tv Key Capitol Hill Hearings CSPAN January 20, 2016 10:00pm-12:01am EST
amendment. if you are a law-abiding citizen -- i am a gun under -- honor and i have done what you describe. sold one gun and bought another to upgrade. , and my here impression, from the president and attorney general on down, they want people in that situation to twice. maybe not be comfortable selling directly to and from a firearms dealer where there are background checks going both ways. the ultimate effect is to slow down the opportunity to legally purchase by law-abiding , citizens, firearms. that is where the infringement comes on the second amendment. senator shelby: chipping away at our constitutional rights. >> yes, sir. senator shelby: do you believe rather than saving lives, the president's actions could result in more lives lost through the violation of the constitution?
>> certainly one of the things that is little discussed, is the defensive use of guns. the actual use of guns for protection. if you go five years before virginia tech, we had another school shooting down in southwest virginia at appalachian law school. a student came onto the campus, shot and killed three, and was stopped by two students who ran to their cars and got their gun. that person, unusually enough, simply surrendered. normally when confronted, someone with mental health issues, they take their own lives most of the time. was five years before virginia tech as a protective measure. there's no compilation of those occurrences anywhere that i know of. yet, we see them all the time. in my law firm, those are the kinds of people we are defending.
we have hundreds of clients. we have never had a client inappropriately use a gun. we have defended clients who have drawn their guns in defense and had to protect themselves from prosecution for instance. all of those have been resolved favorably. that is understated here. there is no questioning the tragic outcomes that happened time and time again in this country, but is also the case that the second amendment rights exercise, and guns drawn, to protect people, to protect people, stop crimes in the process. sen. shelby: just share with us for a minute, something we all believe in, we have a right to defend ourselves, do we not? >> absolutely. it is a natural right and we are a natural law country. the second amendment is one of the rights we have as natural law.
it preserves the right we already had as a matter of natural law. sen. shelby: thank you. professor malcolm, the president has announced that stricter standards not passed or vetted with congress, will be applied by the atf to determine if the seller of a gun is engaged in the business of selling firearms. and required to perform background checks. my question, do you believe the president's announcement of an undefined measurement for determining when a gun seller is engaged in the business of selling firearms and thus , required to perform background checks, will result in harassment and legal consequences for law-abiding citizens who are simply engaged in constitutionally protected firearms transactions. professor malcolm: as the
-- yes, i do. because, as the attorney general said, and we keep explaining and getting all these calls, he had not said how many guns would be required to be put in the category as a gun dealer. right now the lot is explicit that it has to be someone whose main business is telling guns. the law explicitly exempts the casual gun seller from that. they seem to be blurring the definition and thwarting the will of congress. congress did paints to make sure it would not include people who were just occasional gun sellers. sen. shelby: do you think this announcement by the president will have a chilling effect on citizens who merely want to exercise their constitutional right. i use myself as an example, i've used guns, bought guns, so guns. -- sold guns.
upgraded. i believe i have that right. i'm not a gun dealer. if this went into effect, i might say, somebody might come after me for doing that. i might sell the gun to a judge or somebody. a good citizen. or a prosecutor. a lawyer. professor malcolm: it's bound to have a chilling effect, especially since they have announced without getting that -- the punishment for not getting a license is up to five years in jail, and up i have $250,000, not counting additional punishment for not doing a background check. with that kind of draconian punishment, and no explicit how many would be required? sen. selby: in a way, it it
would be intimidation. saying you have these rights, but you better be careful. someone signed an executive order infringing on my rights. thank you. professor malcolm: and when the atf has made a point that they have prosecuted someone who has only sold to guns, they will have shown -- sen. shelby: is the second amendment just as important to the well-being of this country as the first amendment? third amendment? and so forth. professor malcolm: it certainly is. it embodies your right to self-defense. no right is more important than the right to defend yourself and your family. it is absolutely essential.
there are countries where people do not have the right to self-defense. and are supposed to depend on the government. no government can protect everyone all the time. it tends to be ignored. these self-defense uses of guns. while the fbi does not record self-defense uses of guns, it is been estimated that there is something like a million and a half of these a year. law-abiding citizens protect themselves and their families. for the most part, just showing a gun to stop a crime from taking place. sen. shelby: have you seen any years, and the that would look at
part of our constitutional makeup and attack this amendment or part of the constitution like this administration? professor malcolm: i think they have been rather clear that if they had their preference, they would ban guns. the president spoke openly of australia's buyback. i think if they could, they would. i find it interesting when they talk about the second amendment, they like to refer to hunting. that it is fine to have a gun for hunting. hunting does not rise to the level of a constitutional right, but the defense does. -- self-defense does. sen. shelby: self-defense is self-preservation, is it not, senator murphy? senator murphy: thank you for your testimony.
i feel like this is a hearing on a document i have not seen. i want to explore some of the inconsistencies between the interpretation of three of our witnesses and the words on the page. but first i wanted to start with you mr. i want to thank you for your advocacy in the face of unimaginable grief. i want to thank you for the holistic way in which you have tackled the problem. we are talking about the ways we can change the enforcement of gun laws in order to prevent homicides, but your organization recognizes that the way in which we attack the issue of gun violence is not simply through or betterun laws enforcement, but also through increased efforts to buttress
mental health resources or increase gun safety, or prevent violence in the first place. you have a much broader agenda, don't you? >> absolutely. acked,"words like "att but we should all be on the same page. we should be looking for solutions where we can agree that we need to move forward. something has to be done. this situation, this problem of gun related tragedies, it's huge and broad and complex. no one law will fix it all. no number of laws will fix it all. nothing will fix it all. we have to approach it in a more holistic way. senator murphy: one of the reasons you do focus on the issue of gun laws, because the research you have look that makes it pretty clear, states that make it harder for criminals to access guns have of gun homicide. in fact, the very recent report comparing hopkins
connecticut's law against missouri's law, and the effect of gun violence rates and gun homicide rates, suggests there is a real connection between the laws on the books with respect to easy access of guns to criminals and rates of homicide. >> that is correct, senator. there is clear evidence-based research conducted by johns hopkins, that clearly indicates the permit to purchase regulation actually has reduced homicides by 40%. it has reduced suicides by over 15%. those numbers are reflected in the inversion in states like do not havet hot -- this lot like missouri. where homicides have risen and suicides have gone up. it comes down to access. what we're talking about here is the whole fabric of this, with regard to access, and prevention.
organization,my we do a lot of work in the state of prevention and winding individuals on the path to violent behavior, and getting them help. we should be bolstering our mental health system. we should have a better legislation and mental health reform in place to get these people the help they need. let me get at: the inconsistent reading of the words in the guidance here. dr. malcolm, i want to make this clear. you spend a decent amount of talking about a conversation about including individuals on the no-fly list on the list of those who would be prohibited to purchase guns. let's make it clear for the record, that is not in the executive order. correct?
dr. malcolm: the president said he wanted to include people on the no-fly list so they would not be able to buy guns. senator murphy: he has asked congress, he has not included it. it is not in the executive actions announced. >> it was one of those he announced. that is how i know about it. senator murphy: for the record, it was not in the set of executive actions he announced. he has requested congress make that change and the president has acknowledged that is the subject within the jurisdiction in theress, not enforcement of existing law. it is important to point out for the record, that is not part of the underlying executive actions. clear, i want to make thataid in your testimony, he announced the penalty for violating the existing law with respect to who needs to be license, is a certain time in jail.
dr. malcolm: i misspoke. the penalty is listed as on the record, that part of which -- senator murphy: that is the existing law. i think this speaks to part of our disagreement. if the very notion of expressing what the penalty is for violating the lot equals intimidation, that is a very different reading of our set of criminal statutes that many of us have come to understand. that is a simple recitation of the existing penalty. dr. malcolm: but you imply a whole lot of people who are not at the moment under the law are going to be, and will face that healthy, i think it is important. senator murphy: said then let's get to the implications. , attorneyvery much general strange.
