tv CNN Newsroom With Brooke Baldwin CNN March 24, 2017 11:00am-12:01pm PDT
we have to at least try to see where this goes and the feeling is among some member tos of the leadership similar to what we are hearing from the white house, is two potentially bad scenarios, pulling the bill or having it fail. they believe pulling the bill is worse. at least if they have it fail they showed they tried. people are on record and then the political chips will fall where they may. >> wolf, it's extraordinary given that pretty much every republican member on that house ran on repeal and replacing obamacare. >> it's fascinating some of the conservatives may get in line and more secenterists are leavi, not only from the freedom caucus. >> there are other republican
voep voept -- votes hanging in the balance. >> he has not revealed how he will vote. joining me now live from capitol hill. thank you very much. that's the million dollars question, how will you vote on this bill? congressman, it's anderson cooper, you're on the air. how will you vote on this bill, congressman? clearly having problem with the congressman's audio. gloria, it is all coming down to this, what does happen? >> well, as you were saying before, sean spicer says no plan b. i think the president will take a very close look at the people who voted for this and the people who voted against this and will remember who did that -- >> but does he expend political capital? >> the white house says they're going to move on. this is it. they're going to move on and try
to do something that in fact the president has said sort of mused about maybe we should have done tax reform first and i think they're just going to move and if they can at some point come back to this, would they? yes, but you cannot over state what an embarrassment and what a problem this is not only for the president of the united states who made the decision to go first on this, because after all, every republican as you point out, campaigned on this, voted for it, a repealing of it. 50 times in the house. that they can't now get this through when it's real, when it's real. >> i believe we have contact with the congressman. thank you for joining us. the big question for you, how will you vote on this? >> look, this bill is not perfect. the process has been horrible the washington process but in
the end seven years ago we were left with something that is unsustainable, we were left with something hurting americans back home, that's hurting health care coverage and it's a binary choice, a choice of continuing down a path of affordable care act that's not working or repealing it and repairing it and moving forward in the process. i ran on that in 2009 that i was going to repeal and replace obamacare i'm going to vote yes so we can repeal an start the process of of repeal and replacing obamacare. >> do you have a sense of other februaries of the freedom caucus if they are moving forward? >> i don't. the wednesday group, the friday group, i got a lot of friends on both sides of the aisle, what i'm hearing is everybody has their opinion. the real problem is there are two choices either move forward and repeal this bill that everybody wants us to repeal back home and what we all ran on
or you're going to allow it just to continue. because you heard the president and i've got to give the president a lot of credit. he has worked with everyone. i spent an hour and a half in the white house with him. he has listened changed things and actually helped the process and i think at the end people have to realize this is part of moving forward and he wants to get this done to move on to tax reform and i'm hoping others will come on board an vote as well. >> if it does not come to a vote or does not pass, what then? what happens? >> i think like the president said and i'm a businessman as well, you can't just keep going back and forth and back and forth. he wants to move on to other things. i would like to see tax reform being done, i hope we can move on to that, but at this point it's a binary choice, you're either voting for the repeal and replace process to begin or allowing obamacare to continue and move on to something else.
