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tv   CNN Tonight With Don Lemon  CNN  December 5, 2017 8:00pm-9:00pm PST

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through a tax bill that is dangerous to a large part of the american people. that's a freaking travesty. >> thank you all. coming up we are live with new developments, steve bannon campaigning in alabama tonight for roy moore and this time has the president on his side. bannon is not just rally the troops for moore, an accused kpr ed and the trump accuser who wants to take the president to court could he be forced to takes a deposition i'm going to ask the attorney, gloria albright is going to join us and writeser for stlachbt gik teec . so much term oil right now.
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there's so much turmoil right now it teams like the wheels are coming off the bus what's your take on all this. >> i talk to my colleagues about this all the time it is positively exhausting. we have a president who tweets, we have him making decisions, sometimes seemingly to provoke, to turn the page, to crowd the stage with more action. i don't think americans know how to make sense of it. one of my greatest worries the provocatio provocations, the acts of indecency and bad judgment come at us so quick lly that they al blur and numbering americans to the point we can can't see as we should. >> do you think that's strategic or someone whose mind
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>> it's a organic convergence of both those things. >> i often feel the same way you feel. what were we covering last week do you remember. >> no. i was with a prominent republican friend and turned to me and said you realize pocahantus was just three days ago and we were stunned these things are quickly receded to the past they're not okay none of it is okay but because it becomes this blur i think president trump benefits from the offenses he gives from the sheer volume of indecent things he says and tweets and does. >> it's exhausting. you're right about that. republican senator jeff flake weigh in. writing check for doug jones with the message country over party.
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the rnc, the capit ulation for more has to be appalling to many people that are now standing up. >> yeah it's interesting. i spent time talking to jeff flake earlier this year, i profiled him in "the atlantic" he at the time had not announced he was going to retire he was kind of lambenting the state of our politics our political culture raising a lot of the same concerns frank just raised and at the time was deciding whether he thought there was still a place for someone like him in the republican party. he obviously decided to retire. i think that's the answer to his question there's not. what's remarkable, you see this wide-spread shift in conservative base especially among religious conservatives. a poll last year tracked a remarkable shift among white
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evangelicals five years earlier widely believed character, personal morality was important, was essential to assessing a public official or politician, five years later in the midst of donald trump's campaign the vast majorities believed private morality wasn't important and public official can continue to serve admirably and ethically even if they were immoral in their private lives. i think is playing out in alabama and going to continue seeing that have effects on our kul culture and politics. >> what is that called? plain old hypocrisy or not having any moral convictions. >> i talked to a lot of them and a lot say we under estimate how grieved they feel in this country they feel the culture is
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slipping away. white evangelicalal feel christians are more persecuted in this country thachb muslims are. people will say that is ludicrous but it's how you feel. when you feel that attacked or under threat by the elite you are willing to compromise and frankly they're just looking for body guards people who can plpr them. >> i'm not here to coddle anyone, that simly is just not true. because you feel that way does not make it true might the people who feel that way need to get out of their own bubble, stop watching whatever they watch to get there or reading whatever and take a look at the world and nation around them to figure out what they feel is not necessarily the reality. >> you said a crucial word which
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is bubble, we're all living in these bubbles where we curate the nflinformation we get and o the information we want to hear. there's a word that didn't come up and it's abortion. they came to this. character is not important. that was convenient to believe when they n wanted to support donald trump. why did they want to support him, one reason, he was promising he would be a foe of abortion and promising certain kind of supreme court justice and hillary wasn't going to give it to them suddenly character didn't matter because donald trump who didn't have any character they voted for. >> interesting. many voters in alabama rejecting roy moore and the president saying he denies it is
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that a larger strategy when it comes to muddying the water so people don't know what to believe. >> no question we seen it since 2015 when donald trump launched his campaign that's a core piece of the strategy, a core piece of the strategy by the way also is under mining the non-partisan press. they make it, trump and his allies make it so the base the conservative base and the republican party not only believe that news outlets are bias but that they are outright fabric ating things be part of "global conspiracy to disenfranchise them or under mine them and when people believe that it becomes easy for reality to become relative. reality is no longer an objective thing. it can be shaped in whatever way is convenient to you. >> that is doing the ultimate disservice. i mean seriously. it is the worst --
