tv After Words with Dana Loesch CSPAN August 21, 2016 12:00pm-1:01pm EDT
a huge amount of attention because they're more interesting than positive ads. typical positive ad you fine out the candidate favors educated children, clean water and more jobs. okay. who isn't for that? they're pretty dull on average. the negative ads have some pop, crackle, conflict, whichs what journalists like to cover. so these ads have gotten into the consciousness partly because they're more powerful and they get people's attention and that's the way the news works. >> first of all the general purpose of the book is to try to just put up a yellow warning light saying, there's role here for attacks. that we absolutely have to have them because without them the people in power can get away with a lot more stuff. so we need to realize they play a role. what i think is going on now between the rise of super pacs and the news media's coverage of
attack ads i think we have an excessive amount of negativity in the system, which is having consequences. i think it's making governing harolder. i think it's making forarrization, more of a problem for those once they get into office. i do think there's those kinds of concernes, but there's always a belief of overblowing these claims. may be too much negativity but we need that kind of negativity, especially a country that is polarized and it mean wet have differences on issues and those differences have to be discussed. we don't necessarily agree on issues like the budget or what to do with foreign policy or what to do on abortion. whatever those issues are. and so the negativity provides us important information so we learn about the downside of various kinds of policy? in april i launched with lynn --
a professor at ucla something called spot check, spot check is an effort to get us data about impact an ad is having on the public. when an ades aired journalists speculate about the ad and have no data. so rather than doing these kind of fact checks that are seat of the pants efforts, let's get some data, and take advantage of current technology. what we do is take some ads, we show them to a thousand americans, that are representative of the buyer country. they get to see these ads and then ask them a series of questions, and we do it so quickly we can get it done within a couple of days and the ad is still fresh. so we're talk about the present. but more importantly, what we're doing is we're actually running an experiment, and the experiment is as follows. we show one group of people one
ad, another group of people a sect ad. a third group of people no ads inch fact an ad of peyton managing and nationwide, and then the fourth group they see four groups. and the assignment of the groups randomly determined so we have an experiment because for those four conditions the only thing that varies are what ad you saw. so that you can take a look at, heat say, a hillary clinton ad and compare its power to a trump ad or to no ad at up or the interactive so we can say, this ad judged to be negative? does it make them angry, hope inflame move their opinion about hillary clinton? we can do so in a systemic way with real dat because the internet is a powerful tool. not everybody has access to the internet but moe people have access now and we can wait to sample to macit representative of all americans and provide a real reading of what americans think about the ads as opposed to getwork.
-- guesswork. we have the technology and we're doing it with "the los angeles times" and it's a chance to move past speculation and real evidence and pope any advancing the base. >> i remind audiences that if you go back and think about who was your most informative teacher, the person who affected you in the most? that individual who told you our work was wonderful or the person who challenged you, who said you have better abilities than what you're showing here you. need to write more clearly, think more carefully, and challenge you. not with giving you an a but maybe saying this is not very good work, i'm giving you a c, but laying down the gauntlet and you responding. so we always face that. we're better off when we have criticism, when we have vetting. we don't want it to be personal but we want it -- a chance to learn, and that's the mechanism
by which we do, and sometimes it's unpleasant. and some of the attacks-under unpleasant but it's part of the process, and to do away with it rip away the foundation -- one of the foundations of democracy because we battled -- men and women died for the right to be able to criticize government. to be able to go negative. and that's really what -- i don't want people to buy all the aspects of the argue. that would be niles but i don't expect that. at least challenge them to think maybe there's a bit of a silver lining here more than i thought. and if that happens, that's great. >> for more information on booktv's cities tour, go to c-span2.org/cities tour.
>> next, dana doevsch write a bang about the u.s. split at thing into two countries and elitists on the coasts don't understand the impact of their policies on people living in the heartland of america. >> we're sitting here in mid-town manhattan. tell us about the premise of your book. >> when i was in colleges' going for any journalism degree i had this idea to write the great american novel, and i come from such a weird place, rural missouri, where my family lives, and everyone just has all of these stereotypes about flyover country and fly overnation. so i had part written, and then as we started barreling towards this political environment, this political climate, the whole bitter clinger thing we heard from president obama, this idea that we have from the west coast
and the east coast are that people in flyover country, they're just a bunch of backward hillbillies and we shoot our guns off and practice animal sacrifice or whatever we do in the back woods and they have all these stereotypes -- that's stay you'retyping. none is true. there are actually a lot of issue that nyeover nation has with east and west does and a lot of issue wiz look at differently. and so part of it is kind of explaining that. that perspective. that lens through which myself and everyone from the midwest, and that gets into just the -- we're kind of tired of being kicked around and kind of tired of taking it all of this time and it explains why so many people have kind of risen up, why this election cycle is as weird as it is. we can't even trend or predict anything, anticipate anything anymore. so, it explains all of that. one of the things, too, just to
point this out, was in the middle of writing this book when the whole comment about new york values happened, and you remember how everybody was so angry about new york values, and i love new york and i think the people are cool. but people in new york do not get made fun of the way people in flyover nation do. people in new york do not get viewed as being related to their cousin betty. they don't get looked at in the same manner. and they got so mad over one little remark, and they wanted everybody else to defend them. i was sitting here with the rest of my flyover nation family and thinking, no, no, you don't get to be mad. we're always made fun of, the people passed up, passed around, understatemented, taken for granted, expected show show up and vote and expected to stand up to and be there when needed. no. you development get to be angry. we have been downtrodden enough you don't get to be angry. let me show you what we have
been through my entire life and before that. and so i actually had an addendum. added an addendum to the book after it was written and had gone through justice editing, said we have to add this is this perfectly explains why i wrote this book. >> the title makes sense to me. it's a meme on the center right, flyover country, nyeover nation. we not what they means. for the uninitiated, how would you dine the term "flyover nation" who is part of that. >> guest: it's that area between new york and l.a. that 30,000 feet below your plane win when you're going from new york to l.a. or l.a. to new york or d.c. dish it looks like a quilt when you look down and that's -- you have no idea what is going on down there. it's mall-town america. it's mom and pop shops, the people who -- middle class america, people who are farmers and union workers.