you use strong words referring talkingxecutive order, about it being an unwarranted assault on the second amendment. this is where we get down to a question of the words on the page versus your perceived intention. maybe we can see that it is a little difficult for us to understand what is in the thoughts and minds of those who write the laws. we are left with the words on the page. maybe just share with me which of these five key points that are in this guidance do you perceive to be the unwarranted assault on the second amendment , or is that interpretation dependent on an interpretation of intentions that you've derived independent of what the attorney general has testified today. senator shelby: -- i think i would
adopt the comments of my colleagues. i would be happy to answer that question. i really jumped at the opportunity to come, because i wanted to deliver the message from the man women on the street, the people actually going into catastrophic act -- active shooter situation's, and their opinion, bring that here, and not only criticize the president's proposal -- i don't think it is the right way to go about addressing these issues, but to point out the areas that do make a difference. where the committee can make a difference have been neglected. one example is -- senator murphy: i'm going to run out of time -- my question is, what specifically, what is the section you perceive to be intimidating? what is the language that is the assault on the second amendment? to the extent you can point me to the provision you are referring to? a.g. strange: if i could follow
up, i would be happy to. i don't have it in front of me. the men and women in law enforcement, the people i work with devoted to solving the problems, -- senator murphy: i appreciate that. i think you have an obligation to point to the specific , but let -- provisions me just turn it over. i got the sense you probably have the most problem with the recitation of the existing court that are currently the way in which you would interpret whether you are subjected to the requirement or not. so you repeatedly referred to the suggestion that if you sell only one firearm, that you may be required to obtain a license. that is included in a section which simply recites existing court cases. let me just ask you this simple question. do you just use any -- disk you any of the information of
existing court cases on this question of who has to get a license? a.g. strange: my concern partly arises from experience. in my four years as attorney general of virginia, i dealt with the business end of the spear of the federal government as they over read, over interpreted, and used very aggressively, authority they did not have. we beat them back occasionally, but we had to do it. they are counting on the fact that corporations and individuals don't want to fight with the federal government. with the intimidation you are asking the professor about, is the vaguely worded -- despite the attorney general's continuous use of the word clarify, it is exactly the opposite of what they are doing. they are opening the door of the application of five-year jail penalties to a bunch of people right now, under the existing
law, believe they understand they do not fall under that. senator murphy: what is a? -- vag went i seeu is ae recitation of existing laws under public record. ? what is intentionally what of that, is intentionally vague, such as terminating? >> if all they wanted to do was apply the laws existing today, they would have to say anything. senator murphy: what is vague , when you bring all of it you all were discussing circuit the circuit differences, for instance. we have unique case law. the people who live in the fourth circuit who think of themselves as dealers and make a recognizef selling,
what the law is. they have come to understand it. you are introducing at the national level, a new threat of enforcement that there would not be any need for, if the law was not going to change. what are they to think? they are to think something has now changed, and the five-year penalty is being held out over the heads in a way they had to be concerned about. that is intimidation and has been used in all regulatory arenas by this administration for seven years. senator shelby: i just want to go back to the law. i will quote from it. for the record. as applied to a dealer in firearms, as defined in section 921, a person who devotes time, attention, or labor to dealing firearms as a regular course of trade or business, with the principal objective and
livelihood and profit through andrepeated purchase resale of firearms, but such terms shall not include a person who makes occasional sales for the enhancement of personal collection or hobby, or who sells his personal collection. the president, i believe is trying to assault the constitutional rights and it -- he is trying to get around the law. he trying to eliminate the last clause of the section. sen. shelby: you agree with that? senator murphy: can i make it part of that -- there i make a comment? are other factors that have to be included. it is not just one person that is selling one gun. that is why they don't have a number. a widow whose husband dies and she sells her husband's
collection, that would not count as a seller. i think congress has been very explicit that it wanted to prohibit the inclusion of the occasional gun seller listed,ing to be and get a firearms license as a gun dealer. the president announced he wants to it change the existing law. >> i did not read the existing law, i read the actual ticket of action. dr. malcolm: ok. but the president announced he wants to include the so-called gun show loophole -- >> he wants to include rights protected in the law by executive order. may i finish?
let's look at what this is actually aimed at. it is aimed at people who have emerged, especially with the internet, to sell thousands of firearms, while they are maybe a used car salesman. in the meantime, they may not have a store, but they have business cards and they may be selling firearms in existing packages. they are clearly in the business. that is why they have not defined to delineate who is in a certain number to delineate who is in the business and who is not. who shouldn't be captured are not like the widow who is trying to sell her whoand's guns, or someone wants to upgrade, would not be captured. senator shelby: i think a lot of us would agree we want to keep guns out of the hands of people with mental health issues, criminals, terrorists and everything else. but we will always protect the rights of gun owners and people who have guns, sell guns under
the second amendment. >> i don't see any infringement in any of the language. barton raises a legitimate issue about the change in the nature of sales with the growth of the internet. craigslist for instance. there's nothing wrong -- i don't think anyone would object to making sure those people using those avenues are properly , as it exists, but a new love was not needed good however, the enforcement and request for additional enforcement tools would perhaps get to those kind of people. i would note for you, what is called a gun show loophole is not a new debate. 40 miles west of here we have the largest run shell and the east coast. we have it because of legislation in the state senate. show,t through that gun
over 1000 tables, over 400 of them with gun sales, with the proprietor filming it. we went to every single seller of guns and asked every single one if they were licensed. every single one of them was, except six. of those, we asked three of them, what are you doing? all three of them had the same answer. they were all private sellers. they were liquidating part of their collection. all of them. it is covered in the law. the debate just in virginia, it happens every year. there's never a year off from this debate. it was never identified in virginia, a purchase, that came from the clinton administration -- where we found criminally
used guns being bought and sold at gun shows. did not happen in virginia. >> mr. chairman -- i think at the heart of this issue is simply a disagreement about what the words on this page say. i think it is important that when pressed, none of our witnesses could actually recite any actual verbiage in the order which speaks to this claim of intimidation. i think the exception you talk about, mr. chairman, for those just engaging in personal sales from their collection, is important, but that is in the guidance. the guidance says very specifically if you only make , occasional sales of firearms, from your personal collection, you do not need to be licensed here it yo.
you do need to be licensed if you are repeatedly making profit. i think there is a fundamental disagreement about what is actually on the page and i hope that as we have this debate, it is not anchored and perceived intentions of what the administration is quietly, secretly planning to do, but that the objections are based on the actual text of the executive order. i think that is what we have been missing here so far. we have been missing -- disputes and objections anchored in the actual text. it says exactly what we all agree on, we should enforce the existing law, which would inquire -- we people to engage in the existing licensed sales, those just selling occasionally. senator shelby: thank you, senator. i think the endgame should be
that we all uphold the constitution. i want to thank the witnesses for coming here today. we have had an interesting debate. i think timeliness is good. submitted to you, we hope you would answer within for the record. the subcommittee stance in recess. thank you very much. >> thursday night on c-span, wrote to the white house coverage of two credit residential coverage. at 7:00, coverage of bernie sanders inattentive. at 8:30 eastern time, hillary clinton holds a campaign event at the university of iowa. watch the road to the white house live coverage on c-span and c-span.org. >> c-span's campaign 2016 is
taking you on the road to the white house for the iowa caucuses. he getting monday, february 1 at 7 p.m. eastern on c-span and c-span2, we bring you live coverage, taking calls, tweets, and texts. live coverage begins of the republican caucus. on c-span2, live coverage of the democratic caucus. to stay with c-span and join in the conversation on c-span radio and [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corop. 2016] >> the u.s. conference of yors held a press conference at the beginning of their annual meeting. baltimore marry stephanie rawlings-blake is president of the u.s. conference of mayors. this is a half hour.
>> good morning and thank you so much, for my colleagues who are here with us today. i want to, before i open, i think we should go -- do our intros first, correct? so i'm going to ask the mayors are starting at my left if you could just give us your name [inaudible] >> just name and city. >> mark mitchell, tempe, arizona. mitchell, new bedford, massachusetts. >> mcmillan, clarksville, tennessee. >> brian waller, may of piscataway township, new jersey. >> city of atlanta.
