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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  October 20, 2017 6:00pm-7:00pm PDT

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when used daily. for a cleaner, fresher, brighter denture, use polident every day. and my brother ray and i started searching for answers. (vo) when it's time to navigate in-home care, follow that bright star. because brightstar care earns the same accreditation as the best hospitals. and brightstar care means an rn will customize a plan that evolves with mom's changing needs. (woman) because dad made us promise we'd keep mom at home. (vo) call 844-4-brightstar for your free home care planning guide. while the white house says yesterday's statement from chief of staff john kelly should have been the end of the controversy over the president's call to a grieving widow the president keeps talking about it and he's continuing the feud with representative fredricka wilson who was there for the call. this is what the president said tonight in an interview with fox
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news regarding general kelly's speech. >> he was so offended because he was in the room when i made the call. so were other people. and the call was a very nice call. he was so offended that a woman would be -- that somebody would be listening to that call. he was -- he actually couldn't believe it. actually, he said to me, sir, this is not acceptable. this is really not. look, i've called many people. and i would think that every one of them appreciated it. i was very surprised to see this to be honest with you. >> meantime, the white house is standing by a false claim that general kelly made about the congresswoman despite video coming out that 100% disproves it. general kelly on the attack with a false claim that two years ago congresswoman wilson took credit for getting funding for an fbi building. watch this. >> the congresswoman stood up
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and in the long tradition of empty barrels making the most noise, stood up there and and all of that talked about how she was instrumental in getting the funding for that building. now, she took care of her constituents because she got the money. on that phone call obama gave $20 million to build a building. she sat down and we were stunned. stunned that she had done it. even for someone that is that empty a barrel, we were stunned. >> the video of the congresswoman's speech came out today and it is really almost completely the opposite in fact and in spirit of what general kelly described. jeff zeleny joins us now with that. jeff, first of all, congresswoman wilson, what did she say two years ago? >> john, you heard those deeply personal comments from the chief of staff in the white house. but wave copy of that speech
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from 2015 from the south florida sun sentinel. let's watch. >> everyone said that's possible. it takes at least eight months to a year to complete the process to the house, the gnat, and to the president's office. i said, i'm a school principal, and i said, excuse my french, oh, hell no. we're going to get this done. [ applause ] immediately i went into attack mode. i went to the speaker, and i said mr. speaker, i need your help. the fai needs your help, and our country needs your help. and we have nominate to waste. he went into attack mode and in two some days, pulled it out of
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committee, brought it to the floor for a vote. representatives and i apprehend it. we all voted, and i dashed it over to the senate and put our senators on notice. put it on your radar, senator nelson and rubio, who i believe have representatives today, they hot lined it to the senate floor new jersey two days, and guess what? the president signed the bill into law this past tuesday, april 7th, 2015, with a bang, bang, bang. [ applause ] >> right there, john, we heard the congresswoman recounting how she worked with republicans. she raised the fbi officers and this is about the naming of the building of the she was not in congress at the time the building was funded, so the chief of staff was wrong about that. john, this sounds to me like
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most other speeches we hear, a touch of self-congratulation, of course. but it was not about the funding of the building, just simply calling up and bragging about that. >> in fact, there were more minutes spent about the fallen fbi agent than anything else. she asked first responders to stand up, give them applause and she talked about the themes of braver within the fbi itself. when sanders was asked about general kelly's comments today about the congresswoman, what did she say? >> she was very defensive about this. she said they stand by the comments that general kelly made. we don't know if he misremembers this. she was very defensive and said you should not question a general. she said it was deeply inappropriate to question a f r
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four-star general. we heard from sarah sanders this evening who walked that back somewhat, john. this is what she's telling us tonight in a statement to cnn. she said, of course, everyone can be questions, but after witnessing general kelly's heart felt and somber account, we should all be able to agree that impugning his credibility on how best to honor fallen heroes is not appropriate. that reports shouldn't question the general. that created a new fire storm in all of this because generals, of course, are questioned all the time. but he, of course, now is white house chief of staff. that's a political job. >> and he was being questioned on the facts of what he said, not about how he believes fallen soldiers should be honored. jeff zbleshlgs thanks so much. lots to talk about with the panel. mieshlgs let general kelly absolutely a retired marine four-star general.