i have an uncle who owns a quarry. people that work in the quarries. everyday people who aren't on the coast, who don't -- they value family and they have different value, which get into the book because we look at a number of different issues but it's all of those people that don't get the attention that the coast gets, that beltway gets. >> host: we'll get to the politics but you are of flyover nation. you still live in flyover nation. tell us personally about your journey, your american story, that brought you to this studio, with your second book. >> guest: right. it's a weird one, too, because i always wanted to write but never wanted to be in front of the camera. never had any, any, any design or -- >> host: that didn't last. >> guest: no. i went in kicking and screaming. i just wanted to be hind the scenes and free lance. but where i come from, in rural missouri, all my family lives in iron and wayne county missouri. well, we have a huge family.
if have 24 cousins and that's just on my mom's side. so we're a big family. but it's close knit family, a tightknit family, we all know what we are doing. the town we come from, there are literally 301 people. one restaurant called "the restaurant." no joke. and that's where all the action happens, where if you want to go and get little debbie snack cakes or get a -- not a slurpee, the most best thing -- like the generic version of a slushee. but you go down to the quick mart. everybody knows everybody. was raised by single mother who left the country to go get a job because there's not a lot of jobs down there where the country where my family comes from, that town. you can work in the school, work as a hairdresser, maybe you can get a job at the very tiny little bank that's there. you can work as a wait tress in the restaurant or go and you can work in the quarry, and that's about it.
there's not a lot of jobs down there. and people down there, it's david way of life because everybody is not striving to have something. there's no we have to keep up with the joneses kind of thing. people are happy what if they have. they're happen just being out on their property, being able to good and go fishing in the river. just a really scaled back, downsized, slowed-down way of life. still completely different. and my mom left and went to the city to get a job. went with her and i was really isolated and really alone in the city. and it was so weird because you would think that wouldn't be the case because there's so many people around everywhere, but i have found that being in a big city is the easiest way to feel the loneliest because you're isolated by people you don't know. in the city nobody cares what your last name is or what your family does no knows your family, you've resemble each other, nobody knows any of that stuff.
and back in the small town where i family came from, everybody knew everybody. we all knew who you were and what your family's last name was because you resembled your grandpa -- it was just different. and then i eventually -- i stayed in to city to go to school and to work myself, and i would always -- i loved going back to visit family, visit family in oozarks and reconnect and get away from everything. live in dallas now. i like it there. i would still classify it kind of as a flyover because everybody still thinks it's like the wild west in dallas, but -- >> texas counts. >> guest: i think texas does completely count. but people, i think, -- it's a different esthetic. and as i was telling you earlier the lifestyle is different and i don't know -- i have friends from l.a., and whenever they visit, like, st. louis, when we used to live in st. louis, and i
took one of my friends from l.a. down to where some of my family lives, and it's like a whole other world. we have to get a documentary camera crew down their because this is a whole other world. you don't have stop lotts. where do the kid goods to have fun? well, they have bonfires and go to the river. it was just beyond their comprehension that people just lived very scaled back and pretty downsized. and relaxed, and -- i think i like to kind of take that sort of esthetic with me. what i do is very far. you live in d.c. you're in the beltway now. you don't seem like a beltway guy. >> host: such a city slicker. >> guest: you don't seem that way. you tend to have that is the tick or that vibe where you're open and you appreciate flyover nation and you appreciate the people and that relaxed kind of -- i don't know -- slow motion sort of living for the
lack of a better way to describe it, but i couldn't -- i like to visit new york, but i couldn't live here. i get claustrophobic, i can't see the sky. in d.c., while i drive pretty much like everybody in d.c., it's pretty to look at and great to visit but something that i'm miss something something i'm missing in new york and even something i'm missing in l.a. so, we have had chances where we could have moved to new york or moved to d.c., and i can't. i just can't do it. just -- i miss just the way of life in the middle of the country and i'm isolated from the drama. when someone says -- i didn't hear what happened. i'm in the middle of the country. i didn't hear it. >> host: gossip is universal. staying with the permanent, what may by intryinging to some readers readers of "flyover nation" they're familiar with your work on texas news, you're a regular on megyn kelly, you're nope -- i
don't think you would disagree -- as a bit of a conservative brawler. >> guest: , no. >> host: you have your game face on in "flyover nation" there were passages that were extremely personal but i was not expecting from you, an insight into your family and history. you sort of alluded to your single mother situation. some abuse. was that difficult for you write about and be public about to a broader audience? >> guest: you know, way back when, i think it was 2001, when i first started blogging, i wanted an outlet to write about stuff that i wasn't writing about when i was free lansing itch just wanted to met around on the center net, and have fun and if it see writ went. most its still up there. i explored a lot of that online. don't think it was, just it's honest and raw. it does inform people where i
