Skip to main content

tv   Anthony Bourdain Parts Unknown  CNN  October 21, 2017 11:00pm-12:00am PDT

11:00 pm
-- captions by vitac -- ♪ >> who are they anyway? some ugly dutch guys, with guns. i'm guessing not particularly friendly to the current power. they look like they're coming on or going to the oppression of the black man. first order of business, is to
11:01 pm
take that down. am i right or what? i'm kind of amazed. take that down. ♪ ♪
11:02 pm
♪ >> in july 2013, when i went to south africa, 95-year-old nelson mandela was critically ill. in the country he freed from white minority rule was already in mourning. and already fearful of what the future might be without him. >> i pray that somebody takes the leadership from him. >> to come back to his people.
11:03 pm
>> a friend of mine, a really good travel writer, said the more i travel, the less i know. i feel that strongly here in south africa. a place i came in a state of near total ignorance, loaded with preconceptions. for the first part of my life, the south africa i knew was not a happy place, or a good place. it was a pariah state. surrealistically, outrageously divided into black and white. a throwback to attitudes we thought we've long learned to reject. the nationalist government in south africa enacted apartheid laws in 1948. who you could marry, where you lived, where you could walk, be educated, everything decided by racist laws backed by police,
11:04 pm
army and secret services. the institutionalized racial discrimination was designed to maintain white minority power, and economic ily suppress the black and mixed race south africans who lived in townships, mostly in poverty. in 1923, the african national congress was formed. by 1961, it had been radicalized by the influence of a young nelson mandela, among others, and formed an arm wing called the spear of the nation. >> you see africans being able to develop in this country without the europeans being pushed aside. >> we have made it very clear in our policies that south africa is a country of generations. there is room for all the generations. >> in 1963, mandela was charged with sabotage and conspiracy and sentenced to life imprisonment
11:05 pm
on robin island. it would take another 27 years of violence and injustice before the inevitable would happen. >> do you believe in apartheid? >> i believe in god's will that the race should be preserved. >> with the white minority under international sanctions, internal political pressure and the decline of the communist threat, mandela was released from prison in 1990. in '94, he was elected president of a new free south africa. there had been very few figures in the entire history of the world as revered or as important as nelson mandela. but the question is, what happens next?
11:06 pm
johannesburg, or joburg or joesie, the largest city by population in south africa. and the economic powerhouse of the country. southwest of johannesburg, originally an acronym for southwestern townships. now the area is considered a suburb. in 2010, south africa played host to the world cup. the blackjacks who played for the opening celebration are a soweto based band. they're also, not surprisingly, are soccer fans. ♪
11:07 pm
>> game day, a grudge match in a country where soccer approaches religion. you can feel it, or rather you can see it, as everywhere you look people show their love for either the local orlando pirates or the johannesburg chiefs. the typical local joint in soweto. the perfect place to watch a game, talk about a game, drink yourself silly over the results of a game, or just have a very fine local style meal. it is, however, a little hard to find. >> there are a lot of places like this? this used to be the garage of a carport, right? >> yeah, definitely. >> in what was once a garage are now six tables, a lawn turned lounge out back.
11:08 pm
closed on sundays if grandma is visiting. these kinds of bars were born during apartheid times, south africans not allowed to own businesses in white areas adapted and improvised. they did their own thing, created these little microunder the official radar restaurants known around here as eat houses. >> back in the days, obviously, it was apartheid. they would have meetings to plan what they were going to do. >> so that would be considered a hotbed of sad ition? from the black jacks, they've just finished watching the game when i joined them for some food. good times in south africa? bad times? transitional times? >> 1994 was the peak of the good times in south africa. now with all the politics, you
11:09 pm
know, parties fighting, it's quite tense right now. >> not like it was before when everybody was black and white. like we're unified in this. and they're unified on that. >> these days the party that freed the country from white rule, the anc, is not universally loved anymore. in recent years they've been criticized for inaction, corruption, and cronyism. and opposition parties are gaining strength. >> i think it may be new to us. so i think we're trying to navigate the nuance, the reality. like how do you deal with so many opinions, and the party that you love the whole time that brought about the freedom, is fumbling the bomb. the ball.
