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tv   CNN Tonight With Don Lemon  CNN  January 30, 2017 8:00pm-9:01pm PST

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the department and then later released it, someone would leak it or people would find out anyway. she had problems with the law. >> parts of the law are constitutional, parts are unconstitutional. parts violate the statute, and parts are lawful. she could have said i will not defend the parts of the law that are unconstitutional. i disagree with the policy. she could have argued against his political blunderbus approach by being more subtle, new answered and sophisticated. instead, she said, i'm going to consider the whole lot together and not let anybody defend any part of it. that was wrong. >> stand by, i need to reset david. and we'll be right back. just stand by, everyone.
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this is the top of the hour, monday night massacre, president donald trump firing the acting attorney general for refusing to defend the executive order on travel restrictions for immigrants and refugees. and again, i want to get right back to these two yeah, david gergen, you are arguing a point, go on. >> well, she -- sally yates as i understand the story agreed to stay on at the request of the incoming trump administration. and they apparently had trust and faith, they won the have asked her to stay on. she's there, she's doing her job, and along comes this executive order that they don't check out with her, they don't get it vetted through the vuft is department. she like many other americans is it horrified by the result, and she feels it is -- there are at least parts of it are. she's unwilling to say, i'm not
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willing to follow this through. she knew she would be fired when she did this. it seems to me that was an honorable thing to do. i agreed to stay on. >> she should have resigned. >> i have to get to our reporters on this. thank you, gentlemen, i appreciate it. i want to go to elise lavit. sara murray and evan perez. bring us up to speed on what happened tonight? >> it's an extraordinary series of events. we had the acting attorney general sally yates who is an obama appointee, and had agreed to stay on until the trump apointee, jeff sessions as senator, got confirmed. we expected that was going to happen later this week, he today she sent a notice to the
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attorneys at the justice department ordering them not to defend this executive order that was signed by the president on friday, and then chaotically put into place over the weekend. and i'll read you a part of her statement in which she says that my responsibilities to ensure the position of the justice department is not only legally defensible but informed by our best view of what the law is after consideration of all of the facts. she goes on to say that she did not believe this executive order was lawful, and that's what she ordered the department to do. look, i -- from talking to sources all weekend. and you know how chaotic this weekend was, we know that she was struggling with what to do here, and we also know there were u.s. attorneys who were struggling on whether or not they could defend this. some of them did not want to. but obviously some of them did. because they felt that they had no other choice at that moment. she decided today to issue this
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order, and she knew once she did this, she knew that she would be fired. the president deserves to have an acting attorney general, who is going to defend his actions, his executive orders, that's what happened hours after she put this notice out to the justice department lawyers we know that the white house issued a statement for attacking her for being weak on immigration, and said that she had betrayed the justice department by refusing to defend a legal order from the president. don? >> so sara, what does tomorrow have in store, and does this white house know that they are in crisis mode right now? >> don't you know better than to ask what tomorrow has in store? under a trump administration, it could be any number of things, they are beginning to understand the gravity of what it meant to take so many people by surprise on this, even before the yates move today, the letter she put out, and donald trump's decision
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to fire her, i was hearing from people today, why would you implement this travel ban without having your attorney general in place. you know it's going to be challenged in court and you're not putting yourself in a position to defend it. donald trump did not have many many republican allies on capitol hill defending this travel ban today because of the way they rolled it out. key people in leadership were not consulted on this, and because they're members of donald trump's own government agencies that weren't sure how to implement this, that weren't briefed far enough ahead of time, which is what led to the chaos and confusion over the weekend. there's no doubt that this discussion will continue tomorrow, but the trump administration has made very clear they plan to do a lot of different things at once. and that applies to tomorrow as well, he's having a cyber security meeting, we're expecting him to sign an executive order on cyber security, and tomorrow evening, he is slated to name a supreme
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court pick in the evening. it is supposed to be another busy day in the trump administration. elise, i was going to you next. we won't do that, elise. what's the reaction to the state department to what we are seeing with this travel ban and the confusion and chaos this weekend today? >> well, don, just to go on sara's point to build on that, i mean, this is all done without having a secretary of state in place, and all of these countries usually, what would happen after a big policy move like that, those countries would be brought in, those ambassadors would be brought in to the state department, you would see all the ambassadors come in, the state department would brief them on these new changes. many ambassadors i spoke to today, said they have not talked to anybody at this state department. they're getting calls, some of these from some of these countries and countries who have dual nationals, from their paersons of students who are
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here. they don't know whether they should leave, come back. now you have -- the state department memo, this is what we've been talking about this dissent channel. what started with dozens is now more than 100 career diplomats and civil servants who are saying, in this memo, not only does this policy not keep america safe, it actually harms america from preventing terrorist attacks. it's really a -- these career diplomats serve both republican and democratic administrations for decades, this is a very rare opposition to this policy, but certainly one that's provided for in the state department regulations for something like this, where they have a lot of concerns. >> and you know, sara, you warned me about that, you said i should never ask anyone what to expect because it is the trump administration. with that said, evan perez, the
