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tv   New Day  CNN  June 21, 2017 5:00am-6:01am PDT

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>> this is "new day" with chris cuomo and allise allison camara. >> republicans are now 4-0. they won georgia's special election. they won south carolina's election. karen handel winning the most consequence house race in history. so the democrats failed. will they learn lessons from that? we will see. >> we will see. and also republican leaders in the senate plan to unveil their health care plan tomorrow. but how will they quell the frustrations being vocalized by some in their own party about the secretive nature of this entire process. plus, why won't the white house say whether president trump believes russia hacked the
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u.s. election. a lot to cover during n"new day here. ooh, those democrats waking up this morning, they're hurtin'. >> oh, yeah, they are licking their wounds this morning. that is for sure. this has been a major loss for democrats, not just for jon ossoff. they poured so much time and money into his campaign, some $20 million-plus. again, major loss for ossoff and it points to major problems for the democrats going forward, not just leadership issues but an agenda issue as well going forward for them. make no mistake about it, a big win for handel. a big win for the president as well. he came down to the district to hold a fund-raiser for handel, even though handel down played what she could the national implications of the race and the president. but last night it was all about
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handel and the president. >> and a special thanks to the president of the united states of america. >> is there were chants of "trump trump trump" at that victory speech last night. you know, you heard chris mention at the top of the hour, 0 for 4 when it comes to democrats and these special elections. democrats were unable to try to take a seat there in south carolina where ralph norman ended up being the winner there. he also had aligned himself to donald trump. that race ended up being much closer than some expected but close just doesn't cut it when it comes to politics. brooke? >> jason, thank you. . meantime, white house press secretary sean spicer will not say if president trump believes that russia meddled in the 2016 presidential election saying he hasn't talked to him about it yet. how's that possible? joe johns live at the white
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house with more. joe, how is that possible? >> reporter: anybody's guess, quite frankly, brooke. sean spicer, well, he was back in front of the cameras for the first time in eight days but lacking on some of the answers, including to one subtle question about russia's involvement and interference in the last election. sean spicer now five months into this administration still can't say where the president stands. white house press secretary sean spicer refusing to say whether president trump believes russia interfered in the 2016 election. >> i think i have not sat down and talked to him about it specifically. >> reporter: dismissing the unified assessment of the nation's intelligence community. >> it's very disturbing because this was a serious attack on our democracy and at the top of the united states government there ought to be a level of concern. >> reporter: spicer's refusal to answer this basic question adding to the mounting
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credibility issues facing the president's spokesman. >> i have not had an opportunity to have that discussion. i have not asked him. honestly, i haven't asked him. i can get back to you. >> reporter: president trump has addressed the issue with varying responses. >> as far as hacking, i think it was russia but i think we also get hacked by other countries and other people. i'll go along with russia. could have been china. >> reporter: but mr. trump does not appear too concerned given former fbi director james comey's testimony that the president never asked him about russian election meddling. attorney general jeff sessions reflecting this in testimony last week. >> i've never received any detailed briefing on how hacking occurred or how information was alleged to have influenced -- >> meanwhile, "the new york times" raising questions about why the president's fired national security advisor general michael flynn continued to sit in for the almost daily intelligence briefings from cia
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director mike pompeo for three weeks despite concerns across government that he may have been compromised by the russians. >> we told them that we were giving them all of this information so that they could take action. >> reporter: pompeo, ha was appointed to his position by the president in january, refused to answer questions about whether he knew his own agency's concerns last month. >> i can't answer yes or no. i regret that i'm unable to do so. >> reporter: this as the white house faces growing pressure on how it will respond to the death of otto warmbier. >> it is a total disgrace what happened to otto. that should never, ever be allowed to happen. >> reporter: president trump implicitly casting blame on the obama administration. >> frankly, if he were brought home sooner, i think the result would have been a lot different. >> reporter: and tweeting, without elaboration, that china's efforts to help north korea have not worked out.
