tv CNN Newsroom With Brooke Baldwin CNN May 30, 2016 11:00am-1:01pm PDT
♪ hi there. i'm brooke baldwin. thank you so much for being with me on this e moirl day. you will hear some inspirational stories as we honor those who made the ultimate sacrifice and those serving right now. let's begin in cincinnati, the fallout of a killing of a beloved gorilla when the primate held a 3-year-old boy for a terrifying ten to 15 minutes saturday. you can hear the people watching screaming. somehow this child managed to climb through a barrier, fell in to this exhibit. horrified witnesses watched as the endangered silverback
gorilla grabbed the little boy around the enclosure. listen as the boy's mother is pleading with her child to stay calm. >> mommy's right here. >> oh my! oh my god! >> just calm down. >> isaiah. >> back up. okay. mommy loves you. i'm right here. >> my son. >> no. he's playing. he's sitting there. no, no. >> please protect him. >> isaiah, be calm, be calm. be calm. be calm. >> oh my god.
>> you know, it is terrifying to watch. i can tell you that the zoo is set to hold a news conference next hour. we'll hear more what the zoo saying. let's go to jessica schneider. it's horrifying to listen to this mother telling her child to be calm as you're watching this whole thing play out. watching this gorilla. what is the zoo saying? >> reporter: yeah. the zoo is saying, brooke, they had no choice in this matter. they say that the danger was eminent to the 3-year-old child and had to act. they had the dangerous animal response team that moved in and initially tried to lure the gorilla aside out of the exhibit and didn't work. after tenter if iing intense minutes, they had to take action. they had to shoot and kill the gorilla because of that. there have been a lot of emotions out here today. sadness. confusion about how this
happened and also anger about this. there's currently a petition circulating online and garnered more than 100,000 signatures, people want those parents criminally prosecuted. the d.a.'s office and police say that's not happened yet. we don't have ze tails and people here are angry. in fact, a vigil wrapped up and leading that vigil is someone joining me right now. you're a local animal rights activist. >> yes, ma'am. >> the gorilla, not a person. you said there needs sob recognition of what happened out here. why did you have this vigil today? >> i had this vigil because right now we have people arguing on both sides of whether it was the zoo's fault, if it was the parent's fault and between all of the fighting the person who's being forgotten is hamume and i use the word person. person varies but how we look at it has to be the same.
is it our intelligence or is it our ability to feel and sense and be with others? >> you're not taking sides here. >> no. >> you're saying let's remember? >> yes, i am. >> a 17-year-old gorilla. had been here at the zoo since 2004. and of course, his life was taken on saturday when zoo officials say that they had no choice to keep that little 3-year-old boy safe, they had to shoot and kill him, brooke. back to you. >> let me follow up quickly. do we know how close the mother was to the child when the child somehow scooted over or under the fencing and into the mote? what does the video not show? >> yeah. here's what we know from the video and from some witness statements. they say a minute or two before it all happened, the little boy said to his mother, according to a witness, mommy, mommy, i want to go in the water. she said, no, no. you got to stay away. we don't know what transpired
between those words spoken and him ending up in the mote and what zoo officials have told us is that he somehow slipped underneath the rail, went through some protective wiring, through some bushes, climbed on to the mote wall and then dropped more than ten feet into the water below. he got in there. it took some work but officials say that's how it happened. >> i understand this has never, ever, ever happened before. jessica schneider, thank you there in cincinnati. let's broaden it out and bring in jeff corwin, animal expert and host of "ocean mysteries" and with me is doug burns here, as well. so, welcome to both of you. what a story. i mean, jeff, to you, you know, we'll get to your reaction to what happened in the end but first thought was, you see this 450-pound gorilla and the go lal, you know, dragging the child around as you do, what is the gorilla instinct? what was your read on the gorilla watching the video?
>> well, i think can tell you from my own response, and i think what i'm feeling is what many folks in the conservation community feeling right now. gut wrenching and heart breaking the know that this innocent creature, this incredibly endangered species had to fall prey to such a terrible demise. it's hard to get in the mind of a gorilla. yes, they're great apes. we share something in common with them. we're all primates. but to understand what it was thinking is a challenge. i can tell you this. it's 400 pounds. it is exponentially stronger than myself and could easily dispatch that child instantly it had wanted to. it didn't. yet again, who's to know where this would have gone? we have seen examples, brooke, zoo environments when a child falls in an enclosure and it's rescues and cradles the child.
we've seen the other side, too, where a human being and great apes have come together with catastrophic results. so, what it was going to do exactly we don't know. there was so many unknowns. i think these folks were at a desperate moment and took a desperate measure. >> do you think they made the right call? >> it's hard to say. >> yeah. >> to monday morning quarterback this? i can tell you this. i have worked with the cincinnati zoo. they're one of the greatest conservation organizations on the planet. this is one of the country's most important urban zoos. millions of school kids living in an inner city environment connect with nature through the zoo and brought back a species on the brink of extinction. these are great folks. i would find it hard to believe they wouldn't employ every level of compassion and expertise to find an alternative. and who's to say what would have happened and how he would have reacted if something else had
occurred? >> and that's the thing. you know, we were talking about it. >> i can't say it or think about it. >> yeah. we would be having a very different conversation. >> of course. >> if this ended differently for this 3-year-old. >> you asked the key question and jeff provided the key answer and glad to hear it from him. despite the emotion of oh my god this beautiful, majestic animal killed, the reality is we don't know what the gorilla may or may not have done in an instant. therefore, it's very hard to re -- repeat his term monday morning quarterback. legally, "a," you have negligence on the part of the parents. however, who hasn't lost a 3-year-old for 100 yards in their life? i have two sons and been in that situation. number two, does the zoo have a legal responsibility? theoretically, yes, in the sense that nobody should breach in. you pointed in.
no breach since 1978 since the zoo started and really a fluke situation. so again, working off of jeff and you, i don't think you can second guess what they did. >> just staying with you, doug, the child went under a rail, through wires, through bushes and over a wall and cincinnati police said they're not aware of an intention to charge the mother or the parents but could they be held liable in. >> well, it's a very good question. or the zoo. >> very good question. theoretically i suppose at the outer margins of a supervision of a child. the answer to the question is, yes. however, from a practical standpoint, in my view, i was a prosecutor nine years, i don't see any real viability in charging them with a criminal 0 finance. >> okay, okay. jeff, final question to you. just knowing a little bit about elephants, for example, elephants are, you know, they have memories. they feel. they remember. you know? if something happens to a mother let's say in -- i'm just knowing
having a little bit of being to africa a couple of times and wondering with gorillas, other gorillas in this area. is this something a gorilla, would they -- just for animal lovers out there who are wondering, are they aware of what happened? >> just like human beings, gorillas, which, you know, we belong to this elite group of mammals of primates and we are great apes and we have memories and they have memories and they have a great display of emotions. a kaleidoscope of reactions and they can hold things in their memories. there are examples of people that worked with gorillas that returned the 0 the areas of a graduate student to a research and had emotional reactions when they connect with these animals. we have learned that from diane fossi. there is a memory. here's the thing. that zoo very quickly separated all the other gorillas. the last point is this, brooke. visiting a place like a zoo,
yeah, you lose your kids and expect to find your kids, you know, under the clothing rook and you should be watching your kids in a zoo logical environment like this. here's the thing. when you go to these places, the zoo is not your babysitter. you have a responsibility. we have so many examples where people don't employ common sense in a national park, trying to take a picture next to a bison. who gets sued? national park when things go awry. we have had examples tragedies where people placed children on the edges of exhibits for that awesome selfie and the kids slip in and disaster occurs. we blame the zoos. ultimately, there has to be personal responsibility. you're there with your kids. enjoy the moment but you're responsible for your family and their actions. >> jeff corwin, glad we had your voice. and doug burns, thank you so much. >> my pleasure. >> i appreciate it. tough to watch that video. no matter what. and this reminder for you, off of cincinnati, two conferences
to watch for. one from the zoo. and the other actually we'll hear from the long-time caretaker of that gorilla and that's live. also ahead, in politics today, a prominent republican who cannot stand this man. cannot stand him. he suggested he found someone to run against him as an independent. trump is going off. also breaking news out of washington. white house investigating a suspicious package. crews on the scene. stay here. you are watching cnn on this very special memorial day monday. your heart loves omega-3s. but the omega-3s in fish oil differ from megared krill oil. unlike fish oil, megared is easily absorbed by your body. megared. the difference is easy to absorb.
