tv The Presidency African Americans Remember Lincoln CSPAN April 7, 2018 8:00am-9:01am EDT
>> next, on the presidency, a discussion of the book "they knew lincoln." it was first published in 1942 and tells the stories of the african-americans who knew and worked for president abraham lincoln and mary todd lincoln. a newly released edition of the book has been edited. president lincoln's colin -- cottage in washington, d.c. posted this event. >> joining us is kate masur. there are new introductions and edits. she teaches at northwestern
university. she is the coeditor of the war -- the world of the civil war made. her scholarship explores how americans grappled with questions of race and equality after the abolition of slavery in the north and south. she has worked with the national park service on projects of reconstruction. the civil war can alternatively feel like the district past or the recent past, depending on what is happening in our world today.
we will get into that in our conversation. although washington spoke and was successful, it was largely forgotten. we found it in a cottage and it remains an important resource in our staff library. the stories are far too important to be on so few shelves. fortunately, dr. masur has reintroduced this to a larger audience. please join me in welcoming dr. kate masur.
[applause] when we opened almost 10 years ago, before the lincoln bicentennial, it felt like new books were coming out on lincoln almost weekly. it was not uncommon for people to say, what more could possibly be written about lincoln. so i chuckled when i read in the book that after the lincoln centennial in 1909, people were saying the same thing. how did john washington prove them wrong? kate: it is funny, and i like that line too. after this slate of lincoln -- this state of lincoln related stuff came out during the centennial, what more could possibly be written? john washington proved them wrong. it is so obvious and simple and yet it had not happened. despite all of that attention on
lincoln, very few people, really anyone who had access to publications, had asked the question, what did african-americans who knew lincoln think of him? what were his interactions with them like? it is kind of unbelievable to think that he was the first person to write that book. but it was not until 1942 when there was a book like that in the world. so even though lincoln in leadership, lincoln and mary, lincoln and religion come back -- religion, even back in the 1930's there were a million books on each of those topics. and yet nothing on lincoln and african-americans. certainly nothing in a consolidated form of the book. >> tell us a little bit about the lincoln establishment of the
time and how washington was treated by them? kate: it is an interesting story. one of the things i learned as i started to research was that his papers, i never did find and no one i talked to knows where the personal papers could be. that is such a shame. he wrote letters constantly and undoubtedly received them constantly. he was tremendously literate and liked to write and express himself in writing. to imagine what his personal collection of letters would have looked like, it seems amazing and sad that it does not exist. so one of the ways i found out about him and what he was doing was by looking in the papers of people he wrote to. those papers are sometimes
saved. some of the people he was in correspondence with while writing this book were members of the lincoln establishment. many of them were based in the midwest. there was a lincoln industry in the midwest. many of them were involved in various lincoln associations. there is the lincoln national life association in port wayne, indiana. they sponsored and popularized the history of lincoln and helped people collect lincoln related paraphernalia, signatures, original photos. washington reached out to them when he started his work and he wanted to know if they had any information about somebody like elizabeth tetley.
--kekly. he made one trip out to illinois and that is where he found out about lincoln's barber in springfield. he had been born in haiti and immigrated to the united states and became a prominent figure. for the most part, the members of the lincoln establishment were helpful to washington. they received his letters. he said, i am doing this, they were encouraging and said it would make a good book. the colored side of lincolniana, what washington called it, he got a book contract with the help of the library of congress. there were some difficulties to this. mostly in the attitude of a
professor at the university of illinois who was the leading academic historian of lincoln at that time. he was supportive of the book, james randall was an important person to have your stamp of approval from. and randall appreciated the book but he pigeonholed washington as a writer of folklore. he kind of labeled the book as, this is not really history. he compared it in a letter to a negro spiritual. an expression of the racial feeling. in a way that was kind of patronizing and reducing washington to only being a black writer writing about black things, instead of what he aspired to be, which was a real
historian dealing with evidence and facts and research. so there was this dynamic to some extent with randall. so it was interesting to see that play out. >> you mentioned elizabeth kekley. she and one of her books are one of the major motivations for washington writing this book. there has long been speculation about whether elizabeth was the true author of the book, behind the scenes, which was a controversial book at that time. or whether it had been ghostwritten. there was a charge before washington got started writing this that not only had it been ghostwritten by a female war correspondent from minnesota, but that elizabeth hackley never -- elizabeth kekley never existed.
