tv CNN Tonight With Don Lemon CNN May 5, 2016 7:00pm-8:01pm PDT
that does it for us. thanks for watching. cnn tonight with don lemon starts now. >> this is the gop's worst nightmare. paul ryan in a stunning moment declines to support donald trump. >> i'm just not ready to do that at this point, i'm not there right now. i hope to, though, and i want to, i think what is required is that we unify this party. >> you know trump fired back tonight in true trump fashion with a statement saying i am not ready to support speaker ryan's agen agenda. >> everybody's out, i'm the only
one left, that's okay, right? right? [ cheers and applause ] . >> i hope you're writing all this down. george h.w. bush, george w. bush, john mccain and mitt romney all refusing to attend the gop convention. a battle that threatens to tear the party apart. if anyone could explain this, i bet it's gloria bore ger. you got the speaker saying he's not ready to support trump. here's what he told cnn exclusively, and then we'll talk about it. >> i hope to support our nominee, i want to do that, but right now, i have to tell you, jake just being canneded with you, at this point i'm not there
right now. this man is going to get the nomination, because he earned it. he deserved it, he won the vote. i think we need to learn a few lessons here, there's a bit of humility we need, he tapped into something in this country that is very powerful. people are sending a message to people in washington that we need to learn from. we have a presumptive nominee, i think it's very important that there's a demonstration that our standards will be beared. he will advance our appreciation for limited government, for the constitution. for the principles, not only built our party, but built this country and how we're going to run a campaign that republicans can be proud of and americans can be proud of. >> that interview sending shock waves across the country. you've been on the phone all night. i'm sure your phone is burning up. what are your sources saying to
you. >> it's a stunning development in this interview with jake today. look, i'm not there yet i'm not there to support the republican nominee, there's not one person i've spoken with who didn't feel this was a heartfelt move on behalf of the speaker. this is clearly a speaker who has a vision that he wants to talk to donald trump about, and their visions don't cone side donald trump right now, he's the future of the republican party, he's the republican party nominee, presumptive nominee, and paul ryan is somebody who maybe one day will run for president. and he's the speaker of the house. they have to be able to get together on some agenda. you heard what trump said in his statement which is, i don't
support ryan's agenda. >> let me read it for you. donald trump says, i am not ready to support speaker ryan's agenda. perhaps we can come to an agreement about what is best for the american people. they've been treated so badly for so long. stand offhere? >> well, i think the question when i talk to republicans is, how do you put humpty dumpty back together? the fact that paul ryan is not ready to endorse donald trump is not going to bother donald trump's supporters one bit. what's interesting to me is that i'm talking to republicans, he gives some republicans cover, i will support the republican nominee, i like the paul ryan agenda, in that sense he gives some cover another thing, is that you didn't see donald trump go to twitter and take on paul
ryan. you didn't see him challenge paul ryan at his stump speech tonight. he released a statement saying we're going to agree to disagree. i think we're seeing, i think it's a different kind of donald trump than the one during a campaign who would have taken to twitter, because he's not running against anybody any more. and he doesn't want to run against the speaker of the house. >> no twitter tirade, but just a statement which a traditional politician would do. how about the rest of the campaign? how are they reacting? >> i think tonight at a rally, while trump didn't say anythingo
reporters offcamera. was this a slap in the face to donald trum. he said, look, there's the leader of the republican party and he pointed to donald trump. it's not paul ryan, it's donald trump. >> who is it? >> i think it depends which vision you embrace. i don't think this is an argument that republicans want to be having right now. i think at some point -- i was speaking to someone who's a friend of paul ryan's, he believes eventually he'll get to yes, but that he wants to talk to trump about what it is they can agree on. and so reince priebus is probably going to set up a meeting, and they're going to see what they have in common. i think what you heard paul ryan say is we want our standard bearer to share our standards or something to that effect. paul ryan has come out and said that the temporary ban on
muslims is wrong. you're going to see him talk to donald trump a little bit about the big ten republican party and see where they can agree. heading into the convention, this isn't a great thing for republicans. >> it is fascinating to say the least. >> gloria, will you stand by? i need you to help with the next conversation. the next two gentlemen who are joining us right now. luck to the broadcast guys. >> so john. trump supporters are saying this is another example of the republican establishment completely out of touch with voters? >> you have to understand the context of the race. how do you win? >> the play willing field for republicans to win a presidential is not great. you either have to pick up more hispanics, single women, blue collar democrats.