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that can camp out in between our teeth, if we'll let it. use gum® brand. soft-picks®. proxabrush® cleaners. flossers and dental floss. gum® brand. we're back. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. breaking news here from the white house. white house is on lockdown right now. let's go to senior washington correspondent joe johns. joe johns, you were just talking to me a week ago at another situation at the white house. what happened? >> reporter: we don't know all of what happened, quite frankly, but the white house is on lockdown right now. around 12:00, 12:15 eastern time, they locked down the facility, told people to come off the lawn. into the white house. and then a series of steps
occurred, including fire trucks, police officers and others staging outside the white house. at least one or two firefighters getting into exposure suits coming through the gates into the white house complex. we did talk to a law enforcement source that told us that the secret service was dealing with what they called a suspicious package. and there was a report that we received early on suggesting someone had thrown some type of a package or object over the fence. so, apparently that is what they're dealing with. and it's quite clear that right now they're dealing with ado abundance of caution. two individuals at least in partial exposure suits coming on to the complex. they parentally to check something out. we don't know the seriousness of this but what we do know is that this is memorial day, a day of heightened precaution by first
responders in washington, d.c., always on the alert for something unusual happening. back to you. >> joe johns, we know you'll keep us posted there. thank you so much on the status of the white house on this e moirl day. thank you so much. coming up next, are the never trump folks getting ready to introduce a third party conditioned dates? one of the most outspoken critics suggest an independent is ready to come out by the end of the holiday weekend and now donald trump is responding to that. also ahead, she wanted a hi jab as a cadet at the citadel in south carolina when the university went no. she went another route. we'll talk to this young woman live coming up. . with vitamins and antioxidants. now with foundations in shades for more skin tones. 80% of recurrent ischemic, strokes could be prevented. and i'm doing all i can to help prevent another one.
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on this day honoring the fallen heroes, hillary clinton walked in the hometown's memorial day parade. there they are. she and -- i should mention her husband former president bill clinton joined her in today's event in chappaqua, new york. some other names might be added to the ballot. take a look at the tweet. much ado about this tweet here from bill kristol, editor of "the weekly standard." he tweeted just a heads up over this holiday weekend. there will be an independent candidate, an impressive one, with a strong team and a real chance. within hours of bill kristol's tweet, we have trump going on the counter attack writing, if dummie bill kristol gets a spoiler to run as an independent, say good-bye to the supreme court and more and more
and more. he goes a-twitter. much to discuss. jeffrey lord, a former political director in the reagan administration, supporting now mr. trump. cabric fowler and eric siegfried says he'll vote for hillary clinton. perhaps asterisk depending on who the potential person would be. let's turn to you. listen. we don't know who this person could be. this person may not even exist and all waiting with baited breath. how happy are you as you said choosing between trump and clinton is like choosing between cyanide and arsenic. >> this is a third option. if there's a viable alternative third party candidate, i can vote to make america sane again. >> we have seen it in donald trump's response saying the republicans, they, and it was constantly they. never we.
still not identifying as a republican and troubles me almost as much as his judgment and worrisome. >> jeffrey lord, do you think bill kristol is bluffing? >> hard to say. i know bill. he's doing his thing here. if he has somebody, the person would be committing what i call romney-cid e. george romney, mitt romney's father, promised never to support goldwater. he ran for president and did badly against nixon. wound up at the department of housing and urban development and left that and never heard of from again. i think it's stemming from the fact of refusing to support barry goldwater and ronald reagan did and made him president. i think this is a serious mistake for whoever is doing this and hand over the supreme
court to a bunch of liberals, then, you know, have at it. >> capri, i'm coming to you but staying with the republicans here. >> no problem. >> respond to the romney-cide comment and names floated and standy mccrystal, ben sass and saying thanks but no thanks. >> first of all, this is ridiculous, the romney-cide think. mitt romney followed suit with a career and has been unsuccessful successful presidential candidate. what you have seen is people like newt gingrich saying you should toe the party line and newt gingrich forgets his history. he bucked his president and his minority leader in bob michael saying i'm going to stick to the principles and helped when he -- >> supporting george bush in 1992, evan. >> i'm sorry? >> supported george bush in 1992. >> he bucked the president when
the president said i need your help and he led a revolt which destroyed him. >> he -- >> excuse me. it would have been politically inconvenient for newt gingrich to stick with bob michael and the president or to not stick with the president. and he stuck bhi his principles. >> hold on. >> i'm going to jump in. >> please do, please do. go ahead. >> thanks. i think bill kristol, a true conservative, is going to continue to feel that the republican party is being hijacked by donald trump and, you know, the american people in some sense of the world and a guy like bill kristol, he is going to not stop he finds someone. the question i have about this mystery candidate is, you know, what kind of infrastructure do they have? it's one thing to be a spoiler and get on the ballot and two separate things. saying you're a candidate for president of the united states is one thing and putting the rubber on the road is different thing.
you have to get on the ballot for people to vote for. >> this is to anyone and just about into june. to be able to be able to run a formidable race as this, you know, sort of sleeper candidate popping out of nowhere, how possible is that? >> not very. you know, the best attempt was ever made was by theodore roosevelt and was a popular former president in the day. he couldn't manage to do the deal either. so i think whoever this might be is just not going to, you know, get that far. >> i take a different view. i think it's actually a very noble endeavor on the part of this person. they know it's most likely a suicide mission and will energize the conservative base which is depressed to save vulnerable house republicans and senate leaders. donald trump is attacking a very popular governor and when you look at it, you can actually -- the only way that this person if they do exist could win the presidency is by denying donald trump and hillary clinton 270
electoral votes and taking it to the house. that's where it would go. >> a 269-269 with only -- with one down on the supreme court. talk about a nightmare scenario. >> you know -- >> what do we say to is that? >> just saying. any of us that lived through bush v. gore and deny them having enough electoral votes to secure the presidency, we may be facing a bush-gore situation 16 years later with not enough people on the supreme court to make that decision. >> this will get more unprecedented. jeffrey, quickly. >> that would keep us busy over christmas. >> yeah. >> yeah. i think people are looking forward to having time off in december. but to be determined! evan, jeffrey, capri, thank you all so much. >> thank you. >> my goodness, my goodness. we all are expecting two
different news conferences, in connection of a horrible story of cincinnati, the zoo there. we'll bring it to you live. a latest of zoo officials and an individual that raised this gorilla many years ago. also ahead, a muslim student at odds with the top military school. this is the number one choice applying over her special religious accommodation request to be covered, arms, legs to wear the hi jab. we'll talk to this young woman at the center of the debate and find out where she will be attending the school in the fall. coming up.
