tv CNN Tonight With Don Lemon CNN August 26, 2016 6:00pm-7:01pm PDT
that does it for us. thanks for watching. "cnn tonight" starts now. what may be a new low in one of the nastiest campaigns in american history. this is "cnn tonight." i'm don lemon. he calls her a bigot. she says his real message may be make america hate again. donald trump and hillary clinton are not done yet. trump tweeting today how quickly people forget that crooked hillary called african-american youth super predators. has she apologized. clinton's running mate tim kaine going on the attack today, charging trump embraces what he calls ku klux klan values. the rnc calling that remark reprehensible. here to discuss all of this, michael smerconish and larry sabado, director of the center for politics at the university of virginia. good evening. boy, oh, boy. what a campaign season this is.
mr. smerconish, you first. clinton and trump are both accusing one another of racism, trump doubling down on calling hillary clinton a bigot and the clinton campaign tying donald trump to the kkk. tim kaine on the campaign trail today. listen to this. >> he has supporters like david duke connected with the ku klux klan who are going around and saying donald trump is their candidate because donald trump is pushing their values. ku klux klan values, david duke values, donald trump values are not american values. they're not our values. donald trump was a main guy behind the scurrilous and i would say bigoted notion that president obama wasn't even born in this country, and donald trump has continued to push that irresponsible falsehood from all the way up to now. >> truly a war on words here. who's winning? >> both of them are probably losing in this regard. let me start with tim kaine. i think the lesson from the primary is that when you stoop
to trump's level, you come out with mud all over you. just ask marco rubio because when he tried to engage trump at that basis, i think he came out of it a net loser. with regard to referring to hillary as a bigot, bigot, don, that's the bomb. that's the "r" word. that's calling a racist. you better be able to back it up. when anderson pressed donald trump on that issue just within the last 48 hours, trump had nothing to say and in the end he said well, maybe it's her laziness. well, lazy is not a synonym for bigot. but i don't like seeing kaine respond in kind. i think they are both losing at that level. >> you would say take the high road here. my question is, when you talked about donald trump and bigot and saying you have to back it up, has he brought this on himself in part? >> well, he brought it on himself i think because of going the birther route. because in my opinion, playing that birther card for as long as he did was really an appeal to
say barack obama is an other. he's not one of us. he's not an american. he's one of them in the context of the war on terror. he's not one of us. i thought that was really an appeal in the worst instinct. >> his new campaign manager, donald trump's campaign manager, made a clear -- made it clear trump uses his own words. bigot was a prepared remark wednesday night. it was in the teleprompter. was this an attempt by trump you think to upstage her before her big speech yesterday, sort of a prebuttal? >> i think that it probably was. he was knowledgeable of the fact she was going to make a statement that was going to deal with racial issues and he wanted to get out ahead of the curve on it. i just think that he went too far. there's this schizophrenia within the trump campaign of on one hand, trying to stoke the base and keep people fired up and then every once in awhile he will say something that is seemingly out of character which you say well, wow, was that the pivot that i just missed toward
the general election. but there's this inherent inconsistency between the two and he's really got to bring some clarity. it's labor day next weekend. he's got to bring some clarity as to what this campaign is all about. we have been paying attention, we are political junkies. there's a significant part of the country that's going to begin to tune in just come next weekend and thereafter. >> before i move to larry, any day not talking about the clinton foundation or e-mail scandal, is that a win for her? >> probably. i think that this week was really a revelatory week with regard to the a.p. report. i know a lot of people want to pick it apart. i happened to think it drew enough pieces of the puzzle together to raise some serious questions about whether access was provided to foreign individuals who could not write a check to an american campaign, who nevertheless wanted to curry favor with the clintons. i think it's a very real issue. >> larry, let's talk numbers. you are so good eighat it. you are a pro.
