tv Book Discussion on Eruption CSPAN August 18, 2016 12:56am-1:46am EDT
i wanted to interview him again. i was at cornell at the life magazine on the cover some people said i knew where on the other side of the equation trying to get the black students out of the hole where they had taken over and were heavily armed.d. last night i was talking to someone in new england and i don't know as a precursor to tonight we were both talking about how we went certain b b directions and i talked about how i used an image of the daily
sun with those guys walking out coming out of that and they noted the producer of law andof order now but at that time kind of a radical. so i was just wondering how that and the studies fit into your narrative. >> definitely i didn't have to cornell because it happened a little bit before. but i interviewed panthert i inv members who kind of didn't really buy in. i interviewed the member of sncc. i tried to interview erica huggins who was part of the new haven nine and so she was
fascinating. i tried to weave that into the story, and of course all of these are their own stories. part of what i try to do, the sense that i got is everyone had their niche experience but at the same time, so many other resolutions and movements were going on at the same time. so, by sticking to the chronology, i tried to leave in the different stories together. i have a chapter on the feminist movement that also started in 1970 and grew out of the movement and robert morgan was kind of their early spokesman for women. so, i wanted to show the kind of global reach of this great refusal that was going on. gre
and i couldn't go back deep and do the environmental movement. within april of 1970. so that felt like another book.l but it definitely grew back to the land movement and it was also in reaction to a lot of the ugliness of the antiwar movement and the violence on the street so people were just changing their lives personally and that was their political payment in a way. >> thank you for that remarkable achievement. not to get into too much detail, but i was a member and i joined in delaware as a high school student.
went to new york and killed in the townhouse explosion was by doctor. it was an amazing honor to be able to say that. it just happens the medical committee for human rights in chicago was having a meeting to plan to decide to have a cold medical presence in chicago tha was being organized and fred hampton showed up and tried to
persuade them and waswa charismatic and obviously still had a lot of wealth for the weatherman. >> so the irony is they didn't want them to get militants. they realized it was a dead end. but they were doing it in a way to defend the panthers. >> without going into this whole story, it's led to the weatherman and joining people that went to chicago on the other side of town not dramatic stuff downtown trashing that thn rally where fred hampton also spoke. >> i showed interview you for the buck. i want to ask about a couple dimensions to the police and the government repression.
one had to do with sds is crucial to the fracturing of the movement. and i've always wondered why done a little bit of anecdotal research but were you able to come up with much in the summer of 69 which then led to weatherman. we took over a building after kent state and demanded that they put up the bail and people had taken over a computer and said to the university something
is going to happen to thee computer and the timing was to coincide down to what became the so-called hardhat violence. there has now been released a million documents in new yorkeie city that rediscovered a million documents from this period of the activities in new york to be details about the hardhat protest. where is the working class and all of this? were they just hardhat stuff he did the protesters or was this manipulated and was there ate strong working class element ine the movement that we don't know as much about as maybe we should?
>> i didn't delve into the finding out what the fbi but there's a lot of new documentsem coming out. it's all based on the documentation that will reveal this documentation and that may also have information defeat --s one thing i do know is the people i talked to were getting pamphlets from the black panthers that were complete but they were sleeping with the panthers and that was obviously jammed up and a lot of the behavior was clearly classic, disruptive and not that many people penetrated big penetrated
sds. and i'm sure the rest of the multiple disruptors of that.ha >> we know the rebellion was the construction worker who just beat to a pulp while the police just watched.nf one of them apparently john lindsay had ordered all of the new york city flags to be at half past after kent state and i interviewed a police man in madison wisconsin, the most violent of all the campuses apparently. worse than berkeley and cornell and columbia.
he told me that after kent state, he and all his colleagues said we've got four and you've got a zero. so that gives you the sense he wasn't necessarily no either was bill bryson, but they were veryh much against the behavior. okay, one more. >> it's important that it took very little to provoke the fbi. i was a tax resistor and i was just a nobody. i close my bank account andel wrote a letter to the telephone companies.a woman, m
a object or felt there wasn't quite as much as a woman couldmn do a book that provoked visits from the fbi. that tiny little thing from a nobody meant that my landlord was visited, and my father who was a republican had this tax audit so it didn't take much and they were all over the place.ce. >> j. edgar hoover was in power under six presidents. it was his own secret police.