>> mick cornett, oklahoma city. >> mayor joy cooper, city of holland dale beach. >> louisville. >> buckhorn, mayor of tampa. >> victor manello, artesia, california. >> i'm tom cochran with the conference of mayors staff. >> all right. just a couple weeks prior to the iowa caucus, the nation's mayors are gathered here in washington, d.c. to stress to the presidential candidates the administration as well as congress the importance -- importance of cities and the metropolitan areas which are really the lifeblood of the american economy. cities have brought this country back from the greatest recession since the great depression and driven much of our economy's growth. as our metro economies show,
nearly all the nation's 381 metro areas are projected to experience both real economic growth and job growth this year. clearly the future of this country rest with the cities. so the needs of cities so be front and center in the presidential camp and really any policy discussion focused on how we can help working families. we believe that this poinl campaign is an ideal time to change the discussion, to change the political landscape, and to focus like a laser on helping the everyday citizened that we represent. just last week a group of us traveled to des moines to participate in the blown and black forum. presidential candidates forum. it's the only one of its kind focused on prioritizing issues impacting minority communities in the presidential campaign. as we did then, we are calling presidential candidates and
congress to take seriously our mayor's compact for a better america, urging that we invest and protect our cities. invest maple leafs a federal government that must invest in our deteriorated and worn-out d-plus infrastructure. and protect means a federal partnership to support the mayors, our police chiefs and our police departments dashed as we work together to have modern, humane community policing that will help -- live in -- help people that live in our cities, including criminal justice reform, by the way. including the fact that cities have growing needs and those have to be addressed. that is the sole focus of this winter meeting, addressing those needs. we believe that mayors are the elected officials closest to the people and thus are best suited to understand the challenges of working families. what people around our country
are grappling with every single day. we know that many times those challenges are felt more acutely in minority communities. so for every positive story out there, there is still a story of someone who still lacks opportunity. our data show that at the end our 15, two felvingts of metro areas had more jobs than they did prior to the great recession. that really means that one third have not. a large number of metro economies still have not recovered from the lost jobs of the recession. this is why we must still make jobs and investment a key part of the coming year and this is why those who wish to lead our nation must understand the importance of cities and their metropolitan areas. we need our next president as well as the next congress to be our partners, to work in concert with us so that we can [no audio]reets --
>> black liveds matter! >> that's why we're here. > that's why we're here. >> up here to talk to him. how you doing, mayor? >> all right. we need our next president as well as the congress to be our partners, to work in concert with us so we can pave our streets, build more affordable housing, reform our police department and create good-paying jobs for those who need them. we are a nonpartisan group, and the one thing we know more than anything else, more than any other group in the political sphere right now is how we must work together.
our collectev message, if you really care about the financial health of this country and the well-being of the people should be to care about the cities. you definitely need to work with mayors. i want to thank you very much. >> black lives matter! >> and next we will have our vice president of our organization, mayor cornett. >> i did want to speak to the media today about some reforms we're looking for in the criminal justice system. there are bills in the house that deal criminal justice and we largely as the mayors urge the passage of these business. our criminal justice system in the u.s. is broken. it is not unusual for a jail in a city in the united states for 80% of the people inside the il to be innocent, not
convicted of their crime. and states are largely waning out of the corrections system, they are reducing their budget. they are spending too much time or not enough time work on the recidivism issues. do we need to stop the press conference until -- >> no. >> no. > all right. anyway, there are a lot of issues involving reincidentry programs in america that are not being addressed. at the local levels these issues are falling on the shoulders of our pume and our judicial system and the mayors that are in this radio. we need reform in criminal justice and it starts at the top and we were -- would urge congress to strongly consider the two bills that they have before them. >> thank you very much. we'll now here -- hear from our second vice president, mayor of
new orleans -- new orleans, mitch landrieu. >> good morning, everybody. thank you all for coming. i want to thank all -- all of the mayors for joining with us today. our president, and mick cornett and tom cochran and all those who have joined with us today. in 2015 all the mayors from across america, from republican and democrat, all the stirks large and small, came together and talked about national security, public safety, criminal justice, economic reform, climate change and jobs. the reason we do that is cities are where the people really give -- live, where government hits the streets. it's where we find a way to make things work all over the united states of america. in particular mayors have come together to put together the mayor's compact for a better america and we ask mayors
across america to think about ways of making cities better, whether protecting our streets, our neighborhoods, our national borders, to investing in our transportation system, which everybody knows is substandard, and the immigration system and the criminal justice system that we are all working on as we get through the issues that we're talking about. so the mayors are going to join together across america. we're going to talk about ways that fix the problems that make the lives of our citizen better and we're going to ask the presidential candidates to address the issues that reflect the problems for the cities in the united states of america so we can make sure we solve the problem where it matters most. thank you very much. >> thank you very much. now we'll hear from the mayor of atlanta. mayor kasim are reed. >> first i want to thank ms. rawlings-blake for her leadership of our organization
and tom cochran for his leadership. we thought it appropriate today because last month the congress n a bill parcells -- in a bi pairtsan fashion passed the fast act and all of you here who have literally worked tirelessly to get the transportation bill passed, we knew this as real progress. so congress has funded a $300 billion, fibe-year bism it's not what we all wanted but we think it's the opportunity for breakthrough in real job creation in the united states. what we all know and agree on is if we get back to the basics, dealing with our transportation infrastructure system nate bipartisan manner the way it used to be done, there are between 10 to 12 million very good jobs for people all across the united states be america. now that congress has passed
the fast act, we need them to take the next step as we enter the presidential election phase and that really is to give more power to mayors locally because west ability to fund projects that are closer to where people actually live. i say all of the time that cities are where hope meets the street, and mayors are at the center of action for that, so we wanted to acknowledge the hard work that was done by congress on fast act but to ask them to take the next step and push more local funding directly to mayors so that we can continue to push down unemployment and continue to keep the g.d.p. of the united states of america growing and growing. thank you. >> thank you. next we'll hear from the mayor of flint, michigan, mayor weaver. >> thank you.
i'm happy to have this opportunity to talk with you all. you've seen what's been going -- going on in the city of flint, michigan. i'm glad we're getting the attention that we finally deserve to have but if you have been keeping up with what's going on -- on, this is something that in april will have gone on two years now that e haven't had clean water in our city for our kids to drink. i know that you have seen there have been some resignations going on at the top level of michigan department and these are some good first steps. last night was the state of the state. those are some good first steps but flint needs for -- more thep -- help. so that's one of the reasons i was glad to be here, because it gave me the opportunity to talk with the president as well about what's going on in the city of flint.
our congressional delegation was together todays. resources are being sent to flint as we seek. they're resources that we need, but it is still not enough. so one of the things we know has to happen is to hold the state accountable. there is money there and flint needs to be made a priority as to how these funds are distributed. this is something that nobody should have to deal with. everybody should have clean water and it's just a travesty. it's ironic when you live in the great lakes states and you don't have ackstose clean water. so this is something that continues to be a disaster for us because we don't know at which point we will be able to drink the water yet. and so i hope other cities from around the country take note about what has happened in flint, start monitoring what's going on with your water, the infrastructure, and don't let this happen where you live. i'm glad to be here. i have felt such support from
the people that i've met with, from -- from the mayors that i've met with all around the country. they have been reaching out, looking at how they can support what's going on in flint and helping us get the resources that we need. but we talked about would this happen in a different community? well, what we believe is that we know -- we know flint is predominately african-american but it's also a social, a class issue as well and we've got high unemployment and so we just need people to step up, speak up, and speak out about what's going on in flint but i'm really glad to be here because i know we're going to get more resources. i'm going to get to talk with the people i need to talk with and we're going to do everything possible to continue to move flint forward and get us clean, guatemala water. thank you so much. -- quality, water.
all you guys -- not trying to make any assumptions. i cannot hear. i cannot hear you. yes, that's what i'm trying to say. that's exactly what i'm trying to say. just a moment, please. ok. this is for your "q&a," ok? about 20 minutes. ok. we're going to do 10-minute "q&a" with mayor weaver if i could have everybody be quieting please, so we could actually just hear the questions? i cannot hear everybody. > come on, guys!
