tv Smerconish CNN December 7, 2019 6:00am-7:00am PST
that's cyndi lauper. "money changes everything." i'm michael smerconish in philadelphia. unemployment fell to 3.5% matching september's 50-year low, but impeachment of president donald trump appears inevitable. so that leads to this week's survey question conish@smerconi. vote this hour. give you the results in a bit. on monday the house intelligence committee will make a presentation to the house judiciary committee sometime soon the judiciary committee will vote on articles of impeachment. the full house will then do likewise, and in all likelihood, donald trump will join andrew johnson and bill clinton as american presidents who have been impeached, but that's not the same as removal from office.
for that to occur, a senate trial must be held resulting in a two-thirds vote for conviction. mention the word "trial" and most americans probably think what they can view in their local county courthouse or nearest federal courtroom. it imsupplies a sameness with allowance for customs. standard layout, opposing lawyers, a judge establishing rules of evidence and based and statutory and common law and a jury following a prescribed burden of proof using wisdom to facts after a deliberative process behind closed doors. that's not necessarily where we're headed. the constitution says virtually nothing about the process saying the senate will conduct the trial with the chief justice presiding and a two-thirds vote necessary. there are written rules. fewer than ten pages. they are remarkably vague on substance and haven't seen much change since president johnson's
impeachment in 1868. so much remains to be worked out between senate majority leader mitch mcconnell and minority leader chuck schumer. the less they can agree on in advance, the more it will place manufacture sis on the role of chief justice john roberts. so what are some of the key trial issues that will need to be resolved? joining me now is hilary hurd, pursuing a j.d. at harvard law school receiving a masters degree at cambridge, kings college, undergraduate and uva and 2013 a marshall scholar. a contributor for law fair and co-authored this piece along with benjamin witis. thanks for being here. must there actually be a trial? >> good morning, michael. thank you so much for having me. yes. the senate rules presume a trial will occur. that said, it doesn't have to be a long trial with all the bells and whistles attached and with
just 51 votes, the senate to move to adjourn at any point in the process. >> these rules that already exist, you describe as weirdly detailed and then you note we're things turn substantive they also turn vague. explain. >> so the rules on the one hand provide a specific set of staged directions for about what different actors are supposed to say in the process. from the oath they're supposed to give to the way they're supposed to write their subpoenas. and also specific instructions about what time things are supposed to happen. sometimes 12. sometimes 1:30. sometimes 1:00. on a lot of the major questions despite the you radios granularity we don't have much guidance leaving a lot up to the senate and chief justice to decide. >> what rules are evidence apply? >> so the senate rules don't really provide us much guidance on evidentiary questions but
say, show, it's up to the chief justice in the first instance to rule on any evidentiary question but he doesn't have to. the chief justice if a question comes to him he thinks is maybe too political he could decide to punt that question to the whole senate body. and in another case, if he did decide to rule on an evidentiary question the senate could easily overrule the chief justice with just 51 votes if they wanted to. in that way it's very much the senate's show. >> in what circumstances -- by the way, this is great. i love you're able to run through each of these instances that are in my mind as an attorney wondering what the heck is about to unfold. what matters more? 51 votes in the circumstance you just described, or two-thirds, 67 votes, in other circumstances? >> right. well, it really depends on what you're after. democrats need 67 votes to remove the president from office. but they'll only need 51 votes to introduce new witnesses and potentially expand the house
record, which could create some electoral discomfort for republicans. that said, republicans also only need 51 votes to adjourn the whole thing at any point in time. >> hilary, you know there's a lot of discussion as to whether mick mulvaney will testify. whether rudy giuliani will testify. whether john bolton will testify. can witnesses be compelled to testify, like a standard trial? >> yes. the rules are prior toy explicit that the senate has the power to compel individuals to testify. and it has a sargent of arms authority to go get them if need be. that said, the question, do you have 51 votes to agree on who the witnesses ultimately are and i imagine republicans will have their own set of persons they would like to come to the senate trial as well. >> to your point. republicans say they'd like hunter biden to testify. is that a likelihood? >> i don't know if it's a likelihood. i know that's a comment that senator lindsey graham has made
before, and it does seem to me that there might be a strategy in essentially broadening the scope of the conversation to shift it away from the house record, but what will actually happen is anyone's guess at this point. >> okay. final issue. you know we have a number of presidential candidates who will be presiding in the senate. they'll be sitting in the senate, i should say. chief justice roberts presiding. what are they permitted to do or not do as this plays itself out? >> so the rules provide that the senate trial doors must be open. but they're supposed to be closed during the deliberations. so none of those presidential -- anyone visiting would be able to be a part of the process while the doors are closed. that said, the members of the senate who are running for office will be able to have a vote and also to ask questions of witnesses, and to give public testimony about their thoughts on how the whole thing is proceeding. >> i recommend your piece.