a new poll showing hillary clinton holding her post convention bounce with a seven point lead in a four way matchup and ten point lead in a two way matchup. what do you think of these numbers, larry? >> well, the numbers change over time but basically, i think it's going to bounce around between the four points that barack obama won by in 2012 and the seven points he won by in 2008. the basic alignments that we have seen in the past two presidential elections are still present. hillary clinton has some pluses that barack obama doesn't have. she has some minuses that barack obama doesn't have or didn't have in those two campaigns. i think it is a very good lead for her. i would never say before labor day it's absolutely solid but i will tell you, i hear the concrete setting, if you can hear concrete setting. especially with minority voters, but also with a lot of the rest of the electorate. >> yeah. you can't hear it but there's a
time before it sets when you can mark your name in it or write in it and after that it's all done. i have been wanting to talk to you about this. there's this notion of the shy or undercover trump voter that people are talking about, someone who doesn't want to tell a pollster on the phone they are supporting donald trump. they call it social desirability bias. tell me more about this. does this ring true? because his own campaign manager is saying hey, we are getting the people who don't necessarily want to say they are going to vote for donald trump in the polling. >> believe it or not, i first heard about this in 1968. it wasn't called the shy vote back then but it was about george wallace, whether people would be honest in talking to interviewers either in person or on telephone. obviously there was no online polling back in 1968. generally speaking, when you have a controversial candidate on the right or the left, the theory goes that there will be a percent or two or three that simply won't want to admit it. now, they almost never say they
are voting for the other candidate. what they say is they are undecided. is it possible that there is some of that here, yes. do i think it's substantial enough to wipe out the very large lead that hillary clinton has in the big swing states? no. we borrowed some of this from british politics. it's called the shy tory vote over there. it seems to have more impact in britain than it does here. >> what are your thoughts, michael? >> i have seen it in black-white elections. i happened to be in california when mayor tom bradley was upset. many called it the bradley effect. i have seen it in racially charged environments. the reason that i'm dubious in this case, larry's a bright guy, he can correct me if i'm wrong, i don't remember this being a factor in primary and caucus season. i don't remember sitting there on cnn on election nights saying oh, my god, look at trump, he outpolled where we expected that he would be. so my suspicion at present is
that it's a way to keep the trump supporters in the tent as these polling numbers are coming out and showing a widening gap. they need to rally the troops and make them think all hope is not lost. >> go ahead, larry. >> yes. michael has good memory, because the so-called bradley effect, of course, bradley was an african-american candidate for governor. he had been leading in all the polls and he was upset in his race for governor in the 1980s, and later that same decade, we had doug wilder in virginia who was way ahead in the polls, sometimes by 10, 12, 14 percentage points and he won by i believe 6,000 votes out of nearly two million cast. so yes, on the racial side, it can be there. i don't feel that in this particular case. >> even though race has been discussed so much, it's not black-white but still, race has been discussed. that's what they're fighting over right now. still you don't see it?
>> i'll tell you another reason why i don't see it. the american electorate has changed dramatically. african-americans, hispanic americans, asian americans and other minorities will be 30%, 30% of the november vote and because of the things donald trump has said and done, and also because of hillary clinton's record that they have interpreted as being pro-minority, i think donald trump is headed for an all-time low at least in the modern era for republicans. he will be lucky, lucky, to get 20% of all minorities combined and i think it's going to be closer to 15% which means he has to get a massive majority of whites and i don't think that's there for him either. >> michael, your listeners talking about this, especially this so-called shy vote and whether or not they have made up their mind, black or white or hispanic or asian, about donald trump and hillary clinton? >> it's awfully difficult to find folks who call my program and say they are undecided.
if i can just echo something larry said. here's the data point i come back to. in the '92 race, george herbert walker bush got 59% of the white vote. that equated to 426 electoral votes. mitt romney in the last cycle got the same percentage, 59% of the white vote. it got him 206 electoral votes. what does that tell you? it's a different country. the demographics have shifted. and you can't get elected on white votes alone. >> thus this sort of reaching out as maybe an ill attempt as it is to minority voters. that's why they are doing it. larry or michael. >> well, i have got one little thing to add that i learned over the years. it sounds very simple. it sounds obvious. it is amazing how often politicians and campaigns ignore it and it's a simple phrase. you do not get the votes of people you insult. >> thank you very much. have a great weekend. michael, see you tomorrow on
television. >> thank you for that. >> saturday, 9:00 a.m. and 6:00 p.m. on cnn. i will be watching. hope you tune in. when we come back, will donald trump's mixed signals on immigration be his achilles heel? ♪ if you have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis, isn't it time to let the real you shine through? introducing otezla (apremilast). otezla is not an injection or a cream. it's a pill that treats plaque psoriasis differently. with otezla, 75% clearer skin is achievable after just 4 months, with reduced redness, thickness, and scaliness of plaques. and the otezla prescribing information has no requirement for routine lab monitoring. don't take otezla if you are allergic to any of its ingredients. otezla may increase the risk of depression. tell your doctor if you have a history of depression or suicidal thoughts, or if these feelings develop.
