tv 13th Amendment at 150 CSPAN January 24, 2016 8:00am-10:01am EST
what entire interview and others with ronald reagan, george herbert walker bush, and centered -- senator howard baker this 10:00 a.m. eastern. on american history tv. >> the states ratified the 13th amendment in 1865. eight months after president lincoln assassination. anniversary, scholars met to discuss the a minutes legacy print this program is about two hours. -- to discuss the amendments legacy.
this program is about two hours. >> good morning. i am marty castro. before we begin, we have an important opportunity to share with you. we have a finger with us today. she is going to share with us a beautiful song. a song called lift every voice and sing, which is referred by many as the black african -- black american anthem. though overtime the song was not promoted, children throughout the south cap in a lie. the song gathered momentum over the generations and ultimately, made it its theme song. naacp made it its theme song.
i would like to ask the director of president lincoln's cottage to share remarks with us. [applause] >> good morning. we are delighted to have you here with us today at president lincoln's college in washington dc to commemorate the 150th anniversary of the ratification of the 13th minute. this is a home where lincoln toiled on that document for which he is well-known. he understood that the emancipation proclamation was oft one step in a long line asked necessary to advance the quality in this country and he pushed for the passage of the 13th minute. this quoted as saying, " and then it is a king secure for
all evils. " we are delighted to have you here with us today. guest to our scholarly export these issues. -- explorer these issues. thank you again. i also want to express on behalf of of the u.s. commission on civil rights, our thanks for all of us -- all of you joining us. as you can see the room as a minutes capacity. -- a limited capacity. heres to c-span for being to take this for others who could not be here. we stand in the room, and the
home, where freedom was born. this house, as aaron said, is the place where president lincoln worked on and drafted portions, and ultimately planned the tragedy for the passage of the emancipation proclamation. which is directly related to the passage of the 13th minute because there would be questions about whether the emancipation proclamation would still have a forceful effect. , lincoln made a promise to be free forever. in an effort to pass the ratification its which we celebrate today, is an extreme important part of that history. a history that not only lives in the past, but also be present. i'm proud to be a son of illinois, which is the first state to ratify the amendment the day after it was passed in washington. was february 1, 1865.
i know president lincoln was very proud that his home state was the first of many. as we reflect on the abolition of slavery, we realize there are still vestiges of it in this world. abolitionist slavery occurred, as aaron said, the president felt that this would not be from the past. it took hundred years for another king, dr. marla the king, to bring it to fruition. while we have abolished slavery, we see in the country today that of the 13thent minute will not be complete until we abolish inequality. until we abolish economic inequality. until we abolish dissemination. -- discrimination.
remarksve seen from from the supreme court, some ill-timed remarks, we will not -- the until we abolish a block of opportunity that exists in this nation. today, we're going to hear from some scholars. also, its impact today. we want to celebrate its history, but also outline the important living policy that the imminent represents in the year 2015. represents innt the year 2015. before you do that, -- we do thank gailt to
harriet, who i worked with an partnership. we are planning work on the 14th the minute next year to recognize its 150th anniversary. we want to thank our colleagues. i like to ask commissioner harriet to come to the podium and share with us a few words on her behalf. [applause] >> thank you, mr. chairman. we are here at the lincoln college to celebrate the 150th anniversary of a crucial event in the history of our nation. the addition of the 13th amendment, prohibiting slavery and involuntary servitude to the u.s. constitution. 5, 1865 thatember
the state of georgia ratified the 13th minute, ringing the number of ratifying states to 27. enough to put it over the top. 13 days later, ratification was officially certified and the amendment proclaimed to be part of the constitution by secretary of state when stewart -- william stewart, who had recovered from the wounds suffered the same night of lincoln's assassination. as a result of rebellion, the use of indentured servants was discredited. to some, the difference between stably -- slavery and indentured servants
-- to hear modern americans call the substitution of indentured --vants the abrasive slavery was a near fatal error. it wrong turns in history can be difficult to correct. it wasn't because no one saw the danger. american quakers preach against it almost from the start. revolutionary war thinkers condemned it and try to come up workable --ey saw maybe slavery would have straightaway if the cod industry was not as important. cottonenham industry --
industry was not as important. who would care for of early slaves? who would work the farms of list -- wid uld a owless slaves. in the end, it took a congregation in which well over 600,000 died due in slavery. there are those who ask why was it not done sooner and more effectively and they are right to ask. although for perspective, they ofuld also ask about dozens other countries that held on to slavery a lot longer. which have only outlook
-- outlawed slavery in the last few decades. i will leave those questions to others come at least for today. for me, this is a day to pay respect for those who made the 13th minute possible. quakers and 19th century abolitionist. parish and frederick douglass and many others. including, of course, demand whose cottage we are -- the man whose cottage we are in today. i salute them all. [applause] >> thank you, commissioner harriet. invite esthero battle to join us for another song.
