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tv   Politics and Public Policy Today  CSPAN  September 11, 2015 3:00pm-5:01pm EDT

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saved our city from repeated attacks. there is no one, absolutely no one, who on the day of september 11th, fbi or anyone else that briefed me that didn't wash me that -- warn me that my city wouldn't be attacked numerous times in the future. and beginning with commissioner carrick, and continuing through commissioner kelly and now bratton, new york city has continuously grown its response to terrorism because we expect to be attacked again. but we weren't attacked. and we weren't in large measure because of the bravery of the men and women of our military when went and engaged the enemy in iraq and afghanistan and kept them so busy they couldn't plan attacks. that presence of our military also brought us incalculable amount of intelligence warning us about attacks. consider how that has diminished
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when those troops aren't there. if you have 100,000 troops in a country, they are in villages, they're in towns, they talk to people and they gather intelligence. that intelligence gets to the cia and it gets to the fbi from the joint terrorism task force, it gets right down here to the streets of the city. that is now gone. we do not have the benefit of that intelligence. it could be part of the reason we thought isis or isil was the j.v. because we weren't getting the intelligence we were getting in the past. it is part of the reason we miscalculated them and let them catch up real fast and now we're playing catch-up, not offense. but isis is not the biggest threat to us. a determined strong strategy of engaging our special forces
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could do a good job of eliminating isis. our major threat, and let's not take our eye off it, as we watch isis, is iran. the iranian empire that began with the overthrow of the shaw and the first ayatollah and now the second has tilled well over a million people. we're talking about mass murderers. the ayatollah and prime minister rouhani have engaged in mass murder. it is prime minister rouhani who was one who ordered the execution of the jewish people in argentina. there are more people being killed in iran today than under ahmadinejad for a very important reason. the ayatollah and rouhani do not want the people inside of iran to drink the cool aid of
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thinking there is reform going on in iran. they are trying to get us to dring that coal -- to drink that cool aid. but they are reminding people, we control iran. so let's not take our eye off of iran. and let's remember when negotiating with an ayatollah, who has pronounced the destruction of the tate of israel -- the state of israel, the death of americans and has on his hands the blood of very, very many young americans who were killed by the quds forces during the war in iraq. and we're negotiating with them. at the same time, we're negotiating with him and he's pulling for our death and destruction. we're not calling for regime change in iran. if they can have a two-part
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strategy in negotiating, why are we so unsophisticated that we can't have a two-part strategy? if the ayatollah can negotiate with us, and call for our death and destruction, then why can't we negotiate with him and call for regime change in iran. if egypt needed regime change, and we supported it, and overthrew mubarak, a friend of the united states and a friend of israel, if we supported regime change in iran and remove gadhafi who had been neutered. a terrible man. i investigated him as a united states attorney for some of his acts as i did for yasser arafat who was responsible for the murder of leon cling hoffer. if we could remove qadhafi, who was useless as a threat,
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terrible to his own people and useless as a threat. if we could remove these people, why are we not for regime change in iran? iran has taken american hostages. iran has killed thousands of americans. iran supports hezbollah, hamas, the houthis in yemen. iran controls iraq. we gave iraq to iran when we withdrew. and iran controls syria through assad. do you see what is developing? a persian empire. a shiite empire. and to the south, saudi arabia, jordan, the emirates, israel, egypt. we've got a very dangerous situation developing in the middle east where we have a
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divided middle east. and america is sitting back and not taking action to prevent it. agreement that recognizes something that we've been fighting for -- decades, which is a nuclear iran, which will make it an even bigger empire. so, i'll conclude by saying that if this museum exists to remind us that we shouldn't forget, and we shouldn't repeat the mistakes of history, let's let it do that. and lets realize that we are at war. if we don't want to call it that, they call it that. and we have to respond in a way in which we are strong,
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assertive, intelligent. this city has done everything it can to protect itself. the work of commissioner kelly, continued with the work of commissioner bratton has been excellent. it is absolutely necessary, as you pointed out during your opening statement, that we are now dealing with many diverse and smaller attacks and it authorities to think of our police as their eyes and ears. they are approximately 12,000 or 13,000 fbi agents and there are 35,000 new york city police officers. the new york city police department a bigger law enforcement agency than the fbi. and that is only one police department. and i could tell you attacks when i was mayor before september 11th that were thwarted by intelligent new york
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city police officers that were trained to look for what commissioner bratton termed the precursors of terrorism. we're going to need more of that and this committee needs to encourage it. it is hard to get agencies to work together. we all know that. but the work of this committee under you, mr. chairman, and under mr. king, has really been excellent in helping to bring the law enforcement agencies together and i urge that you continue to do that. because although the threat may not be as large as it was with al qaeda, it is more diverse and harder to find. and the threat of iran is greater than both. thank you. >> thank you, mayor, for those profound remarks. you are clearly the expert on this in the room. and i also want to commend nypd and the fbi and homeland
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officials who have worked well together. it didn't always used to be that way, as you know. to stop the threats. and i've never seen these organizations working as well as they do today, which is evidenced by the amount of threats that we have stopped an the number of arrests that we have made. over 60 in the past year. to stop that. but they only have to be right once and people ask what keeps me up at night, it is the case that we don't know about. you talked about 1979, it transformed the middle east, we're still reeling from that today. we had flags, warning signs, rams, world trade center bombings and 12 synagogues, 12 airlines, plotting with the
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mastermind of 9/11 that eventually came back to this target and unfortunately brought the twin towers down. the job of this committee is to make sure this never happens again but we have to see the warning signs along the way. i look at the uniform of the navy s.e.a.l., team 6, the man who killed bin laden, the seal team 6 that brought him down. but the threat didn't die that day with bin laden. and i think many have tried to downgrade that it's over. the war on terror is over. i agree. i was a federal prosecutor like yourself. this is not a criminal case. this is a war that has to be clearly defined who the enemy is and that is rad cam islamic extremists. and only through that can you defeat that enemy. that was a great day when bin
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laden was killed. but it didn't end the threat. now the threat is evolving. the threat is different. the challenge is different. i believe that the policy of containment against isis is not going to win the day. as long as they can fester over there after the arab spring, we've seen it fall, it filled by terrorists in northern africa and all throughout the middle east, and as that threat grows overseas, so too does a threat to the homeland because they have greater territory to launch external operations, including operations over the internet that we've seen more recently. so i ask my question to you, sir, there are many facets to this military, politically, from an ideological struggle, what more needs to be done to defeat this enemy? >> well i think i outlined some
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of it. which is i think there should be considerably more engagement in the parts of the world with people are plotting to kill us. it seems to me, it made sense to have american military in the places that were of most danger to us, which is the reason we kept our military in germany for so long and in south korea for so long. i think the withdraw of our troops from iraq and afghanistan on a time table will prove historically to be a horrible mistake. i believe it was the genesis of isis and our inability to properly assess isis. i think the failure to have american troops in areas of great concern to us, meaning where people are plotting to kill us, deprives us of intelligence because it is the military that can gain a lot of that intelligence for us because
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of their interreaction with people, informants and others that they come in contact with. so i think there has to be an acknowledgment on the part of the administration that whether we want to call it a war or not, it is a war. and the military should be engaged. i also believe there should be more support for local policing. because this is come down to now trying to find the so-called lone wolf. well there have been so many lone wolves that it is a pack of wolves, not just a lone wolf. and they're hard to find. they require trained police officers in looking for, as i said before, the precursors of terrorism. it is a different kind of training. it is very specialized. and it could use considerably more federal support and help at
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the local level. we can no longer rely just on the fbi, the cia, the nsa, and even the military, because not all threats are coming from abroad. some are. some of the threats are coming from someone's home. and we need police officers who can observe suspicious activities. and we should not allow political correctness to override sensible law enforcement decisions about what needs to be done to protect lives. we shouldn't lose a single american life to political correctness. >> and i think the foreign intelligence gained by the fbi and the intelligence community combined with the street intelligence from our state and local police working together is a way -- best way to protect the homeland from these threats. my final question to you, sir, from your testimony, you appear
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to be opposed to the iran negotiation, the iran deal. why do you oppose that? >> i oppose that because i do not believe it makes sense to reach an agreement on the controlling of nuclear weapons with a mass murderer. i think history has proven that negotiations with mass murderers only lead to substantially more problems later. i am extremely upset about the fact that the goals of that negotiation have changed. you might remember the goal of the negotiation, including the u.n. sanctions originally, was for iran to be non-nuclear. and it now becomes now nuclear should iran be. they should not have their hands on nuclear weapons. iran does not need the peaceful