>> the critics say what's the rush? why do you have to do this so quickly? why not go back fix it, make it better, you said yourself you hate the way the process was dealt with, the chances of passing in the senate are very minimal, a much smaller republican vote, why not go back and improve it so you love it and your colleagues love it. >> i hope it does go to the senate, that is the process, let the senators do what they think, send it back, let's keep it moving but the american people want to see things getting done, we have immigration reform, tax reform, all things on the plate. we can't just continue to say well let's go back to the drawing board. it's time to move this process forward. time to move on to the next agenda item. again, i might not like
everything in the bill but i know it's the opportunity for us to repeal and replace and repair and move this forward and get on to the rest of the agenda. >> thanks very much for joining us. >> thank you. >> david chalian, political director. the big picture here? >> i keep thinking back to on election night when the results were clear and we saw that donald trump had taken the oval office and republicans had the house and the senate, the first thing that people discovered or started analyzing and talking about well obamacare is gone, that's clear they have the house, the senate, oval office. >> and have been talking about it for seven years. >> of course. and i can't believe we're sitting here watching this potentially fall apart. again, they still have to cast these votes so we don't know exactly where this will land but if this is going to go the way sean spicer's briefing seems to suggest that it is, paul ryan and donald trump are going to be
the ones that saved obamacare and kept it in place is a bizarre outcome. >> and what's more bizarre is republicans will be blaming each other no doubt if it loses the president will blame the democrats an whatever else, but you not only have republicans blaming each other but you have house republicans saying the reason we can't do this is because we don't trust the senate republicans and it's just this incredible mess that i don't think donald trump had any idea what he was walking into when he became president. >> someone who was sitting in the white house tonight of the election, we fully thought obamacare would be dead long before now, so the fact that it is still alive is not something i think the obama team, most democrats expected in any way. the interesting dynamic which gloria touched on that's happening now there's no doubt the man plaqcconnell is workinge
sweetener -- no way he's keeping the cuts and especiasentials, at of them are going to walk the plank. >> can you explain for our viewers what is happening now? are they still making calls trying to wrangle votes? >> what's happening now is they are going one by one and no longer talking about gee, what do you want in and what do you want out? that's been done, this will be the bill that will be voted on. it's set what they are saying to them are the political arguments and making process arguments. you have got to start this process, if you don't start it here it won't start anywhere, taxes have to start in the house of representatives constitutionally, so will you move to process forward? and that's the major argument they're make k, frankly not unlike 1986 when the house took up a tax reform bill had almost
no reform as president reagan, bradley or dep hahart wanted it. some defeated that rule, and i remember ronald reagan came up to the hill and spoke to house republicans and said i pledge to you if this doesn't come out right in the senate, i will veto it but i have got to have this process move forward. the problem i had with jack was whether he would rule for the process to go forward and he said no, couldn't, hated everything in the bill and he turned around on the stair above me and said shut-up i don't want to hear you talk about it again, i'm voting for it we have got to keep the process going. that's what is happening right now. >> we have all seen the house of cards. how tough, how bare knuckles, you're saying one-on-one, talking about somebody saying
shut-up. >> well that was a member to a staff person, so it's easy. >> working for jack as a staff person he had the right to say anything he wanted to me. having said that member to member let me walk you through what i think is going to happen, this will happen next, this will happen next and that's what members are balancing right here a bill they don't like everything and, they like some things not everything, is it more of a risk to send to the senate or more of a risk to stop it in the house and see what happens after that and that's a balancing act but these conversations aren't vicious kfr conversations they are here is what i think what do you think? >> we have seen concessions for memb members of the freedom caucus, work requirements for those w who -- sooner into medicaid
rather than later and that's brought some of the freedom caucus firmly believes this doesn't do enough to bring down premiums and expand choices for the american people, problem is when they made concessions for some to have more moderate republicans fell off the vote so today we had vice president pence working hard on the hill as you indicated one-on-one with some of these people. >> that's why it's so complex, it's like whack a mole. >> what i'm hearing more than anything donald trump wants people to go to the floor, have a record, but those that are no aren't concerned about what donald trump thinks, more concerned about their constituents back home and that's more motivating.
>> david gurgen what do you think? >> i understand the instinct on the part of the white house to stand up and be counted who was loyal and who didn't for later purposes. but the fact is he's in a position right now where he needs to unify the party and everybody on the line is paying a potential price back home and from the point of view of trying to unify a party this is not what you due, hug each other and saying let's be positive we're moving on. >> but donald trump is used to walking out of negotiation. if he didn't like a deal, we walked off the deal an moved on and this is what i think he is saying now, we have to get this other with and move on. >> in the end david, you know the speaker well, you used to work for him. it's his decision not the
president's decision, it's paul ryan's decision. >> it is a decision that paul ryan and mccarthy and the leadership will ultimately make, but this is one you want to have as much team support for making this decision and at least i presume that the stories i saw about the speaker going down to the white house were correct. that was one place you could get everybody with an opinion in the white house same place same time as opposed to calling the president up on the phone and address the decision head on. the president has done everything he can do, with one exception, time. >> uh-huh. >> and you can take more time if you so desire and move. is something going to have to happen on health care in the next two years? yes, and everybody working with the president knew this, secretary clinton wanted to do -- raise taxes.
