind of term to describe her or any democratic official is wrong, and i'm glad that senator sanders finally decided to disavow it. i think what's troubling overall has been his campaign strategy in new york to launch these kinds of personal attacks against hillary. he called her unqualified, as
you know. we're hoping that tonight's debate, at tonight's debate we see something different which is a focus on the issues and not name calling and personal attacks that have come from senator sanders' campaign. >> you say finally, it was 12 hours. it wasn't like it took weeks and weeks for senator sanders to respond. let's talk about the debate tonight which you just brought up. curious about clinton clinton, how she's going to approach it. when you say offense or defense tonight? >> i think she's going to talk about the issues and talk about the plans. you know, the spotlight shines brighter in new york on any candidate than anywhere else in this country. senator sanders has come under a lot of scrutiny. his plans have come under scrutiny. we saw at the new york daily news editorial board, he was light on details on how he would do things like break up banks or deal with isis. that's been a contrast in this race. you're going to hear secretary clinton talk about her plans and
real objectives that she can fla accomplish that are going to make a real difference in people's livings. we hope to hear from sanders on the math making his plans add up, and the real details? >> that will probably come up tonight as a question. after tonight bernie sanders is going to head off and head to the vatican to make a speech. if hillary clinton got the invite to go to the vatican, make a similar speech, this many days out from the new york primary, would she accept the invitation? >> you know, that's a hypothetical. we'd have to deal with that if we were to receive any sort of invitati invitation. we've been very focussed on campaigning across new york state. as you mentioned earlier, doing those small events where she can really spend time with the voters. she's been out on the street meeting people, talking to them about her plans, talking to them about those details that are so
important. and that's what we're going to keep doing. >> robbie, do you think it's a mistake for senator sanders to leave new york and go to the vatican? >> as a campaign manager, i'll leave it to them to decide on their own schedule. i'm not going to judge theirs. >> all right. robbie, thank you so much. nice to see you in new york. you know, big new york. >> in newtown. nice to see you. thanks. >> in midtown, exactly. >> good luck tonight. let's continue the discussion in this part of new york where the debate is tonight. with our panel, julian selzer, donna brazil, bill press, and paul bagalla. he hasn't been on our show in
forever. >> i don't like berman. >> i advised a hillary superpack. our viewers need to know that. i would be for her for free, but people need to know. >> you do nothing for free, my friend. >> exactly. >> i just spent an hour in a car with him, so i can tell you a lot more about paul today. >> let's talk about expectations tonight. you heard robbie saying they need more details. that's what the hillary clinton campaign is saying. what do you think? does bernie sanders need to talk more details and work on what happened with that new york daily news interview? >> yes. first of all, i think we're going to see a really good spirited debate tonight. i'm excited about it. everybody ought to watch. tune in. look -- >> what does spirited mean? >> you have two great candidates. you have a very, very important primary on tuesday. and spirited, i mean, i think they're going to get into the issues that robbie talked about, issues that are pertinent to new york particularly. fracking, bernie brought up this week. you know they're going to get into that. wall street, the goldman sachs
find this week, the transcripts. i think you're going to see more of the differences between hillary and bernie than we've seen in previous debates. they both need a good debate tonight, and i think hillary flee needs a win on tuesday. >> it's interesting. the clinton supporters say bernie needs a win in new york and there's a lot at stake with him. the wife of the mayor said that bernie sanders is getting desperate. i think we have that sound to play. >> i think the tone will be respectful, but i think bernie is getting a little desperate, so i expect we'll hear the volume pumped up a little bit. >> desperate. fair, donna? >> passionate. the sanders people are passionate. the clinton people are passionate. i think if they get too aggressi aggressive, it could hurt both of them. democrats want to see civility, not the kind of attacks.
that will hurt senator sanders and secretary cloininton. i think they'll find spots to highlight, but the majority of democrats want civil nichlt wit. when you look at the republicans, don't come to my hotel room, you would not want to see me without my makeup like you're seeing me right now. but the truth is democrats want civility. we'll have a spirited debate but not to the attack level. >> do they really want civility, paul? >> yes. republicans, they're just hateful. i'm sorry. they are. they there's a difference -- >> bernie sanders and hillary clinton, they're getting way more chippy than they started. >> you're half right. bernie is, and i think -- >> you think that bernie sanders is getting desperate. >> his supporters are. i this ain't pony express.
