tv Key Capitol Hill Hearings CSPAN April 15, 2016 5:04am-10:01am EDT
them punitive come if there were a proactive way and, of course, is not a question after have to ask the manufacturers, innocent program to comply with vehicle safety recall if one has been identified. i would encourage is there any manufacturers who are listening today to consider that approach as well. i've got to ask you this. the little known fact, you mention novelty motorcycle helmet problems can you tell me what the problem is? i was not aware that. >> there's a group that put outt a novel deal that does not meet the standards. basically people with the help of thinking they are protecting themselves and it does not. >> these are sold as motorcycle helmet? >> absolutely. if he didn't know what you buy into that looked different and cool, thinking you're getting the same protection, you would not be. >> is there a requirement helmets, anyway for a consumer to know this is nhtsa approved
our safety approved device they purchased? >> and the dot labeled so you would know it is correct but these are manufactured and put out in places, so we are acting to try to take care of that. >> but no label would be affixed to those? >> its different depending on a people are producing them. most often there is no label and people don't know they should be looking for that. they just think it's a hell of that probably should be protecting them. >> full-service subcommittee, i learned something new to bit of help our motorcycle public has been attention and will only by officials. i recognize the ranking member five minutes for questions. >> thank you, mr. chairman. and thank you, dr. rosekind. the map of ongoing recalls of takata airbags has remained a huge and complicated problem. as was mentioned just yesterday, nhtsa announced 85 million more
takata airbags could be recalled unless takata can prove they are safe. dr. rosekind, questions about takata are endless. for several consumers want to know how we can get accurate information to better understand which insulators are going into what cars. recently nhtsa state if a car company can meet the requirement to require a sufficient supply of remedy parts, the company should continue its close like for like her grandma, replacing older defective airbags with newer but identical bags. my questions are these. doesn't mean the company will be put potentially defective airbag into a car with hope that it is better just because it's newer? is the consumer told this important information at the time to airbag is replaced? >> i need to begin by mickey shorter but it understands, since the inception 42000 lives have been saved by air bags.
that's the difficulty of the situation. a piece of safety equipment is putting people at risk. what is now known based on testing is the only five different factors that great the risk about a rupture. temperature, moisture, time, driver versus passenger-side and what it has a moisture absorbing additive that can be placed in there. one of the issues you're talking about is at this point where only single ruptures at seven and a half years, and as with all the other risk factors involved as well. what your talk about right now, the our certain number being replaced that at least seven and a half year time span available for the safety to protect people. >> is the consumer promised a later date committed a prominent remedy? >> absolutely. when we announced his recall the hardest part, keep it among the most difficult things, talking about people having to
potentially come twice to what you're describing is an interim remedy that will provide more safety but got to come back for a second time. this is why we've emphasized the 100%. you do want people to get the first women think they are done. >> there are news reports that indicate companies other than takata are making replacement airbags. are the suppliers making the inflators to the old specifications or the new ones? and are these companies required to make the inflators without ammonium nitrate? >> there are three other manufacturers. the now produced about 70% of the inflators that are being currently produced for replacement. not have and use ammonium nitrate. none of them have had any safety problems identified. >> how does a consumer no if her cars replacing airbag is a replicate of the airbag that it
was made to replace? similarly how does the consumer know whether the new airbag she got in the last two years needs to be replaced? and finally how does she know whether the new one contains ammonium nitrate based on propellants? >> the simplest thing would be go to safer car.com. if you go in and the dealer told you that it's the interim remedy then you know you have to be called back again for the second fix spent safer car.com. i am troubled by the report of some auto manufacturers may still be selling new vehicles with potentially defective takata inflators. what is nhtsa doing to ensure that all new cars are free of these airbags? >> it would be illegal to sell a known defect in a new car. so if you're aware of anything let us know. that's something we would investigate. so there should be no vehicles,
ken there are some that are getting like for like. right now the recalls are back to 2014 but all those earning tracked because of the seven and half year rupture timely. >> your underwear then report that some auto manufacturers are doing that, is that what you're saying? you said i should inform you but have you heard that as will? >> right. unless it's something we know about, because against are some that have not been recalled because the time but otherwise were not aware of any. >> thank you. i yield back. >> the chair now recognizes the gentleman from illinois. >> thank you, mr. chairman and, sir, thank you for being here and thank you for serving the country in your capacity. chairman, things are hearing this hearing for us to continue this committee's oversight of nhtsa and the review related safety issues within the automotive industry.
i would like to thank the chairman and committee for the support and work to include my amendment in the fast act, i believe it takes a important step for to improve vehicle safety by requiring automakers provide more information about defective components or parts involved in safety recalls, sharing defective part numbers and other information with recyclers will improve safety and a nhtsa in its goal to improve recall completion rates. section 24116 of the fast act requires automakers to finish additional information in their 575 reports such as the name of the component, a description of the component and the port number. do you have any information what's the status of implementation speak with yes. an important component if you'll of fast act and to name him a description of part number already underway to include that according to what's in the fast act. >> does it require a will making?
>> yes. >> has nhtsa reached out to stakeholders such as the automotive recyclers association for technical assistance and input on implement in the section? >> and they've been very forthcoming. or has any information been received from oem under any section of this law? the new information, any information been received? >> we are still in the producing faith but we will interact with them as well. >> to any idea, for timelines because we will meet the fast act requirement. >> how will the information supplied to the section of law be available to the public or to stakeholders? ideally are you going to have like a static pdf form, electronic database, anything
you force the? >> trying to figure it out. not just with recyclers at the forum we asked for can facilitate how we can make that information available. that's the part that is being worked on now spill i appreciate your working on it, office will continue to make sure everything is going correct procedure chairman. mr. chairman, that's all i have for this witness. >> gentleman yields back. the chair now recognizes the gentleman from ms. clark from new york for questioning. >> i think the chairman and thank the ranking member. thank you, dr. rosekind for coming in today. am i pronouncing her name correctly? that was the brooklyn pronunciation. i think it is safe to assume that cars are going to continue to come equipped with more technological features own forward. connections this is through popular telematics system such
as onstar and build a navigation system. but as we heard in numerous hearings in the subcommittee covering different aspects of the incident of things o if a product can connect to the internet that product is going to be a target for hackers. dr. rosekind, what is nhtsa doing to ensure that the broad number of connected features in cars don't become a to point for hackers? what are the consequences for automakers that do not have robust cybersecurity? and has nhtsa have plans to pursue a room working on cybersecurity? >> but we start with the consequences. last july there was a visible hack of a jeep which was at least planned so that has been a malicious hack of any vehicle yet. we highlighted it is a love that concept. it is real. i pointed out because without any change in our authorities, within days i recall was under way. we are going to act aggressively and get on those when possible.
you bring up an issue which is the more connected everything is the more cybersecurity becomes critical. nhtsa has been on the since 2012 will be created an office specifically focused on. this is my chance to thank everybody for the support and the fast act. we have about seven engineers on this. the fast act will let us add up to 20 new engineers to do with it. they are looking at a broad range from how you protect things to one of our recent folks and researchers look at what are the data element you would have to click to see if hacking attempt for ongoing. there's a very active research program going on. as well as a lot of others. we published a cybersecurity piece on our policy, developing new program element. january we held a meeting with over 300 coming together. manufacturers as well as independent researchers to get to look at these things. this is an area where we need to figure how to cut that middle line, which is we talk about
nimble and flexible for cybersecurity. if you come up with the rule today, tomorrow it can be out of date. at the same time you need best practices and potential roast established protections and things. i think this is aaron you have to see a variety of different techniques used to get the full kind of protection the american public can expect. >> very well. as you referred to the jeep experience with the two researchers, dr. rosekind, when it comes to car cybersecurity isn't about data. it can really be about safety issue. i joined bolton at nhtsa released with you got a month ago said take appropriate steps to minimize risk with the attacking to can you explain some of those steps might be? >> yes, it think it is your right to our focus is primarily on the safety, and that hack that was done on the jeep last july specific dealt with control systems of the vehicle.
that's with a safety concern comes. thanks for acknowledging the collaboration with the fbi and putting that out. that add a lot of straight for things, the careful what you hook up to your entertainment system. so that she packed with of the entertainment system, for example. i think all of us can think about all the things we attach to our vehicles whether you are nowadays a huge number connected to the web if you're after searching you a chance matches for a virus to be difficult but to get into your system. there's a nice list of things in that press release that was put out cautioning people. if you think about it you want to do the same thing you do for your home computer to protect yourself, so think about your car in the same way. >> i thank you. mr. chairman, i yield back the balance of my time. >> the chair recognizes the gentlelady from indiana for five minutes. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i consider my district actually
the auto option capital of the united states, car auction services which i is that go to y district is the second largest in north america selling over 4 million vehicles a year, employers 14,000 in all 50 states. i also, both in annapolis, have next year capital just expanded their headquarters and type into the facility where they serve over 20,000 auto dealers who depend on them for $13 billion in capital to fund their auction purchases. they tell me they want to protect people by ensuring they know their customers know of car defects before they buy. at right now safercar.gov only allows customers to search within numbers at a time and what better time to check for recalls. over 9 million cars sold at auction every year, auto auctions simply don't have the
manpower or the resources to tediously input every single number. so by online auto auctions to rent every car interlocked for recall notices in one query, the consumer would be more equipped to make better decisions, higher successful recall rates and fewer accidents on the road. can you give me an update on the progress you've made and it is made with respect to the search of multiple numbers at once and what hurdles do you still face? >> actually you just described them, which is the nixon lookup is a tool for consumers and we don't maintain a database. that's just tapping the auto manufacturers who control there've been databases. we know there's a great need and interest in have what's called
batch or book lookups into it as the crew. the auction houses, new dealerships come off kind of folks would benefit. we have met with folks i think the biggest thing we're seeing is the technology challenge as your talk about the creation of some mechanism, as such a second we could even keep the database. how would you create a mechanism basically technologically so you can have those bold request going to multiple manufactures in a very short timeframe and providing that both answer basically. i think at most at this point it's a technology challenge and clearly how can we give them is unclear as well. everybody is pointing to the. there are three commercial entities that do that. carfax is one of them. i can get to the other two if you would like. we met in july again front to talk of old happen. that technology is the biggest piece because no has an answer of how to pull that off. >> isn't it part of our challenge that we have so many
people who do purchase vehicles that are moving through the auto auctions and so consumers can pittsburgher difficult for them to know if you get one of these cars that has one of these problems? >> absolutely. when i say there's a technological challenge that doesn't mean we are off of it. it means we're trying to be more aggressive to figure how could you fi fix the issue. you get on another issue which the fastback addressed for rental cars but can you start people can still sell those without having to recall remedy. that's one of the ways to get to this. we met intelligence a meeting with him secret affair with a technological solution to the. >> i hope soldier engineers working on some issues maybe with all the brainpower of those engineers maybe could also be tasked to have that as a topic. i want to turn to a different topic right now. last you a this past month rather, griffith high school boys basketball team was
traveling to a semi-state championship. a driver sideswiped their butts and the bus flipped and overturned as they were on the way to their semi-state game. not other children were seriously injured. however, it reminds us all about the importance of giving seat belts on school buses. last september you announced a series of steps designed to move the nation toward providing more seatbelts to students on school buses. can you please tell us about the research project, the data collection, stakeholder outreach, what's going on with respect to this project? >> i can't thank you enough for raising the question. the are some headlines that people want to talk about. that's one for four decades there's been debate about putting seatbelts on school buses. and yes, it is a clear departure from the to to come out and say three seat belts would add, that they tell us is the safest way
to get to and from. can you make it safer? absolutely. we've had one meeting on how to make it happen. we identified affected such as the seatbelts on the bus. it's around the bus. we are looking at everything from the red lights on the arms to cards that help people pass in front. we are looking at all the different things including our most recent meeting where we pulled the six-day to give laws written to seatbeltreligious see what to do and how we can scale it to the rest of the country. we are on the try to figure out anything we can do to support putting seat of school buses. >> i yield back. >> the chair recognizes the gentleman from new jersey, ranking member of the full committee, mr. pallone. >> thank you, mr. chairman. as others have mentioned today, in january, dot and 18 automakers reached an agreement known as the proactive safety principles and the legacy auto manufactures and dod tried to