really well written, has a lot of good data and thank you for being here. >> thank you so much, michael. that's hilary hurd. your thoughts? tweet me at "smerconish" or go to my facebook page. i will read responses throughout the program. from twitter, smerconish, should the economy he didn't create, cues crimes against the u.s.? this is a joke. right? >> well, debbie, a lot in there to unpack. i'll deal with the first part of it, which is the economy he didn't create. i ask you this. if the economy were in the dump right now, would you similarly be granting him a pass and saying, well, he didn't create that economy? i don't think so. i'm asking for some consistency here. if you're going to give him blame for the economy, i think also you have to give him credit for the economy. second point i totally understand. right? because to say he gets a pass because of a good economy would mean we're going to excuse any kind of bad conduct from a president moving forward. keep the votes coming. go to my website,
smerconish.com. should the strength of the economy spare president trump from being impeached? by the way, put up the "new york times" front page today, so people see what i'm referencing. yeah. look at all the bar graphs and the line graphs. the point is, they're all headed in the right direction. in fact, the headline. "trump carries inch peachment with a boom." making a statement about this odd juxtaposition between a seemingly strong economy at a time when the president who presided over that economy whether you give him credit or not is about to be impeached. up ahead, joe biden has a secret weapon. his incredible popularity among black voters. will that alone win him the nomination? can he sustain it? and she's back! everybody's buzzing about hillary clinton's candid, likable interview with howard stern. what, if anything, should we read into that appearance. ief from cold and flu symptoms without a prescription, try theraflu multi-symptom. theraflu dissolves in seconds,
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of delegates will be awarded from areas more racially defense than those first to states and biden currently rungs strong among voters of color. look at south carolina, majority black democratic electorate, and historically indicated where the rest of the south will go. a recent survey shows biden commanding with 44% of south carolina's black vote. bernie sanders trailing him by 30 points. mayor pete is at a bluetarky. 0.0. if biden maintains supports among black voters, a structural advantage in the nomination fight stronger than his lead in national polls's joining me to discuss don peebles, former chair of the congress' black caucus foundation, who served on president obama's national finance committee. mr. peebles, how deep do you think that support is that the former vice president has with voters of color?
>> i think it's somewhat shallow. i mean, he's gaining black support primarily by association. similar to what hillary clinton enjoyed. she got support from the african-american voting community based upon her marriage to bill clinton and being first lady and so on, and then vice president obama -- i mean, president obama is giving support somewhat to joe biden. so joe biden's enjoying support based upon his association with president obama and being his vice president. i think african-american voters are supporting him because of that. >> well, let's game it out. i mean, unless the no malarkey but tour reversed the tide, the vice president doesn't seem poised to win the iowa primary and new hampshire caucus. does that cause a reset and potential momentum shift or do you think the people of color currently supporting the vice president, former vice president, will continue to do
so? >> it depends on who wins iowa. i think if anyone other than booker or deval patrick win iowa i think the vice president is fine. iowa is much less relevant. however, if cory booker were to win iowa that resets the table and he goes into south carolina with a lot of momentum, and i would not underestimate cory booker's campaign. he and elizabeth warren are considered the best two organized campaigns on the ground in iowa and because it's a caucus state, organization is key. that was obama's advantage. he won iowa and proved to african-american voters that he was a legitimate candidate, and then he overtook hillary clinton in south carolina, and then it was a two-way race for the nomination which obviously he won. >> okay. so deval patrick or as you point out cory booker. if they pull an upset it could shift the tide.