>> i will be singing the battle hymn of the republic and feel free to sing along if you have a ,ayers in your program ♪ my nights have seen the glory of the lord traveling -- he hath loosed the fateful lightning of his terrible swift sword, his truth is marching on. ♪ glory, glory, hallelujah glory, glory, hallelujah
glory, glory, hallelujah his truth is marching on i have seen him in the watchfires of a hundred circling camps they have builded him an altar in the evening dews and damps i can read his righteous sentence by the dim and flaring lamps his day is marching on. ♪ glory, glory, hallelujah glory, glory, hallelujah glory, glory, hallelujah
he has sounded forth the trumpet that shall never call retreat he is sifting out the hearts of men before his judgement seat oh be swift, my soul, to answer him, be jubilant, my feet our god is marching on. glory, glory, hallelujah glory, glory, hallelujah glory, glory, hallelujah my god is marching on in the beauty of the lilies christ was born across the sea
with a glory in his bosom that transfigures you and me as he died to make men holy, let us die to make men free, while god is marching on. ♪ glory, glory, hallelujah glory, glory, hallelujah glory, glory, hallelujah his truth is marching on [applause] >> that is a hard act to follow him up but we happy folks who
will do it. although, they will not be singing, they will be sharing their voices heard they will let the history of -- as i introduced them, they will come up to sit here. i will tell you a little about their background. first of all, i would like to -- te to the panel you can come up and be seated anyway. dr. medford is a career chair. she specializes in 19th-century african-american history and teaches courses in the jacksonian error, the civil war, reconstruction or he --
reconstruction. she was educated at the hampton institute, university of illinois, and university of maryland where she received a phd in u.s. history. she is served as the director of history of new york's african-american burial ground project. she has published numerous articles on african americans, especially during the civil war error. includes theon emancipation proclamation reviews. the price of slavery, slavery in the civil war on one -- boy one two.wo -- volume one and
next, a distinguished professor of law at the university of virginia. while he was a student at law school, he was the editor of the california law review. he served as an, -- four aan diego judge in san diego and judge paul stevens. -- s served as he has written on employment determination, and several -- civil rights. least, we but not have christian cimino. he is based in boston. his graduated from the college of the holy cross before getting his law degree from harvard law school. he earned a doctorate in
american history from boston college. lincoln, thehed 13th amendment in 2015. he teaches american history, political,s on military, and ethnic history. he is also a practicing attorney. at this point, we will invite individual figures to come to the podium and then we will ask members of c-span two mike them for answer -- questions from the panel. dr. cimino, why don't we start with you. it is a pleasure and honor to be here today. i would like to thank the commissioners for inviting me. it is also a treat to speak at lincoln's cottage. even though we are only a few miles of the white house, one
can imagine lincoln here resting. addressirst public after congress passed the amendment to abolish slavery, lakin made a pun calling it a cure for all evils. is --d medical analogy and allergies in the past -- medical analogies in the past. on paper first, 1865 lincoln identified the minute as the proper treatment when he spoke to congress. acknowledged a multifaceted nature of emancipation. to -- the pun
ln retrospect, constitutiona limits seem the perfect vehicle to a compass what lincoln wanted to do. with lincoln'ske long-held belief that it should not be altered. he wants said that we would do much better leaving it alone. aster to think of it unalterable. theshall improve on what original framers did? decades before the civil war, he
said that it should not be amended. the use ofcall for constitutional limit for change. he called for elections. it helps us make better sense of his agenda in the 1850's. he wanted to work within the framework as he understood it. said it is in the constitution that we have no right to interfere with the state. -- 1858 --
since that time, nearly every constitutional thinker understood that the states determine matters of slavery and freedom. member, abolition at this time was not a popular movement. it was very much a small movement in the 1850's. lincolncognize that eliminated the possibility of amending the constitution and he believed that the federal government could interfere with slavery, it becomes clear that for him, the only way to attack slavery was to prohibit its expansion. lincoln could declare his hatred of slavery, could explain the wrongs associated with it, but at the same time he felt the only constitutional way he could ,ut it on a path to extension was to watch it with her and die.
er and die. lingenfelter emancipation could only take place on the state level and that should be gradual to ease people toward slavery's end. fit thetion did not government from inducing states to abolish slavery on their own. encourage the to border states to do that. state-based emancipation had in a historical feature in the united states. it came as no surprise that we can thought this way. tawny raised -- this is protection for slavery
in the dred scott decision. compensation a limited any distinction. demonstrated his desire to work toward slavery's and. it showed physical pragmatism. state raised compensated schemes never gained traction. they did start people talking. many abolitionists expressed opposition to the you of gradual emancipation. frederick douglas expressed hope of the president advocating emancipation in the first place. process inndoned due 1862 he signed legislation prohibiting slavery in the territories. military victories secured in missouri and kentucky for the , even if the states were not raising emancipation
themselves, the overall situation freed when can stand to talk about emancipation on a broader scale. the failure to catch the confederate capital that summer stall the union war effort. something had to be done to turn up the pressure on the confederacy. slavery a lot of to mobilize so many more white man into the armed forces. july 1862 read a draft reclamation by which he would free the confederate slaves in his capacity of the commander-in-chief of the armed forces. he gave confederate states a 100 day time to rejoin the union and if congress went along, except compensated emancipation.
no state took lincoln up on the offer. he issued the proclamation january 1 1863. lincoln cast it as a wartime measure within his presidential war powers and it grounded his actions on solid constitutional bedrock. it garnered support. while the proclamation did not reach slavery in the border impact by had a real -- andng the unions afforded freedom to confederate slaves as soon as they reached union lines. many took action to make this happen. it lifted the union army. proclamationion had an impact on the 13th amendment but putting slave states in the center of constitutional discussions. while the proclamation
referenced compensated emancipation, the proclamation did not. lincoln use the federal government to address slavery in the states where it existed. he held that the confederate states never left the union. that was in contrast to the position he took been elected. in the months following the proclamation, inc. and was quiet about specific plans to abolish slavery nationwide. radical republicans were not. argued ther davis guarantee clause of the allowed congress to insist that confederate state governments abolished slavery. charles sumner of massachusetts argued that i seceding, the confederate states and committed suicide and could be treated as
territories where congress may write laws. more conservative republicans shuttered. some republican started talking about amending the constitution to abolish slavery. soes ashley proposed doing in 1863. lincoln remained quiet on the issue of the amendment. he pressed generals in louisiana and arkansas. progress ind missouri. time beganund this to consider what freedom would look like. on march 13, he wrote to congratulate michael hahn on his election. he added, now you are about to
have a convention which will probably define the franchise. some of the colored people may not be let in. those who have bought you a our ranks. it would help in a trying time to keep the jewel of liberty within the family of freedom. lincoln recognized that emancipation would cause a. -- time of transition. april, senators johnson and henderson endorsed in abolition amendment. started to gain state among some democrats. some saw this as a political liability. some democrats saw the amendment as a way to eliminate something
that was on its way to extinction anyway. it protected federalism for more radical proposals are in state inncipation gain traction maryland and missouri. some porter state senators and -- endorsed the abolition amendment. theoln's senses told him tipping point had arrived. had found his winning team of generals. sherman marched toward atlanta. this will allow for greater published foreign abolition amendment. lincoln wanted to the matter of nationwide freedom out of his hands. it would not be an issue with confederate peace officers. he says it rests with the american people now.
