tv World War II Leadership CSPAN August 20, 2017 12:00am-1:46am EDT
host: i would like to remind everyone he will have books for sale. up upod: i will set there. we can talk more, you can buy my book if you want but if not we can just talk, i guess. [laughter] [crowd >> lectures in history, military historian visiting professor at hillsville college looks at how civilian and military leaders conduct themselves through wartime. today's class focuses on franklin roosevelt and how american and british leaders
learned to work together to defeat nazi germany. this program is about one hour and 45 minutes. professor hanson: ok, um, we will continue with this notion of masters and commanders going into the civil. now we are at world war ii. before we start with the allied commanders, masters i should last week we went over the four in total. we did not talk about mussolini, , lincoln andhitler' roosevelt. i felt we could talk about the beginning of world war ii and the critical change in 1942, july and december because of the radical turnaround in the submarine campaign with the
allies in the upper hand. and the german disaster of stalingrad. let's look at this map for a second. world war ii -- it's hard to know when it actually starts. third when the allies declare war in germany after they had invaded poland, along with russia two weeks later. the chinese have been invaded by the japanese since 1937, manchuria since 1931. the ethiopians have been integrated by italy since 1933. there is a lot of wars going on. all of these wars today are going to coalesced through this conflict of world war ii. that is us looking back at that. at the time, nobody said we are in world war ii when germany went into poland. there was a finnish war, a
polish war, a norwegian war, a manchurian war, and they all coalesce in 1941-1942. we in the united states say world war ii. the british say the second world war. all of that is again in context with the first world war. it was not known as the first world war. it was called the great war, which we do not use anymore great war, it is the second greatest war. being a term for a loss of casualties. we are going to look at this. in this area, and we don't have the pacific up, but 15 to 70 million people will be killed to fifth e-70 million people will be killed to the end of 1945. i would say 50 to 70. we still do not know the exact amount. that will be the greatest man-made disaster in the history of civilization.
maybe with the exception of what now did during the -- mao did during the cultural revolution in the 1960's. it will be a disaster that no one imagined when the war broke out. it affects everybody in europe. 100 million people are going to take part in this war. nothing has ever been seen my get before. it will affect everybody in the united states. we are not going to enter until, i am thinking of my own family that was out in rural california, and was minding its own business farming. my mother and her three sisters were growing up on a farm and suddenly the war breaks out. five years later, she and all of her sisters have gone to stanford university because the women are in the workforce, men are at war. there are openings in universities. my father has flown on a b-29 40 times over tokyo.
the person i am named after is killed on okinawa and shattered my uncle's family. my first cousin was killed in normandy. that whole family is turned upside down on this event. when they were in the 1930's, they thought it was so far away. prices will go from $30 a ton to 250. my grandfather told me, i never made a dime farming except during world war ii. it will get the united states out of the depression. i don't mean with stimulus or borrowing. destroyed, so to speak. in 1946 united states will have this enormous industrial base and be the only capitalize power and pay off the debt. hitler starts here, invading poland.
just think for a minute how fast events follow. he going to invade poland, then there will be a war, but there will be a phony war along the border. france will not do anything. all britain will do is put a third of a quarter of a million of troops to help france. -- help the french. they will have a numerical superiority and they will do nothing. nobody at this time feels that poland is going to lead to a war. that there might be some way to adjudicate things. the pores and conservatives. shouldn't use that derogatory term, but there are members within britain that think they could still do business with hitler's. he is much more praiseworthy franklin roosevelt or joseph
stalin. he admires the british. he invades here, nothing happens. he has already carved off large parts of czechoslovakia here. east russia has been joined to germany. austria does not really exist. it is part of germany. look how enormous that area is. germany had the second-largest economy to begin with, traditionally, in the world after the united states. now people think he will be happy with that. no. in april of 1940, just six months later, he has gone into denmark. as should not say gone into, he he has gone into norway. he does not have to do anything in sweden. my ancestors are happily selling him iron ore at a discount and providing free transportation.
in the bargain to make money out of it. finland has settled -- it will be fighting with the soviet union. soviet union was kicked out of the league of nations, but it will be neutral now. i should say the soviet union's -- union is pro-german. i don't mean neutral, right before hitler went into poland. he had the nonaggression pact. that is the icing on the cake. as early as 1937 they had trade agreements. hitler is being supplied now in critical areas like oil, wheat, coal, iron or from the soviet union. there is a series of specific movements from bulgaria, hungary, all of this area of eastern europe is supplying as it was not at a very advantageous rate. we all know about mr. mussolini.
