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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  November 13, 2017 5:00pm-6:00pm PST

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sect secretary of state will be meeting with her today and traveling to myanmar tomorrow. the question is will the u.s. take a tougher tone with the leader to discuss request a need to be done. erin. >> thanks so much for that incredible report. anderson's next. good evening, we begin tonight with breaking news on russia during the campaign involving involving the president's son. three full weeks mike pence denied the campaign was in quote, ka hoots with quicky leeks. don junior was involved with wikileaks. what is so fascinating is how the communications in the form of twitter, direct messages, meshed with certain points on the campaign time line that we know quite well.
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for instance, october 2nd, trump friend and adviser roger stone tweets, damaging information coming from wikileaks. don junior messages them and ask them what's coming. on the 7th, u.s. intelligence says tbls russia was behind the acts. a month later, the 12th of october, wikileaks messages trump junior asking them to link to one of their items. two days later he tweets it out. on the 14th, mike pence denies any communication with wicky looks. it is fascinating to us. first cnn justice correspondent pam pamela brown with more details. explain, the sheer length of this conversation went on is stunning, pam. >> it is stunning. one sided was from wikileaks but
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there were responses from don junior. he released the strong of messages tonight on twitter that he had with wickly licks during the campaign. in september of last year we noted the first message came, late september, 2016 where wicky licks told him quote, a path website of trump -- is about to launch. don junior responded off the record, i don't know who that is but i'll ask around. thanks. according to the atlantic he did ask around by reaching out to member ts of campaign including the son-in-law jared kushner. it's unclear in what context he was saying that but kushner reported that e-mail on. don junior reached out october 3rd asking wikileaks what the fuss was about regarding the release that roger stone tweeted
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about at the time he was hadn'ting at this release. wikileaks didn't respond just then. four days later it did release john podesta e-mails on the same day russia was condemned for using stolen e-mails. after that wikileaks reached out again to urge don junior to tweet out a hing. he did tweet out that link two days later, anderson. >> i think the very day he got that message asking him to tweet out the link, he said something about the story saying it doesn't get enough attention, then two days later he tweeted out the link. what do we know about wikileaks during this time period? >> that same day the link was tweeted out, mike pence said on
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fox news the campaign was not in ka hoots with wikileaks. take a look. >> one of the final questions about wikileaks, all this bad stuff about hillary and nothing about trump. your campaign is in ka hoots with wikileaks? >> nothing from the truth. all of us have had concerns about it over the years and it's just a concern. it doesn't change the fact that you see -- >> there was the same day that don junior tweeted out a link given to him by wikileaks. they continued to reach out through july of this year but don junior did not respond to those messages. >> don junior released the exchanges tonight after the story broke. any more reaction from him or
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his legal team? >> his legal team has given us a statement, his attorney, he says we can say with confident we have no concerns about these documents. any questions raised about them has been answered in the appropriate forum. a source familiar with this matter alltels us, anderson, didn't junior did tell wikileaks about the conversation. he had a closed door interview with a commission a while back. accident occurring that meeting it was brought up by i'm told it was a braef exchange regarding that matter. >> senator blooming that will calling to subpoena don junior. he wants the president's son to testify about the extent of the conversations. so -- and they're not worried about it. what specifically do you want to know? >> what i want to foe is the
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full range and content of all the communications that took place. what we see here likely is just the tip of the iceberg. there's no assurance that it is all of the communications between donald trump jr. and the wikileaks, which by the way, is characterized by the cia director, president trump's own ci director as a hostile intelligent service abetted by the russians. so, he was donald trump jr. actively engaged with a known russia agent. i want him to be subpoenaed to testify in public about all his communications. i want there to be subpoenas of all the relevant documents because there's no assurance that we're seeing all of those documents without that kind of subpoena. >> do you believe it's possible, then candidate, donald trump seni sr., did not know his son was