the last thing he needs is for every republican leader to rally behind him. in an ironic way, this is probably as unhealthy for trump as anyone. >> we're seeing this power struggle play out. will it be up to washington to get on board with trump's platform or vice versa? >> it has to be a meeting of the minds. i think paul ryan is doing something smart. he has some leverage here, he is chair of the convention. this is going to be a dramatic moment trump gives his speech, will paul ryan endorse him then? i think he's using his leverage to see if he can't reign trump in from some of his successes. both on tone and also on the
substance. you have to move off this idea that you're going to ban every muslim. and we have seen this in the past, when there are two power brokers going on, there's often some kind of meeting to see if you can put together an agreement that both sides can support i think ryan, if he endorsed him right away, he would have no leverage over trump's tone or agenda. by doing this, he has a conversation and he will have leverage. other republicans will join in that, and he'll be led by ryan. trump in mr. ways needs paul ryan more than paul ryan needs trump. >> yes, you can explain why that is, i agree with you, but explain to our viewers why that is. >> well, because if trump goes down. as long as the republicans can hold house. they haven't gone backwards,
they've blown what could have been a big opportunity. paul ryan can continue to build the future of the republican party. trump will be rejected. on the other hand, trump has a lot to lose. this is his shot. he needs paul ryan. the only way he's going to win the presidency, he has to reunite the party. then he can be reaching out to independents and democrats. he's got to have that first circle closed to have any prayer -- in order to win, he needs ryan. >> i want to ask john this. can anyone reign in donald trump? even some of the people he's brought in, they can't even reign him in? >> our first instinct is, here's what he should do, he should look presidential. he should go with a teleprompter. he cannot win a choice election. he can win a moment election.
the way you win a movement is to throw the playbook out, change the dynamics, you know, we're trying to give advice to a guy that just kicked the butts of 17 different candidate notice republican nomination. >> i agree with john on that. i think this election is not going to be so much about persuasion as it is mobilization. you're going to have to mobilize and get out your voters. donald trump has done a good job of that so far. >> it's also important to mobilize your party. >> hillary clinton will mobilize. >> two nominees staying out of the convention, that makes a mess. the division for forever. >> i will tell you that hillary clinton will mobilize republican voters, you know that donald truchlp will mobilize democratic voters. i think the problem, the republicans i talk to today -- the problem that they have is the question of, where does this
end? where does it end? how can paul ryan reconcile his vision for the republican party with donald frump's vision. they don't have a lot of common, it's not only the question of muslims, it's a question of immigration, it's a question of trade. it's a question of entitlement reform. if you go issue by issue by issue, how can they reconcile. it can't be about the issues. it has to be something larger they can agree on, about the presentation the republican party wants to make to voters in this country overall. and how inclusive the party wants to be. >> do they -- >> well, they don't agree on anything. >> done. >> stand by, everyone. >> it is about tone and principles. >> gloria, thank you very much. john and david i want you to stick around.