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president has also replaced the head of immigration and enforcement, right? >> and customs enforcement. >> what do we know before that now? >> well, it's not exactly clear what happened there, don, we know that the president has now appointed an acting -- another head of that agency while they still haven't even nominated anybody to fill that job, that's the job that has to go through the senate. and so we know that the ice and customs and border protection, were two of the agencies that were scrambling this weekend on how to do, what exactly to do with this executive order. and even into today, there was still a lot of -- a great deal of confusion, i want to address one quick thing from your panel that was at the end of the hour, the question of whether sally yates should have just walked away and resigned, we had the situation like this at the end of the bush administration, the beginning of the obama administration, where the obama people came in and they wanted
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the acting attorney general, mark phillip at the time, they wanted him to sign off on some gitmo orders, and he refused, he said, this is something that your new attorney general should sign. the obama administration said, you're right, and they walked away from it, they did not force the issue as happened in the last couple days here. >> they didn't fire him? >> they didn't fire him. the issue didn't come to a head, they didn't go around his back and do this. this is what happened here, you had the trump administration decided to put this order into place, they did it secretly, without consulting her, and then expected her to sign off on the defense of an order that she disagreed with, that's what happened here in this -- and it's what makes this so different from what has happened in the past. this hasn't happened in decades, this is a crisis that hasn't happened in decades and certainly this is something that the trump administration caused
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by virtue of the way they rolled out this executive order. >> everyone, stand by, and thank you for your expertise on this, i want to bring in the creator of finest labs, contributor to the new york times. carl bernstein joins us by phone, and also, page pate. so glad to have all of you on this evening. what is happening here, are we in a constitutional crisis? >> i don't think we're there yet, don. sally yates decided to step aside, because she had both legal and moral problems trying to defend this executive order in court, but the trump administration moved quickly, they went ahead and appointed someone else to serve in that capacity, but i think we're seeing a pattern here that really is problematic. it seems they have some impatience in the white house that they cannot wait until they have their people confirmed and approved and into the job before
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they start making major policy changes that may very well have constitutional or legal problems. you needed an attorney general to review this thing before it was signed, and before it was implemented, and i think sally yates' primary problem was it wasn't done that way. nobody talked to us about it, you can't ask us to step in and defend this thing, when we don't believe in it. >> who's calling the shots at the white house? >> well, it's hard to tell, season the it? obviously, donald trump has the final say, it sounds from all reports that mr. bannon, steve bannon has expanding influence in the white house, not only over domestic policy, you know, he was a co author reportedly of the president's inaugural address. it was his dark vision that animated that address. but also, his -- it appears he was the guiding force in this
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executive order, and in getting it out the door the way it was done. i think sean's -- the priebus has to accept responsibility as chief of staff for how this was done too. you may -- the president may have some additional consequences -- i think there may be trouble brewing about the way the white house is doing these -- taking these important steps without conferring with his full national security team. it's shocking to me that general mattis was not brought into this, that the homeland security general kelly was not brought into this at the time. and the state department mr. tillerson was not brought into this. but i want to make a particular point to general mattis now, this is the second or third time the reports have been out that he's been incensed that things are happening without being checked with them before they do it, and i have a sense -- my reading would be that when they
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put out the word that they were going to move on torture, they were going to move affirmatively on reinstating torture. the next day, president trump said i defer to mattis. my thought is he put his job on the line. i think these guys have some leverage in the cabinet, but the white house has done this more than once to people like mattis, they act -- bannon acts, they don't check it out. >> we saw this, david, during the campaign, he would say something and do something and then his surrogates would have to come out afterwards and clean it up. many times they found out about it as they were sitting here on the set. i want you to stand by david. >> that's a very good point, don. >> lots of moving parts here. we have more developing news, i need to get back to evan perez. our justice reporter. >> reporter: one of the big questions tonight whether dana
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boente who just took over, whether he has the full authorities of the acting attorney general. i'm told by people who have been looking at this tonight that he does, he is a senate confirmed u.s. attorney. he was confirmed by the senate in 2015, and he served in the justice department for 29 years. he's been around for a long time. and because he is a senate confirmed u.s. attorney and now acting attorney general, he has all the authorities including the ability to sign surveillance warrants, which is a big part of the job, these are warrants that come across the desk of the attorney general every day, in order for the nsa, the fbi to be able to do some of the most important national security jobs they do, and he has the authority to sign off on those, that's something that was going to be a big issue for the trump white house.
