tv Smerconish CNN January 7, 2017 3:00pm-4:01pm PST
. >> happy new year from philadelphia. we welcome our viewers in the united states around the world. according to eye declassified intelligence briefing the hack of the u.s. election has been sourced to the one and only vladimir putin. the report says the russian president aimed to hurt hillary clinton and help donald trump, but the evidence remains frustrateingly classified. and trump seems dismissive. former nsa and cia head general michael hayden is here. plus last year chicago had more homicides than new york and l.a.
combined. is the surge tied to law enforcement? stepping back. and gop stonewalling kept scalia's supreme court seat vacant for 11 months with trump about to name his nominee, will democrat ds respond in kind. and finally, i grew up decidedly middle class and still think of myself as in touch with my roots. but the election outcome and a test i took and failed have caused me to make an important new year's resolution. this year i'm bursting out of my bubble. but first, russian president putin ordered an influence campaign aimed at boosting donald trump and harming hillary clinton. that's what u.s. intelligence found and what they told the president on thursday and the president-elect on friday. after being briefed, trump released a statement saying the outcome wasn't altered and his tweet blamed democrats for their own vulnerability. then last night came the release of a declassified public version. which left me wanting more.
having a president-elect at odds with the intelligence community forces the public to have to choose sides but we don't have enough to go on. as one who suspects putin did cause the hacking, i was nevertheless disappointed in reading the declassified report due to its lack of specificity. and when i said so last night via twitter, man, the immediate harsh response was indicative. i tweete last night quote, where is the beef. somebody please direct me to the evidence. i want to see more. and my observation caused something of a twit storm. it's classified, wholly s, dang, i used to like you, you jumped on the crazy train. or i've been done with this natty in sheep's clothing months ago. and i won't be watching this weekend. really? have we reached a point where a demand for answers earns such
disdain? here is how i followed up. i want an e-mail, text, affidavit, int ter september, something. i'm a trial lawyer and i deal in evidence, not generalities. people accuse me of doubting the findings, i don't. but given the stakes i want proof, not just assessment. joining me now the man with the expertise, the former director of the cia and nsa who's mem your is titled playing to the edge. general michael hayden joins me now. how can we, the public be sure? >> well, you raise great questions and frankly, welcome to my world, welcome to my old world in which an awful lot of things we know can't be shared because we need to keep going back to this well in the future, michael to learn things to keep america safe. i read the same document last night, i had the same sense of disappointment, i had more
understanding why it was a brick short of a load as you described it. but michael, again, let's go back to the language that we did read. high confidence in the definition of high confidence is multiple source ds, consistent with other information and good sources. and so when you've got the community coming together and getting high confidence judgments to these things, i think -- i certainly have confidence that that is a true story that was put out there, even though i haven't been able to see the fine print. one other point, michael, very quickly, is that the trump campaign, the trump transition team has not complained about the facts of the case even though they said some other things that want to seem to push the conclusions a bit off to the side. >> in any other circumstance, maybe that it's a brick short of a load wouldn't be such a problem, but because we have a president-elect now at odds with the intelligence community and general let me put on the screen the statement that he released
in the aftermath of having been briefed last night. he said while russia, china and other countries outside groups and people are consistently trying to break through the cyber infrastructure of our government tal institutions, there was absolutely no effect on the outcome of the election, including the fact there was no tamp erri tampering with the voting machine. the rnc had strong hacking defenses. in other words it sounds like he is saying there was no outcome on the so move along and casting dispersions on the dnc saying you were lax, it's on you. >> we are responsible for our own cyber defense, that's a true statement, incomplete. let let's deconstruct the entire statement. it didn't flus the election, we don't know that, that's unknowable. so we're done talking about it, certainly with me as an intelligence officer, that's just not anything we can
discover, certainly in the discover through intelligence information. most important to me, michael, was the front end of that comment which turned this issue into a larger globe wal, we got a cyber problem issue. i freely concede we have a cyber problem. that was not the issue yesterday. the point of that briefing yesterday, michael, was we got a russia problem. and the trump transition team tried to get off the x from that question by simply pushing it over here and saying we got to do better cyber security. they're walking away from the core issue, michael. which is the behavior of the russian federation. >> general, i read and you know from prior conversations enjoyed your mem your, in your book you said the people at the nsa including me come from the same political culture that motivates all americans, in the periodic debates we have had over security and liberty and my