[laughter] >> so. denying her very existence. and she was a very prominent member of washington society. who is behind this, and how did washington and others respond? kate: this was in 1935 and washington was collecting lincoln related materials while -- materials well before that. that in 1935, the reporter for the associated press was interested in the history of women correspondence in washington, d.c. she ended up talking to a democratic political operative who said, by the way, one of the earliest women correspondence in washington was a woman named jane from minnesota and by the way she is the actual author of behind the scenes. no such person existed who could
have possibly been that close to lincoln. the reporter put this down into the paper. it was a big story. the headline turned out to not be about early women correspondence, it was some headline that said this book was written by somebody else. so john washington saw the story in the washington star and there was a general outcry among african americans in washington dc who said, this is crazy. we knew her. she died in 1907. it was not that long ago that she had been alive. how can this person come out of say this? washington went out there and wrote a letter to the editor
, people were calling up the editor on the phone there was this outcry. but washington got his letter to the editor published in the washington star he said all you have to go is talk to people in washington and you will find out that elizabeth did exist. it turns out that these papers are at the library of congress. she went and interviewed washington and he sent her to interview other people. she published this follow-up story and it is good. it says, it turns out a lot of people knew elizabeth after all. and she also says that she went to these homes and found that in
the homes of african-americans in washington was so much history. there were so many stories and photos and objects. and she was taken with that. in her daily diary, she said, wrote correction. she knew it was a correction. anyway, that is what spurred washington to start researching elizabeth further that sent him on a broader project that became this book. >> you also mentioned that randall was taking a paternalistic approach to washington's book. he said it was folklore. but washington said the content was historically true.
a lot of the primary sources within the homes are one thing he relied on. he also heavily relied on oral history. oral history has long faced hurdles and acceptance. on the one hand, there are concerns about accuracy. if you do not give it credence, you are silencing these different human perspectives. those would all be lost to us as washington's book demonstrate. s. how did washington work to support the stories he was collecting, and how did you evaluate those stories as an editor 75 years later? kate: that is a very good question. washington drew on every single resource he possibly could, including his own memory. the beginning of the book has
stories that he remembered his grandmother's friends telling when he was growing up. he was born in 1880 and many of his grandmother's friends had been born in slavery and escaped during the civil war. a few of them had encountered the lincolns. so he drew on his own memory, he interviewed people, he did archival research, especially in u.s. government records. he found elizabeth keckley's application for her son. he found many different kinds of sources and try to triangulate them. in many cases, there was no corroborating evidence. stories that his grandmother's friends had told about what it was like to work in lincolns
's white house or what it was like to be in the choir that sang for lincoln when he visited a camp for escaped slaves during the civil war, those stories cannot be corroborated with any kind of documented evidence. it is just not the kind of thing that had been written down. so the question is, do you say, then we can't use it? or do you say, well, it is a source based on people's to take it with a grain of salt, but absolutely. it is not a coincidence or an accident that many times it is the stories of people who are not wealthy or famous, whose records are not preserved in an archive. so there is also an aspect of those decisions about oral history and how you talk about this that has to do with power in history, and who has had power in the past. you are talking about people who may or may not have been able to
write, even if they did exchange letters with people, the letters might not have been saved. you cannot hope to do -- you have to draw from every possible source you can. my own approach to this, i made a decision with this book that i was not going to try to track down every single fact. someone else could do a different version of a reprint of this book that would be an annotated version, full of footnotes and figuring out, what can we find out about this person or that person, can we locate them in the census or in other kinds of records? i decided i was not quite to do that because it would take the rest of my life. someone younger than me can take that on. or it could be an amazing collaborative project. i decided i just wanted the book out there in the world and i was
leaving it to other people to grapple with what was in their. there. where it came up in my introduction, i backed up some things, but mostly i just let it speak for itself. >> let's delve a little bit more into the idea of power. washington was convinced that every day interactions that lincoln had with african americans showed like what was possible. they were advocates and influencers on lincoln. the atlantic recently published an article about the wpa for the writers project that drew a similar conclusion, that there was a symbiotic relationship there. even though those stories were collected under slightly different circumstances. we used both washington's book and the slave narrative to
inform our interpretation of lincoln's time here, including his interactions with formally enslaved men, women, and children. what challenges did washington face in collecting the oral histories for his book, and how did his efforts differ in some ways from the larger slave narrative? kate: they seemed to be happening at the same time. it is interesting that this is a moment in the 1930's, it probably started a little earlier than that. it happens to be as people who lived through the civil war are dying out. that is going on. at the same time, there is a populist impulse in american popular culture that is turning a lot of people's attention in different ways to the experiences, it is like new deal culture.