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use of nuclear power. it is not an energy-starved country. it is absurd to think that iran needs the peaceful use of nuclear power. if we accept that, i would imagine the ayatollah and his wise men are laughing at us, that we accept the idea that they need the peaceful use of nuclear power. they are developing nuclear power for one reason and one reason alone. because they want to create an empire. which we are letting them do. they control iraq, we do not. they control syria, we do not. and they are basically at war with saudi arabia and yemen through the houthis. this is an enormously aggressive foe. and i learned a lesson from the cold war. i had the great honor of working
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for president ronald reagan. and president reagan always had a nightmare. and this is why he ended the cold war. but he ended the cold war by pointing missiles at the soviet union. and by telling them, he would be willing to use those missiles. he ended the cold war by beginning to develop a nuke shield that was laughed at and ridiculed. it is the nuclear shield that worked in israel. the reality is that we have to realize that we are putting the nuclear button in the hands of mad men. if the ayatollah and the regime in iran is not insane, it does a
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pretense of being insane. to deny the holocaust. to call for the destruction of one of our strongest allies, the state of israel. to call for the death of americans, to be responsible for american hostages for 444 days, and for killing thousands of americans, i would have to say this is an insane regime. ronald reagan's nightmare was mutually assured destruction was an immoral way to keep the peace. because if a mad man got control of the button in either place, the soviet union, or the united states, the world could come to an end. nuclear arms, nuclear capacity should not be put in the hands of mad men. >> thank you, sir. chair now recognizes the ranking member. >> thank you mr. chairman and
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again thank you, mayor, for being before us. as usual, there are some things that i agree with you and there are some things where we differ. certainly you and i have been on the same side with respect to iran and its really terrible acts of violence that it does in inciting, particularly in the middle east and to its own people. so on that, we definitely agree, they are a terrible player. but i really -- i've been 19 years in the congress, 19 years on the military committee. number two for the democrats on the military committee now. 17 of those 19 years, being on the committee that does nuclear war, et cetera. doing special forces. i was the chairwoman for special forces sub-committee, et cetera. so i know your area -- your
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expert ears is not in the military. i really want to get to the area where i do believe you have extreme expertise. and i want to illicit from you some information that we can use. >> sure. >> so i won't argue with you about what is going on with the military. i definitely have a different view point. but i want to talk to you about the funding that the federal government and the system in which we try to buttress what our local law enforcement are doing. i mentioned in my opening statement that i'm very concerned when i see burner or cops grants or whatever it is we are packaging into the local government the federal funds. and the fact they are significantly decreasing over time. and more importantly, there is just the lack of predictability as to how those funds will flow,
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when they will flow, and for what they will flow. can you talk a little bit about -- having overseen the city and in particular during the times of preparedness for your first responders, what that does to you and what you would see as more useful from a funding perspective from the federal government? >> well, when i was the mayor, when i was the mayor i supported the crime bill. and the crime bill was a great bargain between conservatives and liberals. and it included social programs that conservatives disagreed with and including the death penalty and funding -- tremendous funding for local police that some liberals disagreed wnd somehow under president clinton's leadership
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he put together a bipartisan group of mayors that included me and ed rendell, the democratic mayor of philadelphia, the republican mayor of los angeles and the democratic mayor of st. paul. and from that we received money for me to hire considerably more police men. commissioner bratton and i received a great deal of funding. we were able to increase the size of the police department from about 34,000, 35,000 to 41,000. aside from dealing with september 11th, it helped us special in the massive reduction in crime, which by the time i left was 65% reduction in homicide. but on september 11th, it left us with a large enough police department, although we did need
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help from other cities, that we were able to handle it and deal with it. but every year the funding was in doubt. every year we had to make cutbacks and then restore. we tried to manage our way through it. i think we did. but you're absolutely correct, the funding should be -- we should know what it is and be able to plan on it for a five or ten-year period. law enforcement strategies, in particular terrorism strategies, as the chairman said, this is a long war. this requires ten years of planning, 20 years of planning. and therefore, whatever funding congress is going to provide and the federal government, it should be consistent and as a mayor, which i no longer am, but if i was, or even let's say as a police or fire commissioner or
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head of emergency services, you should have a sense of what the funding will be four and five years from now. the mayor of new york city is required to produce a budget for four years. which i think is very, very smart. i thought it was one of the great things that came out of the fiscal crisis of new york city. it removes a lot of one-shots and tricks. because i have to show, if i reduce now, what will happen four years from now. or if i increase now. and we can't factor the federal government in. i don't make one final parochial point on behalf of my city. my city contributes considerably more to the federal government than the federal government contributes to the city. we are a donor city and a donor state. meaning, we give you much more money in tax revenues than we get back in benefits. and i'm including all of the benefits for medicare, medicaid,
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and the poor. and the senator used to publish that report every year and he and i would hold a press conference to show that new york city was being short-changed by $7 or $8, the state by about $12 billion. so we are giving you more money than you are giving back. so at least give it back in a consistent way. >> thank you for that. i happen to represent orange county, california and we are a donor county. >> maybe you are. because you have become larger. and my numbers are 13, 14 years old. >> so i understand and my people understand in particular, the fact that we are community givers in a sense because we do pay more in taxes than we'll ever receive back in that area. let me indulge, if you will, one
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more question, mr. chairman. this question is about after the boston marathon bombings, the harvard kennedy school released a plan action report where it identified the need for improved guidance regarding the role of political leaders and emergency managers during disaster response and how those entities ought to coordinate. and going back to your mayorship, and the reason i don't think you are not doing important things today, but that was a specific time where you had really the largest ever known disaster on our homeland. but i know since then you are working with mayors in other cities to ensure that they are ready and that things are going well in case there should have to be an attack we don't stop in the planning stages. and so my question to you is, can you describe your role in the incident command structure,
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when you were here in new york, especially on that 9/11 day, and what advice you would give other mayors and us with respect to emergency managers and first responders during a disaster of that type? what lesson can we bring away from that, given your experience? >> well, first of all, new york city is very fortunate in that it really isn't a city, it's a confederation of counties. we're five counties in the state of new york. in most cases, for example in miami, or in los angeles, the city is an entity within a much larger county.
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or let's take boston. so when i have a deal with september 11th or the 30 or 40 other crises i had to deal with of a lesser scale, but since we have so many crises, the police and the firefighters, the emergency people, are used to crisis. we have one entity. in boston, the report that you're dealing with, is talking about having to coordinate seven, eight, nine, ten, 12, 15 different police departments. as many different fire departments, some are volunteer fire departments. maybe an emergency services unit, maybe not. so the -- the job of coordination is much harder outside of new york. because new york is so big, and because it is one entity.
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that doesn't mean we didn't have tremendous problems of coordination. but you can imagine, you mult my -- mult my those problems by 10 or 20 when it is seven or eight departments that have to work together. governor tacky and i made a decision shortly after the attack, i would say it was 40 minutes, i was trapped in a building for 20 minutes, when i got out, i called the governor, and the governor and i decided to put our governments together. and we set up a headquarters first at the police academy and then on the pier because the police academy turned out to be too small. and we made all of our decisions together. i would have a staff meeting every morning when i was mayor. he would as governor. we had our staff meeting together. and we did that for 2 1/2
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months. and we did that because we realized that, first of all, a lot of bickering goes on between staffs that do not go on between principals. second, there is a tremendous amount of bureaucracy in getting anything done. so if i have my commissioner and his commissioner, and they were having a fight, and we could resolve it right there and get it done and move it forward. so my recommendation is you've got to do exercises. i'm a big believer in relentless preparation. we had numerous exercises in new york. at one point we did an exercise with the federal government pretending there was a serrin gas attack here at the trade center. we brought in the federal and local people to see if they
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could work together and we found out we know very little about the gas and anthrax. and then we learned a lot about it. we did a mock plane crash on the border of new york city and nassau county, to see how they would work together and to make sure they knew how to work together if, in case, there was a plane crash at kennedy airport, which borders right on the beginnings of nassau county. we did table-top exercises like a possible sarin gas attack at a knick game, how would you evacuate. so one of the things among many that i urge and probably the most important is tremendous amount of preparation. go through the incident before it happens.