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>> i think it's sort of using your worst instinki instincts for a singular and selfish purpose for your own benefit and g. own good. >> your own exhaufltation and dietfiction. there can be no common ground if you done away with objective truth which is what donald trump is trying to do. when you see 70% republicans in alabama disbelieving the post on roy moore when you see republican senators going after the committee on taxation because they don't like it what it concluded theecough it is nonpartisan and they previously praised it. see trump tactics since the day he stepped on the campaign trail. he is trying to delegitimize institutions to the w. point he
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can dictate his own truth where no one is trust worthy other than donald trump. >> if you can do that you have no core. the people who said listen there isn't a tax break big enough for me to put up with someone who said he can grab my daughter by the genitals. one has to respect that because money is one thing but teaching your child that is a certain way and respects certain boundaries that's another thing you can't put a price on. maybe you want a tax break. maybe you want to buy something for your family. maybe you get fewer christmas presents. or you have to spend extra for something else rather than compromising morals, it's over money. disgusting. >> you have to have a moral compass. >> hang on the most disgusting thing i hear from people that grosses me out and pushes me away when people, politician
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left or right says, just give me my money. that is the vialest thing you can say to me. if you don't want me to speak to you again say something like that to me. >> what we need in all leaders ideally in a president is someone who exhorts tuesday move beyond self interest. there's way too much of that. we instead have a president the epitome of it. using the presidency to em bold his brand and enrich his family further and they're doing just fine. that's where we are. >> you talk about the aftermath of the "access hollywood" tape we saw what you wrote this --
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so we were told about this reporting is 100% false. what's your response? >> he's free to de nie it. i'm very comfortable with my sources. the kind of quizical thing ryan previous is said i never reached out for him for comment which is false i left two meje-mails and called miss office i don't know why he is saying that. the reality is, it's amazing how many time wez revisit the "access hollywood" tape it was a turning point in our politics, one of tremendous political
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upheaval, rep republicans calling donald trump to drop out. pence made clear to the rnc that he was ready to take trump's place as the nominee and i report that ryan said that pence and rice were ready to step in as the new fiticket. that obviously didn't happen. it's remarkable to think trump was able to push past that and four weeks later to be president that says a lot about where we are as a country. >> love that you are here. we'll be back with one of the 13 women accusing him with sexual you'll misconduct now a judge will decide if donald trump can be disposed in a lawson.
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president trump facing the possibility that he could bedeposed in a defamiliaratiati claims of assault and unwanting kissing twice during a lunch meeting in his office and separately in beverley hills she
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alleges he kissed her aggressive ily and at the time he denied the obligations. you are new york state supreme court today with your client who filed this lawsuit against the president what's the basis of the suit, gloria? >> the basis of the suit is we allege president trump when he was candidate trump called her a liar. after the hollywood tapes were broadcast we heard what donald trump said on the billy bus tapes he alleged he could grab a woman by her genitals, he could kiss her because after all he was a star he then denied in the anderson cooper debate with hillary clinton that in fact he
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had actually ever done what we heard him say on the tapes. he said it was locker room talk. after that summer came forward as did other women and ledged he had commit the sexual misconduct against her. he then took to twitter and also campaign rallies and other places, said all of the women were liars and what they said were fabrications and he would sue them after the election. we called him to retract, he didn't. so we filed this defamation case against him right here in the supreme court. >> he or his sur gates have denightd denied all of the allegations. calling them liars. so what is she and you hoping to achieve. >> her reputation matterser. truth matters, accountability matters, so we're pursuing this
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lawsuit for her because she has in fact been harmed. she's been harmed by threats, by loss of some of her business, emotionally she has been harmed, but again her reputation matters. so we were in court today, president trump through his lawyers argued that he cannot be sued that he is president of the united states that he has immunity he can't be sued in state court we argued jones v clinton and president clinton said he was immune and the united states supreme court said no man is above the law including the president of the united states. we allege if we can prove the tort was an act he committed prior to becoming president and he can be sued for that.