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an overpass. bronx, new york. here's the deal. we don't know how it happened. the tractor trailer dangling and seeing the guys figuring out what to do. this is in the bronx. the westbound lanes after noon. so, been like this for a couple of hours and reportedly involved multiple cars and two people taken to the hospital with serious but nonlife threatening injuries and we don't know which vehicles those injured vehicles were in. they're working on securing this tractor trailer and precarious as the hunk of metal dangling over an overpass here in the bronx in new york. an intense debate is shaping up over a muslim student's request to wear a hi jab in military college.
citadel in south carolina, a public institution, told sana hamzi i would not allow a religious rule because uniformity reigns supreme but another said it will grant the request if she so chooses to attend that school and this comes as the issue is polarizing and joins me live now from miami. nice to meet you, welcome. >> nice to meet you, brooke. thank you for having me. >> you know, i'm talking to you first of all and so mindful of this day and the country's memorial day and i read it's your dream to be an officer in the navy. and i want you to just tell me -- >> yes. >> -- why is that your dream? why do you want to serve this country? >> well, when i was a lot younger i heard stories of my great grandmother that served in the air force and two of my grandparent that is served in
the navy and how they met and put a sense of patriotism in me and researching it more i realized that being a part of the u.s. military is definitely something i wanted to be a part of. >> so here you are. you know, you're in high school. you -- time came to apply to schools and accepted into two prestigious schools, the citadel in south carolina. norwich university in vermont. citadel is your first choice. is that correct? >> i applied to both and doing paper work for both. i actually sent the religious accommodation to both and citadel denied the request first. >> can you explain that for me? >> right after that -- >> explain what a religious accommodation, what it would do for you. >> well, it would first of all allow me to follow my dream to be an officer in the navy. i wanted to attend that school because i had seen how well it was run and how uniform the
students were and so i applied and sent a religious accommodation to ask to wear a hi jab with uniforms and long sleeves and pants and i got a call from the commandant himself and said he could not grant the request and hoped to see me in the fall. i said i didn't think it was fair to choose between practicing the faith and attending the citadel and he said okay and that was the end of the conversation. i'm disappointing. >> as you really, really, really wanted to go to the citadel. this is what i have from the citadel, in the 175-year history of this special place, they have not made any kind of exception and this is the response. the uniform, they say, is central to the leadership training at the college as the cadets give up individuality for team work and allegiance and leaders concluded they could not grant an exception to the required dress and christians
don't display crosses around their necks. men that are jewish cannot wear a yamaka. what is your response to their response? as you said, it is uniform. >> my response to their response is if it's good enough for the military, it should be good enough for a military institution. >> what does that mean? >> meaning that if since the military itself has made accommodations for sikhs and muslim women why is it causing a big uproar for a muslim student to go to a military college when the military itself makes accommodations for it? >> sounds like some places made the accommodations and sit del is standing by the 175-year history and saying they're not making an exception. so you are going on to norwich in the fall? is that right? >> yes, i will be attending norwich in the fall. >> and, you know, in this day
and age, sana, where there is still clearly a lot of ignorance coming to islam, what is your message to critics? >> i'm sorry. can you repeat the question? >> in this day and age of so much ignorance pertaining to your religion, what would you say to kritdices? what is your message? >> islam is a religion of peace. there is no -- there is nothing besides that. so, all of me trying to attend the citadel and norwich university wearing an hi jab is to be in the military and serve this country. >> best of luck to you. the navy is a special flas. thank you. >> thank you. >> thank you, thank you. >> thank you for having me. >> you got it. coming up, the cincinnati zoo, officials expected to sfeek about the gorilla shot and killed over the weekend after a child landed within its
enclosure there deep in the mote. frightened eyes watched as this played out. we have more from the zoo today. but next, a harvard graduate powerful speech inspiring millions. >> at the core, none of us were meant to be common. we were met to be comets. leaving our mark as we crash into everything. it's more than a network and the cloud. it's reliable uptime. and multi-layered security. it's how you stay connected to each other and to your customers. with centurylink you get advanced technology solutions, including an industry leading broadband network, and cloud and hosting services - all with dedicated, responsive support. with centurylink as your trusted technology partner, you're free to focus on growing your business. centurylink. your link to what's next.
what's recommended for me. x1 makes it easy to find what you love. call or go online and switch to x1. only with xfinity. i think it's safe to use the m-word here. millions. millions of people are raving about the commencement speech by a special harvard university graduate. donovan livingston. he electrified the speech sailing beyond the traditional harvard fan fare. this is spoken word poetry of liftoff and he joins me live in a moment. but first, listen to some of his words. >> i've been a thorn in the side of injustice, disruptive. talkative. a distraction with a passion that transcending the confines.
beyond your curriculum. beyond your standards. i stand here a manifestation of love, in pain, with veins pumping revelation. i am the strange fruit that grew too ripe if the popular tree. i ham a dream act, a movement and memories of america would care to forget. my past alone won't allow me to sit still and my body like my mind cannot be contained. we're easier to touch the stars so climb. and grab them. keep climbing. grab them. spill your emotions and pour out your soul. light up the world with your luminous allure. to educate. requires patience. today when i look my students in the eyes all i see are constellations. if you take the time to connect the dots you can plot the true shape of their genius, shining in the darkest hour. i look each of my students in the eyes seeing the same light
that aligned the pyramids and twinkle that guided harriet to freedom. i see them exists an authentic frustration and enslavement to the standardized assessments. at the core, none of us were meant to be common. we were born to be comets. darting across space and time leaving our mark as we crash into everything. a crater is a reminder that something amazing happened right here. and an indelible impact that shook up the world. are we not astronomers searching for the next shooting star? i teach in hopes of turning content into rocket ships, tribulations to telescopes to see the potential where they stand and injustice is telling them they're stars without acknowledging the night that surround them. injustice is telling them that education is the key while you continue to change the locks. education is no equalizer. rather it is the sleep that proceeds the american dream so
wake up. wake up, lift your voices until you patch every hole in a child's broken sky. wake up every child so they know of the celestial potential. i'm absorbing everything without allowing my light to escape. those days are done. i belong among the stars and so do you. and so do they. [ applause ] together, together we can inspire galaxies of greatness for generations to come so, no, no. sky is not the limit. it is only the beginning. liftoff. >> what? what? that was so special. donovan livingston, joining me now, congratulations. congratulations. congratulations. >> thank you so much, brooke. it means the world that you would reach out to me. i hope everyone is doing well today.
>> i hope you are doing excellently. i have a feeling you have been. mr. harvard graduate. how -- how did you do that? >> you know, i wanted to make sure i represented my peers in the best way i could. spoken word poetry a huge part of my identity for a listening time and to be the most authentic self i would have to do a spoken word piece if i were to patient in the speech competiti competition. >> what is this you mentioned at the top of the speech speaking for your high school graduation, your english teacher wanted to yank you because they heard you were going to do a poem? >> yeah. so, i had just started experimenting with spoken word poetry and excited about it. taked to a few of my peers and just kind of threw it out there to see if they thought it would be interesting if i did a spoken word poem in my remarks and it wasn't necessarily taken so well by the administration and some
of the teachers so we opted not to do that but it's ironic that you ask that, the teacher in question reached out to me and we had a good laugh about it and everything is good. it was just a matter of making sure that i represented my peers in the best way i knew how and i'm glad i got a chance to use my voice in that way this past week. >> life is funny like that. >> yes. >> how -- how did spoken word come into your life? how does it speak to you? >> well, it came into my life at a time when i needed it most. i was, you know, in middle school. not a good time for a lot of us and trying to find a way to express myself and i kind of touched on that in the piece in the seventh grade i had a teacher whose class i was in and kind of rambunctious and talkative and a talkative comment on my report card in that class. my parents didn't like that too much and my teacher helped me
harness that extra energy i had and i started doing speech and debate. prose poetry. things like that to find a voice and kind of stuck with it ever since. so yeah. >> so yeah. so that. that's how. and then now, since so many people have shared your spoken word, your speech, who has reached out to you that gave you goose bumps to think that he or she watched you? >> yeah. it's been insane. so hillary clinton shared the piece on her campaign page. this was a pretty big moment. justin timberlake, too. jesse williams on twitter. a thing that really stood out to me is my fraternity brother, brother paul griffin reached out to me. the fraternity was a big part of my life and the college experience and to hear from the name that's on my certificate freaked me out in a good way and
excited to be able to reach people on this stage. >> just, you know, i kept thinking you're a lucky, lucky student. your lucky future students. humbled the talk to you. thank you so much. same two words right back at you. lift off. >> thank you so much. be blessed. take care, brooke. >> thank you, thank you. let's move on. any minute now, expecting a live news conference of cincinnati zoo where the gorilla was ultimately shot and killed after 3-year-old boy somehow got into that enclosure. how will they respond to critics? we'll take you live coming up. this is shaving.