liberal arts education had reinforced the idea that freedom was indeed a fragile thing. the context is you gave a speech two days after september 11 to the entirety of the nsa. and i think what you were saying is our object activity, we intel professionals, our object jek activity is being challenging, is he challenging the object jek activity of the entire intelligence community. >> he is rejecting judgments from the art and craft of intelligence, we believe to be objective judgments. i will be the first to admit, sometimes, occasionally they aren't correct judgments, i get that. this is very hard work. but the criticism of the intelligence community's judgments on this issue have been that the community is incompetent and politic sized and prejudice. that is simply not right. i think the dynamic we have here is we have a president-elect who has been able throughout the
campaign to by and large get away with creating reality in a shape that was useful to him at the moment. and now we have an intelligence community that doesn't do that. that creates a reality based upon their best understanding of the facts at that moment. and those two mindsets now are clashing right in front of us as we run up to the inauguration. >> you factor in general his failure to take a pdb on a daily basis. he said he didn't want to hear the same thing the same words every single day for the next eight years, a mistake? >> i think it makes the intelligence community's job harder. i like direct, i like often, i like exchange with the first client. but michael, that is just on the intel community. we have to adjust to the tastes and to the character and the way the new president learns. so we're just going to have to go back to the drawing board and
figure out a way how do we get into the head of the new president, the new legitimate president of the united states. and i have suggested in some other writings the gateway might be through tonight vice president who does get the briefing six days a week and whom the president does seem to trust a great deal. so maybe you put a lot of energy into how you brief him and let him be your messenger into the small meetings in the oval. >> there was a lot of concentration in that report that we each read last night about propaganda efforts by rt. i will put a quote up on the screen from the report of what i'm now referencing. i don't doubt any of that. but i thought that is not what we were expecting, that is not what we were looking for. rt's coverage of secretary clinton was consistently negative and focused on her leaked e-mails and accused her of corruption and ties to islam extremism. the report was heavily on that
and a brick shy of a load on the substance, your quote. would general hayden now say to your friends in the intelligence community, come on men, come on women, we have to show something, we have to lift the skirt a little bit to give the american public something so they know trump is not being full. >> jim clapper, the outgoing director of national intelligence expressed pretty much the thought you did. we're going to lien as far forward as possible to make this case. i agree with you, when i read the document, i wish we could have gone even further. i wasn't there. my instincts are the same as yours and james, boy, it would be better the more we got out there. and frankly, michael, putting that appendix in there in terms of what rt was doing, really isn't the core of the story when it comes to affecting american opinion. but michael, it's really important, if you are in the baltics, if you are in the ukraine, rt does create an
information bubble that really distorts reality for the people living there and that is somewhat of a strategic threat there. >> thank you for being gratuitous with your time. fra frustrates me the most about this is the way so many americans are suiting up in their usual jersey, my god, what happened to the day that partisanship used to stop at the water's edge? >> michael, we should be the one institution of government the intelligence community that is above the partisan divide and what we've seen since the election has been putting the intelligence community right smack in the middle of the middle lane of a hyper partisan atmosphere here in washington. michael, intelligence can't survivor in that lane, it will die. >> general hayden, thank you, sir. >> thank you. >> joining me now former house
intelligence chair and cnn national security commentator mike rogers. mr. chairman, respond to what you heard from general hayden. he shared my assessment, he has the expertise and you have the credentials, the report issued to the american people was a brick shy of a load. >> yeah, clearly there wasn't enough information to draw any of our conclusions on the outside. but what the general pointed out and those of us who are interested in trying to find out the level of confidence in an assessment by the intelligence community, you have to walk away from that thinking the cia had a high degree of confident, the fbi, and the nsa had a moderate degree of confidence. which tells me there is a lot of information that those analyst groups and they're all separate came to that conclusion that they think they're in a position to say that putin ordered it, they had an interest in at least impacting the election, i don't believe that they were for one
