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tv   CNN Tonight With Don Lemon  CNN  February 19, 2018 7:00pm-8:00pm PST

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chewy bites. mmmmm...amazing. i have heartburn. ultra strength from alka seltzer. enjoy the relief. when you live your life as an olympic downhill skier... can't let spills slow you down. that's why i use bounty, the quicker picker upper. bounty picks up spills quicker... ...and is two times more absorbent. bounty, the quicker picker upper. that's it for us. thank you for watching. time to hand it over to don lemon. "cnn tonight" starts right now. >> this is "cnn tonight." we have breaking news and it's a cnn exclusive. special counsel robert mueller asking about the president's son-in-law, and it's not just about his russian contacts. while he was working for the president, he was also trying to get financing for his company from foreign investors,
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including the chinese. they've been asking about conversations with those investors. plus we're going to cover the parkland school shooting for you. five days. that's how long it's been since the shooter opened fire at marjory stoneham douglas high school, a gun he never shufd ou have had in the first place. teachers and students were shot in cold blood in a school where they should have been safe. parents a parents, teachers and students are demanding something needs to be done. innocent americans will keep dying until we have the courage to put their lives ahead of politics. if you want to see what courage looks like, i want you to see the students from stoneham douglas high school and list ton their message for the president. >> if donald trump wants to
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listen to us, he should have taken the first invitation. we are not going to come to him, he needs to come to us. >> more on that in a few minutes as well, but i want to begin with our cnn exclusive in the mueller investigation. jeff zeleny is live for us at the white house. also joining us is shimon procupecz with who broke the story. >> we know special counsel robert mueller has been asking the last few months about jared kushner's business dealings prior to the investigation. mueller is asking about discussions kushner had with potential chinese and qatari investors. this is the first time the special counsel is asking about relationships he had with russia. there are questions about 666 fifth avenue, which the kushner
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company owns, and there are financial issues. the building is in debt by $5 million. we're told that the special counsel hasn't asked kushner companies for information. he also has not asked for any interviews with any of the executives from the kushner company, and a special counsel spokesperson declined to comment for the story, but we did get a statement from jared kushner's attorney earlier this evening in response to our story, and he basically said, quote -- this is from abby lowell, the attorney -- the story was based on another anonymous source with questionable motives now contradicts the facts. in all of mr. kushner's extensive cooperation with all inquiries, there has not been a single question asked nor document sought on the 666 building on kushner company deals. nor would there be any reason to question those regular business
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transactions. we have questions despite what the attorneys think, and there will be no other reason to ask these questions. >> do you know what the details are of these meetings? >> from what we know, basically, is this has to do with some finances and a meeting kushner had with chinese investigators -- chinese investors, i should say, just a week after the election. and also according to the "new york times," kushner met with this insurance company out of china that also plans to own the waldorf-astoria in new york. they were close to getting the company to invest in the 666 fifth avenue company. there was also a potential deal with qataris also invest ing in the company and that also fell through. some of this happened during transition, so mueller would likely want to know what the hell was going on here, what
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kind of conversations were they having here. >> let's talk more about mueller, what is he seeking to figure out by asking these questions? >> what we believe is we don't think that kushner is a target of this investigation or perhaps, you know, is the target or is someone who is centered around. this could be more of mueller trying to explore what was happening here and what was happening during the transition. investigators could be looking into whether kushner was mixing his personal business with his work. he was coming into an administration, and officials could be questioning that, could be questioning whether or not there was any kind of quid pro quo, were there any promises made. it's really not clear to us and certainly the people we've talked to why they would be asking these questions. >> to jeff zeleny. jeff, you're at the white house. is the white house saying anything about mueller's growing interest in kushner? >> don, the white house has not said anything specifically about this story tonight.
