tv CNN Newsroom With Brooke Baldwin CNN June 20, 2016 11:00am-1:01pm PDT
>> reince is raising money. the party is raising money. mr. trump is raising money. >> not making it iz for them. >> that's not true at all. he had meetings with all kinds of people to be part of the campaign and we put a plan in place with the rnc to have the resources necessary and mr. trump could be raising the money for the campaign but he wants to make sure that the party has the resources and the boots on the ground and the data programs and the build-out so they can be successful. the difference was four years ago romney has his whole team of fund raising and bundlers and going into the states, two very separate groups of people there. romney people and rnc people. we're completely integrated. it is a different model and much more efficient than four years ago. >> okay. so you're telling me that at the end of the day we'll see fund raising better than it seems to be now and the infrastructure better, before i go to the question to ask, i want to ask about infrastructure because i had reporting that the campaign had 70 people. other reporting said as low as
30. that's nothing. and i know you're saying it's a different world. donald trump is different. again, i just come back to the fact that this is not a primary campaign. you need to reach hundreds of millions of people, not a small slice of the electorate. >> 732 people on the clinton payroll and trump with 70 people on the payroll. we had more votes, almost 14 million votes in the primary than any other republican primary. >> this is not a primary campai campaign. >> i understand. her salaries covered have to be 10x what our salaries are. what they're doing is taking money and spending it on things. we are leaner, meaner, more efficient, effective. get bigger crowds. get better coverage. very important to understand that mr. trump can go directly to the people and that's not what hillary has to do. they're going to waste millions of dollars on paid advertising which consultants and others make a fortune on and that's not the trump model. >> your philosophy is that you should continue to stay lean and mean. >> you have to grow but you have
to grow smart and strategic and efficient. if this was the business world, people would be commending mr. trump for the way he's run the campaign on $50 million beat candidates of spending three times that and hillary's bernie's case four and five times that. they think money equates to votes and proven time and time again the money spent doesn't equate to the votes you get. >> you're painting a nice picture of the trump campaign and state of play. if it's that way, why wouldn't you be the campaign manager? >> i'm proud of the campaign and understand the reality of building an infrastructure, coupled with the rnc's 500 people on the ground and all the resources -- >> why couldn't you be the person to do it? >> i don't know the answer to that. but what i know -- >> what do you think? >> i know i've had a privilege and an honor of being part of this 18, 19 months and i have no regrets and i'm so thankful for this chance and i know that what i will do moving forward is
share my advice of what i know with mr. trump and the team if they want it. i'll still chair the new hampshire delegation to the rnc convention next month and me and every person i know will continue to vote for and support donald trump. >> such a good soldier and you're loyalty here is exactly why, one of the main reasons he kept you on for so long. >> it's not just loyalty. >> and belief in him. i get that. i guess my question is, somebody tuning in to watch this might be thinking that, you know, on another planet because you're making it seem like everything was really great an i get that that's your, you know, your instinct because you've been so loyal to him but it just doesn't make sense in a logical way if things are that great why you are not still at trump tower. >> the campaign is moving in the right direction. that's the most important thing. building out the campaign is something that's very important to do. and i can tell you, again, i'll give any advice i can to the
campaign but at the end of the day voters will have to make a choice. they'll choose hillary clinton or choose donald trump. >> two more questions. >> they have to choose trump to save our country. >> we were talking about structure and you were also in charge of communications. when mr. trump said, this is the speech to give after orlando, and it was doubling down on the muslim ban and delivering a speech that was by republicans almost universally thought what was that? how involved were you and were you encouraging him to do that? >> i don't think that's true and what he is said and given credit for, stepping up and making a speech immediately after the terrorist attack and calling it what it was which is radical islamic terrorism and you know what? >> that's not what i'm talking about. talking about the policy prescription. >> i understand. look. >> but did you encourage him to do that? did you say this is right on? >> we have a problem in the country. >> not going to answer my question. >> we have a problem and he's going to point it out, political
correctness, a problem. not turning people in because they're afraid of being profiling. we saw this in san bernardino and the attacks and neighbors knew they were making bombs in the home and refused to turn them because they were afraid to be called racial profiling. we have to get away from this, save our country and our country and if that means turning somebody in -- >> policy an rhetorical response to orlando was right? if you were to rewind and you had a time machine and do it all over again, would you do it the same way? >> the immigration policies are a us aster. we can't vet people coming into this country. syrian refugees or any other country, a simple background check. the san bernardino killer came in on a k-1 visa. married to an american citizen and the state department said we can't look at the facebook and social media accounts to determine jihad terrorists in you. there's something wrong with our government that can't do that to protect our own citizens and we need a better system in place and what donald trump has said is he'll fix that system on day
one of him becoming the next president of the united states. >> can you take me behind the scenes on the comments of the judge in did you say to him, you know what? mr. trump, you might not want to go that far and say those things about something that is so explosive or did you say, right on? >> no, no. it's not a binary decision. you have a judge in san diego who's ruled against him on summary judgment, and the case should have been dismissed on. the lead plaintiff got out and continued the case an time and time and time again and over 10,000 people with evaluations saying that this is a great institution, he went out and found scholars from the best institutions to put the courses together. >> sounds like you said right on. >> and the judge refuses to make rulings which are fair and equitable. the fairness of this, calling that into question. when you have the lead plaintiff asked to be removed from the case, over 10,000 respondents,
98% of the people that took the courses responded favorably in video or written evaluation or both and some plaintiffs in this case, right, what these people want is to go after mr. trump seeing deep pockets and the judge should have ruled on -- he's calling into question the ability for a fair and honest assessment of the evidence presented to them and i think that's okay to do. >> so you were -- did anybody come out and say, you know what? did anybody have a conversation as part of a campaign meeting or anything of that sort saying, you know what? this is something to pull back on and you said, no, no. right on, go for it? >> wasn't a conversation like that. everyone has an opportunity to weigh in on issues and could be what we like to call surround sound advocacy. end of the day. >> i'm trying to get some specifics about, you know, kind of the -- one of the raps on you is that you fed his worst
instincts. >> look. i think if that's the rap they want to tell me or put on me, i think what's fair to say is anybody who knows me and known me over a long period of time knows i'm a very straight shooter. much to my own detriment on many occasions. i tell it the way it is. i'm not smart enough to lie and can't remember the lie i told. i give my best opinion and recommendation. that's an obligation to anybody i work for, mr. trump or a different company. all i can do is give my best advice an counsel. i'll give you my best advice and if it's something you agree with, great. if you disagree, this's okay, too. we have had many conversations with we have either agreed or disagreed but at the end of the day i don't take it personally. i give my best advice. >> what's your biggest regret? >> on this campaign? none professionally. >> none? >> my biggest regret -- >> there's human.