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however, you might want to interpret that presidential tweet. it is likely to be part of the conversation this morning as the secretary of state meets with his chinese counterparts. the president later today expected to fly off to iowa for a campaign style rally. chris and brooke, back to you. >> thanks, joe. appreciate it. let's bring in our panel, cnn's senior political analyst, ron brownstein. cnn political analyst april ryan. and associate editor and columnist at real clear politics, a.b. stoddard. so, professor brownstein, when you look at the numbers leer, what is the tale of the tape in these democrat losses in south carolina and, of course, georgia? >> i think if you look across the board, president trump picked four republicans from pretty republican districts for his cabinet and republicans held all of those seats. so there is an element here of
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holdi holding. on one hand i think republicans particularly saw in georgia one encouraging sign. they polled republican leaning voters who were ambivalent about president trump by making this less of a referendum on him and more on who do you want to see as speaker. on the other hand, you look across the board at all of these special elections, democrats ranch better than they did just a year ago in 2016. in georgia 6, karen handel wins by 4 1/2 points. that says when you get to places less inherently tilted toward the republicans where president trump's approval rating is closer to the national average of around 40% than what it was in this district at 50%, those kinds of changes put those seats as risk. democrats have a shots at the house. they have no guarantee of the house. in that way we are pretty much where we started before these four elections happened. >> democrats were hoping for a shot at the georgia 6 because
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the president only one by one, one and half percentage points. though this is a ruby red district. a tweet by a republican -- business as usual isn't working. time to stop rehashing 2016 and talk about the future. the future. 2018 mid-terms. how do democrats turn it around? >> brooke, democrats have to find their footing. they have to find some energy. there's been a lot of resist movement activity. there's been a lot of -- we are not happy with this -- but it did not translate in the polls last night. and brooke, in another interesting piece, ossoff did not get fulton or dekalb, his base. so there needs to be some kind of reset. there needs to be i guess like myth romneitt romney had that e sketch moment. they need to figure out who they
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are. there is disease in this nation. the base is just not energized right now. >> so, a.d., when you win, it's easy. no real reason to diagnose success. but when you lose, you get into the acronym for failed. future always involves learning. what are the lessons for the democrats? >> well, i do think that they can comfort themselves with what ron was talking about, that they grew their numbers so much in a district that was long-time republican district and they're really making strides. but close is no cigar and i think they do have to listen to congressman molten and focus on a policy agenda. they do have an energized face. but when all of the millions from social media for the georgia 6 race come out of the district, it is a problem.
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though he spoke like a moderate and played down his criticism of president trump, focused on local issues. they're going to have to think about candidates espousing a policy agenda that gets back to winning back some of the working class white voters in some of these districts where they're really stretching themselves from a blue district into a purple or red one in order to take back those voters notion year. i think they have to realize you can't just get national excitement behind these individual races because people in california are upset with trump and sending a big collection. that's not going to cut it. >> ron? >> i want to add real quick. i agree. look, if you look where trump and the republican party is, the biggest opportunity for democrats is in these white collar, more affluent better educated districts. but this is a reminder that not all of those districts are the same. in the election last year hillary clinton won only 28% of college educated whites in georgia as opposed to almost
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double that in a place like colorado. they are going to have to move beyond that into more of the blue collar places probably, even though most of them might be white collar. they are going to have to be able to compete across the spectrum to win back the house in 2018. >> a.b., we're going to have ron johnson out. we're going to have senator ron johnson on. one of the few republican senators who say, yeah, i know what's in the bill, it is a good bill, we're going to move forward with it. what are the big selling points for them and how do they explain this secrecy that has so many within their own ranks upset? >> well, it is hard to explain the secrecy. it doesn't take a lot for john mccain to criticize his leadership in the clips that you've been playing this morning but it certainly took a lot i think for senator mike lee of utah, who's been in the working group, to step out and say, people in the working group who are supposed to be drafting this bill and doing these -- handling these negotiations have been left out. >> he's frustrated.
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>> that is really a real high level of sort of resentment that they would take that public against their leaders. so the secrecy will always be a big attack surrounding this bill. the components of the bill will be explosive no matter what because it will irk trying to find a balance between what is a soft landing for states where they expanded medicaid. are tax credits sufficient enough to cover the cost of the new kind of coverage for people who are older or sick. will people be priced out of the new kind of coverage, what ezra was talking about, whether or not premiums in the end go down. republicans will own the outcome so they're really scared of this compromise from both sides. but the secrecy decision obviously was they made a decision that both choices were bad, to come out and take this public would expose them to criticism for all the interest groups in the democrats and maybe even president trump which
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ended up happening anyway. so they took it behind closed doors hoping that in the interest of speed they can get beyond this because republican leadership sources have told me if this fails by the end of july before the august recess starts, they're bailing on this for good and moving on to taxes. >> so, as we follow that, april ryan, it is your day job to sit in that briefing room each and every day and ask tough questions of the press secretary. you've heard the line, "i don't know," "i can't respond," "i haven't talked to the president about that." you got that on a couple issues. but when the press secretary was asked specifically yesterday about russian meddling in the 2016 election when you know all of the president's intel chiefs have said, yes, it was russia, why can't they say yes? >> because there is an investigation going on. and they have a lot of time before it really comes down to the president having to say something, brooke. they're trying to be very judicious in what they say and when they say it and how they say it.