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centerpiece of his campaign sis since day one so why the mixed signals now? here to discuss, the former communications director for ted cruz. doing this on a friday. thank you. political commentator van jones and democratic strategist maria cardona and paris denard, who was director of black outreach for george w. bush. so glad to have all of you. i will start with miss cardona first. sarah palin since trump's wishy-washy stance on immigration could erode his support. is she right? why is it hard for him to stay on message on this issue? >> i think first of all because -- two things. he has no clue where he stands, where he should stand, i guess i should say, because during the republican primary, it was the number one issue as to why he won. what i mean by that is that if you look at all of the primary states except for wisconsin and new york, the majority, the vast majority of the trump voters who came out to vote for him in the
rest of the primary states did so because of his stance on immigration. and so he knew that that was the reason, that was what brought him to the dance, right, that was what led him to win the primary. going into a general election, i think now he has people like kellyanne conway who understand that without at least 44% of the hispanic vote, he has no pathway to 270 electoral votes. but the problem is, he doesn't even understand immigration. i don't think he even cares about immigration. so there's no way for him to formulate something, a proposal that even makes any sense. that even he can say look, i do need to change this because it doesn't make sense. he tried but then he would go back on the issue that most of his supporters -- >> i will get alice in. you said she doesn't believe he even cares about this issue of immigration. what do you think of that? >> he certainly cares about it. she's right, this was the corner stone of his campaign. just ask him, he will tell you he's the one that brought
immigration to the forefront of the conversation. every time we would have a debate and he would say i'm going to build a wall and mexico will pay for it, i'm going to deport all the illegals, everyone said that's not going to happen, it's not possible, and he still won anyway. jeb bush even pushed back on that and donald trump criticized jeb bush for questioning whether or not he's able to do this. he got so many people to believe him and his firm stance on immigration and that led to his victory, even to the point to where ann coulter has written a book on "in trump we trust" on immigration. unfortunately if he goes too far the other way he's going to betray the trust -- >> you agree with sarah palin that his wishy-washy support on immigration could erode support? >> there's a chance that could happen. this is something they believed in him for his strong stance on this. i do, though, at the same time, he does need to broaden his base. he needs to reach out to a bigger electorate. he needs to bring in more hispanics to the fold in order to win. but he must be careful in how he goes about doing it because it
does go against the cornerstone of his campaign. >> he started off with immigration. paris, where else does he go? where else do trump voters go if they say oh, okay, well, you know, he sort of went against what he said on immigration. are they going to go to hillary clinton? >> no, absolutely not. trump supporters like myself yur understand the fact -- >> will that top them from being energized enough to go to the polls? >> no, because the alternative is so severe. we realize hillary clinton is not going to be our friend and not going to support the issues that we believe are important. so trump's supporters will be with him no matter what. but i don't believe he is going to have a reversal on his decisions or his position on immigration. >> okay. van, listening over the past couple days, similar question to what i asked you last night. we heard a couple different things over the last couple of days for immigration policy. i know donald trump is set to deliver his big immigration speech within the next two weeks. do you think we are going to get more details and it's going to