flesh and blood. >> not being able to have my family more involved. they live in new hampshire. i have four young children. it's tough on them because they're 5 and 7 and 9 years old, great ages and want me to be around and that's fun. campaigns are so all-consuming, so time consuming, difficult to go home and explain what your day was like. that's not a regret at all. i have no regrets as it comes to this campaign. i'm given an opportunity and privilege and somebody said to me 18 months ago, you'll be managing the candidate through 37 state victories, 14 million votes, more votes than anyone in the history of the republican party, i would say, is that possible? look what he's been able to achieve an i'm a small part of that. so i have no regrets at all. >> still going to be involved in the head of the new hampshire delegation, leading the new hampshire delegation on the floor of the convention. >> i'll make sure that every delegate is voting for donald
trump and every person will that i know come november. >> thank you for doing this. >> thank you. >> thank you for your time. >> thanks. >> wolf, back to you. >> thanks very much. excellent interview. let's get some analysis. we have gloria borger with us, nia-maleka henderson and ron brown steen. what did you think? >> i think dana asked every question she needed to ask him and like he was in an alternate universe saying he didn't know why he was fired and that the campaign had been going well. and that one thing that did strike me, wolf, asda that tried to point out to him, obviously dysfunction in this campaign, he kept on talking about the people who have been here, quote, from the beginning. right? and it's clear when he kept saying that to me that there was this split between the folks like corey who had been there since day one and newer people like paul manafort brought on
later on in the campaign and didn't talk about being relentlessly on mess and. he was usually supportive of donald trump saying he can run a different kind of campaign because he can go directly to the people. talking about the support he has in congress. even mentioning paul ryan and mitch mcconnell whom as you all know have said they'll support the nominee and, you know, had difficulty with trump. so, stayed on message as if he had not just been fired. >> ron brownstein, dana asked several times, why were you fired? he said, i don't know. clearly he knows why he was fired and didn't want to get into it. >> yeah. first of all, they have to save that tape and play it in journalism school of a respectful but relentless interview. that's right. i think that was a big evasion. but i thought he betrayed the answer with the two themes in the interview and two basic issues argued that the approach that worked in the primary would
work in the general. at one point he said donald trump had the finger on the pulse of the public and the past 15, 16, 18 months in a way that no one else has. that's been true for republican primary electorate if you look at the overall ratings with the broader general election electorate, it is a much more questionable statement and second time making that argument said, look, as gloria pointed out, what we did the lean and mean primary organization directly to the people would be what would work, could work again in a general election and i think in both of the lines of argument of lewandowski he kind of showed i think the limitations and extraordinary loyalty, showed the limitations and kind of a vision that would help explain why a decision like this was made. >> amazing loyalty to donald trump. >> he did. i mean, almost like listening to donald trump. right? he talked about judge curiel in the same way as donald trump did. he talked about the muslim ban and the response to orlando in the same way that donald trump
did. he talked about not needing infrastructure, running a lean and mean. he also argued essentially to win the white house using twitter and facebook. he talked about leading polls in new jersey which isn't true. everything according to corey lewandowski is awesome and going his way and the way that donald trump approached this. nothing has gone wrong. everything is going according to plan and i think in some ways made a case for why he shouldn't be there i mean if he's a mirror up to donald trump then i'm sure donald trump needs someone to tell him different things about how the campaign is going, be a little bit more critical because in this interview, i think he called him the best speaker the country has ever seen and sounds like something donald trump would say about himself. >> say what you will, gloria, about donald trump, fires someone in a visible way, an awkward, embarrassing way and the person fired is totally
loyal. >> it's clear to me from listening to this interview with dana that corey's loyalty is to donald trump. corey's remains loyal to the candidate. i think his problem was with the people who worked for the candidate or the candidate's family quite frankly. who disagreed with his strategy and disagreed with his management style. i mean, another point that dana tried to keep hammering in was his management style. which is abrupt and difficult and i was told this morning, you know, people couldn't get any work done. it was a matter of his work product not getting done. the need to expand the campaign. and he denied all of that. and said, look, i'm tough and i expect a lot. but, you know, he denied every point that dana was making which other people numerous other people have made over the last months about corey and i think with trump there was finally a
trau that broke the camel's back and may have been his daughter and son-in-law. >> major political news. everyone stand by. we have to take a quick break. we have got a lot more analysis coming up of da in's interview with the ousted campaign manager corey lewandowski. what he said about the trump inner circle, the state of the campaign. also the latest on the orlando mass shooter, what those new 911 transcripts are telling us about the motive of the shooter, i'll be back 5:00 p.m. eastern in t "the situation room." cnn will continue with brooke baldwin right after this quick break. hmmmmmm.....
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see car insurance in a whole new light. liberty mutual insurance. hi there, i'm brooke baldwin. my goodness, the interview my colleague dana barb had with the former campaign manager of donald trump's campaign, he is now out. i'm talking about corey lewandows lewandowski. he is ousted, the family members put pressure on him to do something about lewandowski. moments ago, lewandowski was
sitting here for 20 minutes asda that bash asked every question in the book. >> from your perspective, what happened? why were you fired? >> i don't know. i don't know the answer to that but i know we have we have been able to achieve in this campaign cycle is historic. we had a candidate who june in last year announced to run with no elected office experience in a field of 16 and went ch went on to get almost 14 million votes and changed the way people look at politics an i'm proud to have been a small part of that and running as the outsider of this campaign, which he has done, running against the corrupt washington, d.c. establishment and political correctness is something i'm proud to be part of. >> so you think it was appropriate for donald trump to make the change and let you go? >> what i think is that the voters have a binary decision coming up on election day, to
vote for hillary clinton and the liberal policies or put someone in place to change washington and i will do everything i can to make sure that the latter of those two happens which means donald trump is elected president. if i can do that from inside the campaign, it is a prif lenl. outside the campaign is also a privile privilege. >> did mr. trump himself call you this morning and say, i don't mean to use this term but it's the term, you're fired? >> i had a nice conversation and said to him it's been an honor and privilege to be a part of this. i mean that from the bottom of my heart. >> we'll postgame that with dana in a second but amid the concerns of the campaign heading into the general election cycle against hillary clinton and with less than a month to go before the republican national convention kicks off in cleveland so this really sort of isn't done and getting dana in a second and first jason carroll there outside of trump tower. jason carroll, he heard from
corey lewandowski saying i don't know why i was fired. what do you know? >> reporter: that was a fascinating interview. you would think anyone in a position like that would know why they were dismissed, why they were fired so either he's not telling the truth or he clearly just doesn't have a real understanding about his relationship with others within the campaign. i mean, you heard there in the interview he said that he got along with people like ivanka, got along with her husband jared. these were two people clearly instrumental in his removal. people like paul manafort, campaign chairman and worked well with and then clearly did not work so well with some of these people who ended up being instrumental in his removal. also, makes me wonder, you know, saying that he worked well with the campaign, clearly, being the good soldier here. this is a man loyal to donald trump, donald trump has been loyal to him. this is someone who signed on to the campaign very early on. and you remember when he went
through the controversy involving that breitbart reporter, donald trump stood by him and pressure at that point to have him removed even then. donald trump saying i just don't get rid of people. so he stood by him at that point. very different styles is what we see going forward. we are hearing that paul manafort is the one, you know, directing that campaign going forward. his style is one of keeping donald trump disciplined. the word is that corey lewandowski and you heard data pushing him on that over and over, this point of this being the type of person when's basically pushing donald to be more like himself out on the campaign trail. clearly this is something that worked in the primary. not necessarily a strategy working going forward. brooke? >> thank you. she's with me now. who conducted that excellent interview. dana bash. we also have cnn politics reporter mj lee. so, miss bash, i was sitting
just around the corner in my office and watched every second and saying to you, loyal with a capital "l," playing a drinking game and every time i heard corey lewandowski saying i had a privilege to -- i would not be able to walk a straight line to you right now. >> that's correct. as jason touched on, corey lewandowski kept on as campaign manager at a time when every other politician on the planet would have cut him loose, when he was arrested, basically, for going after physically going after a reporter and donald trump refused to do it. and so, the loyalty is going both ways here. i think that's a large part of it. i also think that i was, frankly, a little bit surprised to come on and talk to me. >> as long as he did. >> and stayed as long as he did. it is not in his interest to air
the dirty laundry in public. there's no way in his interest and it is in his interest to talk about what's very real which is a pretty remarkable primary run. that he helped guide. >> lean and mean staff. >> lean and mean staff. many questions that went unanswered were i think the obvious ones now which is why couldn't you make the transition and the pivot of there to the general election? and the very real questions about the fact that his personality, his persona, the way he treated people was kind of almost universally known to be way aggressive and over the top and, you know, the way he described it was, you know, i can't remember the exact words but basically popeye. i am who i am. >> i'm not smart enough to tell a lie is what he said. >> yeah. so that's the case. i did not expect him to come on here and start telling tales and to say terrible things about
donald trump because, "a," that's not who he is and more importantly, just in terms of kind of the raw politics of it for him it wouldn't serve him well because he's so inextricably linked to donald trump, even as and especially as trump fired him. >> let's get to -- so he says he doesn't know why he was fired. he says, you know, it wasn't two security guards this morning, it was a friend. be to you, mj, i know you had reporting on stories apparently he was going to plan plant about ivanka's husband and you asked him about and, you know, we didn't get anywhere on that. tell me more about the why. >> yeah. i think when's been so striking in all of the reporting that i have done and dana and all of our reporters on the cnn politics team is family is important in the ultimate decision to fire corey, meetings and conversations with -- between trump and his children including ivanka trump, trump's
daughter, abo concerns about lewandowski's role in the campaign and the direction he was leading the campaign. i think a lot of republicans have noted that there seems to be a fundamental misread an hon you run a primary campaign. the messages and the rhetoric in a primary campaign is really not the same message that works well in a general campaign. and it seemed as though lewandowski according to many sources we spoke to seemed to be sort of egging trump on to say things that were inflammatory and unacceptable to the party and really interesting, you know, dana tried really hard to push corey on questions about whether he was involved in sort of encouraging trump to use some of the rhetoric an he never once said, no, i did not or i tried to stop trump. >> the speech after orlando.