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it is a strategic tactic. we all pretty much know where the president is when it comes to russia. but right now they're trying to hold tight and keep it so they don't cause themselves any more pain. it's about credibility. it's about where sean stands. sean is siding with the team in not giving the information that we are looking for in russia. >> grab some water. sorry i caught you -- >> choked up. >> -- on this issue. it is a tough job. it is a tough job. we appreciate you asking all those tough questions and coming on. thanks to all of you this morning. republicans, they have blasted democrats, as we have been talking about health care. they've blasted them for not being transparent when it came to obamacare in '09 and 2010. why are they rushing to passion the bill that really no one's seen? we'll talk to a senator who has been part of the health care group working on this. what they know next. as moms, we send our kids out into the world, full of hope.
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and we don't want something like meningitis b getting in their way. meningococcal group b disease, or meningitis b, is real. bexsero is a vaccine to help prevent meningitis b in 10 to 25 year olds. even if meningitis b is uncommon, that's not a chance we're willing to take. meningitis b is different from the meningitis most teens were probably vaccinated against when younger. we're getting the word out against meningitis b. our teens are getting bexsero. bexsero should not be given if you had a severe allergic reaction after a previous dose. most common side effects are pain, redness or hardness at the injection site; muscle pain; fatigue; headache; nausea; and joint pain. bexsero may not protect all individuals. tell your healthcare professional if you're pregnant or if you have received any other meningitis b vaccines. ask your healthcare professional about the risks and benefits of bexsero and if vaccination with bexsero is right for your teen. moms, we can't wait.
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so when i got my ancestry dna results it was a shocker. i'm everything. i'm from all nations. i would look at forms now and wonder what do i mark? because i'm everything. and i marked other. discover the story only your dna can tell. order your kit now at senate majority leader mitch mcconnell promising a vote on health care as early as next thursday. the problem is -- nobody really seems to know what's in the bill, even in his own party. we get that they're eager to get something done before the july 4th recess, but is this the way to do it? to make the case, republican senator ron johnson, the chairman of the homeland security, and he is part of the working group trying to hammer out the health care bill. so you're on the two important
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committees here really if you look at it. senator, always good to have you on "new day." thank you for being here. what do you make of this process? is it fair criticism to say it has been very secretive? >> well, first of all, the decision was made to do this through reconciliation. i don't necessarily agree with that but that was the decision made. so you've got a bill that had to be crafted by republicans. from that standpoint it's been a very open process within the republican conference. somebody's got to write a bill. now leadership will write a bill. what i've told leadership very clearly is i'm going to need time and my constituents are going to need time to evaluate exactly how this will affect them. i personally think that holding a vote on this next week would definitely be rushed. i can't imagine, quite honestly, that i'd have the information to evaluate and justify a yes vote just within a week. >> what do you make of that? obviously you have senator mccain being snarky about it but saying that he's not going to vote on a bill that he hasn't seen. you're hearing that from paul,
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you're hearing that from cruz. mike lee went even further and he's one of the guys tasked with drafting it and he says, "i don't know what's in it, i share your frustration." >> i'm in this working group as well. the purpose of the working group isn't to actually write the bill. it is to really discuss all the issues. it is very complex. in two meetings i saw the wide spectrum of opinions within the republican conference trying to fix this mess of obamacare. my suggestion was let's break this into two parts. let's pass something to stabilize the insurance markets that are literally collapsing under obamacare. that was my counsel two months ago. unfortunately, we didn't do that yet. but that's the minimum thing we have to do. that's the minimum legislation we have to pass, is something to stabilize the markets that are collapsing because of obamacare. >> is part of your idea to have the federal government put through the subsidies that the president is threatening which is having an effect on the