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communicating with wikileaks? >> one of the striking assets of these communications is the tone of them. and also, the fact that donald trump jr. was in fact communicating up the chain of the trump campaign organization, including likely to his father campaign. there is so much circumstances evidence that this now president was knowledgeable about the conversation. >> the week that don jr. was asked to post the link from
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wikileaks, then t-- do you want to hear from the vice president on this? >> not only the vice president but the president himself. there needs to be a statement from the president about whether or not he was knowledgeable about his son and wikileaks. the trump administration owes the american people a full explanations. >> we just -- i just received a -- a statement from liz landers from vice president's pence's press secretary. excuse me ali a farrah. she said quote, the vice president was never aware of anyone associated with the campaign being in contact with wickly leeks. he just learned of this report earlier tonight. what do you make of that? >> these revelations and reports, anderson are stunning, they're jaw dropping. it may be fine under normal circumstances for a spokesperson to say the vp or any other official has no knowledge, that
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explanations should be provided by the vice president himself and without any disrespect, in my view relevant officials at the trump administration should provide that kind of explanation in public and under oath to the judiciary committee. my hope is now that chairman grassley who has indicated he wants to get to the bottom of these issues, will in fact issue subpoenas for donald trump jr. for jared kushner and for other relevant witnesses. and there is a pattern here. papadopoulos and his plea agreement is part of that packet. >> two known -- does that undercut at all this was part of something larger if he only responded twice? >> great question. and it reinforces my point that we may be seeing here only the tip of the iceberg. what we're seeing here is some
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of the responses. we know there were in fact responses in action that is tweeting in response to it. but we may be seeing only the very tip of what was going on. >> wouldfully of this communication in your view would have broken any laws? >> another great question. in and of itself each of these tweets may be the full range of what's in the atlantic report, may not violate any law but it is more pieces of a moe sayic. each piece itself, perhaps explain bl, but together with the george papadopoulos plea agreement and its communication with russians, the june 9th feeting involving now known russia agents, all of it coming together and more likely to be revealed. >> does it seems monument lina
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eve or just stupid that donald trump jr. will respond with an account? he has no idea whose operating that account and he's telling them this is off the record. that just seems -- i don't know how to describe that. >> imprudent and unwise is a good way to characterize it. certainly uncharacter isk of a business person or campaign official. whether it's illegal is another question, and you've asked it. that's a question that's no doubt on the mind of the special counsel. it should be on the minds of the judiciary committee, because we have an obligation to protect the fbi and the department of justice from political interference as we seek to know what the full extent is and what of the russian meddling and
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possible trump campaign collusion. that is the evidence and the evide evidentiary value of these communications. collusion and what exactly it shows. >> and finally, these are two instances with donald trump jr. where it would be very easy, and we don't know whether this happened, but it will be hard to believe really that he did not at some point tell his father, you know what, i'm in direct communication with wikileaks or they're making these suggestions to me, just as when he has these meetings with a lawyer whose spoededly representing the kremlin with dirt on hillary clinton. the idea that he never told his father about that meeting, that's two instances with the idea that donald trump jr. is kn knowingly communicating with somebody who he doesn't know who they are with conversations off the record and not tell his
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father. again, we don't know if he did but it is highly questionable. >> there seems to be no explanations for these communications and there seems to be no circumstantial evidence to say he didn't communicate with his father. in fact, on the opposite side, his father drafted a statement for him to explain the june 9th meeting while on air force-1. we know his father tweeted seeminglessly with response to these communications. >> yeah. and he sent an e-mail out. senator richard blooming that will appreciate you being on. up next, retired lieutenant james clapper. breaking news of another woman coming forward accusing roy moore of sexual assault.