he caused in abolition amendment to be placed in his reelection pot form. when the delegation met with him, he spent most of his reply enforcing the amendment. when one ofeeting, us mentioned the great enthusiasm of the convention, mr. lincoln instantly said it was he who the idea into his opening speech. lincoln knew this would be picked up in the press and boston newspapers around the country. william lord garrison reckoned guys that abolitionists were numerically insignificant and politically speaking of no importance. people wanted to restore the union as it was. lincoln brought abolitionism into the mainstream and help shape public opinion to pave the way for constitutional reform by
steps such as the emancipation proclamation and arming black soldiers. lincoln's record nation that radical republican aries and federalism led them to support the amendment. point his concern on this when he pocket vetoed the wade davis bill. that would have abolish slavery in the confederate states by legislation. he sat in the president's room signing bills in 1864, the last day of the congressional session. " i do not see how any was now can contradict all that we always said, that congress has no power over slavery in the states. " it's unclear the extent to which the amendment factored into the 1864 election. the house voted down the
amendment. ont republicans voted restoration of the union. on the other hand, the republican platform did call for abolition by cost to slow amendment. the election may not have been an explicit single issue referendum, it was clear where the parties stood. lincoln maintained consistent stance on slavery during reelection. he made clear in a letter that he would discuss peace only on the basis of the integrity of the union and the hip animate of slavery. -- abandonment of slavery. he looked at traditional desperate congressional -- congressional races. secretary torivate provide a first-hand report in missouri. he used developments in maryland to make a public announcement in
favor of apple is in -- abolition. lincoln wrote a public letter to support. he had returns from the referendum as they arrived. when the constitution passed, he congratulated maryland. he reminded an infantry regiment about how a mob attacked massachusetts troops as it passed through baltimore in 1861 and he noted the world has moved since then. ceases inlavery maryland. lincoln addressed the celebratory crowd of african-americans. it is no secret that i have wished mankind everywhere to be free. in lincoln'slted victory. republicans picked up enough seats in the house to assure the 39th congress would pass the
amendment resolution. lincoln proclaimed victory. so did fragrant douglas. -- frederick douglass. lincoln worked hard to get the amendment passed by the house. the message was not a sure thing. many democrats continue to oppose it. others believe the amendment exceeded the scope of what article five allowed. it addressed slavery in the states. lincoln lobbied some democratic members. he met and the last week with two lame-duck immigrant congressman.
john t stewart of illinois, he knew about a lobby effort to together by the secretary of i was not able to find a link between lincoln and corruption in the process. what is lincoln place importance on the current congress passing the amendment? everyone knew he could call a special session of the 39th congress to pass it after the 38th congress adjourned. this presents an interesting counter. reconstruction developed very differently. congress would have been in session upon his assassination.
the answer is lincoln and his allies that political capital getting the amendment passed. showed some level of democratics of work for ending slavery. it seems likely that maryland and missouri would ratify. thee was no hope for confederate states of the border states would join them. the sooner the issue would be out of lincoln's hands in regard to peace talks in desperate he could say that slavery's fate rests with the american people in the process grade -- and the process. a question as to which states could participate. lincoln explicitly rejected senator sumner's argument to
includes -- exclude states. doing so fit with his generally lenient rican section -- reconstruction policy. endorsed political rights for pac-man in the speech. john wilkes booth stood in the -- and promised that is the last speech he will ever make it up -- make. the question of which states could participate in ratification became a moot point. ratification.the
andrew johnson accepted other confederate states. ratified, three fourths of the states it done so and the 13th amendment was adopted. some his assassination, argued for an expansion of what freedom would mean under the 13th amendment to the wording is vague or it it does not describe what freedom would look like. senator sumner delivered a eulogy and told his audience that slavery caused lincoln's death. he called on them to direct their vengeance by emoting black suffrage. he did not focus on the 13th amendment. sumner is just one example. on one level, the amendment performed the obvious task of ending slavery.
in the process, it created a stronger nation by eliminating the one issue that almost torn apart. lincoln envisioned the country unified. lincoln wanted an open field for economic and dance meant. -- advancement. freedom would like to all americans regardless of race or color. maintained a government whose leading object is to elevate the condition of men and clear the path for laudable pursuit for all. lincoln's leadership helped shape public opinion. he maintained his fidelity. lincoln use the amendment to
reconcile the constitution. he protected doctrine such as federalism and separation of powers. of reform in 1864 and 1865 permitted americans to see the constitution as something that could be revised. he accepted this position it gradually. article five allowed the people to express their will tempered through the representative process. future generations would more easily amend the tuition. prior amendments dealt with the mechanics of government, the third amendment expanded congressional authority to enforce the article by appropriate legislation. legal commentators continue to debate the parameters of this clause. apply to ant might broad range of issues from race-based discrimination to
labor conditions. the 13th amendment can reach private actors. trafficking. sex who humanlavery and trafficking month. of lincoln signed on that they the resolution sending the 13th amendment to the states for ratification. on the other hand, legislation must be held constitutional --.uant to it or it indicated that it intends to patrol the boundaries
of congressional authority. the ruling does not apply to the 13th amendment. one can assume the supreme court would get give broad deference. it would strike down laws applied it to issues unrelated to slavery. amendment can work as lincoln hoped. understood that it can operate broadly to address various issues. the amendment preserve the constitutional equilibrium. congress can legislate. assuresidential veto such legislation is appropriate. disagree,ple elections are the amendment process. the 13th amendment accomplished lincoln's goal of preserving the fundamental structure while bringing it closer to the ideals
of the declaration of independence. thank you. [applause] >> i would like to invite professor green it to the podium to share her remarks. professor green: good morning and welcome. i have an here several times and i always learned some new. i always enjoy being here. i will just after talk more loudly. i like to think the commission and the lincoln cottage this invitation and opportunity to speak with you for a few minutes this morning. in february 1865, days after the
,doption of the third amendment alfred green of the 127th regiment of the united states colored troops address the convention of african-americans in pennsylvania. the soldier was concerned the status of the accorded the black and women with the war was over. he did not hesitate to share his views of the slavery america. and asked when the color returns with the field of battle he will not be turned from your ballot box, your railroad cars, your hotels in schools. renew inon would only the bosom of light fellow soldiers all of the old prejudices which existed before the war."
black men should turn their attention to equal rights and privileges. amendment hadonal yet to be ratified by the requisite number of states, but supporters hastened to define its meaning and potential impact on the nation. americans might have agreed with senator john brooks anderson. slaves no right except his freedom. leave the rest to the states. african-americans view the situation differently. the liberty secured by the 13th amendment was far more expansive than simply breaking the chain of bondage. they insisted on nothing less than full fledged citizenship defined as rights and privileged shared all americans.