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destabilization? >> i don't like the fact that these markets are collapsing, that premiums have doubled under obamacare and if we don't do something they'll skyrocket again but that's the reality we're facing. coming from the business world, i kind of am big into reality. that's the reality we have to deal with. i think it is our responsibility to stabilize those markets, pass something that we really don't like, but i think we should do that first and foremost. >> the speculation is that the secrecy is, in part, practicality, how to get it done quickest, but also pragmatism, that mcconnell and maybe others don't want people to know what's in here because you've got that huge price tag of lives -- 23 million people who may lose care, and that caps may be reintroduced into how much care you can get, and that pre-existing conditions may well be compromised. you know that that's not going to go over well with big groups of your constituents so you are doing it in private. >> first of all, the house passed their bill. that's been out in the public
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demain. the senate is using that as a framework. again, within the republican conference it's been a very open process. now we're going to draft a bill and that will be made public. i want to fully vet it in the public. i want to make sure that my constituents have enough time to provide input. again, i'm not going to criticize the process unless we start taking the vote way too early -- >> that's what your leader is telling you he wants to do. >> well, you know, that will be a decision he'll make. but i've told him unless i have the input from my constituents and have the information i need to justify a yes vote, i wouldn't be voting yes. >> so you think there is a good chance mcconnell will put this up for a vote if he's got guys who are good soldiers but pragmatic like you who say, i'm not going to vote for it if i can't sell it? >> i'm not going to speak for the leader whatsoever. what i will say again is these markets are collapsing. we do have to pass something to stabilize them and from my standpoint, the whole goal of our effort ought to be to fix our health care system.
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that's a really tall order because obamacare has really messed it up. >> you think it is worse now than it was before obamacare? >> absolutely, it is worse. >> even though the rates have increased and premiums are less? >> no. chris, premiums have doubled under obamacare. >> but the rate of increase -- the rate of increase during this period of aca is less than it was before it and you have so many millions more covered in ways that they weren't covered. >> chris, on the individual market -- that's primarily what obamacare is. on the individual market, premiums have doubled. i don't think that's ever happened in our health care history where premiums on the health care market have doubled, in some cases tripled. that's because obamacare is incredibly flawed. >> you're being a little self-selective with the data, aren't you? some of those markets have cratered, but there are complex reasons for that. some of those states haven't taken advantage of the law. they didn't want to. they set themselves up for
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failure. and in other ones you have some endemic problems you need to address. >> obamacare is primarily addressing the individual market. nowhere near the number of un uninsured. about 20 million people. of that, about 10 million are on the individual market. more than half of those already had the insurance. i think close to 16 million on medicaid. half of those already qualified for medicaid. obamacare was all about the individual market. it has really messed up the individual market. that's what they have to fix. for a long time i've been saying what our efforts need to be directed toward is repairing damage caused by obamacare. then work on restraints, cost, improve access. you do that through consumer driven free market competition. that's what actually works. if i really target a metric, it would be how much of every elt had care dollar is actually paid for by the patient.
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in the growth of health care costs, that's a much longer discussion we'll undertake here in the next couple weeks. >> people need to look up two things for themselves. one, what was the rate increase before the aca and what is it now. >> individual market. >> but all the different markets matter. that's how you determine overall cost. senator, thank you formakering the case, as always. >> have a good day. the white house refuses to answer simple questions from reporters. what's behind the constant string of non-answers to the plez president's thinking? david objectionle rod is next. z. . . . . .