driving attention to farmers and working-class people. so it is drawing a lot of people's attention to the idea of interviewing people who had experienced slavery before it was too late. the federal writers project was part of that. one of the issues is that those people were very old at that time. these were very elderly people who would have been more or less children at the time when slavery ended. so for washington, for example, the person he ended up talking to about elizabeth keckley was a woman named hannah brooks who was very old when interviewed. she was originally from virginia but had spent her life in washington. she came from an elite family and had an aunt who ran the boarding house in new york city
where elizabeth keckly would stay when she went to new york. she stayed in that boarding house when she wrote her book. and hannah brooks remembered being a girl and knowing who elizabeth keckley was and she remembers a white abolitionist named james coming by. just to give that example. so washington interviewed the elderly hannah brooks in the presence of her daughter, mary. and mary attested in a written statement to her mother's sound mind and memory. all of that is in the book. so washington put it out there and said, this is the interview with hannah brooks. her daughter vouches for her
ability to remember this stuff accurately. this is what i have. it is plausible, he argued, that the abolitionist could have helped elizabeth get the book into print. now there is scholarship on elizabeth. her book has become important for scholars. no one has definitively figured out to what extent some but he -- somebody helped her write the book. even if she wrote it 100% herself, nobody knows who connected her with a publisher. and no literary scholar has found a better theory then the abolitionist who helped her. so washington put forward what hannah brooks remembers. this is credible, plausible, and let us listen to hannah brooks.
thathere is no evidence jane swiss some -- swisshome wrote it. >> you mentioned new deal culture and responding to the outrage about this claim that elizabeth never existed was an admission point for washington to write this book. but his book also response to other concerns. there was a major cultural and political shift happening amongst african-americans as well. he has strong feelings about the jazz age and fdr. but he also had personal motivations such as his own interest in the lincoln story. how did those motivations shape his book, who was his intended audience, and who was the publishers intended audience? kate: washington was born in 1880. by 1930, he was 50.
he was a middle-aged person when writing this book. he was also a high school teacher in washington. he taught commercial art and worked with kids. he was married but they did not have kids. he was working with kids all the time. he had concerns about the youth culture of his day. he thought they were too many unwholesome things going on. he was worried about jazz and movies and movie representation particularly of african-americans. the book is a little bit the -- nostalgic in that he really admire his grandmother's friends and that generation. a generation that lived through the civil war. i think he imagined both a white and black audience for this book. the publisher marketed it more
to a lincoln collecting, wider audience. but washington wanted people to know about what he considered the heroic generation. he wanted them to know about the brave men and women who had escaped from slavery and came to washington and worked really hard. he emphasizes hard-working values. and he wanted to hold them up. there is another component they -- that came out in his correspondence. he remained a republican, even through the new deal. so as a lot of african-americans were changing their party allegiance, and this was a huge political shift that we need to understand really well, a lot of african americans changing their political allegiance in the 1930's from the republicans,
which was the party of lincoln, to the party of democrats because things were changing. washington was of a demographic, being an older person and a well-off person who did not become democrat. he was more republican and the democrats had always represented to them the party of racism and the party of the kkk. in the end, they were absolutely fighting a losing battle on that front. but what was motivating washington a little bit in this book was this idea to remind people that lincoln was really somebody who believed in emancipation and equality.