>> defended and explained why. >> right. >> trump said what he said and presented the policy he did after orlando. and defended and explained why he said about the judge. >> the judge. so if it was really more about the family and we know how crucial behind the scenes ivanka trump is, then there's the whole arc between described initially the paul manafort to handle delegates and went away they had different roles and got along great side by side. to your point and you kept hitting at him is, you know, he kept pointing out a successes and unprecedented turnout that republicans throughout this primary season, why not then, if you have been there from the get would you not want to stick around and fulfill and as he would hope see trump become president? >> right. >> he didn't really have an answer. >> right. i mean, i think it's hard to say especially when it happened just a few hours ago and he didn't know it was going to happen and hard i think to say, okay, this
is why i was let go. >> yeah. >> i think that he was -- it seemed to me just working with him and knowing him over the past year i guess that, i don't know if you thought this, too, but he was trying to express without saying in the words that maybe it is time to move on. now, if somebody would have said to him 12 hours ago, do you think you're up for this? he would have said, absolutely. that would have been any natural instinct. >> of course. >> especially somebody like corey lewandowski. >> do you think we'll see a much different campaign moving forward? >> i think that's the hope from everyone in trump's inner circle. corey did have access to trump. the kind of access that -- >> unprecedented. >> unprecedented. many of the other aides did not have. i think that's sort of crucial to understanding how trump so far has behaved as a candidate. i think take corey lewandowski out of that picture and possible to see a different trump and
anyone in trump's inner circle will tell you trump is his own man. he doesn't always take advice, even from people that he's very close to and this obviously was an exception. even in the fact that trump decided to let go of the campaign manager. >> it was a long time coming. >> right. >> a long time coming to your point. all of our reporting is it was -- the rnc chair reince priebus, it was not just ivanka but the children, the son-in-law and many others, including donors and trying to get at that with corey saying, like, who is this guy and what's happening? i won't give to your campaign if he is acting like this. >> left no stone unturned. dana bash, my hat off to you. great willing to sit with you as long as he did. >> it was. >> so if you want to see the interview, i'm sure go to cnn.com and it will be there. mj lee, thank you, as well. let's pivot to orlando, though, for now. breaking today, the fbi releasing the transcripts of phone calls with that killer in orlando as the mass kerr unfolded.
hear about the police negotiations and what this terrorist threatened. plus, using this attack as an example, donald trump suggests america should use racial profiling. we'll debate both sides ahead. a? be the you who doesn't cover your moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. be the you who shows up in that dress. who hugs a friend. who is done with treatments that don't give you clearer skin. be the you who controls your psoriasis with stelara® just 4 doses a year after 2 starter doses. stelara® may lower your ability to fight infections and may increase your risk of infections and cancer. some serious infections require hospitalization. before treatment, get tested for tuberculosis. before starting stelara® tell your doctor if you think you have an infection or have symptoms such as: fever, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough. always tell your doctor if you have any signs of infection, have had cancer, if you develop any new skin growths or if anyone in your house needs or has recently received a vaccine. alert your doctor of new or worsening problems, including headaches, seizures, confusion and vision problems these may be signs of a rare, potentially fatal brain condition. some serious allergic reactions can occur.
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happened to him. we have victor blackwell on the story from the beginning. he is on the phone in may con, georgia, with the breaking details. victor, when's happened? >> reporter: the headline first, brooke. the department of justice closing the investigation with insufficient evidence to file charges. you will remember he was found dead at the high school in south georgia upside down in a rolled gym mat, january of 2013. investigators then said his death was accidental. the family did not believe that. they believed their son was beaten. they had his body exhumed and pathologists found evidence of blunt force trauma calling it a homicide. department of justice says investigators to establish any federal criminal rights violation would have had to proved beyond a reasonable doubt that not only someone killed him and motivated by racial animus and very high threshold.
they have not met that threshold according to their estimation. kendrick's johnson's parents are meeting with the u.s. attorney here in may con, georgia. the acting u.s. attorney of northern ohio where this case is being led also with other officials here to get the news that they were hoping that they would not get at the end of this. now, what this news release that's just sent out does not say is deanyonetively how kendrick johnson died. in fact, at the end of this statement from the acting usa in northern ohio writes we regret we're unable to provide them with more deanyonetive answers of kendrick's tragic death. no federal criminal charges in this case and no answers after more than three and a half years for johnson's parents about exactly how he died. >> no charges. no answers. victor blackwell, thank you for
staying on it all these years. appreciate you there in georgia. now to orlando and we are now learning the chilling words of a mass killer as he carried out the deadliest shooting massacre in u.s. history in pulse nightclub in orlando. edited conversations of the transcripts of the conversations with operators and then negotiators. 33 minutes into the deadly rampa rampage, the killer had this exchange with the dispatcher. emergency 911, this is sbg recorded. shooter says in the name of god the merciful, the beneficial, in arabic, 911, what? praise be to god and prayers be well upon the prophet of god. i let you know i'm in orlando and i did the shootings. 911 operator says what he is your name? shooter says my name is i pledge allegiance and then omitted.