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he's also a white house chief of staff, which is a political position. and in either position, even as a general, questions are fair game, correct? >> absolutely. look, there's a great tradition of questioning military officials, but you don't even have to go there because when you become -- when you take a position like white house chief of staff, that's a very highly political position. it's a charged position. you're representing yourself as a spokesman for the president of the united states and coming behind the white house podium, you put yourself out there and you expect questions. so that whole controversy today about whether or not he shouldn't be questioned seems so silly and petty given everything else that's going on this week. >> martin, i want to get perspective from a supporter of donald trump. general kelly said deeply meaningful words about honoring fallen skpormds gold star
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families, but he made stuff up about the member of congress there, correct? >> listen, i agree with the previous commentator when he said this is pet advertisement this congresswoman has shown herself exactly why the united states voters are -- any chance they get they are rejecting the politics of the swamp. she took a sacred moment. she called herself a rock star. she was happy to say i'm a rock star now. she looked for a way to politicize the death. honestly you're chasing a story when at the center services something very sacred. >> we'll talk about whether or not it was appropriate to listen to the phone call or not. >> when? >> right now. but general kelly something that wasn't true. why was that necessary? >> look, john, if what you want to talk about is how he spoke
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about her being an empty barrel, he was addressing the fact that she politicized it. let's go back to saying why do we have to have this congresswoman politicize a sacred moment? let's go back to the heart of the matter instead of the ex-trainous stuff. i think he might have misspoke about that speech but let's get to why is this congresswoman called despicable by everyone? she's a demagogue, that's what she is. >> bakari? i'm not even going to respond to ed. the heart of the matter is not fredricka wilson, four soldiers in niger has been murdered. we need to get to the reason why that was the case. they were ambushed and killed. we need to get to the reason why. while he's calling her a demagogue and people on the
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right are lambasting her character, the fact is that donald trump, the president of the united states has lied about her. john kelly, the chief of staff to the president of the united states, has lied about her. the only person who has actually said the truth about this conversation has been fredricka wilson. if we want to have a conversation about why she was listening in, i mean, ed, what we're going to do is have respect for each other and i'm going to finish this comment. why she was listening in, then we need to talk about her identity. her identity is that of a family friend. she actually knew this sergeant. she was his mentor. she actually sponsored programs he was a part of. if you've ever been a part of these conversations, she was on the phone with his commanding officer who let her listen in. so this was not something in which she demagogued.
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she was actually a part of this young man's life. if you want to bastardize her -- i'm not done with my thought. if you want to bastardize her, call her a chemical going on, then what we need to do is realize the only person who was telling the truth in this entire scenario was representative fredricka wilson, and you need to call her as such. >> hang on one second, guys. b isn't it completely possible that president trump called this widow with the best of intentions, tried to say something soothing but that many this woman took it to be offensive? he can be trying to be nice and she could be offended. both things can happen at the same time, correct? >> absolutely. general kelly said president trump said he signed up for this or he knew what he was getting into. i don't know why the president denied saying that. as soon as i heard those
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comments, i gave the president the benefit of the doubt. i thought he made the call with the best of intentions. saying something along the lines of he did it for love of country. that was my takeaway. the issue is the only people that matter are the families of those who lost their lives and if if she whatever reason they didn't walk away from that conversation feeling better, feeling that the president cares about them and their loved one, then that's all that matters. and the president could have fixed auftds by either picking up the phone and calling her and explaining and apologizing or saying nothing. instead we see once again it's the reaction that gets us in a tough position whereas we would have not been talking about this right now, we would have been talking about those four brave men who lost their lives and talk about why that happened instead of blaming each other and bringing politics back into the fray. we spend so much time talking
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about russia promulgating fake news and she progressed and i'm watching this. we're not the only ones talking about this. the entire world is watching us make political gain from either the right or left over those who serve our country, the top 1% as general kelly said. they can go back to their own people and say this is how they treat their soldiers, those that are willing to sacrifice their lives. it's really upsetting. >> we're continue the conversation after a quick break. breaking news tonight on the russia investigation related to the meeting donald trump jr. had and the latest from capitol hill coming up.