since the late 20's there has been a expansionary government. they have gone all the way , we cannot see until somalia, libya. on march 10, 1940 he invades france. he does it -- he does in 40 days with what the fathers were not able to do in four years. all of france, belgium, holland and luxenberg. at this point, algeria, morocco, the french colonies fall to control under vichy, allied with germany. spain, they bought on behalf of the forces under the spanish civil war five years earlier. four years earlier, portugal was staying. turkey long ally germany in world war i. can. let's look at the map.
where is the bright news for britain? 1941, they have not quite set east. remember, without warning, italy has invaded greece. it will not be easy. hitler has sent troops in, not only to save the italians in libya, who were fighting not too well against the british, but to occupy greece. he does that in a matter of weeks. the first paratroop drop on greece, very bloody but ultimately successful. there is a british presence in cairo and alexander. and of to the libyan border. the british have had some success keeping iraq and lebanon autonomous. everything else is under the hibbler --hibbl --
hitlseer. this is almost like a nightmarish version of the european union six or seven times over. hadything hibbler -- hitler ever dreamed of, he has obtained in two years. he is starting to ethnically ultimately kill jews. he's starting to integrate the economy, not effectively, but still he is starting to integrated in a manner that will serve germany. you have ireland that is at best neutral. and at worse, pro-german. and then you have great britain. in april of 1941 there is nobody else there. the united states is still isolationist. we've not been attacked by anybody yet. russia, as i said, the anomaly is a neutral and is aiding hitler in the war is all over with. there is no reason for it to continue because there is nobody to fight them. the only check on german power has been a failed air campaign
in the latter part of 1940 up of 1941 against britain. but the arts are not good for fields because the air are in holland, france and german and they have direct routes to england. and the u-boat campaign is starting to reach a real effective level of cutting off supplies from britain. what has to be done to end the war, a couple of things. you have to take alexandria and cut off the suez canal. after the italians are reenergized and they are pushing and their backups are here, all they have to do is cut that off. that ends a third of all the oil from the middle east to britain. they have to do a little bit more on the submarine campaigns so that imports cannot come from
canada and the united states. they have to get britain to leave the war with its empire intact. that is why hitler's is giving strange speeches that he has no problem, no acrimony with the british and is ready to cut a deal with them. he has allowed one quarter million british and another dunkirk. all of that sets the stage for the biggest blunder of the entire war, which is probably the biggest blunder in military operations. the june 22, 3 million man invasion of the soviet union. at that point, everything is off the table. why does he go into russia? most likely, a two-part reason. one, it is in accordance with what he said.
mein kampf, that the marxists, leninists, jewish presence has to be eradicated. german settlers will turn this into a paradise that will be six way down to the crimea. a utopian fantasy on his part. second, he was not able to get britain to reconcile to an armistice. russia and done to russia what he has done to eastern europe, just a sheer weight of the opposition will be so much that there will be people within the british government that will see the light. he has some encouragement. there are members of the royal family, as late as 1939 that had peace dealers out to the germans. strong conservative -- should not conservative, and anti-somatic presence in britain and he thinks he can work with those people. that is the general situation we are at.
before we go on to the two leaders of this class, it is called masters and commanders, does anyone have a question about the status of world war ii? this will all change. the unforeseen will happen. the united states will get into the war. it will have the most affect aid program to russia. russian industry will be relocated, and whether will turn traitor on the british. right now, the war is over and won. any questions? yes. >> how independent are the commonwealth nations of britain's decision-making? professor hanson: on our map, we do not have the commonwealth nations, which is australia, new zealand, canada. you have to remember a couple of factors.
one, they do not have a good taste in their mouth after world war i. commonwealth forces in australia, and canada were put -- and south africa, or put on command for british officers and were bled white. there is a lot of resentment against the empire. that means that -- especially and australia, who had two divisions and three divisions fighting the european war, and announce to the british, this is another war. we want all of our troops out of libya and we want them back to protect australia. which, darwin will be bombed. french canada is a problem. nominally now, france is on the side of germany. what are people in french canada going to do? are they going to die for killing people in north africa that happened to be french speakers? in this particular war, most of
the commonwealth -- india is the real question as to whether it will survive as part of the british empire. it will be a pacific contribution. the great exception to that rule is canada. canada has the third largest navy. to 50-250,000 soldiers. they fight very well, they participate, they do not complain, they do not command an independent military's command. there are very compliant. they are bitter to this day recognition that they deserve. canada is essential to the british war effort. especially in terms of trade, natural resources. that was a good question. any other questions? ok. stalin and hitler. they are very alike and they are both totalitarians. hitler is about 50. stalin is 61.