911 operator continues, what is your name? shooter, i pledge allegiance to blank. may god protect him, still speaking in arabic on behalf of blank. dispatcher, all right. where are you at? shooter in orlando. where in orlando? and then the call ends. investigators don't want to release the actual recordings and chose to redact isis the terror group pledged allegiance to. in a news conference, they did describe the attacker's tone. >> while we're not releasing the audio i can tell you while the killer made the murderous statements, he did so in a chilling, calm and deliberate manner. >> here with me now, former nypd hostage negotiator investigator and mary ellen o'toole, senior profiler.
so, welcome to both of you. wally, turning to you first. reading further in the conversations not just with the 911 operator but with the negotiator, you know all about negotiating, he talks about the suicide vests, like used in france, which they apparently didn't find evidence of. talks about the boston bombers, the anger of u.s. coalition bombing of the islamic state. what struck you the most? >> when he spoke about the bombing that he might have a bomb and might have an explosive device. he also in the conversation was talking about he was going to put four bomb vests on some of the hostages. also, he said his vehicle. that changes everything. one of the first things that changes is changes communications because you can't -- the way to detonate bombs today is radio frequency. press a button like a beeper, a cell phone. police may or may not be on the same frequency and nypd with a bomb scare, we have something of that nature, we have to stay
back at least minimum of 300 feet and no transmissions on your radio. so that would have caused some of the transmissions to stop. >> which, by did way, they didn't stand back. i did a 20 minute interview on thursday with the captain canty and said kudos not hanging back because they knew what was going on and despite protocol they were there by the bathroom with the hostages. >> they sent in a robot and their robot as nypd's has realtime. it talks in realtime and see pictures in realtime. and they saw what was a smoke detector on the ground that looked like a device. so everything changes because if they do have explosives in there, you are in into a much bigger mass casualty incident. >> what did you make of the language used? >> what i found interesting is he was very, very specific about what the message was that he wanted to put out there. i thought it was also very interesting that he also
provided misleading information or false information. and when we would see that kind of thing in the -- >> hold on, the false information, you mean pertaining to the threats of explosives? >> right. the threats he had explosives and explosives in a vehicle, that's almost done to super size his already ominous persona but it also causes investigators often times to go in a wrong direction and to slow down law enforcement's response. which it didn't do in this case but the fact that he was attempting to be really a pup t puppetmast we are the information providing. >> wally, we know calling up channel 13 in orlando talking to allegian cer, pledged allegiance to that terror group. the fact that law enforcement chose to redact pieces of this, i choose not to say his name. i don't want to say his name.
i don't want him to have even more notoriety. >> terrorists, one thing about terrorists, and in this particular situation, it falls right into it, they work on the three "ms." money, manpower and media. he would get -- he is a martyr. he would get people to donate money to his cause. and the fbi did the exact right thing. >> speaker of the house of representatives said it's preposterous. should not be redacted. >> why give him publicity, free publicity? we call this the theater of terror. it happened in munich in the olympics. the theater of terror is taking the hostages and had the hostages and the hostage takers, those were the stars. the military were the co-stars and the media they were over 3,000 media there. the producers and directors that directed this theater of terror. you don't want that word out and show throughout the world what he wants to say. >> do you think the fbi's doing
the right thing redacting and not playing that audio. >> i did. but there are two sides to it. even from my perspective, it is very hard to give an opinion because it's based on just what was relayed. and it's also difficult because the statement that is this person made are self reported and akind of assessment you have to be careful about but i think for me what was really stunning is not there and there's no empathy, so remorse or swearing. there's no yelling and ranting and raving from what we know what's released so far and goes to the state of mind and the personality and just how cold and callus that this person is. >> so cold to do that. mary ellen, thank you for your perspective. wally, thank you, as well. i appreciate it. >> thank you. next, in the aftermath of orlando, the politics here. donald trump says the u.s. should consider more racial
profiling as a tool for law enforcement. we'll talk to a former special agent from the dea, for his take. also ahead, more on the breaking news of donald trump fired the campaign manager earlier today. corey lewandowski talked live here on cnn. you will hear his interview coming up. sara, i love you, and... [phone rings] ah, it's my brother. keep going... sara, will you marry... [phone rings again] what do you want, todd???? [crowd cheering] keep it going!!!! if you sit on your phone, you butt-dial people. it's what you do. todd! if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. it's what you do. i know we just met like, two months ago... yes! [crowd cheering] [crowd cheering over phone]
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>> i think profiling is something we have to start thinking about as a country and other countries do it. and you look at israel and you look at others and they do it. and they do it successfully. and, you know, i hate the concept of profiling. but we have to start using common sense, and we have to use -- you know, we have to use our heads. >> with me now, the author of "rebuild the dream" cnn political commentator van jones, once a policy adviser to president obama and david katz, once a senior special agent in the dea and a federally certified firearms and tactical instructor. gentlemen, welcome. and david, let me just begin with you from a law enforcement perspective. you said racial profiling is an effective law enforcement tool and people misunderstand it. but let's just focus for the sake of this segment specifically on donald trump's words. you know, in a very general statement, saying the u.s. should consider thinking about profiling muslims.
any muslim. whatever the situation. would you agree with that? >> no. and what he's doing is he's playing into the hands of people who label that practice racial profiling. look. it's -- what you have to consider is every aspect to an investigation. for example, when i was dea agent, someone giving me information of a major cocaine trafficker and details and said he was a colombian national or she was a colombian national is, a, no importance or, b, important because colombia because source country for cocaine? nothing to do with the dna of that person but the proximity or availability to cocaine. those facts may be important. to say we'll racially profile, that evokes pulling over african-americans just because they're driving a car while black. that's rejected and no one, no one is tacking about doing that. but to say that in no uncertain terms a person's ideology or country of origin or beliefs or practices, to say they're never
important and can never be considered, that's always wrong. ivan, what do you think? >> he has to frame the argument better. >> what do you think? >> i think it's interesting to talk about racially profiling in the context of mass shootings. the vast majority of people doing the mass shootings in america -- >> young, white men. >> exactly. young white men. turns out that even the people ideologically motivated, seven times more likely to be killed by a right wing extremist, a racist or an anti-government nutjob, seven times more likely to be killed by that person -- >> is that ideology important to your consideration? yes, it is. >> well, sure, sure. i'm just saying before we even just go down the road of racially profile muslims or not, if i came on tv and said let's start racially profiling white men, young white men loners with bowl hair cuts, people think
that's a pretty unfortunate conclusion for you to come to, certainly a better way to move forward and important to recognize we now have so much associated the religion of islam with shooting. if a christian shoots somebody, we don't say a christian shot them. if it's a muslim, we say a muslim shot them. >> even in support of the faith, in support of isis, my ideology? that doesn't make any sense. >> that's -- >> no. there are many -- >> you are correct. sir, you're correct. if someone is saying they're a part of an organization, a white person says i'm part of the ku klux klan, a muslim says i'm a part of isis, it's a different world. >> how about if i was a member of david hale's church? that's something to consider? yes, you would, wouldn't you? same thing. >> sure, sure. listen. you and i are probably in violent agreement here. >> making the same point. >> hold on. hone
honestly, this is fascinating but use a concrete example. we know that the gunman went to the gun store, wanted body armor. you know? they did call the fbi because apparently and i read part of the transcript and saying he was speaking a language and wasn't german or spanish and the behavior was mentioned, of perhaps middle eastern descent and the fbi was called because they were suspicious. david katz, to you, is that important from a law enforcement perspective? >> i don't understand why we're having this discussion. you have suspicious behavior and a demographic. look. take the 9/11 hijackers as one example. were any of them, any of the 19 anything other than a muslim male between 18 and 40? no. so we have an issue and are there other terrorists and mass shooters? of course. and whether they're ideologically motivated or they're some -- something unique about the background that might be important you consider
everything. >> to van's point, since many are also young white men, would you then -- >> most are psychologically disturbed and another discussion to have and he's correct. >> you would protime shethem, a well. >> it's not a profiling all white men and active shooters some point. no. you look for difference. you're not profiling all muslims but somebody that says i am a muslim and believe in this jihadi theology or i attend a mosque. >> that person -- >> go ahead, van. >> sorry. >> listen. i actually agree with you 100%. >> yeah. >> if someone by their conduct, declaring with a voice and words and who they're associating with puts them a category of suspicion, that's fine.
