tv Q A CSPAN April 24, 2011 11:00pm-12:00am EDT
and later on the road to the white house, gary johnson declares his presidency for 2012. th this week on "q&a" performer mike daisey. >> mike, can you say what you do. his one-man show has featured the economy, steve jobs, and the american theater. >> mike daisey, can you explain what you do for a living? >> i think i can. i am a story teller. i tell stories for a living on stage in front of people. i tell them extemporaneously. you probably have prepared a little. i know who i am, so i am able to answer. we are making it up as we go along. i tell stories in rooms of
people live. >> how long have you been doing it? >> in one sense, all of my life. i have been doing it as a career for 15 years. >> i saw you at the woolly mammoth theater. i want to know more. you are talking about apple, steve jobs, and china. what is the show? >> it is "the agony and the ecstasy of steve jobs." they are two stories intertwined. it is the rise and fall of apple and steve jobs and his rise and fall and rise. and what these devices mean in our lives. the other strand about where these devices come from. i went to southern china and i investigated the conditions under which they are made. >> where did you get the idea
at? >> i talk about this in the show. it is true. all of my monologues come out of my obsessions. they spring out of my obsessions. one day i was searching the web. i read this article on a macintosh news site because i am a big geek. this guy got an iphone, but it was not blank when he got it. it had these pictures from inside the factory. i became obsessed with these pictures. you do not think about how they are made. i know how to take them apart and put them together, but i did not know how they were actually made. >> let's see a clip.
it is a one-man show. is it always one man? >> it is. >> you have been sitting on stage is for 15 years by yourself talking. >> i never feel lonely. it is told in the space with the audience. it is very much live composed. it is very much communal. i am the only one on the stage. >> is there any difference performing in washington than any other city? >> not in the fundamentals. they are a very political audience. some things resonate differently at different cities. i performed in india, australia, and all over the u.s. if you can connect humans, it is the same everywhere. >> this is from your current program "the agony and the ecstasy of steve jobs."
>> steve jobs has always been the enemy of nostalgia. he always understands the future demands sacrifice. apple's best-selling product a few years ago was the ipod mini. it was awesome. steve jobs was doing the keynotes. today, the ipod mini is no more. do not take it away. i give you the ipod nano. yea! it is everything i wanted. and i am going to lose its even faster now.
>> what did you get in that clip and what do you think of steve jobs? >> i am talking very specifically about the fact that he does something that almost no other ceos would actually do. he has an incredible ability to cancel something, to throw out the past and move forward with the future. people have a hard time doing that. part of his ruthlessness is being able to detach that way. even before the market is ready for it, he is ready to move on to the next thing. that captures a lot of what i think about steve jobs. i admire him a lot. he has been responsible for three fundamental shifts in the metaphor we used to see the world in technology. nobody else is responsible for one.
i think he is a very difficult person to work for. and to be associated with. i think he is really challenging. i think he is in a tremendous position of power at apple. he has built this corporate armature around him. it is my wish that he would open his eyes and recognize the conditions that are in the factories in china and acknowledge them and work towards change. of all of the people in technology, he is the one that is most likely to do something like that. he has always been a maverick. >> you had steve wozniak in one of your crowds.
>> he was the co-founder of apple. he still has a tremendous amount of stock. he told "the new york times" that he was changed and he would never be the same again. he wept after seeing the show. we met for dinner. he and i are determined to keep raising awareness under the conditions that devices are made. workers literally work themselves to death making these devices. it is not a giant robotic factory. thousands of humans, people, in many cases children make many of our electronics. trying to make that real for people so that we care about it is a tall order. >> when did you get the idea of
doubling to the factory in china? >> when i started studying the best. when i started to figure out devices are made. for a company that almost has no public awareness, they make almost 15% of our electronics. so many companies that you think of like dell and nokia. they subcontract the work out to foxconn. it is one company making it the same things. they are marketed differently. they are made next to each other by thousands of people. i read about the reports that are available on the web of the conditions. they are an especially brutal company.
it became clear that i was not able to figure out what was going on and allied sought it for myself. i decided to. >> when did you go there? >> in may and june of last year, 2010. >> how did you go there? >> i flew into hong kong and i have a chinese visa. i crossed the border. it is only about a 40-minute drive north of hong kong. that is the city where almost all of our devices are made in the world. it is a city of 14 million people. it is almost 40 minutes north of hong kong. almost nobody in america has heard the name of the city. even though, almost everything electronic comes from that place. there is an enormous disconnect. i had no idea.