they had a similar career. i think you read in the warlords stalin admires hitler's because of liquidation to his enemy. they both tend to admire people like mussolini. they both have a very cynical view of one another. they both think that there will ultimately be a war between them and one or the other will start it. for now, the cedar is advantages -- they see there is advantages by having peace. what do we mean by that? fought an inconclusive war with japan in 1939, it does not want troops on its western -- it does not want all of its troops here facing germany, then having to fight japan. nonaggression pact seems like a gift from heaven. is ready to turn on his access partner, japan,
russia will take advantage of it. it could move some troops over from japan. japan it is not going to be outdone. remember among thieves there is no honor. japan, in turn, will have a nonaggression pact in april, 1941 with russia. that will allow russia to take its troops back again. notice the timing. it could not have come as a was time for hitler. it is indicative that these acts of mussolini, hitler, and stalin do not trust anyone of the other. that is the case of being when in the united states. germany's way of thinking is everything have turned out well. german people did not sign up for this. they signed up because they bought the propaganda that they they had surrendered 70 miles here into belgium and parts of france.
they were stabbed in the back by communists and jews so -- or so hitler and that nazi fascist party told them. they were treated very poorly at versailles. it is very sad to the softer word. that's what the versailles treaty did. it humiliated the germans without affecting their ability to come back or to make war. the german people are delighted about poland, whom they thought grew at their expense after world war i. they have no problem with denmark because it is easy. these are similar nordic arian people. they are scared stiff of a war in france because of what happen ed in world war i. for years, 70 miles. when hitler talks about going france, they think another four years, 2 million dead in world war i.
in 40 days, when he absorbs france, they are delighted and they think that because of the war being won or lost in france, it is over now. now there is no problem with russia because russia is a partner with germany, so to speak. if there was going to be a partner, russia fell in two years, and france fell in for, if they do have to fight it, france under that paradigm, 40 days. next time russia will fall in 12 days by that 3-1 time ratio. they have italy as an ally. they are tickled pink that everything has worked out they are angry that the british keep insisting. there has been a very effective propaganda campaign by goebbels, that we are socialists, workers and we are not capitalists. it is not quite like communism,
suggests the british are holding out because they have always been greedy and like to have an empire. russia is delighted. stalin still resents the westerns precipitation. had wanted germany to turn their attention to france and holland and belgium and britain. bourgeoiswas a -- the y capitalist societies would carry each other. the only thing they were mad about was what? did not do enough damage or kill enough people. as far as stalin is concerned, this is wonderful. stalin hates britain and america much more than he hates germany.
december 8, actually, 10th, britain is all alone. it does not the get can win the war. it's a whole strategy is to hold out until two things happen. inevitably these two people will turn on us. -- turn on themselves. churchill is convinced. why doesn't he make peace? because churchill is an idealist. he believes that for all the jews and all the people in europe who believe in constitutional government, for all the people being murdered every day, that britain alone, the bbc, british intelligence, british only beacon of hope. now, we are going to talk about
the allies. in this class on masters and commanders, we will see why it states work so well together. hitler does not think we will get along so well because he has seen world war i. taken as a given, you would all think that it would be a natural relationship. america was a colony of britain, we are both english-speaking countries and we fought together in world war i. in fact, how they were able to coordinate their efforts, and how they survived as friends is beyond me to this day. given the obstacles they had to work on. part of this relationship is 2, 3, or four factors that will make it very difficult for them to communicate well. the first is the memory of world war i. in america in 1941 have a very different idea of the first
world war. remember the british are right next to us. if you are in britain in you a boat in the morning and go back and talk with lloyd george in the afternoon. britian will lose a million and a half casualties. it will get nowhere from 1914 to may, june of 1918. it will not really move. it is the death camps of the first world war. they have a very, very bitter memory. france will lose almost 2 million. germany itself will lose about two and a half million. in the british mind, when this war starts out, there is one thing you do not want to do. that is have a million or 2 million people fighting the german army. there has never been anything like it. , is the most
murderous, effective, competent infantry force in the world. anytime the french army or the british army tries to fight it alone it will lose. when churchill who was first commander inalion 1916, 1970 -- 1917. he thought, when we fight this war, we will not go one million men here. remember when he declared war, chamberlain's government declared war in germany on september 3, 1939. they did put men into belgium and northern france, the british did. they did not do anything until the actual invasion of france on may 10. then they were trapped at dunkirk. 100 thousands of them were
wounded, captured or missing. bulk of them survive. thinking, there last thing we want to do is get everyone in world war i killed, or two, we want another dunkirk us in and abandons us. when the war breaks out britain has a lot more soldiers than we do. these are just larger factors we will get to when we get to the issues. the second is the geography and strength. there will be a very different relationship over 1941-1945. when the war breaks out, britain has mobilized and been to war.