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♪ no, you're not ♪ yogonna watch it! ♪tch it! ♪ ♪ we can't let you download on the goooooo! ♪ ♪ you'll just have to miss it! ♪ yeah, you'll just have to miss it! ♪ ♪ we can't let you download... uh, no thanks. i have x1 from xfinity so... don't fall for directv. xfinity lets you download your shows from anywhere. i used to like that song. remember those who made the ultimate sacrifice in serving our country. president obama honored fallen heroes by laying a tomb at the enknown of soldier earlier today there in arlington, virginia. on his last memorial day before
leaving office, the president highlighted specific stories of sacrifice and urged americans to be there for our veterans and families. like the family of daniel somers, an iraq war veteran who took his own life in 2013 and his parents are on a mission, i can tell you knowing them for several years, they have been on a mission to make sure america is caring for the troops coming back home from war. howard and jean join me now. so wonderful to see you again. today is a tough one but i appreciate the time from both of you. >> thanks, brooke. >> thank you, brooke. >> i know that there is not a single day that goes by, not a minute that goes by you're not thinking of daniel. but on this memorial day to both of you, how do you choose to honor him? >> well, i think what we're doing on a daily basis right now is we work on our nonprofit. that is the easiest way to feel
like we're helping other veterans who may be in daniel's same circumstance. >> we have, as you know, the organization called operation engage america. what we try to do is bring together within as many local communities as possible and this year we're up to seven separate communities and cities in the country local resources for veterans, first responders and especially their families that try to help those people with their issues of pts, tvi and transition issues and we have come to learn from so very critically important. we partner nationally with the va and locally with a lot of other organizations because we did not know when we were in the situation with daniel what resources were available to us and we have found so many people in the same situation that we've made it our mission to try to bring people and resources
together. >> you had no idea that's the thing. you lost your son. you started walking down, you used the word journey. you start walking down this journey. so ultimately, you're doing this event and i know san diego is coming up in june. but you want to make sure, you know, different resource centers an different people know and communicating so that other families will be able to know where to turn to and i know that you all have been so passionate about, you know, proposals like several me believes of congress supporting your notion of integrated care for our veterans. howard, will you explain how you think that would help? >> well, we really feel that the va does some things better than any organization in the world. especially when it comes to treating our veterans. and this is especially true in mental health care, rehabilitation and the coordination of all of these care efforts. there's a remarkable program
within va called post deployment degrated care and we feel this is how the va should be functioning on a national basis and creating a center of excellence for service related issues. so if we can have the va really, really do what they do best, we feel this is the best way to help our veterans get the best, absolute best medical care they can have. >> and then veterans that do not have the specific issues, broken arms, this kind of thing, go out into the community, still va, under the va's financial umbrella, but not have to go to an actual va for care. >> okay. okay. jean and howard, thank you so much. we'll talk again and have breakfast again. i truly appreciate both of you and, you know, thank you so much to just your son for his service in the past. i appreciate both of you. thank you. >> thank you, brooke.
we also have partners all over the country, especially the naslins in iowa who lost their son son dillon that we're thinking of today. >> operation engage america, howard and jean, new. >> you're welcome. we have to move to breaking news at the cincinnati zoo. let's dip in. >> we had an all-employee meeting this morning and never seen so many people here at 7:45 in the morning for a holiday but it showed whether people were off today or not they came because they cared. the purpose is different than this. it is for a chance to share their feelings. there were tears. there were hugs. the people that knew harame the best, the keepers, shared a lot of stories about him. but everybody at the zoo feels the loss. there's no doubt about it. that does not just mean dozen or so keepers in the primate department or the couple of hundred zoo employees, but, you
know, we have a thousand volunteers at the zoo, hundreds of thousands of people that are members of the zoo and of course the entire community is very involved with the cincinnati zoo. it is a big loss. that said, we are very glad that the little boy is okay. that is a one happy thing in a dangerous and bad story. naturally, we did not take the shooting lightly. but that child's life was in danger and people who question that or are monday morning quarterbacks or second guessers don't understand that you can't take a risk with a silverback gorilla. they're very big, three times bigger than a man. six times stronger than that. this is a dangerous animal. i know the photos or videos, doesn't seem dangerous. this is an animal with one hand i have seen take a coconut and crunch it. he was disoriented.
he'd never had anything like that going on. and that also led to the decision, of course, not to dart the animal. almost everybody knows if you were to say dart your household pet, receive a dart yourself, there would be a pretty dramatic response and an animal like a gorilla and doesn't understand, you could have displaced aggression at what's the new thing in your area. so in the real world, you make difficult calls. but you have to make them and safety of that child was paramount. i'm proud of our team that handled it and the team that handled everything since. so, we have had lots of discussions with harambe's keepers who told amazing
stories. he's baby gladys' half brother. he was on a trajectory. he was starting to mature. he was 17. he was headed towards breeding in a few years. takings a while. like teenage boys. teenage gorillas take a while to mature to have a family of their own and of course that won't happen but his nickname was handsome harambe. he was a great looking gorilla and he was smart gorilla. that he was very easy to train. and do, you know, with medical procedures or to, you know, look in his mouth, check his teeth, things like that. anyway, before i take questions, i'll also say in tough times you know who your friends are. we have heard from thousands of people around the world,
colleagues, all the way to jane goodall, zoo directors all over the world, with both sympathy, with support for a difficult decision. and the people that know gori a gorillas well, people that research them and work with them in captivity know the decision we made and why. so, i'm happy to take some questions. >> you talk about the security barrier where the child got in? >> one at a time. john? >> you have talked about the dart and tranquilizer situation. was there any alternative that was looked at by the dangerous response team to distract harambe in any way? >> good question. most of you might have been here the other day and the sequence of events was realizing what had happened, both our dangerous response team and cincinnati fire department was on grounds and our keepers very alertly used the special call they have to bring the animals in.
the females responded immediately and came in. the male because he was stimulated, excited and distracted by this little boy, did not go in. that would have been an ideal situation bah he didn't go in and started to drag the boy around. an important thing to note is when you see snapshots, thank you, or you see clips, you might not see everything that happened. there are quotes directly from cincinnati fire department and official report, this child was being dragged around. his head was banging on concrete. this was not a gentle thing. we are fortunate that he is okay. so, when it was determined that the child was being injured, not potentially injured but was being injured, both down in the mote and up on the ground, that we had to make a decision to shoot him and we did. >> how are the other gorillas? doing? >> that's a good question. how are the other gorillas
doing? we have two groups, two females that live with him and then another group of seven which is a big family group with jonah. the two that were living with him, obviously, next morning sort of looking around much like periodically animals in zoos shipped from one zoo to another. they don't know what happened but they're doing fine and all resting. >> do they show any signs of loss? they didn't see anything happen? >> they were inside. >> no sadness? anything like that? >> i don't think so, no. >> how r they very, you know, emphathetic beings? >> gorillas are a lot like us, living in family groups and very, very close. >> is the zoo negligent at all? how were there are not more structural safeguards in place to keep the child from getting in there in the first place? >> the exhibit is safe. we are inspected by the usda and aza. accreditation by the usda twice a year.