>> how did you get there from hong kong? >> i got there two different ways. i took a bus up once. i had to shuttle back and forth to do other projects in hong kong and meet with activist groups. you can take the subway. it goes underground in the station there is a for your passport. you get in the hong kong subway system. it is amazing to go there where almost all of our things are made. any american journalist could fly to hong kong with a chinese visa and go to the doors of the factories and ask the conditions under which they are made. that story has not been told. >> did you go with anybody? >> i went with my wife and director. they acted as backup.
it was not clear what was going to happen when i did this. not to be dramatic about it, but she would stay behind at the hotel. i will check in at this time. if i do not, start calling people and start making noise. i found a translator through friends of friends and i went with the translator because i do not speak mandarin. >> what did they think you were going to do? >> i did not have to say what i was going to do. i had to say what my profession was. i said teacher, which is true. >> did you contact foxconn and did they let you in the factory? >> i did not. it was clear that would not lead anywhere. it would lead to them having a picture made that would cause more problems when i got to the
factory. i work with the fixer who had worked with the bbc to try to get connections to other factories within the special economic zone to do something official be above board. that was hopeless. it was clear that was not going to work at all. if i followed the rules of engagement, the rules of engagement for journalists in china is very clear. nobody is cleared to talk to you about anything. you are just going to tell a terrible story about the things that they know are wrong. they are not going to let anybody in. they are very clear about not letting anybody in. your organization will require you to get a visa. the chinese government will track you very closely the whole time you are there. >> here is a clip about you
talking about china in your monologue. >> we get our stuff from china. there are dragons there. [laughter] >> explained the china thing. you do that, when you talk about china. what are you getting at? >> this is just a stylized gesture to capture something that we all know is true. we are terrified of and fetishized by china. we do not want to think about the implications of china. we are terrified that they are larger than us. we are terrified of the economic relationship we are in. it is scary and we do not like to think about it. we fetishize china.
so many business books say that china is the great new market. this is the wild west. i spoke to so many businessmen that make a living going back and forth between hong kong and mainland china. making their fortunes there. they are talking about it might get is the wild west. fortunes can be won. what is not talked about is it is a fact that it is a fascist country run by thugs. >> it is true. it is a taiwanese company in mainland china. >> that is the part of the relationship between the taiwanese and mainland china, it is not good. the fact that the company is
from taiwan makes it easier to treat the workers as subhuman. >> do you use apple products yourself? >> i do. one of the reasons i did the show is that i have been an apple usurp my entire life. they defined my entire life with technology. i'd love apple products. >> you went to this place? >> 430,000. >> how many buildings are there? >> i do not know. they stretched to the horizon. when you try to drive around the factory, it is trying to circumnavigate the city. it is huge. >> what did you do once you got there? >> i did the thing that i told all of these journalists that i
was going to do. this is the stupidest thing that i have ever heard. i went to the main gate and i stood there with my translator. i just talked to anybody who wanted to talk to me when they came out of the gates. the workers. >> how many talk to you? >> hundreds. >> how long were you there? >> i was there for hours and hours and hours. i went back multiple times. each time, i spoke to hundreds of workers. >> how did you capture what they said? >> with my hearing and my mind. it is really fascinating, the patterns. we talked a lot about the things that you expect. where in china they came from, what they do in the factory. i heard a lot about the minutia
of what it is like in the factory. stories come out about people. i was very struck. this was a surprise to me. i did not know how things worked on the ground. it seemed like a very innocuous question. if you could change anything, what would you change? people would react as though a bee had flown into his face. they would speak to my translator. he says that he never thought about before. that would happen every time i asked that question. that was a very illuminating moment. you are dealing with a very different landscape. you are dealing with a country that has a fascist government that locks down some people. they are locked down in terms of their freedoms and what they are allowed to think.