it knows how to fight germans. thead fought them in 1940's. it has been bombing them. the americans don't know anything. they think they can send bombers over in daylight. fortresses that can shoot down 109's in broad daylight. they think the americans tanked is wonderful. we are very exuberant, excited, we want to go in there and when -- win but the british have a world war i is important as well. world war i we had no tanks, the british supplied them. tanks, theffective british supplied them. the war starts out with churchill going to america as a senior advisor. as this thing starts to gear up, there is a real question as to orther we will fight mobilize. you could've fought world war
two with 4 million men on your arm, or do you want to be the primary arsenal of democracy. we decided we will go full hot. we will gear up and put 14 we will be the biggest producer of ships, planes and artillery platform. as this starts to become evident in 1943-1944, united states will be the senior partner. in this relationship between roosevelt will absorb churchill's criticism. by 1943 we will hear it again and again. whether it is marshals, the alan brooke, or churchill, we're the guys, we are the commanders now. we are putting most of the men on the field, most of the supplies, we are going to make the decision, not just you. later we will make a decision. not you at all. along with world war ii, that
different views of how this war should be fought. the third thing is -- and by the way, britain is more exposed. we have two oceans. when we make a decision that seems reckless, there will not be immediate consequences to us in new york or san francisco. bombing, or the use of fighter aircraft, or going across the channel and that proves to be stupid, or disastrous, there can be immediate consequences. if we say, we don't think there v2 program, and if there is, we don't want to waste resources bombing them. they will not send a v-2 into san francisco. they will into london. americans always tell us what to do, they did not know anything about world war i, they're not ready to fight this war and the consequences are mostly borne by us if there is a mistake.
there is another issue to this relationship and that is, america is coming out of the largest social political transformation in history. after the great depression of 1929, a failure of the hoover administration to correct that economic downturn. hoover is not some reactionary capitalist. he has tried stimulus. he has tried everything that did not work. roosevelt comes in with an idea that the depression was caused of wealth. he will absorb private industry and create jobs and borrow money. he will have deficit spending. he will get america back to work. by 1938, america's unemployment rate is still 19%. this country is very unsure of itself, but it has made a
decision because of the charismatic approaches of franklin and roosevelt. than sincerity, the wonderful rhetoric that will stick with roosevelt. you will be elected for the third time in 1940's, but he is a man of the left. churchill is a 19th century relic. this is a man who fought various times in the sudan for empires. in india for empire in south to cuba, he has written about empire. he is a direct descendent of the duke of marlborough. he was a military officer, he is first lord of the admiralty twice. there is no person on either not stalin or mussolini. there is no person more will first, more experience, more knowledgeable than winston churchill. the american way of thinking is, he is a right wing reactionary
apologist for the british empire. just think for a minute. it would be as if george bush was a lot more far right than he is and tony blair was a lot more far left then he was and they were supposed to work together in iraq. as it was, bush was a conservative and blair was a liberal. it would be as if we find ourselves in a war with obama, very hard left any european nationalists party person. with a eurocentric view of the world. two people to work. how is that going to translate out? it will mean that every time churchill suggests something to roosevelt, people like harry hopkins will always be suspicious. hyper capitalist imperialist point of view. every time some he suggest something to churchill he will say these are naïve americans who believe socialism will solve all of our problems.