work proactively. but, frankly, i have doubts about these principles -- dot. the principles are simply a promise to try to work together in a future. there's no substance and even if there were, there's no enforcement to ensure the automakers keep the commitments. can you assure me these principles are meaningful in some way? that these principles are more than a pr stunt to shift the focus away from the major safety crisis of the past few years? >> you are correct. is not a regulation they're not enforceable. in april we had a meeting for the very first time to discuss with automakers 100% recall completion rate as a target. that is not included in the proactive principle. never before, if one is talked about let's get 75% because that's the average. we are talking 100% should be the target. can everybody be more? absolutely but now have a new
target. i think the automatic emergency braking is another proactive when. in the cybersecurity area chrysler in may had their meeting to focus on things. we all know if we keep doing the same thing we cannot expect different outcomes. we will continue doing everything we know that works comes to get ways to get better but nets is looking for every other tool we can find that could help save a life. >> all right. in addition, and i appreciate that because i think even though you are admitting there's no enforcement mechanism per se that you're going to try to use other measures that you have to do that. in addition to the lack of enforcement, i also have
reservations about the closed-door process needs has been engaging in recently. with regard to the proactive safety principles, were any advocates of drug involved in drafting the principles? >> that process started on december 1 when secretary fox called all the ceos in because of all the recall and safety problems going on in the industry. it was clergy on just breaking records and issue safety culture and industry. he called them in and so we need to do something different. six weeks later that agreement emerged among them basically to come u those four areas. so that start with me with automakers. six weeks latest the holidays is when it came together. so there was again not a public process. there was not, that was come into what he could to change that was agreement that came together. i'll say it again. decided to be a regulation, not intended to be enforcement but
everybody is watching. we have concrete things like that agreement looking to target one of% completion the activity is going on. cybersecurity is being advanced. we have safety meeting coming up next week basically where we're going to be looking at how to take aviation lessons learned and apply them to the auto industry. and that agreement we talked about anonymous sharing of safety data. that meeting is happening next friday. we are watching. >> there were not any auto safety advocates of directly involved, but i mean, how are you going to try to get them involved? what are you going to do? >> that agreement is public. it's out of there. the activities basically, anybody can have input to what's going on. that was an agreement of the manufactures to proactively move things forward. >> it wasn't a public comment period for the proactive safety principles? >> it was not a regulation, not
intended to be enforced. >> i understand. i appreciate your honesty about lack of enforcement, lack of involvement of the auto safety advocates, lack of a comment period. i don't think that's good but i appreciate your honesty. how are we going, we don't want to have a similar agreements like this in the future. i think it's important to involve the public safety advocates. it's important that public comments, a public comment period prior to finalization. so i mean can you make some commitment to is that in the future will try to do that? what can you tell us that makes me feel a little better about the lack of all this? >> nitznudes is good look for af the tools available, and that means we'll have as much of direction -- nhtsa. all the activities that are going on. and, frankly, some the process have cleared elements where in
notice and comment rulemaking the opportunities for everybody to get in fault in public docket, center. will be other activities that certain groups will not be involved in. >> i guess my concern, i know my time is right out, the politics of practices on the par part ofe nhtsa are something hope for but the rulemaking process is for reason and mandatory safety standards have prevented more than 600,000 deaths since the 1960s. i do want to agency moving away from mandatory standards. that's my concern. >> that's what i can set absolutely emphatically that we will regulate enforcement as we need to and we are looking come and want to expand and add to her toolset that we can try to see progress on safety. >> thank you. thank you, mr. chairman. gentleman yields back. the chair now recognizes the gentleman from from kentucky. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you administrator rosekind for testifying. it's my understanding that was
sometimes called the one mission program referring to fuel economy regulations was intended to coordinate or harmonize various federal-state regulations as much as possible. since the are effectively three separate sets of regulations, epa, nhtsa and state regulations it's come to my attention differences between the federal programs that compliance would difficult. first do you agree the development of the one mission program was to fight and 60 and certainty for automakers speak with yes. it is epa and especially the california air resources more. >> are you aware of the differences between programs that affect stringency and possible compliance? >> there's a specific one? >> if i'm not mistaken epa credits can have a usable life of up to 10 years versus nhtsa credits up to five years of life. because of that difference somebody could be, and epa credit could be comply with epa but not complied with nhtsa.
is that the conflict? >> two things. one is i was it is a specific instance of cell and is questioning whether inconsistency is i would've to see that that so we can see what's going on. but the other thing to the question about consistency more generally is there is a midterm review coming up where we will be putting out a technical assessment report so we can go look at how that is doing and a drafdraftdraft report will comer the sake of those comments that people can address. >> that was a specific instance. somebody came to me and said they'd been written up for being complied with one or the other but to look at the standards and say there's a potential being in compliance with epa but not in compliance with what nhtsa is asking for. that was an example of what i wanted to bring out. spirit if there's a specific incidents they should let us know. there is one rule out additional
going by. if there is a concern, we can take a look at it. more importantly in the midterm review will be a draft everyone can comment. >> okay. we will follow a specific on that. shifting to recalls and focus on the millions of motorists, what is the status of the new recall media campaign announced last september? >> there have been a variety of activities going on. that when his safe car, save lives and we are doing media buys. it is agency that has the click it or ticket, drive sober or get pulled over. we have national campaigns we do. this is one focus on recalls. the other two things i will mention quickly our business activities going on, the automobile association has been in research and looking at other mechanisms, things like contacting insurance companies, not just when you register your car but when you contact your insurance company, another touch
point. working with to god at all manufactures. they are required to give us the outreach plan. so that we can look at it. we come up with almost 20 new robust strategies for them to pursue along with the about dozen things we have underwent. >> takata is a case but there are a lot of recalls for a lot of different reasons. you look at like recall, your doorhandle each be readjusted? i've heard, i've never seen one, people say it's it's a typo inr a typo in a owners manual to get a recall notice on that. i personally have not seen that way but a juicy recalls that come with cars i have. the screw in a church or something like that, takata, that's a safety. is what you try to calm markets are the people continued getting recalls and all of a sudden one more shoes than others and against recall fatigue speak with absolutely.
i think that's been the problem with the headline, it is people get so many notices potential when you're looking at come i mentioned the number but last year, 2015 was 900. 51 million vehicles been affected and so just consumers don't that's something they need to pay attention to is a challenge. if you're getting multiple ones for different cars, that is a real problem. that's why we can' try to come p with new strategies, new approaches others a lot of activity going on. i think the tragedy from a couple weeks ago shows we've got to do more. >> i don't have 19 seconds. you said publicly and your staffs and technology may have environmental benefits that would produce greenhouse gases. could get a couple examples? >> engines that are more efficient spilled i yield back. >> gentleman yields back. the chair now recognizes the gentleman from oklahoma.
>> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you for being here. very impressive, your command and knowledge of nhtsa. i think of a new vendor i haven't seen even look back at anybody behind you or even look at a note. so i will commend you for the. i'm not capable of doing that. i just want to run a little bit on the recalls. unfortunately, we heard of the young lady lost her life and has been brought up and talk about. there were some questions about how the vehicle was registered. i get that, too. but i have on multiple vehicles over time and is to get recalls from vehicles that i owned years ago. is there not, unless i'm mistaken i thought dm these were supposed to notify our health
notify the individuals when they were registered with them of recalls. but is the dmv communicating with the manufactured clothing of the people has changed hands? ssome way to get those notifications further out? what we are having is, it's nothing effective to understand the responsibility of the driver but at the same time when you buy a vehicle new or used, you assume everything is perfect on it. you are not looking for because. if you look at recalls you never would've purchased the vehicle. so is there communications with a stay, the manufacture, with the dmv is? what is documentation like? >> there should be but you just hit on, like recall fatigue. you're hitting on another issue, which is where in the communications that the breakdown? one of the concerns you raise it is when there's multiple buyer,
you that multiple, used cars been bought by multiple buyers over time, there is this a just about the transition of ownership is been taken care of, all the appropriate information has been passed on. that's not always correct. now you're look at the whole system. dmv, the manufacture, where the notices go out. even if you update information on the owner and make sure they're sending it to the right address where you live. you just hit on another issue are trying to unravel, figure out where all those touch point could be. that's what i would be interested in the dmv pilot. i would like to use you in an ad because you got and if you want a new car can use car, rent a car, your something is just outstanding recalls. >> the other breakdowns, you eakdowns, youhe fleet of can't, i've the fleet of vehicles, and several mechanics that work in our companies. you can't work on a car anymore
without plugging it into a computer. the would seem that there would be a way for notification to come up on the vehicle and everything is connected what it is that there's a recall regardless if the manufacturer is working out a certified gm mechanic or the mechanic down the road. you would think that would be would take me take that would be ways to mitigate this debate has got to take the vehicles in and get the oil changed the very few people are changing the oil in the driveway. that might be a way. i'm open to discussing it further with you. maybe some simple ways we might be able to come up with some more communication, more ways for just the average consumer to get the technology or the information they need. want to go back to ms. brooks wringing of the school bus issue. i have five kids who go to public school from 12 to five years of age. they will be there for a while. they are on a school bus all the time.
the question is though, i don't think any school is arguing the fact that want to put seatbelts in the school buses because that they can't afford it. so is nhtsa look at a program to help the schools? if we just mandate the schools to do it, schools are being, are having issues with revenue left and right. we continuously put unfunded mandates on the school system and you will not find a teacher or superintendent or someone elected to the school board is going to argue the point that they don't want to seatbelts in the school buses, but we can't have some kind of program to incented-to be able to do it and funding that goes along with it. >> we are looking at all those possibilities. to your point, we don't want school district to make the choice cannot provide a safe school bus because of their concern about seatbelts. that's one of the sidelines we have to address. that's what we came out with a policy without the mandate at this point to try to get how other states and school systems have done it.
we have met folks where they didn't have the funds but they made a decision to only order new buses with three belt. they found a way to pull that off. >> you order new buses that way. it's the old buses. we know how expensive the new buses are. how long it's going to take the old buses off the road trucks you are talking about years at that point. i'm out of time. thank you for being you. really do appreciate it. >> gentleman yields back. the chair now recognizes the gentleman from illinois for a redirect. pitcher will recognize himself for the opportunity for redirection -- that chair will recognize himself. there is something that has come out relatively recently here on car shows on saturday morning,
that is the issue of the seatback integrity we put our children in. our seats, we put them in the rear seat. but in some vehicle crashes, deceit integrity of the seat backs is what fails putting the adult than in the compartment with a child and the child has been injured is this something you're looking into? >> yes. fortunately, severe rear impacts are fairly rare, and then went some of the specific injured try determined if a specific the seatback strain is possibly more rare. which just means trying to get the ditch to get the safety benefit end of the benefit determinations can be challenging. we are looking at that from the potential regulatory standpoint and from a research standpoint. even if we don't have the real-world data, we are looking
at a new test dummy that would allow things that better data to make the cut determination which would have to did come up with a regulation in that area. >> very well. another unusual thing that happened in the north texas area the day after christmas completed very severe tornado, blew up suddenly, came in my time, difficult to let people know it's coming. the greatest loss of life occurred on a tollway overpass. not people getting under it to get out of the path of the storm which recognize is a bad idea because of the effect under the overpass to these are people traveling over the overpass and they got pulled off the road and there were multiple fatalities. department of transportation has lighted signs that they put up. as you allude to the click it or ticket, drive sober or get pulled over, sometimes there will be traffic warnings there
is any thoughts as to providing timely weather warnings, a hailstorm which is that a few days ago in my area, this tournament the day after christmas, of people, i'd like to say but is listening to the weather warning station at that point but we know they are not the there listening to their sound systems. is there anything additionally we can do? this was a new phenomenon, something i've not seen before but again people literally sucked off the overpass and throat in the lake and again with great loss of life. >> you have just said and which as we use the site from a lot of different things. i will go and talk to the administrator of the federal highway administration and see if that information could be added to what is transmitted to the drivers. >> i appreciate that. do you mind if i go to mr. bilirakis first? the chair recognizes mr. bilirakis five minutes for questions. >> thank you so much, mr.