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compares... ...prices from over 200 booking... ...sites save you up to 30%... ...on the hotel you want. trust this bird's words. tripadvisor. the latest reviews. the lowest prices. more on white house press secretary sarah sanders defending john kelly as false claims about a congresswoman. he said kelly should be off limits. >> if you want to go after general kelly, that's up to you, but i think if you want to get into a debate against a four-star general, i think that's something highly inappropriate. >> speaking of generals being off limits, president trump criticized generals repeatedly on twitter in the past on twitter. colin powell is one. bianna, we'll start with you, you were born in russia, a place where questioning authority
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could get you in trouble. now a suggestion that it shouldn't be done here in the united states. questioning generals, questioning anybody is what american society is all about. >> that's absolutely right. it was an unfortunate thing for sarah huckabee sanders to say. having said that, it doesn't come across as a talking point. she goes up to the podium and reads from something that's clearly scripted and discussed prior to coming out. looked like that was the stream of consciousness. it just came out of her mouth and she already responded and walked it back. while it was highly inappropriate and clearly that's not what this country is about, i wouldn't read too much into it because in the past, as you know, this administration typically doubles down on statements that they make and we're seeing the opposite here. >> fair point. they don't walk a lot back. the fact they walked this back tells you something. on the subject of saying things that were unnecessary, perhaps, today you and a byline on an article when you guys
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interviewed fredricka wilson, and she says, quote, the white house itself is full of white supremacists. this after she suggested the phrase empty barrel was somehow racist. we called her to see if she stood by this comment about the white house being full of white supremacists, they didn't get back to us yet. she is suggesting race is a factor in this dispute? >> i think one of the things that is sort of so sad about this tale is that it's a story that has compounded itself from the beginning over and over again. there were moments that everybody could have stopped this, right? after the president was asailed for his initial comments not call, he went to the cabinet room, made comments where he attacked and denied that he had said it. at that moment had he decided to say let's put this ceaside, allf
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america grieves with this family, that might have been the end of it. congresswoman wilson later could have said i'm not going to go on television and keep pushing this, but she chose to and kelly came out and he could have chosen to be not as angry or in attack mode as he was. each time there was an opportunity for this to end, and i think when you see tonight with some of these comments about this being a race issue, i mean, it seems like it's determined to keep all of this going. and i talked to somebody at the white house just before coming on tonight who said, look, i'm just speechless to understand how this all got to this point from a moment when a family was really grieving over the loss of a loved one. >> that's a fair question. bakari, could the congresswoman take this as an opportunity maybe deescalate? >> i think that all of us need to take this as a moment to
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deescalate to be honest with you. 236,000 needs to be on these four families, but we can't forget how we got here. the first person the president drug into this discussion was the name of barack obama. fredricka wilson heard a conversation and relayed the exact fact of that conversation, the president of the united states and chief of staff liedb. to this conversation about race, that is conversation which most of the panelists are going to have some sha immigration she is correct. the fact the president finds these individuals which are for him low-hanging fruit and he attacks them, jamele hill, for example, congresswoman wilson, for example. you don't see the president of the united states attacking at
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the forefront. colin kaepernick. you don't see him attacking figures that look like him with the same voracity. the president of the united states has attacked this congresswoman, jamele hill and colin kaepernick with more voracity and more vigor than white supremacists. >> i'm having a hard time handling this conversation. this congresswoman went way past. donald trump has taken on people that look just like him. carly fear rina, megyn kelly. to make this a racial issue, the whole country is looking up and they're saying what is happening that people like us on this panel are talking about this. the president droobz somethitri something from his heart. we have the congresswoman running around with a hat on
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calling herself a rock star saying it's white supremacy. it's completely out of hand. could it have been done better? insure. you -- sure. it could have been done better, it wasn't, and let's move on. cut it out with fredricka wilson. she's just not relative to this moment. >> the fact that you can form late your mouth to have such disdain for someone who is an elected official in this country who happens to be an african-american woman -- >> that's america. >> it underscores the premise of what i'm talking about. the fact you have no respect for this woman -- >> the president was elected and you don't respect him. >> no, no, no. no, listen. the fact of the matter s the president of the united states, donald trump, no, he has a lot to earn from many of us who