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if they couldn't find someone to fill these shoes, since they were going to fire sally yates. that's what we're told, that's the ruling from the lawyers who have been looking at this all evening, he does have the full authority of the acting attorney general. meanwhile, we wait for jeff sessions to come in. >> and that could take longer now, considering what's happened, democrats will probably have a lot more questions for us. i want to get to you now. you're fired works really well for donald trump on television. i've been watching you all weekend. this started with a refugee ban, which you see as a muslim ban. and snowballed to a crisis of leadership, what do you make of what's going on. and all of the developments that have happened this weekend. >> president trump's muslim ban is a muslim ban.
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preside i want to do the muslim ban, find me a legal way to do it. he would do a temporary or permanent ban of muslims, he said openly, islam hates us, not radical islam, islam. he wants to do an extreme vetting of muslims, so yes, call this what it is, it's a muslim ban. anyone who says anything else, it's an alternative fact which is double speak for a lie. my wife was born in okeechobee florida, there were no other minorities, for about 20 years, people thought she was latino, even though she's south asian. she told me three days ago, she says, for the first time in my life, i'm worried about the safety of our two american muslim kids in this country. it broke my heart, i have these two babies, eastbound rah ham,
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2 1/2 years old. and my warrior princess, who's 6 months old, both of them are adorable and cute, they look just like sara, there's a saying of the prophet mohammed. even if the day of judgment is around the corner, plan the a seed. it may look like one of the four horse men of the apocalypse is present in bannon. you know what i'm going to tell my kids, i told my son right before i left, i said, you're going to resist. this america belongs to you, and i want you to succeed and i want you to thrive. there are going to be haters who try to bring them down. you're going to outsmart them, outdebate them, outtweet them. you're going to outhustle them, out dream them, and you will forgive them. the beautiful thing about president bannon is the
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following, he has awakened a multicoalition of the willing. slumbering giants, kings and queens have woken up and taken to the streets. we want to defend america, and we're coming for the crown, steve bannon and we're going to take it and we're going to win. >> i have to get to the break. our breaking news coverage continues right after this. is found in the audi a4. with one notable difference... ♪ the highly advanced audi a4, with available traffic jam assist. ♪
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mondays night massacre, president donald trump fires the acting attorney general for refusing to enforce his travel ban. i want to bring in cara swisher. before we talk about the tech part of this, what do you make of what's happened this evening?