? don't you know me? that's right. you heard me, right? you know me! >> ok. thank you everybody. ok, mayor weaver. >> could you follow up on your comments up made earlier -- emily banler with the washington "post." your comments that this raises questions about whether this would happen in another community and hillary clinton said in the debates saturday that she didn't believe the response would have been as slow in a wealthy suburb of detroit. do you think that's a fair assessment of what's going on and if it's precisely because t's high poverty, and minority imagine oirt the -- majority >> yeah, this is something we believe. it's a minority commurengts i -- it's a poor community ond -- and our victor santoses were are not heard.
like i said, this has been going on for almost two years and our citizens spoke out about this shortly after the switch was made to the flint river water and they marched and it wasn't until marc edwards came in and -- that people started listening to what we were saying. then our memorandum community spoke out. that took a year to be heard. i was glad she brought this added attention to this and made that comment. that is also why the state and national naacp got out and put oit -- out a stadium as well. buzz this is a civil right. it's a basic right. everyone deserves clean water. ? the governor yesterday in his state of the state address said that were failures of -- at all levels, at his level and up to fralt do you agree with that?
>> well, the state is knostly ultimately responsibility but we do agree with that. people ask who do you stpwhrame the buck starts with the governor but if we want to start pointing fingers, there is enough plame to go all the way around, that is exactly right. one of the things i've decided to do with my energy and time is let the investigation show us who knew what and when because i have to put my energy on making sure the people of flint get what they need. >> why did it take so long until something happened? >> well, that's the very question we asked because like i said, we have been crying about this for almost -- it will be two years in april. that's what we want to go -- know. what took so long? it didn't take a scientist to tell us brown water is not good. the question you asked is the same question we've had.
for at asks did you have president obama when you spoke with him? >> well, one ask is we need some federal assistant. -- assistance. this is bigger than the city of flint, the state can't handle it financially. we need some federal assistant. but the state still has to step up and give us some more. yesterday when governor snyder had his state of the state, that was a very good start but we know we didn't deserve what happened to us and we deserve more support, resources and finances as a result of that -- what happened. so that's what we talked about. [inaudible question] >> is that enough? it's a start. it's a start. that's been one of the issues with the city of flint has been broken trust and who do we
believe? so the governor doing that is a good first step because he's going to have to regain trust and confidence. so that is something that's a good start for him. trust was broken over a period of time and you don't regain trust in a matter of seconds because a statement was made. so this is something he's going to have to work on for a long, long time continued something the city of flint is going to have to work on as well. >> thank you, everybody. obviously if you have individual requests, you can feel free to talk to her. other mayors are also in the next room if you want to talk to other mayors about other issues. they are open and welcome to talk to you about individual issues. o thank you.
>> why did you want to be here to protest against rahm emanuel? ills of be elected city officials all over the country to fail to take care of the needs of the black community. there is no longer time to talk and sit down. we're just willing to do whatever we need to. >> have you been following the controversy with laquan mcdonald? >> yes. i think everybody has. >> and how did that affect you?
>> as a mother and as a plaque person, it's been -- black person, it's been devastating. regardless of what the name is -- in d.c. we have alonzo smith murder by police as well. o for all of these, yes. you may remember the names of them, hopefully you won't orget the names of the government and mayors and police departments who covered it up. >> did this issue change your view of rahm emanuel? >> i already thought he was pretty bad for the people.
>> well, i think the fact that can even -- our mayor is jut trying to pass a law to be able to have security conferences bit businesses. the burger king, the police partment -- they need to change and get rid of that kind of scoort camera evidence. and so there is no reason that these mayors continue to very much in the police and divest in black communities. >> what do you feel is the difference -- [inaudible] >> i don't see a difference. i think to the extent i see facts that have come to life is
the only difference. you can ask anybody from baltimore to southeast d.c. and south side of chicago, and our stories are the same the things that the mothers and the families say, the long-time policing issue is essential the it's in all black communities. i'm sorry, what is your game? >> april goingins. g-o-g-g-i-n-s. >> and where are you from? [inaudible] >> any thoughts on standing with emanuel? > i don't really care. [inaudible] >> i think that it would be irresponsible as a black woman to know that these many people who purport to be able to be working on these issues while
showing the exact opposite in the way that they run their cities and police departments, i think that would be impossible. to come up here and say that this is some fantasy world that they live in while the thousands and millions of people in their citied are experiencing something different and that these plillses -- policies and programs that they're introducing do something to -- nothing but put a bapped aide on. >> so you are holding up a sign about chicago. the mayor of chicago has said we're going to increase, have people wear body cameras, all these kind of steps in protecting folks in community. is that not good enough for you? >> not at all. >> what do you believe this happen? >> the current system we have doesn't work. reform won't work. we've been trying reform police
and prisons since they were both created and it's not working. so as for now i think that the biggest, mofede immediate thing that would actually bring some reef is just for the mayor to divest and the police department to divest in policing in the black community. >> you're asking for rahm emanuel to resign. what would that do? can you talk about the mechanics of what happens if he steps down, if you are going to have somebody from the city council take over? >> i think muriel bouser should step down, too. the fact of the matter is that these people are guilty so whether or not this actually fixes the system, it's not the only reason we do things. we think it's also more important that we look at these people and the acts that they committed.
or that they are not in the public. >> when you talk about divesting the police department would that man shifting of funds and -- >> yes. >> would that include police and schools and special operating units in black communities? [inaudible] >> how old are you and what do you do for a living? >> i'm 33 and i'm part of black liveds matter. -- lived -- black lives matter. [inaudible]
>> now a panel from the u.s. conference of mayors winter meeting on police reform efforts. participants include chicago ayor rahm emanuel, and baltimore mayor stephanie -- stephanie rawlings-blake. his is just under an hour. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corop. 2016] >> we are now going to work -- move into one of our two major themes for this conference. this is an issue that is very personal to me. as you know, after 9 death of freddy gray, baltimore broke out in civil unrest. following that tragedy, baltimore experienced its highest homicide rate per capita in history. this was the year after we reached the second-lowest homicide rate in our history. unfortunately, i know that many of your cities also face increasing gun violence,
particularly homicide and a breakdown in the relationship between the police and communities that they serve. it is gauze -- because of this alarming trend that reducing violence and strengthening police-community trust have been top priorities for me as mayor of baltimore and the conference of mayors. in just the last work our working group on -- police chiefs are produced a set of numb guidelines. following the events in feg uson, new york city, and baltimore and other cities around the country, our former president, sacramento mayor kevin johnson, appointed our working group. i since errly want to thank you for your leader -- sincerely want to thank you for your leader in that. we are now working on the implementation of the task force recommendations and i
appreciate that the be director, ron zaferse here with us today. where are you, ron? thank you very much for being here. i wanted you to know and make sure that you know that we now have a dedicated page on the u scm web site that provides information on the exex popularry effort of the cities in this area and the roe sers -- resources available to you to help implement the task force recommendations. i want to again thank karen staff for he helping that happen. in august i convened a conference when the city was experiencing a spike of -- in homicides this year. the leadership presented our recommendations to loretta lynch in a summit on violence in early october. when she discussed them with us the following monologue -- month, she said we were spot
on. today we're going to talk about the challenges communities face relating to violence ant community trust and the successful efforts we can undertake to address these. ecent events in paris, san rndino, and elsewhere have brought up more. chicago mayor rahm emanuel was first elected mayor in 2011 and was re-elected last year. he's served in top positions in both obama and clinton white houses and was a member of congress between thosestrations. he was -- has always been one to take on the most pressing and difficult issues of his chi -- city and the nation. new orleans mayor mitch landrieu is halfway through his
second term as mayor. e was -- has made reducing violence a top motor. next, marc morial has been the the urban league. he served as mayor of new orleans for two tearms -- terms and is a is past president of our organization, having led the organization during the tragedy of 9/11. interesting that they are both sovens form new orleans mayors and that their fathers also served as presidents of the conference. finally, sam dotson joined the police department before becoming chief in 2012. i want to welcome them all to the stage. [applause]
>> all right. we're all good? i am going to start the panel by raising a few questions. mayors, you will notice that there are index cards at your table. if you would like to share a shot or raise a question, please write it down and hand it one -- to one of the u.s.c.m. staff members and they will bring it up. thank you for your cooperation. make sure on your index card to put your name and the city which you represent. thank you. so. thank you all very much for joining me on what i believe is one of the most pressing topics that we face right now and let's start on a brief update on the crime situation in your cities abandon the -- and the biggest problems that you currently face. i'll start with you.