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it's what's inside isthe person who opens it.x. give ancestrydna, the only dna test that can trace your origins to over 150 ethnic regions. save 20% for the holidays at breaking news tonight on communication between donald trump jr. and wikileaks comes after two solid days over what
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trump said about the russian meddling. yesterday he walked back to his remarks somewhat saying he believed putin believed there was no meddling and he says he has no issue now with the intelligent leaders or as it is presently run. reaction from all of this as one of those people that the president describe a the alleged hack. james clapper. thank for being with us. first of all on this wikileaks story i have to ask were you aware of any of this when you were the director of national intelligence? >> no i was not. we knew about the connection between the russians and wikileaks although western sure -- or at least i wasn't whether that was an un-whitingly relationship. or weather that was an overt
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relationship, i didn't know that at the time. the thing about all this, anderson, for me, you run out of add jessica tifrs to describe the daily revelations coming out. you know, you have to sort of step back and think about the big picture here. why on earth the trump camp was engaging with the russians at all. and now wikileaks, which others have recited, director mike pompeo's characterization of wikileaks is an intelligent service, which i agree with. why on earth would there be any contact? on earthly reason what there be that was positive for any of these contacts, whether russians, wickly kekileaks or a
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else. >> doesn't it seem irresponsible for donald trump jr. to be communicating with someone who he doesn't know who it is on the other side and suggesting the conversations off the record between me and you, this anonymous person? i have no idea who they are. >> yes. it's pretty incredible that the lack of concern about security. it makes me wonder whether they were really taking themselves seriously, whether this was a serious campaign and they thought they could win it. because of the cavalier manner in which a lot of these communications went on. and of course as we all know, e-mails are forever. so, it appears to me they weren't too careful about the trail here of communications with some questionable characters. >> it's also amazing, according to the atlantic, october 12,
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wikileaks reaching out to donald trump jr. thanking him for his father saying something nice about wikileaks, suggesting that his dad tweet out a link to wikileaks. donald trump jr. doesn't respond. 15 minutes later from the time this message is received, donald trump himself tweets out, very little pickup by dishonest media of incredible information by wikileaks. and two days later trump junior does in fact tweet out the link he was asked to tweet out. >> yeah. well plot thickens here. >> that's a huge coincidence. >> i think unlikely that it's continuance dental. i do think that again, whatever metaphor you want to use, piece of the puzzle. tile of the mosaic, whatever, is that -- and i'm sure, special
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counsel mueller's doing this, do a very detailed me tick clus reconstruction of the events and then determine what was said publicly. again, it's -- the pitfall i think is getting into the weeds of each of these revelations on a day-to-day basis and kind of loses sight of the bigger picture here. >> does this qualify as collusion with you? not with russia per se by wikileaks? >> well, liked before i'm not an attorney and i don't know what constitutes collusion. i'm not sure that's an offense. >> right t not. >> it certainly have the appears and smell and feel of a developing conspiracy. >> richard clapper appreciate your time.
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. more on our breaking news on secret communication with donald trump jr. and wikileaks during the campaign. joining me now to discuss jeffrey toobin, steve hall. phil mud.
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also david fran. jeff, the fact that donald trump jr. is basically acting on the advice of wikileaks at times, it's incredible. is it unlawfully? >> it may be. we're getting a lot closer to an actually violation of the law with this evidence. for example, it's illegal for a campaign to solicit or receive campaign contributions from a foreign individual or foreign company. now that campaign contribution can be cash or in inkind contribution. anything of value. here you have at least suggested evidence tat trump campaign is soliciting and receiving information from -- which it has value. this is opposition research. and opposition research, campaigns pay for all the time. the fact that the campaign seems in active coordination with this