be clarified even more? is he going to stick to the okay, they must go, or is he going to say well, we will work with them? what happens? >> i have no idea. i think what they're going to do, they're going to take a bunch of statements he made in the past, they will throw them in a sock drawer, they will blindfold somebody and grb them out and put them on a wall and he's going to give the speech. >> van, seriously, does it seem like, what do you think? what do you think? what do you think? this is where, i mean -- >> here's reality. he is going to realize there's a difference between leading a rally and leading a country. when he gets up there and it's time to lead a rally, he's brilliant because it doesn't matter what you say at a rally. all you got to do is get that big applause and he loves that. he gets a big dopamine rush off of that. but when you try to lead a country you have to have a coherent set of ideas. he himself is admitting he doesn't have one. he goes well, i was wandering around the country and somebody
said they thought my ideas were too tough. so now i'm thinking up new stuff to say. this is disqualifying to be president of the pta, let alone president of the united states. >> even if it's framed as he's listening on the voters and he's -- >> but he should listen, there were voters talking about this before he ran for office. in fact, the people who listened to voters were people like jeb bush who came up with good ideas and he smashed them upside the head. >> they were people who were on programs like this, like you, even, like maria, even alice, who were offering advice at one point, and were seen as never trumpers or trump haters. van, go on. >> well, yeah. my only point is simply this. he can't now go and say well, now i'm learning, i'm evolving, i'm listening to people. you might want to listen to the american people before you run for president. you might want to listen to the american people before you start attacking everybody. it turns out some of the ideas that both democrats and republicans have had are good
ideas. i'm not mad that he now adopts some of these ideas but you have got to then stand for it and say guess what, i was wrong, i apologized, i changed my mind. he never wants to do that. >> go ahead, paris. >> there are examples of hillary clinton changing her mind, her policy positions. >> yes, there are. >> so i don't think it's fair to say because donald trump may, we haven't had the speech, may be doing that or seems he might be doing that. to say it's disqualifying for being president. if that's the case, hillary clinton should be disqualified from running. >> has she done it on core issues? i'm just asking the question. i don't know if she has. >> it's not the flip-flop. >> hey, don, in terms of an example of a flip-flop on a major issue, think back to 2012 when barack obama flipped on traditional marriage and he flipped to gay marriage. he did it back in may. it was quick, swift, decisive and he moved on. that's what we need to do here. if donald trump is going to soften his position on immigration, it would be helpful if it would be quick swift and
decisive and move on. >> that's good advice considering we don't know over the last couple of days. >> here's the difference. both when hillary clinton and when president obama turned to supporting gay marriage, they talked about why. they talked about yes, talking to voters but -- >> that's what alice just said. if you are going to do it, commit. >> exactly. but they gave an explanation that goes to core values. that's where i don't think donald trump has core values on this or on anything else. >> okay. we are going to continue. we'll be right back. calling all go-getters. all providers. all self-motivated self-starters. drive with uber and put a dollar sign in front of your odometer. like this guy. technically i'm a cook. sign up here. drive a few hours a day. make $300 a week. actually it's a little bit more than that. that's extra buy-you-stuff money. or buy-them-stuff money. calling all early risers, nine-to-fivers and night owls. with uber-a little drive goes a long way. start earning this week.
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all right. this war of words over racism, donald trump is using some of hillary clinton's own words against her. back with me, alice, van, maria and paris. so here is donald trump's new web ad aimed at african-american voters. >> they are often the kinds of kids that are called super predators. no conscience, no empathy. we can talk about why they ended up that way but
first we have to bring them to heal. >> you called out president clinton for defending secretary clinton's use of the term super
predator back in the '90s when she supported the crime bill. why did you call them out? >> because it was a racist term and everybody knew it was a racist term. >> that's part of the ad, maria. let me get this up. trump tweeted this today. how quickly people forget that crooked hillary called african-american youth super predator. has she apologized. actually, hillary clinton did apologize.