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white house press secretary sean spicer having a tough 250itime answering a simple question five months into the trump presidency -- does the president believe russia meddled in the u.s. election. sean spicer has repeatedly been unable to answer this question. >> i have not asked the
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president since the last time we spoke about this. >> i haven't spoken to him about it on the reason. >> i don't know. i honestly haven't asked him that specific question. >> i said i have not had a discussion with him about the question. >> i haven't talked to the president specifically about this. >> i have not had the opportunity to have that discussion. >> i have the no askt asked him. >> i have not asked the president. >> david axelrod, you know very well that brady press briefing room is like a stone's throw from the west wing. help us understand how -- and we have president trump on record initially talking about russian meddling. now totally backing off and unable to answer the question. what's up? >> well, look. that -- it may be a stone's throw away but i think in that white house it also could be the grand canyon for the relationship between the spokesman and the president. i don't mean their personal relationship. i have no reason to believe he's not talking to the
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president. but, look. the hardest job in america is to be donald trump's spokesman, because only donald trump speaks for donald trump and we saw that -- we've seen that so many times. we saw sean spicer and the vice president and others go out, for example, and explain why the president fired james comey only to be contradicted by the president on national tv. i think that's what happened is that sean spicer's decided to pull in his horns and simply plead ignorance rather than making declarative statements and then being proved wrong later. >> but is this an improvement, axe? this is just jazzing the media. everybody knows he talks to the president. everybody knows he's aware of his position. so why offer up an answer that just becomes an attack on your own credibility. >> because i think he would rather do that than offer up an answer that becomes a huge controversy, no, the president
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doesn't believe that, or say, yes, he does believe that, and have the president offer a contradictory statement. look, chris, we know he is a short-timer. they are looking for a replacement. it tells you something about how undesirable that job is that they apparently can't find someone who's willing to stand up there and play that role. i mean you have to be in cirque de soleil to be a spokesman for donald trump for all the twisting and turning and unbelievable kind of maneuvers you have to make to try and survive there. i think sean's just running out there waiting for someone else to come up there and take a beating. >> yeah, he definitely didn't deny it when he was asked about what he was up to next. these reports. what about the georgia six, david? i stayed up way too late watching you on tv in the wake of the big karen handel victory. you see the numbers on the screen. you have congressman molten --
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time to stop rehashing 2016 and talk about the future. where is the future of democrats? who is going to win? >> yeah. look. i think seth molten is a great guy and great young leader in the democratic party. i'm not sure that that's what this was about because ossoff i think was talking about the future. i don't think he was a particularly good candidate for this district, a 30-year-old unknown who didn't live in the district. i think his best chance was to win back in the first round when the republicans were fractionated and disorganized and you had a chance to take advantage of that. he got their attention in the runoff and they came with everything they had in a district that the republicans have held for 40 years. this was a big night for the republicans because they averted what would have been a disaster to lose that seat that newt
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gingrich won back in the late '70s and republicans have held would have been an unmitigated disaster for the republican party. but let's also recognize that there have been four runoffs. democrats have lost them all, republicans have won them all, but they've all been solidly if had republicans districts. this was a plus-nine republican district. they won in another district last night in south carolina. that is a plus-nine or ten republican district and they won by a little more than three points. the question is what happens when you get into districts that are more competitive than these districts were. and we don't know the answer to that yet. so i mean democrats will do what democrats do and there will be a lot of finger pointing about messaging and so on. i think the democratic party ha is to gh out and recruit candidates and compete in districts which they can actually win which are districts, for example, where republicans are in office and hillary clinton won. those are the districts that should be focusing on.
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>> message matters obviously. you want to find the right messenger. that's probably going to take a turn toward policy for the democrats. makes this health care situation that much more important. what do you make of the state of play on this health care bill right now? yes, it's been too secretive. even the republicans are clamoring about that. but at the end of the day, if they pass something, that will be delivering on that republican plo promise to undo the aca. what's the democrat play? >> i think delivering on that promise, chris, is what's motivating mitch mcconnell. he does not want to be blamed by the republican base for allowing the repeal and replace effort on the affordable care act to die in the united states senate. so he's trying every which way to get his factions together and find 50 votes in that chamber to pass this bill. it is not clear, as we sit here, that that will happen. i do think what happened in georgia last night in a strange way made it a little bit easier because they would have been in full panic on capitol hill,
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republicans would have, if ossoff had won that race in georgia. nonetheless, there are big, big issues dividing moderate republicans from conservative republicans, the same divisions we saw in the house, only he has less running room because they have fewer republicans in the senate. i think mcconnell is trying to force the issue. he doesn't want republicans to go whom over the holiday break and hear from their constituents. he doesn't want to unfurl this bill until they have the details of it because he knows it is going to be highly controversial and it is a very -- it is a very narrow pass he's trying to navigate. it is also a very cynical play. the fact is the affordable care act had ten months of hearings and a lot of public discussion. this is quite something. this is historic in its secretiveness. >> all right, axe. appreciate your take, as always. >> thanks, david. all right. so one of the hottest companies
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in the country, really in the world, is uber. its founder and ceo is now out. why? what does it mean? next. so you miss the big city? i don't miss much... definitely not the traffic. excuse me, doctor... the genomic data came in. thank you. you can do that kind of analysis? yeah, watson. i can quickly analyze millions of clinical and scientific reports to help you tailor treatment options for the patient's genomic profile.