the barriers are safe. the barriers exceed any required protocols. the trouble with barriers is that whatever the barrier is, some people can get past it. much the same way of you lock your car and people get in your car. and, no, the zoo is not negligent. >> does more to be done? are you reviewing the structural barriers there at the other exhibits? >> as you can imagine when anything happens, an emergency or crisis, naturally we are looking to that situation. the situation now is safe. it is a same as it's been. that said, we lost an incredibly magnificent animal, an important part of the program. so it's important fors to make sure our animals are safe. we'll look at it. >> was there an issue with the barrier? >> in. >> nothing wrong with the fence? >> no. >> nothing out of -- 30-plus years. >> correct. >> >> what's the failure here? where's the breakdown?
was up to code. parent's fault? guardrail's fault? where do you place blame? >> politicians and pundits point fingers. we live in the real world and we make real decisions. people, kids and others can climb over barriers. we work really hard to make sure that the zoo is safe and guests are safe. we have over 1.6 million visitors a year. people can climb over barriers and that's what happened. >> is that the -- >> is that the point of the barrier? so people can't get over them? >> the exhibit and the barrier is safe. that said, any of us in this room can climb over if we choose. >> what about an adult, this is a child. >> i understand that. >> so we know better than to climb over. a child that doesn't understand the risk he is in why would there not be more to make it
impossible? >> the barrier's adequate. and we all need to work to make sure our families and kids are safe, visiting the zoo or a shopping mall. >> what is -- status quo? this happened. >> sure. we are looking at it to determine who's the optimum situation and midst of a change and doubling the size of an exhibit with a big indoor gorilla greenhouse. [ inaudible ] >> oh no. that's important for us. >> isn't it time to review what happens? welcoming back. you were in crisis mode at the time. looking back, would you make the same decision again? >> yes. looking back we would make the same decision. i know that after it is over and the child is safe, it's easy like a monday morning quarterback to look at it saying, wow, wow, wow, don't we need to do this differently. the people that say that, "a,"
don't understand the silverback gorillas and the danger the child were in and we are not there at an important time to make important decisions. we stand by our decision. we'd make the same call today. >> you mentioned the -- have not spoke within the family. have you been in touch with the family since? >> we have not been in touch with the family. they have requested privacy. i don't blame them. and everyone at the zoo is relieved that the little boy is okay. >> did the zoo plan on pressing charges against the parents of this little boy? >> that would not be a good plan. the police were here and did not cite anyone. not a legal action. but i think they know we saved that little boy's life. >> in the future of the breeding program, what's going to happen now that -- tell us how significant this is that he's gone. >> sure. gorillas are one of the most endangered animals in the world. there's only 300 in the zoos in
north america canada to mexico. ours is a leading program. we have had 50 babies born at our zoo in the last 46 years. we'll continue our breeding program. the breeding group we currently have that has three youngsters in it is still intact and, you know, folks see them coming the zoo. the two lone females not part of that group over time may end up with another male in their group and we'll see and double the size of our exhibit space up there which will allow us to more and different configurat n configuration. >> you saw snapshots of the incident on the film and we all know that incident went on for about ten minutes. are you aware any other video of this ongoing ordeal that might give more of a perspective of seriousness of the situation as it continued to unfold?
>> i'm not a video expert but we talked extensively with people there, the security team as well as members from cincinnati fire department who were there. and they are all unanimous the child was being hurt. >> but -- >> can you give us a step by step of the ten minutes? we say maybe, what? about two minutes of what happened. it was a ten-minute incident. do you have a step by step of what happened, say, after that? a video -- >> sure. a brief overview is a little before 4:00 on saturday this young child, 4-year-old i think, evidently went over the barrier and then through the bushes an enin and into the mote. it's about 15 feet down into a foot and a half of water. that's a lot to do right there. he was splashing around in the water.
naturally, the visitors, it was a crowded day. had over 7,000 people in the zoo. they were reacting and harambe noticed that and looked and on seeing him he went down. he went into the water with him. swooshed him around in the water some mostly by the ankle and decided to take him up on to the land. he carried him up on the ladder and up on top and then again continued to do the same thing. you know, gorillas are not polar bears. wasn't trying to eat the animal or the child, but he was disoriented and wanted to get the child to sort of stay there and be probably like a gorilla would which is different than the situation. obviously the child upset and people were screaming. during that time, our security
team emptied the exhibit. and the dangerous animal response team officer came and dispatched harambe. and the reason was that it was a life threatening situation and a silverback gorilla is very dangerous and would be dangerous to us and particularly dangerous to a little kid. >> any word yet on when the exhibit will reopen? >> hopefully by next weekend. >> and the boy went over the barrier and -- >> that's my understanding. >> that he went under. >> my understanding, from talking to folks that were there since this time is he went over. >> can you walk us through what you understand happened? >> do you know any 4-year-olds? they can climb over anything. he dlimed over the top. >> okay. >> yeah. >> doesn't sound like anybody's taking responsibility for what happened in the zoo, the mother, we're all just chalking it up as an accident and everyone goes home. >> the cincinnati zoo is taking responsibility.
>> you said -- >> we're the one -- we're the ones that took the loss on this and very important to us. you can trust me. a lot of people expressed concerns, a lot of people disagree perhaps with it. but it doesn't affect anybody as much as the people here at the zoo. >> how tall is this barrier? >> the people at the zoo -- >> wrongdoing here. you say the barrier's fine. the 4-year-old was just being a 4-year-old. >> that's not exactly what i'm saying. what i'm saying is we had a very, very difficult situation. and we made a very difficult call and handled it. >> do you think fault should lie with anyone, though? >> i'm not here to point fingers about fault. >> is that barrier been the same for the last few years or any changes to it? it's like a rail at the top and then opened with tension wires. >> same barrier of 38 years. >> are you sure -- the other locations like the bear locations, the rhino location, a
similar set-up and loose tension wires and then bushes and a mote. couldn't the same situation happen at those animal enclosures, as well. >> naturally, at the cincinnati zoo, we take safety very seriously and we are all the time keenly interested in continuous improvement and so if you're familiar with the zoo you know as times things need to be
changed and wear out, we add in more fences, guards, safety measurements. we do make sure that those areas are safe. but as i said, you can lock your car and your house and if somebody wants to get in they can. but we take safety very seriously. >> how does that compare with other zoos with similar kind of displays? barrier wall you guys have. >> sure. very similar. very similar. >> and to be clear, there are no vertical steel bars? do i understand that right? horizontal type bar? >> every eight feet or so. every eight feet or so. it is a substantial rail from stainless steel and been there for 38 years. >> vertical bars every eight feet? >> uh-huh. >> not close together? >> correct, correct. >> will you look at upgrading that then so a 4-year-old just being a 4-year-old can't climb over and end up in this situation? >> absolutely. we're in the middle of looking at that right now and the rational as we lost one of the most important animals. so we have to make sure our animals are safe. >> children, as well. this is where parents bring the children to the zoo and should make safe knowing that the kids being a kid isn't able to end up in the situation. i would imagine that's a priority, as well. >> uh-huh. >> what is the industry standard for barriers? are you just like every other
zoo that has this? can this happen anywhere else? >> well, i mean, tragedies, mistakes, accidents can happen all the time. and there's no guaranteeing against those. but all over the zoo we take safety very seriously and we review our barriers very seriously. barriers to keep people out and barriers in and making sure that the fences are high enough to keep them in and barriers high enough to keep people out. >> you mentioned that it's reviewed by someone and reviewed by -- someone keeping the zoo accountable? >> sure. accredited zoos north america are accredited through the aza, the association of zoos and aquariums. every five years we go through a process that's increasingly arduous year by year. in addition, zoos regulated by the usda. twice a year we have veterinary inspections that look at everything from exhibit areas to behind the scenes areas to our care and feeding and medical care of the collection. >> so you said that the exhibit could be open again by next week and reviewing possible changes to keep people safe. will those safeguards or any kind of new safeguards be in place when the exhibit reopens? >> the exhibit will be completely safe when it opens.