>> well, i would say they're consistent, which is -- well, guns and gangs. obviously as cities we're not islands but we can put in place some of the stuff -- toughest gun laws in the sense of criminal access but guns culling from -- we know what shops they're coming from and where they're coming from and having a comprehensive national policy or regional policy would be much better than trying to create your own policy. the other thing is gangs. you cant lou gangs to become an alternative family structure for kids where those values basically transferred to children, which is why we have put in place the largest, most comprehensive after-school summer jobs program. we now have 26,000 kids in sirm jobs and close to 25,000 kids in after school programs. even last year -- while overall
crime is down over the four years 35%, we had an increase in shoot sgs and homicides. adolescents as victims of shootings declined in the city of chicago, proving what we all know, that alternatives for kids, whether with a mentor, an difficult, a supervised safe place with activities, can have a positive effect. but the two bake areas on safety in the city? guns anding gangs. >> thank you. chief dotson? >> very similar. guns are our number one concern. st. louis had 188 murders last year, the most we've seen since the 1990's. guns are the number one problem and when we do make an arrest about those guns, we see a court system that doesn't gib us a change in outcome.
i mean no change in substance abuse, no change in outcome. we always have to talk about police-community relations in. one of the sessions they talked about the accountability that has to happen. we have to get that. if we don't build on that accountability we can't attack the crime problem. >> thank you very much. mayor landrieu? >> thank you. there are a couple things going on that are trends we ule -- all need to recognize. you had this when you were in new orleans. the violence on the streets of america is main effectiving itself in a number of different ways all at the same time. when i was able to take over the police department was for the most part bankrupt. we were under threat of consent degree. we invited the justice department to come in and begin to work with us on police-community relations. simultaneously therewith, the violence on the streets of the
city, we see it happening all over the place. laid on top of that, you have boston, philadelphia, san berndino and paris and what's beginning to happen and the mayors know this already is that cities are not special interest groups any more. we're partners with the federal government and cities are becoming the tip of the spear on not only national security but public safety as well and you have to do is -- it in a way that honors and respects the constitutional rights of the citizens. there is a lot of stuff happening at one time that all has to be managed with the appropriate manpower and resources that quite frankly the cities of america don't have right now. so although crime in america has generally been going down from 1996 through today, the temperature is much higher. the national security threat around potential terrorism on the streets of america has people at a heightened level
avenue wareness and we're being forced to confront all of those. my plea would be for the mayors also to talk to congress and talk about the fact that on the street where it matters, whether it's frol -- federal 's ugh the u.s. marshal office or the police department, they're functioning as one unit now and have to have to -- the resources to keep america safe. we're in a tough time right now. we have to figure it out and of course, like always, we have to make it all work within a certain amount of time and with limited resources. >> thanks. mayor emanuel? >> i wanted to take -- pake up on one thing the police chief said. if you go through prisons, there is a common set of themes much the most common theme? high school dropout, as it
relates to violence. chicago is at a record high near 70% graduation ray. our sophomore class it on track according to university of chicago to hit 80% graduation rate. in the long term, the biggest impact you can make on gun violence is getting kids to walk across the stage on graduation day. that is the biggest impact that we as mayors can have. after school, summer jobs but four years ago chicago had a graduation rate of 57%. which means 43 were dropping out. today it's nearly 70% and we're on track to hit 84% and that would have the biggest impact. obviously we've got to right now hit hard on guns getting into criminal hands, hit hard on giving kids an alternative gang life as a family structure.
that's how you make the biggest impact. >> now i'm -- now i'm going to hit you with two questions, mayor morial. i want to hear some feedback on that first question but i'm also going to pose this next question to everyone to start with. mayor morial, i should say while i remain optimistic in spirit, realistically we know there is no reasonable gun legislation or reform that going to come out of congress. so as a community or as mayors, what do you think we can do to make a difference when it comes to getting guns off our streets and reducing violence? >> good. first of all, i would like to thank the conference of mayors for bring me back. let me thank you, mayor stephanie. and all my colleagues. i'm the old guy up here. i had, and i want to
conceptualize this because i've been where all uven guys, men and women, are today because i spent eight years as the mayor of my beautiful, beloved home town that mitch now leads and led the most successful police reform effort in modern american history. we had 400 plus murders. we cut it by 2/3. e led the nation with the most number of civil rights complaints in 1994. y the time 2001 came, it was infinitesimal. who happened though was that after i left office, my successor dismantled the police reform efforts, leaving this mayor with the channel -- challenge of having to start the process all over again. now i sit in this seat as the leader of the nation's historic civil rights organization.
let me say this to all of you. you've got to own this issue. you've got to own the problem. you've got to own the solution. you can't outsource it to a great police chief, although that police chief is key and is a partner. you've got to own the details. the second thing, you've got to avoid getting boxed in between whether you owe an obligation to the hard-working men and women who are police officers and the community. you've got to avoid, quote, choosing, right? between one or the other or senior obligations. . your obligation is to the people. i told the police officers in my city when one challenged me and said, and this is important to know, will you back me if you are elected? i said, "i will back you when
you're right." his answer was, "i don't need you when i'm right." now, the point of the matter is, the point of the matter is, is that the truth is, is that you do have small numbers of police officers who hold that opinion. but the challenge in many p cities is the infection of culture, the idea that you've got to, quote, back each other no matter what. no public employee, no elected official should ever support that notion and that idea. so i want to say this to get in response -- [applause] to the essential question. when i say own the problem, this nation is crying out for the national voice of the mayors to be lifted on all be
-- of these issues. they have these debates in this town between special interest groups about gun legislation, but you've got to go to the funerals. you've got to investigate the deaths. you've got to deal with the consequences. we've got to make the discussion about these issues very real. mayor emanuel, mayor landrieu. many of you have put together very effective local jobs programs. it's time for the federal government to put some money on the table to put young people to work. so i would say this just to turn it over, i really believe that this is going to define american cities in the future. we've got to building bridges between police and community, we've got to recognize that the recession had a devastating effect and left many people locked out of the economic system, and the voice of the
mayors, own the problem, own the solution. new mayors, know the status and the condition of your police department. ask the questions. ask the question, how many civil rights complaints do we have? how many pending lawsuits do i have? find out. gets -- get the facts. know what the situation is because only by knowing can you avoid being surprised, ambushed sometime down the line because of what you didn't know. ask the questions. find out where you are and then be in a better position to own the solution. >> thank you. >> i got information to add, but i'm going to be a jewish mother. you got to move that microphone up. there it is. >> there's one right there for up. >> it the a janet jackson mike! >> want to break out the video? all right. we do have another one right there on the table for you if you want to swap. i'm going to go to chief
dotson. the basic question is what can we do absent national legislation to reduce the proliferation of guns in our streets? >> i think the president's executive order say great first step but all politics is local. all municipalities need to be able to regular late their gun laws. here's the reach. we have a state that has incredibly liberal gun laws. they're controlled by people who don't live in the urban areas. we're left to deal with the proliferation of guns. you are left to control your budgets, our budgets. we've asked for something as simple from a state court in st. louis as an armed offender docket, not to put people into jail but to track the successes, become experts in dealing with people in a cycle of violence that don't have the education, are the substance
abusers. summer jobs, economics are a great answer. we have to have the ability as a local government to have the outcomes and slegs -- legislation to keep guns out of the hands of those young people you're talking about. >> i just want to jump if on the invitation that president morial gave to us. you have to run to the fire on this one. it should be clear to everyone in this room that something has gone terribly wrong in america at this moment. we have dustups all over the country. not just on you wf. the first thing people should say is it's local -- it's local until it's not. the issue in flint, that's local until it's not. now it's a national concern. the bombings in boston. that was local until it was not. the whole message here i think we need to continue to send to congress is we are not a special interest group. we are partners in making sure that the streets of america are