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non-american entity, wikileaks, certainly suggest the possibility of at least a criminal investigation. >> and phil, according to the atlantic, donald trump jr. send an e-mail to the other top people in the campaign says hey i'm in touch with wikileaks. >> one of the things you got to look at, we're talking about one avenue, which is what don junior looked at. you got to look at this investigation as a multicase table. i want to know every phone, e-mail, twitter contact between anybody in the campaign, including don junior and wikileaks. then you have a second question, that is during the interviews of all these individuals, what do they say about those exchanges with wikileaks and do they talk about whether there was conversations within the campaign. there's one other question i
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can't answer, that's a technical question. i'd be going to twitter saying what's your recordkeeping, if i'm bob mueller, can you give us the information with any contact. so this really gives you a picture of why these investigationes are so complicated. >> steve, i keep thinking about this, learning from over time, is that all these people in the trump campaign. carter page, papadopoulos, mike flynn seem willing or open to at least communication. >> yeah, anderson, what you're beginning to see from the counter intelligence perspective are the dots being connected. we're seeing more and more influence from the campaign that the russian intelligence services were weighing in. i think it's clear now they were
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targeting heavily with donald trump. we saw where he met with the russian lawyer after expressing great interest and any derogatory information the lawyer might have on hillary clinton and now we're seeing it again through another russian cut out. remember the russian lawyer was the cut out the first time, this time it's wikileaks. one of the interesting things about running these corporate actions and influence programs is, you know your supervisors and bosses want to know are they effective. i can tell you if wikileaks sent something to donald trump jr. and 15 minutes later that same message comes out of donald trump jr., the candidate's mouth that's a good communicating that you have impact with your message. you with also say papadopoulos is a part-time guy, donald trump jr. is nod a part time son he's
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a member of the family, which will make him that much more valuable to the russian intelligence service. >> and to steve's point, donald trump sr. said something 15 minutes after the message was received from wikileaks saying, oh, your dad should tweet this stuff out. if it took 15 minutes, and we don't know if donald trump jr. did talk to donald trump sr., but it raises a huge question, but if he was willing to talk to his dad based on that, the idea he didn't talk to his dad based on this meeting he had when a russian lawyer from the kremlin tell him they have dirt on hillary clinton and the campaign, that seems unbelievable he didn't talk to his dad. >> to the question are any laws broken, it is illegal for an american to solicit anything of value from foreigner.
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there's an exception to that rule, which is none of the law plies to media organizations. one of the defense tat trump people were parent as this case got up, was to say even if we did cooperate with wikileaks that's media bauds they're a media organization. the revelation of the method we see on wikileaks i think pass powerful contradiction to that. wikileaks is acting like an organization of influence. oregons do not call on defeated candidates to attest the ability of an election. if wikileaks is not an media organization, all of this has a much more sinister implication. if they are a media organization, donald trump jr. and senior has a defense. if anybody did believe wikileaks are a media organization they're a lot less likely.
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>> anderson if i can jump in there. mike pompeo who is donald trump's director of central intelligence has said repeatedly that wikileaks is an agent influence of the russian government. as for what wikileaks really is, donald trump's cia has a clear view and it is not wikileaks is some online magazine it is that it's an agent of russian government. >> yeah, and donald trump jr. was speaking with them. another accuser coming forward with sexual conduct against roy moore. we'll get into that. you'll hear what she said happened in her own words and a swift reaction from capitol hill. we'll continue. some advisers have hidden and layered fees. fisher investments never does.
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another woman came forward today accusing alabama candidate roy moore of sexual misconduct, she was 16 and he was in his 30s. i believe the women mcconnell said, some of them do not. nor do they believe "the washington post" which first broke this story when four women they say approached him, one alleges sexual encounter when she was 14 years old. moore is suing the post. beverly nelson, she says back in 1944 moore sexually assaulted her in his car after offering her a ride home where she work
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requested he ate. we want to play a critical portion of it. decide for yourself what to make of your alleges. >> he stopped the car -- he stopped the car and parked his car in between the dumpster and the back of the restaurant, where there were no lights. the area was dark and it was deserted. i was alarmed and i immediately asked him what he was doing. instead of answering my question mr. moore reached over and began groping me and putting his hands over my breast. i tried to op my car door to leave but he reached over, he locked it so i could not get out. i tried fighting him off while