chairman. i appreciate it. administrator, where do we stand with the v2v -- if you can tell me that. elaborate on how it's going to work. >> let's start with people talk about either or, connected vehicles or autonomous self driving vehicles. department of transportation think that this is connected automation. actually both, they both give you added safety. connected vehicles are basically the defeat, the to ask, anything else were basically they will all be able to talk. what we know is studies are suggestive into applications of the defeat could prevent 600,000 crashes and save 1000 lives. it has huge opportunity over all potentially 80% of crashes involve the driver could be printed with v2v. we have actually introduced a rulemaking which has been
accepted by only be to try and set up a consistent piece of equipment that would be used for the whole system in the united states. >> when viewing this but this thing online? give me a timeline on that. >> right now it's been accepted by only be as under review. that's where we are answering their questions. >> one year, two years? any kind of an estimate? >> i can tell you that the proposal is to have it out, i will check the filed and the proposal. we have a specific in the proposal for when it will be in the road. >> thank you. next question, nhtsa has announced several initiatives and workshops on numerous issues over the last six months and plans to complete work on these topics prior to the independent station, correct? okay. how are you ensuring adequate
work stay cold engagement is done before the final actions are taken? >> well, for a variety of activities they are, in fact, open public meetings. recalls with open equipment others, distraction, live webcast with things. right now this secretaries announced in six months they will put up several things you like to talk about autonomous vehicles. we distill the first public meeting last friday. there's another with april 27 in california. there's an open docket for the. for activities lea linked to specific projects there's both so much has been evolved from stakeholders. >> very good, thank you. what are the key takeaways from cybersecurity roundtable that nhtsa held in january? >> fast in exchange because we manufacturers with independent researchers and pretty much the whole mix. i would just say, one, necessity
to see a but he thought we needed nimble and flexible. cautious about regulations. they could be outdated sadr city was before they're even in place. and the other is that everybody identified this is critical not just for protection but for the trust of the mega people to see these automation things get on the road. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i yield back. >> gentleman yields back. the chair now recognizes the gentleman from california into to much and thank you, dr. rosekind for coming forth and answering our questions. you are welcomed us questions as well, i'd just want to thank you for all the work you do, and please if you would translate that to all of the good workers that you are surrounded with and my first question has to be, speaking of workers and the people you're bold to surround yourself with, do you have as many people in your organization
that you would need to address all the issues you recognize you should be addressing or getting in front of? >> no. >> i had a funny feeling that would be the answer. >> i will just say, thank you because this committee and the fast act is helping us get there. the potential for us to hire 57 new people and address that issue. so thank you so much because that's a huge difference for us. >> 5070 people. i'm glad we were able to make sure congress has the power of the purse so that's up to us to give you your budget, et cetera. i'm glad we did that but being a ninja to myself and someone who understands how the best way to get in front of an issue is to be proactive. and an organization that has to do with traffic safety like yours, it's a very important people understand and, unfortunately, it's not that often the united states constituents receive the benefit
of other countries good work on issues like this. we tend to be the leaders, is about the case? not always pretend to be more often than not. >> and i try to preface this by saying i am biased but certainly and a lot of the technology innovation, the u.s. is the leader. >> i believe that's the case both an issue we're talking about today and in many, many things. it's something we as americans should be proud of what government does have its place especially when it comes to the safety of the american public, and anybody who comes to our great country and assumes that safety is a priority for us and we're continuing to make it a priority. once again thank you, doctor. i'd like to ask you as i'm sure you're aware in february the center for auto safety filed a lawsuit against the department of transportation alleging by failing to public service bulletins in their entirety, online for consumers to beauty was a violation of map-21.
finally, on march 25 duty announced it would public -- publish them and it has been brought to my attention that full tsb is unavailable on the website. i look forward to ensuring they are all up as soon as possible. however members of this committee work very hard to tsb publication include in map-21. while i'm pleased that nhtsa is beginning to finally comply with requirements i think it's unfortunate that it took a lawsuit to get nhtsa to make that happen. i'd like to ask you about the early warning recording system. a system was put in place in 2000 after the highly publicized for firestone tire recall. early warning is intended to alert nhtsa to vehicle defects as early as possible. ideally helping to identify major problems and minimizing the risk to the public. however, last year's audit by
the department of transportation's office of inspector general highlighted some problems with the current early warning reporting system. it said safety defects are often mischaracterized -- ms. categorize and manufactured have wide letter to avoid information they require to provide. what changes or improvements come if any, is nhtsa making to the early warning reporting system to respond to the findings in the i.t. report? >> this came up in opening comments. this is an opportunity to give everybody an update. they were 17 recommendations the inspector general identified to early morning reports. we made an aggressive commitment to finish all of those recommendations with anyone you agree. so by the end of june 2016. the inspector general was very clear, nobody ever does that. we have six of those closed ahead of schedule and with the other 11 already identified
add-on scheduled to be finished by the end of june 2016. we've done one of thing that nobody ever does. we have set up technical meets with the ig's office to tell them what our plans are to meet those recommendations so have an ongoing discussion to make sure we meet them in an appropriate way. >> eleven out of 17 have been addressed ahead of schedule? >> six. we are work on the other 11 which are on schedule. >> on schedule. it sounds like you're not only a good listener, you are a good action departments i just wanted to thank you so much for doing that. ahead of schedule is greater on schedule is good and we hope you're able to do the. i hope, not that you want to opine but i hope on the side we are as good as listener as your. thank you so much, and. >> gentleman yields back. the chair now recognizes the gentleman from ms. schakowsky. >> just a few weeks ago the new chairman of the national automobile manufacturers
association -- okay, i don't know which is. said we shouldn't have legislation requiring dealers to fix all recalls on used cars before they can be so because only 6% of recalls are hazardous. i have a letter that we received today from another -- mother, and it says as a parent of precious beautiful talented daughters killed by recalled cars with safety defects. we are appalled that you come into letter directed to jeff carlson, chairman of the national automobile dealers association, that you would claim that quote only 6% of recalls are hazardous of uncle. our daughters were driving or riding in cars that were the very defects that you claim were not hazardous and, therefore,
acceptable for your car dealer members to sell to the public without repairing the defects first. so, dr. rosekind, i think it really is important to clarify this point. does nhtsa require manufacturers to recall vehicles if a defect is even not safety related but all defects? >> we have been at this before, haven't we? >> we have. >> yes. at a defect that is an open recall needs to be fixed whether it's new, used or rental. we just heard the congressman said the assumption and when any one of those circumstances is that is the open recall, there is no defect. >> do you plan to reply at all to the notion, first of all, is that accurate in your view that the death of these girls, women, was caused by something claiming to be nonhazardous by the
dealers association? >> this is one of those ongoing challenges of individual trying to sort of split. that's why we're straight for the any open recall needs to be fixed, period. >> to our dealers prohibited and should be prohibited from selling or leasing used cars into all recalls have been repaired? >> that was in the grow america act and we played any new, used or rental should be free of defects. >> i hope that is really strongly communicated. i feel an obligation to the people from whom we received this letter and to the lost daughters of theirs that we make that perfectly clear thank you. i yield back. >> gentlelady yield's back. and that concludes questions for the first. dr. rosekind, thank you very much for your forbearance forcing with us today. we will take a two-minute recess to set up for the second panel,
we move into her second panel for today's hearing and we will follow the same format as the first panel. each witness will be recognized to get five minutes to summarize their opening statement followed by a round of questions from members. for our second panel we have the following witnesses. mr. mitchell bainwol, president and ceo at alliance of automobile manufacturers. mr. john bozzella president and ceo at global automakers. mr. michael wilson, ceo at auto medical recyclers association. ms. jackie gillan, president at advocates for highway and auto safety. news and wilson, senior vice president at motor and equipment manufacturers association. we do appreciate you all being with us today. we will begin that they'll come the discussion with you, mr. bainwol. you up recognized for five minutes. >> chairman burgess, ranking member schakowsky, member of the committee, thank you for the chance to be today to testify.
i guess on behalf of 12 major oems based in the u.s. and europe and asia rather than read a prepared statement i thought i would run through some slides very quickly to try to provide some context so we can move to the next slide. this first slide is a 65 year trendline of the titles on the u.s. roads. the vertical bars are fatalities in absolute numbers. and you see the roughly 33,000 which is roughly where we were in -- the green line is vehicle miles traveled or the yellow line is fatalities by vehicle miles traveled which are down about sevenfold. that is what the cdc described as a tremendous public health achievement of the second half of the century.
the games thus far have been on the basis of two primary factors. want is changes in behavior, few people driving drunk and more people driving belted. that's cricket the second piece of that has been technology focused on crashworthiness. so when an accident occurs folks survived that crash. moving the yellow down forward into the future will require technology to prevent crashes. next slide. a quick recall summary and as you all know we did significant research last summer with global automakers, it was on a number of things. want of which is in terms of awareness, about 85% of the awareness that folks have of the recall comes from communications from the oem and/or from the dealers. we also know that is relationship in terms of certain factors which we call completi completion. the more educated you are, the greater level of completion, the hard income, the greatest completion.
the greater the risk perception the higher the level of responsiveness. the older the age of the car, the less likely somebody is to bring the car in for completion. and the closer to the dealer relationship the more likely somebody is to get that job done. so what do we need? we need, it's not just driver awareness but to find ways to motivate people to comply with the recall. we do mail and e-mail until we're blue in the face. everybody gets a ton of communications at it is very hard to break through. is not unlike a campaign and politics were sent a message is one thing. motivating someone to be it is another thing. it's a very, very tough. we need help and many folks in the other elements of the ecosystem to engage. that's why one of the reasons we are delighted with the fast act provision. the pilot program i think is when they discuss with administrator rosekind. it's a really strong ideas we
think that is worth pursuing. we have reached out to the insurance community because of those folks engage drivers some annually typically. when you go in for a renewal or you go in for a quote, those folks can notify consumers, very focused on the cart the point about open recall and that would be very, very helpfry focused on the cart the point about open recall and that would be very, very helpful. next slide. this is a sample insert. given time i will skip on. next slide. this is what important terms of -- there were 30,000 folks who died in 2014 on the road. that's a tragedy. of those 31,479, accidents had nothing to do with a vehicle. okay? let me find the number. 3.7% were fatalities related to vehicle factors but all
vehicles, motorcycles, atvs, trucks and light duty vehicles, 836, 2.6%, were vehicle factors. and found that roughly two-thirds were accidents related to vehicle maintenance factors. so under 1% of the vehicle related, other factors in 2014 related to the vehicle. the other part down there, it's very hard to see in the lower right, relates to the age of the car. 5% of the fatalities were in cars that were five years or newer. those same, that same proportion of this latest 27%. cars that are older than 10 years represented 75% of the fatalities, and just 46% of the fleet. very direct relationship with the age of the cart. i will skip to the next slide and let's go to that of its of automation will be fast.
so as you talk about the future and shoot as you talk about technology and the tools necessary to drive increased level of safety, there's this question but what happened with automation. is going to be a revolution with autonomy or is it going to be an evolution towards autonomy? the benefits you accrue, accrue immediately. the safety benefits you get from things like automatic braking to the environmental benefits you get from automatic braking, national security reduce the fuel from automatic braking. ..
our members directly employ well over 100,000 americans and still over 40% of all new vehicles purchased in the country. our companies are improving the safety of vehicles on the road today and revolutionizing mobility. automakers are competing furiously and taking the lead to introduce innovative technologies that address and solve problems. i have submitted written testament to which i discuss these matters in more detail. i will highlight two critical policy priorities that will help drive life-saving technologies into the marketplace. at first i would like to update the committee on actions were taken to improve recall completions. the recent tragedy in texas has shown that we must continue to work urgently to reach every aspect of customer and six every single vehicle. since we last met, the committee took decisive action in the fast act to investigate what we think is a very important idea,
addressing recall completions through the vehicle registration process. we requested that appropriators fully fund of the pilot. we have been encouraging states to look at those com and we urged nixon to release the request for proposal to get the process started. the industry is been working hard to complete that the car recalls by securing alternative airbag supply by employing new methods beyond what is required by law to find come inform and encourage owners to bring their vehicles in for repair and participating also in mixes coordinated relief program. the industry is reached out to insurance companies asking for the help in notifying customers about open recalls. ingenuous automakers are joined with the department of transportation to announce the proactive safety principles to under the principles we are working with nhtsa to share best practices to improve we call completion rates and to examine ways to better identify potential safety risks earlier.