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don't look like him. but i do respect the office and i will always uplift the office of the president of the united states, never forget that. >> okay, i uplift the office of a congresswoman but when she's acting disrespectful, i call her on it. people are trying to respectful for the did he tell y-- >> tell me her lie, ed. >> it's much worse than lying. it's taking a part of the speech, part of a conversation and going out in public and demagoguing it. it's called exploiting a family that is suffering. >> please tell me why the president of the united states can lie and why the chief of staff of the united states of america can lie? he did lie, ed. what are we talking about? >> you're talking about -- >> he said that he did not -- the president of the united states said simply, the fact is he said he did not say that that
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young man knew when he was getting into. that's what he said. >> no, what he said -- >> simply that this woman went down and took credit for $20 million and was lambasted him. >> you can hang your hat on things like that and pretend that's what the truth is. the truth is the president tried to do something nice and it was misconstrued and kelly tried to clarify it and now you call it racist and offensive and you're dividing america instead of bringing us together. you're the problem and fredricka wilson. >> with all due respect, i will go to my beth being the problem of this country if i continue to speak the truth. you can say i'm the problem, but i will continue to speak the truth. you know who else spoke the truth? fredricka wilson. >> so did i. >> these four individuals who
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died and gave their lives so we have the freedom -- >> go back to them and segue to attacking people. >> what's crazy about this, i'm not attacking you, ed, but i'm calling you out for what you are, which is an artist who does not tell the truth. four people died and we need to know why they died. >> i agree. >> six months ago you were out here wearing benghazi t-shirt. >> how is grand standing helping that. >> by telling the truth, ed. >> how is this making us make progress? the four, the deaths aren't related what you think about somebody being racist. >> we will continue -- >> you know what's the most amazing thing. ed, i love you with all my heart and i will continue to tell the truth. >> we will continue to speak answers on what did happen to these four soldiers who died in niger.
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thank you so much everyone. we do have brangsz on the ambush at the center of this controversy. four soldiers were killed in niger. four officials familiar with the investigation tell cnn johnson's remains were found a mile from the central location of the ambush. the pentagon is looking at how she was separated from the 12-member team. his body was found 48 hours after they discovered he was missing, after the attack. up next, breaking news on the russia investigation. the meeting donald trump jr. had at trump tower during the campaign, the details in just a moment. is helping the new new york rise higher than ever. as the world leader in unmanned aerial systems, we're attracting the world's best talent to central new york. and turning the airport into a first-class transportation hub. all while growing urban areas into vibrant places to live and work. across new york state, we're building the new new york.
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a busy friday night. let's go to the latest in the russia investigation. new reporting related to the trump tower meeting that donald trump jr. had with russians. man raj on capitol hill. what have you learned? >> that's right. the senate intelligence committee interviewed several of the russians who attended the june 26th meeting with paul manafort and jared kushner. ahead of time donald trump jr. was promised dirt on the clinton campaign from the russians, and he was told that the russian government wanted his father to win the presidency. now, we've learned for the first time that several of the russians at that meeting have spoken to investigators on capitol hill. the chairman of the committee, richard burr has confirmed, in fact, that they've spoken to several of them. he would not disclose to us who
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these people were he met with, but we know there were four russians at this meeting, including a russian lawyer, a russian-american lobbyist, as well as a russian translator, as well as a russian who was tied to an oligarch in that country. john, that is key area of focus for this investigation because they're trying to figure out whether there's improper coordination, improper context, collusion between anyone in the trump campaign world as well as the russians. that's something we don't have an agreement on quite yet but a sign they're moving closer to getting the information they want. >> donald trump jr. has yet to be interviewed by this committee, correct? >> that is correct, and the question is which -- they're