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>> so you potentially would have the opportunity to depose the president of the united states. >> yes if we're permitted to proceed with the lawsuit. >> what would you want the to know from him and is anything from his past off limit to you. >> we'd be entitled to engage in discovery. deposition would be part of that in any normal lawsuit. i would like to say one of the arguments president trump's lawyers made today he is seat e essentially too busy but we're willing to accommodate for him, if we needed to take his deposition we'll be happy to take it at mara lago between his rounds of golf because we want to accommodate his schedule. >> state court as you say does not have jurisdiction over the president of the united states saying if you are to pursue this should be done when he is done serves as president of the united states. what's your reaction?
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>> of course president trump indicated he expects to be president for seven more years. so that would mean if in fact his argument where are to prevail our case would be stayed for at least seven years. of course that is something that is the burden of the defendant president trump to prove why there should be a stay. of course in that time evidence could be lost. memories could fade. we any that could prejudice our client we shouldn't think it 140u8d be stayed at all >> how long will it take. what happens next do we know when the judge could make a decision? >> i thought the judge was very, very thought. was extremely well prepared. obviously read the motion to dismiss by donald trump and our reply and the cases which there were many. she had many, many questions for both side. she did indicate she will e-file
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her decision. she did not indicate when she would file her decision. but i think it's going to be a very thoughtful one. and we're looking forward to that. we're hopeful that we would be permitted to proceed to litigate our lawsuit and protect our client and her rights. >> as we know recently from reporting last couple years and even before that this is a president involved in litigation he seems to thrive on litigation, what do you think will differentiate this lawsuit from the others in the past some may still be open as well. >> i understand there were 75 lawsuits this is the only one, don, on behalf of one of the women who alleged that in fact then-candidate-trump had committed acts of sexual misconduct against her. we think this is a very important lawsuit. we think that a woman's word matters. that it's of value.
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and that she has as much rights as anyone else in the us and we're there to vindicate those rights. >> gloria thank you always a pleasure. >> come back in a moment talk with paula joness lawyer. run, jthe power of in to tempur-pedic sleep with our 90-day trial and being the highest ranked mattress in customer satisfaction by jd power, it's easy to love.
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a justice new york hearing arguments whether a allred defar n . >> you heard from gloria allred
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does summer z have a case. >> certainly if she's telling the truth she's got a case. she's been called a liar but if and now she's file aid lawsuit to vindicate her reputation she's done the right thing and she believes she's telling the truth that's left to be determined by a jury as to which side was actually telling the truth, is it mr. trump who says she's a liar this never happened it's politically motivated or s did this sexual misconduct actually take place. >> will the judge let it go forward he still has to decide. >> i think there is an argument left open by the supreme court decision in the paula jones case that i handled that the supreme court did say that the issue of whether or not there would be immunity if this case were
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brought in state court is left for another day. i don't know why it wasn't brought to federal court to eliminate that risk that trump may have immunity never the ll less it's in state court. if you read the paula jones decision as a whole, the court was concerned with the interference of the judiciary on the operation of the president and the court found a sensitive judiciary court or judge acting in its discretion to protect the interest of the president in conducting official conduct can do justice and allow the case to proceed and give both sides opportunity to hear their case in court. >> so leer's so president trump attorney has argued that president trump is immune from state court action and his speech was political does this have my merit?