summer, is that a mistake? no, i understand why they're doing it. let's not forget, there's been a lot of republicans in the last two days that have come out bobby jindal, who else said they're going to support donald trump. the calculus for trump to win does include getting basically every vote that mitt romney got last time, and then some additional democrats and blue collar republicans. the challenge he has is how to get them to unite but at the same time not looking to have his base leave him because it looks like he sold out. that's the challenge for donald trump. >> paul ryan can help him with that, correct? >> absolutely he can, and i would be shocked if at the end of the day, paul ryan is not there. what he's saying at this point
is, you're going to do it on my terms not your terms. >> on the one hand you have the past two republican presidential nominees and past two presidents saying, no thanks. then we learned rick perry endorsed trump. others saying they're going to endorse him as well. what does this all mean? >> i agree with every word that john just said. i thought it was right on the mark. i think that donald trump really ought to listen to the underlying tone of what paul ryan said, that is, everybody needs to show a little humility here. that includes, he's in a position as a victor to be gracious here. i think for him to go visit paul ryan would be a smart idea. i think at some point he's going to have to pay the bushes a visit. it's very personal with him because of what happened to son jeb. i think donald trump needs to
reach out in a way that shows he's a larger man than he is. any number of people i talked to are sort of -- cab drivers and people in hotels are saying, wow! this guy came out of nowhere and won this? he has something going for him. they're excited about it, he has to bring the rest of the party with him. and i think that's done by persuasion not bombast. >> how do you do that without seeming like you're capitulating? >> one of the things i thought was really -- one of the reasons i thought ronald reagan was successful as a leader, he stuck to his principles. he was extremely gracious at reaching out across the aisle. and indeed, including people in his white house and government who didn't agree with him on every issue. i wasn't as conservative as he was, but he welcomed me in. he made it a big tent. donald trump has to do that, i
think he can create something here. he can surprise all of us, he could still win this election. he has to do something things to do that, you can't kick people around and assume they're going to get together with you. >> is there anything he can do to get the people he turned off support him? people will say, why are you cow towing to the speaker of the house. he's the establishment, that's what we don't want. >> i think he has to be careful, and he needs to understand why he's in the position he is today. these aren't people who waited their whole life to vote for donald trump. these are people who have been frustrated for a long time. felt disenfranchised from the process, and share channeling that frustration through him because he has a big mega phone. the whole point of this is, these are people who want to see change, they believe he's authentic enough and believe him that he will do what he says.
if he's doing this for political manipulation or he's going to sell out, they will leave limb very quickly. >> he can be in a position, but he could be in a position where he is the representative of the people who are angry and comes in to say, paul, you have to understand where the electorate is coming from, you have to work with me on this. i'll work with you on some things, but have you to work with me on some things too. that's what a leader does. this party is not going to come together naturally, he has to be the one who is the leader in bringing it together. i think he can do that. >> that's important. there needs to be this message transition from tapping into that frustration and using it as anger in a republican primary, to now changing it to being something more hopeful, more visionary about how we are going to make america great again, and get people around that, i do think there needs to be some of a positive message transition to do that that hopefully we'll start seeing.
>> the idea of a third party, is that all talk and no momentum? we heard they're still looking for a third party candidate. how realistic is it? >> i think it's unrealistic. i don't think you'll find anyone can take the nomination away from him. and after the convention, it's too late to get on the ballot. >> you hand it over to hillary clinton? >> as john said, he needs every romney voter plus a lot more. >> john? >> yeah. i think what you have to understand is, for all practical purposes donald trump is a third party candidate, he's not running as a quintessential republican candidate. that has great benefits if you request pull it off and get the republican vote this never trump is never more at this point, you're going to see a lot of
people jumping on to the trump bandwagon, it's already happened in the last two days. >> i want to you take a look, this is a new anti-trump ad hillary clinton is running. >> if you're to mock a reporter with a disability. >> i don't remember. >> planned parenthood should absolutely be defunded. >> how do you ban abortion. >> we'll go back to a position they had, where people will perhaps go to illegal places. >> should the woman be punished for having an abrgs. >> there has to be some form of punishment. >> will you condemn david duke? >> i don't know anything about white supremacists. i don't know. >> knock the crap out of him, would you? i'd like to punch him in the face. >> so she is not wasting any time going up against donald trump. here's what shawn spicer said, support of a third party besides donald trump, means supporting