together we come to industry, policymakers, regulators and safety advocates, have made substantial progress over the last 50 years but we have much more to do. innovation in the automated and connected vehicle vehicle spaces already producing significant public benefits. they are two critical near-term priorities for federal regulators and policymakers to accelerate innovation and dramatically improve highway safety. first, the federal government needs to take leadership on vehicle automation. federal policymakers have long recognized the public benefit of national motor vehicle safety standards to allow manufacturers to bring the latest advances in safety to consumers in all 50 states. a patchwork of local and state laws almost certainly slow innovation. for instance, what happens when an automated vehicle meets the design criteria for one state but not another? with the vehicle be banned from crossing the statewide?
the federal government working closely with stakeholders must quickly expand its leadership roles to ensure the development of policies that foster rather than inhibit innovation. secondly, the federal government must help accelerate the game changing benefits that will come with connected cars. moving nhtsa's proposed vehicle-to-vehicle rule forward will create an interoperable standard for all cars can to mitigate with each other and the infrastructure to warn drivers that danger not only avoid crashes. act within a decade of research and develop and and significant investment of both the public and private sectors, this technology is being tested on public roads and is ready for widespread deployment. government support must ensure that both the vehicle standard is established and that access to the dedicated spectrum free of harmful interference is maintained with clear rules, innovation will flourish. ..
part of the manufacturers recall file. the current law also requires manufacturers to submit their notification reports to nhtsa's internet web site portal. given that manufacturers already submit quarterly reports electronically to nhtsa, we believe that the process may only involve a modest technical correction to provide stakeholders more timely access to data fields which in turn would allow parties to cross-check with the invenn to stories of recyclers -- inventories of recyclers. nhtsa's implementing language must adopt parts identification methods that embrace information technology resulting in state of the art processing methods based on the relationship between the vin and part numbers. vehicle manufacturers use vin/oe number relationships in their parts ordering systems. out to manufacturing's -- auto
manufacturing's refuse to use this med puts consumers at risk and an entire parts market at a disadvantage. it is no longer a matter of letting manufacturers to decide whether it suits their business model or not. it is a consumer safety concern that anytime that suggestion -- nhtsa must address. lastly, it's important the effect, to effectively address requiring -- [inaudible] as well as new requirements contained in the past act that requires manufacturers to financially remedy the recalled defects going back 15 years. automakers must be required to provide this data back to november 2000 to cover the 10,252 recall campaigns over this time period. it is only through comprehensive access to both original part numbers and recalled parts tied to specific vins that we can come improve recall remedy rates and seek to effectively address the federal recall remedy
requirements for used equipment that were enacted 15 years ago in the tread act. i am thankful for the oversight of this critical issue, and i thank you for the opportunity to speak before you today. >> the chair thanks the gentleman. ms. gillan, you're recognized for five minutes for ab opening statement, please. >> thank you very much. good morning, chairman burgess and members of the subcommittee. i'm jackie gillan, president of advocates for highway and auto safety, insurers working together to save lives by promoting adoption of highway and auto safety laws. i appreciate the opportunity to testify before you this morning. although motor vehicle depths are on the rise, the good news is that we have solutions at hand to reduce the death to injury are toll. there is an unfinished and overdue -- [inaudible] i would like to briefly highlight several needed improvements. the grim statistic about rising deaths comes at a time when
americans are also facing a record number of recalls for vehicle safety defects which has been mentioned repeatedly this morning. the dangers posed by the record high number of recalls are exacerbated by the disturbingly low rate for completing -- by completing repairs. however, the most effective and direct solution can be summed up in one word: prevention. the auto industry must identify safety problems sooner and take corrective action immediately. millions of vehicles are under recall today, about one out of five registered vehicles, because known safety defects were hidden from the public and from nhtsa. now consumers must bear the burden of driving defective vehicles, waiting months for parts and taking time to bring in their vehicles for repairs. other necessary solutions are closing the loophole that permits dealers to sell used
cars under recall, linking vehicle registration with repairing defects and providing nhtsa with authority to immediately stop the manufacturing of defective vehicles. additionally, we commend the increased funding levels adopted in the fast act for nhtsa, but it is still not enough to address the numerous challenges facing the agency. insufficient resources will hamper nhtsa's availability to insure the safety of the car today as well as the safety of the car tomorrow. one of the chronic problems facing nhtsa is timely completion of important rule makings required by congress. and i know there was focus on how well they were doing addressing the fast act requirements. there are many map 21 requirements that are overdue, some by more than a year. these include final rules due in 2014 to improve occupant protection in motor coaches for the roof strength and anti-ejection protection.
in addition, motor coach fires are frequent, often times fatal and yet completely prevention bl. nhtsa has been ignoreing repeatedly ntsb recommendations and their own research about strategies and rules that can be implemented to address fire prevention. and that needs to change. child occupant protection is another top priority. again, nhtsa has delayed producting rule makings required by congress that affect the safety of all of our children. for example, rules requiring seat belt reminders and improving the latch system for proper child restraint installation were due last october. and still haven't been issued. also as you mentioned, chairman burgess, millions of children ride in the backseat are needlessly at risk, but there are solutions available. there is no need for a child to tragically die from hypothermia
when inadvertently left behind in a vehicle or because the seat back fails in a crash and kills or seriously injures a child sitting behind a front seat passenger. it's time for nhtsa to issue rules requiring technology to alert adults to unattended children left in a car and to update the seat back strength standard which was issue in 1963 -- issued in 1967. unfortunately, the fast act did not adopt important safety solutions that are still needed in the safety and vehicle improvement act of 2015. these include removing the cap on civil penalties, upgrading early warning reporting requirements and improving pedestrian safety. advocates also believe the advent of driverless cars in the future holds great promise to advance safety. however, federal oversight, minimum performance standards as well as transparent and verified data are essential in the process. consumers should not be guinea
pigs in this experiment, and nhtsa cannot be a passive spectator. fifty years ago congress passed and president johnson signed into law the national traffic and motor vehicle safety act of 1966 to protect the public against -- and this is quoted from the law -- unreasonable risks of accidents occurring because of the design, construction or performance of motor vehicles. the underlying principles of this prescient 50-year-old law have not changed, but in order for the agency to fulfill its statutory mission, nhtsa needs sufficient resourceses and a strong resolve to use its regulatory and enforcement authorities to protect the public. thank you very much. >> chair thanks the gentlelady, and the chair apologizes, i mispronounced your name, and i had a phonetic spelling in front of me, and i should have done what i knew was correct. >> well, no need to worry. when i was reviewing my statement right before i spent it over, my staff had misspelled
my name, so you're in good company. [laughter] >> ms. wilson, you're recognized for five minutes for your opening statement, please. >> thank you. chairman burgess, my name is ann wilson, i serve as senior vice president of -- [inaudible] this better? manufacturers association. we're good. thank you for the invitation to testify before you today on the implementation of provisions in the fast act. mema represents vehicle suppliers, manufacturer and we manufacture components and systems for use in passenger cars and heavy trucks. our members develop and manufacture original equipment to new vehicles as well as aftermarket parts to service, maintain and repair the over 256 million vehicles that are on the road today. suppliers are the largest employer of manufacturing jobs in the united states, directly employing over 700,000 americans with a total employment impact of 3.6 million jobs. our members lead the way in
developing advanced, transformative technologies that enable safer, smarter and more efficient vehicles all within the rapidly growing global marketplace. ultimately, about two-thirds of the value of today's vehicles comes from suppliers. suppliers work closely with vehicle manufacturers to provide cutting edge, innovative systems and components for new vehicles. today i wanted to focus on the real benefits that advance safety technology can provide to motor vehicle safety. there are many advanced safety features available ranging from pass i to active -- passive to active systems that either warn, aid and/or assist a driver to avoid or mitt gate vehicle crashes -- mitigate vehicle crashes. these combined with decades of improved crashworthiness features provide the opportunity for significant overall reduction of fatalities, injuries and property damage claims in the united states. in 2015 mema and a boston
consulting group explored the safety benefits of some of these systems, known collect live -- collectively as ados. last year we testified that technologies can provide immediate safety benefits and form the pathway to the a partially and fully automated vehicle fleet that could virtually eliminate traffic fatalities. the study found a suite of technologies has the potential to prevent as many as 30% of all crashes, a total of 10,000 lives saved annually. however, relatively few vehicles on the road today have the technologies, and the market penetration is only growing at about 2-5% annually. since driver error is by far the leading factor in mosk crashes -- motor vehicle crashes, the lack of widespread adoption of these technologies in the u.s. is a significant missile opportunity. missed opportunity. cobb recognized -- congress recognized the importance of these technologies.
shortly after passage, as dr. rosekind testified, nhtsa announced system upgrades beginning with model year 2019 vehicles. the purpose of this enhancement is to expand the program beyond crashworthiness by including crash avoidance and mitigation technologies and pedestrian safety. mema commends congress and nhtsa for taking this major stride to enhance and expand the end cap categories and ratings. collaboration between government, vehicle manufacturers, suppliers, safety advocates and oh stakeholders -- other stakeholders is key to the success of the senate we've louse of the -- significant evolution of the program. it has a substantial and direct impact on how automakers and suppliers design future vehicles and plan for emerging technologies. in addition, end cap provides that all-important link of information to the consumer. there are a variety of other tactics that can be utilized by
policymakers in industry to achieve the overarching goal of reducing crashes. we support the volunteer agreement between the automakers and nhtsa to make braking technology standard equipment in almost all light duty vehicles by the year 2022. additionally, we strongly believe another key element is expansion of ados technologies is the development of future regulations with our global counterparts, most notably the european union. these efforts do not equate to a lower standard to safety; rather, a strong are, harmonized system. members are committed to motor vehicle safety as the industry moves forward with increased collaboration with regulators, we believe that nhtsa's use of the program, voluntary agreements and rulemaking has the potential to address many of our current challenges. mema also urges the agency to actively engage in the
harmonization of new regulations because the completion of testing standards and regulations. we applaud this committee's commitment to motor vehicle safety by updating the end cap program and providing greater access to safety technology. i'd be happy to answer any questions. >> the chair thanks the i can'tinglady, and i thank you all for your testimony. we'll now move into the question portion of the hearing, and i would like to yield the first five minutes to the vice chair of the subcommittee, mr. lance, for your questions, please. >> thank you, mr. chairman. good morning and almost afternoon to you all. ms. gillan, i believe i heard you say that fatalities are increasing, is that right? >> yes, they are. >> could you explain that, please? >> nhtsa recently released day showing that comparing the first three quarters of 2014 with the first three quarters of 2015
that there has been over a 9% increase in motor vehicle fatalities. and that increase actually represents one of the largest jumps that we've seen in the last 30-40 years. and so t really significant -- it's really senate, and that's the -- it's really significant, and that's the reason we need to focus on what are those programs and strategies that can help turn that around. >> mr. bainwol, would you like to comment on that? because i'm looking at your chart. >> sure. >> i see it, your chart goes to 2014. >> right. and that's because they're not official numbers yet for '15. and, in fact, but we do know that the advocate number has prisoning, and it's risen -- risen, and it's risen beyond the vehicle miles traveled. so there is a delta there that is disconnected from the amount of travel, and that's very, very concerning. what we don't know is the cause. there are some clues, and we won't really be able to know until the full data set comes out. for instance, is this from motor
vehiclists? is it pedestrians? -- motorcyclists? pedestrians? passengers, drivers? we just don't know. there was a story i saw a couple of weeks ago comparing one state, wisconsin, pedestrian, motorcycles, others, and there was a spike in pedestrian, there was a spike in motorcyclists, but we won't know until the full data set comes out. it is concerning, but i would make one other i think kind of crucial point, and that is if wilied in a zero-defect world, 99% of the fatalities that we're addressing still exist. so the question here is that doesn't mean we shouldn't cope with the 1%. we should get that right. we call policy as vitally important, and we are totally committed to getting it right, but we also have to find a way to deal with the preponderance of the problem, the 99%. and the good news that we've been talking about on this panel that technology brings that possibility. the ability to avoid accidents will save, you know, thousands
of lives. and the faster we can lean forward and immeant that technology -- implement that technology, the off we're going to be -- the better off we're going to be. >> cord your chart in 2034, 1,with 196 as i you said your chart were related to vehicle factors. am i reading that chart accurately? >> correct. factors represents two things. one are defects and one is maintenance. so if you have an improperly inflated tire, that's a maintenance issue and not a defect issue. >> and i'm sure this is still a matter of speculation, but could the increased fatalities as ms. gillan has indicated, and i will ask her as well, could they be based upon factors such as texting, for example? >> so i'll give you an anecdote call response, not a scientific
response, but, yes. every day i drive to work, it takes me about an hour to work, and as i focus on my driving task, i also look to see what the other guy is doing. and i see lots of folks looking down at their phone. to there's no question there's a texting problem both in the car and, ironically, with teds. if you watch people cross streets, more often than not they're -- >> i see a texting problem in the hallways of congress. [laughter] >> not one on this panel. >> no. out involves people a generation younger than you or i who are bumping into me as they are texting and not looking where they're going. ms. gillan, if you would like to respond to my series of -- >> yeah, i very much would like to. we need to really attack this problem both looking at getting the, improving the behavior of the driver. advocates are very active, in fact, we just put out report -- >> yes, ma'am. >> -- on the need for states to
step up and pass texting laws, tougher drunk driving laws -- >> yes. >> however, the other part of the equation is also the issue of driving safer cars. many years the former president of madd said to me, you know, jackie, the best defense against a drunk driver is a safe car. so you really need to attack both. and the problem with all these recalls is, you know, we've seen that people are not taking them in, you're getting two or three notices, and then we have these deaths like this 17-year-old teenager in a low-speed crash. >> thank you, my time is expiring. thank you, mr. chairman. >> chair thanks the gentleman. chair recognizes ms. schakowsky for phi minutes for questions. >> thank you, mr. chairman. ms. gillan, members -- in february, i wanted to preface this question. the center for auto safety filed a lawsuit against d.o.t. alleging the failure to public tsbs on line finish. >> i'm sorry, i'm having a hard
time -- >> okay, let me try again. >> okay. >> all right. in february the center for auto safety filed a lawsuit against the d.o.t. alleging that d.o.t.'s failure to publish technical service bulletins or tsbs online was a violation of map 21. on march 25th d.o.t. issued a federal register notice saying that it would begin posting all t.s.b.s on line. conveniently, started appearing yesterday on d.o.t.'s web site. so here is my question. members of this committee drafted and pushed hard for the tsb publication provision in map 21, and i know this might sound rhetorical, but should it have taken a lawsuit for d.o.t. to start posting that information, and is this a pattern we should worry about? >> yes. and there is an issue, an
example even closer to home, representative schakowsky, and that's rearview cameras. >> okay. >> that is also an issue where finally in 2008 we got legislation passed requiring rearview cameras, they'll become standard equipment in 2018. because of your legislation and your tenacious advocacy and the work that safety groups did, we ended up having to file a lawsuit to finally spring that rule free from omb and the agency. so we're kind of faced with all of these roadblocks, you know? we can't get the agency to issue the rules. aye given examples -- i've given examples in my testimony. then when they are, they delay the deadlines and, finally, we have to resort to litigation. and public interest groups, you know, public citizens handled both those cases for us, but it really is unnecessary for these common sense and important rules
and regulations that consumers want. >> and let me point out in terms of the rear visibility, that law actually passed in 2008, and so finally, in 2018, we will see that standard. but, yeah. so i wanted to ask you, we talked a bit about, quite a bit about recalls. as you said, 2015 was another record-setting year for recalls, more than 51 million vehicles were recalled. again, for ms. gillan, dr. rosekind has said publicly that nhtsa's diligent in pursuing automakers for safety defects is why recalls have gone up. perhaps that is partly the case. some have suggested that because of the recent high profile recalls the industry is more willing to go to recall faster to get ahead of the story.