come from, where i guess my tone is, why i take the tone i take, just because it's -- what you see is what you get. i don't put up a front for -- if i go on television or -- you have been out with me before, you have bold with me before. you know. i think it's -- it informs the read where are i come from and kind of how i operate the way i operate, and why i'm so passionate about certain things. why am i passionate bet the family unit? because i've seen first hand what happens when it breaks down. i've lived through that. why am i such a champion of supporting single moms? i had a single mom. all of these issues i've lived them, in some respect, and for instance, the issue of abortion, or the issue of unexpected pregnancy. well, my husband and i weren't married and i was in college when i had my first child, and i had every pressure and every invitation in the world to have an abortion, so dana, you can go
did some free lance and continue on this path good college. this is not the best time to have a baby. i believe in accepting the consequences of your choices, and i'm just very frank about it, and i think that also -- people relate to a story and they relate to if you're open about your experience where you have come from, people relate to that because they think -- i think a lot of hearts and minds are more easily changed when you are reaching out to people and trying to connect with them on that real level as opposed to lex touring them. i'm not perfect. this is where i come from. and these are the decisions that i made, and this is why i do things the way i do. so maybe you can see it from my way a little bit. >> host: i think when the public sees someone on team, almost dehumanizing, a perfect tv pundit, have a perfect life, and no one is perfect. you go through that in the book. you open with a reference to thomas frank's book, "what's the
matter with kansas" where he cooperate fight out why people in kansas would vote republican elm thought it was against their interest. was this at all framed as a refutation or conservative comeback? >> guest: in a way. that was one of the things in my mind when i added it to my repository of people and writings i wanted to tell off, and sort of push back against. it did factor in that way. because so much has been said about, we can't understand why someone would vote this way or why people would think this way. and i just disagreed with his premise. i disagree with his premise. i disagree what if the president said, with the reaction of new york values. in a way i guess for the lack of a better way to put it or put it in a way my family would appreciate, you could kind of say it was like sinners
responding to neil young, and -- sort of maybe in the same vein. >> host: who, who, who. >> guest: southern men don't need him around any howe. >> host: you made reference to this, the def expect and polarization. as we are having this conversation your book is out and available for purchase. we're still reeling from the orlando terrorist attack at a gay nightclub, and it was inspired by isis and we're still tracking down all the details. there was a poll that asked -- a gallup poll that asked whether the attack was more about islamist terrorism or more about domestic gun violence, and the country was split right down the middle on this, with republicans say terrorism, and democrats saying, overwhelmingly, guns. how do you address that massive canyon that seems to separate not just the things we believe
but almost the premises, the fact set from which we approach issue? >> guest: this is a problem we have in this country, people just want to be right and don't care about the actual debate at hand. just -- and that poll you're referencing, you're right. it was split right down the middle. there was no gray area at all there. and it shouldn't be that way. it really shouldn't. of course, i believe that whole situation -- it was terrorist situation. doesn't matter how you look at it. it was terrorist situation. but i wish that instead of people taking a party line they could just immediately remove that as a variable from this discussion and just look at the basic facts of the matter. this is a person who is -- has professed a belief system which is completely incompatable with western culture, person who has professed a belief system completely intoll rapt of everything that -- intolerant of anything -- hes to not like
women or gays or western culture or christianity or any of the things that here in the united states people are allowed to be who they are and allowed to worship however they want to and women can vote here in this country, and we can go and drive cars, unlike in saudi arabia. but that was so -- that it was so polarrist has to do with the political rhetoric. seems that not just really so much people in flyover nation, although i think they're start you have this yanking back and forth, the right and left that are pulling them in one direction or another. and it goes back to, we need you to show up a certain way to vet or support this issue because we want you to spurt it. that divide is scary because now politics is affecting whether or not we can defend ourselves again a major threat, and domestic terror attackers are increasing in the united states, whether we want to realize it or not. we don't live in this perfect kittens and sunshine world where we don't have to worry if we go out to a club where if we go to a baseball game, we don't have