hillary clinton, and then she has that ammunition as well, john. >> this is -- >> first of all, that ad right there, was targeting toward moderate republican women in my opinion. and what they are trying to do, and i think the clinton combine will do this, is try to cherry pick and divide the most mobil swing republican voters and see if they can turn them against a trump. if they do, he's going to have a big problem. >> thank you, guys, appreciate it. >> we're just getting started, the conversation continues right after this break. don't go anywhere. r work. i'm really looking forward to this spinach salad. it's got quinoa in it! (vo) it's the little things that make a big difference. courtyard, make room for a little fun. this just got interesting. why pause to take a pill? or stop to find a bathroom? cialis for daily use is approved to treat both erectile dysfunction and the urinary symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently, day or night. tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medicines, and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex
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a political earthquake in the republican party, house speaker paul ryan telling cnn he's not ready to throw his support behind donald trump. the likely nominee. here to discuss are kaley and peter. kaley is supporting trump. also here, amy holmes. peter -- hello everyone by the way. >> it's pretty remarkable he didn't have to do this, he could have pun theed and waited until
trump came down to washington. paul ryan is trying to protect that house majority. donald frump's numbers are so terrible he puts not only the senate in jeopardy, but the house as well. one of the things ryan is calculating, he's giving other house republicans cover if they feel they don't want to endorse donald trump. >> he's saying, look, you have to do this if you want to save the republican party and our majority? >> he believes, he didn't want everything to go down in the massive bonfire that is the trump candidacy, he wants there to be a republican party in washington afterwards that can rebuild. he doesn't want the republicans to have lost the presidency, the senate, the house and essentially the supreme court all in one election. >> you look pained, kaley. >> it sounds like lunncy to me. this is the candidate who has
the most votes of any -- as does your candidate, hillary clinton. >> she's not my candidate. >> you have a candidate. >> actually, i'm torn between bernie and hillary clinton. his ratings are 15 points higher. hers are high, his are unprecedented. >> he's also -- you know what's unprecedented, she's undergoing a criminal investigation by the fbi. the democrats don't have a problem with unity when she's undergoing this investigation. what paul ryan did today, was unprecedented, was wrong. your goal should be keeping hillary out of the white house, what do you do to help her get in the white house zm you cause division in your own party. that's exactly what he did today. he should have done what mitch mcconnell did, what rick perry did, that's the responsible
thing to do. >> who's a leader, paul rion or donald trum snp. >> they're both leaders. and paul ryan will be presiding over the convention. >> they're not ready to support each other, right? this is what donald trump, how he responded. he said, i'm not ready to support speaker ryan's agenda. perhaps in the future we can work together and come to an agreement about what is best for the american people. it's about time for politicians to put them first. so can the two be united? >> they could be, and i think peter you're right in a number of respects why paul ryan made the statement today, he's trying to give cover to other party members in tough districts this fall, and may have to go their own way. may have to run against donald trump and hillary clinton. i also think he's saying, i'm not ready yet. he's playing footsi, and he's trying to have leverage and influence over donald trump. his campaign. stantively and style.
he's expressing catharsis for those republicans who didn't vote for donald trump. i get you, this is where i'm at, it could be that he could move toward donald trump. >> his motivation not in a bad way, it's not personal, this is a political motivation in order to help the party. do you believe that's correct? >> i think it's also a moment for him to sort of channel this catharsis for republicans who are not themselves ready for donald trump. they could be. >> i think the problem for paul ryan is, what do you expect donald trump is going to do. even if you had a great meeting with donald trump. he said various things about how he's not going to be insulting. maybe he's even a full back. do you really have any faith that he's going to teach you that the next day? >> he's very much his own man. paul ryan presiding over the convention in cleveland does have a lot of power, in terms of
those rules, delegates, who gets to speak on the floor. donald trump good need to do business with paul ryan. >> does ryan risk sounding out of touch with the electorate? >> yes, that's the whole problem here, it's not surprising we see ryan, romney coming out against trump, at least not supporting him yet, this is the thing. trump represents the electorate who feels betrayed by our party. we chose this person because we are rejected republican leadership. what is so strange to me, they're using conservatism as a shield. he's not conservative enough. they brought in mccain who was against cap and trade. conservatism is a shield. >> i think truly if i had to guess, i would say it's because they don't think donald trump is a decent man. they don't think he's a decent honorable human being. that's the fundamental differences. they were willing to overlook
the differences with romney and mccain because they respected him as people. >> there's always the question of trustworthiness in terms of the positions he's taking now, will he stick to six months from now, a year from now. i would also make the point as we know, politics is a game of addition not subtraction. donald trump needs to add to his numbers not subtract them. it doesn't behoove them to say -- >> it does, here's the thing, the cnn poll that came out yesterday showed this was of all registered voters. washington doesn't represent their views. there is a problem with the system on the democratic side, which is why people like senator sanders and on the republican side, i think it helps him to say, i said the system was rigged then, i'm saying it's rigged now. i'm consistent. >> he needs the party's support to get him across the finish line, tactically and i'd yo logically. he can't just win with the trump base, he has to -- >> isn't it amazing, as i'm sitting here listening to you