this is twitter. i believe you give them the benefit of the doubt. i don't believe he heard it. i know bernie is a good guy. i also believe he heard it within 12 hours. he should have corrected the problem. it's a hateful thing to say about hillary clinton. the guy walked it about and said i meant the democrats in congress. really? i have friends who lost their seats voting for obama care. they lost their jobs. that's beyond the pail. if bernie turns to that tonight, and i think he will. he's going to go hard negative tonight. fanaticism comes with reaping your efforts after you forgot your aim. >> it's issue base negativism and personal. i don't think he's descended as far down as people are saying. even the qualification debate, compared to where the republicans are, is nothing. and i think both candidates,
including bernie sanders, understand that an issue-based debate, vigorous and principled, not only benefits both of them. it benefits the party. now they're thinking what's the contrast with the republicans when they're talking about hand size and talking about other issues like that. i think it sets up a nice general election. even if they go at it tooth and nail. >> yeah, plus i have to say this word that keeps throwing around, desperate. why is bernie desperate. he's won eight of the nine last contests. 27,000 people there last night. i don't care if they want to try to deflate the number. it's what everybody is reporting. he has momentum. they both have to win on tuesday. >> that's setting the bar high. >> well, let me maybe correct myself. within 12 hours. i think hillary clinton has to win, and i think if she does not win, it's going to totally change the momentum. >> your phone is going off the
hook for the sanders campaign head quarters. >> and a win for bernie would be huge. >> there is no momentum. there is no moment you want. there's no such thing as momentum. >> why does he keep winning? >> what's 27,000 people in the park. >> >> there's only math. >> hillary needs the voters. she will need his voters. she has to do better with them. that's not momentum. that's demographics. where there's more people of color, hillary wins. you can go through the next 22 states and tell you who's going to win based on demographics. >> i think that's one thing that's wrong with the clinton campaign. you tell the 82% of people voting for bernie that politics is nothing but math. that's wrong. it's about heart. it's about spirit. it's about things you believe in. it's about energy and enthusiasm. it's about passion. it's more than math. >> doesn't the nominee need both? >> but the race to the white
house is not about poll size or crowd size. it's about delegate math. and, yes, i like all of the stuff that you have put into the soup pot, but at the end of the day, the chefs who are looking at it are looking at the numbers. you need 2383. 237 delegates. we won't get the to large number like this until california. at the end of the day, it's really about delegates. >> professor, you have the credentials. we'll give you the last word. you've written an on ed saying they shouldn't go negative and leave the republicans out of it, but isn't a campaign about mixing it up? >> well, what i said is they should mix it up on policy. and i actually think the great thing about this primary, there has been a really visions you debate about where the democratic party should go. and sanders has raised very
important questions about campaign finance and economic inquestion tai inquality. they should talk about when the united states should use force and when there's a national interest in sending troops abroad. take it that way, and they should give voters an opportunity to see the choices that the party is offering. it should be vigorous and heated, but it should be about policy. >> amen. >> it is tonight at 9:00 p.m. thank you to all of you. >> thanks, guys. >> it is all happening here tonight. passionate, vigorous. you choose the word. they face off tonight at the cnn debate only at the brooklyn navy yard only on cnn. >> ted cruz says he's lucky he hasn't woke up with a horse head in his bed. he's accusing the trump campaign of acting like thugs.
what does donald trump think about this latest attack? >> and math again. math matters. >> you told me math wouldn't be part of this. >> trump says the process is rigged. he's slamming his own party, but the rnc says not so fast. those are the rules. our special coverage from brooklyn continues, next. it's how i try to live... how i stay active. so i need nutrition... that won't weigh me down. for the nutrition you want without the lories you don't... try boost® 100 calories. each delicious snack size drink gives you... 25 vitamins and minerals and 10 grams of protein. and it's available in two new flavors, vanilla caramel and double chocolate fudge.