i don't know -- i don't know the aens what changes might or might not be. we are reviewing that. naturally, taking this very, very seriously. that is very big loss to the zoo. not just emotional loss. but a loss to a key conservation and breeding program we run. making sure the animals stay safe and the visitors are safe is the priority. >> not sure of changes in place when the exhibit reopens. >> as i said, we're looking at how to do that best. i don't know the answer. >> was there a specific protocol for the d.a.r.t. team? do they practice this specific scenario and if they do, what was the last time did they actually practice? >> sure. that's a good question. very proud of our d.a.r.t. team. dangerous animal response team and security team. they do drills regularly. they train regularly. they go to the shooting range regularly. they're certified by the hamilton county sheriff's department.
and clearly, they're steady at the moment of truth. we'd never had a situation like this at the zoo but they meet and both do physical drills as well as meet to do sort of tabletop discussion drills and did that as recently as last week which was them doing that in response to a similar situation in a zoo of chile with i think predators that were in a -- people in predators of an exhibit. >> is there another incident like this at that exhibit or in the zoo? >> never where we have had to kill an animal. we have had accidents at the zoo. we had a zookeeper lose her arm to a polar bear but not in the exhibit. we have had other people hurt by animals but never in a situation where their life is at risk like this. >> how many times was harambe shot? >> once. >> [ inaudible ] >> there's a future. we have, of course, a renowned assistant reproduction program of crew. the lender center of
reproductive. they have viable sperm and important to bank on endangered species for genetic reasons. we have been contacted by a number of scientists working on genetic issues and other issues with lowland gorillas and so most of that is in the function of storing tissue for potential future both research as well as possible breeding purposes. >> the boy if n there -- >> the sperm was saved? >> some of it. not the end of the gene pool and in addition he is -- he and his lineage are part of an ongoing breeding pool. gladys that's in our exhibit also came from the zoo in brownsville, texas.
she is his half sister. >> you praised the way the response was handled but the boy was in there for ten minutes. could they have reacted quicker? >> i think we reacted remarkably quickly. and we were remarkably fortunate that the boy wasn't hurt. >> how tall is the barrier and how many feet of bushes before the dropoff? >> the barrier is a little over three feet high and the distance between the barrier and the -- if you will the drop zone is about four feet deep. >> and then 15-foot drop to the water? >> correct. >> trying to balance the safety of the patrons versus their ability to access and see the animals, is there a takeaway? is there a message of parents and people taking kids to the zoo moving forward? >> sure. very fortunately, this zoo is a longstanding beloved institution
in cincinnati and i think people recognize we care about our mans. i'm walking on the grounds in the last days and many, many people talk about this is hard and sorry about harambe and care about him. in terms of a message that, yeah, everybody should keep a hold of their kids, keep an eye on them. here or anywhere. the shopping mall rg right? schoolyard. but the zoo is a safe place. this is the one time this sort of thing has happened in 143 years. >> what do you think about the backlash you and the mother received over the last few days? >> i'm old enough i don't pay much attention to social media and most of the legitimate media, all been pretty positive and the colleagues particularly so. >> were there cameras in the enclosure or the complex area? >> do you remember like caught the -- no. >> does the zoo have cameras? most facilities have them to watch the animals overnight or an issue. do you have any surveillance cameras in the gorilla exhibit? >> i don't believe we do. i haven't seen that kind of
video you are talking about. we have a lot of sort of closed circuit video where we aren't like the back of buildings to obvious buildings when we're not here. >> do you have statistics of children coming the zoo every year? >> well, if it's half the visitors, 800,000 but maybe more than half. some families come with one parent and three kids so a million? million kids a year, probably. >> you're the expert. >> that would be my guess. >> some say it looked like the gorilla protecting it. what was the gorilla doing? was he treating this boy like a baby gorilla? >> the gorilla was clearly agitated, clearly disoeshted. and so, the idea of waiting and shooting wit a hypodermic was not a good idea. that would have created alarm in the male gorilla and as i'm sure you know when you dart an animal or you yourself go to the
hospital, anesthetic works in a minute to ten minutes. so the risk was due to the power of that animal. >> but was he trying to protect the child in your eyes as someone that studies gorillas? >> in my eyes he was acting erratically. he was disoriented. and it's due to his strength. that's what the danger was. >> is there a monetary value that the zoo takes a hit on? >> that's a good question. today we live where eng dangered species aren't bought and sold. breeding cheetahs and send them off, it's a breeding agreement and the same thing is true with gorillas. they're not an animal to say, okay, well, they're a million dollars to get one. it's a process like a dating game, dealing with other zoos, trading back and forth. >> is there any legislation that you guys are potentially scared
to face with the death of the animal? are there statutes in place in the act that protect zoos in situations like this from any national or federal litigation? >> no. i think we are good in that regard. as you run a zoo with wild animals, you have to have a number of priorities and certainly one of them is safety of our visitors, employees. as well as safety of our animals. >> are you favor of increasing sign and to -- the children and parents about the barriers -- >> okay. we lost the signal and listening -- we are going back? let's go back to the cincinnati zoo. >> changes will be made. >> well, you know, we have a lot of signs at the zoo about don't feed the animals or don't cross the barriers or wild animals are
dangerous. we can look at that and put a couple more up. the thing would be respect the animals. that's what we're trying to do is to not have people, throwing food in there or climbing in there, in one way or another harming our animals or causing the death of our animals to. >> to clarify, is the body still here physically? >> yes. >> are you having any sort of memorial service of the staff or anything like that and remembrance of him? >> i don't think we have a formal memorial service planned. a step of that today was the full zoo staff coming together just to share our thoughts and memories of him and talk about it and cry a little bit. >> you said that your main concern was his strength and in the beginning you spoke a little bit about him crushing a coconut with the hand. can you give us any other examples of just the power of this gorilla? >> well, he was over 420 pounds.
so that's bigger than anybody on the cincinnati bengals, as an example. his arms, i'm sure you're familiar with gorillas. most primates have a big upper body and small lower body unlike huks. his arms are as big as our legs. very big, very strong appendages. the difference is a huge hand that's extremely strong. and that's where his strength comes from. his chest, arms. and that was the risk. >> what is the reaction from all of the other zoos in did i hear right, more than 1,000 zoo officials talked? what is their reaction? >> they are obviously sympathetic and emphathetic. they know how many people in zoos love their animals and know it's difficult with a lowland gorilla because gorillas are a beloved species. it is true.
we know his name. we don't every zebra's name but we know the gorilla's names and so they know that we're going through a lot. they offered their support. >> what do you think it says that they're all backing you up? >> they're professionals who understand the animal business. they understand the power of gorillas. they understand tough decisions have to be made. >> have you been in contact with the -- >> i have not personally but our primate curator with a relationship with their folks have. >> is there any concern that this will affect viz its in the future? >> no. you know, i think the opposite. people will show how much they care about animals. people that work at zoos love animals and people innately love animals and this is a town that loves the zoo and the gorillas. i think folks will be here to see them. >> when will the exhibit open again? >> this weekend is the hope.