to worry. if we go to a mall we are don't have to worry. we don't live in that world anymore and up farm we have to protect yourselves here at home because not enough has been done to contain it overseas, and that's the situation we're in. we have some people that don't want to acknowledge that this is a terror issue because that means giving spun sacrifices another part of their narrative and they'd rather be right on an- -- rather win the argument than actually address what is happening and be morally and ethically correct on how to handle this. >> host: you argue that people who don't live in flyover nation don't understand it, and have really deep-seated misunderstandings, are even kind of biased against people who do live in what you're characterizing as flyover nation. you talk about the church, talk about guns, talk about the military. how would you explain -- it's like a foreign country, as you said. how do you explain the miscop
singses and try to correct them? the book? >> guest: well, you're right. everybody -- there are these crazy stereotypes about flyover nation about middle america, and the people that i think have a genuine interest in understanding what makes flyover different from the west coast or the east coast, those people when they go and visit flyover nation, they're like this is amazing. i took a road trip with a friend. i had to peek in indianapolis and my friend passed away a few years ago and we were on a road trip phenomenon indianapolis back to st. louis before he went back to los angeles where he lived and he wanted to pull off the highway and go to all these little mom and pop towns. he's lining they don't have this in l.a. we went into this one place where you can get deep fried anything and thought it was amaze. you get a deep friar and you deep fry everything, and you sell it. god bless america. this is so amazing. >> host: what is the craziest
deep fried something you if eaten. >> guest: i got a deep friar as a wedding gift, and i'm not even kidding you. the first two months my husband and i deep fried everything -- >> host: were you asking for one or someone just knew you? >> guest: no. one of the things you do. in ozarks. i have to have a deep fried. i've had a deep frightened dipping donning, twinkie, deep fried every vegetable. i did a deep fried pizza roll. what haven't be deep fried? we have deep fried everything. you can't make it weird. out all delicious. it's horrible for your health but all delicious. >> host: so, almost like some on the left or some people in the coastal elite, however you describe them, look at bible believing christians from the heartland as almost this sociological phenomenon. explain what the church has actually meant in your life
day-to-day, not as i have the bible vote abuse of these issues. what does your relationship with christ mean to you, what does your church community anyone you and your family. >> in. >> guest: in growing up the church where is -- they sent out -- there three churches in at the town where my family if jazz no stoplights, three church snooze and all on the same road and you can go out and see the other two from the other one's parking lot. it's the funniest thing and they all compete, especially with their signage. when my grandmother was on hospice, it was the church that sent brother -- they all call them brother -- they sent someone to be there with my grandmother and help the family. the church stepped in when hi kiln, who was drawing faith and he was dying, flew in from jacksonville, broke, completely broke, he had not a nickel to his name. he had nothing.
his -- he was all by himself, estanged from his kids, and the church that made sure he had respectable funeral. in flyover nation the church isn't there to lord a religion over you because we're all imperfect and everybody -- when you police in small towns imperfection is on display every day. the church there is to assist, to -- where you get together and fellowship and worship and help each other. thoughts what the church is in flyover nation. the churches i have attended i've seep them throw baby showers for teenaged unwed mother. my father-in-law is hoss business and he deals win aids patients on their death beds who are professing faith in christ, and so this is -- i've seen the church in action. that's the church that i have grown up with. it is a cornerstone in the community. it helps keep a community together.
it's not the way that it has been made out to be, and there has been a lot of effort by progressives in east coast, west coast, and the beltway to kind of divide people to really be the divide between the church and the people. and i feel badly for the people who fall for and it feel badly for the people who have a bad impression of the church because that's not the church, it's not the faith i've grown up and the faith i have seen every day of my life, and i wish that they would kind of fly -- come to flyover nation and see it in action. >> host: we're having a delightful conversation and so much fun. don't want potential readers to be me led. you definitely throw purposes in the book. it's not -- you're coming from a strong perspective and do not shy away unsurprisingly from some hot buton issues. you made a few comments earlier about abortion. you get into physician assisted
suicide as well and you write on page 27: physician assisted suicide is a glossy term for euthanasia or more plainly a very late-term abortion? is that fair -- i'm pro life. in abortion, part of the argument against it is the human whose life is being ended has no say in the matter whatsoever. but in many cases in the physicians assisted suicide someone is make as choice for themselves and their life based on their circumstances. isn't that an important distinction? >> guest: i think it's a distinction but not a qualifying one. because the way that i look at it issue it's not their decision to make. it's not anybody's decision to make. as to whether or not to end a life. i can look at this from a christian perspective, too. it's a god thing. it's god's decision, and you're completely eliminating him from the equation. when you're saying i think i'm done now and i'm going to go out the way i want to go out. i'm finished.