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>> well, i don't know what to say, the last 15 minutes, i'm waiting to see what happens next on the show. it seems crazy, one thing after the next. and tomorrow is full of busy inning thises, an announcement on cyber security, supreme court justice, still dealing with this muslim thing. it seems insane at this moment. you guys are getting a lot of good tv out of it. it's quite a story, i guess. >> i usually try to limit my tv time on weekends and i couldn't tear myself away from cnn this weekend, especially yesterday evening. >> yeah, i think game of thrones is going to be a relief when it comes back on i think. a little light watching. >> here's what you tweeted. tech leaders come out strongly against trump's muslim ban. first part of that expression to follow, right? tech companies have been among the most vocal critics of the travel ban, are you surprised by the response? >> no, i think they were ready to, they had been very quiet and
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embarrassed, i came on last time, i talked about, they should say something, because this was coming, when it did arrive, they were shocked by it, they were told by people in the trump administration, presumably peter teal, i remember he said, trump shouldn't be taken literally but seriously, he should have been taken literally from what he said, i think tech was shocked by it, and initial ly -- i put that out, because i said, now you have to say something. i started calling them on friday night, texting and e-mailing all of them, and said, when are you going to say something? they started to, it started to dribble out on friday night and saturday. mark zuckerberg had said something early on on his facebook, and then the rest of them started to, and they increased in vorciferousness. read hastings said it was
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unamerican. >> can we get to some of these responses? >> sure. >> you said these tech guys are going to have to get used to a very political atmosphere fast. is that because of young people who use their apps and their product are so politically enga engaged? why is that? >> i think their employees, i think the employees -- i've been hearing from thousands of employees at these companies, tech companies in the good times like to talk about how they're changing the world. the world has changed because of all their inventions and now they have to be part of that. they tend to avoid it, and say, we're just a platform, surely immigration is a massive issue for tech and talent and this visa directive that might come out over work visas. you know, gay and lesbian rights
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is a big issue in california. you know, all these things are important to tech, and obviously, they have some things they want from the trump administration, less regulation, they want all that money back, repatriated cash, on this issue, it goes to the heart of what silicon valley is. >> i want to ask you about peter teal, i want to get to this uber thing, i found it fascinating. a lot of people use uber. i got this whole delete uber thing this weekend. >> here's what you said, trump has one big supporter in silicon valley, pay pal founder peter teal. every time you open your mouth, you look more and more like you got played by steve bannon to the detriment of tech leaders who you somehow got to bow and scrape to the new
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administration, you're referring to the fact that teal got elan musk and uber's ceo on to the president's advisory board. >> yes. into that big meeting, the silent meeting of tech executives who could never shut up suddenly became silent which was fascinating to me. >> uber is facing a big backlash, telling people to delete uber, and to start using lyft. lyft comes out and says, we're going to make a million dollar donation to immigrants and after i guess figuring out that they were in major trouble with this, because uber sent people to the airports, they also got rid of their surge pricing so they could pick people up from the airports. and social media went crazy about this. >> i know people want to jump on uber, in that case, theyen didn't realize what was happening at the time. they got caught in a situation, if they had put surge pricing in, people would be furious, or if they left it in, which would
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have happened in that case, because the airport was blocked and the taxis went on strike. >> saying we're still operating? >> they shouldn't have done that. the thing happened so quickly, these things happened, i think they weren't -- they're not attuned to the fact that we're in highly political times and everything you say is going to be scrutinized, people had a relatively better year than before, in terms of controversy among uber. it allowed lift. i think more to the point, the ceo of uber is on this advisory panel along with elan musk and several others, people in tech are not as tal rant to them being there it's going to be
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difficult for them to be on it, and continue to complain there and make their case, and serve on it at the same time. i think that's going to be a push me/pull you for the two of them. >> sergei brent went to one of the marchs? >> well, he's a refugee. he's an actual refugee, and he said so. today at google protests, it was an symbolic walkout of google. he told the story of being a refugee, and he is, and so a lot of people, the head of microsoft, immigrant. the head of google, immigrant. >> steve jobs was the son of a syrian migrant. >> syrian imgrant. this particular issuesome at the heart of these things, net nutrality, it's going to be one
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disastrous encounter with the trump administration after another. >> it's going to be interesting to watch this play out. joining us on the phone now is george terwilliger who was an attorney general under george h.w. bush. i want your take on what just happened so far. >> thanks, don. it's nice to be with you. i'm either up early or up late. what happened at the justice department tonight is quite sad for the department. and for the acting attorney general. >> if an attorney general, acting or otherwise, has responsibility as the lawyer for