>> you mentioned lincoln's barber a little earlier. we posted about him earlier when haiti was in the news. he was a haitian and knew lincoln well. why is his story so important? kate: the barber was from haiti and moved to baltimore originally and then moved to louisiana and up to st. louis. he was in the french influenced
part of north america. then he moved to illinois because it was a free state. he was really is tired of living in states where slavery was legal. so he ended up settling in springfield where he ran a barbershop that was a kind of meeting place for all kinds of people. springfield is the capital of illinois so probably a lot of political conversations happened. he supported the arts and published interesting poetry and anecdotes in the local papers and lincoln was his property lawyer. in terms of the historical records, not much is known about their relationship in springfield before lincoln became president. we know that lincoln was a lawyer. and we know a fair amount about
the barber because he published stuff in the newspaper. but as far as the character of their relationship, there is not a lot of documentary evidence. there is a letter from him to lincoln when lincoln was in the white house that is cordial and friendly. washington had heard of a child, a preacher had said he was sure that god had put an african-american person on this earth to teach lincoln about equality and to teach lincoln to understand that all people should be free and have rights. and according to this story, he said that there was such a person in this world. washington never forgot that as a boy.
so when he came to learn about the barber, he hypothesized that the barber was that person. was the person who had shown link in the dignity, competence, creativity, and independence of people. it is significant that he was from haiti. haiti had become an independent republic and had thrown off the chains of slavery and the french and was governed by free people of african descent in 1803. the barber would have -- and was -- would have known that history . he would have told that story and made a link that black emancipation was possible -- and made lincoln know that black emancipation was possible.
i like the story about when washington went to springfield to track down as much as he could about the barber. he met some of his descendents in springfield. he was asking people about what they remembered about him. one person said, look in that mirror right now. that is the mirror that lincoln would have looked in because it was the mirror from the barbershop. i just imagine washington looking in that mirror that lincoln had looked in. it is cool. >> it gives me chills. we have talked a lot about the content, about how he came up with this project. how was the book received? kate: the book was very well received. it was reviewed very widely in places like "the new york times" and "the new york tribune.
there was nothing else like this out there and it filled a really important niche. there were some not so positive reviews, particularly some lincoln aficionados that said there was not much that was new. whatever, we all read those reviews. [laughter] kate: it was covered in the black press. he got a medal of honor from the haitian government based on his telling of the barber. the haitian government gave him an official certificate of honor. and it sold out quickly. and then it was never reprinted. >> why was it never reprinted? kate: i do not know. there are a lot of different factors that could have gone into it. one is that washington's
literary agent died right before the book came out. he did not feel like he had an agent, or somebody who could mediate or go back to the new york publishers and say, hey, help this guy get another book out. he later said in one letter that the publisher was having financial problems. somebody pointed out to me the other day, i had taken on board that this book came out in february 1942, right after pearl harbor. it was not expected to be a book that came out in the middle of the united states being involved in a war. there were paper shortages. i actually do not know right now what the impact of the united states entering the war was on the publishing industry. it was possible it could not be published right away and then by
the time things got back to normal, it was forgotten. when i first found the book, i found it in a university of michigan library. i then tried to figure out where to get a copy. it has been out of print and copies cost usually more than $150, if not, more than $300. so that was really one of my motivations for wanting to see it back in print. i think it should be widely available and until now it has been a collectors item at a book that your average person cannot get, a book that is not available and any bookstore in springfield, illinois or here. i just really thought that it deserved an audience and a readership in the 21st century. >> and the copy we have at the cottage was donated to us. it is one of those rare books that it is so essential to the work we do.