every republican some form or another wanted the market to shift over to the market and that's what we're going to have to have it because aca does not have a long life expectancy here because the costs are going to drive people away. >> president trump is fooling himself if he thinks he can lose today and just move on like tax reform is going to be a slam dunk, the last time was a very difficult task that involved president reagan's leadership. we're not through with health care. republicans said they would do something about it they campaigned the past seven and a half years through four elections and then have one house vote and then say too bad? there are issues -- the affordable care act may not be in a death spiral as much as republicans argue, but the congress and white house probably need to address if they refuse to do that who takes the blame for a system that continues to get worse.
>> let's listen to sean spicer explain from his perspective and the speak eaer's perspective wh repeal and replace obamacare comes first. >> wouldn't it have been wiser to work with the freedom caucus first to work on infrastructure? >> we talked about this since 2010 and every republican with the exception of probably a handful that they would do everything they could to repeal and replace obamacare and to get in and say hey, you should have done something else wouldn't be fair for the american people who said okay i'll vote for you but i want you to fulfill this pledge. >> do you feel, david chalian, that the president was really enthusiastic over these past few months since he took office in making sure this was the first issue on the legislative agenda? >> yeah, i think we've seen what donald trump looks like when he
puts everything on the field, i think we saw that during the campaign in stocome of the dark moments, i know sean said he was doing everything he possibly could. i think there will be a lookback and i don't know that the republican leadership ton the hill feels donald trump did everything he could, so that may be revised and again if indeed the vote goes down this relationship between ryan and trump will be forever changed because of this moment and how they move forward together i think is going to be a really determinative thing for the rest of the agenda. >> i think when you look at next steps, if this goes down, the question is whether you now need to do things incrementally as oppo
opposed to these massive bills a where you do play whack a mole as anderson was saying, and go back to health care and say this needs to be fixed and that needs to be fixed i don't know whether republicans would play on that and dave, you may know more on that than i do, but the question is these massive things given the polarization and the congress will be done anymore this way. it seems almost an impossible task. >> the roll call of the house of representatives a little more than an hour away, another fight up on capitol hill, this one involving the investigation over the trump campaign's possible ties to russia. you're going to hear what the republican leader of the house intelligence committee did that is now infuriated several members of his committee. this is cnn's special live coverage.
snoo another major story unfolding on capitol hill. one is close to donald trump now volunteering to be interviewed by the house intelligence community with ties to russia. stone saying it isn't his bag of tricks, manafort's -- ukraine, carter page who allegedly advised the trump campaign on foreign policy saying he's also willing to talk. want to bring in manu raju. we are hearing tuesday's hearing has been cancelled? >> reporter: that's right. that's prompting a lot of concern of people on the committee who believe they should have moved former.