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livelier, a little more you. ultimate flora probiotics. a new chapter in this republican race this morning. perhaps a new chapter in the god father saga. ted cruz likening trump to a mafia like figure. >> he says trump and his henchmen are acting like thugs. his words. he also accused them of threats and intimidation of potential delegates. >> it's not funny when roger stone who organized and put together trump's political campaign is telling delegates in cleveland we're going to make public your hotel room so people can come and threaten and
intimidate you if you dare vote against donald trump. that is behaving like democrats in 1968 in chicago, and we're not democrats. we're not interested in behaving like union thugs. and donald trump needs to learn that. >> all right. let's bring in michael cohen. the executive vice president for the trump organization and special counsel to donald trump. i know you don't work for the campaign. >> i do not. >> but we just heard from cruz, he basically said people who work for donald trump are thugs. >> thank you very much. wrong, and he's wrong again, because roger stone doesn't work for the campaign either. roger stone is somebody that's known mr. trump for many years. he's not part of the campaign. he's not paid by the campaign. the fact that he wants to say what roger stone is doing, he's turning around saying anybody that does something that he doesn't like is now part of the trump campaign and they're acting thug like. >> but we're hearing from people in colorado, the kparm of tchaie
party saying he's being harassed. delegates in indiana are concerned because of what trump supporters are saying to them. >> maybe the supporters are in colorado and they're upset because there wasn't a primary of caucus in colorado. they allow delegates to just give out the votes. >> if, if someone is harassing delegates, do you agree it's a bad thing. >> yes. nobody should be harassing anybody. >> if it is a bad thing, and these supporters of donald trump -- shouldn't donald trump speak up and say don't do this? >> right now mr. trump is concentrating on winning new york. winning the northeast. you know what, there's also the northeast and there's california. his goal is to win this nomination. his goal is to get to the 1237, despite the millions and millions of dollars that are being launched against him,
including by people like ted cruz. >> any responsibility as -- >> does ted cruz not have the same responsibility to turn around and talk about the superpacs that he knows are running the negative ads and then he disavows himself of anything? he speaks with two sides of his mouth. that's cruz's problem. hence by mr. trump calls him lying ted. >> but trump wanted cruz to tell his superpac to stand down. regardless of what ted cruz did, why is it wrong to say that donald trump should stand up and tell his sportd supporters to stop harassing delegates. >> he says he doesn't call for violence and he's not asking his supporters to act in ways that are inconsistent with how he would behave. >> reince priebus tried to maybe take air of the tension, lower the temperature in the feud he's
been having with donald trump. do you think that donald trump still believes that reince priebus should be ashamed of himself for the way the delegate process is working? >> i think reince priebus has an onbligation to the american people to turn around and say, okay, listen, you cannot all get together against one individual, spend $70 million plus in attack attacks, attacking his wife and mr. trump on everything, twist words and then go ahead and run negative ads against one person because he's the front runner since the beginning. reince priebus has an obligation to deal with the other candidates, to deal with the superpacs. he knows them all. if he wants to claim that he doesn't, he's sitting up somewhere in his perched mount olympus doing what? he's supposed to be unifying the party. instead he's allowing the party to become disenfranchised
because it will stop mr. trump from getting the number of votes. >> his job is to not take sides. what do you want him to do? >> he's supposed to keep the republican party unified. that's his job. he's doing a terrible job at it. and do i personally as a voter, as a supporter of mr. trump believe that the process is rigged? i do. i think that the process -- the establishment does not want mr. trump to be the nominee. >> given your opinion of reince priebus, it's traditional when someone becomes the nominee, he brings his own people into the national party committee to run things. would you want reince priebus to stay in power, shea -- >> that's mr. trump and a campaign decision. me personally, i'm a registered democrat. >> you're not voting for donald trump? >> not in the primary. >> so his kids and you? >> i'd like to be one of his children, but no, i'm not voting
in the primary. i'm a registered democrat. >> he's losing votes from his family and the people -- >> you don't have to worry about mr. trump. he's around 50 plus percent in new york. this is his hometown. >> how close is close enough if you don't get to 1237? >> i think he's going to get to 1237, but i don't think it's my opinion regarding close. within 100 points should be fair. if the next person is 400 points away, you've got to go with the person who's brought not just the republicans out but brought democrats and independents. he's bringing in massive crowds, 25,000, 30,000 people at a clip. he's a unifier, and he could unify the party if nay give him the opportunity, if they for some reason, they don't want to. >> leave us with a prediction. will we get all the delegates in new york. >> i believe so. >> michael, a man never short on opinion. thank you for coming in.