hearing racial profiling, they're reacting to an idea of putting somebody in a category just because they're muslim. >> that's why i think -- yeah. that's why donald trump is making a mistake. why go there? >> yeah. >> makes no sense. >> okay. >> like any -- every other country in the world looks at the whole picture. you can't say that here because you will offend somebody. part of the case you say it. it makes no sense not to. >> you both agree on what donald trump said and having the conversation because this is a man who wants to be the next president of the united states and a lot of americans i think, you know, they agree with him and important to hear both perspective. thank you both. van jones, david katz on this notion of profiling. >> very welcome. >> thank you. more on the breakinging news here. donald trump talking about and firing his controversial campaign manager corey lewandowski. corey talked to us here live on cnn with dana bash moments ago. we'll replay pieces of that interview coming up.
all right. 52 years. that is how long it's been since the city of cleveland celebrated a professional sports championship. that streak is over. lebron james and the teammates just landed in cleveland with a championship trophy. there they are. a massive crowd there to help welcome home the champions. cavs won game seven against the golden state warriors. lebron was named the most valuable player. there's the entire finals even president obama got caught up in the excitement. he's a hoops fan and apparently stayed on air force one an extra half hour to catch the game of the game. go straight to cleveland. joining us is die-hard cavs fan jason herron. nice shirt and have you lost
your voice? >> yes. i sound like everybody else in northeast ohio. none of us have voices, up all night celebrating. fan nastic night in the city. >> jason, you famously burned that lebron jersey when he dared leave you all for, you know, the beautiful miami, florida, in 2010. a, have you forgiven him? b, have you forgiven yourself? >> yes we forgave him immediately when he returned and, b, yes. we've all apologized. lebron apologized. dan gilbert apologized for the letter he wrote and all back together and we won a championship. i mean, it's incredible. last night, just being downtown and i probably high fived half a million of my closest friends. it was one of the scenes and didn't matter your age or race. everyone's hugging and high fiving. fantastic. and we're no longer the mistake by the lake. we are believe-land. >> you know, i was looking back and the last time, you know, it was the browns winning the super bowl last time you guys had the
big win. lyndon johnson was president and beatles invaded america. you know, i know you were in the party in the streets last night. we are looking at some of your pictures. tell me what that was like. >> it was -- i mean, we have been waiting for this our whole lives. when the final buzzer sounded, you heard a joyous eruption of half a million people celebrating. i saw grown people crying in the streets. i mean, i -- this is the first time i haven't cried in 24 hours. everyone was just embracing and hugging and it was just so awesome to see the entire city celebrate together and wait 52 years for this and the parade is wednesday and that's another day we have been waiting for a long time for and another fantastic day in the city. it is a great day to be a clevelander. >> can i ask you your thoughts on steph curry? i mean, the guy is extraordinarily talented. when he threw the mouthpiece, what did you think? >> i was there on a season ticket hoemder.
it was great. you know, the reason we won is we have lebron james and they didn't. steph curry is a great player. lebron is the king. the best in the league. after last night, i think he replaced michael jordan of greatest of time. he is a hometown kid and seeing the raw emotions last night thanking cleveland and saying it was for us and meant the world and great to have him back and winning forever now. it is a great feeling. >> so speaking of winning, there is someone else who would like to win coming to your city soon. july 18th, if i'm correct on top of my head here, this thing called the republican national convention and the guy by the name of donald trump. that's -- when we talk about cleveland last couple of months we talk about the republican party and trump. do you have any notes, any messages on winning, on cleveland for those 50,000 people coming the town? >> well, i'm a huge liberal. they won't let me huge 100 yards. cleveland behaved themselves last night and i -- the city,
we'll behave ourselves in the convention. it is the people from the outside we're little worried about. and the police department will have it on lockdown. i know they'll behave. i hope everyone else in the city will be, too. we'll throw a great party. >> believe-land. i like it. keep that party train rolling. congratulations again. thank you so much. >> thank you. all right. thank you so much for being with me. i'm brooke baldwin. we have breaking news off the top. major shake-up in donald trump's campaign. today, mr. trump fired his embattled campaign manager with him from the very beginning here, corey lewandowski after pressure apparently from trump's closest advisers and including and maybe particularly family members and daughter ivanka, for example. short time ago, corey
lewandowski sat here and spoke with dana bash about 20 years. they talked about the firing and ultimately he says he has no regrets. >> from your perspective, what happened? why were you fired? >> i don't know. i don't know the answer to that but what i know is what we have been able to achieve in this election cycle has been historic. you know? we had a candidate who in june of last year and announced to run for president with no elective office experience in the field of 16 other people in the race and him who's gone on to do something historic and almost 14 million votes a s and fundamentally changed the way people look at politics. running as the outsider of this campaign, running against the corrupt washington, d.c. establishment and political correctness is something i'm proud to be part of. >> do you think it's appropriate for donald trump to make the change and let you go? >> what i think is that the voters have a binary decision on
election day. vote for hillary clinton and her liberal policies or put someone in place to change washington. and i will do everything i can to make sure that the latter of those two happens. which means donald trump elected president. doing that from inside the campaign, a privilege. from outside the campaign, that's also a privilege. >> did mr. trump himself call you this morning and say, i don't mean to use this term but it is the term, you're fired? >> i had a nice conversation with mr. trump and said it's an honor and privilege to be part of this. and i mean that from the bottom of my heart. >> were you surprised? were you blind sided? >> yeah i don't know it's so much that. there's been a lot of conjecture in the media lately of what's going on well and not going on well in the campaign. i think a lot of that is just the media trying to hype up a campaign. you know? we have a candidate on the other side under criminal investigation and most of the mainstream media doesn't want to
talk about. and even when he gives a great policy speech and probably the best speaker our country has seen he doesn't get credit for those things. >> i want to get into the specifics about how the campaign was run and where you are right now. were you escorted out of the builting by security today? >> doesn't work like that. i mean, obviously, protocols in place when someone is no longer an employee they make sure, there's no escorting out. i have had the privilege of working with them. they're friends of mine. but there's a protocol in place and regardless of who that is and that's the right thing. >> so yes you were. >> wasn't security. it was a friend from the office. >> okay. >> yeah. >> let's get into what went on inside the campaign. sources who i've talked to and others talked to said that they described you as a hot head and didn't treat people right. what do you say to that? >> look. i think i'm a very intense person and my expectation is perfection. because i think mr. trump deserves. i think he deserves the very
best because he's put his life and his fortune into this campaign. spending tens of millions of dollars to go do something that candidly he didn't need to do. he's had a great life and wants to change the country for the better and i see how hard he worked on the campaign. he works 18, 19, 20 hours a day consistently. >> that question is about you. >> i understand. because leadership starts at the top and i see what he's put in the campaign and when i see someone i don't think working as hard as the person when's funding the campaign, the campaign principle, meaning the candidate, yeah, that bothers me because leadership is at the top and i have never asked something to do something on this campaign i wasn't willing to do myself and mr. trump never asked me to do something he wasn't willing to do himself. he doesn't sleep on the plane and just works all the time. that's the mind-set and the tenacity and the intensity he would bring to being the president of the united states. and i think you can expect that
of people. we never had 700 people at the campaign. we were in the campaign with 70 people. more efficient, more effective. leaner, meaner. does that mean people need to do more and stay late and get in early? you bet you do. >> that's part of the interview coming amid concerns about the direction of trump's campaign headed into the general election. against, of course, hillary clinton. and, you know, check your calendar. less than a month to go before the republican national convention in cleveland. let's bring in supporter kevin paul scott. also here in new york, cnn politics editor juana edwards and doug high. kevin, you're closest to me and you get the first question. that's not really a rule. just being facetious. what do you think was the real problem here? was it corey lewandowski or mr. trump? >> what you are seeing here is a classic case of what got you
here won't get you there and seeing a campaign trying to transition to be ready. >> it is corey's fault? >> i think the style honestly worked well and let donald be donald in the primary and starting to get worried. remember in the primary, every day it seemed like donald trump standing up and reading poll numbers and always positive. now those numbers aren't as positive. >> according to the polls today -- >> yeah. they're looking at that saying now we have to do something different. >> more than polls? >> i think it's more than polls, more than style. there are a lot of things but this is how it goes. when there's a challenge within the campaign, got to be a sacrificial lamb. corey obviously ruffled feathers in the family and other key groups, especially with the rnc, and now you're seeing him to take the fall for this one and try to get somebody else that can hopefully keep donald trump on message. >> doug high, from an operative perspective, this is less than a month before cleveland.