three years after supreme court ruling overturned part of the voting rights act, courts around the country struck down a number of state laws saying they discriminate against specific groups of voters. saturday night the sheer spotlight looks at the voting rights and then back to the 2016 election. we will feature part of the supreme court oral arguments in shelby versus holder. members of congress looked at whether to restore the voting rights act. plus a discussion on whether the act is necessary. here's what the presidential candidates have to say. what is happening is a sweeping effort to disempower and disenfranchised people of color, poor people young people from
library of historical society in hudson ohio. [inaudible conversations] good evening.ve welcome to the hudson library historical society. we are happy that you are here for this event. i'm one of the reference librarian. tonight we are honored to welcome how worded to discussni his new book, 76 shots, kent state and the end of american innocence. at the main campus where the shooting in 1970 took place going 10 miles from here, we are
excited to have this program of national and local interests. mr. means as a biographer and editor of the washingtonian. he's the author and co-author of ten books and some of the other works include the avenger takes his place, and drew johnson and the 45 days that changed the nation. the man, the mess an myth and te american story and he also wrote the first biography on colinon l powell. please welcome mr. means. [applause] i also wrote 67 shots. [laughter] i'm going to talk about that tonight instead of 76.nd thank you, amanda who herself is also a very accomplished novelist. she should be giving this talk
instead of me but i talked to a number of people here have 1970. can you hear me back there? stand up, raise your hand, let me see you. okay. this is scary. this is really scary. [laughter] jerry was a great help to me putting together contacts. over 55 i think it is at kent state. i'm going to start this talk with a slideshow, with the background noise was and so people who were not at kent
state can envision what the situation looks like. to say that begins april 30, 1970. evening richard nixon addresses and two weeks earlier announced as going to be a drawdown in vietnam with 150,000 troops april 30 he announces instead of the war is going to be expanded to cambodia. since it was already in cambodia if shocked the nation and nixon expected to blowback on the campuses and he got it. not very dramatically at kent state. right there is but he talked abouwhat he talkedabout and thaf cambodia is closer to saigon banned baltimore is to washington.
it's a very strange talk actually. he got around the desk and walked over and sat back down. just very strange looking.ba at kent state the next day, friday, may 1, there were twotwo demonstrations.. there is a second demonstration about two hours later. they look to be tame so they honor a previous commitment and go off to mason city iowa for a college testing group of which
he is the board's chairman. however things fall apart. here's what it looked like on the streets at about 11:30 atni night. it's the first string. can this day. he told me that earlier. also, for those of you here but remember, they sold 32 beer. i don't know about you but i drink a lot of this beer and there were -- was a bar owner's dream because you had to drink twice as much beer and you felt bloated by the time you got there. so there were a lot of factors involved.d. but around a little before midnight, there were some kids that came out and lit a fire in the street. they start stopping cars, talking about vietnam. the eventually breaks down water street and throw some rocks doww and other things.
the mayor about this time declared that the bars have to be closed. so, now you've got all these kids coming out of the bar. they've been drinking. a lot of them were there to watch bands. college campuses, the headliners go on at about midnight and they closed ofwhenthey closed the ba. a lot of them are there to see this band perform. one of the most prolific scorers in nba history as you may know. [laughter] that is will chamberlain and it was game number four of the nba title series. mind you this was game number four and not the quarterfinals. this won't be held until i don't know, august sometime. will chamberlain, jerry west, willis reed. they start on the west coast at midnight and they closed the bar down the street. okay so ugliness ensues.