11:10 pm
what do you do? >> ah! smiley's, fire roasted sheep's head. chopped into tasty bits and eaten with cold beer. yes, of course. yes. just needs a little salt and pepper. that looks good. what is it? >> it's like maze. >> a sticky porridge made from ground cornmeal. it fills the role that brits do in the south. it's tasty, relatively nutritious and cheap filler. and it sops up gravy when you have something like this stewed beef real good. >> that's dumplings. >> that's a dumpling? >> yes. >> dumplings, important throughout the african diaspro. a spongy bread type tool to mop
11:11 pm
it up. stewed greens, carrots, beans, and more gravy. wow, that's awesome. tell me about your band. how long have you guys lived together? >> about ten years now. >> whoa, a long time. would you say you were -- i guess what i'm getting at, is there -- i was kind of getting there. >> the south african culture, really pushing it. you look around, it's like, man, like demographic is crazy. such racial classes. people being pushed and pulled.
11:12 pm
like an aspirational culture. >> what do you think that means? >> the whole rainbow nation notion was quite romantic and ridiculous. like races on a piece of paper. it doesn't mean people stopped being racist. it was ridiculous in that sense. but we've lived something else for 20 years. it's not like a coffee table like that. taxes and fees included. and now netflix included. so go ahead. binge on us. another reason why t-mobile is america's best unlimited netwk.
11:13 pm
we're on a mission to show drip coffee drinkers, it's time to wake up to keurig. wakey! wakey! rise and shine! oh my gosh! how are you? well watch this. i pop that in there. press brew. that's it. so rich. i love it. that's why you should be a keurig man! full-bodied. are you sure you're describing the coffee and not me? full-bodied. [don't stop me nowhad by queen]me sir. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪
11:14 pm
with over 500 flights every day, emirates brings the world together through dubai. fly emirates for a world of good times. ♪ that goes beyond assuming beingredients are safe...ood to knowing they are. going beyond expectations... because our pets deserve it. beyond. natural pet food. i'm not a customer, but i'm calling about that credit scorecard. give it. sure! it's free for everyone. oh! well that's nice! and checking your score won't hurt your credit. oh! i'm so proud of you. well thank you. free at at, even if you're not a customer.
11:15 pm
this is santa sandio. pioneer of sorts. he's taken a traditional cook
11:16 pm
shop space in a neighborhood in johannesburg and done something different. it is a neighborhood where just about everybody comes from somewhere else. >> i came here from croatia. and when we heard about the change, we all ran to this central part of the city. >> with the end of apartheid and emergence of mandela, the beginning of real and compassionate black african government, south africa became a beacon and ref funl for africans all over the continent. south africans fought hard for their freedom and their country. as i understand it, a lot of them are ticked off. where are these nigerians, they're coming in. >> and you can't kick those people away. that's not what our people are all about.
11:17 pm
food is the first way to engage. >> he's completely self-taught. picking up bits and pieces from the neighborhood in the neighbor. you're plucking the best from everybody. >> every day i learn. the smell, the colors. where are you from, you know? cooking at home. go there every night. and then that's me. >> they'll show you? >> they'll show you. i pick up. and i rush to the shop and try it out. i've got all elements now. >> at his cook shop he mixes recipes, techniques and traditions as he sees fit. one reviewer described his style
11:18 pm
as gastronomic smuggling, with dishes that slightly partake of elsewhere. on today's menu -- >> i made it for you. >> beef stewed with melon and pumpkin seeds. cornmeal porridge made to a texture more crumbly than pat. >> and pickles. >> right. good taste. >> is it? >> oh, yeah. awesome. you have good food here. you have a lot of great food in a small space. there are no seats. his customers remain part of the constantly theater, where they mingle, talk and serve.