>> two more questions. >> you might have seen this. i don't know if it's on the press but a charming thing, people have -- some bringing flowers and notes. mostly put them around a gorilla statue at the entrance to the gorilla center and with kind notes and a sweet thing. >> it will open saturday? >> that's our goal. yeah. yeah. >> any legal ramifications in the future for either the zoo or these people? do you know? >> i don't know. but i hope not. >> what do you think about -- >> what do you think -- >> -- like an investigation, how you're looking into this? is that just the zoo itself? usda or someone to check off on that when you're done with it? >> sure. as i mentioned, zoos are regulated by the usda and they'll take a look at the situation. they're charged with, you know, reinforcing the animal welfare act and the endangered species
act and make sure that we're checking off the boxes as we do it and naturally in our case we're looking at this area and other areas around the zoo to make sure that the barriers are just right. >> what do you think about the law? i don't know if you've seen it and keep parents or someone when's not paying attention accountable if an animal critically endangered is shot. what is your take on that? >> yeah. i'm not familiar with it. i heard there's some petitions or something. that all sounds very complicated and i don't know the answer to it. >> you mentioned jane goodall. could you tell us what came out of that exchange? >> she sent her sympathy. she sent her sympathy. >> last question. >> can you expand on what you were talking about? you said you'll look at safety in other areas of the zoo. is there an i have a safety audit coming up here? >> well, as i said, and i think folks maybe even the other day heard me say, a park over 1.6
million people a year, you have over 10,000 kids spend a night in the zoo in the dark, you take safety very seriously and review safety regularly. we have a safety and security team and we have a system through both the facilities program and the keepers out on the grounds. to review areas regularly. look at them seeing what needs to be improved or repaired and an ongoing process. and we'll make sure it's tight. >> we need your name. >> thane maynard, i'm director of the cincinnati zoo and botanical gardens. >> thanks, guys. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> thanks. >> all right. you've been listening for a half hour here, the director of the cincinnati zoo, where this just terrible thing happened over the weekend in which the little 3-year-old boy climbed over some barriers. apparently barriers had been exactly how they had been for 38
years at the zoo. you know, through some bushes and somehow fell down into the mote 15 feet down and that's when ultimately the 450-pound endangered silverback gorilla grabbed the child the zoo made the tough call to shoot it and they did. he said mega, mega loss for the zoo and just so glad that the little boy is okay. we should have a bigger discussion and i have ron mcgill with me, communications director of miami zoo which is home to harambe's 50-year-old grandmother. danny sevalis is here with me and jessica schneider and what we haven't seen on the video. ron, let's begin with you. i was taking note of the language when they described this child in the mote, you know, and it was essentially an all hands on deck situation. the female gorillas quickly went awe and the male was excited and
so the words as far as behavior, he described displaced aggression, acting erratically and that then led them to not tranquilize the animal and shot him. is that how -- do you read the situation similarly? would you have made the same call? >> absolutely same call. that gorilla was disoriented. he was agitated. contrary to what the female's going in, the male's instinct is protecting the troupe to find out what's going on. you saw how he brought the child into the corner. i don't think that gorilla had an intention of hurting the child but he was frightened, agitated. his strength is unbelievable. you can watch the way he whipped the child through the water like a ragdoll. a right whipping and hit the child against the congresswoman yeet and over in a second. that situation was escalating. the people were screaming. the gorilla more disoriented.
needed to be a quick decision. i have been in situations where we tranquilize gorillas and as soon as that dart hits the gorilla, like a dart hit you. you would go ow and they don't know what it is and they have displaced aggression and all of a sudden whatever is closest to them they think is the reason they felt that dart. that child could have been in more severe danger trying the dart and the fact is it would have taken minutes to take effect and probably longer and would have taken drugs longer to take effect. >> when you saw all of this, and fortunately, we have a little bit of a window of what happened, right in what i want to see is how the heck this child ended up at the top of the barrier through the brush and the mote. we don't have that. the zookeeper saying haven't you seen a 3 or 4-year-old? anyone's capable of seeing this. seeing this little boy, at first it looks harambe is being gentle and other videos around the world and gorillas almost as if
it would be their own taking, taking the child in and then suddenly, you see this. >> right. and the different situation is this. one was in chicago and the child fell in and was unconscious. this female got to the child and had been a child and child was not screaming, didn't have the tons of people screaming so close to the gorilla and different situation. this female had an instinct to hold that child, bring it to the zookeeper. i guarantee you if that child was screaming and flailing it was different. had the public screaming and raising the you kruckus it's a different situation. a female of a mother to a father who's never been a father. >> that's what that zoo director was saying. you hear the screams and the gorilla was excited over it. danny, let's bring you in because you can hear all of the different reporters asking the questions, peppering this, you know, director who's clearly in mourning over the loss of this
beautiful animal. you know, as far as if anyone's pointing fingers, so far, by the way, no one is suing anyone although this just happened a couple of days ago. how do you read it from a legal perspective and negligence? >> there are many legal issues here when it comes to dealing with exotic animals. under the law, nothing like the law of pets or something. you can imagine these are endangered species and even the endangered species act allows for self defense. if someone is endangered, they have principles of self defense when they kill a critically endangered species. another this ing to think about, too, federal law or more appropriately federal regulations require certain things with non-human pry mats facilities and essentially be kept away from other animals and we would presume other humans
getting in. what kind of protection did this gorilla have from humanity? not so much what protection humans had from the gorilla and how well was it protected by the zoo from humans? >> as for the little boy, jessica schneider is with us, correspondent in cincinnati. let's bring you in. i wanted the find out how this little boy, the 3-year-old, we heard the zoo director say he wasn't going to be injured he was injured and dragged along the concrete. how's the clild? also, how did this happen? where were the parents? where was the mother for this little child to slip away? >> reporter: so a lot of issues here, brooke. we haven't heard from the family except for a statement saying that the child is safe and that they're grateful to the zoo. but what we did hear in that sid owe tape and heard from witnesses out here on saturday afternoon, the mother was talking with that 3-year-old boy and witnesses say that the boy said to the mother, mommy, mommy, i want to go in the water. she said, no, no.
you can't do that and between that conversation and maybe minutes later, when that boy was 15 feet down in the mote he got in there. now, the parents haven't commented about how this happened. but zoo officials put it this way. they said that somehow that boy got underneath or over the barrier and made it through the protective wiring an through the bushes and climbed up on the mote wall and then dropped more than ten feet down into the mote below and that's when the visitors heard the splashing and hear the screams on the video and that's when the action began to unfold. it was ten tense minutes until the dangerous animal response team came in and decided that their only option was to shoot and kill that gorilla. brooke? >> ending with this gorilla. ron, on my bucket list to go to uganda and see these creatures in their own habitat and how rare, how endangered, how special as we know he was 17, a couple of years away from, you
know, breeding, just talk to me about the significance of this animal. >> it's a huge loss. people talk about the loss of the cincinnati zoo's part of the family, a loss to all of us working with conservation and the magnificent an ma ls. i have been to uganda and rwanda. it is an amazing experience. they're gentle giants a. horrific situation, accident that ended tragically and hopefully people learn from it and understand and how magnificent they are and how much attention to pay to them. >> ron, thank you. thank you very much. >> thank you. >> danny, thank you. jessica, thank you, as well. let's move away from cincinnati now and i can tell you that just into us at cnn is one prominent conservative teases that a spoiler candidate to be announced soon. there's a new cnn reporting on one republican lawmaker considered a third party run against donald trump. hear who that is, coming up next. that's why you drink ensure. with 9 grams of protein and 26 vitamins and minerals.
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welcome back. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. on this special memorial day monday, hillary clinton, she walked in her hometown's memorial day parade. her husband former president bill clinton joined her for the event at chappaqua, new york. bernie sanders in california and as a november election draws near, there's word another name could be on the ballot. take a look at this tweet from editor of conservative publication "the weekly standard" bill kristol. he tweeted and got everyone over this. just a heads up over this holiday week.
there will be an independent candidate, an impressive one with a strong team and a real chance. within hours of that, donald trump went on the counter attack calling kristol a quote dummie and embarrassed loser. with that, let's did to cnn national political reporter maeve reston and david chalian. my goodness, who in the world could this be? if it's anyone, david chalian, let me ask you first on bill kristol's response to this and will be a challenge, by the way. almost in june. and then i'll ask you about adam kissinger. >> right. so bill kristol tells our dana bash nothing is eminent. that sounds to me like we get through the holiday weekend without a person coming to fruition just yet, brooke. but also a point here is that what bill kristol represents here is there is clearly still a sect inside the republican party that firmly believes trump is more dangerous to their cause
than not, and so, i think what you see are people unwilling to rally around him and yet they have not been able to emerge with a vehicle in a way that can actually harness the sort of never trump energy, whatever of it may still exist, inside the party. and to me, that's been their biggest problem. it's one thing to have a bunch of strategists saying, hey, i think donald trump may harm the republican party. if you look i length rally at the fall or doesn't believe in the policies and that we shouldn't have him be the conservative standard bearer. it's another thing if somebody steps forward with a real credible opportunity to do what is a very significant, significantly difficult task of getting on every ballot and actually being competitive in a national election. to me those are two different things. >> if it's not eminent and could be someone, some time from the romney folks and quote da in's reporting the source. no, no, no. no, no, no, no, i promise you no.