we appreciate it we're talking about republicans, but we're hours away from a big democratic debate on cnn. bernie sanders and hillary clinton facing off tonight, and the stakes could not be higher. and if bernie sanders somehow is able to pull off an upset here in new york, the entire race changes. of course, if hillary clinton wins big here, the entire race could be all but over. >> changes too. >> we're live in brooklyn for a special two-hour edition of at this hour, or maybe at this hours. >> double hours. don't let dust and allergies get between you
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right now a annual wounded warrior project ride for wounded veterans. >> president obama speaking at the white house. let's listen in. good morning, everybody. welcome to the white house. thank you, william, for your outstanding service and your beautiful family. i think i heard your youngest one saying daddy, that's daddy. so she's proud too. hey, you. i want to thank outstanding advocates on behalf of our men and women in uniform and our veterans. first of all our secretary of veterans affairs, mr. secretary mcdonald. please give him a big round of
applause, and somebody who has veterans' backs every single day, vice president biden. [ applause ] let me just first of all say this seems to be an exceptionally good looking group here. i do want to check, though, to see how the distribution is. first of all, i understand we have some army here. [ cheers and applause ] >> navy? [ cheers and applause ] >> air force? [ cheers and applause ] >> marines? [ cheers and applause ] >> coast guard? [ cheers and applause ] . >> all right, coast guard, and we've got some of your biggest fans which is our extraordinary military families. [ cheers and applause ]
>> we told a lot of events here at the white house, but few are as inspiring as this one. over the past seven years this has become one of our favorite traditions. this year we've got 40 active duty riders and 25 veterans. many of you are recovering from major injuries. you've learned how to adapt to a new life. some of you are still working few wounds that are harder to see like post-traumatic stress, and like countless riders across the country, part of this great movement is to help each other for all of us to see each other get across that finish line. and that's how america is supposed to work. that's how our military works, and it doesn't stop when you take off the uniform. we're joined by marine captain jessica bilkavic. there she is back there. jessica was injured in training but went onto serve in
afghanistan and over time her injuries compounded. in addition to intense back pain she was also struggling with post-traumatic stress and depression. it took her six months to make the phone call for help, but she finally reached out and as part of her treatment, she discovered cycling. an her first ride she says i felt so free like a weight was coming off. the soldier ride gives her the chance to too do what she loves, and jessica, you're an inspiration. we should not be prouder of the example you're setting for so many people. [ cheers and applause ] >> we have army staff sergeant cas cas casey mcuen. he served in afghanistan, injured in an attack on his outpost, he had to medically retire. something he had never imagined.
and he felt lost struggling to find work and living out of his jeep. and then veteran service organizations helped him get back on his feet, and today he's still fighting for his brothers and sisters in arms working at hired heros usa which helps connect our returning heros with job opportunities. we are proud of you casey. thank you. [ cheers and applause ] >> and that's what's so remarkable about this ride. dreamt up by a bartender. some of my best ideas have come in a bar. [ laughter ] >> you too, huh? but this is one of those ideas that the next day actually was still good. [ laughter ] >> it's a reminder that -- that was not in the script. it's a reminder of the power of
one person to launch a movement that changes people's lives. it's a reminder of the sacrifices that our men and women in uniform have made to keep our nation free and a reminder that for those who are called to serve, their mission doesn't end on the battle field. it's one you carry with you for the rest of your lives. our veterans will tell you themselves they may have put away their uniforms, but they're not finished serving their country. that includes the wounded warriors here today who often tell me as soon as they can, they want to serve their country again. service is in their dna. giving back is what you all do. but as we all know, many of our returning heros still have a hard time connecting opportunities to community, and finding ways to serve. and today i want to thank our incredible veteran service organizations who step up for veterans every day. making that connection,
organizations like the mission continues. ] cheers and applause. >> organizations like team red, white, and blue, organizations like team rubikon. i want to close with a quick story. we're joined today with jason miller. where is jason? there's jason right there. jason served four combat tours in afghanistan and iraq. came home with his body intact but inside he was strugling with wounds nobody could see. and jason doesn't mind me telling you all that he got gresz depressed enough that he considered taking his life. four years ago he wrote me a letter about what he was going through, and he told me how hard it was to get the services and support he needed. as look would have it, right around that time i met with a team which deploys veterans for
emergency response to disasters. and in addition to making sure the v.a. was following up with jason, i also asked this team to get in touch with jason. it helps when you're commander in chief. folks take your phone call. the team reached out. jason ended up joining team rubikon, deployed the oklahoma which was devastated by a tornadoes, and feeling an immediate bond with his teammates, he threw himself into the work of helping people pick up their lives. in the process, he found a path to a new life of his own, and when jason talks about what this new opportunity means to serve, he says the best way to find yourself is to lose yourself in the service of others. and jason's spirit, the spirit of all of you, is the story of our armed forces. it's about dedicating your life to a cause that is bigger than yourself. it's about support and love for each other, and for our country
that flows through everybody who serves under our proud flag. and it's about the country that pledges to be with you every step of the way. not just when we need you, but also when you need us. that's why every day that i have left in this office i'm going to keep doing everything i can to make sure we serve you as well as you've served us. that means making sure you get the care and benefits you have earned and deserved and making sure you and your families have the opportunity to contribute to your nation's success to achieve your own dreams. you represent what's best about our nation, and i hope all of american people along the way will come out and show their support for these heros, not just today but every single day. god bless you and all the military families, all who serve. god bless america. with that, we'll let william strap up, and then i'm going to blow the horn, which i always really enjoy. all right. come on.