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the executive branch. then her job is to either work that problem out or to resign. if she can't work it out to her satisfaction. it's an bomb nation for her to order the lawyers of the justice department to stand down from doing their jobs. we have an adversary system of justice as we all know. and the job of the justice department's lawyers is to go into court and be an advocate in that adversary system for the legal position, and when the acting attorney general took the stand to make herself an umpire, and stand between and arbitrate between the president and legal opponents of this executive order. if she didn't resign, she had to
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be fired and rightly so. >> i want you to listen to chuck schumer from the senate floor just a short time ago. >> i would say this to the president-elect and his minions, there are a lot of people who voted for president trump, not the hardcore. and they are appalled by the simple ineptitude of this administration. substantively is even more important. how can you run a country like this. >> what's your reaction? >> well, senator schumer has no shortage of a flair for the dramatic, that's for sure. or for taking political advantage of things that come his way. but my reaction to it, don, really having a distance looking at this across the ocean for a moment. we're seeing a bit of a political revolution in the united states right now, and
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revolutions sometimes are a little messy, particularly at their opening stages. it's obviously true that the senate where senator schumer is the minority leader has contributed to not having his team in place, maybe this would have all been handled differently, if jeff sessions would have been confirmed. he's well qualified to be the attorney general, and he will be confirmed. the fact that politics are being played with that process is troubling. >> thank you. >>? deputy attorney general under president george h.w. bush, thank you, i appreciate it. we'll be right back. milast. otezla is not an injection, or a cream. it's a pill that treats plaque psoriasis differently. some people who took otezla saw 75% clearer skin after 4 months.
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monday night massacre, president interrupt fires the acting attorney general for refusing to enforce his travel ban. i want to bring in brandon friedman, a former obama administration official. i'm so glad that all of you could join us this evening.
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i want to start with the story of you, and an iraqi interpreter who helped u.s. troops overseas, he was detained this weekend at jfk airport. tell us what happened. >> so he worked for a long time to come here, this is a guy who deserved to get in the country. he had first signed up to work with us in april 2003 this guy is fearless and totally committed to assisting u.s. troops. he worked for a long time for it, he got his visa approved and got the final signoff last week on wednesday. and he was supposed to fly over here on friday, and while he was in the air on friday, that's when the president signed the executive order banning people like him from entering the country. when they got to the airport, he was there with his family, they let his family go after a few hours, and held him there for 19
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hours, and to me, the whole thing was utterly disgraceful that someone who had protected u.s. troops for so long, would be treated like that, as soon as they set foot on u.s. soil. >> brandon, hameed spoke to the press after he was released on saturday, let's listen? >> what do you want to say to donald trump? >> i like him, but i don't know, this is a policy, i to be the know. he's the president. i have an immigration visa. me and my family, because i work with the u.s. government. i support the u.s. government during the war, when i came here, they say, no and they said i broke the rules, i did something wrong. when i get out, i surprised all those people, waiting for me, they support me, they don't know me, they never meet me, they leave everything and come to support me.
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>> i like him. this guy may have been on his side, but now he's not winning any fans -- any future fans. how is he doing now? how is he doing now? >> he handled that situation with a lot more grace than i think i would have been able to. to your question, it's been a long weekend for him. he's still in new york with his family, they're planning to get started with their new life here in the u.s. and we're going to do everything we can to make them comfortable and help them out, and try to return the favor in some way to what he did for us when we were in iraq and in danger. >> what would you like to see happen with his executive order moving forward? >> they have to rescind it. this is one of the most absurd things i've seen a president do. this is -- it's not only unfair, it's a moral failing on our part. these people risk their lives,
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the lives of their families to make sure we were safe and taken care of in combat. and to repay them by telling them that they're not entitled to come here, i think is a real failure on our part as a country. we've always done the bear minimum to help the translators who helped us, and now we're talking about barring them completely. it's unconscionable. >> thank you. i want to bring in randy. you posted on facebook, you had been planning to relocate to the u.s. from singapore with your 2-year-old daughter. she has a citizenship and green card. walk us through what happened. >> well, we're living in a basic state of confusion and fear. we've tried reaching out to the embassy. the lovely people at the embassy have been helpful. but they don't have any information other than what you are reading in the headlines. i was just there this morning, two hours ago, they wanted to help, but they don't have any information other than what the