>> yeah. look. i think it demonstrates a lot of the probables that donald trump and his campaign have and we should keep in mind this is a campaign of, for and about donald trump. replacing one person, whether that's campaign manager or spokesperson or anyone else doesn't change the fact that it's donald trump who's running a campaign of division. it's donald trump having trouble raising money and it's donald trump who doesn't have an organization on the ground and key campaign states and while i think corey did a very commendable job today, in his interview with dana, dana did a great job, as well, they're tough interviews and sounded like the first day and not the last day, the realities of the trump campaign faces are very steep challenges and they're also one that is a lot of people predicting for a long time. >> so, moving forward, asking about the fund raising, we mentioned the poll numbers. he is down 7 percentage points today, having a tough time fund raising. half the republican party, you know, isn't showing up to cleveland now. what will the, you know, what
will the convention look like? how do they make it look like it's unified? >> this is going to be really tough. from my recent memory, the latest of a colossal shake-up and i think a couple of things really important to look at in the convention. that is, do any of the elder republicans, those the party stalwarts saying they're not in a donald trump and change their mind and looking for and sot thing recently a lot of corporations saying they don't want to get involved and be there with donald trump at the top of the ticket? that more or less. whether or not donald trump can get the full support of someone like senator ted cruz on the sidelines. we saw him earlier today still not coming forward, not embracing donald trump and saying he would support him and endorse him. donald trump needs to signal to mainstream republicans he is on their side and the party can come together or else the polling right now even though obviously five months out from
november, it is not good for him and i think that's worrying people, particularly in the donor class within the republican party. >> we do know that corey sitting in your seat earlier today. he name checked mitch mcconnell, paul ryan. obviously proud to have them behind the campaign. although sometimes they're having to answer for some of what donald trump said. what will -- you talk about replacing, will paul manafort take over operations? what will this real battle moving forward look like? >> it's interesting to see. juana is right in terms of seeing this be an outreach move but i don't think ultimately you are going to see anybody get on board or not get in board because of corey being there or not being there. what you will see is strategic approaches. tackling key states, turn the traditionally blue states red. that's what you are looking at. this is strategic decision. not a pr decision an going to be a lot of shake-ups and things to
come. >> we were remembering, doug high, when ted cruz, a big deal in february. ted cruz fired the communications director and donald trump took to twitter saying this. wow. was ted cruz disloyal to the very capable director of communication and used him like a scapegoat. fired like a dog. ted panicked. is donald trump panicking? >> well, i think loyalty's a one-way street with donald trump. you're loyal to him. he's not loyal to you. the campaign is panicking seeing a lot of bad poll numbers which have come after weeks and weeks of bad press for donald trump. it seems to be the only kind of press he's getting springs from him and operationally to use the word of earlier, there are two messages that voters hear right now. one is trump campaign on the ropes and disarray and other are the pro-hillary ads running, positive, biographical ads and positive of hillary and trump campaign in disarray. that's not the message and still june and not a message they want
or need right now? >> also hearing hillary clinton e-mail scandals and hearing a lot of things like that. so it's not all roses and flowers for hillary clinton at this point, either. we have two key candidates, party leaders, both have extremely high negatives. talking about donald trump, clinton campaign is not smooth sailing. they have a lot of challenges, as well. >> democrats are qulu nighted and republicans aren't and won't get there any time soon if at all. >> i think that this, though, tells us we have a general election matchup of a question of trust versus temperament. to your point, obvious that the e-mail scandal has had some issues with the support looking at polls and trust for hillary clinton. and donald trump constantly voters talk about the things he comes out and says, whether or not he says he'll be more presidential and then tweets about somebody that's less presidential so i think that there's a divide here and see in polls 25% of people don't know
if they can vote for either. >> corey lewandowski letting trump be trump guy and paul manafort meeting in florida saying he's moving to the center. it boils down to mr. trump and listens to -- >> whether any of the people can control him and i don't think anybody is sure they can at this point. >> thank you. >> thank you. let's take you back now and talk orlando. breaking today, the fbi releasing the transcripts of phone calls with the killer in orlando in that nightclub as that massacre unfolded. we have new details today about the police negotiations and what this terrorist threatened. also ahead, three police chiefs gone in just nine days. the sex scandal that has rocked a major police department in this country and these stinging words from the mayor there. >> as a mayor of oakland, i am here to run a police department. not a frat house.
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that can camp out in between our teeth, if we'll let it. use gum® brand. soft-picks®. proxabrush® cleaners. flossers and dental floss. gum® brand. welcome back. you're watching cnn. we have the words of the mass killer with the transcripts. new unedited transcripts of the gunman's words and then later conversations with police negotiators. 33 moneys into the deadly rampage, the killer called 911 and said this. emergency 911. this is being recorded. his response in the game of god the merciful, the beneficial. operator saying, what? he responds, praise be to god and prayers as well as peace be
upon the prophet of god. i want to let you know i'm in orlando andy the shootings. 911, what is your name? he responds, my name is i pledge allegian allegiance. 911, okay. what is your name? i pledge allegiance to -- may god protect him against still speaking in arabic. 911 responds, all right. where are you? his response in orlando, they then ask where in orlando? and the call drops. investigators chose to initially redact the name isis, the terror group he swore allegiance to and the leader of that group and not glory if i copycats and minutes ago they reversed course. and in a news conference a short time ago they described the attack attacker's tone. >> while we're not releasing the audio, what i can tell you is while the killer made the
murderous statements, he did so in a chilling, calm and deliberate manner. >> joining me now, cnn justice correspondent pamela brown and art roderick. former assistant director with the u.s. marshal's office. pamela, first, you know, obviously, it is the language he used and the redacting of the transcript. now we see it all, pamela. why? why change? >> well, doj, the department of justice, saying it is sending out the full version of the 911 call because the redactions have called -- caused an unfortunate distraction as doj calls it. it says initially wanted to omit the word isis and abu -- the leader of isis and doesn't further fuel terrorist propaganda. but what seems strange to a lot of people was that earlier, you know, just a few days ago james comey, head of the fbi, was talking about how he pledged
allegiance to isis in the phone call and many people wondering why would you redact this now? and there is this strong statement from speaker of the house paul ryan saying that it was preposterous to leave out the terrorist group, that inspired the gunman, omar mateen, to go on this shooting rampage. and so, this transcript really does give a window, a glimpse into what he was saying, what his mind-set was as he just mentioned, pledges allegiance to isis during that 911 call and then that was about half an hour in to the rampage and then later after that he has a total of 28 minutes on the phone with crisis negotiators and three different phone calls. and in this, he demands that america stop bombing syria and iraq and at what point the negotiator asks, what did you do? and he says, you know what i did. and then he goes on to talk about the fact he has explosives and threatens to set off these
explosives. her's what he said to the crisis negotiator. there are some vehicle outside with some bombs, just to let you know. you people are going to get it an i'm going to ignite it if they try to do anything stupid. also, brooke, apparently told the victims he had four suicide vests to put on them. i spoke to the s.w.a.t. team commander of learning that there were possibly explosiveser and turns out there that were not and he said it ramped up the risk for the civilians and first responders, brooke. >> you were next to me, interviewing mark canty and, art, i want to come to you and remind everybody what he said to me on thursday. >> trying to save lives. when he start talking about the bomb vest, kind of an average or normal inclination of people is hearing that there's a bomb, you want to back up. our normal protocol is to back up 1,000. >> didn't. >> officers knew that they had to stay there even though they were in jeopardy because there
was a chance to get some of those people outside. that's right. we started thinking about we have a good relationship with the sheriff's office here. they have a bomb disposal unit with the ability to create walls and i asked him to prep for a charge. we knew the suspect was in the north bathroom. >> so that was just a piece of the conversation playing it for you to, again, they thought, you have to take a mad person at their word that they have explosive vests and to maximize casualties. >> absolutely. take him at the word and point at this point in time he killed 49 people and once they say something like that, that changes the whole background of what you're doing in that particular instance. you know? you're planning to make an entry and then somebody says, oh, there's a bomb out in the vehicle and there's also suicide vests to place on people and put them around the corners. those are deadly, deadly weapons and the commander was correct. if there was a bomb out in that
vehicle, it would have taken them all out. >> they chose to stay and then engaged. thank you. pamela brown, thank you. next here, three police chiefs, forced out in nine days. all started with a shameful sex scan dunleavy at the oakland police department. now, an investigation of racist text messages. live to california to find out what went so horribly wrong. ♪ ♪ ♪ geico motorcycle, great rates for great rides. don't tour paris.. and please, don't "do" paris.