11:19 pm
>> food is a way to engage. you've got to put something in your note to get your ears open, you know? >> across town, another pioneer of sorts, an urban settler in a very different neighborhood. this is hillbrau, a notoriously dangerous district, and this is b.j. >> i see myself singing in front of huge crowds, you know, making money in the process. that's what i'm about. >> he spins records and promotes acts and events in nightclubs. we meet in his favorite spot. in this restaurant. what's good? what do you like? oh, that looks good. fried chicken?
11:20 pm
the place is heavy with the smell of frying chicken, stewing greens. walk right up, place your order, and be sure to get some meal pot. it's a nice heavy base. tell me about the neighborhood. >> when i first came. >> before '92 it was like white business district, residential district? >> back then, you could see respect. >> once hillbrau was an elite whites-only center of town. but when things started to change, so did hillbrau, becoming one of the first gray areas where whites and blacks mixed. it became aspirational, a symbol of everything black africans have long been denied but was now accessible. people poured in in large numbers, many of them squatters from all over the continent. >> people come here with one
11:21 pm
intention. making a living. making money. >> white landlords in tents, simply walked away from their property. the disenfranchised who moved in legally, semi-legally on illegally or just squatting, influx of gangs and criminal organizations, the area soon slipped into anarchy. entire buildings were seized to become superstores for illicit drug operations. everything that could go wrong, did. >> people were making a living from different things. some they sell their bodies. this is where i live. this is where my life is.
11:22 pm
>> we walked down the street and one of the many enterprises doing business on corners and in doorways around us because alarmed at the sight of our cameras. we see an angry mob of people coming our way. we do not turn around our cameras for obvious reasons. these days things are slowly, slowly improving. >> it's like before. you can walk freely. now we are afraid. >> there's actual law enforcement going on in fits and starts. and that's making a difference. black-owned legitimate businesses have gained a real foothold. there are revitalization projects like farmers markets springing up. buildings are being reclaimed and people here hope that hillbrau has passed the bad old days.
11:23 pm
and google is the balsamic. no, actually they separate into a suspension. it's more like the google pixel 2 is the unlimited storage. and verizon is the best unlimited plan. what if it's like h2 and o? yeah. that's right. i had a feeling that would score with you guys. good meeting. (avo) when you really, really want the best get the pixel 2 for up to $300 off on google's exclusive wireless partner, verizon. if yand constipation,ling and you're overwhelmed by everything you've tried-- all those laxatives, daily probiotics, endless fiber-- it could be wearing on you. tell your doctor what you've tried, and how long you've been at it. linzess works differently from laxatives. linzess treats adults with ibs with constipation or chronic constipation. it can help relieve your belly pain and lets you have more frequent and complete bowel movements that are easier to pass. do not give linzess to children less than six and it should not be given to children
11:24 pm
six to less than eighteen. it may harm them. don't take linzess if you have a bowel blockage. get immediate help if you develop unusual or severe stomach pain, especially with bloody or black stools. the most common side effect is diarrhea, sometimes severe. if it's severe, stop taking linzess and call your doctor right away. other side effects include gas, stomach-area pain and swelling. talk to your doctor about managing your symptoms proactively with linzess. ...studying to be a dentist and she gave me advice. my daughter is... she said dadgo pro with crest pro-health. crest pro-health protects all... ...these areas dentists... ...check most. immediately i felt a... ...difference it did an... ...extremely good job of cleaning 4 out of 5 dentists confirm... ...these crest pro-health... ...products help maintain... ...a professional clean. go pro with crest pro-health my daughter inspired me... make a change. crest pro-health really brought my mouth to the next level. crest healthy beautiful smiles for life.
11:25 pm
11:26 pm
11:27 pm
what's in a name, if the name is seweto, you better know what it means. this is madu, for over a decade he's been in at what times has been the very difficult business of driving a taxi. you should probably know that the word taxi in soweto than, say, in new york. how many times in johannesburg? this coming from a potential passenger means soweto. this, and this. johannesburg has different ways
11:28 pm
of showing desired modes of travel. you're not going there? in 1904, soweto came into being of the housing project. it was designed as workers' lodging, the place to put black laborers, comfortably removed from white societies. a ghetto. but the 1950s, it had become the center of resistance to white rule, synonymous against the struggle of the whole rotten racist system. >> i remember one day that the situation was so bad, that my mother had to put me inside a box where we put shoes and hide me under the bed. this is where i grew up most of the time. and sometimes we would get bullets. there was this time these guys were followed me. and they picked me up and shake me. i will never forget that moment in my life.