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there was of course the statement that shimon was reading from jared kushner's lawyer, but the white house is sort of looefeaving it at that. which is sort of standard practice when there is a family member involved. yes, he's the senior adviser to the president but he's also a son-in-law to the president. it's uneasy, it's, i guess, awkward to say the least here, but every new chapter of this mueller investigation that involves a family member, it does make some people here apprehensive in terms of what the next shoe is. but officially, don, the white house not saying anything about this story. >> so, jeff, the president back in washington after throwing a late night twitter tantrum on saturday in mar-a-lago. he even linked the russia investigation to the shooting in florida and told the tweets are still coming. he tweeted, obama was president up to and beyond the 2016 election, so why didn't he do something is about the russian meddling? what's this latest outburst all about? >> don, you saw the tweets there
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on the screen. they barely fit on the screen. 21 tweets in all from palm beach. he has just returned here in the last few hours or so here. the reality is the president was stewing over the weekend. he was sitting at his mar-a-lago resort unable to play golf because of the optics of that. of course, the shooting in park dgs lan land, florida just 40 minutes south of mar-a-lago. so he was watching a lot of cable television and was tweeting a lot saturday evening into sunday. white house advisers did not know these were coming. they see these in realtime the way everyone else sees them, but it's clear despite the fact there are two major challenges going on, one, the tampering of a u.s. election, and two, another school shooting, the president again managed to turn this back to himself, asking questions about himself through all of these. but don, it's interesting that he is blaming president obama
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for not doing anything, but in the course of these tweets he has acknowledged more than he ever has before over the last year-plus that there was russian meddling. what's striking is the commander in chief is not saying what the u.s. should do to prevent this going forward. that's been absent from all of these. >> it's interesting. as you said, if we could put the tweets back up. as you so aptly pointed out, who does this? barely put that up on the screen, jeff, you said that. but right on, nothing about what are we going to do about any of it to make it better. thank you so much. appreciate both of you. thank you, shimon, thank you, jeff. now toii want to bring in senio white house counsel. put the tweets back up again. he tweeted about all of this stuff, right, just blaming everybody except for vladimir putin and the russians. john, when you look at that, what in the world is going on?
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>> it's unlike any president we've ever had. first of all, no one has ever had a twitter account before, but just in general, his reaction where he tends to personalize everything into his own point of view and world view that relates only to donald trump and how it affects him. it's really quite surprising where all of the intelligence agencies have alerted that this is ongoing activity, and yet the president is silent. it's quite stunning, don. >> it is, and in history it's going to be interesting to watch all of this, because this is going to be archived and i wonder how people will look back in history at all these tweets. do you want to say something, jack? i see you nodding. >> i'm just agreeing with john. it's beyond belief how the president remains silent. we talk about what russia did here, but there is too little attention given to the fact that
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this attack on our very democracy not only happened but is ongoing. and yet the president is not standing up. america has been spanked by vladimir putin, and nothing is happening. there is nothing done in retaliation. there is no warning that it needs to stop. it's a very sad and embarrassing moment for our country. >> it's all about him. everything is about him. he always brings it back to him. john, when you were -- when you hear, i should say, that mueller's team is asking questions about jared kushner's conversations during the transition about securing financing for his properties from chinese and qatari investors, what stands out to you? does this raise quid pro quo concerns to you? >> certainly the whole operation of the trump family running the government has raised serious conflict of interest questions. the president, from his point of view, he's not subject to any of
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this. he doesn't accept any of the prior norms that past presidents imposed on themselves in many instances. and, for example, nixon was a realistic l realist stickler on impact. it's just out there, you cannot ignore it at this point. >> jack, there is a lot we don't know, but is there any distinction -- i have to ask, is there any distinction if jared kushner did this as part of the transition versus after the inauguration? >> i think, as a practical matter, there's not. the law may not precisely apply to the transition. however, and let me emphasize this, the trump transition operated pursuant to an agreement with the obama administration that included
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detailed conflict of interest rules. although i have not researched this, it's entirely conceivable that a prosecutor could look at that agreement and deem the commitments made by the trump transition to have essentially bound it to the conflict of interest rules that would apply to a government employee which, of course, make it abundantly clear that no one should seek to profit from business with somebody doing business with the government. mr. kushner is in an unusual position. he not only holds a senior office in the government, but he has access to virtually all of the government secrets by virtue of his being the president's son-in-law. >> john, you know, what this also shows, i would say, is that this investigation goes far beyond questions of collusion. mueller is also looking at financial ties, obstruction of justice. his investigation is wide ranging. >> it's very wide ranging, and
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that's in his charter. when he was granted authority, it not only included the russia issue but anything that came up in the course of his investigation. and i think these are the things that are coming up just in the natural course of an investigation, and he has every right to follow them. he is within his charter when looking at these issues. >> president trump said the mueller investigation, if it turns, they'll be looking at that. i want to know precisely what they're looking at in terms of jared kushner's dealings. it may implicate kushner's precise dealings.