what, in your view, is causing the rise in recalls, and do you agree with dr. rosekind's assessment? >> well, i think, you know, as i said in my testimony we supported legislation which removed the cap on civil penalties, we supported criminal penalties. i mean, i think that you had gm, takata and vw feeling that they could ignore the law and produce cars that were faced with these defects and pretty much just faced a fine that's a slap on the wrist. it's contributing to the problem. and i think that while, you know, i support what nhtsa's doing in trying to accelerate the consumers repairing their vehicles, i mean, i think that we need a tough cop on the beat. and i think that, you know, we need nhtsa -- a lot of the issues we finally got technical service bulletins published. there's still an issue with that
agency on transparency. i just heard from one of my board members, center for auto safety, that's still trying to get documents out of them. it is still a very difficult and cumbersome process for consumers to get that information. and i will tell you if you look back on those three examples, gm, takata and vw, consumer groups played a big role in exposing those problems. and so, you know, that's the importance of having this information available so that we can also be a check on what's going on. >> and thank you for that. a number of people brought up today in january nhtsa announced a voluntary agreement with 18 automakers called the proactive safety principles. do you expect that agreement to have an effect on recall rates? >> well, i'll make that a short answer,. no because voluntary standards are rife with deficiencies. they are unenforceable. when a consumer goes to the showroom, they don't know whether that car meeting that
standard. they're done in secret without any public input from other stakeholders, and typically they result in the lowest common denominator or industry practice and discourage innovation. >> my time is up, so -- >> okay. >> we'll leave it at that. thank you very much. >> thank you. >> chair thanks the gentle lady. chair recognizes the gentleman from texas, mr. olson, five minutes for questions, please. >> i thank my good friend and our chairman. welcome, witnesses. i do not intend to ask any questions, but i want to deliver a plea from home. on march 31st, two weeks ago today, huma left her high school to head to her home. as she turned onto her street in her neighborhood, she tapped the car in front of her, a minor fender bender. her airbag deployed with an
explosion and sent a small piece of shrapnel the size of this nickel into her neck. she died in her own car with her seat belt till on. she was -- till on. she was 17 years old. here is a photo of the accident scene. i drove to see where huma died for myself. it was so close to my home. ought turns through seven -- eight turns through seven trsk traffic lights and i was there. it was hard to believe a young girl could die right there in such a minor collision. i know that we've made a lot of progress in getting recalled cars in for repair. right now about 70%, we're told.
70%. that's great. but i also know and i worry about another huma being out there. i know that we can't quit at 70%. the only acceptable number is 100% of recalled cars repaired with a defect like that. i wish i could tell you how to achieve this. i can't. but i know that working together we can achieve our goals, and that starts by acting on the plea i promised at the start of my comments. it comes from huma's brother, faison. short video.
[inaudible] that's faisan there, the brother. you can hear my voice, it's working fine, the machine's not working properly right now. [laughter] not saying anything, no comments. that's the airbagging that was deployed. that's the part that was lodged in her neck, right there. about the size of a nickel.
>> that works. >> ca -- ca rot did artery. >> i would just like to urge everyone regardless of whether or not you receive a recall notice, if you have a car that has a defective airbagging, get it fixed before you lose a loved one on it. >> that's our mission, guys. get out there and make sure people know if they drive a vehicle in america, log on to safercar.gov. check out the car online. make sure you don't drive a defective car. if you do, get that car fixed. let's make sure that another huma will never happen again. i yield back. >> chair thanks the gentleman. chair would note that he deferred his questions for other committee members, and i will now yield myself five minutes for questions.
so, okay. given what we've just seen, and i guess this is a question for you, mr. bainwol, perhaps you, many bozzella. i'm going to refer to the slide set that you gave us. and when you look at the, down at the bottom corner with the stuff that was hard to read, the fatality percentage was 75% in cars that were older than ten years, older than 2005. and that's 46% of the fleet. and that's the challenge, because if you look at some of the stuff that mr. rosekind had provided to us, the compliance with recall notices that age set of cars -- that is, older than ten years -- is 5 percent. 15%. so we've got a disconnect there. now, you said something, mr. bainwol or mr. bozzella,,
that really intrigued me because you talked about working with insurance companies. i actually tried to call up my insurance card on my iphone. i couldn't do it, because i forgot my challenge question. that's a separate be issue. [laughter] but your insurance company has your vehicle identification number when you get your renewal on your insurance. and one of you mentioned partnering or of getting insurance companies involved in this and to help with this. there's actually an opportunity. they have the data, and maybe we can talk to mr. rosekind about the larger data sets being able to go through more easily. but that seems like a fix. and i know my insurance company that advertises heavily on tv and says 15 minutes can save you 15% or more, everybody knows that, boy, 15 minutes could save your life or your daughter's life. i mean, that's pretty important stuff. so what can we do to engage our
state dmvs and our insurance companies? there is a way to get this data transferred and get these cars in and fixed, is there not? >> the short answer is, yes. we want to see every car car fixed. we are desperately trying to communicate with car owners to move them to comply with the recall. but we clearly have a problem doing that. and the older the car, the more difficult that challenge is. so what that means is it's an all hands on deck proposition. we're not trying to shift the burden, we're trying to bring other people to the party to help get the job done, and it strikes us that dmv and the insurance world are the touchpoints that consumers engage with. and you talk about the health of the vehicle at that point. and so they are a perfectly natural place to go to augment our efforts. they also have better data. so we have custody of the name when we sell a new car, but oftentimes the car that's 10 or 11 years old has been resold
multiple times, sometimes by private parties, so so the trail goes cold. to the the trail, if hotter, with, the mv and the insurance companies. so we turn to everybody in the ecosystem to say, helm. >> it seems hike there's opportunities there. and when you mentioned an insurance company, that kind of leapt off the page at me, because he was your vin number. it's on your card. you have the card you have to buy, but the state requires you to buy it to drive on their streets. i appreciate the efforts that the automobile manufacturers have made. i know i've seen full-page ads in the that's morning news on several occasions, and i think last summer when dr. rosekind increased the recall notice. i don't doubt that the manufacturers have a very vested interest in getting a defect i car back -- defective car back and getting it fixed. they don't want their customers put at risk, but there are other people as you describe it in the
ecosystem, the insurance company has that vehicle identification number, and it's touched once or twice a year. people go in for an oil change, two or tree times a year. -- three times a year. and then, of course, in my state we have to go get a state inspection and comply with all kinds of things. that is another opportunity. i liked your statement of an every hands, all hands on deck proposition. let me just ask you, because this came up an interview i was doing this morning with one of my local it's stations x -- it's stations, and they said they had a viewer who had received a recall notice and was trying to get her car fixed, and there was no part available. how would you address that viewer? what can we tell her? >> it's a very important question, mr. chairman. and, first, the customer should call the manufacturer. it's very important that the customer call the manufacturer and explain the situation, the vehicle, the vin and listen to
the advice and counsel of the company. that will tell them what the parts availability situation is. the customer should also reach out to the dealer and get additional information about how the dealer is handling parts flow into the dealership and the repair. i think these are really very, very important questions, but you would start very much -- i would start very much with calling the manufacturer and asking what that specific manufacturer's situation is. >> so it's the third or fourth owner. they didn't buy it from a dealer, you know? but they know what the make of the automobile is. so go to a web site and get an 800 number? what are the practical steps that that person, okay, they took it to a garage, they said we'd like to help you, but we can't get that right now, they're on back order. that person should call the concern not the dealer, but the
manufacturer at an 800 number they can found find on the internet at the library if they don't have access to a computer? >> that's correct. they can go to the web site, you'll see many manufacturers have information on the web site specifically related to an open recall. so there is important information both at the web site and on caller assistance lines and consumer assistance lines. and i think this is very important in addition to going to savercar.gov. >> i've gone way over time, but i do want to ask one additional question because we dealt with a problem with an ignition switch a year, year and a half ago, two year ares ago. now, we don't hear about that any longer. is that because the problem has been fixed and even has brought their cars in and gotten the recall taken care of on key that was switching off on the ignition? or what -- why is it that we're not hearing any longer about those defects? are they all done?
are we at 100% compliance? >> i don't know what the actual compliance rate is, but we'll check it and come back to you. >> great. i appreciate that. i'm going to yield back to myself and recognize mr. guthrie from kentucky for phi minutes -- five minutes. >> thank you, mr. chairman, for hosting -- calling this committee. and thank everybody for being here. mr. bainwol, mr. bozell la, could you provide information, an update on the auto i, ac information sharing and analysis center, and how much information sharing is occurring between members, and have any vulnerabilities have been uncovered that were not previously known through the information sharing? >> i'll go first. so the isac is up and running. it was stood up by the end of last year. so the portal's working. there is an exchange of threat information. we have also brought on, begun the process of bringing in suppliers.