it was in february in "time" magazine. there was an article of her apologizing. i asked her about it in march at a debate. listen to this. >> in 1996, you used the term super predators to describe some young kids. some feel like it was racial code. was it and were you wrong to use that term? >> well, i was speaking about drug cartels and criminal activity that was very concerning to folks across the
country. i think it was a poor choice of words. i never used it before, i haven't used it since, i would not use it again. >> so maria, why would he tweet that if she has apologized for it? does that make a difference? >> see, this is again the problem with his critique of' hillary clinton. he uses things that have already been talked about and that yes, she has already apologized for. the big difference is, don, you know this, i think everybody on the panel in america knows this, trump has never apologized for anything. he has offended so many people, so many groups of voters, so many demographics which is why he is in such trouble in the polls, yet he has never come out to say i am sorry, i shouldn't have said this, i said this wrong. >> he gave a general apology about a week ago. >> that doesn't count because what was he apologizing for, really? what one thing was he apologizing for? >> either this campaign will be
about donald trump versus hillary clinton or donald trump today versus donald trump from yesteryear. maria just made a point saying we are addressing things that happened in the past as relates to hillary clinton. that's all maria does and all the democrats are doing -- >> that she apologized for. >> he tweeted out today, the reason we are talking about it is because he tweeted out the term she used super predators. how soon we forget. that's why we are talking. this is just factual. we asked her about it, she did an bettinterview with "time" magazine and apologized for it. >> it's factual donald trump apologized and said he was sorry -- >> for what? >> sorry for things he said that were insensitive or might have been taken out of context and things like we keep bringing up david duke and the racist stuff which is all false. again, we forget the fact he disavowed david duke and everyone else that is a racist that people try to say are affiliated to this campaign yet
you continue to bring it up. if you are bringing up the past about hillary clinton, leave it in the past about donald trump. >> quickly. there are other people on the panel. >> the very first general election ad that he ran was an election ad that was demonizing immigrants and using statistics from a group called the center for immigration studies that is a hate group that is connected to white supremacy. >> so you are bringing up the past again. >> no. this is his first general election ad that he ran not two weeks ago. he used it. he is putting himself on trial here and giving us the opportunity to point out why two-thirds of americans believe he is bigoted and racist. >> van, you seem confused by some of this. what's going on? >> well, let me say a couple things. first of all, the ad. this was a vulnerability for hillary clinton. bernie sanders raised it, it's been raise dz. i think hillary clinton has
tried to address it. one of the things that's most remarkable is that in the 1990s, both she and her husband were big, big advocates of what turned out to be a mass incarceration agenda. what's remarkable about both the clintons, though, is they looked at the data, they looked at the facts, looked at the outcome and have now become big champions for reform. that is what you can respect in a leader, to be able to make a mistake, look at that and not just them, by the way, newt gingrich, rick perry, big republicans have done the same thing. meanwhile, donald trump says he wants african-american votes and has been completely tone-deaf on this issue and is going around saying law and order, law and order, in a way that makes it seem as if he doesn't care if the police obey the law. it's very interesting they would raise, that he's going to try to raise this question because i think the clintons have performed quite well on this issue of late. >> alice, i want to talk about strategy here. you have been the spokesperson for a number of big campaigns, a presidential campaign as well. is this a viable strategy for
donald trump? is this strategy working for him? >> i think the fact that we spent this week talking about bigots and racists is a race to the bottom. i think the voters are not interested in this. i think they want to hear what each of the candidates are going to do to help improve their economic situation, the national security of this country and certainly improve education and health care. and i think donald trump can certainly show a sharp contrast if we want to talk about minorities. what he can do to help minorities. take a page from the jack kemp playbook. talk about empowering minorities, talk about building ladders of opportunity and encouraging them to use their god-given talents to lift themselves up in their communities and i think the tone of', you know, what the heck do you have to lose, probably needs to tweak that a little bit. but use more of this as an opportunity to appeal to minorities on what they can offer the minority community as opposed to what the others have done to hurt their feelings or