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yelling at him to stop. but instead of stopping, he began squeezing my neck attempting to force my head on to his crotch. i continued to struggle, i was determined that was not -- that i was not going to allow him to force me to have sex with him. i was terrified. he was also trying to pull my shirt off. i thought that he was going to rape me. i was twisting and i was struggling and i was begging him to stop. i had tears running down my face. at some point -- at some point he gave up, and he then looked at me and he told me, he says, you're just a child and he said, i am the district attorney of
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the at what you county and if you tell anyone about this no one will ever believe you. >> beverly young nelson revealing what she said when she was 16 years old in roy moore's car. some of the defender raising question barajas the motivation -- about the motivation. >> i do not expect "the washington post" to stop. i think they have a political agenda and i think they're running that agenda and everybody in this room, every person watching on these cameras should ask themselves, isn't it strange that after 40 years of consistent investigation, people have waited to for weeks prior to the general election to bring their complaints. >> now, whatever you make of the alleges, and roy moore denies them, this notion that women waited decades to come forward
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until it will be politically damaging to him doesn't seem to stand up. neither kofman nor any other people sought out the post. two post reporters contacted and interviewed the four women, all were initially reluctant to speak publicly but chose to do so after multiple interviews saying it was important for people to know about their interaction with moore. subsequently a former ko worker of his in the district attorney's office in alabama stated at the time moore was known to date high schoolers. >> teresa jones spoke with cnn and she told us it was common knowledge that he dated high school girls. we wondered why someone his age
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would hang out at high school footballs and the mall but you really wouldn't say anything about that. >> we should point out that the lady who was 16 at the time said that her encounter with then district attorney roy moore was anything but consent wall. prior to to beverly moore coming forward -- he's yet to sue and discredit the story. however late today he did respond his wife as well, to the latest alleges. >> i want to make it perfectly clear the people of ma'alabama e and my character. i can tell you without hesitation this is absolutely false. i never did what she said i did. i don't even know the woman, i don't know anything about her. i don't even know where the restaurant is or was. >> you heard roy moore say he did not know his accuser.
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at a press conference today she showed her yearbook and it reads quote, to a beautiful sweeter girl i could not say merry christmas. signature seems to be roy moore. in light of this reports have been clashing all day on national republicans. a lot of calls from republicans on capitol hill for moore to drop out, where does things stand tonight? >> that's right, there is republicans saying moore need to drop out of the race period, no caveat. some are saying they hold their endorsement of moore. as you recall, the line coming from republicans when this broke is that if these allegations are true, moore should step aside. now you have a lot of republicans, a growing number who are dropping that, if true. they are saying he needs to get out. its come from a few republicans over the weekend and then mitch
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mcconnell, the senate senator leader weighed in in kentucky today, he said he believed the accuse rs. he found them credible and he said more needs to step aside. now the question is where does this go. mcconnell talkinged about the idea of a right in candidacy. luther strange himself here on the hill today pouring cold water on that saying that a arriving candidacy would be highly unlikely. >> should roy moore will elected could candidates refuse to see him? >> i don't know about refusing to see him but expelling him is a possibility. he is the head of the campaign arm for republican senators. he's got his eye on the midterm
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elections. he's worried this is something that's going to bring down other senate republicans. he said if roy moore refuses to withdraw and he wins, the senate should expel him. that is something that will take 3/3 of the claim -- 2/3 of the claimer to push forward. i was talking to one democratic senator whose been here for quite a while, anderson, he said it will be hard to imagine a situation where certainly he would not vote to expel roy moore. he said politics aside, because as you can imagine, roy moore being a problem for republicans, as something that favors democrats. politics aside, roy moore is not good for the senate. does seem like there could be some democratic support to an effort to expel him if he's seated. it's a real possibility. >> appreciate it.