the other problem is they've already been cracked by the times and by the fbi to assume the worst of any demonstration. one of the reasons was to spam. anybody recognize him, jerry hi? rubin. he had a talk two weeks before any talk sanctioned by the university. onuniversity. one of the things hesa said wase was a street theater. founded at the youth party and he was street theater and he said in order to start the revolution you must first kill your parents. now, he told me that the next day i was speakingspeaking metaphorically. no, he meant it, you have to kill your parents. understandably, this set up the residence somewhat but a bunch
of kids were counseled to tell parents. kill parents. so you have all that. he goes around after he gets everybody off the street he has to make $50,000 with the damage and it turns out to be 10,000 or 5,000 depending on the revised estimate of the chamber of commerce estimates which is lower. nonetheless in the wee hours of the morning i forget it was 1:3a 2:00 he calls the office and says there had been trouble in the streets and students were involved in and he makes his first inquiry about bringing the national guard. to the best of my knowledge and anybody's knowledge, the presence on the street friday night if it existed at all it was minimal. some of you would never occur in student activities i asked him about it and he said i felt like when i looked at the photographs it had nothing to do with the
campus and when i looked at it there were students we justwerel didn't know who they were. i said how many people were involved and they said i wouldn't argue if you set a zero.ul so any rate, it's now in the governor's office that he is coming in. anybody know who that is with sean connery? claudine, she was ms. france in for a darn good reason if i am concerned.fa [laughter] so, saturday they closed the bars, the kids can't go because they are restricted to campus, so the university does a great job. they bring in movies to show in dormitories and forget about one thing though. they don't protect the rotc building. if one thing was predictable
saturday night, they were going to come under assault. there was a sign on friday with demonstrations going on and still standing. those of you that lived in thatt time at the campus nationwide it was the most ready symbol of the military power on the campuses.e the administration leaves the building unprotected and whenn they find that the sky is lit up and read, that's what it looksle like. it looked like it was lit on fire. so this is the first time it comes onto th on to the campus. that's what they see. this is what it looks like looking east and this is the building looking south and this is an important shot by the way because it set the stage for monday. that is the comments behind the building and the hall where the students would eventually run up the side. this is a prime piece of real
estate in every academic department as far as kent state wanted a piece of property that is one reason nobody dissented the building. why tway to campus police put ae was burned down basically and didn't help the fire department when they came out and people started attacking with hoses because this was prime real estate. but the problem is if you let e people burn down a building but do they do, they take it as a green light okay sign. we are not going to do anything. it was a terrible message toss send to the students. so, this is saturday. i'm sorry, sunday may 3. jim rhodes had been at a debate the night before with robertre taft junior, the republican senatorial primary rose by the pool on friday trailing by 70,000 votes. the primary is on tuesday the
next day. he comes to town and this is the chance for him to energize theto base. he has a press conference hereg they are worse than knight rider and he says memorably we are no longer going to treat them wesi are going to eradicate the problem. extremely provocative and irresponsible language, but hele could see i will give this away he loses by 5,000 votes on tuesday.00 he closes with 65,000 on the 75,000 margin before the shootings. here's what the campus looks like on sunday. i like this shot. and i love this one because you have this sort of campus scene in the 1960s and 1970s and then you have to honor the
guardsmen. but everything looks kind and altogether this is a little more questionable. but there's a lot of that going on. and then it all falls apart again. they matched and one the march on the town and that's the situation. this is how sunday night ends except this. these are the scenes of equipment into the kind of equipment the guard brought with them. so you have a campus entities personnel carriers and eight of these light and medium helicopters and of course
remember that side of the helicopter. they are chasing people but the dormitories and when it's not ai confrontation about vietnam anymore. when you talk to person afteral person after person they say the same things it was us against w the guard. there's the speech therapy building if anybody can confirm that i think that's what it is. everybody knows there's going tn be a confrontation. professors were talking abou abt against about itin scribble on s
everybody knows it's going to happen. this is the whole end of it and that the close-up. he is 24 minutes to live at this point. that is the guard and what are they holding, and ones. there couldn't be a worse weapon to do crowd control with. there had been military duty. it's lethal to half a mile. if you line 250 people up at 250 yards out, the round will pass through all three and if you hit the engine block was that it will move the engineou block and let them sit inside of the car. they have an incredible speed and power. it's a terrifying instrument.
all you can do for the crowd control is wha let people get co enough to you to stab, slice them more blow holes in them. when i look back at this i spend months and months thinking about this and images from 1965, birmingham alabama you will remember them doing crowd control in the streets ofl in birmingham with enriched grossee pic absolutely humanitarianhumaa crowd control. anin that odd comparison this as is when they had to do crowdwdth control. i'm sorry, one more thing. some of the writer member it was a half-mile off campus.