11:29 pm
i felt stupid, you know? get on, get on. >> how are you? >> hello. >> now, there is a definite cache to living in soweto. back when it was hard and dangerous to have an opinion. man del l lived here. if you say you were born and bred in seweto, it would mean something. people own their homes? they start to make money? can you build up? >> yeah, you can build up. >> look at the streets here and you see what that kind of pride does. it may not be a rich area, but it's it's immaculate.
11:30 pm
>> you know where you're going, right? >> yeah, i know where i'm going. >> next exit, smoky delicious meat over flame. under the overpass, all sorts of mystery meats for sale. the taxi man's lunch. we order some brisket, some sausage, some heart. beautiful thing. meat, a cutting board, a knife. these are good. >> here spread over thousands of square feet, the remnants of white colonial rule.
11:31 pm
what's left from the descendents of bible-thumping dutch settlers who came here to farm, to ranch, to build their own world on top of an existing one. they came in the 1600s, and if nothing else can be said about them, they were a tough bunch of bastards. in 1800s, the british game. diamonds were discovered. there was war, and an ugly one. in the end, there was an uneasy sharing of power. the boards were known as africaners and racist africaner ideology, apartheid laws were enacted and it became the rule for almost 100 years. you want to see a south african wheat, wave this under their nose. mussolini themed restaurant? >> that's it. >> the good old days. >> it didn't look like any butcher i've ever seen.
11:32 pm
>> still the administrative center of south africa. once the heart of apartheid. here you can find a father/son butchery, restaurant and theme museum. i just don't know how i feel about this place. it doesn't fit in with my white liberal guilt sensibilities. as any south african butcher would, they springle brown sugar, pack in layers, repeat. after 24 hours, remove and hang to hair dry for a week. voila, a tasty jerky treat we can all get behind. chef andrea, south african by birth, english and german by background, can usually be found in the trenches of her restaurant the leopard. she's known for her playful
11:33 pm
menus, but loathes culinary fashion. she strives for a locally grounded cuisine. today, however, she's my guide through this twilight zone. it's weird here. and though i'm told the place usually reflects the changing demographic of modern south africa, today, not so much. the customers may or may not have feelings about the africaner memorabilia, but really, they just come for the beef. pick your meat at the butcher counter. we choose t-bone, rum steak. spicy sausage made from beef and pork. >> you don't want to mask it. >> light on the sauce. >> it's barbecue sauce. >> they cook it up along with some fries and presto, a colon-clogging pile of meat in
11:34 pm
the ruling empire. >> meat is a very big thing. there's enough of it, i think. >> good lord, i could swim in it. tastes like oppression. after this show airs, i'm going to get a huge amount of mail saying, why didn't you go to capetown, cutting edge chefs. is it all right that i missed all of that? >> i still like the tip restaurants in capetown, are not really representative of what most people in this country are eating. i think a lot of our most basic stuff is really what we do here. it's never going to change. >> the chefs here understand the great advantage they have is the enormous african larder of ingredients and flavors. >> who knows. if you're in the city, you're probably going to east the worst food of anyone in the city,
11:35 pm
quite honestly. it always feels like it's a little more political here. these layers of things that you couldn't have. like restaurants. i go to restaurants and i think to myself, wow, this many years ago, i couldn't have come here. they were not allowed to sit in here. and i remember clearly being about 8, a cafe owner would regularly not pay the customer who was black with change. he would pay him with bubble gum. and the guy somehow couldn't argue. if you're a black guy, you got your change in bubble gum. and i was feeling like, oh, my god, this is so terrible. but you couldn't say anything. because that would have been worse. it was so innocent and representative of badness. it just seems mad.