they have a very -- world war i, geography, there own politics will affect this relationship. also, this idea of russia. remember, when they start bombing britain after the fall of france, you look up and there are dive bombers -- the whole bit will kill 40,000 people. the papers are starting to see int in 1940, let's say august, these guys are laughing about it and they have direct links all the way into eastern and western germany. the materials of the germans are this is part of stalin's plan that they will destroy each other. the british are going to have a distressful view of russia
because russia wanted them to be destroyed. russia was an active participant with the german effort to bomb them to smithereens. the more imperialist churchill thinks he is the more anti- bolshevik he thinks he is. all about the show trials in the execution between 600,000 dissidents, military officers, intellectuals. in the late 1920's under stalin. for them, it is a real question whether you want to give a lot of aid to russia. it is nominally useful, but ultimately, there is not a lot of difference between hitler and stalin. you can see what this will do in this relationship.
of let iran kill iraq off and vice versa in the 1980's in the americans point of view. america on the other hand, there are a lot of people. we don't want to get near that topic or class on war about mccarthyism, communism, let it just be said, there are a number of naïve americans involved in this transformation of american society who look on the soviet union as an unhappy, or unfortunate excess. not necessarily evil, not killing more people than hitler did, but socialism gone too far. but it could come back, it had the right idea. it is a natural part. you look at the history of world ii, the chapter on world war ii is called "a people's war." very favorable for the soviet union. that will affect this relationship. before we go on to how these differences in culture and history affect the actual
mechanics of the war policy, this point? none? ok. the war breaks out in europe, churchill and roosevelt, you want to know how to beat hitler and mussolini and the japanese coprosperity spirit. what we actually did is not the way it had to happen. we could have tried to invade amsterdam. we could've tried to invade norway. we could've landed troops in portugal. we could've gone from the suez and had an american plead and gone into greece. or we could've had the pacific fleet or something go into the persian gulf and come in here and try to help russia. we did with the annexation of iran, but there are a lot of
different strategies. no one says we have to have 14 in our miss transfer nations in american society -- transformations in american society. we were very effective in world war i, but we do not do what we did in world war ii. these will be decisions that are made at the highest levels of the american government and the british government. the first page issue is europe first. as i said, all of these differences are fundamental and existential are going to play out here. why should europe the first for the united states? we were not attacked by germany. we were attacked by the japanese on december 7. the japanese are close to the pacific coast. they are in the waters of hawaii. they have attacked american held they are trying to take over the philippines.
they will attack wake island. they have taken over the marianas. they are encroaching on american fears of influence. -- attacked by germany. japanese will -- and one case. they will send balloons with bombs. in america's way of thinking, japan is a problem. it is somewhat of a racial element. the japanese look different than we do. there is not a lot of japanese in the united states except on the west coast. there are a lot of germans and a -- germans in places like michigan, lake here. there are a lot of people in the 1930's, amidst the depression, germany was just trying to find an ideology. it is not really nazism. it is not that, there are just china mold -- mobilize people to create autobahns, dams, give people apartment buildings, national healthcare, this is
he gave people back their pride. we feel guilty about versailles. the league of nations was never a good idea. there is a lot of -- remember, , it has only been about five months fighting in russia. people do not know the full horrors of germany. the american way of thinking, there are a lot of people who think, let's give aid, let's id for russia. we like russia to fight hitler and get rid of both of them. let's help the british give aid to the arctic sea. britain and help crush japan. we have a very soft spot in our hearts with china, which is an occupied in 1931. let's free the chinese. once we solve that problem we can turn our attention to hitler.
if he is even there. he may be finished off by the bolsheviks. he may be bombed by the british, but let's not fight a two front war. there is a great myth about world war ii that hitler lost because he fought a two front war. we fought a two front war. remember, when this war from brilliantly diabolical war. the molotov agreement is designed to have a one front war. and it works. people say, why did it start at the second war in 1941? he started the second one because there was no war. britain was being bombed and had no ability to land troops, so hitler had a one front war. we think we are so smart, we ended up with a two front war. people are saying, let's not do this. there are elements within the
american government and military who are trying to say -- especially chief of naval operations, let's not get sucked into the british war, we have fortunately for europe's first europe's first strategy, sees that hitler has the greater strength, the greater resources, perhaps even the greater evil and he has to be dealt with first. russia may fall if we have a strategy first. hitler is like a snake. the more animals he swallows, he needs time to digest it. you do not really have a lot of time. this issue is going to be very important because britain will be pushing for a first front war because it is almost ready to be obliterated. it has interest in the pacific. as much as it wants to hold
india, singapore and all of those jewels of the empire, it is willing to put them second in comparison with the british homeland. that is going to be an issue all so what degree do we put resources? how will it be solved? it will be solved on a very brilliant way that may have been inadvertent. the americans are going to learn vast 3000 mile expanse of the united states. given the fact that most of the industry in the united states is bilateral. in a sense that the great lakes region on the east coast naturally can turn its attention to europe. while the pacific great centers of commerce in seattle, oakland, san francisco, los angeles, san diego can turn to the pacific. one way of looking at is that there are two united states.