who knows, make it's in the last couple of days your life actually directly impacts someone else's. i've seep that happen. i gave the example of my uncle, drug addict, who came in from jacksonville and died in st. louis. he actually -- because drug tickets tend tend to heave drug addict friends. it was in his dying and on his death bread his friends says -- it hit me. saw what he was doing with his life and it really impacted me, and it changed me. and you never know how something is going to affect someone else. and i think it's for that reason -- i view it differently. i just think that you're on god's timeline, not your own timeline and that's not a decision for you to make. >> host: another front in the culture war, boiled over, at a small establishment in indiana called memories pizza. you discuss memory's pizza. an issue that i think a lot of people feel strongly about. on both sides. talk about what happened there and why you think it's
emblematic of themes you get at in your book. >> guest: i could not think of a more apropos story than that one, that really kind of described how people view flyover nation you. had a reporter from bloomington, indiana, who went down -- really went out of her way to find some sort of christian mop mom and pop shop -- >> host: during the to? that was basically allowing people to say, well, if you open a business and you want to choose how you want to run your business, that's fine. if you don't want to violate your religious conscious -- there are limitations. people think it's a free for all. no there are limitations. if you engaging in discrimination you're going to run afoul of the law but if you are sincerely professingor faith and saying on this one, instance of a wedding ceremony i don't want to give you my artist stick skill or my labor or my expression, then that's understandable and that's what it was about.
but this reporter actually went out of her way and went to this really little tiny little small town. one of those small towns where you have the storefront windows and people park in the middle of the street, and went in and saw some crosses on the wall of this pizza shop and thought, here it is, and walked inside, crystal, the daughter of the proprier to was at the cash register, and she asked her would you serve -- would you indicatary gay wedding? the weird thing is that there was to actual service done. no goods were -- money were exchanged, anything like that. just a hypothetical question. and crystal said, we serve customers every day. that's one thing. but the act of a wedding ceremony goes against what we believe is christians so we probably wouldn't participate. i was just thinking the report we're good to a quick trip or something -- can i buy some fudge rounds and stack them up for a wedding cake or something like that, or hordourves.
it was weird that it went to a pizza shop. wrote about this because i have gay friends and gay family members and i'm sorry. i'm from the ozarks. we would never cater a wedding with pizza. i'm not throwing shame on anybody who has but do these people not understand, our neighbors throw a block party in st. louis, gay neighbors, fabulous, and they had bottle service. no one is going cater their wedding with a pizza. anyway, that became a big story, and this restaurant was all of a sudden at the center of all of this maddening debate. they hod to close their blind. they were getting death threats, for a hypothetical question. and it was maddening because not only was it something that never actually happened. there was no discrimination that took place, except discrimination against christian proprietors of a pizza shop. you should -- this is more than an issue of whether or not you are serving a cake at a gay wedding or photographing a gay
wedding or giving pizza to a gay wedding reception. take that variable out of it. this is about who owns your labor. can the government come in and say, no, you don't get to determine how you work, when you work and who you provide your services do. we do. it's about association, which we have already had supreme court decisions on this. and so the thing about it is you're talking about indentured servitude and that's what this boils down to, when you remove the window dressing of identity politics, this is about indentured servitude and people are too involved and navel gazing to realize what night being led down and that's the scary thing. and this -- the fact you had a reporter that went to this small town and sought someone tout prove a narrative she was billing, that's exactly why miami in flyover nation have just had it.
>> host: one of the villains in the story, hedge riff's pizza, was the media, and that is one of the villains in the book overall in flyover nation, where you have it in or out -- -- for the mainstream media. you talk about the deep distrust of the media among the american people. why don't you comment on that briefly, just bat the loss of trust and why you think that has been the case and if there's anything people in the media can do to regain it. >> guest: i don't know if there is. i know -- i realize with irony what i do is considered part of the media and it churns my butter. still like it. i don't ever think there's any -- been anything as -- never been an objective media, media got its start in the united states because ben franklin wanted to talk smack about people using an appropriated name. it's the american way of life. i think that some people have more decency than others and
some people are more committed to just giving you the story while minimizing their editorial input as much as possible, and that i can appreciate. i can appreciate it if i know where -- and flyover nation is the same way wimp don't care if your republican or democrat. dough recent tend you're not while delivering us a story and don't pretend you don't have a bias, they see that on nbc, see it on cbs, on abc, with he anchors. the anchor, the person that used to invite into your home whenever things hit the fan and it got bad and you wanted to hear a trusted voice wimp don't have that anymore. appoint e people don't desire that because the don't trust the media. these people, they had at least thought they could do some sort of job, watchdog of the government, and just informing them of what's going on and they decent even do that anymore. it's about your have cbs that goes and violates federal law where it concerns gun purchases because that they want to lecture about gun troll. documentary filmmakers do the same thing.