11:36 pm
nobody does it better. she's also in a rock band. look at her shred. but when it comes to mortgages, she's less confident. fortunately for maria, there's rocket mortgage by quicken loans. it's simple, so she can understand the details and be sure she's getting the right mortgage. apply simply. understand fully. mortgage confidently. listen up, heart disease. you too, unnecessary er visits. and hey, unmanaged depression, don't get too comfortable. we're talking to you, cost inefficiencies, and data without insights. and fragmented care, stop getting in the way of patient recovery and pay attention. every single one of you is on our list. at optum, we're partnering across the health system to tackle its biggest challenges. at optum, we're partnering across the health system directv has been rated #1 in customer satisfaction over cable for 17 years running. but some people still like cable.
11:37 pm
just like some people like banging their head on a low ceiling. drinking spoiled milk. camping in poison ivy. getting a papercut. and having their arm trapped in a vending machine. but for everyone else, there's directv. for #1 rated customer satisfaction over cable switch to directv. call 1-800-directv. it's called broccoli of cheddar i loved it, but it was like, "honey, i am way too decadent for you!" so i came up with o, that's good! a new line of comfort soups with a nutritious twist. we replaced a hunk of this... with velvety butternut squash. if i hadn't told you, you wouldn't know. comfort food that loves you back. o... mmm ...that's good!
11:38 pm
11:39 pm
11:40 pm
this is the largest antelope in the world. it is also, luckily for him, delicious. got him. >> i think that was very good. >> that is such good meat. that's really what we do. >> though this one weighs in around a ton, rest assured every bite, every scrap will be eaten. some of that tonight at dinner.
11:41 pm
chef andrea birgner, deion a hunting expert and myself join bailey on his farm. his dad was originally a publisher of a drum magazine, a first of its kind during apartheid, disguised as glossy pop culture. his farm is a mere 20 miles from johannesburg. all of this in sight of the city. near his farm,idden within the city's shadow, is what's known as the cradle of humankind. a unesco world heritage site, an incredible look back at where we, the human animal, came from. >> this is a classy little sinkhole.
11:42 pm
there are loads of these. the cradle, this is called a cradle, now a world heritage site. 60% of all the evidence of human evolution comes out of this valley. the geology just conspires to preserve fossils. they're a very, very rare thing. but they've found more here in the last ten years than they've found anywhere. so you're home. this is where you started. >> my ancestral homeland? >> this is your ancestral homeland. >> that makes me happy. what does that sound remind you of you guys? happy childhood? meat sizzling over the fire? parental love? your enemy generals frying in hot oil? nothing?
11:43 pm
fire and fresh kill. i get to work on the heart. something i strongly suspect will be delicious. and i'm right. andrea works her magic on the liver, drenched in flour and sauteed. the loin seared in glaze. and there's papercash, with paprika, peppers, onions, tomato and cream. as the sun sets over the belt, johannesburg's lights winking in the distance, a feast. meat on the plate, blood on my pants, life is good. i've been very, very, very confused by my visit here. you've got basically a goulash here. italian inflected liver going on here. the bread, someone referred to as portuguese? >> yeah, portuguese, but it's from madira. >> south africa, depending who i
11:44 pm
talk to, completely different contrast. for some people it's whoever comes to south africa from anywhere else in africa. all the good stuff from malaysia, east indies. >> there's different colonialists. >> does original african have any meaning? >> this wood is originally pine. >> i arrived spectacularly ignorant. i will leave spectacularly ignorant. that's it. look how much coffee's in here? fresh coffee. so rich. i love it. that's why you should be a keurig man! full-bodied. are you sure you're describing the coffee and not me? do you wear this every day? everyday. i'd never take it off. are you ready to say goodbye to it? go! go!
11:45 pm
ta da! a terrarium. that's it. we brewed the love, right guys? (all) yes. we brewed the love, right guys? t-mobile's unlimited now includes netflix on us. that's right. netflix on us. get 4 unlimited lines for just $40 bucks each. taxes and fees included. and now netflix included. so go ahead. binge on us. another reason why t-mobile is america's best unlimited network. i'm vern, the orange money retirement rabbit, from voya. i'm the money you save for retirement. who's he? he's green money, for spending today. makes it easy to tell you apart. that, and i am better looking. i heard that. when it's time to get organized for retirement, it's time to get voya.