in the weeks and months after the amendment and the president it out to the states for ratification, black men and women intensified their campaign to secure the rights they feared would be denied to them, even in freedom. amendmentle over the had been a protracted and difficult one. partisan politics was on full display. the majority of the southern states were not a part of the debate because of secession. there was ample support for the position among southern unionists and northern democrats. they questioned the supremacy of the federal government over states rights in such matters. certain groups of legislatures feared the amendment would lead
to black equality. such arguments were raised and proponents denied this was their intention. charles controversial sumner of massachusetts was an exception. the republican senator proposed his own with language that was sure to own the -- burned this pleasure -- displeasure. are equal before the laws so and can hold another as a slave, his amendment read. the congress will have power to make all laws necessary and proper to carry this declaration into effect everywhere in the united states. his language was quickly rejected as too radical. wording adopted from the northwest ordinance of 1787. read,nal amendment
neither slavery or involuntary servitudeis him -- shall exist in the united states. or any place subject to their jurisdiction. congress shall have power to force this article by appropriate legislation. this second enforcement clause would become a focus of debates once the amendment was set to the states for ratification. opposition was strong in the two border states that had resisted lincoln's encouragement to take action against slavery themselves. delaware, we protest against the policy and shall labor to maintain the supremacy of our
own race and will submit to equality only when resistance shall be in vain. man is a government white for the benefit of white men. conservatives in kentucky argued the government intended to free the slaves and put them on the quality of whites they condemned section two as authorizing the government to pass legislation that could make that equality possible. their concerns were hardly unwarranted. supporterstors were of black equality. the radical elements of had sought to elevate the race socially and politically and remove the legal statuses. african-americans have used the opportunity presented by the war to pursue their own agenda of political and civil rights.
held the douglas had promise of citizenship to those men he recruited for the army. that theed famously brass letters let him get an eagle on his chest and eight must get on his shoulder and there is no power on the earth which can deny that he has iprned the right of citizensh in the united states. those men and women at home railed against customs and legislation that singled them out for abuse. lincoln, a of successful taylor led the .rusade against th they had attempted to a new arrivals from the state.
blacks a free state people are being banned by anti-immigration laws. in pennsylvania, a challenge different treatments on the street cars and other public conveyances. the northern states, they agitated for the right to vote. transcendence of the value of good education and a contested the practice of separating black children from white students and placing the former in inferior, overcrowded facilities. white insisted the word be removed from state laws and the constitution. in october, 1864, concerned black men attended a conference aimed at remedying the discriminatory practices that affected the african-american population in the north and south. the 114 mencuse,
from 18 states and some from the confederate states who attended through up a declaration of rights that demanded the immediate and unconditional abolition of slavery and the enjoyment of the full rights of citizens. this sentiment was echoed by henry highland garnet within days of the passage of the constitutional amendment. delivering a sermon in the house chamber on lincoln's birthday, the first african-american to be invited to do so, garnett answered the question on the minds of those in attendance. when would people of color know they were truly free? angered many in the african community and the larger community in 1843 when he suggested a slave rebellion could solve the problem of black answered "when all unjust and heavy burdens shall
be removed from every man in the idiouswhen all inv distinction shall be blotted out laws, whether they because additional, statute or minas of all law -- or municipal so been emancipation followed by an franchise men and all men shall enjoy every right of american citizenship." acknowledging the debt owed to b the battlefield to continue to sacrifice for the union cause, he suggested they were entitled to justice and the elective franchise. to pressld be no need for a quality what promotion cell smile upon merit -- smile upon merit without the slightest regard to the complexion of a man's face, when there should be no more trouble concerning the black man and has rights then there is in regard to other american citizens, when in every
respect, he shall be equal before the law and be left to make his own way in the social walks of life." abolition society encouraged by the approval of the 13th amendment declared that their work was done, african-americans rejected the notion. slavery is not abolished until the black man has about, douglas argued. while the legislatures of the south retained the right to pass laws making any discrimination between black and white slavery still lived there. man can belack denied the vote, while the legislatures of the south can take from him the right to keep and bear arms as they can, the legislatures of the states can carry on the system of un friendly legislation. let the civil power of the south be restored and the old prejudices and hostility to the negro will revive.
hasvery fact that the negro been used to defeat this rebellion and strike down the standards of the confederacy will be a stimulus to all their anded, all their mallace lead them to legislate with greater stringency towards this class than ever before. of course, both garnett and douglas had reason to be concerned. ended, theer the war states of the former confederacy began to pass black codes that saw to prescribe the rights of african-americans. first andi's, the most egregious, served as a model for the rest. collectively called the civil lawss of freedman the granted certain rights to black men and women, such as the right to sue and be sued, to have their marriages recognized because they had not been recognized under slavery, to own personal property. were more inclined
to deny rights to the friedman. vagrancy laws require that free people d-day fully employed -- free people be gainfully employed or risk being arrested. course, if you are not employed, you are not going to have some money to pay the fine. others denied that wrote the right to purchase property in the countryside. thus preventing them from pursuing economic independence. purchase farms. in some places they cannot even buy or rent homes in the town. an apprenticeship law made black children vulnerable to land owners and businessmen who exploited their labor by submitting allegedly humanitarian appeals to the court and claiming the parents were. indigent. much has been made about the failure of
african-americans to get behind me and mending, electing to press separately for equality under the law. this is a fair assessment. was before the amendment adopted, there was a tendency to talk about abolition if it werre and accomplished fact. this was encouraged by the abolition of the district of columbia and the and issuing of the emancipation publication and the use of -- the an education publication -- the of proclamation. african americans expressed greater confidence that bondage was succumbing to a rapid strangulation. less than a week after passage, the christian recorder of the african methodist episcopal church reported "glorious news, slavery abolished!
the constitution is now amended beyond doubt." this is in february before there is ratification. the swift ratification by the states in the first few weeks after adoption seemed to confirm that sentiment. by the end of february, 18 of the required 27 states had voted for ratification and by july, only four additional votes were needed. doubtless, african-american saw little reason to expend greater energy on securing the measure. but the legacy of slavery, the racism and discrimination that was sure to impacts their lives had to be addressed and immediately. african-americans recognize the potential of the amendment to remove these disabilities. one thing that makes this triumph -- is the second section of the amendment. the congress theo
power to legislate in regard to the rights of freedman. power to see they're not subject to oppressive laws, power to protect them and all the rights of freemen. fore it was a bitter pill the former slaveholders to see their enslaved laborers freed, it was even more devastating to them to have congress empowered to legislate itself as faithful guardians of the freedmen and to act for the protection of their rights as freedman. as a long-suffering people, african-americans were not inclined towards patients. ce. they were unwilling to wait and see if the enforcement clause cure.be therir theirs was a tradition of education for equal rights. they saw no reason to press less vigorously for it now. in the post war years and beyond, the amendment's
relevance and power would be freed people and their descendents saw to secure the freedoms they had been promised. [applause] greene. you, dr. dr. ruthergen, would you like to come appearance big? then we'll open the panel for youussion -- would like to come up here and speak? >> i would like to follow up on medfordrks that dr. made today. and talk about the foundation overall of the 13th amendment in securing equality in public life. the 13th amendment is not often cited in decisions of the
supreme court. it really depends upon a completely different model of constitutional lawmaking. takes ahich congress n active role. i can, since chairman castro challenged me on the subject, i theillustrate this with connection between civil rights and admirably law. -- admiralty law. [laughter] there is an important case from the late 19th century. robertson against baldwin which concerns the rights of seafarere and whether they were protected by the 13th amendment. it illustrates a profound connection between the amendment came tor rights which fruition in the 20th century.