disenfranchise them decades ago. i think it's time for both of them to focus on what they can do to help the minority community as opposed to what the others have done to harm it. >> paris, having heard all that, we have heard trump call clinton a bigot. is he right then? if he is right about this, why does hillary clinton have the majority of the minority vote? 77%. let's make that easier to understand. 77% of the minority vote. >> i think what we have seen this week is the clinton campaign running scared because they know that donald trump is making significant inroads with the black community. there's no reason, there's no reason, my goodness, it's the facts. there's no reason for them to engage in this type of gutter politics against donald trump unless they were feeling scared or nervous that he was making inroads and connecting. the point that you made, alice, is very factual but also, we have to understand when you talk about chicago and the crime that's there, under the democrat rule, donald trump talks about law and order, we need law and order in chicago. we also need to highlight the facts going on in our
communities in urban centers and having a republican candidate talk directly to black people and say i'm your person who is going to care about you and -- >> so what republican candidate is going to do that? what republican candidate's going to do that? he's not spoken directly to the black community. >> every single time he opens his mouth and talks to the black community on television -- >> don. >> every single time -- >> so is speaker ryan with the opportunity agenda. same thing. >> every single time he speaks to african-american or latino voters it is condescending and insulting. >> no, it's not. no, it's not. i'm african-american, i don't find it condescending. >> to the majority. >> i talk to other people, too. you're wrong. >> he says to us that we are walking down the street and we get shot. >> if you lived in chicago and lo at the crime rate -- >> hang on, maria. i live in chicago, i live in harlem, i lived in a number of big cities. i never walk down the street and worry about getting shots. i also lived in neighborhoods where -- i lived in tree-lined
neighborhoods. most african-americans i know are educated, working and doing quite well. >> i'm in the streets, brother. >> i am, too. i am on the subway. i never worry about getting shot. there's no evidence from larry, a numbers guy, a pollster guy, that donald trump is making any immedia headway with any minority communities. >> part of the thing i'm concerned about, it actually is the case that there are some republicans who understand and who have tried to reach out. you do have a paul ryan who used to say very very disturbing things who has completely changed and is trying to -- rand paul and others. yet you have donald trump who is doing it exactly wrong. first of all, what if i were to say to white people who are in poverty, who vote for republicans, you have been in poverty for generations, you live in a trailer, you don't have good dental health care, you should stop voting for republicans and vote for me or vote for hillary clinton.
the insult would be so loud that it would drown out anything else i had to say. and that's what we hear from donald trump. he continues to lead with insults even when he's reaching out. what i think is very important for republicans like the ones we have on here to reach out and to be more inclusive. i think democrats sometimes want to beat up republicans even when they are doing it the right way but donald trump is doing it the wrong way. >> as i explained to a friend just yesterday, i said if you have a friend or your spouse says honey, i have an issue with you and you say there's not an issue, there's no problem here, then you never get anything, you have to start from the premise that if someone is telling you are doing it wrong, that they have an issue with the way you're doing it, that there is indeed an issue with the way you're doing it. because then you prove hillary clinton right when she says the nerve of you to tell me what's better for me, for you to tell me what you know better for me what's good for me. do you understand that? >> hillary clinton talks about community. you can't have it both ways. either you have two white people who are running for president
and you want them both to talk to the black community. so they are going to do that. they have to have some type of credibility. i think donald trump does -- >> i think it would be right if hillary clinton was saying vote for me, then what more do you have to lose, your neighborhoods are terrible. >> she says vote for me because he's a bigot. >> let me say this in terms of what donald trump has to offer the minority community. i do think his economic policies will be better for this country. i do think it will help lift people out of poverty. in terms of republican agenda has always been about lifting people up and giving them a hand up, not just a hand out. i think it's just a matter of him communicating that in the right way. >> i think you're right. i think you're right. i think you're right. people are not saying the policies are bad. they are saying the approach is wrong. that's it. >> well, there are some people who are saying the policies are bad. >> that's a whole other argument. >> we have to talk about foethe policies. that's a whole other show.
>> they are telling me i had to go ten minutes ago. coming up, the men who know what voters are thinking about donald trump's mixed messages on immigration. by. no artificial flavors, preservatives, sweeteners. no colors from artificial sources. 100% of our food will be clean by year's end. that's food as it should be. ♪ alzheimer's disease the fi is out there.survive they're going to hold on to everything the disease steals away. that smile they can't hide. the dance class they love. every single piece of them is going to make it through. and the alzheimer's association is going to make it happen by funding research, advancing public policy and spurring scientific breakthroughs. and by providing local support to those living with the disease and their caregivers, we're easing the burden for all those facing it until we accomplish our goal.