each one is fighting its own war. it is more likely that if you grew up in california, not certain, but it is likely you would fight in the pacific, more likely. if your in a factory, you will be making products that will be that is one way we solve that dilemma. the country is so big and fast -- vast and industrial centers on the coast, and the population basis tend to be on western resources. the second is the nature of the theater. think about it for a minute. the japanese empire spread all over the pacific. if george washington wants to make 8 million people, and make an 8 million man army, 3, 400 divisions, how will you use them in the pacific? you have to transport them all around. that effort to create this
monstrous army will be designed to function on the european continent, not on a little island like iwojima. or even in the philippines or okinawa. yese will be an favor operations and you can create a force for that. pacific, but it will be the first marine division, the second marine division and the pacific fleet. the pacific fleets battleships will finally get up to about 50. it will get 78 carriers heavy and medium. pacific. there will be a few battleships, but there is no german navy. there will be artillery support in italy. there will be artillery support at d-day. -- will need to shorter's destroyers to guard the convoys that are providing key supplies to britain, but the navy will have to be in the wide open theater in the pacific.
why, because the second-largest navy in the world after the brita states will not be in it will be the japanese. we will say it is european first, but we will have the west coast reassured, all of the politicians out there, they will know that larger resources will more importantly, we will put the navy and the marines and the pacific. we will have the army and the heavy bombing campaigns in europe. that is a brilliant way. because they have interest in the pacific. and they have the existential question of protecting the homeland. the third grade issue is, after the war -- and i want to put a dash here.
we talked about this last time, that is the empire. in the american way of thinking, one of the great evils in the american liberal conscience of the 1930's, 1940's, early 1940's is the british empire. especially because we did not want to be part of it. we look at the united states and say, see what can happen when you are free of britain. we do not really appreciate british institutions, culture, unique. everybody from john locke to edmund burke. but there is a resentment of the british empire. there is a lot of continental immigrants, especially german speaking families that do not how that works, as men of the left, the roosevelt administration is very suspicious. how does that work out? it reflects all of these issues we talked about, world war i,
left, right, dichotomy especially russia. there will be another great debate. i am skipping ahead a little bit. i want to get to the second front. what do you do with the british empire? how do you fight when we know that everything from the dutch east indies, to burma, to india are all there to protect british oil, british natural resources, rubber, and especially the crown jewel in india? american he died in burma trying to preserve india for the british, or he died in indochina to fight for the french empire? no. what happens is, in a very brilliant move -- you remember the letter that andrew robert roosevelt divides up the spear of influence, the americans will say, we will go as americans.
we like to find the enemies, mobilize, destroy and get home. we will target our efforts on the japanese mainland. we will not go to burma. we will help you, but we are not going to operate in that part of the pacific. we are going to try to island hop. and because of our historic ties to the philippines, we will restore the philippines. we will outsource that part of the pacific to you and you're imperial interests, and we will build aircraft carriers and destroyed the japanese mainland. the british were delighted cut off the head of the octopus with tentacles in burma, the threat of india will fall to us. that issue is an issue about the british empire. as it works out in the pacific, whether we should have in europe or japan.
in europe it is a problem. i am kind of conflating this postwar here, stalin here. now we get to the second front. all of these issues are involved. that is, ok, we have some kind of agreement that we will fight in europe, that the americans will fight a full-blown, fully mobilized two front war. nominally at least it will concentrate on europe, but there will be large elements of navy that will deal with japan. that we have a way or protocol with dealing japan that will not infringe on the british empire, yet not think -- not give the appearance that americans are fighting colonials. we are fighting against the people who attacked us on pearl harbor. we still have this other
the british do not want a second front. that seems to be the theme of the entire andrew roberts masters and commanders. also the warlords. they do not want a second front. we talked about it because later in 1940, dunkirk, that is one issue. they will have at least until 1942 and 1943, they would have to put the bulk of the troops -- but there is another issue, this is what i want to get up. churchill can say all he wants. i will help the devil if you defeat hitler. i will help stalin if i have to. deep down the british resentment 1949. stalin is very rude to the state ambassador. suddenly he is attacked on june 22 and says, now i want to be your friend.