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closer to bringing trump junior in. staff interviewed last month. in the same committee there's an effort to bring him in publicly. i'm told that could happen as soon as this month, even though that is not yet been settled yet the republican chairman of the committee, chuck grassley told them to bring donald trump junior in. >> fascinating if it happens. thanks so much. joining me, congressman eri is m california. the senate intel committee has spoken to several russians who were in the meeting with donald trump jr. has your committee been in touch with any of these folks? >> it's highly significant to the question of whether any u.s. persons worked with the
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russians. it's not disputed. there's no evidence to counter the proposition that russia attacked our elections. that's settled the the question is who on the campaign worked with the russians. this meeting as you know, john, shows an eagerness and willingness to work with russians. after the e-mail chain, we are seeking to interview every person who was in that meeting. we have not been able to with the exception of jared kushner just yet. >> if you did have a chance to ask these russians any questions, what would those questions be? >> sure. i would want to know what their relationship was to vladimir putin, what their relationship was or continued to be with the fsb and the svr and the gru. john, if you take a step back and think about the context of this meeting, it's during june of a presidential election. how did they secure a meeting
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with a presidential campaign. they said it was about russian adoptions. no one buys that the meeting was about adoptions or that the campaign would be willing to work with them. you're going to be comparing stories to look for inconsistencies. what was the prologue before this meeting and the epilogue after? what set up the meeting and what was the follow-up because it's hard to imagine this was just a one off. >> richard burr says they're sequencing the timing of the interviews with everyone else before they get to donald trump jr. help us understand what that means. >> that's a classic bottom-up investigation. i wish we were doing that in the house investigation. you want to start with the outside, they call them satellite witnesses, and get closer and closer to the center, so that way when you confront the individual in the center of the investigation, you have the facts from everyone on the outside. you're looking for inconsistencies, to see if the stories match up. you don't want to go early at a witness without all the document
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production. we did that with jared kushner. we brought him in early. he didn't turn over almost any documents to us, and he decided on his own when he wanted to end the interview two hours into it. that is not how you would conduct an investigation. what the senate is doing is zblejds h encouraging. >> how important is donald trump's involvement? he allegedly didn't know about the meeting beforehand, but now there are questions about did he help craft the statement after the "the new york times" was reporting about it? >> the key is understanding then candidate donald trump. it's hard to believe that he didn't know about the meeting just a few floors below that occurred at the time. that is something that we want to seek to understand because,
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again, it shows and puts it in context, in the also the same year donald trump is seeking to do business in russia where felix sater is saying we can engineer this to elect our boy, donald trump. understanding their intent is essential. >> thanks so much for being with us. but measure pleasure, john. up next, it's been a week full of half truths from the white house, but questions about the president's relationship with facts stretch back long before he moved to 1600 pennsylvania avenue. one of a kic delivers. only tempur material precisely conforms to your weight, shape and temperature. it provides up to twice as much pressure relieving power, so you won't toss and turn. and tempur-pedic is the best at minimizing motion transfer from your partner, so you won't be disturbed during the night. you'll wake up, feeling like a champion. only the best carry tempur-pedic. find an exclusive retailer at
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it has been a truth challenged ten days for the white house. just a few examples of the mistruths coming from the walls, the president said the united states is the highest taxed nation in the world. it is not. he suggested a link between when he called radical islamic terror and incorrectly said a fema director gave him an a plus for his hurricane relief efforts but in realities he made those comments before maria struck puerto rico. this relationship with the facts started well before he moved into the white house. here here's. >> we had a massive amount of people. it went all the way back to the washington monument. >> to his party just this week.
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>> the republican party is very, very unified. >> but trump's problems with accuracy go back decades to the building and selling of trump tower where barbara reyes managed the questions. >> he said prince di was looking for an apartment. >> it was just getting the buzz out there about trump? did you guys laugh at it? >> yeah, because there was something not guilty so terrible about it. it was kind of like puffing, exaggerating. >> coauthor of trump's art of the deal has a name of this. >> i call it truthful hiyperbol.
