tv Criminal Justice and Wrongful Convictions CSPAN August 21, 2016 8:58pm-10:01pm EDT
again, you don't quite fit in. -- our guest is nancy isenberg. she is a historian. trashok is called "white ." we thank you very much. >> thank you. >> for free transcripts visit us at q and a. or. q&a programs are available at c-span podcast. >> did you enjoy this week's interview with nancy isenberg,
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likely to sit or. 7:00 mondayng at morning. join the discussion. >> now look at criminal justice by a man who became a lawyer after being wrongfully convicted and serving time in as an. and rappers discuss how the user music to gus racism. and a discussion on hillary clinton's policy agenda and at 11 p.m. another chance to see nancy isenberg. >> as a teenager jarrett adams was convicted of sexual assault and served 10 years in prison before being exonerated with the help of wisconsin innocence project. now he is an attorney helping to represent defendants. he spoke at the city club of cleveland for about an hour. good afternoon.
welcome to the city club of cleveland. i am a partner at baker and hot settler and it's my pleasure to introduce today's speaker jarret adams. in it addition to my day job i serve as the president of the northeast ohio chapter of the american constitution society. thate a nationwide network has lawyers, judges, students and professors all dedicated to the promise of our constitution and to the values it embodies. civil rights and liberties, genuine democracies and access and justice. years ourast few program has hosted programs on wrongful convictions.
we heard from ohio attorney about thed his wife mix of our criminal justice system and how they produce wrongful convictions. to be clear, they are both republicans, which shows this issues not a partisan one. last year, we heard from ricky jackson, the clevelander who spent 39 years of his life behind bars, several of which on death wrote for crime that he did not commit. death wrote. last year i was fortunate enough to meet jarret adams who had a makes during its similar to ricky jackson. mr. adams was 17 years old when he was sentenced to 28 years and a maximum security prison after being convicted of sexual assault. yearsserving nearly 10 and fighting multiple appeals he was exonerated with the help of
the wisconsin innocence project. he used the injustice that he had endured as an inspiration to become an advocate for the underserved. in the loyola school of law after graduating from university with high honors in may 2015 he graduated from law school and started a public withest fellowship honorable and clay williams, a judge on the seventh circuit court of appeals. the same court that had reversed his conviction because of his trial laurels -- lawyers. andtly after, mr. adams antoine day established the life after justice center. it served as "an advocate for the rights of the wrongfully convicted by seeking health care, housing, job training,
computer skills, finance classes, mentoring, and more." this past year mr. adams passed the new york state bar and just last month he joined the new york innocence project is one of its attorneys serving our profession and our society by helping convict -- wrongly convicted men and women. since 1989, innocence projects across the country have exonerated 342 wrongly convicted inmates in 37 states. 70% of them have been people of color. but his accomplishments can be considered extraordinary part of his story is not unique. according to a 2014 study published in the journal pmas, more than 4% of the sentencing between 1973 and 2004 are likely in a sense. men of color are
disproportionately representative. it begs various questions. how can we combat racism in the questionjustice system -- question mark what role can -- play that is truly fair for all. the conversation on race, equality in the american justice national wideing and yet the city club and we're so glad to add mr. adams voice to the discussion. ladies and gentlemen, members and runs of the city club join me in welcoming jarret adams. [applause] thank you all from join us here today. thanks for the good introduction.
i am starting to get more speaking avid student -- speaking activities. thank you so much. this is something i have worked on for over a year now. i'm thankful force dumping into -- stepping into the city club. a good idea tos go to a college party in wisconsin, like an hour and half outside of chicago. it changed the trajectory of my life. 17 years old just out having fun. we do things as kids without thinking about the repercussions. in my case, we were just going to a party and to be falsely accused of a sexual assault i didn't commit to just like most
17-year-olds, making up, sex, , thatinking, smoking pot comes with being a teenager. it also came with a false accusation. that changed everything. the reality for me was totally different after this accusation. i was a kid thinking about even during trial about the chores that i needed to do when i got home during the weekend. yearsd up sentenced to 28 in prison. my mother, single mother, worked two jobs and it still wasn't enough to be up to afford an attorney. is then many instances reason that our prison population is overfilling right now, is access to justice. the prison system has a disproportionate amount of black and brown men. if we were all green it would have a dis-portion of amount of poor people in prison.