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mr. mueller's charter was told to investigate any possible connection between the russia government and the trump campaign and any wrongdoing he discovered that might investigation. lastly, he has the power to pursue any obstructions of justice. >> john, it's interesting, we were talking about what happened to jared kushner. remember the big story that happened last week was the rob porter story. you know, the white house chief of staff john kelly sent a memo announcing a change to the security clearance process in the wake of that story, of that scandal. as the washington works this out, jared kushner has interim clearance now. should jared kushner be interacting with classified material, including the daily presidential brief? >> well, that's really an option
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of the president himself. he can waive the restrictions. the power of classification emanates right from the president himself. it's not a congressional grant of power, but rather an inherent presidential power. he could theoretically waive a waiver, he could declassify. there is a little ex. >> interesting. cnn reported last week. and now the l.a. times is reporting that he's planning to plead guilty against his former boss how much pressure does this
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put on him? >> manafort may be the oyster that holds the precious gem of truth -- >> the pearl there. >> -- yeah, the pearl there. that anybody else we don't know for sure. this has got to be bad news for the floor. when we come back, he was talking to foreign investors from this company. plus, you've seen this picture. it may be the worst picture of
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cnn has lenders tharned thal counsel robert mueller is asking questions about jared kushner's business dealings during the transition. the president of the senate conservative fund joins us, also the officer who ran for president as an independent in 2016. gentlemen, thank you very much. let's get started. evan, you first. as a former cia agent, what is
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your take on what's happening? robert mueller is investigating foreign contacts, including china. >> that's an ethical question, so that's of interest, that's important. what's more important is whether foreign countries could have been using that opportunity to help jared kushner in his business dealings in a way that could be used as leverage over him down the road. that's the more significant issue even than the ethics, although their both ethical questions because the latter becomes a national security issue. so i imagine thaet pat's part ot the special counsel might be interested in. >> let's talk about the indictment on friday. why do you say it exonerates the president and his campaign?
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>> because mueller would not have come out and said they have what are called unwitting officials with the trump campaign. if they did that, which they've done now, and came back later with a future indictment suggesting that there was something along the lines of collusion, it would be the most extraordinary head fake -- we're getting close to march madness so i use basketball terms -- it would be the most extraordinary head fake in the history of special counsels. and look, the confidence that america has in robert mueller comes from the professionalism in which he carries forward his very difficult role. and that would shake the confidence of the american people in his conclusions and his results. he doesn't want that, it isn't good for america. i think that what we saw there friday is effectively not an admission, because that's not an appropriate word, but a concession on the part of the special counsel that there was no intentional working with the
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russian bs by the trump team. >> he said in that particular indictment that involved the 13 russians, he didn't say in the entire investigation. >> that's why i said that looking ahead to any future indictments that putting this indictment out now -- and there was no time pressure on him to do this. he did it now for his own reasons, but if it was going to point in one direction and then ef he was going to go in another direction, because they have a lot of information. it just wouldn't happen. >> evan, you disagree. explain why you think friday's indictment means the president doesn't want to stop the interference of russian nz os i elections. >> the indictment was on 13 russians and it's important because it describes that a crime was committed. it also describes those 13 russians were involved with the americans unwittingly, but says
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nothing about what other issues may be out there. the public knows other things about the president's campaign, about their contact with russian officials, but this indictment doesn't address any of that. we know that our intelligence services collected other information about senior russian government officials talking about helping trump. and this indictment doesn't address any of that. it was a very narrow, although very detailed, indictment, but it's very narrow in scope. >> don, that reinforces my point. i don't disagree that it was a targeted indictment. of course, it was pretty broad in the sense there were 16 entiti entities, 13 people, three businesses and a lot of detail that we learned in that indictment. but my point is a special counsel in the position of robert mueller and every special counsel is in rather touchy political sort of oversight. they're under a microscope type