candidate or another. i think this he just wanted to cause confusion, lack of confidence and with all the debate we had over the last week they've been successful in that. >> right. in ordinary times, that would be enough. but we've got a president-elect who frankly has been costing his lot with julian assange. i want to show you a clip of what assange said earlier this week and then ask chairman rogers to respond. >> can you tell the american people a thousand percent you did not get it from russia or anybody associated with russia? >> we can say we have said repeatedly over the last two months, that our source is not the russian government. and it is not state party. >> mr. chairman, you said earlier this week somebody needs to march into donald trump's office and tell him who julian assange is. okay. let ds assume you walk into his office wharks
office, what is at the top of your list? >> first of all, you have someone who is a fugitive from the law, wanted on sexual assault charges that is why he is hiding in a basement for several years now. number two, he has caused the leak of information harmful to the united states national security along the way. i almost -- not seeing the inside information, you could buy the fact that julian assange didn't know that it came from a russian -- was caused to get to him through a cutout of the russian government. that's plausible. the problem is he has other information that he is eager to leak that would hurt the united states interest. giving him any creditability at all is harmful, it's not smart. and i argue at the end of the day it's going to be dangerous, because other nation states will use that as an outlet to hurt the united states. you should never give, a, a criminal this must creditability by engaging with the u.s. president let alone the information that he will
continue to leak in the days, months and years ahead. >> you have served at the highest levels of government. reflect on how you think this puts pressure on general mattis or general kelly at homeland security x these extremely well credentialed by all accounts individuals that trump, the president-elect has to surround him. how must they be feeling to the events we're describing and discussing. >> those folks in the intelligence business or the business of national security are obviously hoping for a bit of a change on january 20th. there comes a point where the campaign must end. for both parties, by the way, for both parties. and i think this whole public floging of the intelligence community over the last few weeks and the pushing of the intelligence community by the current president of the united states has been a disservice to the very difficult job that our
intelligence community has. this is the other part of this, is that it sends a message, imagine if you are in tehran, moscow or somewhere in north korea and you are thinking my regime, my government is up to no good and i want to help the using use, i want to give them information that keeps the world safe. if you have to make that determination that you are going to risk your life commit an act of treason to your country to help the united states of america, if you have this big public fight about the confidence and creditability of our intelligence services, not only do you hurt our folks moral, you will sending a message, if you don't trust them, maybe i don't trust them either. that's dangerous for the long-term health of intelligence collection so that the next president can get the information that he needs to make a good decision to keep the united states safe. so we need to take this out of the political debate as soon as we possibly can and get back to
regular order. remember, he is going to own the combination to every lock, he will have a key to every cabinet on january 21st, that intelligence community is -- he'll set all the priorities, his administration will set the collection priorities and where we go and how we do it. he will have the ability to do that. you don't want to damage the one institution that we have that is non partisan that doesn't look at the world in a partisan way that can collect that information to do and accomplish the kind of things you want. i think mattis and kelly are going to be just fine. they're great leaders, they are very strong national security credentialed individuals and i look forward to that first conversation in there, it would be a hoot to be in that national security counsel when mattis lays out an agenda that will be well researched, and it will be -- it would be a lot of fun to be in that room to hear that conversation. >> mr. chairman, thank you.
by the way, mike morell, channels a lot of your thinking and a great op ed in the times today which everybody should read. what are you thinking about all of this. here are the tweets already flowing in get at customhe is a russian agent. is this what we're in for for 2017, i ask to see the evidence. the former head of the nsa and cia share my assessment but i'm now the russian agent. coming up, president obama -- another one. i usually pay no attention to your bias. president obama's hometown was the number one u.s. city last year in a category no place wants to win, deadliest. is it because the chicago pd is stepping back, perhaps you saw my next guest on 60 minutes, brian warner, a former chicago cop is about to join me. you have a 911 call you go to
911 call, when you want aggressi aggressive patrol when you are breaking the law. >> you say they're not being as proactive. >> near not. how could you ask them to be and why would you you expect them to be. >> because it's their job. they signed on to do that there it's my job to go to work and listen to your 911 calls and respond to my 911. that's the basic ability of my job. so if you want me to do the basics, that's what i'm doing now. healthy, free, the world before me, the long brown path before me leading wherever i choose. the east and the west are mine. the north and the south are mine. all seems beautiful to me.