getting a attorney is more than saying i am wearing a nice time. we are being sworn in to serve the people. that's exactly what i failed to do once i was released. i was sentenced in 1998 to present -- to prison. the first prison i went to was green bay, wisconsin. it was one of the most violent prisons. fortunately was never attacked, but you cannot erase what your eyes see. the place of correction is a place of warehousing. i saw it on a daily basis. , and waving a white flag for your lives. 90% of those men will be going home one day.
at the same time i'm fighting for my reading. that site didn't start until one waswhile in a prison cell i so up with a man who is close to 60 years old and had been imprisoned for nearly 20 years. he was an older white man who was found guilty of two murders and he would tell you that he committed the crime. unlocked down. then you are pretty much in anselves and they are doing investigation. lockdown was the first time that i really had a conversation with someone i was in a cell with forum six months. during this time i happen to have a prison -- and i was calling out to my parents. everything is in your cell.
myself thatall in timen the year 2000 at the it for thestrumental reason i am here today. i was talked to my mother and my aunt about how they denied another one of my appeals. they were denied my appeals by saying, you have a strategy you can do over. who is impossible to be in two places at one time. , i got to the point where i was in the cycles just like many of the people i was in prison with. i just didn't want to do with my case. i'm telling my mother they denied another one of my deals and i don't understand why.
as soon as i got off the phone i was told to get off of the top bunk. they were listening to everything i said on the phone because he was on the bottom bunk. he said i have been in the cell with you almost six months and i have never heard you say anything about innocence, your case. you don't do anything but play escobar and chess -- play basketball and chess. i have this conversation with him that i saw myself in the same cycle of giving up. he said let me see your transcripts. i gave them to him that day, many of which were on open and still in their envelope, because i just wasn't strong enough to deal with the reality of being in prison for 28 years with the mandatory release of 2019. i wasn't far enough to take my
own life and i wasn't strong enough to deal with the reality of the place i was in. week we course of the got off of lock down and he read my transcripts and my police reports. played, went out and basketball and chess. therapeutic way of dealing with it. i came back to my so one day and he had all my paperwork spread out. he had the police report in hand. he said he's -- he threw me a notepad and a pan. races will craft -- you are working and giving out. you have the rest of your life i had of you. i wentd to start working
to the law led library and i my own versionh of a petition to get myself home. i was writing everyone trying to tell them they were innocent but i realized that as years went by, my writing got better. my research got better. i went from saying look i am innocent get me out to sing look, i'm innocent.
it was immediately as i started writing these letters i got a response. i got a response from the wisconsin innocence project. me with twod saw law students were in school at the time. and they said, do you mind if we take your case? and i almost fell over, do i mind? absolutely. they took my case, and they started litigating my case in court. they did this federally. confusing, you have the opportunity to file in a federal court and say there are constitutional flaws in this conviction. the seventh circuit granted me a certificate to appeal. with the innocence project appealed my conviction to the
seventh circuit where a three agreed toe of -- overturn my conviction. i listen to them argue my conviction, i was on the phone onprison while it was listening to them argue on my behalf. almost a year to the date that they argue my conviction in a court i was released. that was another fight that started. , recordnow i'm released is expunged. report cbs asked me to get pictures. notnt to my mother's house, only to eat her food but to get these pictures. i look through a photo album from when i was a baby until 17
when i graduated from high do not those pictures start again until i was 27 years am i hads strong as i to go or move myself from the room i go cry. it put into perspective just how i cannot erase that. i got out and i noticed when i got out that my aunt and my emotions were very sensitive to me. they just didn't know. misconceptions that you believe from prison, you just know. you know that they are not set up to be release from prison to do very well. they develop the same about me as well. i felt so god awful that i put
them through this. i made the decision to go to this party. even i wasn't guilty, i felt so guilty that my mother had to go with that cloud over her head and she would be brought to tears. that was the day i knew i would be an attorney in the state of new york. i do know that i old them one. -- the prison calls, i owed her for giving birth twice. one time to get me there and to continue to keep my spirit alive as i sat for 10 years in the prison. i got up off the couch and to those -- 2007 and i walked three
road.down the in chicago in february, it is long. blowing, i enrolled in school. i just wanted to be able to one now andhat i am doing be able to contribute and talk to people who are going through things and even talk to people before they go through things to help them understand that this is real and possible. i graduated in 2009 from south suburban. i was able to meet someone who introduced me to someone who hired the is a full-time investigator at the public defender's office. itot that job and contributed to my growth as a person. inent from being in prison 2007 and in 2010 i am going into
prisons and taking statements, and i am helping people and contributing. that encouraged me to continue to go to school. . went to school at night my schedule was ridiculous. i would get up at 5:00, or to 6:30, go tobest work during the day, serving subpoenas and stuff like that in chicago. i never realized to many loose dogs were around in the city until i served the subpoenas. i would come back from work into the office and read from 5:00 until 6:00 and i go to school until 9:30. repeat go home and then the process and i did that for five years.