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the problem is that there is no such thing. the truth is the truth. they don't go together. >> we didn't go together during the troubled opening of trump's taj mahal casino in 1990 when some of the slots didn't work. >> when the casino control commission went down there on opening day to check out that all the things had been done, in things hasn't been did listen to they shut down a third of the slots. >> slots that were critical to the casino's success. >> the slots are the prime revenue of the across an. to shut down a third on opening day was humiliating and financially disastrous and it was only done because he doesn't have an organization in-depth. >> but that wasn't the story trump told. >> something could go bad like the opening of a, theaj, and he would say it's because we had so much business here that this
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happened, not that the systems broke down, not that we didn't know whaerp doing. we had so much business it broke down. truly he would lie about. >> everything and he did. >> what about the slot machines? >> the slots were so hot. again, nobody's seen people play the hard and that fast. >> it blew out the slots? >> they were virtually on fire. >> donald is so wrapped up in hyperbole where it's the littlest things. if you had 2,000 people at an event, he would say there were 5,000 people at an event. >> and he got away with it. >> there's no belief system. if it will work, i will say it. if it stops working, i'll say its opposite and i will not feel any come -- problem.
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his only distinction is what will work and what will not work. >> what happens when he's challenged with facts? what does he do? >> he has a genius perverse genius for turning any situation into something that is evidence of his brilliance. even if it's not true. >> gloria borger joins me now. gloria, let me start with you it's one thing to use high per bolly, it's another thing to do it when you're president of the united states. and yet, it seems that people around the president and a lot of the president's supporters are willing to accept it. the question is, why? >> we've been trying to find the answer to that for a long time. i think we learned during the campaign the kind of catch phrase became don't take him
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literally, that his supporters didn't take him literally but they took him seriously. so they were willing to overlook a lot of the untruths, a lot of the exaggerations because they thought it was in service of a greater goal which was to get donald trump elected or to get his agenda through as is the case now during the presidency. and they believe that it's part of his showmanship which will serve a greater purpose. >> you know, michael, you know him as well as any biographer. does the president think he's lying when he does this? >> i don't think he believes he is lying. i think he believes he's making his best case. he'll draw from something that is halfway true, something that's completely true, and then something that's a lie, and it all gets kind of mixed up. the problem here, as everyone is pointing out, is that he's now president of the united states.
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he is held accountable in other ways, ways other than he's acan you still did know he's very seductive. what gloria was getting at is this president will pull people in, and then all of a sudden they are part of something they didn't quite understand and way out on a limb where somebody might saw it off. >> it's a great question, gloria. is this contagious? is his attitude towards the truth contagious? you saw general kelly saying things that are untrue about wilson. >> i don't think it's contagious so much as people find themselves twisted into knots trying to explain him and rationalize him and making what's untrue seem true. when the president tweets every
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day or comes out and says something that they then have to kind of figure out a way to make it work. and so it strains decrcredulity. i think it's difficult. >> one of the things, the skills, michael, and i think it's a skill in some ways the president has as a businessman is taking credit for success but not taking the blame for failure. we've seen politicians, michael, tried to do this with variously levels of success before. is this something president trump is particularly adept? >> i think he's very adept. he's pointed at politicians and called them liars and the worst people on earth. he was doing this before the press became the worst people on earth. he's great at it because he knows how to reinterpret
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something, a defeat as a victory, or reinterpret a distortion as something accurate. and he's actually succeed at various times by saying something that ultimately at some point turns out to be true. so i think people around him think maybe this is a game we can win, but i think he's probably more gifted at it than anybody on earth. >> look what he did with the slot machines in atlantic city, which was a big failure a disaster, a financial failure. he goes on larry king and says no, new york city nit was becau success that those machines blew up. he figures out a way to turn it into a win. >> at a certain point, facts are facts. >> i agree. >> great to have you with us. thanks so much for your time. >> thanks. >> thank you. a rare look behind the scenes of the white house. intimate, unplanned moments with
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former first lady michelle obama from the lens of a former white house photographer. anderson speaks to that photographer next. it's a match made in tech heaven. it's like verizon is the oil and google is the balsamic. no, actually they separate into a suspension. it's more like the google pixel 2 is the unlimited storage. and verizon is the best unlimited plan. what if it's like h2 and o? yeah. that's right. i had a feeling that would score with you guys. good meeting. (avo) when you really, really want the best get the pixel 2 for up to $300 off on google's exclusive wireless partner, verizon. i am totally blind. and non-24 can make me show up too early... or too late. or make me feel like i'm not really "there." talk to your doctor, and call 844-234-2424. our guests can earn a free night when they book at and stay with us just two times? fall time. badda book. badda boom. pumpkin spice cookie? i'm good.