former national intelligence committee officials to talk about russian meddling and contacts and any alleged coordination that may have occurred during trump campaign and russian officials, devin nunes said he would not move forward on this because they would have a private classified meeting with james comey, and mike rogers to get briefed going forward but democrats are furious. they believe it's going to prevent the public from getting a clear understanding of what's happening in russia, and adam schiff is joining calls criticizing devin nunes and i asked him if he does not agree with others who believe devin nunes is not fit to sit as chairman. >> as i said we're we are not going to get in a -- era because
they were mentioned a press story and i am highly concerned about that. >> to take evidence that may or may not be related to the investigation to the white house was wholly inappropriate and of course cast grave doubts into the ability to run a credible investigation and the integrity of that investigation. >> do you believe that he can still run this committee or should he step aside? >> ultimately that's the decision that the speaker needs to make. and i think the speaker has to decide just as well as our own chairman whether they want a credible investigation being done, whether they want an investigation that the public can have confidence in. >> reporter: now anderson, it is significant that these three former trump advisors have agreed to come forward. nunes said he did not want to bring them forward because he wanted them to voluntarily come
forward. and carter says he wants to clear his name and does not believe he's been treated fair by the democrats on this committee, just before coming on air he told me his presence is that he would like to testify in public not in a private setting a because he does not believe that the committee democrats would treat him fairly and says he's tired of these innuendos, page willing to go public, the question is will they agree to have public testimony that may not look so favorably from the trump campaign trying to distance themselves from russia. >> would this classified briefing be on tuesday and any word on when the next public briefing would be? >> reporter: we don't know, devin nunes suggested he's still open to a public hearing, did not commit to a day, but a new focus going forward to demand a public hearing, because much of
what this committee does is in secret. >> thank you very much. back now with the panel. i mean, i don't even know where to begin. >> let me ask you, anderson because you had that amazing interview with carter page. you got to talk to him and he was described as an important policy advisor for the trump campaign. >> which is why i said allegedly, because the timeline is very strange. then candidate trump was under pressure to kind of name significant people who were his national security team and finally after some delays he came out with five names one he said carter page phd, that seemed to indicate they had met. i talked to carter page who claimed repeatedly in russia and elsewhere that he attended meetings with candidate trump. upon further questioning what
carter page meant by meeting he says he was using meeting in the russian term of the word which means he attended rallies that donald trump gave like in bismark, north dakota with 25,000 other meetings and i said does that mean anybody who has been to a rally with donald trump means they have been in a meeting with donald trump? apparently he likes to stick with the russian meaning. >> you spoke with another former advisor? >> who feels the same way that you do about the closeness of carter page to donald trump. >> and we should point out that the campaign itself within a short amount of time started to distance themselves from carter page. >> and paul manafort, but i spoke with roger stone today who wanted to point out -- don't forget paul manafort announced this morning he was willing to testify before the committee without a subpoena and very
short order also heard from roger stone and carter page and speaking to carter page he made it clear he says he has nothing to hide an wants to clear his name and this letter from his attorney his lawyer says mr. sohn is eager to -- because of the way he has been portrayed. so now they are ready to testify, some publicly and we will see whether the committee wants to do this. >> but it is interesting how they are characterizing the relationship with -- now seems like paul manafort was a bystander. >> a summer intern. >> a staffer and certainly carter page as well. >> one thing i think is interesting, nunes and schiff
used to do two different conferences and i think there's clearly some rift there and may need to call for special counsel to come look at this because there's clearly some internal strife there and i think to get to the bottom of this, we have to remember this is all about russian interference and the rest is collateral damage. >> virtually every democrat on that committee right now is saying just that but you don't really hear that from republicans. >> and it's interesting because the democrats were playing pretty nice from the beginning they wanted this to be bipartisan, more so on the nat side burr and warner still have a pretty good rapport and it was a matter of time before the dam was going to break on the house side. a lot of people are calling for an independent investigation, but now with these individuals of willing to testify publicly
may have a different definition. >> what's also irritating to the ranking democrat adam schiff is that the is chairman now cancelled an open hearing i think scheduled monday with james clapper -- either monday or tuesday next week with former director of national intelligence, cia director john brennan, former acting attorney general sally yates and it was going to be an open meeting and now for some reason devin nunes is canceling that. >> they had a right to object, it's been planned for some days, i think what some draemocrats wanted was to hear from clapper and yates on patterns of how the russians interfered, to set up
the narrative of how this unfolds an then to show what the various individuals who have been implicated in all this what they did and how it fit sboos t -- fits into the narrative, now look, isn't it interesting this american did this, a and this american did this, that's what they were hoping for. and have a right to be angry, but for the three guys who have come forward, they ought to have the chance to come forward. >> the snares involving presidents speaking out for themselves they may have things to deny, may say they have done nothing wrong, their interests may not be necessarily in line. >> but they will be under oath, they will be under oath.