mayor pete, running atop some of the surveys in iowa. what if he wins? will there be a revisiting of his candidacy by voters of color that could alter his zero-point status in south carolina? >> no. he doesn't have any legitimate reason -- >> why? >> to induce african-americans to vote for him. because of his record in his own state. his record in his own state with african-american communities in terms of economic opportunities, contracting opportunities, as well as police conduct. so i think he's got issues there, it's a very small state. if he can't manage those issues in such a small state i don't any anyoning giving him the chance to run the country. african-american voters will play a critical role and other voters have many alternatives better qualified. vice president biden by far is more qualified than mayor pete buttigieg.
elizabeth warren is much more qualified and articulated a more contrasting vision. so it's buttigieg who is similar in a political spectrum to joe biden, and the vice president is exceptionally well qualified and i can't imagine voters looking at buttigieg as an alternative to joe biden. >> right. but in iowa, apparently they are. let's deal with the elephant in the room. you've talked about his record. not talked about his sexuality. do you see that as a non-factor in the minds of voters of color? >> yeah. i think that african-american voters just like other americans are going to look for a candidate that articulates a very compelling vision for america, and one that includes them and addresses the economic and wealth disparities that african-americans confront every day. he has failed to have a meaningful discussion throughout all five debates, throughout his campaign in terms of an economic plan for african-american voters and it's for that reason that
he's polling so low. >> final subject. by election night super tuesday, i guess that's march 3rd, by the conclusion of that voting, nearly 40% of the delegates will have been selected. so this process which already feels like it's been going on for years is going to move very quickly early in 2020. here's my point. my point is that if someone can keep intact this voting block of folks of color, they will really put themselves on a path to securing that nomination. at this point it looks like joe biden. but what's your thought relative to the quick pace that we're about to see? >> i think that the organization, the best organized campaigns are going to be in the mix by super tuesday. i think it will ultimately be a four knt race. warren, sanders, biden and most likely booker. four candidate race.
and maybe deval patrick and bloomberg in the mix, with mike bloomberg's wealth he can be a major player. i don't think anybody gets 19, 190 delegates. just like in obama/clinton, ultimately someone's going to have to get out of the race or it will be a brokered convention. with biden, leading the pack, most likely, but i would not underestimate warren or sanders, because they're challenging america about how capitalism works. capitalism is the best system in the world, but our capitalistic democracy is based upon fairness and capitalismal now is not fair because it leaves so many people out especially african-americans. look at wealth, and economic disparity and african-americans carry a disproportionate burden of poverty. that can't continue. other americans now are feeling, know, left out of our capitalistic system, and so it needs to be rebalanced, and warren and sanders are clearly articulating a plan to rebalance it. i would not overlook them either
and i think african-american voters will take a second look at them as well. >> here's what we can agree on. it's got a very fluid nature to it. it's got a very unsecretary of stat stated -- unsettled nature, a lot will happen. appreciate you being here, don peebles. >> thank you. see what you're saying on my smerconish twitter and facebook pages's from facebook. why are we still collecting data by race? people vote not their color. hmm, that's an overly simplistic analysis. put back on the screen that times graphic to answer this fella a little more specifically. the "new york times" had bar graphs that showed, i've got my hard copy right here. that showed just how distinct iowa and new hampshire are from the rest of the country. you know, being so overwhelmingly white. then all of a sudden -- there it is. things change. when you get to nevada look at the diminished green.
get to south carolina look at the diminished green. because of so many more people of color voting. right now joe biden is doing so well among voters of color that that fact alone if he can lan on to that support could secure him the nomination. that's the observation. frankly, i'd be derelict if as a political observer if i ignored it. i hope your answering the survey questionconismerconish.com. tell you who thinks the president should be impeached. president trump. he tweeted on this subject. look at that. stock market up, dow 18.65, s&p 24.36. nasdaq composite, 29.17. quoting james carville. it's the economy, stupid. i wonder if he's voting on today's survey question? up ahead after the grab him by the pea tape, melania trump
responded, wearing a gucci bow. the first lady we don't know all that well after three years in office. i discuss with her unauthorized biaugu ographer. and making waves way long wide-ranging interview with howard stern. what if anything should we read into that appearance by hillary clinton? >> are you going to run again? >> no. that is 100%. >> in a few days i won't open my newspaper. >> well, i never say never to anything. so why treat your mouth any differently? listerine® completes the job by preventing plaque, early gum disease, and killing up to 99.9% of germs. try listerine®. need stocking stuffers? try listerine® ready! tabs™.