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as killings and shootings rose, police activity, it fell, and some say that is due to the ferguson effect. chicago had its own videotape showing a white officer's controversial shooting of black teen laquon mcdonald. for over a year the justice department investigating the chicago pd's use of force. consider this, in august of 2015, cops stopped and questioned over 49,000 people, a year later those stops dropped to less than 9,000, that's down 80%, at the same time arrests up by a third. a former chicago police officer he had 18 years on the force, wounded in action, suffered ptsd. brian warner now is the chair of the organization known as chicago police survivors. brian, i was watching on my sofa outside of philadelphia, my take away was chicago cops feel under siege, they're taking it down a notch. is that a fair assessment?
>> it's not. i will have to clarify what you saw on "60 minutes." i wasn't given the opportunity to finish my sentence. the police department was if you look back at 2016 what was happening you talked about the laquon mcdonald video and the mayor and elected officials blaming us and talking about a code of silence, nationally you had presidential candidates vilifying the police for political gain. more importantly, you had officers gunned down protecting the same sit tens protesting against them. and then you had law enforcement being ambushed and shot for just because of the uniform they wear. so emotionally the trauma coming from all the directions, had a dramatic effect on the police officers. i don't care what profession you are in, if you have so much trauma and that much energy being forced on you, you will have to step back, pause and reevaluate.
there was a reflection period, some officers stepped back and reevaluated, about you to go into a fetal position like our mayor suggested that never happened. the true reason why the crime -- not why the crime spiked, one of the major factors crime spiked is the aclu reports that been forced on the police department that report is a two page report that used to be a single index card and it's hindering and effecting the way officers police. it slows them down and slows down the in ability to stop more people. with all that said, the good men and women of the chicago police department that i'm embarrassed the people are putting the brunt of the blame on them took over 6,000 guns off the streets last year. if you think about the ripple effect that -- how many lives they saved, how much senseless violence did that prevent by taking those 6,000 guns off the street. they don't want to mention that. they want to talk about the police is laying down, that is why crime spiked, that is not why crime has spiked.
>> i'm glad that you are clearing the air and i hear you, it sounds like part of the key part of your interview got left on the floor over at "60 minutes," i want you to finish your sentences. >> thank you for giving me that opportunity. >> well, here is what i was unsettled by, the mcdonald case, we can run the video again, everybody has seen it, but the perception it left me with was that the chicago pd ldidn't lik the fact that a police officer has been charged in connection with this 17-year-old, the shooting death of the 17-year-old, he was shot 16 times and the video seems to show him moving away. let me just finish my sentence and then you can have the final word. >> i apologize. >> i said to myself, i would hope that the police officers response would be, hey we want something like that to play itself out in court, if a guy got shot 16 times who wasn't posing a danger to cop, maybe that cop was out of line.
that is what left me unsettled. you get the final word. >> okay. the reason the front line patrolman is upset he is a political animal. the police department didn't say don't release the video. when the facts play out in court you will see that. it was politic sized once again by our mayor. the only people who don't want the video released were the two people running for elected office. the state's attorney and the mayor. those are the two people who sat on that video because they had the most to lose by it. if the police department would put that video out explain the facts and let people know truly what happened that day when the facts come out in court, people will have insight they don't have right now and have a different opinion how police do their job each and every day. >> is there anything else that you came to cnn here today to get off your chest that you weren't given the opportunity to say on "60 minutes" on the first
of the year? >> i would just ask that when you just made several inflammatory, not inflammatory, people are looking at situations, directly after a police shooting, people are taking in the streets and protesting, ten minutes after the shooting in i believe it was baltimore or maybe new orleans, these people ran to the streets and milwaukee, they go outside, tipping cars, flowing rocks at the police. they don't know if the offender is black, the officer is black, they know nothing, they assume a police officer shot somebody so they must have done something wrong. we're people in your community going to work doing the right thing. when you vilify the police and keep bargsing them, you will have crime spike. >> i heard everything you just said. here is my final word.