>> all right. you guys ready? here's what we're going to do. when you're ready, here's what we're going to do. i have some volunteers here. so i'm going to blow the horn first, but we're going to let everybody -- [ laughter ] >> this is an unusual start. we're going to hear, like, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, 11. there will be 11 blows of the horn. all right? are you guys all prepared? >> what do we leave on? >> you leave on 11. when it's me, then you'll know it's time. >> all right. you're going to start off and pass it down. you just press that thing.
[ cheers and applause ] >> all right. just terrific pictures. terrific images. >> and they're off. >> from the white house right you, president obama with some help kicking off the wounded warriors ride. no you can see it here, on the south lawn, i think, of the white house. the president making remarks and had the children, i believe, of some service members help him blow the horn several times to get the race started. >> 11 or something. but when do they actually start cycling? not until the president gets to blow the horn. >> i don't think the vice president got a chance to do it. let the record show. >> poor joe biden. >> terrific pictures. >> terrific event and a pufl day to start this off in washington
d.c. this is the annual wounded warrior ride. wonderful to have that moment. >> and then back to politics. at the brooklyn navy yard, former political rivals to potential running mates. a few months ago rubio accused cruz of dirt any campaign tricks. wait until what they're saying these days. it sounds pretty different.
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all-important new york primary. >> joining us here, cnn political commentators s.e. krupp and margaret hoover and long time andrew kurtzman a political consultality. andrew, waking up this morning, it was all over the local news. the helicopters covering the events and the rallies everywhere. there's so much energy. this feels like such a big event tonight. >> yeah. well, you know, there's an old saying if you're going to hit a home run, do it in yankee stadium. this is yankee stadium and almost the bottom of the ninth inning. this is an incredible race. bernie sanders, you know, had this remarkable victory in wisconsin. and has been completely knocked off his stride. you can feel kind of the air coming out of the balloon last week. made all these kind of attacks against hillary clinton. didn't quite work. and then he has a historic rally at nyu, washington square park last night. 27,000 people. and, you know, the electricity is in the air. it's a good, good time for political junkies. >> hillary clinton's campaign is disputing the number of people that showed up. >> almost feels like a swing
state -- a battle ground state. >> welcome to the new normal. every state is a swing state. >> new new york. >> so let's talk about the republicans. how about that? so s.e. one of the big questions right now is -- well, the most important question, basically, at the moment is delegates. where are they, who are they going for? and now, what is the magic number? if it's not 1237, what is it? donald trump's campaign -- they're meeting with folks on capitol hill, laying out, according to reporters, laying out their strategy. they think they've got a path. they think they can get to the mark. what are you hearing? what is close enough? >> i think -- i agree. i think they have the path and i think they'll get there before the convention. i really do. you know, the map is not great for ted cruz going ahead. donald trump has new york coming up. i think he's going to do very well in new york. and a couple other friendly states following close thereafter. so i think he's going to get it and all of this hand-wringing and speculation, what a brokered
convention will look like. i don't think we're going to get there. but, of course, anything is possible. look, trump has had a bad couple of weeks. no one can argue that. and if ted cruz really cobbles together the great organization that he has up until now, and really puts that -- you know, builds that into more momentum, anything is possible. but i think he's got it. >> s.e., thinks donald trump will get there, margaret. what is the number of how close he needs to get and still have a chance? we're all fishing -- is it 10, is it 20, 50 delegates? >> it depends on the day. we saw a report from the rnc yesterday it's 1100. you talk to anybody anywhere near the cruz campaign or surrogates and you say one. if he is one shy of 1237, you better believe they'll have a fight on the convention floor. >> i can't change what a majority is. >> the reality is, the rules are the rules. whoever is going to have the nomination is going to get 1237-plus. the question is, do you fight
on -- i mean, when do you have the real fight, or at what point does the momentum shift and then solidify around the front runner? i mean, that's what hasn't happened yet. what we're seeing now is a momentum shift. >> john kasich promising to go, regardless, right? >> but john kasich has the fourth most amount of delegates. so i mean -- >> don't tell john kasich that. >> but i think -- >> marco rubio. >> the momentum shift is starting, and trump is primed for it here in new york, just in terms of finally getting a win. but it's happening as a ripple effect down the entire organization, right? he's starting to get serious, respectable consultants and political analysts and political operatives on his team. i think you're going to start to see another round of endorsements, frankly for him, elected leaders. >> senators? people who work with him? >> eventually there will be red state senators in safe seats who not just jeff sessions from alabama, but who ultimately, should this momentum pick up, decide he's going to be the party's nominee.