police chief ousted in nine days all happening inside the disgraced oakland, california, police departments. the scandals prompting citizen protests, the city's mayor vowing to clean up the department saying she is, quote, not running a frat house. cnn's sarah sidener with us in oakland and phillip holloway. sara, first to you, what happened? >> reporter: well, this department is starting to feel to a lot of people like a house of cards. they have a leadership vacuum. three police chiefs in just nine days gone, forced to resign or resigning because of two things. one, what's now become a sex scandal of a teenager both underage and 18 eventually. who has made some accusations against more than two dozen police officers, not just in this department but in several departments across the bay area. however, the majority of the officers came from this department. she says there were 14 and she says some of them knew that she
was under age at the time that she was having sexual relationships with them. the accusations that she's made, brooke, some of the more serious ones to do with the underage sex with police officers and payments saying that some of the officers would pay her for sex and that some of the officers would pay her giving her information, tipping her off to prostitution stings she says she was a sex worker at the time and so those three things have really started a major full-blown investigation here. the mayor coming out strongly after the accusations and not only that, but after the sex accusations, there were more accusations made against two officers with nothing to do with the sex scandal for texting one another with racially explicit texts of high-ranking african-american cops. >> i feel that this is an appropriate time to place civilian oversight over this police department.
and to send a very clear message about how serious we are of not tolerating misconduct, unethical behavior and to root out what is clearly a toxic macho culture. >> reporter: you can hear oakland mayor's libby schaaf's anger at what happened in the department and now a special city administrator to basically oversee the department but here's a small detail that a lot of people maybe outside of oakland don't know. this is already, this department already under federal oversight. it's been with a federal monitor watching the goings on inside this department more than a dekid and a lot of people wondering what kind of monitoring was going on considering how large the scandal has become. brooke? >> phillip, how do they clean this up? >> well, good afternoon, brooke. i really don't know the exact answer but i do know that civilian oversight of a police
agency certainly one this size is probably not the right way to go. that being said, i commend the mayor identifying the problem. there does appear to be a mjor, major cancer growing in the oakland police department and somehow you have to excise the cancer and get it out of there and bring in somebody with the knowledge and the training and the experience dealing with police officers. you don't super vise cops just the way you do other types of employees. they will not trust somebody who they don't believe has their best interest at heart. cops by their very nature don't trust bureaucrats and if the mayor wants to think that a bureaucrat running the police department is a good idea, she may very well be in for a rude awakening and find somebody for six months or a year to come in on an interim basis looking for somebody on a long-term basis with the knowledge and subject matter, experience, to clean up the police agency. sara? >> reporter: brooke, can i jump
in here? >> yeah, yeah, yeah. >> reporter: look. she's tried that. she's had three police officers. one of whom the federal monitor was backing. he's gone. he was the police chief. she's had another police chief from bay area rapid transit that came over to run the department. there a couple of weeks and gone. they tried someone inside the department a captain and lasted two dais. he's gone. there have been five police chiefs since 2013 in this department. so if you're looking at the police department to be able to run itself, a lot of people are going, wait a minute. what is happening with this department? and to be fair, it's not just oakland police department that is involved in this sex scandal. we are talking about richmond police department is named and several other departments with several other officers who have been found on text messaging to be talking with her and possibly having sexual relationships with her. but to be fair, a lot of folks in this town are saying, we keep trying the same thing over and over and over again.
with sworn officers. and it doesn't seem to be working. it's a hard one to crack. >> well -- >> sitting here shaking my head. they have to fix it. that is a major metropolitan city. let's leave it. for now. wow. the fact that they have been monitored while this was happening. thank you so much. we'll stay on it, oakland. next, the name isis, the word isis removed from newly released 911 transcripts from the orlando killer. with 911 operators. that has a number of republicans or had them in an uproar and mow changed but we'll still debate whether prosecutors made the right call. they have since redacted them. stopped the redacting. 16 chevy , but here's the catch. you're only going to answer me in emojis. so, this cruze has built-in 4g lte wifi® with 24 gigs of data. wow. (message sent sfx) strong! it also comes with 24 months of siriusxm satellite radio. (message sent sfx)
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a quick reversal. we are talking a matter of hours here. from the fbi on the release of the transcript of calls between the orlando mass murderer and members of law enforcement. officials first had redacted the name of the terror group isis and also the name of the leader of the islamic state from the verbatim provided members of the media and today they toll us why. >> part of the redacting is meant to not give credence to individuals who have done terrorist acts in the past. we won't propagate the violent rhetoric and we see no value in putting the individual's names out there. we are trying to prevent future acts and for cowards like this one, people like that influence them so we're not going to continue to put their names out front. >> immediately, republican house speaker paul ryan, you know, hit back saying selectively editing the transcript is preposterous.