11:46 pm
[burke] abstract accident. seen ♪ video-it. covered it.c we know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪
11:47 pm
11:48 pm
ramadan. at this hour, all over ja han esburg, members of south africa's sizeable muslim community observe. the religion of islam as many of south africa's most beloved and delicious dishes and ingredients come from malaysia, indonesia, india. during apartheid, many south africans would have been referred to as colored. color didn't mean black, it meant everybody else who wasn't exactly white. asians and mixed race. in the observatory neighborhood of johannesburg, this family prepares for the meal at sundown
11:49 pm
when fasting for ramadan is broken. joey is a stand-up comedian and actor of cape melee background. this dish, panang curry with beef and eggs. joey's wife, cindy, prepares a chicken pie. their son makes the traditional ramadan shake. daughter laya. everything smells terrific. nice. >> nice to have soup after you've not eaten the whole day. it's nourishing and all those good things. >> there's also cheese and beef
11:50 pm
samosas. these are delicious. you were born in johannesburg? >> yeah, i'm a johannesburg guy. >> how are things? >> depends what type of things you're talking about. >> society operates the way society should. but on the other hand, in many ways this is a new country. >> it is. we're 19 years society should, but on the other hand, in many ways this is a new country. >> joey: it is. we're 19 years old. >> anthony: everybody's from someplace else. >> cindy: i think the africans from the other countries see south africa as a place of hope, because there's a lot of bustling here. there are a lot of opportunities, lots of people make it from here. you won't find 3 million germans coming here or 3 million french people coming here. it's africans who come from far less to come and find a little bit of something here. >> joey: so how do you find south africa so far? >> cindy: yeah. >> anthony: i like it. i'm very comfortable here. i like a country where people have a sense of humor. a lot of ball-busting going on in this country. >> joey: all the time, from the top to the bottom.
11:51 pm
>> anthony: 20 years from now, what is south africa going to be like? >> joey: their generation, the born-frees now, is the one that's giving our current president lots of hell. the born-frees is the ones that was born in the new democracy or just before the first election. the born-frees now, they like, "look here, we went to school. this is right and this is wrong. and what you're doing is wrong." but we had a struggle. >> cindy: yeah. >> joey: yeah, "we weren't part of a struggle. i don't care. thank you for the struggle, i'll go twitter now." >> anthony: now i want five bars on my 3g. i want -- >> cindy: yeah. >> joey: absolutely. >> anthony: wi-fi, and it better be high speed. >> joey: absolutely. >> cindy: and why can't i have it? >> joey: why can't i have it? >> cindy: i don't think the current politicians foresaw that. >> joey: yeah. >> cindy: foresaw the born-frees not supporting them. >> anthony: right. >> joey: there's a critical mass of young people that wants to change south africa in a positive way. how they do it or how they go about it, i don't know the answer to that. neither do they know the answer to that, but their intentions is clear.
11:52 pm
ard. hey. what can you tell me about your new social security alerts? oh! we'll alert you if we find your social security number on any one of thousands of risky sites, so you'll be in the know. ooh. sushi. ugh. being in the know is a good thing. sign up online for free. discover social security alerts.
11:53 pm
(avo) if you'rand you've triedlly pain any number of laxatives, probiotics, and fiber, it could be wearing on you. tell your doctor what you've tried and how long you've been at it. linzess works differently from laxatives. linzess treats adults with ibs with constipation or chronic constipation. it can help relieve your belly pain and lets you have more frequent and complete bowel movements that are easier to pass. do not give linzess to children less than six, and it should not be given to children six to less than eighteen. it may harm them. don't take linzess if you have a bowel blockage. get immediate help if you develop unusual or severe stomach pain, especially with bloody or black stools.