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circumstances just like special counsel mueller is, and yet with all the information they know beyond this indictment, if there was going to be actual collusion, first of all, he would have a hint of it already and they wouldn't have led us all to see an indictment where they say that all the cooperation that happened was unwitting. >> collusion is not a legal term, so it wouldn't be for collusion, it would be for obstruction, it would be for something else, for money laundering. >> but all of those don't involve cooperating with the russians to affect the election. that's misbehavior in the course of the investigation. >> the president spent a good deal of the holiday weekend tweeting 21 tweets in total here. there's just two of them. he takes aim at the fbi, the former president barack obama but not the russians. is this productive, evan? >> no, it's not productive at all. of course, this is the most absu absurd, inexcusable behavior
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that you could possibly imagine from an american president. russia has attacked our democra democracy. our intelligence services warned us about this months and months ago, and now the special counsel's office has laid it down in excruciating detail. still we have a president that refuses to offer obvious criticisms of vladimir putin, refuses to take steps that would deter the russians from continuing their ongoing attack against our democracy. it's absolutely bizarre. and i think for a long time we have sort of given the president an undeserved, i think, past to a degree saying, the allegations of russian interference just hurt his feelings and made him feel like he didn't win fairly and that sort of thing. i think we're being very naive when we make that argument. this president has some sort of conflict that keeps him from behaving in a responsible way,
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living up to his commitment to defend the country. there is something there impeding that. in some way the kremlin owns him and/or he welcomes the support of the kremlin as he did during the 2016 election. >> ken, i got to ask you, this is -- republican chuck grassley tweeted this today. the next time president trump that you talk to putin tell him to butt out of our elections quit the cyber warfare interference in our democracy. why is he not pushing hard against russia? >> i agree with senator grassley. i think that statement is more than appropriate and the use of twitter in this discussion was no help by the president this weekend. i would like to see more directed action. i hope as the dust settles on last friday's indictment, we start to see that going forward as facts start to be laid out for the american people, which includes, by the way, congressmen and senators who don't necessarily have access to all of this.
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it starts to give us a national direction and i hope the president will pick up that kudgel and start using it in that direction. >> thank you very much. i appreciate it. when we come back, the president asking his guests at mar-a-lago advice about gun control. shouldn't he have advisers about this sort of thing? david axelrod joins me next. -i've seen lots of homes helping new customers bundle and save big,
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sorurces telling cnn that te president spent the weekend inside his mar-a-lago resort boiling into a rage while watching the news with his son donald trump jr. he tweeted over 20 times. more than a dozen of those tweets slamming the news media. and three of them the president claimed no collusion with russia during the 2016 election. he attacked oprah winfrey, congressman adam schiff, hillary clinton and former president obama. he undercut his own national security adviser, and he
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promoted a nascar race. none of the tweets included a combination of russia. joining me now, david axelrod. sometimes i read this and i can't believe i'm actually -- when you put it up on the screen plain enough for people to see, what is happening? >> that's quite a weekend's work there, isn't it? >> it is. >> you know, this is not -- you learn to come to expect certain things, and he's very reactive to events around the russia investigation. so, for example, after michael flynn was indicted a couple days later, the storm welled up and then he talked about the fbi being in tatters. this has been true throughout. this is something that really sets him off. and, you know, after the holiday break, his lawyers right before the holidays met with mueller,
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and the first thing after the holidays we had 17 tweets, i think, in the first day that were nothing short of bizarre. so this is a pattern that's developed over time. it didn't shock me. it would have been shocking, frankly, if he was quiet over the weekend given the magnitude of the indictments on friday. >> it's really interesting because i remember, you know, when my sister was raising her kids and someone did something like this, you would say they just want attention, ignore them. meaning a child. and it seems reminiscent of that. it's hard to ignore the president of the united states even when he does childless things like this. obviously cries for attention and deflection, a combination of both, possibly. >> i mean, he certainly likes attention. i think we all can agree on that. but i think he also sets these things off as diversions from the main question at hand. the really disturbing thing has been commented on already