several of the stories in their are essential to our interpretation. washington had a second book project. what was its purpose and what happened with that effort? kate: he was really excited by the reception of this book. i could see that in his letters to other people. letters i was reading, he would say, he had a clipping service so he would say, i have just gotten more reviews. he knew that black soldiers stationed in hawaii were reading it at an army base in hawaii. all of these exciting things were happening and he wanted to do another book on african-americans and lincoln. but this one sounded like he imagined it to be more of a political book. more about the need to remain faithful to the republican party and the need to honor that tradition of the republicans. he said he had lots of stories that never made it into the book
and i believe that. just his notes on interviews, i mean, what happened to that stuff? he had lots of stuff on the cutting room floor. he thought there would be an audience for another book but he was not able to get it published. he wrote to some of the people in the lincoln world and asked for help approaching a publisher in new york. they were lukewarm. they did not seem too interested in helping him out this time around. it's like they only had space in their brain for one book by washington but not another one. he was disappointed by that. it never came to fruition. several people have asked me and i know several people who have tried to find that lost manuscript. there are correspondence about sending the manuscript to so-and-so. nobody has ever found the actual manuscript. or knows what was really in there.
>> i love those kinds of mysteries. it could still be out there. barring someone finding that manuscript, let's go back to the original question, has everything been said they can be said about lincoln, or are there crucial perspectives that are still missing? kate: i am really glad this book is back in the world. i hope going back to the idea of annotating it. i think that people could use it as a jumping off point for additional research either on african-americans who encountered lincoln, or the african-american world that we still do not know that much about. i want to try to say this without sounding boastful, but there was a black historian
named benjamin quarrels who was writing in the 1950's and 1960's. he was one of the few people who delved into the relationship between lincoln and african-americans. he tried to write about using the resources he had at that time. he wrote about african americans in the war, african-americans and lincoln. and i have in my own way gone back in a couple of issues that he wrote about to see if there was more to say. in two major areas, i found there was and i have written articles that are scholarly articles that expand on what he was doing. because of digitized newspapers and the kind of range of questions we can ask now, i think -- i have been surprised at how much scholarship there still could be about lincoln and race and lincoln and african-americans. if people could just go beyond
the stories that get told over and over again. go back to primary sources and use the sources at our disposal. i think there is more to say. >> obviously the answer we wanted to hear. what is your next project? kate: i am working on a book about the origins of the 14th amendment and the antislavery movement. i have written a lot about reconstruction but this book is about going much earlier and talking about the things that ended up in reconstruction policy, especially the 14th amendment, had their origins. >> fantastic. thank you so much. everyone, please join me in thanking her. [applause] >> we would like to open it up for questions. just a note because this is being recorded. please speak up when you ask your questions. >> from your perspective, was
there anything you would consider a new insight into lincoln that evolved from washington? kate: definitely. if you do not consider things like establishing elizabeth's existence, and her relationship, one thing that is significant from washington's work and verifiable in documented records is how lincoln seems to have treated people who worked for him. a lot of the people that washington is writing about are employees of the white house and employees of the lincoln's and who worked for the lincolns. there is a story, to stories about two men who had worked for the lincolns in different ways. lincoln worked really hard to get them jobs in the treasury department. there is a paper trail of that.
he was writing the treasury department saying, can you help this person get a job. it will not work out here, what about here? that suggests he was a conscientious -- and there is more anecdotal evidence that he and mary lincoln were conscientious employers who treated the people who were for them quite well in relation to the standards of that time. that is the kind of thing that somebody could use to add to or fill out a portrait of who lincoln was. it is the kind of question like, how were they as employers? a lot of people never think to ask. because people do not think of the history of wealthy or middle-class white people as employers. do we think about what they were like at home and how they treated their staff and family? those are different kinds of
questions. they go more towards questions about people's personal or private lives. that is an example of -- sorry to go on -- those are some of the areas of the book that have been frequently cited by historians. >> [indiscernible] it is amazing how compatible the stories are from my mother telling the stories. [indiscernible] >> kate, can you tell everyone a little bit about who elizabeth thomas was? kate: one of the stories in the book is about elizabeth thomas,
known as betty thomas. she owned land on what is now fort stevens property. when the united states government decided to build a fort there, they informed her going to have to -- they informed her that she was going to have to give up her land. they said we will compensate you for it later. they proceeded to build fort stevens on that land. there is also a story that she was there when lincoln was there -- somebody else told him to -- but he was there during the battle of fort stevens. and then she never got her just compensation from the federal government. and washington had some documents about her that tells the story of her and her relationship with lincoln. she mentioned that lincoln promised her this, and that it was not his fault.