by richardas argued henry dana, famous for his novel he years before the mast, was an agitator both in the abolitionist cause in boston and for seafarers rights. the claimed he put forward that the amendment would protect seafarers failed in the supreme court. it largely won in congress were legislation was passed. to protected these vulnerable members of the workforce. this illustrates my point today that in order to appreciate the impact of the 13th amendment, we should not look just to judicial decisions. they really are few and far between. but we should look to what congress did to enforce the amendment. and in this respect, there are two very important features the amendment has. christiansen meda said
earlier, the amendment reaches private discrimination. it is not concerned simply with discrimination by the government. this makes it unique in provisions in the constitution. so that legislation under the amendment can also reach private discrimination, as it has. the second point is that congress has acted repeatedly starting in the month that the 13th amendment was ratified to pass implementing legislation going to the issue that dr. medford identified in her remarks which is procuring equal citizenship so that in december of 1865, congress began since consideration of the civil rights act of 1866. by conferrings
citizenship on all persons born within the united states and not subject to a foreign power. so it tried to answer the question left open by the 13th amendment itself -- what are the status of the former slaves now they have been freed? and the answer given unequivocally by congress was full and equal citizenship. by full and equal citizenship, congress was very specific. the right to sue, give evidence to make and enforce contracts, to hold real property for the full benefit of the protection of the laws that are conferred on persons and property and to equal treatment before the law so that the promise held out by the 13th amendment in its text in section i, congress rapidly moved to fulfill in section ii. this statute that became the
basis for the 14th amendment to the constitution, the 15th amendment guaranteeing the right to vote, and the model for reconstruction legislation that sought to bring all americans to an equal footing before the law. the 13th amendment itself does not so provide, but the legislation that congress has enacted has accomplished that purpose. let me just of elaborate a little bit on the historical path by which this was accomplished. it was not just an attempt, as we tend to thing today, of the courts interpreting the constitution to recognize new constitutional rights. instead, it was a cooperative
andure between the courts congress, gradually to expand the public sphere so that, as we , understand it today it does not embrace just the quality in dealing with the government. the 13th amendment, because it reached private action, dealth with equality in education, equality in economic rights, equality in housing, the kinds of equality we now expect that everyone can enjoy within the public sphere. the great triumph of the civil rights act of 1866 is one that is almost entirely unnoticed. it change the meaning of the term civil rights. before the statute passed, civil rights just meant rights of citizens. and it was used in the law just
to referred to the ordinary rights that people had. part of the aspiration of the amendment to confer those rights on everyone changed the terms so that within just a few years it anyused to referred to legislation that sought equality, inequality in the public sphere. now, after 1877, the promise of reconstruction was long neglected. ime country fell into the regm of jim crow. and only with brown against board of education the civil rights movement and the civil rights era did we see any attempt to make good on this promise of equality within the public sphere. but at exactly this time, we see aat congress entered into
partnership with the judicial branch. congress passed major legislation that fulfilled the promise of brown against board of education. and the civil rights act of 1866 became an important part of the story so that the great civil rights acts of the 20 centuries, the civil rights act of 1964 guaranteed equal rights and public accommodations, equal contractors,eral equal rights and employment. the voting rights act of 1965 created equal rights to vote, the fair housing act of 1968 created rights to equality in housing. in those examples, we see that the 20th century congresses were congress out what the
did in the immediate aftermath of ratification of the 13th amendment. that is, worked to make constitutional values a reality, work to make them important not just in the sphere of dealing with government but in the sphere of dealing with private institutions that govern our public lives. it is this achievement that we h avave to attribute to the 13th amendment to the congress that first pass legislation under it in the civil rights act of 1866. in the words of lincoln, we can see what the courts and what congress working together can do for our country and bring us ba ck to the better angels of our nature. thank you very much. [applause] >> thank you, professor.
now i better understand the interrelationship. i appreciate that. that is the beauty of these events. we all in something new. the relationship between the 13th relationship and current day and other -- 13th amendment and the current day. we are here today to show it is not static happening. it is alive and well today. and many of those promises remain unmet. i will start it with a couple of questions and then we will open it up to the audience. there's words by lincoln that or disputed as to whether not he said them but he said "i am the president of the united states clothed in immense power. you will procure me these two votes." enough votesking to pass the amendment in the house. there is dispute as to whether or not there were efforts about efforts behind the scenes so to speak. can you all speak to whether or not there is any truth to those
efforts and the stories of chicago style politics happening to pass the 13th amendment? [left it] aughter] >> that is a terrific scene in the spielberg movie. they did a wonderful job of capturing i think the character of lincoln. the character of a lot of other figures. unfortunately, you know, i don't think he said that. when i look at the source, it, wouldoff, i don't lincoln be so indiscreet as to say something like that. it seems out of character. "the president clothed with im mense power." the quote is in a recollection published decades after lincoln 's death. i see that in other pieces. in fact, colfs has a piece talking abou lincoln
clothed in great power. was there lobbying that took place? there was lobbying. to referred to the movie, there bow lobbying. he does write a letter to lincoln. his correspondence does imply that there is corruption and maybe we will use money to pay people off. but i was not able to find any evidence of that. some historians have said that there were a couple of appointments that lincoln made in exchange for votes for the problem is those opponents -- those appointments were made by andrew johnson after lincoln's death. i think the movie did a great job capturing the character of lincoln, the character of seward. that was very much in flux. it was not a done deal.