corporatism has been invited in and given free rein to control the landscape. they are given very pliable workers. you wonder, how could they be given such terrible work conditions? we are working hand-in-hand with the government of china so that they do not ask these questions when they opened up a special economic zone. we are not only exporting our jobs, but the values. i am talking about a work week that has limits. i am talking about people having the appropriate breaks so that they do not actually die on the production line. we chose not to do that. our corporations chose not to. >> in your monologue, you talk about suicides. i got on the web, it did not tell us how many there were, but
they are all around 20 years old. >> the workers are very young. they fight hard to get these jobs. they are some of the best jobs in china. people will struggle to get out of their villages to this economic honeypot we have created in the south of the country. the perversity is that they are drawn to these jobs and some of these people are the brightest people. in a different world, those people would be doctors, lawyers, civil servants. they all get degrees in electrical engineering. they make our stuff. fundamentally, -- china is smart. china knows that trouble comes from student protests. problem comes when people have too much time on their hands. it is clear to me that corporations work hand in hand
with the chinese government. they were soaking up all of the people that might otherwise cause trouble. they give them a place to be. they get a good wage that they can send back to the people of their village. >> how many suicides in 2010? >> i believe there were 13 or 14 in 2010. it is a little bit blurry. the number shift according to what article you read. what is interesting is that the number of suicides in 2010 were not that much different than 2009 or 2008. it goes back to when people started reporting on it in 2005. in 2010, there happen to be a cluster of them. the associated press ran a single story that people were climbing up the roofs and throwing them off week after week at their workplace.
because of one article, a certain degree of western press rose up about these issues. they did not go very deeply. they just looked at the fact that there were suicides. why are there suicides? we are going to pay them more. that pay raise never materialized. they promised to pay them 30% more. if any employer can afford to raise the salaries of all of them are employees 30% overnight, that sounds like something where you might have been underpaying people. >> how much are they paying them? >> i believe the median salary was something like $114 a month, which does not sound like very much to us. the thrust of my investigations and the piece that i created is not concerned with the amount
they are paid. that is a good wage in that area of china in terms of what you need with what your expenses are. what they need is not more money. they need humane working conditions. they need that recognition that they are human beings. that is more important than their wages being increased. that's simple respect that workers should have that make things so that they can have a life. >> it does steve jobs know this? has he seen your monologue? >> i think he knows. >> when you go to the theater, you give the people the e-mail address. >> i do. steve jobs has a long running policy that he responds to email sometimes. i give his e-mail address. i tell people to write to him about their experiences in the
theater. if they have questions, ask apple to be open to them. he has responded to a large number of people who have written to him about this. a large number of people have forwarded their responses to me. his principal response is, basically it is, i do not think mike appreciates the complexities of the situation. i think it is a fine response. it recognizes some degree that there is a cinch to ration. somebody from apple wanted to talk about the complexities of 12 year-old putting together a electronic, i would be happy to listen to that conversation. >> there is a list of companies
that you foxconn, amazon, apple, samsung, sony, acer, why did you not give up your apple stuffed if it bother you so much? >> if i give it up -- there are no humane electronics today. there are none. the electronics not made by foxconn are produced in the special economic zone by other factories in conditions that are the same or worse. if i get rid of my electronics, i would have to buy more electronics and perpetuate the problem. these devices have become a part of our consciousness itself. they change the way we relate to the world. i can not just opt out of my culture.
you can live with honor. i will be of on the side of the mountain. i would have no impact on the culture. i cannot live that way. i believe in communicating with people. i need my tools to do it. it is very complex. >> where did you grow up in the united states? >> i grew up in maine on the canadian border. it is the end of the u.s. route 1. there is a sign and the road ends. >> what did your parents do? >> my mother was a meat packer. my father works for the veterans administration counseling, in those days, a vietnam veterans. today, he is busy counseling veterans from our wars. he is planning on retiring.
there is so much work that he thinks there is no way he can retire. >> how long did you live there? >> i lived in fort kent until i was 13 or 14. then we moved down to central maine, which is still very remote. compared to northern maine, it is a tropical vacation. >> when did you first performed? >> my first performance was when i was six or seven. i gave an astronomy demonstration. i had a shoe box with a light on the one end. i would shine the light. i would charge people tickets and make them sit in the room. i would hold forth like some sort of miniature barnum. i started doing theater in high school.
it was in conjunction with speech and debate. i was a very avid speech and debate person. >> what year did you start the speech and debate? >> i was a sophomore in high school. >> did you compete? >> yes. i did well. i went to national's twice. >> what drew you into that? >> i think the love of the extemporaneous. in a real debate, there are vectors and factors the cannot be known that assert themselves on the fly. i like thinking on my feet. i said when i was a young man, i would drink a lot of bourbon. when i was drinking bourbon, i would rail against the tyranny of the written word. i really do believe that we conflate the process of writing with thinking.