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is hillary clinton finished for good? or laying the groundwork to run again or be drafted for president? she sat for a wide-ranging 2.5 hour interview with howard, many including myself think she should have done in 2016 to help her seem more accessible and human. one of the many tidbits discussing her attend in the inauguration. >> then he started on that speech, which was so bizarre, and that's when i got really worried. a president is supposed to try to reach out to people who weren't for him or her. >> right. >> you're supposed to say, okay. i'm going to be the president of everyone. i didn't hear any of that, and then that carnage in the street and the dark dystopian vision. i was sitting there, wow.
i couldn't believe it and george w. bush said to me, well, that was some weird shit. >> wow. >> is she letting it all out now because she doesn't care any more, or because she'd like to get back in? joining me now to discuss is patti solis doyle who was campaign manager for hillary clinton in 2008. patti, i can't tell you how many times in the last few days people said to me, where was that hillary in the last cycle, or in the '08 cycle? your reaction sew that to that ? >> frustrating to me, michael, just because i worked for hillary clinton for almost 20 years. that's the hillary i know. she's a person. she's a real person with humor and compassion and fears and frustrations. and the fact that that never really came out in either cycle, '08 or '16 is frustrating, because, you know, that hillary is really likable. >> so you repeat me, i called
lanny davis after the interview aired and we had both listened to it. lanny always said, you just don't know her. is it the fault of hillary for never allowing us to get to know it or respectfully the people around her who kept her buttoned up? >> that a shot at me? >> just a question. >> it's hard to run for public office as you know. and especially when you have 30 years of public service behind you. people for the most part have already made up their mind because of those 30 years. so it's very difficult. and by nature, you know, admittedly, hillary clinton is a private person my nature. it's hard for her to open up in public. she's not like her husband. she's not like barack obama. she doesn't have that sort of gene in her as a, as a politician that they are or the or yate eators they are.
when you have 30 years public service and being in the public eye, most people have already made up their mind. you said at the onset, if she had done that interview with howard stern in 2016, we may be in a different place now. but i would imagine that if she 4 do had done that interview in 2016 the questions much different, about her emails, about what trump was saying about her. it would have been a different interview back then. >> in 2008, if she said to you, or you said to her, we have this invitation from howard stern. what would have been patti solis doyle's recommendation whether to accept it? me, i'd love to see that kind of conversation unfold. i wished that you would have given it consideration, but as a campaign manager, truthfully, what would you have said? >> i think if i had to be completely honest i would have said, just because of his reputation back then in 2008, probably not.
but we did, we did push for venues like "saturday night live" and "the view" other ven yups that were much softer. again, even in 2008, the questions weren't about her former boyfriends or her mom. they were about the -- her vote on the war in iraq. they were about other things. so it was, you know, certainly -- i would be willing to take a lot of responsibility for not putting her -- not having in a situation with her more personal side coming out but i think the media also needs to take a hit on that as well. they really weren't interested in that. they were more interested in the topics of the day, and the topics of the campaign. >> final thought. i keep replaying in my mind 2016, which is not the cycle wherecalling the shots. want to reach educated white
guys in states like mine of pennsylvania, wisconsin, michigan, you know the list. i can't think of a better venue to go than howard. >> i agree, in retrospect. i completely agree and wasn't calling shots in 2016, bhut it was a different environment and as i said, would have, could have, should have, but there were a lot of other intervening outside things that happened in 2016 and we can go on and on about them, whether it was the russian interference or not campaigning in wisconsin or the comey letter. i don't know if you can really say that one interview would have made the difference. but -- you know -- that's all i really have to say. i don't know if you can say one interview would have made the difference. >> final question, quickly i buried the lead. what do you read into this? does she want back in? no. first of all, it's too late for
her to come in to a presidential race right now. just tactically, mechanically. you know? she's already missed the deadlines on getting her name on the ballot in certain states. she is not michael bloomberg. while she's very well off, she does not have billions of dollars to still fund a presidential campaign. difficult to raise money mow, but she has a lot to say. she is a former first lady, former senate, former secretary of state, and by the way, also the last person who ran against trump. i think listening to her and to her advice is very important. not just for the country but for the people running now. so i, you know, more power to her. i want her out there all the time, if she can be. >> patti, thanks. bye for now. >> bye-bye, thanks. check in o'ontweets and facebook comments. what do we have? from facebook. hillary prepping herself to got back in. guaranteed strategic gone op stern's show to show he human