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what do voters think of donald trump's mixed messages on immigration? joining me, three radio hosts who have the ear of those voters and listeners. dennis prader, john dipietro and chris degaul from philadelphia. a lot to talk about so let's get straight to it. here is donald trump on hannity on wednesday. take a listen. >> no citizenship? >> no citizenship. no citizenship. >> everyone agree with that? all right. >> let me go a step further. they will pay back taxes. they have to pay taxes. there's no amnesty as such. there's no amnesty. >> right. >> but we work with them. >> all right. here's trump with anderson last night. >> if they haven't committed a crime is there going to be a
path to citizenship legalization? >> no. there is not a path. there's no path to legalization. unless people leave the country -- well, when they come back in, if they come back in, then they can start paying taxes. >> they still have to leave the country? >> there's no path to legalization unless they leave the country and come back. >> okay. so dennis, i will start with you. donald trump's what appears to be zigzagging on his core anti-immigrant campaign platform all week, how are your ichb willers responding? is anybody could be fusnfused a or they get it? >> nobody can talk on behalf of all their listeners. i'm on 150 stations and a couple million listeners. i'm a self-confident guy but i can't tell you what they all think. i can tell you that my conservative listeners are not stupid. they understand that no matter what his position, there's a grand canyon-esque separation between him and hillary clinton. she wants all illegal immigrants to become american citizens and obviously to vote and the
presumption is the vast majority will vote democrat. so whatever his position, that's an interesting question and a very difficult one for him to navigate. i acknowledge that. but between the two, they're not dummies. oh, he's not radical enough for me. >> it doesn't matter. >> i don't think that's an issue. >> it doesn't matter. they are not going anywhere else. >> that's correct. that is correct. >> okay. so john, what about you? what do your listeners think? >> you know, don, it's interesting. independent voters, they view donald trump, from what i was hearing today, as this is a guy that's going to get it done. washington is broken. maybe he doesn't have it exactly right but they know at the end of the day when it's president trump he is going to build a wall, he is going to get rid of the criminals. at least he's going to address the problem. i agree with dennis. it's a world of difference. maybe the hard right, they are upset about it but one of the most important things about this is the whole element of
deterrence. if don lemon is riding along and sees a police car, he slows down. if you have a president who is zeroed in on illegal immigration, that's going to keep a lot of illegals out and a lot of people are going to leave on their own. this business of rounding up 11 million, everything else, it's all just parsing words. he owns the issue compared to hillary. >> just so i get it, so your listeners, some of them are voicing some concern because like dennis, they are not going anywhere. they understand he's at least close enough to their side that it's going to stick, correct? that what you're saying? >> that's exactly right. listen to the crowd when he was talking. listen to the applause of the people excited. >> to chris now. the surrogates seem clear on the policy. what about your listeners? how do they see it? >> i agree with the gentlemen. there's nothing -- where will they go? what is your option? if you intend to vote for president and you are not a hillary clinton supporter, where do you go. what i wish deeply wish is that donald trump could have stayed
focused on what was a really great week last week and really the early part of this week. focus on her. here we are back to parsing and slicing and dicing words he said on any given day. if only he could just drive home the problems with her and stay off of anything else related to the campaign, it's a winner. but i cannot figure out the logic in turning over this opinion polling session on a hannity show on a random wednesday night. i don't get it. i don't know why he keeps doing this. >> you and i have spoken about this before about he can't seem to help himself with stepping on some of his own message and you know, running for president, the political gods kind of smiled on him this week with the e-mails and with the clinton foundation and instead, now this happened with immigration and also the bigot thing. maybe chris has a point here. >> well, there is a point there. but there's a chicken and an egg
issue. who came first, did the press start pushing him on other issues because the press has pretty much acknowledged it wants hillary clinton as president. the "new york times," one of its chief writers has actually acknowledged it, said it's actually immoral for us to try to cover both of these people impartially because morally we want hillary clinton to win. >> the press didn't make him say it. that was in the teleprompter. bigot was in the teleprompter. >> oh, no, i was responding to the immigration issue. the bigot issue, look, the bigot issue -- >> the immigration issue, he said that on his own. with all due respect. >> yes. okay. so if he raised it on his own, then it is because he needs to pivot more to the center to win a national election. every candidate does that except ironically, hillary clinton, who has pivoted only to the left and still feels she can win which might be true because american people have moved to the left. >> my point is, i think chris' point is that he postponed this immigration, the speech on
immigration so that one would think he could capitalize on a bad news week for hillary clinton but yet and still, he went on to talk about immigration in a way that didn't seem to succeed. am i wrong with that, chris? >> we are talking about a woman who was under federal investigation before she got her party's nomination. there has never been a more beatable democrat in history. there's nothing else for him to talk about but her. just stay on her and you stand a real shot at winning this thing running away. >> all right. we'll be back. we'll continue. behold the power of protein in birds eye protein blends. ok. they're delicious side dishes with the protein of beans, whole grains.. ...and veggies! mmm good. my work here is dooooone! bird's eye protein blends. so veggie good. do not mistake this is a journey.ion. where maps give way to meandering. and schedules are left a time zone or two behind.