if you are thinking, you are not thinking in sentences. there is a different thing going on. i love the way in debate, it is oral. i love the way the thought hovers from the mind and is expressed. >> where did you go to college? >> colby college. i was very much the diver banged from maine. everybody else is from outside of maine. >> was a grades that got you in there? was it your s.a.t.s or your performance? >> my grades were good, but not exceptional. my s.a.t.s were good.
i think it was my essays. i think my essay played a lot in getting me in. i am glad they let me in. >> you wrote a monologue on gold. >> this is probably black cargo gold. >> how many monologues have you done in your professional career? >> 16. it is about my trip to an island in the south pacific or the people worshiped the objects of america. they have a celebration one day a year where they are at the base of an erupting volcano and they tell the history of america in dance, theater, and song. >> is this fiction? >> no.
it is in thomas. the people have a lack of an economic system. on this island, a lot of people do not use money or believe in currency. this is how their worship works. it is paired with a story of the international financial collapse. you can march right down to the treasury and you march in there. you walked in and say, ahh! i demand my gold. they say, oh, my god, another libertarian. wait. [laughter] put out your hand.
there you go. [laughter] get out of here. get out of here. ahhh! ron paul in 2012. >> i think that was in 2009. >> how long did you perform this? >> a year. they are rotating. >> you use that language there, you use a lot of language in all of your performance this and especially the one that i saw. >> if i do not speak in english, we are going to have a problem. i love the conflation of adult language. i use it because it expresses the full range of the words that are available to me. i do not actually have naturally
limited vectors that caused me not to use certain parts of my speech. fundamentally, i am not a puritan. i use all of my language. >> you had a strange experience where people got up and left. >> this was at cambridge. >> in massachusetts? >> yes, in 2007. >> what were the circumstances? >> a christian group came and saw the show and did not choose to be aware. they were like a school group. they had been informed that there was an adult language and adult situations. they did not heed that warning. the teachers decided to panic after i began speaking.
they laughed. as they left, one of the adult chaperons decided to destroy the outline. i use the outlines during the show. they are irreplaceable because i make them by hand. he poured water on them. >> i am going to show a clip in just a little bit. at first, you think this is part of the show. >> i was very surprised. it is surprising when a theater of 350 people, to have 90 people all rise is a surprising thing. >> are you sure that they did not plan this in a advance? >> i am pretty sure. i got in touch with them afterwards. i got in touch with the person who destroyed my outline.
>> that is a long nine-minute piece of video that is on youtube if you want to see the whole thing. you talk more about it. what happened to you physically? what was your personal reaction? >> it was really painful. it is hard to express to people -- i think a lot of people would understand. to be open the onstage and to be open telling a story, when they are not scripted and you are telling the story every night. it is really painful to have people literally destroy your work. it is painful. that is one of the reasons i had to track them down. it always galls me that i had to track them down. i had to restart the show.
i thought, it is a school group. this was completely crazy. of course, one of the parents, not the person who did this stupid thing, one of the other ones has left a note in the lobby saying, we are sorry. we will have to talk about this. there was no note. i could not believe it. i can be so naive. you would not just do this and leave. they did. the group wanted a refund. they did not want to contact me. i had to track them down. >> how long have they stayed? >> 15 minutes. >> they were reacting specifically to the four-letter words? >> if they stayed longer, they would have been upset about the political things.
>> what happened to the person that poured the water? >> he was from a small town in california. that is where the whole group was from. they were in the boston area. this is what they chose to take their students to that night that they did not research very well. when i talked to him, he was apologetic. he admitted that he had anger management issues that he was working on. i appreciated that. he talked about how his feeling was that he had children, he had two daughters at that time, 12 and 16. he was terrified about the future. he was terrified about the world they were going to be in.
it was fascinating. their actions, the fact that he felt this way, i felt terrified, too. i could actually empathize with that feeling. i would not agree with the way he is addressing it. or if the same things would terrify both of us. >> you sent this to him or you wrote it on your blog. i was raised catholic. he changed his demeanor on the telephone when you said that. what was the change? >> it really upset me at the time. what happened was that he saw me differently. i said that and that was a code word for the fact that i was christian. as soon as i was a member of his extended religion, he began to talk to me in a much more open way.