guys. is it amazing that we get anything accomplished considering what happens? how this process works? >> it is amazing. >> yeah, but it's important to them -- there's a false equivalence here -- it's a much more unified party. the percentage of democrats that won't support hillary clinton, the perlsage of republicans who wouldn't support donald trump is 28%. even if it drops by half, you're talking about a much more divided republican party. the democrats will coalesce around hillary clinton. >> they may get on board eventually. hillary clinton just lost to bernie sanders in indiana. democratic voters are still expressing their disapproval. >> hillary clinton beat barack obama in many of the primaries and yet the party -- >> not everybody believes that a third party is out of the question. so we're going to discuss that
back with me now, do you think paul ryan opened the door to a third party? >> no i don't think he did. it's not in his interest as the house speaker to launch a third party candidate. back in 1992, ross perot was the most successful third party candidate in history. he got 18%. i don't think a third party candidate would be successful, and it may just put hillary clinton in the white house. >> i would love to write someone in or have someone else come in as a third party candidate. but it's a vote for hillary clinton. >> absolutely. >> if you are a conservative, it pains me to no end to say, i'm a conservative and i'm not voting for trump. >> does it help democrats? >> yeah, if you look at it historically, divided parties historically don't win general
elections. the republicans in '92. it's much harder to win when you're a divided party. they're more divided at this stage than any political party in my lifetime. >> rick perry endorsed trump tonight, said he would be open -- i'm open in anyway to help the party, that would be a vp as well. >> that's fantastic many that's what people do when you have a presumptive nominee. you have a nominee, you support the nominee. i commend rick perry and mitch mcconnell. i never thought i say that. >> here's what mitch mcconnell said, he would support trump, i have committed to supporting the nominee chosen by the voters, and donald trump is now on the verge of clinching that nomination.
as the presumptive nominee, he has the opportunity and the obligation to unite our party around our goals. so -- >> that's also -- >> you're happy about that, but you also said you want marco rubio? >> i do. >> why is that? >> that's the ultimate sign of unity, to have someone donald trump had bitter fights with. come and stand next to, and say i support this person. hillary clinton has a horrible problem with millennials. she's lost millennials in every state. marco rubio can bring those people into the fold. he brings energy, he's excellent. >> trump says he says he, meaning trump has the opportunity and the obligation to unite the party. do you think trump sees it that way. >> clearly he doesn't. i don't need that help. brushing them off. mitch mcconnell saying he wants trump to come around to gop
ideologies. a lot of politicians are using this clever wording, they say they will support trump but they don't endorse trump. >> we support the nominee, they don't want to say trump's name. >> is it because, you know, you said trump is his only man and he runs his own mouth and twitter feed. >> it's also because they think he's going to get creamed. if they just disagreed with this guy. but thought there was a likelihood he would be president. and becoming his running mate would give you the ticket to becoming vice president. you're talking about a guy who they genuinely they don't think is fit to be president. they think he's going to get killed. why would someone like marco rubio want to get on a train like that. >> he's having those conversations with donald trump
and he's not going back to washington. why not? >> the same people who are the naysayers now were the naysayers in july who said, donald trump never had a shot. >> the primary is much different. >> you're operating in a different environment. the african-american population, asian population are significant. it's a completely different political environment when you leave the republican party. >> one last point about the republican party being able to unify around donald trump. let's not forget hillary clinton could be a unifying factor for conservatives and republicans. now that it's a one man, one woman race. >> quickly, i want to move on. >> i think peter's investigating the infanningibles. contrast that to hillary clinton who has a history of losing an
election she should win. she had both of these locked up. she lost to barack obama, they're complete opposites and they will beat her. >> listen to donald trump in west virginia tonight. >>. >> they're all taking our jobs, folks. that's all going to change very rapidly, i promise. but the minors don't want to leave anyway, is that right? you want to stay here, open the mines. we're going to open the mines. i see over here, trump digs coal. look at that, trump digs coal. that's true, i do. i've always been fascinated by it. i've been fascinated by the whole sequence of doing it, it's incredible the engineering that's involved and the safety and all that's taken place over the last number of years. >> clearly a direct shot at hillary clinton who was inferring that the coal mining
system they must evolve. that was a direct shot at hillary clinton. >> i will say this. donald trump will win west virginia. west virginia is the kind of state where the democratic party has been just obliterated. what you've seen, the democratic party has lost, is doing much worse among working class white voters. west virginia is a state with very low education levels in general. those states, barack obama was extremely unpopular, hillary clinton will be extremely unpopular. the democratic party is doing very well with rising democrat tick groups. younger people, single women and la dinos. >> if it's identity politics, hillary clinton said that she would put coal miners out of work and coal out of business. >> i have so run, that's got to be the last word. >> donald trump, thank you by the way. donald trump promising to make america great again. will the art of the deal work in the white house? waiter. water.