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you can do that? even way out here? yes. even way out here.
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file for 5 things to know for your new day. president trump and fellow republicans celebrating a win in the most expensive house race in u.s. history. karen handel defeatng democrat jon ossoff in the special election in georgia's sixth district. >> senate republican leaders plan to unveil a draft of their secret health care bill tomorrow. a vote could come as early as next week. tropical storm cindy along the gulf coast. 70 million people are under a tropical storm warning. that storm could bring 15 inches of rain. jared kushner in jerusalem trying to kick-start middle east peace talks. he is meeting with the prime minister of israel before traveling to ramallah for talks with the palestinian president. > the man who held build uber
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and turn it into a transportation giant all over the world is resigning as ceo in the face of a revolt by the company's investors. so, special counsel bob mueller meeting with the senate judiciary committee today. he has been making the rounds to kind of draw the lines between what congress and he should investigate. obstruction of justice is a big one. can he make the case. but first, the family dog may soon have a high-tech way to be man's best friend. researchers are developing technology to help dogs fetch for assistance when their humans have medical emergencies. it is the latest in "teching care of your health." >> reporter: this border kcolli is testing a device that could ultimately have dogs call 911. the dog taps a color pattern and
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signals help. >> this uses infrared technology. this allows the screen to get a little messy but still be functional and be able to be used. good boy! >> reporter: researchers are finding ways to help all dogs, big and small, to communicate when their owners needs help. >> my owner needs you're attention. please follow me. >> reporter: dogs naturally as puppies can pull things, they can touch things with their noses. they can hold things in their mouth. they can bite things. we just taught them, okay, you're going to do that behavior you already know on the sensor that you are wearing. for people with certain medical conditions, the technology could be a life saver. a person with diabetes can have an episode where they become very disoriented and they might not be able to make a phone call or call 911. so it is extremely important that the dogs can do that. these creatures are man's best friend for a reason.
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♪ [...rumors of the new discovery...] what if we lived in a world like that? (crowd applauding) ♪ we know a place that's already working on it. ♪ today bob mueller will meet with senators today. with me today, ken cuccinelli, the former attorney general and president senate conservatives fund. it is good to have you with us, ken. thank you for helping us out.
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>> chris, good to be with you. >> thank you. let's start with something that doesn't really deserve much debate. would you be surprised if bob mueller is looking at this issue of the context of the dismissal of james comey? >> well, at least to check the box. the starting problem with that is the president has the authority to fire the people who work for him. but when the president says after he fires james comey, you know, i really want -- i was really mad about this russia investigation, that obviously raises the question. but comey's testimony i think actually made it harder to make an obstruction case against the president. the intent element is required and it's got to be substantial. and remember, within less than 48 hours andrew mccabe, acting director of the fbi, testified before the senate that comey's
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firing stopped and slowed down nothing with respect to the russia investigation. surely the president had to know that was the case. >> well, we don't know what he knew, first of all. and we don't know what his intent was, as you say. but you basically have a list of a pattern here. i mean my initial question to you is because the idea that the president's not under investigation. jay sekulow comes on, that's what he wants to argue about. it seemed a silly thing to pursue. of course mueller is going to look at this. i think he would get a lot of criticism, and rightly so, if he didn't look at it. that doesn't mean he could make a case. but the fact that he's not looking at it because he hasn't informed jay sekulow because he is looking at it? that's absurd, isn't it? >> yeah. no. look. investigators do not typically tell the people being investigated -- >> right? >> -- that they are in fact under investigation. there's no duty to.