safe. now, this is the only place in america where people can always have an either or an or as though the world was that clear, and all of us know that it's a lot more complicated than that. so just on the issue of your police departments, i think the president said it right, you need to ask the question. you don't really wa -- have to wait for the civil rights division the department of justice to show up on your doorstep like they did with me. if you get into it and ask yourself, are the police officers being hired correctly, supervised correctly, fired at the appropriate level, do you have the right kind of over sight when there say police-involved shooting? is my experience, we've had five consent degrees we've had to work with, is that the community will work with you if you work with them and get ahead of it. if there is a police involved shooting and there is transparent oversight, the
community more often than not about will -- not will get to the right place. they're all painful to go through. they're all hard. you got to find that. now, on the side that mayor emanuel talked about, i think long term the -- no question about it the best way to keep kids out of harm's way is to give them options. so when you are fighting violence, police chiefs are saying why are you looking at me to be the father and mother of every child? you know we have a huge problem with early childhood education, substance bution -- abuse, mental health -- just last night in new orleans, a 3-year-old was shot. we don't know the facts around how it happened, but we continually have these issues and you know all the mayors, you do this. you go to the funeral and when you are looking at somebody in the coffin, whether it's a
police officer or a citizen that was killed, dead is dead and there are may -- way too many people, police officers and citizens, being killed and the mode of operation say firearm. so one thing i think all of america can agree on is we need better gun safety. it's something everybody in america needs to get better at because we die at higher levels and rates than anywhere else in the entire world and certainly we are more than our fair share of it in the city of new orleans. but the president is right, mayors lead to lead. we are the ones who can understand the complicated nature of making sure that the police are doing the right thing, everybody is working together. because at the end of the day, everybody is from the same neighborhood. it the people of new orleans who are policing new orleans. but at some point in time, the streets are telling us that everything is not ok and you can't turn a bliped eye to
this. you have to turn to it, analyze it and walk through the difficult discussions, as painful as they may be. >> yeah, i want to add a couple of perspectives about the nature of violence in urban communities today. there is an organized element drugs and gangs operating not only within many cities but also in concert with the same types of testimony acower -- occurring in other cities. it involves the transfer of illegal narcotics, stolen weapons, fenced property. and what also goes along with this is the organized nature in which gangs operate and they operate like gangs operated in the 1930's. they are people specifically
enumerated within these groups as shooters of the there are people that carry out the intimidation of witnesses, the effort to take the lives of those that maybe invading on turf. there is an organized element to the violence that's occurring in many american cities. now here's what's true. what's true is that there are only a handful of police departments in the country with the sophisticated tools, resources, and mechanisms to infiltrate some of these illegal groups of really domestic terrorists. p because they're preying on citizens in our communities. so you all have to think about how we can build a stronger partnership with a.t.f., d.e.a., all that. and the other thing you have to recognize is that 70%, 80% of all shootings in most cities
are never reported. they are never reported. so you've got to look at new mechanisms to report those shootings. the final thing i want to say on police-community issues, i established when i was mayor a protocol, whafere police officer was involved in a shooting. and it involved a -- an automatic and immediate investigation by the office of municipal investigations. it involved a press protocol where there would be no opinionating by any, with all due respect, police public information officers, anyone who worked for me, about what, quote, their sense of the incident was. because i learned very easterly that -- very early that communities are inflamed when there is a rush to judgment and that all too of when you find with these cents you don't know
instantaneously all of the facts. and your job is to ensure that there is a levelness and fairness. now, that's not easy because sometimes usm police organizations and unions that want to get out there and offer an opinion about something. but here's the point. you need, if the police department is under your jurisdiction and control, you need a protocol. how will we respond in the hent -- event of one of our officers being involved in shooting a citizen or shooting at a citizen? what is our protocol? and you've got to have a protocol. and you can be a bit transparent with members of the city council, police unions and others about what this is. i just wanted to get that in because you also have to think about the very escalating public relations dynamics that
occur because of the body cams and dash cams and things of this sort that didn't exist 20 or even 10 years ago. >> mayor emanuel? >> i want to take up a little we have mayor said the gangs in all our stifments the truth is there are a few individuals in those gangs that are creating a disproportionate amount of violence. we have 22 police districts. in the sixth district, south side of the city of chicago, we have embedded d.e.a., f.b.i., the u.s. attorney and they're not allowed after the end of the day, they don't know -- don't go to their own office. they are housed in the sict -- sixth be district and they have their own office. they're targeting the individuals with the highest ind of heat number in terms of
causing violence so it's focused on the individuals with the greatest propensity and we're using all the resources in a coordinated way. we're trying that out. the serksd i don't know about other places but there are a few guns where the disproportionate gun violence on our streets we've traced to happen. in the past chicago we've considered pretty top of the line and modern gun legislation burr -- but we're not an island and there's three gun shops right over the city's border that play a big role in the guns on our city streets. we would like to see the city of chicago become a statewide model so you can torg the tars -- stores where the disproportionate amount of the guns come from and the individuals. in one way the federal government can be helpful, they have entities, in a very
coordinated, localides way of going after the few individuals that are creating a disproportionate amount of the violence and targeting them with state, federal and local resources in a concentrated way. >> i certainly agree the embeding of federal officers is helpful the we've done that in baltimore and we have that collaboration between all levels of the government and the prosecutors and it's been very help envelope trabbing down -- we had one seller of illegal guns that was coming in every weekend from i think it was -- outside of the state, somewhere in tennessee i think -- every weekend at least 20 guns. every weekend without fail and we were able to through that partnership to track that down. and this is one of the issues that we brought up in our meeting with the attorney general that this is not about cutting us a check. this is about using the federal
resources and our federal partnerships in ways that affect -- he feblingt real change in our community. >> that's the number one challenge that law enforcement is one challenge law enforcement is having around resources. the drug cartels we're seeing now are organizations, they'll deliver heroin to st. louis, methamphetamine to new orleans, that's where we need the resources to focus to disrupt the cycle. heroin is ep democrat nick all our cities, you can still get crack, you can still get marijuana where it's not legal. >> i want to add something, this is a reflection. i remember sitting here about 16, 17 years ago when the issue of gun violence was gripping and ripping american cities. and like so many of you, we had
a us from tration about the inability to really move any meaningful, you will, gun safety legislation through the congress. now this was just after the brady bill had been passed. it was actually in place then. the anti-assault weapon ban. of course, we were so, if you will, frustrated by what we were facing that 30 of us actually filed class action lawsuits against the gun industry. some of you all may remember that. now we were not that successful. and we learned about the power of the organized interests that support guns in this country. but i'm proud that we had, you will, the courage and the guts, 0 of us, to stand up and say something certainly needed to be
done. if all we can do now is talk about a strong, airtight background check system for all purchases of guns in this country and number two, a ban on assault weapons. james madison, alexander hamilton, thomas jefferson, and those fellows that wrote the bill of rights and the second amendment, i do not think they were thinking about an ak-47 or a glock. i don't think that's what they were -- what they had in mind. the duck hunters and deer hunters and all the sportsmen of the world, i don't think they use those type of weapons either to do in fact what they do. we've got to confront and not be frustrated that there's strong interest in this country. we've got to define the issue, that it's about safety, it's about military-style assault weapons. it's about a strong, airtight
background check system. and i really urge, i urge the mayors to lend their voice to that. because this police community -- police-community relations, drugs, it all goes hand in hand. it's a vicious circle and a psych until our communities and you can't have a voice on one without having a voice on the other and mayors can integrate and bring all these issues together. >> thank you. [applause] >> i'm going to spring until one of the questions from one of the mayors. from mayor yady and i don't know what part of new jersey you're from. that and writing is -- what part of new jersey? central. got it. ok. i just couldn't read it. >> we're not going to answer until you tell us what exit you are on the highway. [laughter]