11:54 pm
the most common side effect is diarrhea, sometimes severe. if it's severe stop taking linzess and call your doctor right away. other side effects include gas, stomach-area pain, and swelling. talk to your doctor about managing your symptoms proactively with linzess. [don't stop me nowhad by queen]me sir. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪
11:55 pm
with over 500 flights every day, emirates brings the world together through dubai. fly emirates for a world of good times. ♪ ♪ >> anthony: no more hipster jokes.
11:56 pm
it's low-hanging fruit, and one can no longer argue against the steady creep of their foodie sensibilities. artisanal cheeses? yes, right over there. handmade charcuterie? yes, there. thin-crust pizza, a very respectable paella. yes, yes, and yes. it's official. they're here and they aren't going anywhere. i like the idea of a burger for breakfast. there's something a little perverse about that. throw in a crowd of much more racially diverse hungry people and you might think you're in brooklyn. surely, this is not a bad thing. this is neighbourgood's market in the braamfontein precinct of johannesburg. my dining companion, "city press" arts and features writer percy mabandu, says we should hold out for this -- the balkan burger. >> cook: next! >> anthony: one with cheese for me.
11:57 pm
>> percy: one with cheese, lots of cheese. >> anthony: hell yeah, flattened ground beef seared over flame. >> percy: yeah. don't cook me. cook the food, all right? >> anthony: add kashkaval and mozzarella cheese, fold it up, pick your condiments. you got cabbage, tomato, onion, lettuce, of course, and hot peppers. up to the roof with a view, and eat. woo! spicy, good. i guess i wanna talk about nelson mandela, because what i was not aware of at all was the degree to which he was personally responsible for really the nuts and bolts of the transition from white rule to majority rule. >> percy: oh right. >> anthony: now he's very ill. >> percy: ill, yeah. >> anthony: what happens after mandela do you think? >> percy: we go on. i think the foundation is laid. and i think thank god we have him as a symbol. i think mandela represents our
11:58 pm
collective better intentions as a nation. >> anthony: all the things that could have gone terribly wrong, it's a remarkable thing how well it -- it went. >> percy: between 1990 and 1994, tough times, you know, internecine fighting, black-on-black violence, black-on-white violence. are we going to descend into a black path? but we transcended that through that message of coming together regardless of the unresolved issues. >> anthony: to what extent is it really a rainbow nation? are things getting mixed? we like to think we live in a rainbow nation, but in fact, in the states, black and white live in to a great extent in different neighborhoods. it's only 19 years. in some ways it looks to me outside looking in, a little more gracefully mixed up than we've managed to pull off successfully in the states. >> percy: here, i mean, you've got black, white, colored, you know, all sorts of people here. but i think, in all fairness also one should have knowledge
11:59 pm
that the economic disparities are managing to keep us divided as well. i think what we need to do is unpack what we mean by rainbow. i think the idea of united in our diversity also means that, you know, and there are moments of discord. >> anthony: and do you think things will continue to improve? >> percy: yeah, i think we've seen our worst. and that's not to say that we're getting it right all the time, but it's an experiment with democracy. it's an experiment you need to fine-tune as you go along. that's really the south african story. the dream is there, we all agree. the divisions are there, but these are not bigger than our hopes. >> anthony: what did i know about south africa before i came here? exactly nothing as it turns out. but i think based on what i've seen is that if the world can get it right here, a country with a past like south africa's, if they can figure out how to
12:00 am
make it work here for everybody, absorb all the people flooding in from all over africa, continue to make mandela's dream a reality, maybe there is hope for the rest of us. -- captions by vitac -- >> anthony: for most of my life, libya was a word with bad associations. libya meant gaddafi. libya meant terrorism. >> reporter: pan am flight 103 went down in a blazing fireball. >> anthony: libya meant a bad place where a comical megalomaniacal dictator was the absolute power. nobody in libya, however, was laughing. >> reporter: reports of explosions. >> reporter: clashes between rioters and security forces. >> anthony: in 2011, what was previously unthinkable happened. the libyan people rose up and fought for their freedom. >> reporter: heavy battles raging around the libyan capital. >> anthony: they fought like hell. >> reporter: the rebels are about to force gaddafi's


info Stream Only

Uploaded by TV Archive on