nhtsa has been briefed. so we're making progress. we're also involved in a best practices effort where the framework has already been established, and we'll be rolling out more detail by the her -- by the summer. as dr. rosekind mentioned, there's never been a market cyber attack just yet, but we know it's coming, and we're the first industry to get ahead of the curve to establish an isac before an event actually to occurs. >> thanks. anything to add to that? >> so i'll ask another question on that, should cyber vulnerabilities in vehicles be approached differently in terms of the recall response than tradition safety defects found in the motor vehicles? >> it's an important question. when is a vulnerability a defect and when is it not a defect. this is a question that the agency is currently reviewing. it's a conversation that we're
having within the isac discussion among the automoteoff associations -- automotive associations. and it really does speak to why it's so important that we extend the cybersecurity best practices framework that we've already announced and start to build out those cyber best practices. it's critical that we design cybersecurity, right, that we think about it not only think about it, but act on it throughout the design process, the manufacturing process and throughout the ownership process. >> should dealing with cyber issues be treated within the recall system like safety defects? the system we have today, should cyber issues be treated similarly or should there be a separate way to deal with thatsome. >> i think the short answer is it depends on what, it depends be on the circumstances. vulnerability is not by deaf -- by definition a defect. >> right. >> so i think you have to start there, and then the question is,
you know, what is it we're addressing with regard to the systems in the vehicle and perhaps more broadly? but a vulnerability is not itself an indication of a defect. >> say everything's vulnerable to some degree? hope any very limited degree, but everything would be somewhat vulnerable, i guess. >> when you slash the tire on a car, it's a malicious act. we think to some extent that does apply. i think it's also important, dr. rosekind made the point earlier today that the cybersecurity issue requires nimbleness. and one of the topics of discussion -- not to open up a can of worms but to go ahead and maybe go there a bit -- is how do you manage change in a world in which technology and innovation is happening very quickly? what dr. rosekind was saying was regulation does not necessarily work fast enough to deal with the rate of innovation. and so that's a very, very important point and, certainly,
it's true in the cyber case. >> okay. i had a question, quick question. i'm going to turn to proactive safety principles and stick with you two for a second. what is the timing for each of the proactive safety principlesesome and are you or regular companies have meetings with nhtsa to coordinate implementation of the principles? >> we are working as associations to coordinate the process. that coordination is already taking place, and we are in communication with nhtsa right now, as a matter of fact, and at the level of engagement with the administrator directly and then more broadly. >> i'm going to go ahead and go to mrs. wilson. how will the safety principles be in the aftermarket context? >> we've been asked by nhtsa, and we are currently drafting our own principles. we have a thousand members, so it's going to take us locker to review them -- longer to review them. we want to reflect the
responsibility the o to e suppliers have. >> okay. >> we support the principles that were laid out but, obviously, we feel like there's some other initiatives that we think are important -- >> i just have a couple of seconds, mr. wilson, how would it affect -- [inaudible] >> i'd sort of lump us into independent operators within that 300 billion aftermarket space and, again, to make sure that cybersecurity is protected, you have other issues along security issues with vehicles that the amount of folks that are able so to work on those voces very, very limited based on those security concerns. so we've got to find a way to make sure the independent operators out will can work in that space, that they're not blacklisted for working on that. and i think the european union has put in some good language to work on that. >> well, thank you.
the chairman's time now. i don't know if he had a chance, if he wanted to respond? if the chairman allows? >> proceed. >> one thing on the aftermarket cybersecurity -- [inaudible] so the consumer would know when they take a vehicle into the retear -- repair shop -- [inaudible] >> if the chairman allows. >> could i just add one thing? i know that mr. bainwol talked about voluntary standards, and on cybersecurity i think that's a really strong case where we don't want voluntary standards, because voluntary means just that. you don't have to abide by them. and i think as we enter this brave new world of driverless cars and the fear of cybersecurity problems, that that's when we really need an agency like nhtsa setting those
minimum standards so that everybody's playing by the same rules and that consumers can be confident that these are not manager that one automaker decides to abide by and the other ones say, well, t kind of expensive, we don't want to do this. >> thank you. my time is way over, so i appreciate the chairman's indulgence and your answers. >> gentleman's time has expired. seeing no other members wishing to is can questions, chair would inquire of the gentlelady from illinois if she has a concluding question or thought. >> i do not, and i need to go. >> gentlelady needs to go. i do want -- it and came up, mr. bainwol, mr. bozzella, mr. wilson, the all hands on deck nature of this, and we heard the very emotional testimony from mr. olson who has now lost two constituents to an airbag rupture. and it is important. we have a role, you have a role,
perhaps we can end list help from insurance companies -- enlist help from insurance companies and state dmvs. but let me just once again stress moms and dads, brothers and sisters, or you have a role. and this data is easily accessible to you with, lower left hand of your windshield is your vehicle identification number just inside the driver's side door post behind you as you get in and out of the car, safercar.gov, safe with an r car.gov, and you can weary the database. anytime you take your car in for service, you should ask the dealer, have you queried the database. this data will change, it's not static. we heard this morning about another 30,000 cars that have been added for a recall. so the database, you can't just check it the first of the year and be done with wit. you need to check from time to time. perhaps an appropriate interval is when you take your car in for
service. but this has been, obviously, a very important hearing, and i do want to thank all of our witnesses for being here today. before we conclude, i would like to submit the following document ares for the record by unanimous consent: a letter from rma, a letter from pci, a letter to the national automobile dealers' association. pursuant to committee rules, i remind members they have ten business days to submit additional questions for the record. oh, and i forgot, i will have a question dealing with the event data recorders that are in automobiles and as to the ownership of that data, who has title to the that information. this actually came up when we did the uncommanded acceleration hearings several years ago, who owns the data in the electronic data recorders, and i will submit that for the record. i ask the --
>> [inaudible] if i cod request. >> sure. >> i'd like to submit for the record the letter that we received from mrs. houk and -- did you already do -- >> yeah, we did that. >> oh, i'm sorry. >> i ask witnesses to submit responses to written questions by ten days within receipt of the questions. i think we all recognize there's still a lot to do and encourage people to check the nhtsa web site. it is extremely important. with that, the subcommittee is adjourned. thank you. [inaudible conversations]
>> this weekend the c-span cities tour hosted by our comcast cable partners takes you to tuscaloosa, alabama, to explore the history and literary culture of this southern city which is home to the university of alabama. on booktv we'll learn about the history of the university of alabama in the 1960s with earl tillford, author of "turning the tide." the university of alabama in the 1960s. >> what frank rose was trying to do i think above all was to get the university of alabama away from this party school, football school focus and get us heading in a new direction to become a
viable academic institution first in the south and then nationally. and it took a while to do that. first thing he had to do was to hire faculty. only a third of the faculty here had degrees. by 1965 two-thirds had them x that made us competitive. today we have our share of some of the finest faculty in the cup. we also -- in the country. we also are attracting students today that could go to harvard, yale, places like that. in fact, we are, we lead the country in the number of national merit scholars that come here. >> and on american history tv, we'll visit the moundville archaeological side and learn how the native american culture lived from about the 11th through the 15th centuries. >> welcome to moundville archaeological park. in its hayday, moundville was the largestty north of mexico and contains the remains of
about 30 flat-topped principlal mounds. we are standing at mound b, and this is the largest mound in alabama. it contains about 112,000 cubic yards of dirt, and this would have been where the structure for the highest ranking ruler of the highest ranking clan would have been. originally, scientists thought that the mounds were complete hi built by one -- completely built by one basket load of dirt at a time. recent research indicates that the base of the mound and possibly the sides of them were initially built with sod blocks which were then filled in with clay. this would give a lot more stability to the structure as they were building it. we know that periodically after the mound was built it would be capped over with different colors of clay so that if you sliced into the mound, it would resemble a layer cake. >> watch the c-span cities tour saturday at 4 p.m. eastern on
c-span2's booktv and sunday afternoon at 2 on american history tv on c-span3. the c-span cities tour, working with our cable affiliates and visiting cities across the country. this weekend the c-span cities tour, hosted by our comcast cable partners, takes you to tuscaloosa, alabama, to explore the history and hit area culture of this southern city which is home to the university of alabama. on booktv we'll learn about the history of the university of alabama in the 1960s with earl tilford author of "turning the tide: the university of alabama in the 1960s." >> what frank rose was trying to do i think above all was to get the university of alabama away from this party school/football school focus and get us heading in a new direction to become a viable academic institution first in the south, and then
>> we are standing at the largest amount in alabama. it contains about 112,000 to the chart of dirt and this would've been where the structure for the highest ranking member of the highest ranking plan would've been. originally scientists thought that are completely built by one basket load of dirt at a time. recent research indicates that the base of the mound and possibly the sides were initially built with sod blocks which within filled in with clay. this would get a lot more stability to the structure as they were building it. we know that periodically after the mound was built it would be capped over with different colors of clay. if you sliced into the mound it will resemble a layer cake. >> watch the c-span cities to work saturday at 4 p.m. eastern on c-span2's booktv and sundry afternoon on american
history tv on c-span3. that c-span cities to work we do with our cable affiliates and visiting cities across the country. >> booktv is 48 hours of nonfiction books and authors every weekend. here's some programs to watch for this coming weekend. >> we wanted to raise early money and we thought if we gave
him women credited by raising early money, then they could go on and raise the additional money they needed to win. we were like little a little venture capitalist. we're going to go out. in today's terms we were the kickstarter for women. we make the dough rise and we've been doing that ever since. >> go to booktv.org for the complete weekend schedule. [applause] hello, everybody. welcome to the white house. to our a lot of good things about being president. i get a chance to travel all across the country and meet people and see all the amazing things that are being done,
being commander-in-chief of the greatest military the world has ever known and seeing the incredible service of our men and women in uniform, air force one is very cool. [laughter] i don't have to take off my shoes before i get on an airplane. [laughter] but some of the best moments that i've had as president have involved science and our annual science fair. i mean, i have shot a marshmallow out of a cannon directly under lincoln's portrait. i've learned about prototypes from six-year-old girl scouts who built a page-turning machine out of legos for people who might be disabled, there they are.
good to see you guys. i should add, by the way, that i took a picture with them with one of their tiaras on, which i think is still floating around the internet. most importantly, i've just been able to see the unbelievable ingenuity and passion and curiosity and brain power of america's next generation, and all the cool things that they do. i've also, by the way, had a chance to see an alarming number of robots. [laughter] none have caused me any harm up until now. they've startled me a little bit. i understand today that we have a live chicken here, which i'm sure the white house staff i [laughter] thrilled about. but this is fun. more importantly, it speaks to
what makes america the greatest country on earth. i want to publicly thank some of the people who helped make today possible, also because i want you to know who to blame if something explodes. we've got some members of congress in the house who have been highly supportive of all our science and basic research efforts. we've got my science advisor, john holdren, who is here. give john a big round of applause. [applause] we have my chief technology officer megan smith in the house. [applause] we have some guests who are really helping to lift up the importance of science, like, this is not a typical combination, supermodel and super coder karlie kloss is here. [applause] we've got actress and science enthusiast yara shahidi.
there she is. good to see you. [applause] we've got xkcd comic creator randall munroe is here. give him a big round of applause. [applause] we're joined by some of the past participants of our science fairs, including elana simon, who studied her own cancer and started coming up with some cures. i remember meeting you last year. how is harvard going? so far, so good? she was a senior last year, just started. [applause] so this is an eclectic and diverse bunch. but what they all share is this love of science and love of technology, and a belief that our youngest innovators can
change the world. and there's nothing that makes me more hopeful about the future than seeing young people like the ones who are here, and they come from all over the country, they come in all shapes and sizes. all of you are showing the rest of us that it's never too early in life to make a difference. you teach us about the power of reason and logic, and trying things and figuring out whether they work, and if they don't, learning from that and trying something new. and you remind us that, together, through science, we can tackle some of the biggest challenges that we face. whether you're fighting cancer or combatting climate change, feeding the world, writing code that leads to social change, you are sharing in this essential spirit of discovery that america is built on. john holdren helpfully reminded me that today happens to be the 273rd birthday of thomas jefferson.