>> on the turnpike. >> new york media market, right? >> so the question, where in the conversation regarding police -community relations is a specific topic regarding personal responsibility? >> i'll take it. in every discussion i have with faith-based community, the not for profit community, whether it's in the african-american community or the others, everybody always starts with personal responsibility. there's discussion that takes place, and this is a misnomer as if people don't talk about this and engage in this discussion, every mayor that i've been in meetings with says, essentially everybody is responsible for themselves. you have to -- there's only so much the government can do, even on our best day, when we're performing perfectly, you can't replace a father or mother. you can't ever really replace a
church or a coach. essentially the community has got to make sure that they're all in or none of this can be done. but, that doesn't -- so this is the or, is it personal responsibility or something else, it's everything. rahm alluded to this, in terms of getting after the small number of people creating most of the crimes in certain neighborhoods which is essentially what you have, it's a three-prong strategy. i'm looking at my friend michael, together we started cities united. the multiagency gang strategy, rahm just identified it for you. in one neighborhood in his city, in a police precinct, it isn't just the local police officers. they're the ones leading it but you've got a.t.f., d.e.a., guess what they're doing? they're targeting individuals that they know through intelligence that are part of gangs and they've gone after them in something called the group violence reduction strategy where they have the eyes and ears on the best intelligence that we can find
and we need more resources to do it. once they identify who those folks are, they actually need to get either the u.s. attorney or the district attorney to identify which one of them has the best chance at prosecuting the most of them all at once. now it used to be in the old days that if one person shot and killed somebody, you'd arrest them and indict them and convict them for one murder. that's not the strategy anymore. this is starting to happen. this works. where the u.s. attorney and district attorney are starting to arrest these guys with conspiracy theories like they use with the rico statutes and in new orleans, we've indicted and convicted over 119 gang members in two years and reduced the level of violence in those neighborhoods fairly significantly. now, there's still way too much of it. but this is a tried and true practice that in my opinion once it's been done needs to have the resources of the community. at the end of the day, the part of the group violence reduction strategy is calling the young men in who you know into court
and saying to them, we know who you are. we know who you hang out with. we know what you do. we're going to give you a choice today. we want you to be ok and if you choose well, we'll put you in front, give you mental health services, substance abuse treatment, but if you don't choose well and exercise your responsibility the way you're supposed to, we'll have to do what's necessary in a constitutional, thoughtful way to protect you from each other and to protect everybody else from you. that strategy is working but you need the resources. you need the boots on the ground. this is the only discussion we're having where people will leave, you know, folks that need to fight the fight on the ground without the resources to make it happen. we don't do that in national security. we don't leave folks on the field. we give them the resources they need. this is a national problem. in some neighborhoods it's an epidemic. and we need to treat it like that in the united states of america. we're not doing that. >> i do want to take on two points. there's a place where we collectively in the public's eye can reenforce personal responsibility.
and our public transportation system we now have the largest reentry, second chance program in the united states. i believe the best way to make sure that an ex-quict is not -- ex-offender is not a reoffender is a job. i can provide the opportunity but you have to make a choice. if you don't make that choice, then there's nothing else i can do. but we have to, what i can do and what i as mayor or all of nuss public life, we have to provide that opportunity. in the same way with after school summer jobs. there has to be that alternative but you have to make a personal choice to have a different life and lead a different life. and sometimes we don't tie, i'll give you one example. we were now as i said, 26,000 summer jobs. four years ago we were at 14,000. we now make the kids sign a pledge to go on to college. they participate in the summer job program, you've got to show some initiative that you're not
going to just have a summer job but do something else with your life. it's a subtle thing. small. not going to be a game changer but it reinforces that personal choices, decisions you make have an imfact on -- an impact on your life. we have a role to play to help reinforce the positive choices you make. we have a role to play to make sure there are consequences to the wrong choices. but then to also always reinforce that you don't get a pass when it comes to the decisions you make. in the same way, i know all of us in one way or another touched on this, parents don't get a pass on being parents. you have a role to play in making sure your children know right from wrodge, good from bad. we can co-everything we need to do on the public side to support parenting, but not to supplant it. and that's important that we reinsert that value system. [applause] >> these are all important questions but mayors, here's how you can operationalize that.
visit one school every week. methodically and in a determined way. and go talk to kids. go talk to them about responsibilities, hopes, aspirations, and dreams. the power of your image, going into a classroom and i like to visit schools and go to a classroom, not just a large auditorium, to talk to kids on a methodical basis, to talk to them about obligations, responsibilities, these young people today, particularly when they become 10, 11, 12, are paying much closer attention to issues that go on in the community and also it's a great way to find out what's going on and put your ear to the ground to get a sense of what's happening. it's one thing to say, let's talk about personal responsibility. it's another thing for all of us to use the pulpit, to use the platform, to use your voice, to use your collective will to talk
to young people on an everyday, all the time basis. so i'm going to issue that as a challenge to all of you. many of you do it. and many of you visit schools. if you could do it one per week, spend one hour each week at a school in your community, you'll have an impact on how these young people think and what they do and how they live. >> personal accountability. really quickly, it's a two-sided equation. let's talk about the law enforcement accountability into that equation. we have to have policing agencies that look like the communities we serve. it can't be a long-term promise. we have to take immediate steps toward that. and that's what i push to the officers. your experiences will be different than your experiences. as we recruit people, i want to -- i want a diverse police agency that has young people, young african-americans teaching older whites, older african-americans teaching younger whites what the community is about. we heard from david kennedy that
communities who have stronger relationships see crime reductions. if we can start to have the accountability side on the law enforcement, what can we do? we have to look like the communities we serve and be committed to it. it's a small number of people that commit the crimes, focus on the people who commit the crimes, not the race. >> the biggest thing we're trying to do in chicago and i always reinforce this, we can either patrol a community or be part of a community. and if we're patrolling it, you're going to have a limited impact. if you're part of a community you'll build trust and cooperation that's essential for safety and legitimacy of the police department. >> so this brings us, we're -- we could be here all day talking about this and i'm sure some of us could talk all day. ut i do want to exercise the prerogative as the moderator to give us think last question. we'll start with you, chief.
a lot of what this boils down to is trust. we know the issues that we face across our cities, we know that there's no switch we cab flip to end racism. there's no button we can push to end income inequality. but there has to be things that we can do to improve trust. as a chief, what would you tell mayors to do to help build trust between the community and the men and women that you lead? >> i think we first started, and they're doing this in st. louis a public commitment to diversify the police department. st. louis is 56% african-american, we're at 36% in the police department. that shows a commitment to understanding the problem. we take all our officers through implicit biases to understand those differences and that differences aren't bad. mayors need to invest in their police departments, make a
long-term commitment to diversity and give them the tools and training because every encounter and we have over 300,000 911 calls we respond to every year. every one of those has the potential tore a michael brown or an eric gardner. we have to make sure we have quality police officers that look like the community and are open and transparent. >> president morial? >> i agree with all that he said because if you walk the streets communities, they wail say, and mayor landrieu in new orleans, there was a time when the community, the police department didn't look like the community. that may not be the case today because you've got a predominantly african-american police department. and you can still have issues with a predominantly black police department. right? diversity alone will help but doesn't do the trick. secondly, and this was an issue
in new orleans. the sense that most of the police officers live outside of the city. and by virtue of that, their kids didn't go to school they didn't worship they were not part of the fabric of the community. these are barriers to overcome. i fought and enforced a strong domicile ordinance. it isn't the case that one exists today in a city like new orleans. but you have to hear what people are saying. thirdly and importantly, you've got to embrace and understand that the philosophy of the tact -- the philosophy of, the tactics and strategies of, community policing are not a cliche. it's about commanders having relationships with community leaders, it's about officers understanding that they're not evaluated on simply racking up arrest numbers. that what we are thinking about, what we want to focus on is overall reduction in violence.