but was i able to find those connections -- another great quote. it's a terrific scene. when thaddeus stevens brings an original copy of the 13th amendment home with him. he probably did not do that. aniddid have african-american, law wife. everybody in d.c. knew that. the quote "aided and abetted by the purist man in america." it's on attribute it. it is printed in something that dates to the late 1890's, while after he is dead. there is no other source cooperating that. one thing i will say that the movie did get closer to the theh than what some of confederate site, the depiction of the hampton roads conference where lincoln does meet with people. if you read alexander
talked, lincoln about if i were georgia i would ratify. would never have said something like that. in the movie, it shows lincoln saying slaver is dead. i think they're the movie gets it much closer to the truth. the movie a lot of times does use historical sources. you look under the hood and you realize the historical source is wrong or is published 40 years later and there's no cooperating evidence. evidence.rating the words mayd, not be has but i think we do need to remember that he is p ushing this amendment by mid 1 864, actually. and that is the important thing. where the movie got it wrong is where it started. it started very late. and so it should have started in late 1863 when it goes to the
house of representatives the first time. it leaves the impression that lincoln is the only pushing this amendment. in reality, there are lots of people pushing it much earlier than he does. when he does come onboard, he gives it 200%. and i think we do need to remember that. , you made reference and your remarks about how the immigration laws are being used against the free blacks and issues of jim crow and lynching that resulted afterwards. theons and i were at library of congress and there was a civil rights act exhibit and there were some very powerful information. the signs that would hang from aacp saying a man was lynched today. then we saw the poor richard's almanac and ben franklin's newspaper. on the other hand, the other side of the paperwork prices for slaves.
there was inconsistency there. these types of inconsistencies exist today. the unjustified use a police force against young black man is a version of today's lynching. the black lives matter. could you speak to those issues and how these intertwine with one another? whole concern with african americans was what was going to happen when they were officially declared free. they knew that there were still be these practices that would keep their lives proscribed. so, what we are seeing today is a failure to learn from history. we have been down this path before but we keep going there ouruse we don't know history, first of all, i think. many of us do not even know what is in the 13th amendment. we do not look at the constitution. we don't really know what our society should be about. when you have a situation where a presidential candidate is
talking about preventing people from coming into the country because of their religion, i think if you looked more closely at the constitution he would realize he can't do that. neverparently, he's looked at the constitution. absolutely these whole badges and incidents of war, of slavery as it was called, the, the legacy of slavery. freedom may have been declared. slavery may be over, but it legacy continues. and it continues not just for african-americans but for anyone who's denied their legitimate rights. so, the question now is -- do we pursue those injustices to correct them by remembering what was in the 13th amendment and what supposedly, at least for some people, was the intention of that second clause? >> that is a nice segue to the
question i want to ask you, professor. you indicated the 13th amendment was the first time there was private action as opposed to government action. would that give, you said there are not many cases on the 13th amendment, but are you arguing there is a private rate of action within the 13th amendment and could that be something that can be used today to address some of the issues we are talking about? >> well, there's privacy all around the 13th amendment. i was really referring to privacy on the side of people who engage in discrimination. you know, private actors who control our public spaces fall within the scope of many civil rights acts now. most significant advance was made in the civil but it setof 91641964, a precedent.
as part of that effort, the civil rights act of 1964 conferred on private individuals on the other side, victims of dissemination, -- discrimination, the right to bring lawsuits. that pattern can be traced directly back to the civil rights act of 1866. then't give you all legislative details but the enforcement mechanisms in the civil rights act of 1866 was copied by congress and another statute. now is a general conferral of a right of private action on any individual whose federal rights, not just constitutional rights have been denied under state law. i think the big advance in the 13th amendment is who is covered and who has to provide you quality. but you're right to suggest that
weour system ofl law, depend very heavily on private individuals, civil rights group to sponsor and engage in litigation, to make those rights a reality. >> thank you. i would like to open it up to questions. our audience and commissioners. yes, sir? >> we have a boom mic here. reference was made a few times to the fact that georgia, and i assume other southern states, ratified a 13th amendment. my guess would be they did not do that voluntarily. is that correct, and what kinds of pressures were brought to bear on them to make them ratified the 13th amendment? >> the 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments were forced upon the former confederate states, and coersion that
was exercised by the republican congress was not to seat their representatives or senators until they had reconstructed their government with an appropriate constitution and ratified the relevant amendments. so, that was, that was the principal form. the presence of the union army in the south. [laughter] troops would not be withdrawn until a reconstructive government had been put in place. >> just to add to that, remember with the 13th amendment, it says , involuntary servitude. it does not define what freedom would mean.
confederate states thought, we will technology antislavery but we will pass black codes which grant some rights but heavily restrict them. so, remember, there is a lot of stuff that we don't realize is very contingent in history. and could turn out a different way. there is nothing that does not say that story does not end with abolishing slavery but then having a caste system in the law and having, saying, ok, african-americans, you have to live by black codes. the republicans in congress moved quickly to pass the civil rights act of 1866, but you could be in the south and pass -- and andrew johnson, ok, fine. ratified the 13th amendment also pass black codes heavily restricting african-americans. it is not going to be freedom and equality the way we would envision.
that nearly in terms of the 13th amendment is also a factor. the southern states know that slavery is dead but hope that by quickly technology -- quickly acknowledging it, we get to define what for and will look like. we will define in a way that is not egalitarian. they failed in the civil rights act of 1866 trumps the black codes. it's a good question. you see all the southern states ratifying. >> keep in mind, too, the northern states are not required to ratified. and some of them don't ratify that easily. and so, you have new jersey, for instance, it takes a bit of ti me to ratified. you have the border states like kentucky in delaware who don't ratify until much later with delaware in 1901 and kentucky in
1976. and then, of course, mississippi 1995. so, yeah. >> was there not also an effort -- got shot down were president lincoln wanted a fund of $400 t million to have compensated emancipation? >> even after the amendment resolution gets passed and goes to the states, he has a meeting with the cabinet. he proposes should we apor million and offer compensation. this is after the amendment is passed and states are ratifying. illinois ratifies on february 1. homeln says, i'm happy my state was the first to do this. remember, lincoln does not know when the civil war is going to end. he's looking at the cost in blood and treasure. he says to the cabinet, do you
realize how much the war is costing every day in money? it would be cheaper to do this. think of the human costs. but his cabinet is against it. says that sends the wrong message. and he does not bring up the proposal again. but, yeah, he's looking forward not knowing that the war, on every one, no one know is the war will be over by april 9 with lee surrendering. the movie catches that contingency too. staton'nton'sed arm and happy about the wars of victory. we look back, it is 1865. the war is over. lincoln does not realize that. he is still thinking, is there a way to compensate emancipation to get this war over within cost? stop the >> is it not also about property
rights? who believes very strongly in the constitution and he believed the constitution protected rights and property. and so, he was willing to compensate them because legally african-americans who were enslaved for someone's property. so, even had he known the war within weeks,nd he would've wanted to find a way to compensate them for the loss of their property. >> a question in the back. >> a veryy rich discussion. i'm wondering whether you do not emphasize enough lincoln's -- to the declaration, especially in his speeches prior to his election. i think what the 13th really means is a reconciliation of the declaration with the constitution, which was his major argument before his election. dred scottat the
decision is still in effect. i think the 13th has to be read in a way to undo the effects of dred scott, which lincoln himself wasn't able to do in his various actions against it. i think what lincoln had in mind was that the 13th amends the w hole constitution, including the republican guarantee clause, privileges and immunity clause of article iv, such that the constitution is to be finally -freedomted as a pro document the way frederick douglas thought it was. in a colorblind way. the 13th amendment could have said colored slavery shall be protected. it just says slavery. if you could address some of these thoughts. >> i think there are two points.