i'm fine with everything you just said just so you also agree the bad cops need to get weeded out and those who exceed their authority using deadly force, they need to be prosecuted, that's it. >> 100%. if you know how we're trained in chicago and you know the state statute when you can use deadly force, when those facts come out in court we'll have a different situation. thank you for the opportunity and place pray our law enforcement. >> will do. my mailing address says pennsylvania but the election results were a wake up that i actually reside in a bubble. i have plenty of company on both sides of the aisle, can we do anything about that. and we have only had eight supreme court justices for almost a year, thanks to a block indicated after the death of scalia. will democrats do to what they did to mayor garland chris coops
is here. >> we will not settle on a supreme court nominee, if they don't appoint somebody good we'll oppose them tooth and nail. >> there is a new standard now, to not confirm a supreme court nominee at all. i think that is something the american people simply will not tolerate. coming up on "look! famous people!" we catch flo, the progressive girl, at the supermarket buying cheese. scandal alert! flo likes dairy?! woman: busted! [ laughter ] right afterwards we caught her riding shotgun with a mystery man. oh, yeah! [ indistinct shouting ] is this your chauffeur? what?! no, i was just showing him how easy it is to save with snapshot from progressive. you just plug it in and it gives you a rate based on your driving. does she have insurance for being boring?
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>> after supreme court justice scalia died last february, the republicans declared he would not be replaced in an election year. that action was unprecedented, they refused to hold hearings much less vote on obama's qualified nominee garland. the court remained at only eight members for nearly a year.
as soon as donald trump is inaugurated he will nominate a new justice. will democrats respond in kind. should they. joining me a member of the judiciary committee who will have say in this matter. you told me yesterday on seriir xm radio you feel they stole a seat on the supreme court of the united states. are you going to let them get away with it. >> we have to continue to uphold the role of the senate, our constitutional role and provided advice but not necessarily consent to a nomination of a supreme court justice. the republicans held this seat open for nearly a year. by refusing to not have a hearing and not have a vote. i think we should have a hearing and i think we should have a vote. because i don't think it's fair and responsible for us to do the same thing to them that they have done to us and continue to grind farther downward any possibility of our respect and support for the supreme court. but to be clear, i don't think
that we should vote to confirm a supreme court nominee who is well outside the main stream of american legal jurisprudence. >> what is you your gut on the list by candidate trump of the individuals he would contemplate putting on the supreme court. do you have a gut feel for them, i don't know that you have studied the list? >> i know a few of them. i do not know all of them. you are asking me for a gut feel. he was a candidate at the time running to try and win over the most conservative elements of the republican party, so my hunch or my assumption is that he may at that point have been putting forward names that would be among the most conservative he could possibly find among potential candidates. let's roll back here to the weeks after justice scalia passed away. before president obama nominated someone to the supreme court, i was calling on him to nominate a consensus confirmable candidate.
he certainly did that. judge garland, who is among the most seasoned, most senior circuit court judges in the entire united states has been confirmed by the senate of the united states by overwhelming by partisan votes in the past. he was not a partisan bomb throwing, not a judge who has a record of dividing, rather he is a judge of leadership and consensus and uniting the dc circuit. my hope is president-elect trump will turn away from this bitterness, change direction and nominate someone who is confirmable. what is not what the list put forward by president-elect trump as a candidate would suggest. >> i played sound going out of my last segment of mitch mcconnell. do we have that, if you do, roll it, i want to ask a question. >> there is a new standard now, which is to not confirm a supreme court nominee at all.
i think that is something the american people simply will not tolerate. >> but that is what they did it garland, right, that is exactly what the gop just did to judge garland. >> it is not only exactly what they just did to garland, what they did was even worse. they refused to even hold a hearing, let alone give him a vote in committee, let alone give him a vote on the floor. and i think in the hundred year history of the senate judiciary committee on which i serve this has never previously happened where a nominee for the supreme court, there were two exceptions where the nominees themselves withdrew. it has never happened that the american people were denied an opportunity to get a sense of what that nominee would be like by having thorough hearings. and i just want to bring us ahead to next week, if i could, we're going to have confirmation hearings on the foreign relations committee and five other committees next week.