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good evening. evan first, as president, donald trump promises to make america great again, beginning with jobs. here he is in west virginia tonight. >> the jobs are going to everyone else but us. we're sending our jobs to mexico, china's taking our jobs. japan, they're all taking our jobs, folks. that's all going to change very rapidly, i promise. we'll start winning, winning, winning, you're going to be very proud and for those miners, get ready, because you're going to be working your asses off, all right? right? so from day one president trump says he'll put corporate executives on notice if they move jobs out of the country, he's going to hit them with big tariffs. is that going to work? >> no, he could set off a global trade war, which means all sorts of people lose jobs.
the worse thing he could do is erect tariffs and cause a trades war and have people cut off their trade with us. that would would be a disaster. >> this message resonates with his base. the strong leader who's going to fight for american jobs? >> no doubt, we saw that in west virginia today. what he said to the miners, we're going to get you back to work and you're going to work your asses off. these are folks who have been out of work. and what donald trump is doing is offering very little specifi specifics. he's offering them hope. >> he sums up his foreign policy in two words, america first. how do you read that slogan? is he redefining america's priorities or is this isolationism? >> what's interesting is that the whole slogan comes from the 1940s. they didn't even want to get involved in world war ii. just a -- you know a week or two
ago, he did a foreign policy speech, where he talked about how he was going to make america first he talked about the greatness america did, how it saved the world in world war ii. if you look at the historical context, it goes against everything he's saying. we sat here with great minds like fareed zakaria. he said isolationism would be get rimtal to the economy. what's your take on this? >> i think trump is all over the place. he seems to be isolationist mostly, he certainly wants to cut off the world as far as trade goes. he doesn't like our allies and wants to cut off our allies. he also says he's going to smash isis. who knows what he's going to do. i think he's making it up as he goes along.
strump has been widely criticized for his lack of foreign policy jobs. his cabinet doesn't have room for elites like these it's an issue you address in your new york times piece. as much as his neo-isolationism frightens our allies, it's his stance that most threatens international security as even nixon recognized since it's emergence as a global power in the late 189th century, america has relied on a highly trained core of diplomats, and academics to steer it straight. get rid of them as mr. trump seems intent on doing and chaos will follow. here's my question. why the chaos? what can diplomats and bankers offer that generals and business leaders can't? >> it's simply true that the united states has created a world war that's fostered stability. kept us out of world war. we're all here.
huge giant global economy that was created. they made a lot of mistakes, vietnam war, others, by and large, they have gotten it right for a long time. it takes skill and expertise to do that, amateurs can't do that. to deal with country that is have nuclear weapons and complicated trade issues, you need people who know what they're doing. you can call it an establishment, you can call it elite. every president including those that railed against the elite like richard nixon, he understood that. >> he had harvard grads and wall street types in his cabinet. what do you think a donald trump cabinet would look like? >> evan is absolutely right, you're talking about the glue that keeps everything together. it's not optimal, it is what keeps everything together. donald trump in many ways is making things up as he goes along. let's assume he does win the
presidency. i'm fairly certain it's not going to be a radical change to what happens here in washington about he's going to hire people that know what they're doing, and they're going to go into these cabinet positions. washington is not going to change that much. a presidency does not alter washington. i have not seen a presidency turn washington on its head. >> thank you, gentlemen. i appreciate it. >> when we come back, donald trump celebrates cinco de mayo as only he could, and no surprise, stirs up some trouble.
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paul rye an drops a bomb on donald trump. the house speaker is just not that into trump. not yet anyway. he says he can't support his own party's nominee. trump says he can't support ryan's agenda. who will come out on top in this latest battle in the gop's civil war? can the party be saved. hillary clinton has more than just bernie sanders to contend with. the fbi interviewing her closest aides. soon they'll interview clinton herself, as she battles to seal the deal with the democrats. liston the interview that's turning the gop upside down