it really upset me. i hadn't actually got his respect before. as soon as i said this thing, now we can speak as equals. that really got me, the fact after all this happened -- we are talking, so he can apologize. we still cannot have an honest conversation unless we happened to worship the same god. >> then did you tell him that you were a liberal atheist? what was his reaction to that? >> he did not have much of a reaction at all. >> that comes through that you are part journalist, part activist. are you political? >> of course. >> how would you define your political beliefs? >> i do not know.
my political beliefs are defined by the age i'd live in. if you but get the part of my work over the last 5-10 years, i believe that our age is an age of moving between an age of nations into an age of corporations. most of my work is about the alignment of that transition. in another age, it would be fruitful to say that i believed in socialism. i believe more in capitalism. i feel like that debate has ended for my age and my time. the debate is instead about the corporations and their rise, which seems and exorable and the amount of power is staggering. my work is in relation to that. my political work is, what does it mean that we created these entities and gave them the rights of individuals? of men? they loom above us and our
multinational and are not change it to any one country and cannot be held to account. in many ways, we work under them. that forms the core of my belief system, that this is actually a war being fought over what it will mean to be a human being in a world where corporations are getting this powerful and getting more powerful. >> do you ever find yourself in the corporate world or any world politically as when you do your monologues? >> i do sometimes. >> do they get in your face? >> sometimes. >> is it in the middle of the show? >> not in the middle of the show often. you are trying to creek this artistic construct. that confrontation is dramatic.
we loved it when the theater breaks in the middle. something is happening that is not unexpected. you cannot achieve catharsis if you are being interrupted. i go to the lobby after every show. because the issues of the shows are so charged and political, i feel like it is my obligation, when i'm on stage, it is a bit like greek theater. you wear a mask and you are representing things. i have this power. i owe it to people to take off the mask, even though i am just playing myself, and go to the lobby, so we can talk to one another as human beings. if there are confrontations, that happened there. or people send me anonymous e-mails. >> have you had conversations with politician since you have
been here? >> a few. politicians are functionaries of the sub functionaries. never an elected official. i did have an elected official that said "if you see something, say something." that was about the rise of homeland security and the military industrial complex. i know people who have interest with defense contractors, really upset about the implication that their industry actually exists to create an american empire. >> so often in washington, some of these theaters are underwritten by major corporations. have you ever had a kickback on that or not being allowed to appear somewhere because the underwriter the not want you there? >> it is interesting.
it is true that they are underwritten. i am really proud about this about the american theater. there is a lot that is wrong about it. most of the places that i have worked have worked hard to make sure that there is some degree of separation between their working and their underwriting. were i have experienced pushed back is when i did a monologue about the american theater about how theater failed america. sometimes you say things and they hit you where you eat. there were a number of theaters that found it a little bit too close to the bone when they talk about feelings close to the theater, so i will not be working with them anymore. >> i will contact your father and present day and you could tell us where it came from.
>> all that he wants to talk about is iraq. he is afraid that we are going to go to war in iraq. he works as a therapist for the veterans administration. he knows that when the government is done with those kids, he is going to see them. he is worried about that. it is funny. as a kid growing up in maine, their fathers sometimes lose their jobs at the mills. every time that happened, the family went to shit. i worried what would happen if my father lost his job. all of the veterans are vietnam veterans. they are all getting older. i got worried. what happens if my father runs out of veterans. i actually asked him once, what is going to happen if you run out of veterans?
i will never forget, he laughed and said, oh, michael, that's never going to happen. >> where is that from? >> that is from a monologue called "invincible summer" which is about in part the history of the new york subway system. it is about my neighborhood in brooklyn before and after an 9/11. it is about the changes in my life, my family's life, and in america after 9/11. >> where were you on 9/11? >> i was in lower manhattan. >> what impact did that have on you? >> it had a huge impact on me. i was one of the people that
walked out of the city over the bridge and it felt like the world was ending. it had a very deep impact on me. one of the things that changed in me, i have always been a bit of a iconoclast in terms of my political beliefs. in the years following 9/11, i did not reckon with the amount of rage i felt about that attack. i was very angry. i was isolated. my wife was in seattle when it happened. when it opened up, there was a gulf between us because she was not here. she would never fully understand. i should have resolved those feelings. i think i nurtured them a little bit. sometimes it is hard to let go of anchor. there is a comfort to it.