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executive order states. and they wished us the best of luck and to keep in touch. we tried calling the airlines, the airlines do not have any information. they will allow us on a plane with our green card. they cannot determine what will happen to us on the other end. we contacted several organizations that assist, in what type of travel documents that are necessary to travel around the world. they don't have any information on it, so it's trying to hear news that green cardholders will be allowed back in, that information has yet to make its way to the other side of the world where we are, we're not feeling that on the ground here. >> i understand that officials told you that if you were to show up with your green card in hand you may be put in handcuffs and detained? what was your reaction when you heard that? >> so that's what officials told us, that's what we've been
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reading from the news. we've not been told any official communications of anyone if i will be allowed in or if i will be sent back or detained. we don't know, we just hear all these stories on the media, just like you do, and we try to get any communication, so nothing. and i feel -- i just feel sad and heart broken we have gone through this long process of what we call vetting, we have gone through two years of vetting, all the required paperwork and interviews, and when we finally got the -- i just got the dwreen card this past december, and we're trying to make our way back to be with family and start our new life,
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and then we get this news a few days ago, it's like the door just slammed in our face, and we have nowhere to go. our visas are expiring soon here in singapore, and now we don't know if i will be able to get in with my husband and daughter. >> what do you you're there, i see your daughter who is asleep, i'm glad she seems to be doing well, you said you wanted to relocate to the u.s. from singapore with that beautiful little 2-year-old, what do you want her to know about the u.s. what should she think of america now? >> i always thought america is where i can find happiness and freedom. i spend my entire -- my whole life running away from oppressi oppression. i studied very hard and got scholarships in some of the best
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universities in the world to be away from the mess and be able to get freedom and happiness. >> randy, you said this ban is unamerican? >> i definitely feel that way, i've been living abroad for six years, supporting american business interests, i've been paying my taxes, i'm a proud american, and then to be told at the 11th hour i won't be able to return home. our visas are going to expire here in singapore, i can't go back to america, i'm unsure what will happen when we go back to america. we obviously are not going to go back to iraq. our visas here will expire because they're dependent on our employment. we don't have anywhere to go until we get further information on what we can do.
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>> keep us updated. thank you so much. >> thanks to brandon and also your 2-year-old daughter. thank you, we really appreciate it. coming up, president trump's travel ban. does it make the u.s. safer? just checking my free credit score at credit karma. what the? you're welcome. i just helped you dodge a bullet. but i was just checking my... shhhhh... don't you know that checking your credit score lowers it. just be cool. actually, checking your credit score with credit karma doesn't affect it at all. are you sure? positive. huh, so i guess i could just check my credit score then. oh! check out credit karma today. credit karma. give yourself some credit. sorry about that.
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breaking news tonight, after defying president trump's travel ban, acting attorney general sally yates has been fired and replaced about dana boente. here to discuss now is michael weiss. former national security operative, joel rosenberg, they're all here. so glad you're here. you see president trump's travel ban from these selected country system counterproductive and is a bonn aanza for isis. why do you say that? >> again, i'm not american. i don't speak from a partisan perspective. only from a security perspective. was one of the people who was training coalition operators who are in the field right now, fighting the propaganda fight against isis. my role was to play isis. so i can tell you that this is a
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recruiting bonanza for isis. >> so for many people, first of all, why do you say -- why is it a recruiting bonanza? they'll play it and say america hates us? >> well, one thing is, remember, groups like isis, no matter what you do, they're still going to hate you, let's be clear on that, but we shouldn't be giving them ammunition. they wanted this to be portrayed as a war against islam, against all muslims. they just released a statement saying at least the two previous presidents hid their hatred for arabs and muslims. now that it's out in the open, this will make people open their eyes. >> i want to bring in joel now, you say it's right for the president to protect the homeland. but this order was poorly drafted and needs to be fixed. how would you fix it? >> sure. it's good to have a president
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that finally will call out radical islam. we haven't had that in eight years and who is willing to take bold, decisive action, build a national security team who is serious about defeating isis and other radical islamic terrorist groups. so the objective is right. the problem is how it's been done. there's a series of unforced errors, right? some of those, the green card issue should have been dealt with when you sit around the table with your principals and say, what are the holes in this draft? right? people that were translators for us and other heroes, you know, that would have come up. but it seems like it wasn't well vetted, ironically, since it's a whole document about vetting. but taking several months to review and improve the vetting process is an excellent idea. there are some gaps, though. if you're going to do these seven countries, why not