we don't expect people to not have lives lives and we don't et people to not have biases or preferences over an issue. but don't act like you don't and then deliver us the story and in your narrative while pretend be objective. the white nobody trusts the media and flyover nation particularly. >> host: part of your critique of the media, you have this chart here where you have -- >> guest: oh, yeah. >> host: sel rid of the top news anchors and the millions of dollars. annually. and i was interested in some of the numbers. was like, oh, really? he makes that? she makes that? i did have this thought, we're capitalists, we believe in people earning what the market fetches and it seems like it's the left that obsesses with unfair, un -- ill gotten gains, millions of dollars where successful people are demonized. are you doing the left's --
borrowing from their playbook and obsessing over media pay. >> guest: snow not really. we're not the ones who are trying to shame the so-called one percent for earning and doing well. we're not trying to go after them. i remember the eye occupy wall street "coverage and it's horrible if you're a business owner today. why don't you increase your hourly wages to $15 an hour, of iryou really love them, bring it up to $25 an hour. we're not out there demmizing success. i love that in the united states of america people can make millions of dollars a year. i'm not jealous of them. don't want to take night from them. that proves you can still do in the united states and that's wonderful. however, those same people apparently don't want anyone else getting up to their level so they're demonizing they've demonize all of the thing about capital limp that we -- danalism has raised communities from the ash. capitalism has done amazing things in the the world ask the country and these people want to peoplize people who work hard
and want to be able to creep thud fruits of their labor, penalize business owners for wanting to keep their doors open and penalize people for not artificially raising the wages beyond what they market is going to actually organically support. they demon mates the very things they used and climbed up to get to the success they are at now. that's the hip come place, we decent do -- hip hip pock -- hypocrisy. >> host: let's talk about violence. we heard that in the wake of orlando and set eight side the fact and what actually inspired this monster to murder 49 people in a gay club, set eight side his own word, it's the rhetoric, antigay rhetoric, legislation, christian conservatives, the same fall guys that they want to blame for everything and there's this argument that, oh, conservative hostility or conservative rhetoric on lgbt
issues has contributed to a culture or a climate where there's hatred and, therefore, we ought to watch what we say on the right. you do that a little bit on the flip side i've black black black and al sharpton and saying these people have blood on their hand win someone kills a cop? is the right guilty of this, too. >> guest: you do mention those examples? i do. i don't think it is because they have -- when i particularly when i think of al sharpton, there's been nothing i recall that nip on the right that has ever saved that his -- has incited someone to burn down a fashion mart and has gone out there to try to antagonize and increase violence and hope that rhetoric will plant a seed that stirs violent protest. we actually speak out against that is what we do and we're -- in comparing that anything that ever been said, about gay and lesbian rights as well, i don't know -- no one talks like that on the right.
to say things that would be in any way -- >> host: on the fringe. >> guest: every side has its friends and koo ks. you have the westboro group. i'll -- >> host: chance thanks you. >> guest: that's not a church or a faith. that entity reminds me of the dish don't know -- i'm going to bring this tug boat back to shore. in pole fer -- poltergeist. he reminds me of the -- the big old hat. the cult leader. >> go with the reverend -- >> guest: i haven't seep that. i'm sure that's perfectly -- no, back to shore. when i see some of things like "black lives matter" activists -- i'm seen they're protests.
they violent. don't know what their objective is. usually when you protest you want to have an objective you. want to gain attention for something but at the same time you want to advance what you're fighting for, forwards so you can gain? another step and i don't see where "black lives matter" is doing that and where causing violence i doing that or running down cops is doing that unless the goal is chaos and that's a whole other discussion. >> host: all of "black lives matter"? i have yet to see an example of not. >> host: there's an association you make in the book that our political and class hate us. and you quote -- >> guest: i don't -- >> host: -- senate harry reid who famously talked about smelly toilets in washington, dc. you certainly take your shots at democrats but republicans right-hand spared in flyover nation.
eric cantor, the revolving door you get out and get voted out and then make bank as a lobbyist, influencing the situation you used be to part of. is that part have the disconnect that drives anymore flyover country just up the wall about washington? cincinnati is, and it's one of the reasons why we are in the position that we're in now. with the political climate. the republican nominee -- i'm said this before -- one giant red-headed middle finger to washington, dc because people are fed up and don't know what to do. they want somebody who ick goes take mallet to the whole system. regardless of the consequences. they're just -- they have lost faith, not only in the way that washington works but they've lost faith in the vehicle that they have believed and have been told for so many years, this is the best way to get your conservative ideals into practice in washington and that's the republican party. they seen the republican party compromise on budgetary issues and compromise on taxation.
they heave have seen them compromise on issue after issue or not do anything on issues. they search the leaders of the republican party fight with the grassroot members of the republican pear and that's caused -- they look at that and think, who in here is representing us anymore? and it's infuriated them. that they have gone so far outside of the system -- then there are discussions as to whether the nominees they have is part of the system and has been, but is not a politician for sure. we could have that -- it's not the poll niksch the way we have normally again about electing -- >> host: we'll return to mr. trump. >> guest: but they're mad. i have -- i get so many calls every day on my radio program where people -- it's a consecutive audience, and -- conservative audience and it's young and skewed female and i have noticed a huge shift. people are equally angry, and sometimes i think more so at republicans because they expect this stuff from democrats.