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so that when it happens, you're not going through it for the first time. and that is how i distinguish, let's say, the response to september 11th, where the city, the state, and the federal government, which included fema, by the way, by that afternoon, were sitting at the same table. and then the mistakes that were made in katrina, where the governor stayed in the capitol and the mayor stays in the city and fema stayed -- well somewhere. >> and the sheriff stayed on the bridge, as i recall. >> yeah. >> thank you very much, mayor. i'm really blessed to represent an area where we have mutual assistance. and so my 34 cities, the police and emergency and everything, all fall under our sheriff. >> but they have to work at that. >> and under our sheriff we fall under the l.a. sheriff if it should be larger. and i think you're right, one of the things we could do effectively mr. chairman is to look at funding more of the
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exercises because people really need to go through them to understand. >> i know in boston, it helped out tremendously. chair recognizes the gentleman from new york, mr. king. >> thank you, mr. chairman. rudy, it is great to have you here today. i would like to make a few points at the start. one i want to thank the port authority for the great job and acknowledge my neighbor, jon ryan, the chief of the department. good to see you, ryan. and as far as the homeland security funding, and in the last several years it has stabilized and i commend secretary johnson for taking the cities off the list because the monies should go to the cities that are the targets. it makes no sense to send the funding all over the country. i want to thank him for making the tough decisions and narrow it down to the cities that do need the funding and new york's funding for the last three years have been consistent. when president obama came in he
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did try to cut the program and we worked with him and that has been stabilized so i would say while there were always problems and we could always use more funding, over the last several years new york has been treated fairly and i'll address mr. bratton later but there is a much better job on that. as far as the nypd, no one has done more to stop domestic terrorism in this country than the nypd. i know the new york times is quoted as saying the nypd spies. i would rely on the new york times for absolutely nothing. and what they call spying, i call good police balance. and you don't have to believe me. but john brennan, when he was president obama's homeland security adviser he said they were the model for the country as far as combatting islamic terrorism. and if we are talking about profiling and ethnic, you're italy, and they went after the
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italy-american and they hit every irish bar and nobody was going to harlem. they knew where to find them and that was in the irish neighborhoods so i think we should put political correctness aside. and these are deadly enemies that we face. and if we cater to the people who want to ream their hands and under mayor bloomberg and commissioner kelly, 16 plots in 12 years were stopped. commissioner bratton, in less than two years, 12 plots were stopped. and what happened over the fourth of july, what bratton did was stop the threats to new york and the arrested made here here in new york. if they had not been made we would have a different climate today. we came close to be attacked over the fourth of july.
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port authority cops were killed. but people are still dying. cops and firefighters are still dying as a result of the illnesses they incurred. and the fire department alone and commissioner and i can talk with more authority on this, they lost 111 firefighters who died since 9/11 from 9/11 related health illnesses. so i would ask you again, as the former mayor, who did a phenomenal job and we can never thank you for the leadership you showed on september 11th and the weeks afterward where you held the entire country together, the importance of extending the act that expires this year and the zed rogga act, and there were hundreds that came to volunteer and 49 congressional districts have that extended. >> first of all, of critical importance, it shouldn't even be
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a question, it is a matter of duty that we owe to these people. i can tell you, as the mayor, at the time, and going through the trauma and shock of september 11th, to have people come here from all over the country to help us, was enormously important. for two reasons. first of all, even though new york city has the largest police department and the largest fire department, the largest emergency services, components, significant presence of fbi and everything else, this attack was beyond our capacity. when i talk to governor pataki on the phone shortly after getting out of the building i was trapped in, the governor thought i had -- the governor thought i had died. and he said thank god, we thought you were lost. and he said, mayor, i know you
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don't like this, but i've prepositioned the national guard and i've put them on randall's island. why he said that was, i always resisted the national guard in new york city for any kind of civil disturbance. because, number one, i was quite confident my police department could handle it and number two, i don't like putting national guard in a law enforcement situation because there are differences that they are not trained for and i don't want fema getting in trouble, doing something that a cop knows you would do. when he said that, i had a totally different reaction. i said thank you for getting the national guard and if you can get ten more of them, i need them. september 11th was way beyond new york city. so i needed all of the help that i could get. mayor dally from chicago sent me police officers and firefighters.
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governor bush from florida sent me state police officers. i got help from maryland. i got help from indiana. i got help from every part of the country. and number one, we needed the help. and number two, we needed the emotional support. even more than the help. we needed the feeling that we weren't alone. that we were being supported by the rest of the country. think of it as the loss of a loved one. your first feeling is that you are all alone and then you have a wake or a gathering and people come and hug and squeeze you and now you realize you are not alone in your trauma. well the presence of all of those people that came here was enormous loy important. many of them sacrificed their health to do that.
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i knew from the moment that started, that this would be an enormously dangerous operation and was very worried people would die almost as though a firefighter have his head decapitated by a crane that swung around and he was tackled by another firefighter who saved his life. so these people -- look, these illnesses, we don't understand. the simple fact is this never happened to us before. so at the time that it was happening, and to this day, we're doing the best we can to try to figure out what the damage is physical and psychological. and i know people that are suffering from ptsd as a result of september 11th. it is horrible to see, but they are. and that is not going to stop tomorrow. that is going to go on next year and the year after and year
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after. so i think this should be continued if we really mean that we're not going to forget. >> thank you, rudy. thank you for your service. >> chair recognizes miss jackson william. >> mr. chairman, thank you very much and i want to thank you and our ranking member for your leadership and i think it should be noted here in new york, mayor, that this is one of the most bipartisan committees in the united states congress. i'm grateful for it. because i certainly was not you, but as a member of congress, i sought to come to this sacred place as soon as i could. and in actuality, i managed to arrive and there was still the recovery process going on and became one of the early members of the homeland security committee and ultimately the department was created. we thank you for your service. and we thank those -- i had my
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office just print out for me the names of firefighters, police officers, fire marshal and the chaplain you mentioned just to reinforce for america that these souls gave their life for this nation. as i walked into this place, i could not help but read no day shall erase you from the memory of time. and i think as members of congress, this is something that maybe we should carry for all of our very weighty decisions that we'll be making. and i know you note that we'll be discussing a very important agreement come this week. i will not choose to discuss the iran nuclear agreement, but what i will say to the american people and those listening, this will be a vigorous debate with members of congress seriously considering the security of this
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nation. some of us will vote yes because we have deliberated and believe it is the right decision. but i want to give you comfort that it will be a vigorous and thoughtful discussion working on behalf of the american people as you have done. so i want to proceed to talk about the people whose lives were lost and whose memories will never be erased. and to join with my colleague. and let me, of course, acknowledge congressman king and kathleen rice, and john catco, new yorkers who have been outstanding on this committee and thank them for their service and others who have gone on. but let me again agree with congressman king. i'm a champion of the reauthorization of this legislation dealing with those who are impacted. so i just want to be somewhat redundant and ask the question, is it not imperative that we, as quickly as possible, reauthorize
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the james zadroga legislation primarily because of what you said. but is the urgency there, as i understand it, there are individuals whose sickness are being discovered sh the length of sicknesses, people who are losing their lives, is it imperative that we sort of move quickly on this? >> the simple answer is yes. and i underline that. it is important that you do move on it. and i also would like to acknowledge, congresswoman from our previous encounters in the past, that i know the bipartisan nature of this committee, how it has always worked to do the very best that it could to try to improve homeland security. and i must tell you, just as someone who works in the field of security, i greatly appreciate what you do on both sides of the aisle and try very, very hard to reconcile differences because you realize,
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as we did immediately after september 11th, that in protecting ourselves against terrorism, we're not democrats and republicans, we're americans. >> i have another sort of directed question if i could. we've heard different perspectives on the funding. but i want to ask the question of the value of consistent funding for police departments, first responders having an ability to plan. and you noted you have a four-year budget here and therefore you would be willing to do that. as i do that, i can't leave out my city of houston. everyone has mentioned their area and i want to bring greetings from the former mayor of the city of houston, mayor leapy brown who was a commissioner here in new york ayou know and served ably and houston was one of the cities rumors primarily because of the energy resources there. but the consistency of funding,