>> like jim richie -- >> it's going to start to happen. this momentum shift will have real consequence. you're starting to see the hash tag never trump fatigue, even, you know, rippingeling around. it's not made a lot of difference. >> take a step back for a minute. i think that trump somehow miraculously forgot to put together a delegate operation. realized at the last second, which is pretty phenomenal to watch from the outside. and now he's fighting a two-front battle. number one, he's final hired some professionals who know what they're doing behind the skeebs and fighting a public opinion war to try to portray twhole thing as one giant process. throw the others on defense. the bottom line, is there is no magic number and there is no kind of republican dayity who is going to swoop and decide that's it. this is war. >> there are no rules. >> it's a bizarre choice for trump, going into new york where
he's primed to do very well. to instead be talking about his losses. and really point out, you know, the -- expose the gaping holes in his organization. all that's really done. talk about new york, where you're going to win. stop talking about the rigged system that you are winning, by the way. it's just a bizarre political decision. >> he thinks it's going to turn people out more because they think it's rigged against him. we'll see. guys, great to see you. >> appreciate you being here with us. coming up for us next, the top three things to watch in tonight's democratic debate here at the brooklyn navy yard. you will want to hear them. back in 90 seconds. >> count 'em! i'm terrible at golf. he is. people say i'm getting better. no one's ever said that. but i'd like to keep being terrible at golf for as long as i can.
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we are just hours now until the big cnn debate, live from the brooklyn navy yard. bernie sanders, hillary clinton, face off at this event, 9:00 p.m. tonight. >> to find out what voters should watch for in tonight's big debate, let's bring in cnn political analyst and author of "how's your faith," david gregory joining us now. david, what is the number one thing? you're talking about tone. everybody has said tone is going to matter. what are you going to be watching for in the tone tonight? >> well, you you want to say how both interact with each other. it's gotten testy, nothing by republican standards, but it's gotten more personal, gotten more contentious. not just about issues, but qualifications, temperament, about who is really prepared for the job. so i really look to see how they
both treat each other. does hillary clinton focus on bernie sanders? does she want to take him down a notch in the eyes of perhaps his supporters or the broader democratic electorate? that's important, because this is a closed primary. so he has got to turn out a lot of democrats on tuesday to do well here in new york. can she kind of cut him off at the pass there by going after a lack of specificity on issues, lack of understanding, more complexities on issues in public policy that she talks about. or does she want to just focus on the republicans, and play more rope adope with him, since he is looking for the fight here. this is oxygen for him. this gives him a shot at the title when he's far down in the polls here in new york. >> he has a different choice to make, too. doesn't he? he has to choose how he engages here. he has to choose how badly he wants to try to win this, if he has to go after hillary very, very hard. >> i totally agree with that. and i would temper what i said
by saying she always has to keep in mind, a lot of these sanders supporters, a lot of them, not all of them, but a lot of them are not necessarily anti hillary. they may vote for her in the end. you know, i don't think they have anywhere else to go, naturally politically. they may be holding their nose a bit. but they like sanders as an alternative, as a movement politician, as a populist, et cetera. she wants to make sure to keep those progressives in the fold, to make sure they turn out, and that they vote for her enthusiastically in the fall. and -- but for him, i think you're right, john. i think this is an opportunity to say, look, he's up against a wall a little bit here. he has got to show that he can grow his portion of the electorate in a bigger, more diverse state like new york. with a higher minority population. he's got to show that he's got some game beyond whiter states, more progressive states. and to do that, he may have to go after her a little bit more toughly, aggressively, about host