one caller said i expect harry reid to betray me and nancy pelosi to do this. did not and i should not have to expect it from the republican party leaders. i have people said they left the republican party because they do not want to feel like they're being betrayed in the same manner that they have been with democrats. and so they're finished and don't even want to hear anymore. they're not at a spot where they're open to hearing anything else about it. and that's really tough position to be in. you asked me earlier what the media can do to regain trust with folks. i think that's the least of the country's worries. it's what the republican party can do to regain trust. >> host: fact check. to what extent we both work in the conservative media world. townhall. to what extent do we as a community or industry, if you whatnot to call it that, beer some responsibility in terms of setting expectations. one argue.
is republicans said they were going to repeal obamacare and obamacare is still the law. they won the house and won the senate and voted and used reconciliation, got to the president's desk who tennessee stowed and its still the law because they the way the discussion works do woe bear some responsibility in why people are so angry because they thought things could work in ways they could not? >> guest: i think you're absolute lie right. the welcome are. i feel i am completely. started out in this -- i've been going for a long time. some people who straight journalists and they want to be objective reporters which i've never claimed not have any kind of bias and it's partisan and as biased also you can get and i admit it but some people who want to mesh that activism with journalism and i've done that as well. i've protested in 2009. i helped create the tea party in my town back in 2009. and i think that some of this focusing on populist sound bites and not focusing enough on
solutions really contributed to that. contributed to one of the reasons we're in this position in the first place. do think that it helps set a bar for high expectations as to how washington, dc works and that's not a compromise, and it's not a forfeit but we -- i told people that's for a long time, this amar'e thon, not a sprint. i think that people -- you meninged high expectations. people think that things in washington can got done in short order and that it can't note the system was designed to work. it's a feature of the system, not a bug. takes a long time to get things done in washington, dc, particularly when you're changing the operations of a political party and have that impact washington as a whole. that takes quite a long time. takes more than one or two or three election cycles. people don't have the patient for that kind of fight anymore and i think a lot of the rhetoric we have heard from both sides and myself included in the past eight years have contributed to that. >> host: one of the buzz phrases that has percolated on your air,
on our blogs, for years now, during the obama administration is is american exceptionalism. you have an entire chapter in flyover nation defending american exceptionalism. there's the famous or perhaps infamous quote from president obama asked about american exceptionalism where he said i'm sure the brits think there's british exceptionalism and the greeks and is downplaying the whole point of american exceptionallively. first part of the question, why is it important to have an entire chapter about why america is exceptional and the second path to the request deals with the republican nominee and first let's talk about the issue itself. american exceptionalism. why did that warrant in your mind an entire chapter of flyover nation. >> guest: i feel that whole discussion and focus has been absent in the past eight years. it almost seems as though we are supposed to feel ashamed of being exceptional. that we're supposed to be ashamed of having a country that is really it's a beacon to the
rest of the world. freedom guys in america where do people go after that? nowhere. this is it. every country you -- some superran countries are free but they have a lot more limitations built in united states really was this great experiment and exercise in republicanism and independence and when you lose that, where does that go? we have been made to fail ashamed of having -- being just frankly back-to-back world war champs. we are feeling beside bat being a great mission. it's not nationalism and not just blatant patriotism -- >> host: on the left. >> guest: i hate that word so badly. it's honest, though. what nation -- on this earth has done more for other countries -- has done as much for other
countries as the united states? we give aid to everyone. we step in sometimes too much -- that's a whole other discussion -- we are absolutely were we're every. i went on vacation in the caribbean and while i was down there we chartered a boat and were going to go fishing and i don't know if they captains' first mate thought are we going too far out? they said the u.s. coast guard comes down here. we're in the west indies. we're like the u.s. coast guard? he said they're everywhere. you're guys are everywhere. and i have to admit there was at part of that, you know, we are. i really felt that way. we are an exceptional country and we shouldn't have to feel about bad that. feel bad about being great and offering people freedom andin' to -- if they want to raise themselves up to a different circumstance or not, they have that choice and they have the ability to do. so there's nothing wrong with that and it's that refusal to acknowledge or celebrate what makes this country great that
has really frustrated a lot of people, and i even get into particularly the military, when you look at who sends more of its sons and daughters in the military service, flyover nation. we send -- >> host: dis proportionately. >> guest: we send our sons and daughters to go and proudly serve, and to fulfill obligationsover seas and elsewhere and when we hear their endeavors and see their objectives spoken down of by the president, we see them -- we can't -- like it's bad if we acknowledge that what wear doing is good or keeping america safe is good. that makes people in flyover angry because they've sacrificed a lot. i've nope families who have sacrificed more than one child out off their family, gold star family is. families who have had every one of their children serve, and when we're supposed to feel ashamed of our accomplishments and ashamed of being exceptional and ashamed of everything they're values have won for this