as the trump administration, president-elect's trumps, his allies in congress try to rush through their nominees for attorney general, secretary of state, and others all in one week that will present us from doing our job as senators of having thorough and constructive hearings that the american people can absorb in a timely way. >> that is not right. senator, thank you, i appreciate you being here. >> thank you, mike. >> this week, the president-elect modified his controversial plan to build a wall between the u.s. and mexico, instead of making mexico pay up front, he says america can pay and then be reimbursed by mexico. the former president of mexico responded on twitter, in no uncertain terms, trump when will you understand that i am not paying for that fing wall. be clear with u.s. taxpayers, they will pay for it. president fox joins me from
mexico. mr. president, i am looking at a huge headline in today's "new york times," trump's insistence that mexico will pay for the wall has something changed, is mexico now paying for the wall or not paying for the wall? >> no way that mexico will pay for that wall. and on the other side, he -- his followers in -- that -- >> have there been any conversations that you are aware of of president-elect trump's incoming transition team with anyone representing the mexican government about how perhaps this could take place? >>. [ in audible ] >> was responsible for bringing trump to mexico while
campaigning, he has some friend within trump's -- it's incredible, but he keeps managing corporations like nissan, ford, gm, that he want to tax upon them if they don't build the factories within the united states. he -- he who doesn't learn about history is sentenced -- there is no way that global corporations, u.s. corporations will survivor by forcing them to manufacture within the united states. that is not the way to save jobs, he is absolutely mistaken on that. >> when you say i am not paying for that fing wall you are speaking in a universal language. president fox, thank you, sir. still ahead, question for you, have you ever walked on a
factory floor, have you or your spouse ever bought a pickup truck, if you didn't answer yes, you may be living in a bubble. i never thought i was, but i have my own personal new year's resolution and it is to burst out. >> now there . >> who knows what is happening youts side in their america, the bubble will be a fully functioning city state. >> that's more like it. (becky) he has enough energy to believe that he can jump high enough to catch a bird. (vo) try new beneful originals with beef. now with real beef as the number one ingredient. [and her new business: i do, to jeanetgo. jeanette was excellent at marrying people. but had trouble getting paid. not a good time, jeanette.
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working. their's was 77. and it was in the book "coming apart." the question is have you ever walked on a factory floor. who is jimmie johnson? not the coach. have you or your spouse bought a pickup truck? since leaving school, have you worn a uniform? murphy proved his point america's upper class had become and the detachment meant to the working class with interaction between the two was limited. my poor results should have prepared me for the disconnect watching donald trump's to the presidency. my being out of touch with 46% of the nation. then the christmas break brought further evidence i was living in a bubble. mine is a virtual gated community. defined by zip code or where kids go to school. my political registration. even the color of our christmas
lights. and the tv shows i watch. "the crown" than "duck dynasty." i pride myself of being well read, i am quick to discount sources due to the story's point of origin. my grandparents were eastern coal crackers. both of my grandfathers had black lung from working the mines. my parents raised my brother and me on the great middle class street. three bedrooms inside. we didn't have a shower until i was in the eighth grade. that bathroom renovation was performed by a prison inmate on work release. i went to public school. my first job when i turned 16 was a maintenance man at the local mcdonald's. as the years passed, like others, i unintentionally self sorted. it happened. i was reminded of my disconnect
when i had a meal with an octagenarian in florida. collier county, florida. the turnout was 87%. trump won by 45,000 votes en route to the florida victory. the breakfast diner was the bubble. my companion told me trump was the only shot of turning this around. never defining what this is. he said he is delighted that senate minority leader harry reid is retiring after quote all that spending. my retired breakfast companion enjoyed busine enjoy enjoyed his breakfast. in the meantime, i made a new year's resolution to be better grounded. meaning to have a greater awareness of those not living in my bubble and build bett
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you are live in the cnn newsroom. i'm pamela brown in washington. poppy harlow is off today. breaking news coming in to cnn. federal officials in south florida charged the suspected killer of five people at the ft. lauderdale airport and charges carry the possibility of death penalty. this as esteban santiago, 26-year-old, from puerto rico. charged with performing an act of violence at an airport. he is accused of picking up a handgun from bag claim and firing it into the crowded airport terminal. five people dead. six wounded. the airport packed with people not knowing if they were under