>> i don't mean they would be telling a lie, but telling the truth could create problems. >> who knew what when, which is what people are not focused on, it's the collusion, roger stone certainly alluded to this if there was information previously known about plans to leak the e-mails about the hacking that's a problem whether it's criminal, that's not for me to define. >> i think part of what's happened is politics has broke up this week in the intelligence house committee. shocking nunes made a mistake and schiff came out and said some things he shouldn't have said. if you want to lower the temperature and work together in a bipartisan fashion, put some time in, calm down, we got a lot of time to go here. all i'm saying is take some of that time. it doesn't hurt to take some of that time to sit back down, look
at some things and then bring all these people. >> usually this house intelligence committee, senate intelligence committee there usually is cooperation between the republican and democratic leaders. >> and they have gotten to a political spin. >> i'm not sure they had the resources to do it to be honest, this investigation has grown and grown and grown, and you've got members of the senate and house going into vaults at langley looking through thousands of pages of loose leaf notebooks, and seems this undertaking is growing and growing, i'm not sure they are ready. >> the speaker saying he does not have the votes. the vote could happen less than an hour from now. we have a lot to talk about. you're watching cnn's special coverage.
in less than one hour the house of representatives will be casting vote os on a critical tt of the trump presidency, will the republicans have the votes the repeal and replace obamacare. congressman, thanks much for joining us. >> thanks for having me. >> you're planning to vote in favor of this legislation to repeal and replace obamacare. but what do you think? you've got your finger over there. is it's going to pass? >> well, look, it's touch and go, these things tend to be decided at the last minute and we're certainly in that situation, but we will wait for the votes an see what happens. >> what would be smarter from your perspective if it looks like it's going to fail for the speaker, majority leader to just
pull it say we're going to think about it work on it we'll get back to you or let this vote go forward and have an embarrassing defeat. >> i'm not sure about the quote of embarrassing defeat. look, i'm a big believer in when you finally schedule something, karr carry it through, the members have lhad a lot of opportunity o participate, i'm very proud of what the speaker and president have made. i think they have been representative to all sides but there comes a point on these things when you have to go in and press a button red or green and so my advice would be to go ahead and vote. >> congressman, it's anderson cooper i was wondering if you could describe the impact that the president has had on the
bill? >> i met with him fairly early about the deputy whip team. he was very knowledgeable about the bill, very engageing, strategic in his thinking, high energy, and said be open to changing the bill, if people bring you a good idea no matter where they're from, take it and work with them, and he's been true to his word and he's excellent in this deal making and consensus making and if it doesn't work out it's not his fault. i think congress has to look at itself. >> what is the next step if it doesn't work out in terms of repeal and replacing obamacare. >> well, then you have to move in chunks, we have a chance to
get every american covered to get the tax credit designed for their care. ours is going 69% and we're down to a single provider so we don't really have a lot of options but obviously if this solution doesn't work, sit down and try and craft another one. >> thanks very much for joining us. >> wolf, may pleasure as always. >> we will be speaking with a spokesperson from the coke brothers, who are offering to support republicans who vote against this health care bill, our cnn special live coverage continues in just a moment.
welcome back, quite a day in a short time the house set to vote on the bill. cnn's phil mattingly is with us what do you hear. >> reporter: it just doesn't look good, the most interesting element is everything they have tried over the last couple of days has ended up not working or in some cases backfiring, one interesting thing in talking to aides the last couple hours trying to recognize when did the bottom fall out, when did things fall apart? and that's a question we're going to be looking back to if this does indeed fail or gets pulled from the house floor, but i'm hearing it's not the conservatives, or the freedom caucus but it's the moderates. and months ago i was told repeatedly keep an eye on them,
new jersey, pennsylvania, new york, if they start the flee this thing will go down. that's pretty much exactly how this went down. i've been told privately a lot of the the tuesday group members are not in line and not coming over in part because of the compromised language they tried to hand out to the conservatives, that leadersh end up going along with, so result of them trying to schiff to thi the conservative side, they didn't bring in tfreedom caucus side, you know it's short and any of the undecided, undeclared -- what it would do
things going forward? we don't know, i can tell you what's what's going around capitol hill g.o.p. sources, that's their biggest concern about what the president wants to do right now, put this on the floor so it's an open question whether or not that's going to happen but as recently as a couple minutes ago, as of right now still scheduled for a vote. >> we will be watching closely, as soon as you hear anything thank you very much. >> james davis from freedom partners, a group linked to the coke brothers, you oppose this legislation and you're telling republicans in the freedom caucus and elsewhere if you get punished by voting against it you will come up, freedom partners will come up and help them with money, right? >> we have seen republicans run on the idea they're going to repeal this an this current
legislation does not do that and so we want to stand by those who take position and let them know they're not alone. >> this doesn't repeal? >> it doesn't repeal. this keeps all the mandates and regulations in place that have driven up the costs of obamacare premiums over the last several years and also uses the tax credit as a subsidy just virtually indistinguishable from the obamacare subsidies so there's a lot we need to do to fix health care and this bill doesn't do it. if you repeal it then focus on individual solutions bills you can put forward to take care of the vulnerable population that everyone agrees those with preexisting conditions and then push those pieces of legislation through congress, through the legislative process, i think that's a better path. >> it's not going to be -- if this goes down it's not going to be another huge bill it's going to be step by step by step?