and thomas jefferson was obviously a pretty good writer. the declaration of independence turned out pretty well. he was a great political thinker and a great president. but he was also a scientist. and that was true of most of our founders, they were children of the enlightenment. they had come of age when all the old dogmas were being challenged. and they had this incredible faith, this belief in the human mind, and our ability to figure stuff out. and whether it was benjamin franklin or thomas jefferson, or all the others who were involved in the founding of our country,
one of the essential elements that is embedded in our constitution and the design of this democracy is this belief that the power of the human brain when applied to the world around us can do amazing, remarkable things. and it also requires, as we're seeing from these outstanding teams, not just constant inquiry, but also strong teamwork and dogged perseverance. and by following the trail of your curiosity wherever it takes you, you are continually adding to this body of knowledge that helps make us a more secure, more prosperous, and more hopeful society. science has always been the hallmark of american progress. it's the key to our economic success. i can't think of a more exciting time for american science than right now, because we are busy reigniting that spirit of innovation to meet so many challenges. just give you a couple examples.
we're on the cusp of a new era of medicine that accounts for people's individual genes. and i've been doing a lot of work with francis collins, the head of nih, around how we take the human genome that we've mapped, in part thanks to the good work of francis and others, so that we are able to not just cure diseases generally, but figure out what exactly do you in your particular body need in order to keep it running well. we're harnessing technology to develop cleaner sources of energy, and save our planet in the process. we're unraveling the mysteries of the human brain, unlocking secrets of the universe. in fact, just last month, commander scott kelly returned from an almost a year-long stay on the international space station. some of you may have read about that. he conducted countless experiments, and he also served as an experiment himself.
his identical twin brother, mark, who is an astronaut, as well, mark stayed home during this entire time that scott was up in the air, and that meant that nasa could study the two of them side by side to gain insights into how a long-term occupation in space changes your body and your operating systems. it turned out, initially, it makes you two inches taller. [laughter] but i saw mark just two weekends ago. apparently, you shrink back really quickly. it makes your head bigger too. [laughter] but i don't know how big. america has also got a selfie-taking rover that's instagramming from mars. the international space station just got its first inflatable habitat for astronauts. spacex, on the commercial, private venture side of space, just landed a returning rocket
on a drone ship in the middle of the ocean. and that's opening up the possibility of reusing our rockets instead of just throwing them away once they have launched. so the progress we're seeing across the board is extraordinary, and it's just the beginning. the rest is going to be up to you, the next generation. somewhere in your generation, maybe in this room, are pioneers who are going to be the first to set their foot on mars, the first humans, anyway. i don't know about other life forms. and i know what you're capable of because i just had a chance to see some of the exhibits, and we had some of the press pool follow. if you were not blown away from some of the young people that we just had a chance to meet, then you had too big of a lunch and you were falling asleep, because if you were paying attention it was unbelievable. we've got maya varma, who is a senior from san jose, california. where is maya? yay, there's maya.
maya is using a low-cost microcontroller, software freely available on the internet, and a smartphone, and she designed a tool that allows people with asthma and other lung diseases to diagnose and monitor their own symptoms. so her goal was to use smartphone technology to make diagnostic tests for all kinds of diseases a lot cheaper. my aspiration is not only to create the next big thing in my field one day, maya says, but also to make it accessible to more than a privileged few in the world. so give maya a big round of applause. [applause] i do have to say, this is just an aside, the only problem with the science fair is it makes me feel a little inadequate. [laughter] because i think back to my high school, and, first of all, i didn't have a field. maya talked about her field. i don't know exactly what my
field of study was at that time, but it wasn't that. [laughter] we also have nine-year-old jacob leggette from baltimore. where is jacob? there you go, in the bowtie. [applause] so jacob loved programming ever since the age of two, when he nearly wiped clean his grandma's computer, which i'm sure she was thrilled with. but don't worry, jacob fixed it. last summer, this young maker wrote to a company that manufactures 3d printers, asked them if he could have one of the 3d printers in exchange for feedback on whether their printers are kid-friendly. so clearly he's a good negotiator and business person. [laughter] and today, jacob is churning out toys and games for himself and his little sister, and he dreams one day of making artificial organs for people. i should add, by the way, jacob, john, had a very good idea,
which is that we should have, in addition to our pcast, which is my science advisory group, all these scientists and leaders in various fields, we should have a kid's advisory group that starts explaining to us what's interesting to them and what's working, and could help us shape advances in s.t.e.m. education. anyway, that was jacob's idea. so way to go, jacob. we're going to follow up on that. give jacob a round of applause. [applause] we have 16-year-old anarudh ganesan. where is anarudh? there he is, right there. [applause] so when anarudh was little, his grandparents walked him 10 miles to a remote clinic in his native india for vaccinations, only to find out that the vaccines had spoiled in the heat.
though he eventually got the shots that he needed, he thought, well, this is a problem, and wanted to prevent other children from facing the same risk. so he developed what he calls the vaxxwagon, and it's a refrigerator on wheels that transports vaccines to remote destinations. that's the kind of innovation and compassion that we're seeing from so many of these young people. so give anarudh a big round of applause. [applause] and we have olivia hallisey, a high school senior from greenwich, connecticut. where is olivia? there she is. hi, olivia. now, think about this, so olivia swept the google science fair. she read about the ebola epidemic in the news. she decides, i want to make a faster, less-expensive test for
the disease, as opposed to a lot of adults who were just thinking, how do i avoid getting ebola? she decides, well, i'm going to fix this. so she wants a faster, less-expensive test. an old test cost $1,000, took up to 12 hours to conduct. using silk as a base instead, olivia made the test cost $5, without requiring refrigeration, with results that are available in under 30 minutes. what were you doing in high school? [laughter] give olivia a big round of applause. [applause] so this is just a small sample of the incredible talent that is on display at this science fair. and we couldn't be prouder. to all the students, to all the young people, we could not be prouder of you.
i want to thank the parents and the teachers and mentors who stood behind these young people, encouraged them to pursue their dreams. i asked all the young people who i had a chance to meet, how did you get interested in this? and there were a couple whose parents were in the sciences, but for the majority of them, there was a teacher, a mentor, a program, something that just got them hooked. and it's a reminder that science is not something that is out of reach, it's not just for the few, it's for the many, as long as it's something that we're weaving into our curriculum and it's something that we're valuing as a society. and so i hope that every company and every college and every community and every parent and every teacher joins us in encouraging this next generation of students to actively engage and pursue science and push the boundaries of what's possible. we've got to give all of our
young people the tools that they need to explore and discover, and to dig their hands in stuff, and experiment, and invent, and uncover something new, and try things, and see hypotheses or experiments fail, and then learn how to extract some knowledge from things that didn't work as well as things that worked. that's another theme that came out of a lot of the conversations i had with young people. and that's why we're building on our efforts to bring hands-on computer science learning, for example, to all students. as i've said before, in the new economy, computer science isn't optional, it's a basic skill, along with the three r's. so we're issuing new guidance to school districts for how they can better support computer science education. oracle will invest in getting 125,000 more students into computer science classes. give oracle a big round of applause for that. we appreciate that.
[applause] we've got more than 500 schools that are committing to expand access to computer science. and this is just a sample of the things that we've been putting together over the last several years to try to expand opportunity for the kind of brilliant work that's being done by these students. and we're seeing entire states take action. for example, last month, rhode island got on a path to bring computer science to every school within two years. so we're going to build on this progress. we want to make sure every single one of our students, no matter where they're from, what income their parents bring in, regardless of their backgrounds, we want to make sure that they've got access to hands-on science, technology, engineering, and math education that's going to set them up for success and keep our nation competitive in the 21st century. that includes, by the way, working through some of the structural biases that exist in
science. some of them, a lot of them are unconscious. but the fact is, is that we've got to get more of our young women and minorities into science and technology, engineering and math, and computer science. i've been really pleased to see the number of young women who have gotten more and more involved in our science fairs over the course of these last several years. and as i said to a group that i had a chance to meet with outside, we're not going to succeed if we got half the team on the bench, especially when it's the smarter half of the team. [laughter] our diversity is a strength. and we've got to leverage all of our talent in order to make ourselves as creative and solve as many problems as we can be. and one of the things i find so inspiring about these young thinkers and makers is that they look at all these seemingly intractable problems as something that we can solve. there is a confidence when you
are pursuing science. they don't consider age a barrier. they don't think, well, that's just the way things are. they're not afraid to try things and ask tough questions. and above all, what we've seen today is that they feel an obligation to use their gifts to do something not just for themselves but for other people as well. olivia said after she was working on this ebola diagnostic tool, my generation has been raised with an awareness that we're part of a global community. it's everybody's responsibility to take a proactive approach and think of solutions. she is right. i want you to call up congress and tell them you're thinking on that. that was just a joke. [laughter] maybe not. but it's all up to us to work
together with our youngest talent leading the way. a century ago, albert einstein predicted the existence of gravitational waves. this year, a team of scientists finally proved him right. this was very cool, by the way. i don't know, those of you guys who had a chance to read about this, the way they measured it was the building got a little longer. the building that, from which they were measuring this gravitational wave grew, like, a little bit. [laughter] and then it kind of shrank back, which is really weird and really interesting. and that's the thing about science, you don't always cross the finish line yourself. you may have a hypothesis, a theory, and then people build off of it, and it's like you're running a race and you're
passing a baton. everything that we're working with today is based on some young person like you 10 years ago, 50 years ago, 100 or 300 years ago, who were asking themselves the same question. and while even einstein didn't see all the fruits of his labor, because he went as far as his curiosity and hard work would take him, generations of scientists continue to build on his progress. so that's what we're going to need from all of you. we are counting on all of you to help build a brighter future, and for you to use your talents to help your communities and your country and the world. we will be with you every step of the way. and i will be keenly following your progress so that when you invent some cancer cure or find some new source of cheap, clean
energy, i will take some of the credit. [laughter] i'll say, if it hadn't been for the white house science fair, who knows what might have happened, even though it won't really be my credit to take. so i'm just teasing, guys. thank you very much, everybody. proud of you. good job. [applause] >> you guys don't have to be quiet from here on out. good to see you again. thank you. proud of you. thank you. good to see you. thank you.
highlights problems facing the american taxpayer. today is april 15, the day when federal tax returns are normally do. this is also emancipation day, washington, d.c., holiday. so federal taxes are due this year on monday, april 18. you see hearing members coming in, taking the place. the house is also in session and first votes expected today to come in the bottom half of the 10:00 hour. you are watching live coverage on c-span2. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations]
[inaudible conversations] >> gthe subcommittee on covert operations will come at order and without objection the chairs authorized to declare a recess at any time. i want to thank you both for coming. we have a few other things that are going on so we will have members coming in and out your we are here today to examine the taxpayer advocates 2015 annual report. the taxpayer advocate is a
statutorily required, statutorily required to provide report to congress and is also identified 20 of the most serious problems facing the american taxpayer. so i look forward hearing from my friend nina olson, the taxpayer advocate about how to better serve the american taxpayers by overcoming these problems. on a personal note, just say thank you, ms. olson, for coming to western north carolina to advocate o on behalf of the tax, en route to the concerns of so many. it was very refreshing, well received and it just shows you're going to extra mile to get that input. i would also like to thank you for your dedication to work come working to protect the american taxpayer. this was on full display when you came to my district for the town hall but it was also interesting to see the other information that was helpful to understand about tax administration. as far as the issues annual
report, i'd like to note as we look to spend considerable time discussing the future state plan that is currently being developed by the irs. this plan will lead to a greater electronic tax administration, and online service for the irs. we obviously have a witness here for my home state of, from greensboro, north carolina, to talk of those issues. this is an positive and a important for the american taxpayer. however, long want to make sure we have the responsibility -- we want to make sure these are done in a safe, secure manner that protects the information and rights of the taxpayer. so i would welcome comments at the taxpayer advocate on this topic, as well as yours, mr. buttonow, the chairman of electronic tax administration advisory committee. your expertise in the area of
tax administration will provide a child inside as congress conducts the oversight of the irs future state plan. the taxpayer advocate report also discusses troubling trends, in two important areas, improper payments of the earned income tax credit, the difficulties administering the affordable care act. that eitc as one of the largest and most important tax credits available to low income and most important tax credits available to low income taxpayers, and the taxpayer advocate reports that note an estimated 27%, that's right, 20 some% of the 65 billion in eitc claims result in improper payments. this is roughly $17.5 billion. and potentially a massive waste. we will look forward to hearing more from the taxpayer advocate about what is being done to reduce the improper payments with regards to the eitc payment program. regarding the aca, the irs has
seen massive overpayments by individuals of individual mandate penalty fee. last year approximately 412,000 taxpayers overpay by an average of $123 per return. the irs needs to the taxpayers understand precisely what is there penalty for payments under the aca. the taxpayer advocate also noted that the businesses face a complicated calculation to establish their obligations to pay the employer share of responsibly payment under the aca. we have heard from constituents in my district as it relates to that complex issue as well. the irs has not issued any clear guidance to help them calculate that payment obligation. furthermore, the taxpayer advocate reports that the irs is poised, who will handle the complex cases lack the
specialized training needed to do their job effectively. so in short the aca has imposed a burdensome requirement on the american taxpayer but the irs is not doing enough to help the public understand and comply with the law. i look for to hearing from both of our witnesses today, at want to thank each of you for coming. i one of recognize the ranking member providing an opening statement instead of mr. connolly. so she is now recognized for her opening statement. tatement. >> thank you very much, mr. chairman. good morning to you. thank you so much for being here with us. i first want to thank ms. olson, mr. buttonow, for the work they do and for being here today. i sincerely believe that the work that you both do on behalf of taxpayers and congress is vitally important.