and that means understanding that the police department is just one part of the system and that there are other parts of the system like prosecutors in courts that are part of it. to build trust, i also think the mayors, again, must use their leadership to indicate that they're going to put their credibility on the line to build that trust between officers, the police department and institution and communities. it isn't an easy challenge. as i said if you don't own the problem, you'll never own the solution. >> thank you. >> i want to just -- i want to echo that with a bunch of exclamation points. do not be afraid of this. you have to run to it. this notion that somehow the community, in this instance the african-american community, does not want to work with or partner with the police departments is wrong. that is not correct. what they don't want is an oppress i have police department that is making arrests based on
race and not behavior. a lot of crime is taking place in neighborhoods where people want to be protected. the police department has to be of the community. you have to earn this. the mayor makes an excellent point in the city of new orleans this epolice department is majority african-american. in the last five years, everybody on that department has had to earn it back. community policing is the way you do it. you don't drive through the neighborhood you stop and talk. somebody needs help, give them help. if someone needs to be arrested, the consequences have to be meeted out but they have to be fair and have to be transparent. when there's a police-involved shooting in new orleans now, after five years of working through the consent decree, stoons that happens, p.i.b., which is your old m.o.i. shows up on the scene. the independent police monitor shows up. all of a sudden there's a thorough and transparent investigation so the public knows that what's happening is fair. now, the outcome isn't always
predetermined. in some instances, right, the police officer did the wrong thing. in that instance that officer gets indite and/or convicted. the police department and unions have to say, under those circumstances, when the officer did the wrong thing, we're not going to stand there and try to justify that behavior. on the other hand when the officer did the right thing, when his life was in danger, when he was protecting other people and the prosecution and investigation work the right way, the community more often than not will back it up. but this only happens when they're part of the process, when they feel like there's a relationship between the two, and there's trust. and the only way to do this is he hard way. you've got to earn it every day. and you've got to prove it over and over again because it's a trust but verify situation. we are in the circumstances that have occurred in our nation across all of our cities should nonstrait that we do not have this right in america right now. there's upset on the streets. there's miscommunications, there's lack of trust. you've got to get it back.
the point is, it's gettable. the public wants to be one with the plt and the police department has to understand how they have to be one with the community as well. we're going to have to work through this painful time. there is success on the other side of this. but you have to focus on it as though not just a law enforcement issue but it's a public health threat too. it's all the other stuff we talked about because you've got to be good on the law enforcement side and the preventive side too. it teals with early childhood education, summer jobs and opportunities for folks. >> i start and have always believed in community policing that every encounter between law enforcement and a resident is a teachable moment. if they walk away positive, you got something you're going to draw on when you need it which is essential to safety. the trust factor is not just a goal. it's a key ingredient to effective community policing, which is what you need for safety. second, people, the public has to know there's a legitimate oversight.
it's certain. it's not biased. and the truth is we're working on that. our city, other cities, because there's a lot of judgment that the oversight has been lax and there's not an accounting system. third, and i think the most mportant thing, is helping folks in where community see beyond the badge. there's a father, mother, coach, parent, there's people that are more complex in their lives, not just a uniform and a badge. in the same way the kids they encounter are not just a kid with tattoos or a hoodie. they too are siblings, or parents themselves. nd get beyond the stereotypes. i've been facilitating these meetings across the city, i bring the local community police officers, commund leaders, aldermen. the communities most affected by
distrust, begging to host them out in the community, not in the precinct. we're to be the to put out a memo, we want to, with some regularity, the roll call you do in the department, out there. in the community system of it's visible because they want to see you. second if you support the police department, go in tell them, you're doing a good job. they too need to here -- to hear periodically. one of the things we're doing, about a third of our department in short order will have body cams. that gives people trust. there's another set of eyes. this came from a resident a woman about two summers ago. we have officers on bike, mainly in the central business district, etc., but we started a pilot. we opened up a playground and this woman, about 40 feet away, started walking. when somebody -- when a resident has that, ok, what's this. and we were cutting the ribbon on a playground. ok, here we go.
she said, i've got something to say oto you. i said, ok. she said, i want to say thunk. i said oh. you don't get that often. i said what's that? ever since you put police officers on bikes they're stopping more frequently at the playground at the park, now i let my older son walk my will younger son to the playground at the park. so we're up to 400 police officers patrolling on bikes. they'll stop at the front stoop, at the playground. they'll be at the street corner when kids are leaving school. that pays dividends. we're expecting to -- we're thinking of expanding it further. all those pieces of accountability, discipline, all these things reinforcing, driving toward a trust factor that gives the cooperation for community policing and the essential legitimacy and effectiveness of community policing. >> i cannot thank you enough.
one of the things i tried to focus on as president is tackling the tough issues head on. i think you've done that today. i know i'm grateful for this conversation and i hope all of you who are here are as well. please give our panelists a round of applause. [applause] >> coming up on c-span a senate armed services committee holds a hearing on u.s. strategy in the middle east. iowa governor terry branstat delivers his annual state of the state address. later, part of this year's winter meeting of the u.s. conference of mayors with discussions on criminal justice and police reform. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2016] >> on the next "washington journal" we talk to general motors pamela fletcher about the future of electric cars. and tom jawetz on the supreme court's decision to review
president obama's use of executive action on immigration. join us live with your facebook comments and tweets on c-span. at the senate hearing on u.s. strategy in the middle east, committee members heard testimony from former army vice hief of staff john keane and former ambassador ryan crocker. senator john mccain chairs the armed services committee. this is two hours and 40 minutes.
senator the senate armed services committee meet this is morning to continue our focus on our strategyful we welcome the news this weekend that four americans who had been unjustly held captive in iran have been released. there will be plenty of time to examine the original circumstances and their release. but four americans being
reunited with their families is good news. but we must continue to look into other prisoners. us vious generation wants to remember that they were, quote, present at the creation, of the rules. if present trends continue, we may well remember that we were present at the unraveling of this international order. while signs of the unraveling can be seen in europe and asia, it's most visible and most dangerous in the middle east. all across the region, we see a dangerous breakdown of state authority and the balance of power. as henry kissinger testified before this committee, there's a struggle for power within states, a conflict between states a conflict between ethnic
and religious groups, and an assault on the international system. as general petraeus also told us last year, almost every middle eastern country is now a battleground or combatant in one or more wars. for the past seven year the obama administration has sought to scale back america's involvement and commitment to the region. assuming that a post-american middle east would be good for the region and for us and that regional powers would step up to police the region themselves. results of this massive gamble should now be clear to us all. no new order has emerged in the middle east, only chaos. a power vacuum has opened up in the absence of america and has been filled by the most extreme and anti-american of forces, sunni terrorist groups such as isil and al qaeda or shiite extremists such as the islamic republic of iran and its proxy sis and the imperial ambitions
of vladimir putin. these challenges were always going to be present and difficult but it did not have to be this way this dangerous. instead of acknowledging failures and changing course as previous administration of both parties have done, the administration has all too often doubled down on its reactive, incredibility -- incremental and inadequate policy. now more than a year into the campaign to roll back and destroy isil, it is impossible to assert that isil is losing or we are winning. to be sure there's been some tactical progress including the recent recapture of ramadi. s that testament to our civilian and military leaders, but serious challenges remain. isil has lost some territory on the margin but has consolidated power in its core territories in both iraq and syria. it maintains control of key iraq cities like mosul and fa lieu jasm they estimate that this key the rain will not be retaken
this year. the u.n. reports that since isil's invasion of iraq in 2014, nearly 20,000 iraq civilians have been killed. nearly 3,500 people, predominantly women and children are children, are estimated to be isil slaves in iraq. it is no surprise that the training of iraq security forces has been slow. the building of support for sunni tribal forces even slower. in syria, there is no possible strategy to achieve isil's the feat on a timeline that would result in the tragic deaths of tens of thousands of syrians. there is still no ground force that is both willing and able to take cities, nor is the realistic prospect of one emerging soon. in the absence of a realistic strategy to create the conditions for the achievement of u.s. goals, the administration has fallen back on hope.