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tonight on your show is that what those indictments unfurled for all the world to see was a very elaborate plot to subvert this country. you're the commander in chief and it's your job to respond to that attack and there was no hint of that in his tweets. so it was disturbing. and then to use this terrible tragedy just 40 miles away from mar-a-lago and use that to try and deflect blame on the fbi and to try and discredit the fbi who -- >> he also tried to blame the former president saying the former president should have done -- and he said, this started in 2014 halfway through president obama's second term. should president obama have done more? >> i think if you knew then what
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you know now, perhaps so. i was thinking when i saw that tweet what exactly would donald trump have said if the president of the united states knew at that time and said the russians are actively involved in our campaign and they're trying to help donald trump defeat hillary clinton, what would donald trump have said? we know that mitch mcconnell basically told the administration that if you intimate that, we will react very strongly and negatively to it, because it would be tilting the scale in this election. but the reality is a lot of this information has come together after the election. the administration did, through the intelligence community, tell the country that russia had been involved in trying to hack our elections. but the degree of information that mueller had, yes, released on friday wasn't available at that time. so, you know, i don't take it terribly seriously. the question really isn't what
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barack obama should have done then, it's what donald trump should do now. else the president of the united states today. he is the man who now has this information, and for whatever reason, he doesn't want to act on it. >> just because obama officials and his aides have insisted that the president had a confrontation with vladimir putin in 2016, the g-20 summit in china. they're also saying he slapped sanctions on russia, 35 diplomats. also he said russia meddling would have political implications for the incoming president to do that. donald trump was already saying the election was rigged and he wouldn't accept the results if he lost. i want to discuss something current as well. the white house says the president is open to changes in gun background checks. sources tell cnn it was a topic
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of conversation with his son and close friends such as waldo rivera. as someone who has given advice to president trump, is it odd the stance he takes on policy? >> nothing that we see is consistent with anything that i know from the white house i served in, and i would suggest that if you talk to anybody who served in any other white house, they've never seen anything quite like this. there's been a merger of mar-a-lago as part of the official tableau of the government where he walks around and talks to people about stuff like this, and has high-level discussions in the dining room as patrons watch. it's a strange, strange thing. i will say this. if the patrons of mar-a-lago have persuaded the president of
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the united states to defy the nra from whom he took $30 million and change his position and begin to embrace some commonsense reforms, good for them. i'm all for it. >> we have to remember, though, the two sons of the trophy hunters that you've seen on the internet with him -- >> we need to separate out some of these issues. background checks is not gun n confiscation. i do think we have to ask the question about whether weapons of war would be made available especially to 18-year-old kids as was the case here. but there are modest reforms that have been proposed by senator cornyn and senator murphy that would tighten some of the reporting provisions around the background checks. that would be a helpful step. if the president endorses it, that would be positive. it's not nearly enough. and the question is whether there is this sense that they
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have to do something now because these children down in florida have been so compelling and this has so captured the imagination and the disgust of the country that you can't do nothing. so is the question if we do this, can we sort of lance the boil here and move on? i hope that doesn't happen. i hope there will be a serious discussion in the country about what we need to get done. and yes, let's do this, but let's examine some of these other issues. let's get back to the bump stock issue. let's talk about these semiautomatic weapons and let's talk about universal background checks. >> thank you, david axelrod. i appreciate your time. when we come back, new troubling information about the florida shooter as the family who took him in is speaking out. all the details next. it's inspected by mercedes-benz factory-trained technicians. or it isn't. it's backed by an unlimited mileage warranty,
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pg&i help customerss, how with their there's different rates to fit different needs, so listening is a huge part of my job. because customers want to know that you hear them. they have kids, they have families, they have priorities. i definitely understand that. i have three children, i was a stay at home mom, i didn't have money to pay the bills, and so i put myself in their shoes. and i'm going to do all that i can to lower their bills and to help their situation. to choose the rate plan that works best for your family, visit together, we're building a better california. the florida high school shooter in court today as two funerals took place today that he is accused of shooting. mark, good evening to you.