especially this time of year when millions are filing their taxes and you know, frustrating. i personally, i think i have little stomach extra this time of year. what about you? i care for my constituents and i know ms. olson, here from people all over the country who find themselves this time of year frustrated as stress but i appreciate the forum's given evn holding around the country listening to stakeholders and taxpayers alike so they can learn what their concerns are and how they can look for solutions. that's fantook for solutions. that's fantastic. many of these frustrations temperament a difficult time getting through to a person after i read. whether it's a long wait time for calls or not having a tight answer at all. unfortunately, this less than robust service is not unexpected. when congress slashes the inflation adjusted budget of the irs by $1.2 billion, you do not
know what can happen to taxpayers service. the addresses in report stating, the national taxpayer advocate has been recommended against significant reductions in the irs is budget because reductions of this magnitude harm taxpayers. because of the budget cuts congress @taxpayers. because of the budget cuts congress has imposed the irs has cut staffing and now has 13,000 fewer full-time permanent employees. because of the budget cuts, irs is i.t. systems are totally obsolete. some of the systems date back, i thought this was a typo what i saw but it says the kennedy administration. these systems are so old that young i.t. professionals and recent college graduates out what they do not know how to work on them. the irs cannot find people who can code in olde all the languas that run these systems. this is absolutely
unsustainable. the i a s. has outlined its plan to modernize its i.t. system, create efficiencies through online taxpayer accounts. congress needs to fund this initiative so we can reverse this trend by degrading taxpayers services, because of the cuts we have made. congress approved 290 million in additional funding for fiscal year 2016. which was a step in the right direction but we need to make strides, not mere steps. online customer service is not a one size fits all solution for the country. that are millions of taxpayers who do not have access to or feel comfortable doing financial transactions online steal. the irs needs to take this into account the ms. olson, i just didn't have some concerns about this plan and i look forward to hearing from you today, and irs needs to take these concerns into account when looking for. the irs needs to be transparent
and to engage with taxpayers and congress as they develop the future state initiatives. he also raised an excellent point when you state and i quote, in this apartment of more work and inadequate funding, it is easy to bash the irs. this bashing can produce a patent held in the irs that makes aware of sharing things that the public until they're absolutely finalized. but that means the irs will certainly miss things and get things wrong because it has not engage the public and bloated proposals publicly before they become set in stone. he also recommend congress to assert our oversight authority and insist the irs comes sooner rather than later to explain the specifics of the future state initiative. you also state and going to quote you again, it is important that these hearings be kept separate from the hearings
congress has conducted in recent years over actual or perceived irs shortcomings. letting us see their plans and initiatives ever thoughts on moving forward, not just having hearings about what specifically they are doing. i feel like you're speaking directly to this committee, were you not? i call on my republican colleagues to heed this advice and to bury the hatchet so that we can work together to improve taxpayers services for all of our constituents. thank you very much. >> i thank the gentlewoman for her comments, and want to follow up just very briefly of that. it's very easy when we start to look at problems in the federal government to paint with a very broad brush, all federal employees. i've had opportunity, ms. olson. you know had opportunity to visit some of employers at the irs. it's part of a longer process we are not going to revisit them here but throughout the country
as you and i have discussed. so i want for the record today for all those irs employees to know that the vast majority of them want to serve the american taxpayer, not on in a professional manner but in one that is indicative of customer service that wld be highlighted in the best of the private sector. so my hat is off to the hundreds of thousands of federal workers who each day show out. i'm committed in a bipartisan way to make sure that we address the real problems and focus in on fat. and that's the reason for this hearing today. and yet at the same time, applaud those who day in day out show up to work very diligently on behalf of the american taxpayer. so i would like to say the we will hold the record open for five legislative days for any member who would like to submit a written statement. i will not recognize our panel
of witnesses. i'm pleased to welcome ms. nina olson, a national taxpayer advocate at the internal revenue service. and mr. james buttonow, chairman of electronic tax administration advisory committee at the internal revenue service. welcome to you both. pursue to committee rules all witnesses will be sworn in before they testify. i would ask you to please rise in racial right hand. [witnesses were sworn in] -- and raise your right hand. >> thank you. but the record reflect that the witness answered in the affirmative. you may be seated. in order to allow time for discussion, questions, we would ask you limit your oral testimony to five minutes but your anti-written statement will be made part of the record. so i would like to recognize you, ms. olson, for five minutes. >> chairman meadows, ranking member plaskett, and
distinguished members of this subcommittee, thank you for holding today's hearing of the national taxpayer advocates 2015 annual report to congress. in the report identified iran's future state plan as the number one most serious problem for taxpayers, and i will focus on that issue in my testimony today. i will start with a simple but foundational question. what is taxation about? to my mind, taxation involves taking money from one person and applying that taking to the greater good of many, if not all. that is an extraordinary thing to ask the people. a tax system depends on taxpayers being willing to offer up their hard earned or saved dollars and let the money be applied to everyone or someone else's benefit. so the central question in tax administration is, how do we promote that willingness? what does the tax administrator need to do to maintain and expand taxpayers willingness to pay their taxes? the answers to these questions
should try both the current and future state of the irs. taxpayers are experiencing many problems today because the irs lacks adequate resources to assist them. since fiscal year 2010, we estimate the irs is the budget has been reduced by about 19% on an inflation adjusted basis. that is a huge reduction for any organization, particularly one as labor-intensive as the irs. this year congress has given to iran's an additional 290 million which is very helpful and i'm hopeful congress will continue to provide additional funding in the coming years to ensure our nation taxpayers receive the assistance they deserve. budget constraints have greatly influenced the irs future state plan that envisions how the agency will operate in five years and beyond. eight central component of the plan is to gratian of and reliance on online taxpayer accounts. the irs believes online accounts will produce significant cost
savings and enable it to substantially reduce its expenditure for telephone and in person assistance. the crux of my disagreement with the irs boils down to whether taxpayers will ultimately use online accounts as a substitute for personal service or whether taxpayers will use online accounts as a supplement to, for personal service. what i've long advocated that the irs offer online account access to taxpayers, i believe the irs is wrong in assuming online accounts will substantially reduce taxpayer demand for telephone and face-to-face assistance for many reasons including that millions do not have internet access, millions with internet access to enough for comfortable trying to resolve important financial matters over the internet, particularly in the face of massive security breaches on online government systems. and many taxpayers are not cookie-cutter. required a degree of back and forth discussion that is better
suited for conversation, at that taxpayers will insist upon, therefore it is critical the irs not develop future plans based on assumed cost savings that may not materialize. the irs likes to say it needs to provide the same type of service to financial institutions provide to their customers. the results of the most recent annual survey conducted by the board of governors of the federal reserve system show that come at a quote, while mobile banking users are utilizing technological platforms at a high rate and on a consistent basis, they have also maintained connections to their banks through the more traditional branch and atm channel, end quote. yet despite this evidence of consumer behavior in the financial sector, for several years the irs has been reducing face-to-face taxpayer service options and -- at at has decided to to an appointment only system at all of its tax by the end of
2016. attacks which were printed known as walk inside will no longer accept walking taxpayers get and irs is conducting a pilot under which it will not even accept tax payments from walking taxpayers. in short,, the irs of failing to meet the needs that many walking taxpayers for personal assistance. and i find the notion of decline to accept tax payments from walking taxpayers inexplicable and battling for a tax collection agency. the results of the appointment only pilot show 20% of the taxpayers had to wait between 13 and 41 days to update an appointment, and 5% had with more than 41 days for an appointment. in my written testimony i described how taxpayers to arrive at up to nine without an of them are being treated i'm also concerned if taxpayers give up and stop going to the tacs because i'm not provide adequate assistance, the irs would use the date of declining usage is
to justify further reductions in in person service. for many years and in many areas the irs has made more services more difficult to use, if empowered the declining usage of that service as a basis to cut the service further and to eliminate it entirely. to me, that's disingenuous. i believe the irs much, the future state must adopt as its north star the needs of the vast majority of taxpayers who were willing to comply with the laws. i used the word willingly to liberally because it includes taxpayers who may not now be in compliance. these are taxpayers who want to comply but for one reason or another are not able to. my point here is that rather than designing tax administration about the small minority of taxpayers who were to liberally debating payment of tax we should decide our rules and procedures to make it easier
and clearer for the willing taxpayers to comply. in my opinion, any future state plan will fail unless the irs changes its focus to prioritize taxpayer assistance and does a better job of listening to taxpayers and the representative about what it takes to maintain and enhance voluntary compliance. thank you and i'll be glad to answer any questions. >> thank you, ms. olson. star but now, you are recognized for five minutes. [inaudible] >> if you push the red button right in front of you. or else it will be read once you push it spirit thanks to the subcommittee for holding today's hearing on the national taxpayer advocate's 2015 annual report to congress. taxpayer advocate at our office were critical the rights of all taxpayers and the improvement of tax administration. each year the taxpayers best friend nina olson and her team take a productive approach to reducing taxpayer burden while increasing overall voluntary compliance.
the irs electronic tax administration advisory committee was formed by law in 1998 to make strategic recommendations to congress on how to improve overall tax administration through electronic means. in short, we are objective outside digital strategy consultants to the irs. in the past few years etaac has been focused on two big challenges in text message today. first, the proliferation of tax identity theft. and second, the inadequate levels of taxpayer service at the irs cause by an antiquated customer service model. the committee believes the key solution to both of these problems is a more innovative digitally enabled irs. much of this is outlined in the irs future state initiative. to address the urgent problem of tax identity theft, the irs commissioner has will execute a summit which is a coalition of state and industry leaders. etaac up lots of this collaboration within industry,
and for the irs working together with this important group to find solutions. authenticating taxpayer identities is absolutely foundational to a digitally enabled irs. the securities of summit is working toward some innovation solutions to this challenge. today i'm going to focus on the future state of taxpayer service at the irs. first let's take a look at where we are today. for most taxpayers interacting with the irs, it's not quit, it's not easy and it's mostly done by paper and foam. most taxpayers have no idea about their tax information or their status as the irs. when they do it interact with the irs they are often created with long wait times and extended answer periods. these are big problems, especially for the 43% of taxpayers who have to interact with the irs outside of filing a tax return. the irs current state, and to history quite frankly, could leave us feeling quite pessimistic about the near-term
possibility of modernizing taxpayer service. but the irs is committed to digitally enabled taxpayer service model with its future state initiative. the irs future state vision aligns with etaac's vision of how taxpayers should be served either tax administrator. an ideal taxpayer experienced the loss taxpayers to fully understand their tax obligations, have transparent access to their tax information ion and status to the irs, and allows the taxpayers to effectively and securely interact with a tax administrator in the way that they want to be serve. these are big statements but they are not revolutionary but, in fact, the future state mayors the customer service experience that most financial institutions and many other companies already provide. so what will the future state mean for taxpayers? first, putting transparency when there's hardly any today. taxpayers will get information