as we said what we discussed stalin earlier, the motive of the stalin mind is, whatever i've done to other people, i am convinced they will do to me. just as i had signed a nonaggression pact with hitler, trying to port him to destroy england, i know they will do the same thing to destroy me. stalin is going to call for a second front. immediately. the americans, have a very different view, world war i. one year, 117,000 dead, same thing will happen with world war ii. there are americans who believe, john pushing got one million men on the continent from 1917 to 1918. one million americans went over to britain, we lost zero in transit. they did not get involved, they won the war.
these people, they said to themselves, it happened again. within one year we will have ormous rs -- en army, we will send them over there and they will be in the same battlefield were in world war i. the only difference this time is, we will not have an armistice, we will occupy and humiliate in germany. the british were saying -- they were saying to an private communication, all you guys are doing is going to get us killed by these horrific german divisions all you will be doing is helping stalin. stalin wanted to destroy us so just hold on a minute and lets get some experience. so from 1941 in december, all the way until 1944 in june, there is this kabuki dance between george marshall and
the americans bring in the british and say we are ready to land in france. the british said, we are too. they say, it yes. and they say, how 42, if you insist. they come in 42 and say, ok, we want to go in 43. yes, that is a great idea. what is behind the american idea? save russia, it will kill two out of three germans, if they lose the war we will suffer the kind of losses they do. it is the moral thing to do. we did in world war i. ulysses s grant taught us the strategy of the american military is clausewitzian. you find the enemy, and target him and destroy him. that means land right here and go right in and destroy german
no the british are saying, amphibious capability, 10 to 15 american combat divisions will be slaughtered. we could not do it with 300,000 at dunkirk. you do not have air superiority. you have not crippled german industry yet. the bombing campaign is very problematic. the german army is -- even though it is 1942, the watermark of the russian campaign is not failing at moscow. we have been very successful down here and they are remembered out to stalingrad. the british are saying let's think about this. second thing. the new dealers are not that suspicious of socialism.
i think some of you brought up that quote with stalin, stalin is, i give him everything and don't ask for anything in ."turn that is not the british idea. they understand that the home office had spies. the soviet union's methodized as i said, they are here. they work perfectly well, that is because they are able, because of the personalities of roosevelt, the master politician and churchill is a brilliant strategist. they are able to have the solutions, as we just talked about, europe first. the solution they get is, rather than going and getting the 50-50
chance of winning and losing, let's soften germany up. how will we soften them up? we will do it in six to seven ways. the u-boat fleet. why? because the british tell us we are sending very critical supplies to stalin, north of circle, into the white sea into arc angel. there are losing 25% of them as they get off the coast of norway. let's get american destroyers, american long-range bombers, british destroyers and make sure we do not lose any more on the convoy system. the highest level will be up in 1942. the british said, we will not be able to start by the operation. we are not going to be able to have enough resources. let's do that first so america
engages in a massive steed building. this is a great strife with the king. he does not want to commit to specific naval resources. he loses that battle. belatedly, but finally. the second thing that the guys built the world's best bomber and have had it since 1937. not us, you call it the flying fortress, let's use air power. and wein with halifax is have a big lancaster bomber in the works. we will bomb germany. double be a second front. by the way they will lose 40 -- 45,000 brits and 25,000 americans. i think you should make a note of it in this relationship, because you can see what a second land front would've been
like in 1942 and 1943 had the british allowed us to do a -- like george marshall wanted us to do. you can see that through the air campaign. we go over there confident, swaggering, say we have a b-17, we fly in formation, it is absolutely a fortress and the british say, do not tell us that. our cruise as they bomb. what the germans do, as they leave england, they pick you up on radar and they have 20-30 bases here and they pass you off from 109 squadron to 109. the new f1 90 is better. they are excellent pilots.
they will shoot you down like you do not believe. we are doing this at night. we are doing get in singular formation. we do not announce what we are -- where we are going. if you think you will stack up 100-200 bombers in broad daylight, then you will be about 20,000 feet and drop individual bombs, there is a prescription for suicide. and it is. we are doing in 1942 and 1943. it is a testament to people like the eighth air force. they do not give up. typical american ingenuity and know-how, and learning from air, and people look at the situation and say, this is winnable if we start acting smart. we develop a fighter that can escort us over the germany.