first, as a representative of the university of virginia, i feel i -- madee to offer this seldom observation about my view tragic figure of thomas jefferson. but he did author the declaration of independence. there is very good evidence that he also authored the northwest ordinance which prohibited slavery in the northwest territories in exactly the same language as the 13th amendment. tragicng among the many ironies of thomas jefferson's career, you can find that he was the person who brought the language of the 13th amendment first into federal law. in debateid come up over the 13th amendment and congress. one of the reasons for rejecting charles sumner's version of the
amendment was that they could return to the jeffersonian language which had a connection to the founding generation. theyou can see that in debates over the 13th amendment in congress. as to the effect of dred scott, couldth amendment itself made dred not, it scott moot, but it did not disturb the holding that african-americans could not be citizens in the eyes of federal law. that is one reason the civil rights act of 1866 was passed. but many people, including supporters of the 14th amendment believed the civil rights act of 866 went too far in conferring citizenship contrary to dred scott. and that is why we have the 14th amendment. amendment least directed to the 14th amendment partly to rid us of the legacy
directlycott -- leads to the 14th amendment partly to rid us of the legacy of the dry ed scott. >> thank you. the discussion of black suffrage, did the issue of women's suffrage enter in the discourse and were black women ok with the lack of women's suffrage? certainly, white women mostly, were very much concerned with all of the debates occurring whenever they were talking about the elected franchise for african-american men and if you'll recall that was what tore asunder the relationship between frederick douglas and the women's movement, because white women both to have the right to vote, and if there could
be a choice they should come first and african-american men second. douglas said, oh, no, you have your husbands and your fathers and your sons to actually vote on your behalf. african-american women and men had no one. so, black men have to have that right to vote. african-american women, there are african-american women who certainly are part of the women's suffrage movement. generalink that in african-american women recognize are as long as black men not recognized as fully fledged citizens of the nation, they are not going to be recognized, either. so, you do not have the kind of tension at this point, at least, between african-american men and african-american women that you see with white men and women as
a consequence of the women's suffrage movement. amendmenthe 13th also includes that phrase " except as punishment for a crime," which would appear to allow slavery as punishment. can you speak to that? is i think the biggest defect in the amendment, because it led to the regime and jim crow which echoed today in police totality cases of arresting african-americans for minor crimes and then forcing them into indentured servitude. deployedncy laws were in that effort. passed by also laws
if youthern states, breached a contract of employment, that itself was a crime. you were convicted and then you could be enslaved. clause was"except" subject to abuse by chain gangs throughout the period of jim crow. to return it to the problems we face today, this is just a very vexing issue in policing is that we have many laws in this country. it is easy to violate the laws and the police then have enormous discretion in apprehending you, pressing charges. you've seen all of this play out on tv now. in one instance after another. it can be traced to the same abuse of the law and order to control minority populations. >> let me just add --
mass incarceration of people of color. we've seen the rise of for-profit prisons. some of these for-profit companies farm out the labor of these prisoners for profit. how do you see the relationship between that and the 13th amendment? >> i think it goes directly back to the practices that were first of jimring the regime crow. have. medford, i hope i don'tame right, if we study our history, we are going to repeat it. in some respects, we are. >> thank you for your time and thoughts today. i've recently heard the author -- describe the experience of african-americans in this country as an enduring. struggle their work to make change and
the work of their allies can be akin to dropping, droplets of water into a glass. on that history is written the event when the glass kills over but that the expense of putting drop after drop and seeing imperceptible change. i think that is evident in the passage of the 13th amendment 150 years ago and nearly 100 years after that the voting rights act and things of this nature. following up on the comments that were just made, and the current expense of black lives matter movements and things of this nature, drops are continuing to be made but do you believe we will have to wait another 50 years until we see substantive criminal justice reform, substantive education reform or are you a bit more optimistic than that? >> we'll get to that question. [laughter] he's certainly right about that.
we trained him well. he is a howard graduate. and from the history department as well. i don't know that it's going to rake another 150 or 50 o whatever. i think we cannot wait that long. if it takes much longer we are going to have an even worse problem in this country. especially since the demographics is changing in this country and it is not going to ofjust abuses african-american rights but abuses of other people's rights as well. we already see that occurring. oftalk about the danger terrorism in this country that comes as a consequence of people who disagree with us for a variety of reasons. but i think we have some domestic issues that we're going
to have to address now as opposed to later, because it is going to be even more explosive. people have lost patience. don't solve the problems now, as a nation we are going to be in much greater trouble than we are at the moment. >> i have time for one more question. [inaudible] >> of course. thank you so much for such an interesting discussion. i took a lot of notes. i was wondering if you could address briefly the role of the religious people in the abolitionist movement, the quakers, the passages, later on when reverend king had a lot of interfaith alliance is. what do think the role of religion and religiously inspired people played in the movement? we just i thinkw sang "the battle hymn of the
republic," which is a religious humn. ymn. i think it is profound. and pervasive. effort of religious groups during reconstruction was to found schools throughout the south for black slaves. int was really a first step ofieving a broad form desegregation and true civic equality. well,need to remember as though, that there are religious groups that are associated with -south position, the proslavery position as well. so not all religious groups can claim what the quakers can. without the quakers and without other groups, they were
epicenter of abolitionism. but there are many religious groups. who are in support of slavery, who were owners of enslaved asple, who could be just abusive and a new man as anyone else -- and inhumane as anyone else >. >> think very much. very enlightened. my challenges are to challenge the commission to challenge our president to make sure that this knowledge we are hearing in this room can be integrated into our school system. history. study our it is not being broken down to the common person so we can have it. i think that is something your commission can do to challenge the educational system of america. with a black president, his positive legacy. that we can have that available to every student in high school should we -- should be able to
get a copy of the constitution and their hands with her family to have in their homes. and to interpret it in language that they can digest. to you. is my challenge i thank you so much for having this event. i hope you will have additional ones at the community level, at the library. do videos. i wase that was there -- very much enlightened and allotted to him ways about lincoln. appreciate that. thank you very much for your worst today. ini learned a lot about him ways i did not know. >> anyone else want to,? comment? >> donald trump could agree. >> in a lot of ways the issue of states rights, states are the ones ultimately responsible for education. we have seen a loss of chica statusn -- chicano studies programs.