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only on directv. back now with the radio guys. guys, let's rip. can we talk about the shadow voters? are people talking about that? >> they are, don. as you know, during the primaries, every time there was a poll, they would undershow where trump was going to be and then he would blow it out in the primary so it's tough to track the trump voters. but what i think is really significant this week hillary by her calling him a racist and therefore kind of embarrassing,
if you're a trump supporter, you're a racist. she's ensured that people don't want to argue about it, they don't want to be called a racist. i think it's going to be even tougher to track who is going to be a trump supporter. but no doubt people are going to come out in droves to vote for trump. >> do you think it's come out in the reverse, that she's come out saying he's trafficking in bigotry? >> it was to tell people who were on the fence about him, you don't want to go with that guy, he's crazy, he's a bigot. people don't like her, and that's most of the country, and people who don't trust her, and that's most of the country, will they vote for her? i guarantee you there are a lot of people who will never admit
they're about to cast a vote for donald trump. >> let me talk on the large picture on the whole term of racist and bigot and so on. i believe that one of the sins for which the left in america really is going to have to answer to if there is a good god is that they have dinuted the terms racist and other horrible things of any meaning. i've actually coined an acronym on my show sixer, that the left doesn't actually argue with you, they call you one of those six things, seven things and that end all the discussion. i don't even know if it resonates. since every republican is called that anyway, i don't know if it matters. >> i have a linguist who is on later, and we talk about exactly what you're talking about now so i hope you stay tuned and
listen. it's in the next hour. i think it's a fascinating conversation. i think anyone has to admit that there are times on the left where the left throws those terms around for conservatives. but in this particular election, do you think, any of you, that donald trump, has he done anything to deserve any of that? is he trafficking at all in -- >> if i may just comment on one and you know i'll be brief because i always cherish the other people's right to speak, but i'm a jew and i wrote a book on anti-semitism, which is extremely highly regarded. this notion that the six-pointed star was anti-semitic, that's an example of just over-the-top foolishness. what it does is it cheapens real anti-semitism. a man that has a jewish daughter, orthodox jewish son-in-law, orthodox jewish
children, his other son is dating a jew, that he's anti-semitic is bizarre. >> i'll give you the last word. >> to dennis' point, if we want to talk about guilt by association, let's look at the millions upon millions of dollars that mrs. clinton and her husband have taken from some of the most bigoted -- the subjugation of women, the murder of gays that have given big bucks to the clinton association. >> john, he went too long. i'll see you next. >> all right. >> thank you, chris, thank you, john, thank you, dennis. have a great weekend, okay? we'll be right back. [ salesman ] congrats on the new car.
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donald trump speaking at a sold out fund-raiser. we'll bring you the latest on that. this is "cnn tonight." i'm don lemon. trump sending mix signals on the cornerstone of his campaign and that's immigration. clinton charges trump's campaign is built on prejudice. in the middle of a campaign that is dividing america, what do we really mean when we talk about race? here to discuss, alice stewart, van jones, maria