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thank you very much. support among his base in alabama still strong in many places. we'll get into that with our panel when we come back. the day, that we find a cure? i think how much i can do to help change people's lives. i may not benefit from those breakthroughs, but i'm sure going to... i'm bringing forward a treatment for alzheimer's disease, yes, in my lifetime, i will make sure. duncan just protected his family with a $500,000 life insurance policy. how much do you think it cost him? $100 a month? $75? $50? actually, duncan got his $500,000 for under $28 a month. less than $1 a day! his secret? selectquote. in just minutes a selectquote agent will comparison shop
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than we could ever go alone. sofi. get there sooner. even before today's new accuser came forward, the headlines were already piling up against him. mitch mcconnell saying moore should step aside, and gop senators joined in. when he got to hear more from the white house has alabamaens are sticking with moore. >> after the initial story broke, i had more support. my phone actually rang off the hook for almost 24 hours. >> people saying they wanted to volunteer for the campaign? >> yes, people wand to volunteered, signs for the yard, people who say i don't believe it, he's a good man and we want to show our support for him,, yes absolutely. >> a perspective from peter
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binarc and chief political correspondent dana bash. how do you see this playing out? >> it's completely unclear. i think it's as clear as mud right now. you saw this avalanche of republican leaders, republican rank and file, even people like ted cruz who had endorsed roy moore appeared to rescind it and leaving out the if-true part, which we had heard through the weekend from the white house. but how they deal with it in real terms, if roy moore does go ahead and win this special election, stays on the ballot and wins in december, it's going to be as ugly as it gets because there doesn't seem to be a mechanism for the senate to keep him from being seated, but there
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is expulsion. even the top republican in charge of electing republicans, keeping gop seats in place is a saying he wants to start expulsion proceedings, and he's not alone. >> do you agree are senator ted cruz? you said the burden is on moore to provide a demonstration that the accusations are false, and short of that he's not going to support moore. >> i disagree with mike lee and ted cruz. we're in a good old fashioned political hit. the fact is just this works 40 days before the election. gloria allred gets to say all the facts, and "the new york times" didn't check any of them. they admit, we didn't check any facts, we just took gloria
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allred's word for it. this is an extraordinary indictment. if the indictment of elected officials is premised on women just saying something, then bill clinton should have been thrown out for what the women said. moore is 70 years old and has never had an allegation like this, and suddenly he's had a litany of it. "the washington post" is way out of touch with we the people, and i hope alabama votes for who they want for this seat, and when they do, let the senate reject people and we'll go right down the line: the people on tv, we'll diet them for personal conduct because many of them that you cite, we'll get someone. we're in dangerous territory and it's a real shame. any of the women coming forward deserve to be heard, but the
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fact they're being encountered at true and therefore the guy should have thrown out of office is amazing to me. >> why would these women possibly lie? these are not -- sorry. >> let him finish. >> these are not political people, right? did you watch that woman giving a press conference? do you think she was enjoying that process? this is obviously deeply traumatic stuff. we know "the washington post" had to find them and convince them to participate, and most of them were trump supporters. this claim that just because it appeared in "the washington post," which happens to be one of america's best newspapers, and because this happened before the election, therefore it must be made up, these women talked to people at the time. they talked about the incident decades ago. again, what possible motive would they have to lie? >> ed? >> anderson, peter said seven
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things i didn't say. i didn't say because they said it, they lied. i said 40 days before an election to roll out a systemic plan and have members of congress condemn him. it's pretty clear it's an order, right? by the way, just because "the washington post" says they didn't seek them out, it doesn't mean -- we know the campaign operatives don't say go find this and this. >> ed, are you saying that this is some sort of plot by "the washington post" at the behest of democrats or mainstream republicans? >> i'm saying the establishment in this case made clear they didn't want him, and it's a systematic effort to discredit him. what i said was you're saying
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they have to be true and moore has to be lying. and i'm saying moore has a right to be taken by truth. a and his word has been pretty good. he's been alleged to do a lot of things in terms of politics and policy, but never this. suddenly your life is transformed by people saying it. >> peter and then dana. >> i think these women's lives were transformed by what appears to be his terrible abuse of power. it's the same thing we saw with donald trump and i think you're right, bill clinton. >> good. >> when you have six women who don't know each other and keep coming forward despite the fact it's difficult for them to come forward, and then to be attacked all over the place by all these people, there's just -- it belies credulity. >> here's what i would say. what we're witnessing between
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these two gentlemen, maybe replace peter with an establishment republican is an illustration of what's been going on with the republican party, it's bearing out with a very, very unfortunate, horrible story, allegations and defense that this isn't true. at the end of the day, we talked about this the night this broke last week, roy moore was never the candidate for the establishment. they cringe at the notion separating all of this from his record, but just in terms of what we know that he has said and supported with regard to his experience in the state supreme court. and so that is the bottom line. even if the president weighs in -- >> we're going to have more in our next hour.
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