every single administrator was having lunch to talk about what they were going to do once the guard left campus. the president had come back on sunday at about midday. in the administration building he was a 23 or 24-year-old graduate assistant. on that campus at the moment all this happened he couldn't see anything. he is talking to people with walkie-talkies and he has no idea who he's talking to and that's the communication between the administration officials and the campus is pretty inexcusab
inexcusable. it's a 17-mile per hour wind. this was basically the principal means for crowd control other than bayonets. i have a little schematic here for those of you that don't know this is what the rotc building national guard start and where the kids are here at the whole. i think it is kind of a natural baseball stadium here with the victory bell the guard is going to come up. it's going to go over company ay
and it's a group of students with company c.. there was a man in company c.ine that day. they get to the top of the hill and what have they done, the mandate there can be no crowds gathered on the campus. the guardsmen runs off and runs back to say three people. somebody said to them so if two students are talking and were e back and threatened the conversation and they said yes. so, anyway, it is an insane mandate. they take off and run to the mission commander of the national guard and said he hoped with all that is hard when hed
got to the top of the hill at the students would have dissipated. what are the chances of aul student dissipating? they come to the parking lot down here and the guard will chase them down and march the troops into the cul-de-sac. the company stay states up hered they turn around and this is where they returned the fire. so that sort of basic movement can see behind me allen will be
shot in the rest. wrist. they will repeat this gesture on the skirmish line. they go back and start retrieving up the hill. they start chasing after them and taunting them. this is the colonel who was a. these close-ups by the way, he did wonderful work and this is another close-up. he's about 30 feet further up the hill. so they are firing at this point is that they start diving into
the parking lot for protection and then we get -- they don'tge want to horrify anybody but this is what happens. let me go back one second. i'm sorry. the first is douglas mackenzie whose 250 yards away, two and af half football fields walking away when he's shot through the neck 250 yards away to give you the sense of the power of the m1. john cleary was 37 yards away. he was shot in the chest fromfr 37 yards away and survived barely and spent three days in intensive care.
you will recognize these photos. very distinctive looking. a long face and hair, so antiwar movement. he won a scholarship and decided he didn't like his major and transferred to ten states that he could be a psychology major and was number two in his class and he stopped by to have a look at what was happening. you see him holding the books like this.
this is the one that breaks my heart every time, the speech pathology nature and it didn't have a political bone in her body working from one to anoth another. we will get more of her in a second. geoffrey miller used the earlier he darted around and was probably throwing rocks and other things. this is a photo that appeared in all the newspapers and i think it exaggerated that innocence.
this isn't the famous photograph. this is one taken just beforehe that when she realized what happened. for some reason to me that this powerful. go back and then -- stop doing that. there we go. here you can see that wounded. the guard goes back to its original formation and now they start filtering back and they
are telling them what happenedkw and in a way this is the mostaw volatile time o point of the whe incident. the guard is now facing the guad crowd and there's only one thing to do march 4 and disperse it to. a a lot of people i talked to said they were ready to charge. they felt so angry that they didn't. but this didn't take place largely due to one man. you know his story, former
footage of it so i couldn't use it here. he starts basically begging and crying and tears tears in his voice and at some point he falls to the ground and number two they've been encircled by the national guardsmen someho set oe position is absolutely ducks in a pond and at the moment breaks to disperse and of th the events ended but it would have been the guardsmen it would have been horrible.i'm sorr and then go back to the white
house, the chief of staff weight stop mixing and tells him whatsm has happened and then he demand basically j. edgar hoover to find evidence that they are responsible for this and that becomes the story line.w spirit agnew one of nixon's first order you can't shut spiro agnew up. he says i think that it was a murder, too but they went on to
say that it was sort of excusable. you can read more about that. then the next night you might remember this photograph he gives a press conference he thinks that it's very successful and he goes back and he can't sleep. he makes 87 calls and finally a three-time go 30 cents if you ever been to the lincoln memorial, you have to understant the white house at this point they are sleeping in the executive office building basement and there are tens of thousands of demonstrators on the mall to protest the kent state shootings and nixon thought that this would be a great time to show the lincoln
memorial so they go down and ae couple of these are demonstrators that are sleeping down there and i love the expressions. you know they are thinking what drug did i take. so this goes on and he says they've never seen the fbi secret service so petrified in my life. they leave there and he says have you ever seen that house of representatives where the union addresses are so they go from there to the house of representatives and he wakes upt security and them up there and tells them to say something. it's richard nixon at his absolute weirdest but one more
thing that happened at this is my last slide herbivore cutters put this out for sale and they said when they were questioned its just natural wear and tear random coloration. well among other things that almost exactly where he was shot and that was appalling they would do this. it's one of the things that drove me to write this book because -- that is an ugly shot. let me -- >> they changed the logo. i read it in