>> absolutely. that's one of the major criticisms we had with obamacare, from the start, so why do this? we'll get better policy when we focus on individual problems and also more politically palatable. >> the president, according to sean spicer, we just heard him at the white house briefing says the president has committed everything he can, he understands this is it, this is do or die, if you don't do it now forget about it he says it's over with, you've got to pass this legislation now, why is the president wrong? >> because it's more important to get it right than fast, this is an opportunity to get it roog right, so if it doesn't pass they need to go back to the drawing board, and figure out how to put the pieces of legislation together. >> you are very well plugged in
with conservative republicans. what's going to happen? >> i don't think it's going to pass. it looks like with moderates also jumping ship on this bill that i don't predict that it passes. >> stay with us, david chalian, yesterday a lot of people were pretty upbeat those who liked the legislation believed the president would get it done but today met with pes michl. >> mike pence described what was an intense meeting with the freedom caucus left the meeting tight lap lipped nipped. >> all david. david gergen.
>> and the idea that jim is talking about is -- makes good sense but you have to understand one thing about it, all that will be done under regular order which means you will need 60 sen votes in the senate. people supporting that strategy has to understand that's what it mean, this will not be done in regulation, you have to do it in constrictive regulations, and you have to physical the byrd rule. >> is there a concern that the president will feel burned? the president has talked about moving on -- already talked about wishes maybe he had done
infrastructure or tax reform, is it possible he will want to move on? >> i think he's told us a while, he said if we lose this we ought to just live with obamacare, of course that isn't good for the country, if this goes down you're going to live with obamacare and let it go into a death spiral, that's what they expect. i actually think that would give the democrats an opening and they could come forward, we're delighted we saved obamacare we know there's problems and we would like you the republicans to work with the fixes and make sure it doesn't go in the death spiral so when the republicans refuse to do that as they will, the democrats can say when it does go into a death spiral they
can say we tried to work with you, who is going to be left with the tail on the donkey? >> the public. >> well, i agree with that. >> the voters wanted changes wanted something done and now not getting anything. >> they don't like this bill. >> well, i was just going to talk about that because the recent polling shows this bill has a 17% approval rating, so if you're a member of congress do you want to kind of walk over that cliff voting for a bill that has a 17% approval rating and i know we go district by district by district and some won by an overwhelming margin they can clearly make their case but if you are a moderate republican and these essential health benefits ten essential health benefits have been eliminated from the bill like maternity benefits, substance abuse, mental health coverage, you're never going to vote for
affordable care act the house of representatives is expect today vote on the republican health care bill, but what happens is up in the air right now. the house speaker paul ryan, here he is seen leaving the white house a little while ago. he laid down the reality for president trump as of many aides there they don't have to votes and short falls emerging despite the president's ultimatum to either pass the plan or get stuck with obamacare. anderson, this is a critical moment right now. >> it certainly is, the house vote is expected about 3:30 p.m. i also wanted to play new sound from the freedom caucus skeptical who had in many cases refuse today back the bill. listen. >> there's a lot of emotion in the room. people feel strongly about trying to find a way to -- their