a lot of the monologues are the fact that i supported the iraq war. i found myself persuaded by the arguments that many people were persuaded by at the time. the monologue reckons with the fallout of that. as an artist in the arts community to a myth that you supported the iraq war and to speak in a candid, open white about why you gave your support and how you withdrew your support, because today, no one will admit that they supported that war in any way. there is an incredible silence. i remember there were other people that i had conversations with. each step along the path seemed reasonable. it seems important for us to remember that. the past is not people acting in an insane matter.
everything seems reasonable walking down that road. >> moving to central maine, going to colby, i saw somewhere where colby had a big impact on you. >> absolutely. it is small, maybe 700 students. it is in central maine. it could have been on another planet. my whole life was defined by growing up in maine. it was only in colby that i was put in contact with the power structures of our culture. i did not understand what wealth was until i went there. i understand that there are people in the world with a lot more money. i had not spent a lot of time around them.
the spectrum in my small town, i knew people that have less money for more money. not in the quantum way. i did not understand what it meant to be living in new york city. i think about my life today. i could not conceive this life growing up in my small town. it was this place where i encounter these ideas for the first time. i learned to grapple with things. what is the point of this life if these things are possible? is it the point of my life to find a job or i can make enough money to make these things real for me? is my calling to find a calling and do something real for me? >> before we run out of time, are you really going to do a 24-hour monologue? >> i am. it will happen twice.
it will happen once on the west coast in portland, oregon and that it will happen once on the east coast in new york city. >> what are you going to talk about? >> everything. it is called all the hours in the day. the show is about a huge number of topics. it is an earnest attempt to create a gigantic story that compels people's interest. the goal is to make it compelling enough that people will stay longer than they ever thought that they would. it is an attempt to create a working definition of the american national character and having a strong streak of puritanism running through the heart of the it. on the strong side, it gives us our work ethic. on the negative side, it gives us repression.
it is an attempt to reconcile those things and create a chart of what it means to be american over this immensely huge story. it is 12, 13 or 14 stories that we've back and forth that tell this gigantic mosaic. there will be little breaks here and there. they are more for the audience than me. people are going to need to eat. we will provide food in different ways. it is one gigantic experience with this really, possibly crazy, but earnest attempt to say that if you want, you can come in at the beginning and stay all the way through. we will take care of you. >> what will it cost? >> i am hoping it will cost less than what you expect. >> how big will the theater beat?
>> we are working on that. we are looking at 600, 700 seats. >> here is a clip for you are talking about cheese. >> rip off their clothes and they run to the cast party. at the cast party, there is the cheese. the white cheese, the yellow cheese, the mozzarella, this is what they are paid in. [laughter] they are lining their pockets. in the darkness -- [laughter]
this is so worth not having a job. >> is this part of what made people in the theater mad? >> in the american theater, it is less glamorous than talking about the labor conditions in china. it is all the way in china. i worked in the theater. the truth is that actors in the american theater are paid represents a plea. they are paid low wages. >> we take it back to steve jobs and apple. did any journalists heard you what you saw about foxconn. have there been any articles written about this?
>> yeah. i agitated with "wired" magazine about this. they did a cover story about the suicides. it was a pathetic story. they send people over with the p.r. firm and were dotted around. they did not talk to a single worker. it was a puff piece. >> of all of the people you talk to outside of the gates, who did you remember the most? >> there was one girl who was explaining to me how she cleans
the screens of iphones by hand. i showed her mine. i handed it to her. i have a picture of her holding my iphone. i said that you might have clean this iphone. we will never know. incredibly quickly, as soon as she said that, she rubbed it on her pants and said, i have cleaned it a second time. i was talking to her and she was so delightful. i said, how old are you? she said, i am 13. >> if somebody wants to get a hold of all of your work, what is the website? >> it is my name. it is mikedaisey.com. >> thank you very much. >> thanks for having me.
[captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2011] >> for a dvd copy of this program call -- for free transcripts or to give comments about this program, visit us at "q & a".org. >> in a couple of minutes russian prime minister, putin's address to the white house. and in the road to the white house, former governor gary
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