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how important is that? >> it is very important. like in business. most people in business will tell you what we need to know is what we're going to get or not get and then we can make plans. and since budget in new york city is an enormously complex process, it is now a 70 -- i believe eight billion dollar budget, almost double the size it was when i was mayor. consistency is enormously important. in other words, knowing what you can count on so you can figure out how to make up the difference somewhere else. >> and one last question and would you like to submit to the record, hr 2795, a bill that i've introduced called the friends act which is to address the impact on first responders of the concerns regarding their families. when they are being called off and may spend long days and
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hours away, the responsibility of the homeland security department should look into resources for the families of first responders while they are engaged on fighting the war on terror. i would like to submit this into the record. hr-2795. >> without objection, so ordered. >> thank you. and mr. mayor let me follow up my question on this. as i said, this bill deals with the idea of not leaving these first responders burdened with what is happening to my family. we should have some sort of response plan for families left behind while they are. and so i'm going to ask you whether it is a valuable thinking that i should engage in. but i want to raise this point. as i started out, i indicated that this place, this hollow ground was very moving to me as i walked in. i wanted to take a moment to honor the thousands of victims on this hollowed ground and
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those in shanksville, pennsylvania, and the pentagon. and those of us in congress at that time, mr. mayor, we there and saw as the plane came down on the pentagon. it is a very real vision in our minds and our psyche. and to acknowledge those military personnel who went forward into battle after this time. and i note this particular hearing title, it does sort of throw us into the arms of fear somewhat. and i want to end on celebrating the bravery and the sacrifice of those who lost their lives. and i would like to -- because you have said that any moment, we are subjected to the possibility of a terrorist act anywhere in the united states, where the bad guys think they can make a statement to the world about our democracy and our peace. so i would like you first to comment on the value of trying to think about the families of first responders and then second i would like you to think about
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what i think you're proud of, is that new york city is a hallmark of resiliency and how it rebuilt itself from devastation. and in that, how we should be -- i guess i'm wrapping three questions -- how we should be concerned about home grown terrorism with the attitude we stigmatize no race or group but we are conscious about that potential. so the friends act, which is about the families, the resiliency and then home grown terrorism. >> well the friends act makes a great deal of sense, congresswoman. the reality is that the families suffer sometimes more than the responders. i've found not just in september 11th, but with the loss of almost 50 firefighters and police officers before september 11th, that the men and
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women who are engaged in the activity have the adrenalin and the sort of satisfaction of doing what they -- what it is they believe they can do best. it's the families that are left behind to suffer. and i come from a family with four uncles who are police officers and one who was a firefighter and he had been seriously injured twice. and i know how devastating that was on my family. and when you get a big incident like this, this is something where there should be support for the famlies. i am very glad you mentioned the word resiliency because i am enormously proud of the following fact -- there are twice as many people that live in this area of new york today than before september 11.
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on september 11 and in the days after september 11 we weren't sure anybody who because going to return here. the people who lived here had to be moved out. the businesses had to be moved out. thank goodness to two companies, merrill lynch and american express, who made clear immediately they would return. other companies i would have to spend enormous amounts of time on the telephone and the american begging them, pleading with them to come back. this went on for some time. and i don't think we ever thought we'd be able to get it back, even to where it was. but to demonstrate the resiliency of new yorkers and americans, there are twice as many people living here today than before september 11. they fully recognize that this is a target.
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but they also realize that you have to have life go on and you can't let these terrorists terrorize us. >> absolutely. >> a defense to terrorism is resiliency. >> absolutely. >> and it's a more subtle deft but a very, very important one. and the resiliency of new york has been, i think, a real model for which the people who live here should get great, great credit. and this is a very vital community. it has little leagues, it has soccer legs. this has become a community 20 years ago this was purely, as you know, offices. this was wall street and is wall street moved to midtown, really, and this has become a mixed business/residential community. it's one of the most vital and unfortunately it's starting to get too darn expensive for a lot of people. but that's what happens.
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the second thing is, thank you for mentioning the bravery of the firefighters and police officers. the september 11 commission who when they concluded with their recommendations and conclusions made some very helpful observations. so laudatory, some critical, all very helpful. but one of the things they pointed out was that the new york city fire department saved 98% of the people they were capable of saving. and i would like this committee to know that the first estimate that i was given of the number of losses was 12,000. that was the first number. by the end of that day when i was asked a question "how many casualties do you think you had?" the number that i had from all
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of our sources was 6,000. and that's why i said -- i didn't mention a number and i said it's just too much for us to bear to talk about that right now. turned out to be less than 3,000. that's a terrible number and and thanked me. and you know what they say to
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me? "thank you for your firefighters, because if they hadn't remained calm, we could have lost more people in the evacuation than we lost in the attack." now, i'm not sure that's true, but they believe that. but we know of many evacuations that are chaotic and that lead to death during the evacuation. this was not a chaotic evacuation. this was an orderly very well-handled evacuation and it only was that because these men and women gave up their lives and that is a source of, i think, tremendous strength for america. imagine if the headline the next day in addition to the fact that this was the worst attack in our history was it also was characterized by firefighters and police officers who ran away. . can you imagine how that would have affected the morale of the united states and how different was it that the headline the
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next day was about a terrible attack but also stories of incredible bravery on the part of the fire department, the port authority, the police department and also single individuals like from morgan stanley and others who played the same role. >> thank you very much. we are a not allowing terrorists to terrorize us. >> you're exactly right. >> i thank the gentlelady. we have eight members left for questions. we have a second panel. i'm going to have to strictly enforce a five-minute rule. with that i recognize miss miller. >> thank you. i appreciate you enforcing the five-minute rule. mr. mayor -- and i say that with the highest degree of respect, because sitting here today in this sacred place and having the opportunity, it was my first time to be here last night and
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joe gave us a tour of this facility and every american thinking about where they were on that day, i think -- we were all talking about, where were you? where were you? what happened? but when we think about -- one of the things i think about then is that you not being just the mayor of new york city, you were america's mayor at that time. you became america's mayor and the entire world looked to you for your news conferences so we could figure out what was happening. here's rudy, he'll tell us what's going on. we're listening to you all the time. so being here today in this place and listening to you and your thoughts and remembrances are certainly a bit overwhelming, as some other members have said. certainly emotional. but i think i'm going to go right to picking up a little bit what you just talked about, the 9/11 commission and some of the recommendations they made because, really, one of the things that as you said it didn't start on 9/11 but i think
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many people realize we are facing such a different enemy than our country has ever faced before and the battlefield has changed. you don't see now around the hill with with everyone has the same kind of uniform where you can immediately identify them. no, we're facing cockroaches, cowards, it's an asymmetrical battlefield. and who responds? not the military in many cases, it's the first responders that are responding over the countries, whether it just happened in chattanooga, various things that have happened here. but one of the key recommendations i think that came out of the 9/11 commission was say said there were so many different agencies that were stove piping their ability to communicate one another. really the inability to kwhun kate and i think -- certainly i've heard you speak on many occasions about some of the handicaps you had here and the inability to cooperate properly with one another and the 9/11 commission said we need to go
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from the need to know to the need to share. the need to share information from all various agencies. and yet we still learned some of the lessons you mentioned about the boston marathon bombings there where really -- and we had a hearing on this, you know, you've got 12,000, 13,000 fbi agents across the country, 35 police officers here in new york city alone. one thing about the street, the street talks and the ability to have law enforcement gather the information, share the information and from our best intelligence in our country to make sure it gets down to the boots on the grounds and having interoperability, et cetera. so i would like to have you expand on how important it is to have the interoperability, the ability to community kate, the most simple thing, communication, how important it is and for the. from's role in making sure we get the resources out into the first responders that people can talk to one another about what's
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coming, what's happening, god forbid when there is some other attempt, attack, what have you. >> well, i'll be very brief because i think commissioner bratton can give you more details on this because both here and in los angeles he was in the forefront of developing criteria that you use to try to identify terrorists. well, it's all well and good to have that criteria or precursors of terrorism, and the new york city police department utilizes it, but i'm not sure that's being done all over the country. and it needs to be done, because as we've now found out, although new york is is a big target and the main target, i think we're now turning into a situation where there are many targets. and with these lone wolves or smaller groups of terrorists, i think we'll see smaller towns