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>> well look there is an argument that the state court judge can't enforce something against a federal officer and he clearly is a federal officer. if i go to court in a criminal case and want to subpoena in an fbi agent in a state-court action i have do go through a perfects process to get the department of the justice to comply and they don't have to comply. i am right now trying to get a state court honored by the feds and routinely don't have to comply. so they got an argument there. the argument about the immunity while he was in office was clearly settled 8-0 in the jones-clinton case but i'm not so sure right now because at the time part of the rationale if you read that case it's not going to take up much of his time and we all saw what happened with pleasaresident cl.
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so i'm not sure the supreme court will say that was then this is now. but they clearly have a good argument here. i'm not so sure a supreme court judge is going to want the to get into a significansituation order him or the capabilities to go forward that they have no way to enforce it. not like a federal marshall will go get him. if he doesn't show up for deposition what is a state court judge going to do to enforce that order. >> i think the state court judge does have the ability to have authority over people appropriately litigants before him or her. you have a president that is not being sued in his official capacity. he was a private citizen who committed a wrong. so the state court would
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arguably have jurisdiction over mr. trump. with respect to state court ruling it was 9-0 don't leave out the extra justice there we won 9 h-0. and matter of fact said a careful judiciary can oversee a lawsuit. >> right. >> and we know a president like anybody else has time. >> the fact remains that that case has been criticized by legal scholars ever since and as you well know cases are reversed all the time depending on the composition. >> i don't know what court you're talking about. >> with the supremacy clause it's a real problem. you can say state court judges can sue, he is a federal officer, they have no way of enforcing it. that's what is called the supremacy as clause so how is a
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state court judge going to enforce this. >> i know, you know, it's funny, but i a little bit gated the case and i don't remember anybody criticalizing it. >> and i litigated in front of that same judge when i was in arkansas and i joined -- >> use me a second. >> -- i don't know why they hadn't gone federally. suzanne webber wright had authority over bill clinton. this judge does not have federal authority. this is a state supreme court or trial court judge. there's no enforcement mechanism. >> i understand what you're saying, but saying it three times doesn't make it any more true. so i think the fact -- [ overlapping speakers ] -- >> you saying you litigated the case doesn't make it true. >> fact of the matter you say was criticized i never heard that only person who criticized it was president clinton because now he had to face justice, put
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under oath and testify. >> you know what we need to here, we need a judge. i'm going to step in and be a judge and say it's done. that's the gavel, thank you guys. when we come back the man who declared open war. my question is the g.o.p. becoming the party of bannon. e? that's good. lica misses you. i'm over it though. (laughter) that's fine. i miss her more than you anyway. ♪ ♪ hey, my window is closing. yeah that's okay. alright miles. i love you. (phone hangs up) ♪ ♪ yeah i love you too. ♪ ♪
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steve bannon, donald trump's former top aide, headlining a rally in alabama for roy moore braising the candidate but taking opportunity to slap g.o.p. leaders. >> jeff flake, did he sign a check today $100 to jones, what, put country ahead of party? come on, brother, if you are
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going to write a check, write a check. mitch likes to be called leader mcconnell in washington they all call him leader. all of the consultants and all of the, you know, lobbyists, are you kidding me? judge moore served his country in one of the toughest wars we've ever had, vietnam. mitt, that's honor and integrity, and by the way mitt, why we're on the subject of vietnam and mhonor and integrit, you avoided service brother. >> want to the bring in our commentators and analysis. them's fight worgds right in. i feel like considering that sound byte, kevin i got to go to you y is that? >> well i think it is a pretty odius attack given steve bannon referenced mitt romney's