side. obvious. she's a great actress. >> i don't know actress, watch it. on the app, as i did. don't just listen to it. watch it. i don't think you're going to believe she's acting for 2.5 hours. what you get in the interview is the real hillary, and very likable. i want to remind you to answer the survey question at my website, smerconish.com. should the strength of the economy spare president trump from being impeached? by the way, show you what republican voters think. okay? republican voters. put it on the screen. what issue they find most important. i know how they answer this. 50% say it's the economy. 15% say impeachment. now, democrats by contrast, put that up. here's how the ds look at it. interestingly. health care number one. climate change, way up there. impeachment and economy, very, very close to one another. still to come, how could one commercial drive down the value of a company 1.5 billion
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16 years agz a book on monk kmuation with a title subject to interpretation became an international best-seller called "eats, shoots and leaves." was it supposed to be "eats shoots and leaves" syntactic ambiguity and i thought about this this week when a new book was released about the first lady called "free, melania." hmm. what does that mean? joining me, its author, kate bennett, the only reporter in the white house press corps whose sole purpose cover the first lady, east wing and trump family. kate, i am hung up on the comma. what does the title of the book imply? >> it implies, i would say it free melania. implies she is quite free.
describes how i believe she is and lives within the trump administration. the harb freemelania came on the scene, everybody thought she was miserable. the opposite true three years in enjoying herself has a lot of autonomy and independence and do and says whatever she wants. so she is "free melania." >> a woman of mystery. three years in the white house and i don't feel we really have a clear picture of her. that is up until release of your book. does she cultivate that deliberately? >> i think it's a handful of things. one is she's very uncompromising who she is and what she wants to do. good and bad. lowered the bar what's expected or anticipated from a first lady and in a way raised the bar for first ladies who don't have to, never seen as individuals. sort of dragged along a lot of the time or expected to do this or expected to do that.
it's a bit of a tricky game but i certainly think she's savvy enough to understand how she's, i guess, marketing herself to the public in a way with the mystery. listen, we felt we knew michelle obama. go to sole cycle do carpool karaoke's imagine melania trump do push-ups on jimmy kimmel? doesn't compute. this is still a first lady we're learning about which is why i wrote the book. >> the "grab him by the pae" tape comes can out and next time we see her in a gucci pussy bow. what was that about? >> i have long believed no melania trump coincidences. a reason she wore that. subtle. not sure she thought people would pick up on it. a strange term but a legitimate fashion term. you know, was she signaling the women who were against her husband for what he did and said on those "access hollywood"
tapes or supporting her husband saying it doesn't bother me. i'm wearing a pussy bow blouse. leaves open that ambiguity and people have that question mark about her. she speaks through her visual cues and doesn't, never came out and said i wore this because -- she leaves it up to us to interpret it. >> it all began with that escalator ride. you say that people have misunderstood, misinterpreted her desire to be in this, meaning she wanted him to run. wanted to be a part of it. explain. >> i mean, i write in the book this escalator ride looks like she's going down maybe to the shoe department at saks or something. not like she wraunts ants to be to kick it off, people have to remember they've been together 20 years listened and sounding board each and every time there was a presidential election saying i'm going to run. i should run. this is the year. finally said, listen, you're getting older. if this is going to happen
you're going to win if you run, run already. very supportive. i think for melania trump sort of moves through life as she so chooses. this is just a finite chapter. she's not a seasoned political spouse. we don't get that energy from her. at the same time she's taking, taking this moment and making the best of it for her. she's mostly protecting her son. and she's tried to get by living in really the biggest fishbowl. >> okay. finally, you say it's "free melania" as opposed to, free melania! >> it's "eats, shoots, run". >> that was all about a banda. right? all about a panda and whether he was eating shoots and leaving and eating, shooting. anyway, congratulations. >> thanks. tweets and facebook comments. from twitter -- doesn't want to be freed.