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and more isolated places attacked and in a way that produces its own kind of fear, like you're not safe anywhere. and therefore this committee, i think, can play a very useful role in helping the department of homeland security in i think what one of its main missions is, which is to make sure every police department, every fire department, every emergency services department in the united states has at least a basic ability to deal with spotting terrorists, identifying terrorists, and then how to react if it happens and i very much appreciate your description of them as cockroaches because that's a great example of the difference. these people are emerging from the ground and it's the police officers that patrol the streets who have the most knowledge of the ground. and sometimes it's the police officers who can interpret the
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intelligence better. there was one incident during september 11 when it took me four hours to get the information from the federal government that i needed for my police commissioner and police department to interpret. and i wanted the words. they had increased the threat on new york but they wouldn't give us the words that were used and i finally was able to impress on -- well, i won't say who in washingt washington. i think i said something like "i might cancel the world series." because i wanted the words. now, why did i want the words? i wanted the words because if i could share that with my police department, the words -- which may mean nothing to an analyst in washington, might give a hint
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to my police officers that it's a bridge, a tunnel, a building that's going to be hit. because they may understand something in the language because they know the city. the analyst in washington doesn't know the city. but our cops on the street know the city. and one of the excuses i was given was "we don't share information like this with local law enforcement because local law enforcement leaks." to which even though it was shortly after september 11 i just laughed and said "you're talking to somebody who was a federal prosecutor for 17 years and don't tell me the fbi doesn't leak." ha. my department doesn't leak any more than the fbi. and we're not going to leak this information because we know how critical it is. and we don't have time to worry
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about leaks because if you give it to me now it can be actionable information otherwise i'm going to read about it four days later in the "new york times" anyway, so you might as well give it to me. and your committee can perform a very useful function in breaking down that barrier. the protection against these cockroaches are our local police. but they need to get information in order to know what to look for. it's not just give information, they need to get information. and these joint terrific task forces are quite an effective way to do that and i would really consider expanding. >> thank you, mr. mayor, thank you, mr. chairman. >> and the world series went forward and the president threw a perfect strike as i recall, right? >> as challenged by derek jeter. [ laughter ] >> chair recognizes mr. vela. >> thank you, mr. chairman, and
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thank you for holding this hearing in these solemn grounds. i think as we go back to washington, it's important to go back there and with the perspective of knowing that what happened here was such a tragedy and that we owe it to our country to honor those who fell and who lost their lives and thank you for your compelling testimony, mayor, and thank you for reminding us how this area has flourished since 9/11. on 9/11, i was under a court order to take a deposition in new york city about a week later and you can't live too much further away if you're an american than i do because i'm from brownsville, texas. opposing counsel and i had to make a decision because there aren't too many flights going
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out so we decided to drive and it took us three days and i remember when i got here it wasn't the new york city that i was used to visiting. i remember how quiet it was. i remember the dust. i remember just how gray it was. and then several years later i stayed at the very hotel across the street that we stayed in last night and i remember thinking to myself, i'll never stay here again. because by that time the jackhammers had come back and they were starting to rebuild and then last year at the invitation of congressman crowley, my friend from queens, i had the pleasure of touring the new freedom tower, i was on the 64th floor and the port authority gave us a tour and i remember being on that top floor and thinking to myself what a great tribute it was to the
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people of this city to be rebuilding and, of course, here we are today. but at the end of the day, the most important thing about this hearing is that we the american people owe the people of new york a great deal of gratitude for rebuilding and for honoring the people that died here that day. i'm going to limit my questions. i've got two questions and i'm going to limit them to this and that is we talked about the diversity of the threat that we face today because it's not just in new york, it's all over this country and i'm curious about what your assessment is. we know how prepared the city of new york through federal, state, and local cooperation is to deal and prevent these threats.
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16 in the last several years. h what is your assessment of how other places around the country are prepared to prevent those threats? >> well, first of all, mr. vela, i may i say that september 11 brought us together much closer than a country has ever been for about two or three months. no democrat, no republicans, no liberal, no conservatives, just americans working together. but i can tell you in new york opposing counsel would never be able to drive in the same car to brownsville, texas, without beating the heck out of each other. >> well, we did drive separately. >> oh, okay. because i know lawyers, lawyers aren't affected by any of this. may i just interrupt for one second to suggest to you that one of the funding things you should consider is funding this as a national museum. there's a bill pending to do that and this really should be a
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national museum because it affected the whole nation and i would just like you to know how important i believe that is that this be funded as a national museum. >> we'll take that back to our committees of interest. >> i'm sorry, the rest of the question? >> i was curious what your assessment is of how other communities -- >> oh, yes. it's very mixed, to be honest. in my ability to get around and talk to the police and i travel a great deal, some communities are -- some cities and countries are tremendously well prepared.
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and some are not well prepared. and i've always thought that are the mission of the department of homeland security is to get every place in america ready and to orth of set a standard that every community should reach. everyone should understand anthrax and sarin gas and biological agents and how to detect them and that's a naungs the department of homeland security should monitor. the present head of homeland security was one of my assistant u.s. attorneys and i have great respect for him and i think he's doing a very good job of trying to do that. and any assistance you can give him in that regard i think would be enormously important.
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i think we have to think of the fact that although new york is a major target as is d.c. or los angeles or -- these new terrorists -- let's call name -- might be thinking let's attack them in places of less resistan resistance. >> like chattanooga. >> like chattanooga. and therefore what that means is a tremendous burden on the secretary of homeland security and homeland security department to get a lot of departments that wouldn't necessarily face a lot of emergencies up to speed and i think your encouragement and sensible funding of that working with jeh johnson could be a very important thing because it's something he understands and it's something he's trying to do. >> thank you. >> thank you, mr. chairman.
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mayor, on 9/11 i remember standing in the u.s. attorney's office in syracuse where i was an organized crime prosecutor and watching the events unfold and it left an indelible impression on me. but also what left an impression on me was your leadership that day and your leadership in the days and months thereafter. i think you had a profoundly pozive effect on our country and i thank you for that. since that time, i've watched you gain more experience and more knowledge on the whole terrorist threat globally and with respect to the united states and as i see it the threat matrix has changed. back in 9/11 people came to this country to attack us and now we have the phenomenon with isis where people within this country of ours, american citizens, are being implored to take up arms against the country, go blow up
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something, go shoot something. it's a very different threat matrix now and i'd very much like to have your impression on what you think is the best way to attack it. you touched on it with the violent extremism and how it's branching out to different areas, not necessarily centered in one city right now, or new york city, for example. the biggest thing that i'm concerned about now is how do you counter that violent extremism in the communities? one of the things i think we need to focus on is those communities nationwide when we see people who might become radicalized, what do you do? how do you go about fighting it? how do you go about interceding before somebody who's drifting in the wrong direction does something terrible and i'd like to hear your input on that. >> well, first of all the idea that there would be lone wolf
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attacks or attacks that were self-generated two, three people who were natives of the country doing this in a way our government starting about a year ago was acting as if there was a big surprise. bin laden wrote about this in the 1997 and some of his surrogates couraencouraged this 1998 and 1995. gosh, it happened in london. i don't know why we're so far behind all the time. >> we're not heeding the warnings. >> yeah. i was one block away from the first bomb that went off in the liverpool station with exactly the same police officer who was
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with me and got me out of the building i was trapped in which is a heck of a coincidence and it stopped getting me invited anywhere for about five years but if i recall correctly, all four of those bombers were citizens of the uk and two of them were born there. so i don't know, i would think we would have started then saying to ourselves this is a threat. well, okay, finally in the last year we recognize it. and it does require a different law enforcement strategy and it requires a different military strategy. it requires, as i said, the use of the police in a much more energetic way and a much more informed way as our eyes and ears. it also requires something that is controversial but it's true.