it was because lincoln had been killed that -- she would have gotten the compensation had lincoln survived. she tells that story and provides some documentation and i think her story there about her struggle to get what was due to her after the war. which went on for decades. i was really interested in this story. we should just compare notes because, i do not know if i would have found something you did not party fine. -- you did not find. otherwise i would say things like ancestry. all of the things in database like ancestry are adding to it. oral history, oh no, wait. [laughter] kate: maybe we can put our heads together. >> i found all of it.
all of that property was owned by my great great grandmother. kate: and the whole neighborhood sounds like it was so interesting. thank you. >> i was thinking about how many documentary projects there were, funded by the government, but clearly that was not the case. i wondered how he was able to do the research that he did going to many places. was it self funded? kate: he was a teacher, so he had summers. when he went to the midwest, that big trip to the midwest was in august of 1938. he had a very stable job teaching for the desegregated d.c. public schools. he also had a degree in dentistry and by most accounts was the first african-american to pass the dental boards in
washington, d.c.. he probably practiced dentistry out of his house, on the side. >> they would call that a side hustle. [laughter] kate: he was well-off enough to own a house on florida avenue and a vacation house in highland beach, maryland. if you don't know what that is, it is like a very elite african-american beach community in maryland that was originally founded by frederick douglass's son, charles douglas. he was not wealthy, but by the standards of that day for someone who was african-american, he was doing pretty ok. in terms of time, he did it in the summer. i was trying to figure it out, he said he got launched on the book, he was collecting step
before 1935. he got launched on the book. a lot of the dates of interviews are from 1938 and the book was in production process for most of 1940/1941. so he worked on it for a few years. >> could you tell us one of the best oral history stories? kate: i think the story from hannah brooks about remembering elizabeth keckley and being around when that book was written is an amazing story. there is another story from washington's own memory of his grandmother's friend who remembered being in a church in washington, d.c. on the night of
december 31, 1862, the day of the issuing of the emancipation proclamation. she describes -- there were a lot of -- during the civil war in washington, especially with some ame churches with prominent pastors, white dignitaries liked to go to these churches and see what was going on there. she described how in advanced going to be were white important people there, and the black minister would be there, and she wanted to be part of it all. there was singing and preaching all day and into the morning, and celebration. so that is a really good story. >> there is a lot of effort that
people make to portray lincoln as a racist. is there anything in his work that would reflect either way? kate: yes. this book is very admiring of lincoln. and i want to be clear on this when i am talking about the book, this is not the only view of lincoln. it is not the only view among african-americans of lincoln. even in the early 1920's, w.e.b debois published some snippets on lincoln that was admiring of him but said he was big enough to be inconsistent. it has this beautiful, poetic language about how he was generous, our friend but our worst enemy. all of these dichotomies about the contradictions of lincoln, and the frustrations of lincoln
not moving quickly enough on emancipation or not really believing in colonization, or not really believing in equal voting rights for african-americans. so i want to be clear that there are many ways of talking about lincoln's legacy and this is just one of them. he is very positive on lincoln and thinks that lincoln deeply believed in the equality and dignity of all humans. i do also think that lincoln had a very humanitarian sensibility. but he also had a really hard time imagining the united states as a republic in which people of different races could live on terms of equality. that was hard for him to wrap his mind around and he was not as progressive on those issues as many other people of his era.