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they just released documents into a 2016 investigation of nikolas cruz. how did that become public and what was in it? >> reporter: it became public because a judge ruled that that should be released to the public. there has been a great deal of of debate, of course, since this whole tragedy about what has been the mental state of nikolas cruz. certainly his public defender and others have said he has a history of mental illness. that's sort of what these documents go at. they focus on a specific incident, and that's from september of 2016 in which nikolas cruz put up images of him cutting his arms. they actually went to his home. they talked to his mother, she was actually alive at the time, they talked to nikolas and they talked to mental health workers overseeing his care. it took a while to do the study, about one to two months. once they were done, though, dcf
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ruled that he was at low risk to do harm to either himself or to anyone else. and that was about 18 months, a little less than 18 months before the attack here. so it's looked upon as maybe another one of those flags that was just missed. >> the couple who took him in after his adoptive mother died, martin, talked to abc's "good morning america" about the last time they saw him. >> i wanted to go after him and strangle him more than anything. everything i wanted to say, i tried to reserve myself. i was like, really, nik? really? he mumbled something but i didn't hear and he said he was sorry. >> the sneads said they had no idea that cruz could be capable of something like this. what more can you tell us? >> this is a family that took this young man in after the death of his mother, and i'm talking about nikolas cruz in november. so they really are attempting to
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do something good. and they acknowledge that he was odd. he had his, you know, quirks, but they also felt that he was polite. they knew he was on medication. he was getting counseling. and they actually thought he was getting better. they say that there was nothing to give them the idea that he was going to carry out this terrible attack. now, it should be pointed out they knew he had guns, but they had rules, and those rules were that he had to keep those guns locked in a gun vault. they thought they had the only key, but that does not appear to be the case, don. >> martin savage, thank you very much. when we come back, our exclusive interview. two mothers embracing outside the marjory stoneham douglas high school right after the deadly shooting. their picture heart ts breaking. one of those measures will speak for the first time live, next. n, isn't it? uh huh! let it go! whoo!
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it is one of the most iconic images of the florida high school shooting. two mothers horrified at the violence that took the lives of 17 innocent people. one of those mothers is kathy rush. her two sons survived the shooting. she's speaking out for the first time and joins me exclusively
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tonight with her husband scott. thank you so much for joining us, we really appreciate it. kathy, you first. how does it feel being part of an iconic photo? i'm sure it's something you would rather not be part of. what do you remember about the moment this was taken, this photo? >> first of all, i just want to say i hate that photo with every core of my being. every time i look at that picture, i relive it. and -- do you want me to tell you what led up to? there's a little bit of a story behind that. >> go on, share what you want to share. >> okay. i was at work. i'm the school nurse at nova high school in davey, which is south of here. i got a robocall from my youngest son connor's middle school that they were on a lockdown. i hung up and i went back to work. it didn't bother me that my son's middle school was on a lockdown, it didn't bother me because it's been done before, they've been on lockdown before,
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and everything was fine. i'm so desensitized to the lockdowns that it don't both i me, and that bothers me now. my friend jody called me, did you hear what was happening? i said, yeah, the middle school's on lockdown, no biggie. no, no, it's the high school, kevin's going there right now with s.w.a.t. then it was serious. i opened my phone, it was everywhere, on the news, on facebook, everyone posting everywhere. i talked to scott. and he had spoken to our oldest son, adam, who apparently had evacuated to the middle school, which is right behind the high school here. and brandon,grader, was hiding under a table in his classroom. i went to the courtyard at school and i sat on a bench and started crying and crying and crying. one of the ladies came over to me and helped me up and hugged me. then they brought me inside the building to take me away from the students at that high school