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it requires understanding there's an organizing principle. these are not singular acts of crime like, you know, the shooting that took place in brooklyn the other night at the west indian parade or a shooting that might take place in chicago or a shooting that might take place here or there, whatever. there's an organizing principle much like the mafia was an organizing principle. a mafia murder in new york was different than a murder in new york. the mafia murder in new york had an organizing principle behind it and these attacks have an organizing principle behind it, it's called their interpretation of how mohammed taught jihad. which islamic scholars could have great debate.
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one interpretation is to remove or subjugate the infidel. this comes out of islamic literature. many reform muslims reject it but some muslims accept it. but there's an organizing principle here. if we fact a state of denial out of political correctness that this is the organizing principle then we're going to miss a lot of these situations because that helps to give us some of the criteria that we're looking for, that some people think should be ignored. so the reality is we need to train our police, we need to realize that the organizing principle here is jihad and their interpretation of it. that means we look in the places where that's going to be taught
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and exploited -- social media, unfortunately mosques, certain groups that are more extremist than others and that we somehow say the words islamic extremist terrorist and not be condemned as bigots for saying it. congressman king made a reference to the mafia. when i indicted the first group of mafia members in new york and referred to them as the mafia i had a demonstration in front of my office by the italian american civil rights league. the italian american civil rights league was founded by a man named joe columbo who was the head of the columbo crime family. and i also found out something i didn't know. in the justice department manual
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it was improper to refer to a group as the mafia. i could have been penalized. and you know they love to penalize in the justice department. >> oh, yes, i was there 230r years, i understand that. >> i had actually violated the rule of the justice department in using the word "mafia." and i said "well, punish me. because there is a mafia and it has an organizing principle." you know what that principle is? being italian. that's the principle. and when there were a bunch of car thefts in southern brooklyn i didn't go look for hispanics or asians or blacks, i went and looked for italian kids because they were doing all the car thefts. that was profiliing but if i
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hadn't profiled i wouldn't have caught them. there's two kinds of profiling, profiling based on hard facts that lead you to the criminal or criminal group or criminal enterprise here or profiling just for the purpose of harming some particular group that is doing nothing wrong. so i think we have to define this word carefully and i think that political correct nts has cost us lives. i do not think the attack at fort hood would have occurred if we had not been applying political correctness and i think those brave people would be alive today. i think they died because of political correctness. because no one was paying attention to what was being written by the captain in which he was predicting what he was doing. in fact, he was promoted even
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though his colleagues were saying that he had become a very extreme erratic and big exponent of jihad i think he was not penalized and promoted because the people in the military were afraid that they'd be accused of picking on people of a certain group. >> thank you, mr. mayor. >> ms. rice is recognized. >> thank you, mr. chairman. mr. mayor, given your service as mayor to this great city of ours and your professional work since that time, how prepared do you think new york and this country are to handle a large-scale cyber attack that is probably one of the more inevitable attacks that we have to look at, in your opinion. >> not as well prepared as we are for the more traditional
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attacks. new york cy is -- and, again, commissioner bratton i would defer to, he can explain it. but from a long time ago new york city has constantly increased under different commissioners its response to terrorism. new york city police department is doing a lot of work, as is the fbi, in cyber security. but as a nation we are way behind in cyber security. way behind. because it can't be solved by the government alone. bern mizs have to spend a lot more money protecting themselves than they do if you're the ceo of a large company that's publicly traded, your
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expenditures for cyber security come out of your profit and loss. it means $10 million, $100 million and you show less profit in that quarter. and there's no countervailing benefit that you get for it. it isn't like hiring 50 people and they're productive and you can put something on the other side of the column. and american businesses number one have not spent enough time or money on developing cyber security and number two the methods and techniques that we use in many cases are contradictory, not everyone works with each other, people don't want to share intellectual property. there are many problems in the area that you're talking about
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that have not received the same attention that the other things we talked about earlier, the physical security, and that could be an area where this committee could play a big, big role in encouraging not only our government as we saw the vulnerability of the internal revenue service. my goodness, that's frightening. that's frightening that someone can come in and get documents from the internal revenue service. so i would say that's an area maybe where this committee should put some great emphasis. one of the big mistakes we make, i think, is we prepare for the next attack as if it's going to be the same as the last attack and what they're trying to do is trying to figure out some kind of new attack and i think we've been forewarned about cyber security so i'm very glad you brought it up and i think it's something that should be given a great deal more attention by
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both the government and the private sector. >> thank you, mr. mayor. >> i thank the gentlelady. mr. hurd is recognized. >> thank you mr. chairman and ranking member for holding this and mr. mayor, thanks for being here today and your leadership during a difficult time. i'd also like to thank the city of new york for hosting us. i'm from texas and texans and new yorkers have a lot in common. we're proud of our heritage, we have a bunch of great accents and, you know, we're not afraid to fight for our country. this is the second time i've tried to be here. the first time i tried to come to this great facility there were so many people here it was hard to get into and so that warms my heart to know that there are many folks that are not going to forget what happened on those days of september 11. this is special to me because i spent nine years as an undercover officer in the cia. mr. mayor, you talked about yemen.
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the day i left san antonio, texas, to start training in the cia was the day of the "cole" explosion and we did not take seriously what our enemies were saying then. you eluded to that in your opening remarks. we weren't taking seriously what was being said in the late '80s, either. and it's unfortunate, i'm nervous that we're not taking serious enough some of the concerns we're hearing all over the world from our current enemies. i've chased al qaeda all over the world in understood ya, pakistan, afghanistan, they're a real threat. isis' ability to leverage social media is shocking but one of the things we have to do is we have to stop it where they live and since you've been out of elected office, you've been a leader in emergency preparedness, public safety, leadership during
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crisis. you've been described as turning an ungovernable city into examples of good governance and effective management and you have done deals all over the world so i'm going to refer to you as a deal maker. i have two question, one on isis, one on iran. what else should we be doing in these places like syria and some of these cities to help them stop this scourge in their tracks? and my second question on iran, as a deal maker, usually when you do a deal people benefit on both sides of the deal. i'm still having a difficult time figuring out how the united states benefits from this iranian deal and i'd love your insights on that. >> on the second i would refer you to donald trump. "art of the deal." he would probably give a much more interesting answer that would get you much more coverage for this committee.
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but on the second question i think we were completely outnegotiated. if you just go back and look at what the premise of this negotiation was supposed to be, we lost on all those points. this all began ten years ago with u.n. resolutions that iran would be non-nuclear. that it would haven't any nuclear power. for the reason that i stated, you would have to be an idiot to think they need nuclear facilities in a country that's oil rich and natural gas rich. they don't need the peaceful use of nuclear power. so the premise of the original resolution was a non-nuclear iran we gave that away with the
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preliminary agreement when we began the negotiation with how nuclear should iran be? so what do we get back far? the release of prisoners? an iran that is going to give up being devoted to the destruction of israel? an iran that's going to give up being devoted to the death of americans? an iran that's going to stop funding hezbollah, hamas, the houthis and about 12 other groups that don't even have names yet? we didn't get anything back for that. then we were going to have ronald reagan trust but verify. well, we're just trusting, we're not verifying.
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first of all, we're consigning it to the iaea. the iaea was fooled twice by iran before. in 2003 and 2005. the fordow facility. i've forgotten the names of the other -- actually three facilities discovered by the mek that the iaea missed. i'm sorry, i wouldn't trust them. i'm a baseball fan. three strikes and you're out. trust but verify to ronald reagan meant we verify. we. the u.s. we go in and we make sure that they're not hiding nuclear material like they did before. if anybody took the time to read rouha rouhani's memoirs. the reform prime minister of
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iran, rouhani brags in his memoirs that he fooled us twice before. he brags about it! [ laughter ] i -- it's astounding to me that we -- that we're trusting him and then we're giving them 24 days which, by the way, as a lawyer having read the agreement i can probably extend into six months because you can appeal and it's not us that raises the objection, it's the iaea. who got fooled twice before -- actually three times before i'm trying to figure out what we're getting out of this. we're getting out of this the promise that they're not going to become nuclear for so 10 or 15 years.