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today marks exactly nine months of the trump administration and nine months to the day since first lady melania trump wore this dress to her husband's inauguration. the donation fills a 100 plus year tradition for first ladies.
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she told the audience the dress marks one of the many beginnings for her family's history in washington. michelle obama is also in the news this week. her white house photographer is releasing a book of rare photos of the former first lady. it's called chasing light. around son sat down with the photographer, amanda lose done. here is that conversation. >> first of all, can you just describe what a day in the life of a white house photographer is like. >> well, there's no really -- no real typical day. you know, there can be slow days and days that you think are going to be slow but you should always be ready to, you know, that things change quickly. >> i imagine it's very just kind of on the fly. you have to figure out the best angles to get and where to be and where to stand and security implications, obviously for everything. >> right. >> there's got to be a dynamic environment. >> yeah. i mean, i learned a lot. it's a pretty steep learning curve, and i think my time as a photo journalist for a newspaper really prepared me for, you know, polishing my skill set. >> there are so many intimate
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moments that you capture and that are in the book. the back of the book there's a photograph that i understand you actually didn't love. i mean, it's a really cool -- very intimate photo of the president and the first lady. >> well, i'm such a perfectionist, i like a very thoughtful and composed image, and sometimes i find a scene and just wait for something to happen in it and sometimes i wait for something that's a really emotional shot. and this was an image where we were setting up for a taping an outside company was taping a segment and i was just -- they were resetting their cameras so i was there just to document that this filming was happening and i just looked at my camera. i had enough to get two frames and then the moment was over. >> were there ever any moments you didn't take pictures because you felt it wasn't -- i mean, it was too private. >> there are times when you know that you're in a really special moment and that that's when you need to be especially decisive and so you just sort of take a
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breath and if you're documenting history, so it's important that you have the courage to take those pictures too. >> are there particular photographs that are your favorite? >> yeah. i love a picture of she surprising a bunch of students in a map room and so there are a bunch of turn around art students and they had just performed for herment they did a poem and a dance, and they were waiting in the map room. they thought they were going to be taken out of the white house and she was like i want to go see them. so i slipped into the room before her because i obviously wanted to get the reaction and then i walked in and she just said something like, hey, what are you guys doing in here and everybody just erupted with joy. just like seeing -- it's just the back of her head, but i like seeing all the different emotions of everyone's faces just so raw. >> do you see yourself in the pictures? >> i mean, i personally am drawn to the pictures that really make you feel something and whether that's joy or laughter or love, you know, those are the images that speak to me. so i guess i see myself in the edit, right, because that's also
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an important part of the work too, so -- but those are the images that i like to make. i like to see peoples' reactions. i like to look at the edges of the frame. i like to be able to show people something they haven't seen before. so sometimes that's a step behind like there's a picture of mrs. obama waving at the audience at the kennedy center but i shot it from the presidential box and i had just about enough time to get two frames before the secret service agent closed the door. so like i said, all of my photo journalism training helped to prepare me to be ready for those things. >> and capture the moment. >> capture the moment. >> thank you so much. >> thank you. appreciate your time. >> all right. again, the book is called chasing the light. it is available now. we'll be right back.
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thanks so much for watching 360. time now to hand it over to don lemon. cnn tonight starts right now. this is cnn tonight. i'm don lemon. it has been a week that has felt like a year. you know what? lies will do that to you. the trump administration again engulfed in a controversy entirely of its own making, and once again, lying about it. swhau turning a call to a gold star family into an ongoing spat with that family and a congresswoman. the president's chief of staff laid down a blistering attack of that congresswoman yesterday. it sounded really good to a lot of people, and that was the whole point. too bad we learned today with video proof, it was all false. facts matter, and the fact is general kelly took the podium at yesterday's press briefing a