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afghanistan? as just one example. we've been fighting there since 2001. seems a little odd, based on the principles that we think we understand about the document now, why wouldn't afghanistan be on the list, as just one example? >> and why not saudi arabia and other countries where -- >> exactly. gaza. >> and it's been said that not in places where donald trump has businesses located. so that's an interesting point. i'm sure that deserves more reporting, but i have heard people say that. >> i'm not sure if he has a business interest in afghanistan. so i think that's probably a bit cynical. >> do you agree with him, we finally have an administration that will call out radical islam, or radical terror? >> to me, it was a non-argument, the nomen collate clature issue. the former president called it isil. the i stands for islamic. middle east scholars and
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academia, it's accepted to say islamist and islamic. that to me is a red herring. two of the countries on the list, iraq and syria, consist of people, muslims who are fighting the war against isis on the front line, keeping america safe. i just got off the phone today with a guy called mustafa, a political director of a brigade called the mutasa, which is backed by the pentagon for one purpose of the war in syria, to fight isis. they cannot fight assad, hezbollah, russia, iran. the pentagon is backing him for that purpose. he said, we already have a target on our back because we're seen as american proxy. we used to go on the media and say, at least we can defend america because they're helping us liberate our country from extremists. now, how can we go on the media and defend them when they're not even invited there, when we're
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held under suspicion of being the kind of terrorist that wants to kill us and americans? so the hypocrisy, is it making us safe? no. it's making the world much more dangerous. and it's alienating the sunni islamists that we need. >> so you think we're less safe with this ban? >> yeah, this is what the brits call an own goal. shooting our ourselves in the foot. self-destructive ultimately. >> donald trump's chief strategist was behind the executive order. along with steven miller. this is steve bannon, speaking to a christian conference in rome, saying we're at the international atomic energy agency -- we're at the beginning stages of a war. >> we're at the beginning stages of a conflict, if we do not bind together with partners and other
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countries this conflict is only going to metastasize. they have a twitter account up today, isis does, about turning the united states into a river of blood. if it comes in and tries to defend the city of baghdad. and trust me, that is going to come to europe. that is going to come to central europe, western europe, and to the united kingdom. and so i think that we are in a crisis, like i said, a crisis of capitalism and the underpinnings of capitalism. on top of that, we're now, i believe, at the beginning stages of a global war against islamic fascists. >> bob, what are your thoughts? >> don, it sounds like preaching for the first crusade. this is not going to be taken well in the islamic world. seriously. the countries that have been banned, it makes no sense at all. and this administration, even putting any sort of ban on is going to look very bad. we're going to lose allies. 99% of our intelligence in the middle east comes from allies,
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from iraqis, from syrians, and the ref of st of it, and now we saying, you're second-class citizens. you're not even allowed in the country. and now you look at iraq, we have 5,000 troops there. the parliament there wants to throw the americans out. how do you fight the war on terrorism? none of this makes sense. there's nothing more impervious to fact and reason than political fantasy and this is what bannon represents. >> and he now has a top seat on the national security council. he's going to have a role in some of the most sensitive operations facing this nation. what do you think of that? >> well, what they're doing, don, they're going to set up a parallel intelligence service. that's why the director of national intelligence was thrown out. the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff was thrown off. they're going to find their own facts. alternate facts. and that's what they've done so far, and it's going to get
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worse. and i just don't trust bannon to figure this out. he's got no experience in policy, no experience in coordinating government agencies and you look -- saying we are less safe. these bans are going to get americans killed. >> i've got to run. that's the last word. thank you very much. we'll be right back. and now, i help people find discounts,
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audi pilotless vehicles have conquered highways, mountains, and racetracks. and now much of that same advanced technology is found in the audi a4. with one notable difference... ♪ the highly advanced audi a4, with available traffic jam assist. ♪ this is cnn breaking news. president donald trump takes big action tonight. this is cnn tonight, i'm don lemon. president trump firing the acting attorney general, an obama appointee, for refusing to defend the executive order on travel restrictions for immigrants and refugees. and tonight the new acting attorney general orders justice department employees to defend the president'srd

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