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if you believe that, there is a bridge right here here i'm willing to sell you. so as a deal maker teaching deal making 101, guii would give us "f." but that's no different than our reset of our relationship with russia when we gave up the nuclear defense of the czech republic and poland. and what did we get in return for it? how about nothing? i would not sell my house for nothing. i would get something in return maybe if we had stuck to the nuclear defense of the czech republic in poland, crimea may never have happened. so i see a one-sided deal completely in favor of iran and
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i see worse than that an iranian empire developing. with iraq and syria and yemen. >> thank you. >> mr. ratcliffe is recognized. >> thank you, chairman mccaul for holding this hearing at this hallowed ground where nearly 14 years ago today america did look directly into the face of evil, an evil that took from us thousands of innocent lives in the most senseless and cowardly act of terrorism that the world has ever known. the evil of radical islamic extremism changed the world that day, changed the lives of everyone here in this room. for me personally it compelled me to become a terrorism prosecutor and later the u.s. attorney and for that reason i know all too well what the radical islamic terrorists remain capable of today. they will not stop, they will not relent. they will not give up in their
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quest to destroy the american way of life. we're here today in recognition of the fact that we therefore must remain ever vigilant of the threat of radical islamic extremism and those to that seek to cause us harm. but here in this place which will always serve as a somer reminder of the lives lost and a somer reminder of just how fragile our freedoms are so, too, must this place always be a reminder of the heroic efforts of so many of our police, our fire departments, rescue personnel and volunteer citizens who stood up in a historic time of need for this nation and i include you in that group,ly your giuliani, your leadership in the aftermath of 9/11 was something that not just the city but the entire country needed to rebuild and to persevere.
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it's been said and written by many that we all became new yorkers at that time and in that respect you became the mayor to all of us. and i know i join everyone here and around the country tell i don't go that we will forever remain grateful for your leadership i came prepared today as the chairman of this committee's subcommittee on cyber security to ask your opinions on that. you've given your comments and answered the most important questions that i would have asked so i just say thank you and yield back the balance of my time. >> thank you very much mr. radcliffe and let me say two things very, very briefly. thank you very fuch for the compliments about leadership but i would point out that i rested on the shoulders of giants.
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whatever credit i get for leadership there were hundreds and hundreds of people that were equally as heroic and more so than i was and it was from name i derived my ability to move forward and do whatever you could do so the credit doesn't belong to me it belongs to all of them. and thank you for your interest in cyber security because i do believe that as congresswoman rice pointed out this is the great threat that we face in the future and it's the one we're not paying as much attention to as we should. >> mr. donovan? >> thank you, mr. chairman, mr. mayor, when you're the most junior member of a committee, by the time the questioning gets to you, you ask the witness what their favorite pizzeria is and i already know yours.
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[ laughter ] you are not only america's mayor, you are not only the mayor of new york city, you are my mayor. for all the people on this panel i was a resident of new york city during your mayoralty and i appreciate what you've done for this city and what you continue to do. since that time you have traveled throughout the country for the last 14 years and i remember calling a friend of mine from a different part of our country after the tragedy that happened right here and told him wasn't it an amazing feeling to see all these cars with american flags flying on them, how people have come together and he said to me "what flags?" there weren't flags flying from the cars where he lived and some people at that time -- although we talked about the heroics of people from other cities coming to help us, a lot of this looked at this as an attack on new york and not an attack on america and this coming friday you and i will be going to many, many
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events in our city to continue our pledge that we will never forget. i'm wondering through your travels throughout the country, have people forgotten? >> yes, some people have forgotten but you know, dan, it is in the nature of the human being that as you move further and further away from an event like the death of a loved one you don't forget but the impact of it isn't as great and, of course, the closer you are to an event like whether you're a new yorker or you had friends in new york or -- so i think it is the job of this committee to remind people of that and i want to conclude by commending this committee from the day of this inception to today, mr. king,
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mr. mccaul, all of the democratic members, all of the remember members, i think you've been one of the most effective committees in congress in the things you've done. i think you've been able to be forge bipartisan solutions where you could. and i ask you in closing to please consider once again the legislation to make this a national memorial because this will serve to remind all americans when we forget because i think that unfortunately this is going to be a war we are going to be in for a long time so we have to keep reminding americans of what's happening because it's so subtle and sometimes hard for them to see, those of you who have been in it in some capacity or another know it but it's the job of this
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committee and the job of this museum to make sure that the american people remain vigilant so if it does happen again it doesn't happen because we weren't paying attention. thank you. >> mr. clawson is recognized. >> do you have time for one more? >> of course. >> first i want to thank you for your service and for your bravery. flow according to my economic understanding, the u.s. economy is about $16 trillion, maybe a little more. we're over 20% of the global p gdp, we are the engine of everyone else's economic growth, i think you would agree. $50 billion of trade deficit refly every single month. i think that if china or the european community as two
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examples had to choose between doing business with iran and selling product at walmart or target, what do you think they'd decide? when i hear that this was a bipolar decision between this deal and war i wonder what happened to our economy that is the growth engine for the whole world. and then, mr. mayor, i'll take it another step and say we have a financial system -- you may know better than me how many billions of dollars in arbitrage and hedges take place everyday across continents. and the way the corrupt -- foreign product practices law works, if somebody does something wrong and put their money into our financial system they get nabbed quick, correct? >> correct. yet to my knowledge in the iranian deal we have not used
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this awesome power of being the center of the global financial system? the leverage for the deal. i am astounding that these facts are never really talked about and that we are making a deal that is based on verification without using the global economic leverage that seems so self-obvious. i must be missing something here. and i'm not trying to run anybody down in particular, but i think this idea that the sanctions would fall apart is only because we don't want to use our financial system or our global economic power. am i missing something or would you agree on this different take on the iranian outcome? >> i have not just grave reservations about the agreement the agreement is to me frightening because we get so little in return, if anything
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and we are creating an empire. we are making available to a country that is set on the destruction of our greatest ally, a country that is dedicated to killing americans and continues to say that as they negotiate with us we are making millions of dollars available to them everyone on this panel and every one of any political party would agree that iran is the biggest sponsor of terrorism in the world. state sponsor of terrorism in the world. there is no disagreement about that. why in god's name would you give them billions of dollars? what does it mean to be a state sponsor of terrorism? it means you take money and you give it to terrorists. it means you take weapons and you give it to terrorists. it means if you are a nuclear
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power you take nuclear capacity and give it to terrorists. one of the main reasons that these resolutions began was not just a fear that iran would attack israel with missiles. it was the here in if iran had nuclear capacity it would hand it off to the terrorists that it is presently sponsoring and we could have a dirty bomb in new york or in chicago or in london or in paris. somehow we have forgotten that. iran should have no nuclear capacity they can not be trusted with nuclear capacity would we have used our economic power to stop it? absolutely. absolutely. and finally when you say the only alternative is war you make it clear that you will not go to
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war which maybe would have been the greatest leverage of all if the military option had not only been kept on the table but maybe the military option were something they were afraid of to win a negotiation you need leverage. we gave away our leverage when we backed off that red line 12 times. because the ayatollah took the measure of his opponent and he took the measure of his opponent as i don't have to worry about a military response. >> mayor, let me just close by saying that there were many heroes that fateful, tragic day and you, sir, were the lead herb you are america's mayor and of behalf of a grateful nation i want to say on behalf of the
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committee thank you so much for your service. >> and thank you very much for coming here and reminding everyone of what happened and for your continuing work for the security of our country which i think is just about the best in the united states congress. thank you. [ applause ] >> in the interest of time, we'll move the second panel.