country, that's another reason why this book needed to be written. >> host: the presumptive rump rump tom knee, this campaign slogan is make america great again and there's something underlying the premise which is, that perhaps we have lost some greatness or greatness altogether. donald trump was asked about american exceptionalism and his response was not the same as prone probe b some striking similarities in their posture on this. that's justice like a face palm moment for you? >> guest: when i heard the slogan, for the first time, and i was trying to think of, well, is this in response to obama of the past eight years? because this president -- he has gone on apology tours. he apologized -- where has he not gone? everywhere he as gone he has apologize ford our drown and in apologizing he would make some remark -- in egypt he talked about all the accomplishments of
the arab world almost as if to slight the united states and everything the united states had accomplished. and when you do that on an international stage, it does feel like you're trying to reduce america to not being so fantastic. and in the past eight years, with the passage of -- >> host: cutting us down to size. >> guest: it does feel like that. absolutely does. with the unaffordable care act, a lot of the grabs they've been making on guns and so much more, america isn't as free as it was eight years ago. that's for sure. especially after the unaffordable care act, after dodd-frank, america is not also free as it was eight years ago, and i think that there is a certain truth in recovering some of the rights we have lost. in terms of whether or not, as a country, we have lost that animating spirit, that drives us towards freedom. that drives us towards
independence, that drives us towards everything that made the country great. whether or not we have lost that. time is -- i don't believe we have. because there are too many people in this country that still believe in the entire reason why this country was founded and believe in all of the things that in our constitution and everything that the founders believed in. i don't think it's lost but i do think it has been obscured by a lot of the past eight years. >> host: when i picked up your book one thing is was most curious to sees' was thumbing through, flipping through, how much is dana going to talk about her tempes tempestuous relationship of the trump campaign. didn't know the trump campaign reached out to you to possibly be an on-air sure good at for them -- surrogate for them or speak on their behalf. you declined. explain that interaction and
then your relationship with trump and how that seems to have really declined over the last number of months. >> guest: well, i've always and just admittedly, i -- this even goes to cruz and lee and all of the politicians out there. i always view politicians as being kind of different people. and i don't feel -- almost as if when someone -- the moment someone announces they're running for office i feel kind of antagonistic towards them. even itch i do agree with them. because i feel that we should kind of be. if i don't want to have a cozy relationship with a politician i don't care to be friends. i don't do any of that stuff for friends. did doesn't get you friend. honesty doesn't win you friends in washington. but i feel as though i need to be antagonist antagonistishingii want to ask questions and want to know what formed the opinions
you have, what changed you, because when you look when people have changed -- it's a great tool of witness. not because i'm trying to do it as got gotcha, if you change i want to know what moved your heart and mind, because when you talk about that who knows how many people you might reach oust to and how that might resonate with so many people. it's an amazing tool for witness. i always -- there's that saying that god doesn't call the equip, he equips the called, and i think how great of a tool would that be if he would be able to talk bit and that's what i've always wanted to hear. >> host: from trump. >> guest: from trump. >> host: on his political -- >> guest: on different issues. drop the other stuff and look at people and just be real with that. that would resonate so much with people. when -- it was few years ago, his camp reached out because we have a mutual friend that works with hem and they wanted me to
introduce him at cpac and i had radio and other engagements and then the year before last i went out and introduced him and met him and he was very nice, very amiable. we got along. i got along with his folks, his staff. and i never had a one-on-one with anyone on his staff that was particularly contentious. i've never been particularly preferential on any candidate. i've gone after ted cruz pretty hard and have got an lot of pushback for that. that's -- you're supposed to do that and you should do that. i've never had any ill will towards anybody running. there's do. >> but you did pen an essay in national review among many prominent conservatives why -- >> guest: on policy points. i had a few policy issues, and used the words -- some of the
most important to me and i wanted to know where does this candidate stand on this issue? what changed them on this issue? i want to know more about this issue before i can come to a decision and make a decision. and i just don't really thick can do this unless i know what is happening. and i wrote that out, i would do that again. would do it again if would do it for any candidate where i felt like i still had more questions or concerns about -- we're talking about major issued. supreme court nominations, talking about we may actually -- we other stand to lose our rights to sea semi automatic rifles and have -- that's where we are right now. we could lose reciprocity because of what happened in the appeals court with california. so, niece are huge issues, and i don't -- this isn't it's not show friends, it's show business and we have the business of the country to attend to and i want to have the questionses an. >> host: have they've been? >> guest: some respects. on a couple of issues.
on a couple of issues they have been, whether or not -- i still -- whether or not it's been to my satisfaction is one thing, but i think that could be made more clear. >> host: so, two more points on this all anyone ever wants to talk about. >> guest: i will say this. i view what is coming and i -- with hillary clinton in 2016, and absolutely terrifies me as someone whose life has been protected by a firearm to have to lose that ability. i don't get scared and i don't get intimidated and that truly does terrified. >> your previous book, "hands off my gun" do? everybody needs to keep that in ...