i see him as a complicated figure on this issue. but washington is slanted very pro-lincoln. >> i have often thought about that same thing, about his inability to envision this. i have always wondered but have not researched how much of that had to do with his own personal feelings of what was possible, and his reading of society and how surprised he would be to see the continued struggles we have today. >> [inaudible]
kate: i think there is no doubt that lincoln hated slavery. he thought slavery was immoral and hated what the slaveholding class was doing the united states. he thought that slavery and slaveholding was taking the united states away from what he believed was the right path for america. so i do not actually think there is a contradiction between wanting to get rid of slavery and also having some kind of doubts about racial equality. >> why did washington die in the mental hospital? kate: he did not die in the mental hospital. >> what did he die of?
kate: it is very sad and sweet. he and his wife died three-month apart. they had been married for 60 years or so and he died in 1964. as far as i know, he did not die at saint elizabeth. there are open to where is of him that do not say that he did. >> [inaudible] in that case, i would guess -- his wife died a few months earlier and he was quite elderly. it is possible that he had gone there because he could not take care of himself. i have never seen any indication that he was mentally unsound or anything like that.
>> we have time for one more question. >> one more question. [laughter] >> what is your view in terms of, did lincoln really free african-americans? kate: your question took a little turn at the end. i think he hated slavery his whole conscious life and probably sincerely felt this was a moment of tremendous importance. did he free african-americans? no, he did not. this was one of many policies
that led towards emancipation and while people in washington were doing what they were doing, people in slavery were breaking their bonds. they were leaving slavery. they were refusing to work and moving towards union lines and making slavery untenable on the ground. so in very many ways, they freed themselves or at the very least put things in motion. they put a problem in motion that the united states government was not going to be able to solve. you cannot put that genie back in the bottle. they made it impossible to do anything other than move towards emancipation. >> that is a good way to end. thank you so much. thank you dr. masur. [applause] thank you all. i'm the executive director of president lincoln's cottage. i realize i did not say that at first. thank you for coming to the cottage and we hope to see you again really soon. take care.
[indiscernible] >> this week on c-span cities tour, we go to norman, oklahoma. we will explore its literary scene and history. today at noon eastern. an author discusses oklahoma's complex history in our nation. gaveis is the land that birth to 20 century -- the 20th century's american athletes. , and one of its most celebrated black novelists. all within a few dozen years and a hundred miles of each other. >> on sunday at 2 p.m. eastern
on american history tv we visit the national weather center, located on the campus of the university of oklahoma. >> the stuff that we do here at the national weather center impacts everybody. this is a one-of-a-kind facility. it does not exist anywhere else. this is the only national weather center. we are a true destination for the state of oklahoma and the entire company -- country. everyone wants to see what is going on here. here about the carl alberton congressional research and study center at the university of oklahoma. >> this document is a memo to speaker albert, it is labeled personal, and confidential. but it lays out what albert should do if he becomes president. you can see it says step one, take the oath of office.
step three, resign from the house. this is a thing that albert would have had to do, he would have to resign leadership if he moved up to the president, and it would have been temporarily. i think this is an interesting piece of hip -- history that people do not know about. when we think about nixon and impeachment, we do not think of the things i could have potentially happened during that time. . city tour ofan's norman, oklahoma. we are working with our cable affiliates as we explore america. monday on landmark cases, katz v. united states where charles cap, a bookie, was tape recorded by the fbi while transferring illegal debts from a telephone booth on sunset boulevard in los angeles.
the supreme court's decision expands americans rights to theacy and forever changes way law enforcement officers conduct their investigation. rosen,sts are jeffrey and jameel jaffer. both are at george mason --versity's anthony scullion antonin scalia a law school. school.a law we have resources on our website for background on landmark cases, and a link to the national constitution center's constitution. this weekend, american history tv is featuring norman,
oklahoma. c-span cities tour -- city tour staff recently visited, norman was settled during the land run of 1889, learn more about norman all weekend here on american history tv. political television and radio advertising gives people insight into the candidates and the problems of their times and the issues of their times. i don't minimize the value of the written word. i think television and radio advertising will bring history for those people who what these commercials and give human quality to the candidates whose advertising there watching -- they are watching. when jillian cantor was working in broadcast television in the 1950'