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first we have commissioner william bratton serving as the 42nd police commissioner of the city of new york. he previously served as commission of the boston police department and the los angeles police department. next we have commissioner daniel nigro, serves as the commissioner of the new york fire department, joining in 1969, he's held every uniform rank within the department during his 32-year career including chief of the
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department following the attacks of september 11. next we have mr. ilepi who is a member of the vigilant fire department in great neck, new york where he became a volunteer in 1963 and rose to the position of chief of the department. on september 11 he helped organizations at ground zero until midnight and returned to the site daily to assist in the rescue of the operations. he continued his work for nine months to ensure all who were lost were returned home, including his own son jonathan who was in squad 288. finally, mr. gregory thomas who served as president of the national organization of black law enforcement executives, serves as the senior executive for law enforcement operations in the office of the kings county district attorney we
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where he is the principal liaison to the new york city police department. the witnesses' written statements will appear in the record. the chair recognizes commissioner bratton. >> good morning chairman cole and distinguish members of this committee. my name is william j. bratton, the police commissioner for the city of new york. on behalf of mayor bill de blasio i welcome you to new york city and to this 9/11 memorial and museum. the locations of these hearings could not be more appropriate. this site was hallowed by the lives we lost in the terrible attack that happened here. it was consecrated by those who zachasacrificed whose heroism k those losses smaller and has been dedicated through the memorial and museum to a promise we'll never yield in our efforts to prevent another event from happening here or anywhere else in this great city. as you know in three days we will see the 14th anniversary of the september 11 attacks. in those 14 years, the new york
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city police department has changed dramatically. prevention of crime and disorder and the fostering of public approval was expanded to include keeping the this morning, i'll provide a brief overview of the current terrorism threat and describe some of the nypd's counterterrorism measures that are constantly evolving and expanding. and provided more extensive written testimony to the committee, as well. in many respects, we currently face a greater likelihood of attack than we have seen in years. with regard to criming new york city, with regard to the current terrorism threat environment, we now face multiple hazards. lone wolves, as my deputy commissioner of intelligence says, al qaeda, particularly al qaeda in the arabian peninsula or aqap which operates primarily out of yemen, it remains a distinct threat. they are believed to be the
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primary driver of the attack in paris on ""charlie hebdo." we've also seen emergence of a virulent player, isil, isis, and establishing a pseudo state between iraq and syria, isil has fundamentally destabilized the middle east and other parts of the world. fortunate nayly a strike impact has not been felt yet here. the important words there are direct impact and, yet. isil has been far more successful than al qaeda in driving indirect impactss. isil has shunned al qaeda's model which focuses on secretly recruiting and training small dproerlz the grand attack. instead, we have embraced a lone wolf model in the name of the so-called islamic state. isil promises that those who carry out this carnage will be publicly revered on global social media. it will be remembered as heroic
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fighters who are an essential part of a struggle. this promise of valor, empowerment, has a particular appeal to those who fall in the margins of society. those who are failing at most other things in life. isil ask focused on attacks that are low tech, low cost and high impact. killing with a gun or a car was simply made iad, to something even those who feel most of things unfortunately can do. most americans, most new yorkers, don't know that the law enforcement and counterterrorism intelligence communities have been remarkably busy recently. ? in june alone several men were arrested in new york, new jersey and boston for taking part. and plots being pushed over social media platforms. these recent plots, most uncovered by the fbi, nypd, joint terrorism task force after a failed attack in garland, texas, plots that involve
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building pressure cooker womans bombs and the days leading up to new york's fourth of july fireworks celebration. this wave of arrests comes after the jttf arrested two new york city women in april, women who were in the process of research explosive compounds to construct an ied. among the targets they discussed for their barn plot was a police funeral for officers killed in the line of duty. i'm proud to say i was able to meet and thank the undercover new york city police detective who spent more than a year on this case and was a linchpin in that investigation. none of these plots, had these gone forward, would have had the scope of the attacks that happened here. in that respect, they do not have the depth of those we face from al qaeda even at its strongest. but while the threat from terrorist groups is not as deep it has grown to be miles wide, indeed, worldwide, and in many ways harder to track. after the worst terrorism attack in in, new york history, new york city proved its resilience. but any terrorist attack in this city, regardless of scale, would
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have a profound effect. here, across the country and throughout the world. that is why, even with the significant funding for the department of homeland security and its appropriators in congress the nypd continues to invest our own resources in this fight. and in the "charlie hebdo" attacks in pariser we saw police dribben back, even coldly executed by weapons and munitions. the nypd team flew to paris and was quickly briefed on all the lessons learned there. another team of emergency service unit officers have hostage negotiators went to sydney, australia. when isil-driven attacks occur in the museum, detectives assigned to interpol traveled to tunisia. the collective lessons learned formed our plans for the strategic response group, sig,
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an 800-person unit, specially equipped, trained to deal with crowd management but also terrorist threat active shooter types of activity. we've also recently formed critical response command, crc, which will take an interim initiative put in place by commissioner kelly shortly after 9/11 and institutionalized it in our counterterrorism bureau, 415 highly trained officers, specially equipped and trained to deal with the growing threat that i have referenced. srg and crc significant city wide units, additional 1200 officers we'll be focusing as part of the responsibilities on the growing threat. we also within the past year assigned 250 detectives to a new initiative that includes significantly increasing our capabilities to deal with cybersecurity threats, both in the traditional crime world as well as counterterrorism world. we have within the last month assigned a squad of detectives
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to the fbi, to work with them on an expanding cybersecurity initiative that they have recently created. and within the next several weeks, i'll be signing another squad of detectives to district attorney cy vance's office as he expands his efforts to deal with cybersecurity threats to financial institutions. new york city remains in the crosshairs of global terrorism. since september 11, 2011, there have been 20 plots against new york city, including those discussed above. they have been thwarted by the efforts of the nypd and local and federal partners. that partnership is vostronger than it ever has been. under john miller, one of the first to interview bin laden when he began to make threats against the united states and veteran of the fbi, lapd's counterterrorism bureau, and the office of the director of national intelligence and my
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counterterrorism intelligence director we have undergone a collaborative reset. together, we have continued to keep this city safe. we have done so upholding constitutional right according toes this who live, work and visit new york city. ple off /* after all, our freedom makes it a target for those who hate us. i'd like to thank you for inviting me to testify. and i will be happy to answer any questions the committee members may have. >> thank you. the chair recognizes commissioner nigro. >> thank you. good morning mr. chairman. and all of the members present. thank you for having me here today. since i joined the fdny in 1969, there's been a tremendous shift in the way we train and prepare the members of the fdny. the department's primary mission has always been to protect life and property. but in the ever changing threat
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environment of a post 9/11 world, that mission has become even more complex. the department has confronted this challenge by building an infrastructure that identifies potential threats, builds a response plan, and train members to carry out those plans. the result is the fdny is prepared as a moment's notice to provide rescue and triage in an infinite array of potential scenarios and disasters. not only does this ensure we are prepared in the case of a terrorist event, but it also means that the department functions as a rebut regional asset that can be deployed in almost any kind of disaster scenario. the value of this has been seen nationally, such as when the fdny responded to new orleans after hurricane katrina. as well as statewide, as when we responded to the record snowstorm in buffalo earlier this year.
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these assets can also be utilized locally to prevent a crisis, such as when a case of the ebola virus reached new york city. the fdny was able to draw on a preparedness framework that specialized units developed preparing for bioterrorism threats. this includes decontamination procedures and operating in chemical protective clothing, which is an added benefit, also protects against blood borne pa pathogens. it builds and trains the units that played a key role in the response, and supporteder. of specialized equipment and resources that provide emergency medical transport, treatment, and patient care. the planning, training and equipment the fdny utilizes can be applied in any mass casualty situation, whether terrorist attack, natural disaster,
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industrial accident, pandemic outbreak or biological event. this ensures that we are not only prepared to respond to likely scenarios, but that we have the training, capability to respond to any threat presented to us expected or not. this is not a capability that the department had on 9/11. and our ability to build this capability has been largely as a result of the funding we've received from the federal government. a perfect example of how even the day-to-day work of the fdny is impacted by this training is that times square bombing attempt in 2010. though first responders from engine 54 and ladder 4 initially responded to a typical fire call, once on the scene they immediately recognized the threat potential of the smoking vehicle and ensured the appropriate law enforcement resources were called to the scene. they took action that day that reduced injuries


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