we have c-span here in this abuse robin broadcast and the commission will be doing something silly to this for the 14 amendment we are engaging right now with taxes to make sure they get birth certificates to u.s. citizen children of undocumented aliens. -- we are engaging right now with texas. one of the reasons that we have such a vibrant commission is that we continue to have an influx of new leadership and we're pleased this past year president obama sent us a new vice chair. and our vice chair will jio oin us. i would like to introduce the former justice -- madam vice chair? [applause] >> thank you very much, mr. chair, for that introduction. i want to thank our three presenters, dr. edna green medford and dr. christian
sameo, for the wonderful presentations and the ensuing discussion we have had. i also want to take the time to thank our staff director, mr. morales and barbara de levine and the commission staff and our special assistant, and the lincoln cottage staff for making this event possible. [applause] many throughout the nation content that december 6, 1865, the date on which the 13th amendment was ratified in slavery abolished i america is the most important daten in african-american history. others would extend the statement by saying that, in deed, it is the most important date in american history.
it is on that day that this its existence with a lofty ideals embodied in our founding documents. yes, all men are created equal. the date was the moment that our nation decided all men would be free. lincoln'ssident emancipation proclamation marked a pivotal turn in emancipating all slaves, our presenters have reminded us that it was the 13th amendment that formally abolished slavery throughout the united states. while the emancipation proclamation provided for the emancipation of some of those already enslaved, it did not prohibit slavery outside of the affected areas, nor did it prohibit the enactment of future could return to
slavery. in fact, the emancipation proclamation could have been overturned by a subsequent president, a legislative act, or by a court decision. passage of the 13th amendment was different. for the 13th amendment represented the collective will of the people as expressed by their elected representatives that this condition would not, should not exist any longer. the representative process, are citizens of this nation in 1865 spoke, said they decided to effectuate the absolute and perpetual abolition of slavery. in short, the 13th amendment has the force of law.it was the supreme law of the land . the amendment is so important. it established in a country based at its founding on the
rule of law that slavery is forever vanished from this great land. now, during our question and answer period, we heard the theme of religion and optimism. they were raised in at least one of our questions. as we pause to mark the 150th anniversary of the passage of the 13th amendment, i hope we spiration in from its passage. quoting theodore parker in 1857 " look at the facts of the world . triumph ofrogressive the right. i do not pretend to understand the moral universe. the arc is a long one. and my eye reaches but little ways. i cannot calculate the curves and complete the figure by the experience of sight. i can define it by conscience.
but from what i see, it bends toward justice." this was the parker speaking about the abolition of slavery. unfortunately, he died before the end of the civil war, but his words are remarkable. it is profound that for 245 years, 1620 when the first slaves arrived in this country, until 1865 when the 13th amendment was passed, slavery remained a recognized institution i this land. a land supposedly created on the principle of freedom. now, depending upon how you define a generation, this represents at least 12 generations of individuals, of families held in bondage, owned as chattel by other human beings. but that dark period did not
last forever. "the arc of history bends toward justice." slavery was a cruel, legal and economic system that permeated the fabric of america. and as we have already discussed, we continue to live with its remnants. evident by -- the education gaps between white children and children of color, the national unemployment rate, where african-americans are nearly twice the national average in unemployment. by the widening wealthe gap and ethniccilal lines. by the school to prison pipeline that seems to prioritize incarceration over education. by criminal justice debt policies that disproportionately
harm indigent african-americans and even by the growing concern about the police use of force in our communities. but it's with the efforts of many courageous americans, ordinary citizens, by the efforts of the civil rights commission and other civil rights organizations, that our country has made great strides in living up to the spirit of the 13th amendment. yes, the arc of history is long and it bends toward justice. thank all of you for attending this wonderful recognition of the importance of the 13th amendment. let us continue marching on. mr. hchair, i turn it back over to you. [applause] mr. morales: thank you to our
commissioners, and to the lincoln cottage.a n and thank you for joining us. that and our program. please feel free to continue to enjoy one another's company. -- that ends our program. thank you. [applause] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2016] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] >> you are watching american history tv, 48 hours of programming on american history every weekend on c-span 3. @c-span history for information twiur schedule on tter. watch in theen campaign this year it is far more interesting to look at the republican sent to look at the democrats. and that may have some thing to
there is more interest in these candidates and their books. >> tonight on q&a, a nonfiction book critic for "the washington post,". discusses books written by the 2016 presidential candidates >> everyone does have interesting stories in their lives. and politicians who are so single-minded in his pursuit of could haveeology, particular interesting ones, but when they put out these memoirs, re sanitized, they are vetted. they are there for minimum controversy. >> tonight at 8:00 eastern on c-span's q&a. monday night on "the communicators," national technology reporter craig -- joins us from stanford university in california to discuss a series of articles for
"the post." he examines the creation of the internet, the founder's objective, why security played such a small role for them, and whatsoever security issues facing internet users today. consumers, hundreds of millions, billions of us, we are forever choosing things other than security. we are choosing the speed, the performance, the features. know,, security, i don't maybe somewhere between five and 10 on the list of the priorities of most software developers for whatever else they say. they will tell you, security experts will tell you, security does not pay. >> watch "the commun icators" monday night at 8:00 on c-span 2. >> each week leading up to the 20 seeking election, road to the white house rewind brings this archival coverage of presidential races. next, look at the 1980 campaign through interviews with the top four republicans. ronald reagan, former cia
director george h w bush, illinois congressman john anderson, and tennessee senator howard baker. taped by students it is the first time they have been aired in national television. we we on to win the new hampshire primary on his way to securing the gop presidential nomination. he then defeated incumbent resident jimmy carter and the presidential election to win the presidency. this is just under 15 minutes. clark's welcome to election 1980. many americans feel they are not receiving strong, effective leadership today. how would you define leadership? ronald it is not as easy as it sounds. there have