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there is a point where grand juries might be used when people are identified as targets. that's doj practice. >> but that's way down the road. way down the road. we're nowhere near. i would never suggest anything otherwise. >> and it is correct to say that mueller has got to list all the possibilities and at least look at them closely enough to check off them as to whether they did or didn't happen, whether it is possible to make a case. >> so we agree, of course he is investigating it. what he does with it is a very separate issue. let's talk about that quickly here. the idea of making a case. not easy. i don't think anybody would argue otherwise if they were doing it for non-partisan reasons. but, the "i hope" statements. you've talked about this before. so i did a little research. there are federal courts of appeals that have found similar "i hope" statements to be enough to trigger obstruction. it depends on the context and what kind of pattern behavior may have been at play. wouldn't that be a concern here? >> i was just going to say, it
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depends what it's combined with. >> it wasn't just firing. of course he can fire as the head of the executive. but he can't fire anybody for any reason. and when you look at what happened with co-nmey in the context of what he asked in letting the flynn thing go, going to dan coats, going to the dni, and then firing comey. when you look at it all together, it does seem suggestive at least to go down the road of what was the intent, was it corrupt intent. because obviously that would be the check on the power to fire, would it be not? >> right. and it would be at some level. you do trigger a constitutional question about whether there can be any restrictions on the president's ability to fire people in the executive branch. >> you really think that's a big question about whether or not he can fire? really? >> well, it will be for constitutional lawyers. i mean, look. if this were to proceed -- let's take a worst case scenario and
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say that enough other information comes up to suggest -- because, as you said, we can't know what he's thinking. we're going to see the use of circumstantial evidence to decide that he had that intent. if worst case scenario. and then you trigger the question, the constitutional question of can we proceed down this road at all. the obstruction cases you're talking about in federal courts are correct, but they aren't against a president who had the authority to direct the executive branch -- >> but the authority's not unchecked. we both know that. i'm not talking about nixon. remember the trouble that nixon got into by saying -- >> it's an untested legal question. >> it is. but i'm just saying conceptually, the idea that he can fire anybody for any reason just doesn't make any sense. if he said to a prosecutor, if he said to the fbi, no more drug cases, but only against my friends. and you didn't do that so i'm going to fire you, nobody would question whether or not that was wrong.
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right? i mean even with pardons where you have almost plenary authority to the president. if he was exchanging them for money, we'd say that's wrong. so you have to look at why he did it, right? >> sure. right. but as you noted earlier, i think we can reasonably expect that the only kind of evidence we're going to have here is circumstantial other than statements like, can you lay off mike flynn, the day after he was already fired. that was actually i thought the most serious thing on this obstruction front to come out of the comey testimony was the personal testimony about that request. but of course, it was made the day after mike flynn was already gone. so this is going to be a very speculative area, especially for those of us on the outside who don't have access to the investigative information. until we hear some kind of conclusion from bob mueller. >> you were an a zbchlt and you
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we an ag and you were a damn good one and you were aggressive. if this fact pattern came to you about the governor, let's say, you wouldn't just dismiss it out of hand because he was your state's chief executive. >> look, we had a fact pattern about my governor and we did look at it. >> that's why i asked you. >> we proceeded down the state law. i expect muler to check all of the boxes within his jurisdiction. i assume the meeting today with the senate is to define the boundaries of who's investigating what. i mean one of the big complaints by both republicans and democrats over the last 20 years has been when these special counsel or independent counsel take on a case that they, on their own authority, expand their jurisdiction massively. that's where mueller could get in a lot of trouble. things that might get outside the russia collusion box, he should hand over to other doj investigators so they can carry them and stay focused on the
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main question before him and that's russian collusion and whether it happened or not. because america is going to benefit from knowing the answer to that. >> right. no question about that. we need more fact and truth in this situation. this question certainly would fit in the box. despite what the president tweeted, bob mueller is neither bad nor in conflict on this issue. so let's hope he does the job the right way. ken cuccinelli, appreciate you here making the case, helping us out. always a pleasure. this is the new new york. we are building new airports all across the state. new roads and bridges. new mass transit. new business friendly environment. new lower taxes. and new university partnerships to grow the businesses of tomorrow today. learn more at
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y286oy ywty it's time for "the good stuff." a community in california helps a teenager get the surgery she needs. paige was active her whole life, but that all stopped when she was diagnosed with scoliosis. her spine quickly progressing to a 70-degree curve. >> you lose your mobility, your whole lifestyle changes. >> her doctor said she needs surgery and fast. but, it wasn't that easy. the problem -- didn't have the cash. >> $150,000 is something that you can't pull out of your
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wallet and say, let's go for it. >> but guess what? >> they did! >> when they decided to go for it? the community. word spread. they pitched in. and now paige has something she'll never forget. >> i'm hoping to get this procedure and live a long and happy life. >> isn't that what it's all about? >> love it! >> you find out somebody is in need. maybe you can't help all by yourself but together, what a power. >> love it. thank you. thanks for having me. al alison, not that you're tuning in to watch your own show, but happy birthday! >> john berman. we have a lot of news. let's get right to it. new this morning, the president is claiming victory in a race he did not run and the democrats are claim iing it in a race the did not win. this is the actual winner in


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