that's from the team romney. senator ben sass who's been, you know, folks have been trying to recruit him. still a no. what about republican congressman adam kissinger? >> this is a young republican congressman from illinois, somebody familiar with his thinking told dana bash that he would have considered it and believes literally this person said to save the union. he would have done this. because he's so scared of both clinton and trump. and yet, even with that as his thinking, he thinks that it's loilo i gistically not feasible and rejected the idea and shows you how difficult it is going to be for the never trump forces to actually find someone. >> yeah. okay. so still not a yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes from anyone moving ahead. maeve, what about you and california? i know hillary clinton added a
couple more campaign stops in california thursday through monday and bernie sanders has been there sort of nonstop since last week and seen, you know, the polls showing last week she's in a tighter race with him in california. what do you make of that? having gone to both of their events last week clearly bernie sanders his last big push to make an impact and try to win this thing. he talked about it over the weekend as being the big enkyi will data and what is striking is just how much energy there is still is at his rallies. certainly with diverse young crowds coming out, for example, to see him in river side last week. he's going all the way. i will say at the same time it feels like now that hillary clinton is just solely focussed on donald trump that she is starting to hit her stride a little bit more not with the e-mails so much but in terms of her messaging and effect
connecting with the crowd and electrifying them. you saw that more last week. that's going to be an interesting dynamic going into the final weekend where she's going to make a huge push. >> thank you so much. i want to get to this here as we're talking, thank you, on memorial day. you know, it's a day to acknowledge the incredible men and women who put their lives in danger to protect each and every one of us. when you meet as many veterans as i've had the privilege to meet, you come to realize what they accomplish when they return from service can be just as amazing. today i'm in awe of the staff sergeant charlie lindvale. he became the first combat amputee to do so. a feat he could not have done without the founder of the hero's project. this is a group former hells angel and thrill seeker started to help our men and women in
uniform take on the world's tallest mountains. i talked to both of them awhile ago. you have to hear their story. >> sergeant and tim, it is awesome to talk to both of you. congratulations! yes, thank you. >> amazing and, you know, obviously especially on this memorial day, sergeant, thank you so much for your service and your time, but, i mean, seriously everest. has it hit you that you reached the tallest peak in all the world? >> no, it hand. that's one of the questions everybody asks. besides my body being deteriorated and ready to go home to have some drinks.
>> i just did kilimanjaro which amounts nothing to you did. a few days after trying to climb stair was a challenge. take me to that moment, as we would say in the south, your come to jesus moment. the moment when, you know, you were thinking should i, could i, can i when you were on that mountain? the moment for me is can i do this? i hit the second step which is a tall vertical rock face and i remember getting to the base and being like oh, man. i have to go up this thing? are you kidding me. it was a pretty scary moment. i got to the top of that and had a good confidence. my body was peopfeeling good. >> what did it feel like? >> you come up this steep rock base, it's like a mile drop off down the side and you ground up and i remember seeing the top
and seeing -- that's it. i'm there. there was exhaustion, excitement, an culmination of emotions going on for three years. i got to the top and let out a yell, as much as you can at 29,000. >> i'm imagine the air is a tad thin. tim, we have to continue meeting like this. i love this. and, you know, for you, you, you know, you summited everest a number of years ago. you know what it takes. when did you meet sergeant linville and what point did you say you and everest needs to happen? >> that's an easy one. first, i need to want to interview for a second and just thank you for continuing to recognize what we're doing for these veterans and from kilimanjaro with julian torres,
who is missing both his legs, post injury, and now with charlie. to have you, you know, ringing the phone and say we want to have you back on our show. it's media outlets like you guys that are recognizing what we're doing for these veterans and doing media is, obviously, it's nice because it allows us to reach more than just one guy. that's what it's truly about. specifically on this day, memorial day, in light of the guys who didn't make it back. and he's still here and a lot of these guys are still here, but they're recovering from their wounds in the war, and it takes people like you and news outlets like cnn to recognize that. >> i appreciate the love. i'm throwing the love right back at y'all in bangkok today. please, tell me the back story. how the heck did this happen? >> well, you know, charlie you're asking how did i know he was the guy? it's simple, actually. all the military branchs and
charlie elected to go into the marine corps. and after boot camp he decides he wants to be a bomb disposal technician, one of the most dangerous jobs in the marine corps.. and he gets back. he gets blown up and he comes back and he's missing his leg and completely thrashed. the doctors tried 13 sergeants to repair it and finally charlie walks into the doctor's office and tells them i want you to take the leg off. i'm done with it. it's too much pain. i don't want to deal with it. and so marine corps. bomb specialist, and tells a doctor to amputate my foot. that's the kind of decisions in life that it takes to get up the summit of everest and get back. it was a real easy decision. it was like a rock fell out of the sky and hit me in the head. that's quite for everest. the handful of people who have summited everest and made it back alive have made those
decisions in life. at some point it's no longer physical, it's here and here and that's why the hero's project and myself chose this guy. >> so much of it is here and so much is here. two questions and i've got to let you go. charlie, why did you say yes? [ laughter ] >> ah, at the time i said yes because i was making decisions to have my leg amputated and i knew i was going to need something more than just doing physical therapy and, you know, just going to the gym. i needed something that was totally going to push my body to the limit. not just your body but my war torn body. what was i going to do with what i was left with? to me i needed a challenge. there's no greater challenge why, in my mind, than mount everest. i had the opportunity to climb everest. so i took it and never looked back. it's been an incredible journey
and figuring out how to use my prosthesis in the mountains and how far i can push the body i'm left with. >> by the way, it's time to go home. one more voice i wanted to bring in on a special memorial day cathy robinson president of blue star families received chief of staff army medal. cathy, i told you we would talk on memorial day. so nice to see you again. we met the other weekend. quickly, when we met how many times has your family moved? >> eight times in 15 years. it meant ten schools for my tenth grader. >> my goodness. and blue star families. why do you do it? tell me about it? >> blue star families was started six years ago bay group of military spouses. we wanted to tell the story of what we do so we can make military families stronger and connect americans to us. we have grown in the six years
to be 1.5 million military family members we work with. i think there's a real need and we found it and with help with good neighbors such as yourself, wuf been able to do great things to help our military. >> in the final 40 seconds. so much attention on our men and women in uniform, but it's about the families, too. so many of them, you know, back here at home missing their loved ones. what is your message to them on this day? >> our message is that we military families know we love the work we do and we're happy to make the sacrifices that make the country safer. the sacrifices we make aren't necessary. we work to identify them and work with our partners to fix those problems. if it takes a village to raise a child, it takes a nation to support a military. we need our good neighbors. we ask everyone to join us. >> blue star families. honor to meet you and everyone else the other weekend. i appreciate your voice.
>> thank you so much. >> thank you so much. >> thank you. thank you for being with me on this memorial day. i'm brooke baldwin. we'll take you to washington next "the lead" starts right now. thank you, brooke. as the gop found a new hope? "the lead" starts right now. can't beat them, can't join them. a leading conservative finally found the candidate that might stump trump. could cost the gop the election. the bloodiest battle of the iraq war. on this memorial day, a dozen years later, the u.s. and its allies are trying to rip the city of fa lou ja away from isis to take back what so many americans died for. plus, blame the primates or parents? shock and outrage of the heart-stopping video of a gorilla dragging