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so they wouldn't see me crying. and it was on the monitor at the desk, what was on the news. they want, oh my god, kathy, go give us the keys to your clinic, go get your babies. i went to the parking lot. called my son. and my oldest son, i got ahold of him. and he was in the walmart parking lot. he made his way from the middle school to the walmart parking lot. and i said, stay there, i'm coming, it will be about 30 minutes, i'm that far away. i hung up with him but i hadn't heard back from my younger son, who was hiding under the table. and i still didn't think it was as bad as it was. then i got on the highway, coming home on the sawgrass express way. and i can't even tell you how many police cars were passing me. literally hordes and hordes of police vehicles and ambulances and s.w.a.t. vehicles. they kept coming and they kept coming and they kept coming. from everywhere. from every entrance onto the
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sawgrass. and i had no idea the magnitude. and i was crying more and more and hyperventilating. i called my mother, screaming into the phone -- >> can i ask you something, is it still -- i understand that it's very upsetting. i know it's something that most of us cannot imagine. has it settled in to you yet? does it still seem not real to you? >> oh, no, it seems very real. it seems very real. my friends buried their daughter yesterday, it's very real and it's horrible. and i got off the expressway at that exit at coral ridge drive. there was so many police and so many vehicles. they just kept coming. and i parked my car and spilled out of my car to the ground. and my friend michelle, that's the blond woman, picked me up and that's the picture. and i had no idea somebody snapped that picture in that moment. and i was literally screaming because i hadn't heard from my youngest son. and i thought it had only been a
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half hour. later i looked back, it was nearly an hour that i had not heard from my son. >> scott, your son was in class with jamie guttenberg. and i understand her funeral was yesterday. >> they're the same age, yes. >> same age. >> guttenberg. >> they had been in the same classes at least as far back as second grade so we knew the family. >> can you tell us about jamie? >> i would defer to kathy to tell you about jamie. i'd met her but not enough to speak about her. i can tell you what i heard yesterday at the funeral, which was amazing. a little girl who had her whole life planned out, knew what she wanted. i'm going to let kathy talk about jamie because she knew her a little better than me. >> i don't want to talk about that, i want to leave that that to her family, those are her family's words to say. >> fair enough. >> amazing young girl.
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>> fair enough. how is your son doing? >> so brandon, you can tell it's affected him. he's going on with himself, but he certainly seems affected. our older son doesn't seem as affected. but you never know. obviously we're keeping close eyes on him. our youngest who is in middle school seems fine, but again, this is very early. and how it's going to be going forward, we don't know. but for sure our middle soon, who is a freshman, who had classes in that very building normally, and if it had been the day before or the day after, he would have been in those classrooms, he just happened to have an elective that was on the other side of campus. had it been the day before or day after, we might be here telling you a different story. so that makes me shake just thinking about it. >> listen, we're glad that your sons are okay and we're sorry for the tragedy that has befallen your community. and the children, the students there, are so amazing. every single time i hear from
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one of them or see one of them on television, it's unbelievable to hear their strength and courage and how bright and articulate they are. what do you want to say about those students before i let you go? >> i want to say those students are going to roar. you're going to hear those kids roar. they are so angry and so upset and so devastated that their class rates and their friends, their teachers, were gunned down. they weren't even just gunned down, those kids were hunted in that school. that man that came in the school, he hunted children. and these kids at the school are going to roar. they're going to make some changes. you're going to hear from them more. changes need to be made. >> i just want to add that the parents, kathy, myself, the parents of the victims, other friends of ours, we're going to keep roaring as well. this is not going to go away. >> though. >> we need to be louder and have more stamina than the people who want this to go away. >> it's not going to go away. it's not okay that a 19-year-old can walk into a shop and plop down money and walk out with
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that gun and hunt children in a school. >> kathy and scott rush, thank you so much, we appreciate it. cnn is holding a live town hall wednesday night, "stand up." the students of stoneman douglas demand action. it will be hosted by jake tapper, wednesday night at 9:00 eastern. the students of stoneman douglas speak out to demand action and an end to the violence once and for all. "stand up" a live town hall wednesday evening, 9:00 eastern.
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