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religion, i was governor romney's spokesman in 2008 and 2012 campaigns. i think it is emblem attic of the fact that i think civil war is too strong of a word for the part yi but there's certainly a split if this wasn't a split in the republican party a generic republican would win that race by a democrat by 20 points and instead by all accounts down there it's neck in neck. we do have a nationalist, pop u lift base that steve bannon recognizes and understands and stokes in order to drive some level of definitely de vicive chbs deviceness and the question is whether that serves the long-term goals of the party. because all of the attacks on mitch mcconnell he and donald
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trump need a strong working relationship if they achieve tax reform or judiciary it feels like a short-term game for a lot of the foder for steve bannon but there's a long-term loss for the party overall. >> it's like the proxy for the president, because steve bannon has takesen aim at mitch mcconnell as well and romney continues to be a proxy war between bannon and the establishment. >> sure that was the game he played throughout the general election was draining the swam doing away with washington and business as usually and it was very successful. it's another powerful tactic that bannon has been able to use for president trump and he's using it successfully with moore is putting the power back in the people's hand and he said several times tonight don't let washington tell you how to vote. don't let them take your vote
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away. don't let fake news. don't let the republican establishment tell you how to vote. this is your vote you should do this how you see fit. the successful thing with that he managed to make tuesdit us at them and not allegations of sexual harassment and key for roy moore given he's doing well in the polls. but to kevin's point long-term impact of the party, the fact we're supporting bannon and the president and someone and rnc supporting someone with these allegations is harmful did ask important put chashlgtracter ab and this is a long-term black cloud over the party. >> it's not just steve bannon endorsing moore the president and his endorsement in the last 24 hours has given republican national committee and other republicans cover to follow
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suit. so hatch says president trump didn't have any choice because moore is the only republican you can possibly get down there at this time. what does this say about the g.o.p.? >> well, look, it's a sorry state right now. and i think that this is a a sur gat battle right now between romney and moore roy moore burr real but really about donald trump and the direction he and the republican conservative month, it's a real danger you're rebranding the party of abraham lincoln. >> are you surprised the rnc is not embracing more. >> no i think the rnc is a political operation and it's perfectly natural that they would be essentially the arm of the republican president. so i think what they're doing is
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calculating maybe political but it's not surprising they are derogatory what the republican president wants them to do. >> do you think this is an extraordinary circumstance? >> i do. but i'm still not surprised. to me the mistake was made when the republican party nominated donald trump. what we're seeing happen right now is pretty much an exerable response to that decision that was made over a year ago. >> kevin, public rights -- the g.o.p. is a broken party, adding that trump is the largest and most obnoxious symbol of that and moore shows this is not about individuala. m -- that's a quote not my words. how can republicans turn this around? is that even possible? do you agree with that/had. >> it's a very tough assessment, and it's one many republicans are going through the process of
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discussing. i was at an event years ago and a question was who represents the heart and soul of the party. the answer i think most telling was parties don't have hearts and souls. parties are organizations and fundame fundamentally organizations around ideas and what has happened we are talking about roy moore versus steve bannon and mitt romney, we're talking about individuals, sort of -- personalities. i think the party should flourish again when it is organized around defense of principles and ideas that have an impact on voters. the longer we start arguing this or litigating this through the cult of personalities that's what happens when you have a reality tv president who is head of the party we end up with debate that's are vaccous and lacking substance. it is about personalities.