she chose and supports this toxic man as a husband and must now live the consequences. you know, there's another interesting aspect of kate's book which is that the stand by her man mantra that was that dolly part jn that paoparton? the way melania leads her life kate contributes to slovenia upbringing taking the good and bad with the spouse. found that interesting. i kw i obviously enjoyed the book. should the strength of the economy prevent president trump from being impeached. put up jim jordan. a tweet on this. yeah. speaker pelosi is counting impeachment votes. here's what president trump is counting. then rattles off all the economic data that he thinks is more important. so i wonder what you are thinking? go to my website, cast a ballot on the survey question. results soon. still to come, it may have
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i have a christmas confession. i am sexist and misogynistic according to peloton haters. as you've heard peloton maker of high-end at-home exercise equipment faces backlash over a new holiday television ad titled "the gift that gives back" featuring a husband gifting his wife the bike for christmas, and her videos chronicling her usage and ends with this. >> a year ago i didn't realize how much this would change me. thank you. >> twitter exploded with criticism saying the ad smacks of sexism and classism like peloton, because maybe your partner thinks you're fat on the inside. or nothing says, maybe you should lose a few pounds like gifting your already rail-thin
life partner a peloton. or to own a peloton are you also required to own an $8 million oceanfront home or a new york city loft like everyone in the commercials? and i've seen hostage videos that look more comfortable. others made parody videos. >> first ride. a little nervous. rightly so. my husband got me a [ bleep ] workout bike for christmas and that's rude. let's go. >> fish day five days in a row >> surprised? >> i am. >> peloton had to turn off comments on its own post. meanwhile, this week the stock it dropped 15%. the value of the company plummeted 1.5 billion dollars. so where do i come in? well, last year for christmas i gave my sirius xm radio producer, her name is t.c., gift certificates to four of her favorite workout haunts. a cycle bar and flywheel.
and a t-shirt. telling her she needed to slim down, get into shape? no. i know working ot is her passion and fig ared she's appreciate the thought that went in my visiting those four locations and getting guess what, she did. hopefully people will come to their senses and get othver the absurd outraoutrage. still to come, the best and worst facebook comments and go to smerconish.com and answer this. should the strength of the economy spare president trump from being impeached? wow! that's ensure max protein, with high protein and 1 gram sugar. it's a sit-up, banana! bend at the waist! i'm tryin'! keep it up. you'll get there. whoa-hoa-hoa! 30 grams of protein, and one gram of sugar. ensure max protein.
the ones that make a truebeen difference in people's lives. and mike's won them, which is important right this minute, because if he could beat america's biggest gun lobby, helping pass background check laws and defeat nra backed politicians across this country, beat big coal, helping shut down hundreds of polluting plants and beat big tobacco, helping pass laws to save the next generation from addiction. all against big odds you can beat him. i'm mike bloomberg and i approve this message.
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time to see how you responded to the survey question at smerconish.com. should the strength of the economy spare president trump from being impeached? survey says, here are the results. whoa! 96%. 4% said yes. i think the 4% is within the margin of error. look at it, that is with 15,500 votes cast. here's what came in via social media at this hour. what do we have? in what regard does a questionable booming economy absolve someone of crimes? your survey is ridiculous and pathetic. but do you like the survey
question, francesca? 15,000 people voted and 96% of them agree with you. what else has come in? the economy is doing well because of president trump policies. impeachment will bring the u.s. economy down. stop impeachment. look, what i was getting at with the survey question is the odd juxtaposition of what's going on on front pages all across the country. robust job numbers have just come out driving the unemployment rate down to a 50-year low. the economy by many measurements is doing extremely well at a time when it seems almost a certainty the house of representatives is going to vote to impeach the president. it's all relevant. it's all related. what else came in? smerconish, clinton was impeached during a booming economy too. and was not convicted by the senate, which is my real point. it seems a foregone conclusion of what will happen both in the
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good morning. it's saturday, december 7th. i'm victor blackwell. >> and i'm amara walker. you're in the cnn newsroom. >> we're starting in florida. we're learning new details about the suspect in that shooting at naval air station pensacola. in an exclusive interview with cnn, his uncle said there was nothing that showed any signs that he would carry out such an act. investigators are looking into whether or not there is a link to terrorism. three people were killed and several others were injured. cnn's natasha chen has been following this story from pensacola. natasha, what's the latest? >> reporter: amara, we still don't have many confirmed