we know the shooter was a radical islamist extremist inspired by isis and we also know he intentionally targeted the lgbt community. the administration should release the full, unredacted transcript so the public is clear-eyed about who caused this. and now they said it was an unnecessary distraction and reissued the transcripts in full w. that update, let's bring in senior cnn law enforcement analyst, dan fuentes and commentator buck sexton, a former counter terrorism cia analyst. buck, turning to you, on fact we are now seeing the name abu bakr al baghdadi, isis and we knew from, you know, mr. comey last week, when's new? >> no rational behind this whatsoever. had to be a political decision enforced on the fbi. i don't believe for one second anyone in the fbi hierarchy came
to this decision to redact and says omit to omit things already publicly stated out there and known. isis already gotten the full propaganda bump from this. everybody knows what's in the information. it seemed like a very clumsy attempt to try to give some deference to this politically correct culture of don't want to say the islamic state but a terrorist group and can't come up with a rationalization for it because it's a bizarre act and soviet level propaganda and no justification, makes no sense whatsoever and it does play into a larger narrative that the administration does not want the speak honestly and forthrightly about the threat of jihadism and looking for other thing to point to. >> tom fuentes? what do you make of buck's comments? >> well, sorry, but i have to disagree with buck because in this case, and i have this from several sources that were involved in the meetings, it was not not made by the
administration, the white house or the intelligence department. they made the decision because, you know, partly because of the sensitivity of the victims and the main reason was that they're looking at these thousands of isis videos, social media messages that go out every single day and they just didn't want to have this guy be the one in the next upcoming video whereby name he's cites baghdadi and boston bombers and other people individually an isis itself so they're thinking was and the police requested that the fbi release some information because they were taking a lot of questions about the timeline of what was responded to and the s.w.a.t. operation taking three hours and so they asked the fbi to put out some of the information to show the timeline but not any of the information thamd pertain to parts of the investigation which would include his wife or any other possible co-conspirators so it actually was not a political
decision based on the administration. it was a political decision based on denying isis more propaganda coming from mateen himself. >> that's just nonsense. everybody could tell what was redacted. they're redetectiving i pledge allegiance to omitted. everybody knew what was in there. you tell me the fbi thought -- >> almost like they were calling more attention to something that they didn't want to call attention to and now attention -- >> true story of the world for a week. we know that the fbi director said he pledged to isis. they're running this. people are reading and are going to continue to read whether the u.s. government redacts from the accounts or official account or not, they have gone back on this realizing how bizarre and strange it is and maybe sources inside telling you this wasn't a political decision. i would contest that because it seems bizarre. >> let me jump in. >> and because they lasted three hours with this. >> it is over. part is over and i sat and
wonder and sit here and i've covered too many of the mass shootings and we have made a decision or we on the show an i know an almost of colleagues made a decision not to say his name. right? so much is about notoriety and i don't want to say his name and people know what his name is. i don't want to keep saying it. isn't that the same thing? >> every major media outlet are running stories of tn motivations f. we try to prevent an attack, what are the motivations going forward to try to do that and i think the killer, mass murderer, this jihadist in this context, leaving a voice message saying these are the motivations and why i did it is relevant to the discussion, part of the public record and the idea that anybody in the hierarchy of the fbi or elsewhere thinking elsewhere is just bizarre. it makes no sense whatever and look this is not really a problem anymore because they have gone back and changed it but let's not pretend it was a sensible decision. there's a reason they haven't stood behind this. nothing to do with tactics, not
protecting sources and methods. they didn't want to talk about this. >> tom, last word. i appreciate that. tom. >> they didn't want it in his words verbatim. to have the fbi say it is one thing. they just didn't want to coming out of his mouth from the grave still extolling the virtues of baghdadi and isis and that's all. if it was a mistake with the backlash and this and taking it back, that may be but their original intention is not political. that's the only point i'm making. >> okay. >> we agree to disagree on that one. >> tom and buck, thank you. it is now moot. moving on. next, hillary clinton repairing another trump takedown. a preview of what she has in store on a big speech on the economy coming up. of control... legislature. stand up to this price gouging. prices... relief act. of control... legislature. stand up to this price gouging. prices... relief act.
speaking in our nation's capital. >> the imperative for the next president to deal with complex transnational threats, because in our hyper connected world events anywhere can impact everywhere, environmental disruptions, pathogens, computer viruses, malicious ideologies, these threats don't respect borders. and no matter what others may claim, we cannot wall ourself off from these challenges. even in simpler terms, isolation never offered more than a false sense of security. >> wall ourselves off. jeff zeleny is here, senior washington kropt. what else did she say? >> brooke, this is so interesting. the president last week, the vice president now. this is a coordinated democratic effort here. i mean, as donald trump is having a shake-up and issues of his own, democrats are really coming together and going after donald trump really in every
news cycle and he, you know, in the vice president's own sort of sober, slow way, he went after him incredibly. this is a day before hillary clinton is going to be doing this same thing in ohio he said, if we build these walls, this anti-americanism will rip through the atmosphere. he said that people will turn against america if we do things like that. it was one part history lesson and one part politics. tough words from the vice president. >> he even add michelle obama, mentioning the wall as well. hillary clinton, big speech tomorrow on the economy? >> right. it's part of her trump lecture series. she went after him on foreign policy. tomorrow it's all on the economy. she'll be in ohio, which is a battleground state. but there's a piece of real threat and will use his own words against him against all of the things he's talked about from bankruptcy to other things.
it's very clear that the clinton campaign has a strategy and it's been echoed to define droip. we'll see if it works or not. >> that was a mega speech she gave. president obama speaking out as it is world refugee day, speaking out on behalf of the people around the world who have been forced from their home. 65.3 million refugees is 1 in every 113 people here on earth. he said the scale is almost unmarriageable and the suffering is almost unimaginable. scott, welcome. thank you for your service to our country, first and foremost. >> thank you, brooke. that's for all you have done to get out the veteran voice.
>> thank you so much. and whether refugees should be allowed in this country for not, how will you respond to those fears? >> the first thing you have to do is make a distinction between a native american citizen who committed a lone wolf attack and those refugees fleeing persecution and violence and conflict. 65.3 million refugees. it's also important to remember that they are the most highly and intensely vetted of people trying to come to the united states. it takes 18 to 24 months to come here. they are vetted by all of our intelligence and law enforcement agencies and they go through a series of five to six interviews before they finally are welcomed to the united states. >> why, scott, is this personal
for you? i mean, you have served overseas. why do you care so much from a veteran perspective? >> i would say among all of us veterans, it's quite personal. many spent tours in iraq and afghanistan and served alongside interpreters whose lives are now threatened because they cooperated with the united states and worked alongside us. we've seen what it's like and we also put the uniform on because we care about what this nation stands for. we care about the fact that the symbol of the united states is not barbed wire and walls. it's where we put the uniform on. >> tell me more about this group you're a part of and how can other veterans who are watching join? >> absolutely. i work at human rights first. we started an initiative called veterans for american ideals, which is a group of veterans
that believes that we are most secure and safe when we do advocate for policies that are in our interest and our own ideals. so to all those veterans out there, we have conversations going on throughout the country today. there's one in d.c., new york, boston and san francisco where we welcome refugees here into the united states and keep our word and keep faith with those translators who served alongside of us. >> thank you for getting the word out with this nonpartisan group, scott cooper. thank you so much. >> thank you, brooke. >> thank you. we do have more on our breaking news. donald trump today firing his campaign manager, corey lewandowski. he spoke out live here with dana bash and doesn't know why he was let go. you will hear his interview coming up here on cnn.
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xfinity lets you download your shows from anywhere. i used to like that song. "i'm in orlando and i did the shootings." transcripts of the terrorist's shocking 911 calls just released today. "the lead" starts right now. the fbi releases the orlando conversations with the cops. not one single mention of gay people but several mentions of isis. ones that the federal government
original originally censored from the transcripts. why? the senate is minutes away from voting on measures to restrict gun ownership or background checks. all four might fail. plus, you're fired. a huge head-scratching event in the campaign. corey lewandowski is out just one month before the republican convention. hello, everybody. welcome to "the lead." i'm jake tapper. we're getting a terrifying mind glimpse into the worst shooting in modern u.s. history. [ gunfire ] just minutes ago, the fbi released a new full transcript of the orlando terrorist's 911 call. earlier, the fbi released a partial transcript of the conversations between authorities and the