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it has to get back to about ideas and issues. >> i'm so sorry i have no more time. thank you very much. when we come back my next guest called republican tax plan to democrats another warning it looks like the policies that led to the great depregs. to the great depression. breaking it down next. ♪ ♪ohhhhhh, ou! guess what i just got? uh! ♪i used to be spellbound hello again. ♪i used to be spellbound hi. ♪i used to be spellbound that's a big phone. ♪in your arms. [screams] ah, my phone. ♪you built the flame ♪that warms my heart, ♪but lying and cheating
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new polls showing americans do not like the gop tax plan that's making its way through congress at lightening speed. only 29% approve. but is a plan designed to penallize democrats in blue states across the country? let's discuss now. a senior economic advisor to the trump campaign and historic -- let's discuss gentlemen. steve, you first. you were quoted in a bloomberg article describing the republican tax plan as death to democrats. why make policy this way, and is this political pay back? >> well, just one thing on the polling. you're right that the poll does
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show a majority of people don't favor the republican bill, but it's also true. you know, one of the most important polling results is by over a 2-1 majority americans think a tax cut would be good for thechy. i happen to agree with that. i think when they get this republican bill passed -- >> a tax cut or this one? >> this one will pass. >> no, no. a cut is good for the economy or this tax cut because you said a. >> no, will a tax cut be good for the economy is the question. i think the reason people are reacting negatively to this because a lot of americans are just against anything trump is for. but to your question, don, about blue states being impacted, it is true. there's no question about it. by getting rid of the local and state tax deduction people in new york, california, illinois,
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in new jersey, connecticut, will be relatively negatively affected by that because their taxes are much, much higher than states like texas and florida. and the other point i was making -- >> are you okay with that? are you saying this is good because -- >> by the way, the reason i'm for that, don, is because i don't think it's fair for people in red states to pay for higher taxes, to pay for bloated services than in blue states. california and newark, they have twice as much government services in terms of the cost of services than a state like new hampshire. so why should new hampshire people pay higher taxes to pay for services in new york and california. especially when their services are much better than those in new hampshire? >> you want to respond to that, and then i'll talk about what you said in the "the washington post." go on. >> we'll get throughout the comparison, but this idea that people in new york and california are somehow getting
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benefits illegitimately is just ridiculous. those states that have it high taxes, one of the reasons they have to pay for services, is they send more revenue to washington than they get back. they are supporting the rest of the country with those. but beyond that, i mean this whole idea of attacking democrats and not just through doing the removal of the deductibility of the state and local taxes, but also they're taking out things like universities and their endowments, taxing the grants that are given to grandwit students. these are people i guess they don't like. i don't think tax policy should be made on that basis. but i hope in a moment we'll get to talk more about -- >> let me talk about this. yeah, let's talk about what you write. you wrote this piece for "the washington post." you're issuing a warning about the bill, and you write in 1932
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in the depths of the great depression franken roosevelt called for bold persis tpt experimentation. the contrasting method and if it fails try it again and again and again. talk to us about. >> at least for over a century, he said there are two contrasting views of how government and the economy should work. one is that you should make the people at the top richer and richer, and their prosperity will leak through on those below. brian said correctly the democrat idea is the other way around. and all those dependent on those will rise with them. and that's been the distinction
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ever since. he was talking about leaking throa. that's the sort of this term we now use of trickle down economics. which we've had a couple of trump advisers come out and say recently yes, i believe in trickle down economics. well, trickle down economics has never worked. and in the 1920s, is a perfect example of that. the idea in the 1920s is the least government you can possibly have, the least regulation you can have, massive tax cuts. there were three different tax cuts in the 1920s. republicans were in charge of the government entirely during that decade as they are at the moment, and they were able to do whatever they wanted. and what they want was mainly being pushed by the secretary of the treasury. andrew melon was one of the richest people in the world and -- >> i've got to get steven. robert -- robert, stop.
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>> said at the time this bill would get more tax benefits to mr. melon himself and -- >> robert, i've got to go. maybe he can't hear us. all right, guys. that's it for us tonight. bye. work keeps me busy. so i've asked chase sapphire reserve cardmembers to find my next vacation. rome, show me something. i'm having breakfast at the pantheon. what an amazing view... of your finger. ♪ ♪ look at this view. your finger! isn't that incredible. your finger! and check this one out!
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witness katy perry and left shark. or a card shark. grandma? witness katy perry work. witness katy perry firework. witness katy perry swish. witness katy perry... aaaaaaw look at that dog! katy perry: with music videos and behind the scenes footage, xfinity lets you witness all things me. good evening. you're looking at a live picture of a campaign rally in fair hope, alabama, where roy moore is expected to speak tonight with the election exactly one week away. it's where we begin our broadcast, keeping 'em honest, with an evolving message from the white house that's ended with an unmitigated endorsement by the president for a man accused of sexual misconduct with teenagers, including initiating sexual conduct with a 14-year-old girl, sexually assaulting a 16-year-old, and pursuing relationshi

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