i am saying that specifically for you kids that are here. obstaclesing to have always in life. you are going to have to decide whether or not you go around it, or overwritten or right through it. you will have to keep going. .hat is a real message that's not scripted. that's what i had to do. i did not know i would be here today as an attorney. i knew i wanted to do something. i was able to get through law school by continuing to network and meet great people. i'm a great attorneys. graduating from law school with an outstanding, but what was theer is working for seventh circuit. the same circuit that over turned my conviction.
many times i would have to ask the clerk of the court room with me what was going on in court. i was thinking about when i was in a maximum security prison. some attorneys argued my case for my freedom. courtroomn the same less than two years later as a graduating law student on his way to becoming a lawyer. --s made me pinch myself to myself. applied for the chicago bar scholarship foundation, which i want. she was one of the deciding vote members. me. was very important to again, nothing on my record but the tentacles of a conviction will reach you almost forever. i did not have a bank account. i didn't have credit.
banks did not find me credit and my last known address was a maximum security prison. in voters crystals to school and pay my way through college because of the difficulties that i endured. that scholarship that i received from the chicago bar foundation was very important to get me where i am today. i never lost touch with that relationship. i continued to send them e-mails, updates and let them know how i was doing in school. they gave me the opportunity to clerk on the very same circuit that overturn my conviction. i spent the next six months after i clerked in the second -- seven district in new york, i clerked for judge deborah batts. another amazing person who sat thatwn and told me things
i needed to know as a young person starting a legal career. to do with nothing being a lawyer. oh my goodness. but it's necessary. you have to do what you need to do to get through and get by and that's what i did. i needed that community of support and i got that continuously, to get to where i am today. start working for the innocence project. i could pinch myself sometimes, as i walk through the door, and i have my case files of people that i am fighting for the innocence. not even 10 years ago. i was fighting for my own innocence. want to seem as if what i did was so amazing that no one
can do it because you can. you have to believe in yourself. the one person that should never stop believing in you is you. this is a talk about my life and my story, but whenever i am in the room with kids that are close to my age, i am sure i need to let you know to pursue school. and i my time is short want to stay within the time limit. i will conclude by saying this. i had a birds eye view of the criminal justice system. it is a not a place of corrections. it's a warehouse. one of the things i saw in prison is people getting out in the wintertime, they are coming right back in the summer. ,ecause i was there for so long i would see the same people come right back. i would have conversations with them, what happened?
basically, what i got from what they were telling me was, they were first convicted from a crime in their community. they were in prison with no skills at all being taught to them. they were released right back into the community, where the crime happened at. they were right back as a result of that. -- iss what has happening happening in our present. the second thing that really is i was watching a couple of guys play basketball. i know sing that they are calling each other's names. pops, old manas and son. it wasn't a month later that these are nick names. that was a grandfather, a father .nd a son in one prison
can you imagine what this family looks like right now. continue to banish people from society and bring down our communities, how can we ever expect to stop the senseless gun violence that plagues our community. to bridgeever expect the gap of the police and the community, women are strong. they are not strong enough to be a father and a mother. there are a thought -- a lot of fathers in prison. lot, justfully, but a because they were in the backseat of a car that took a couple of shots. and in enormous amount of men and increasingly women are imprisoned for drug for pot. can do that legally?
that's a head scratch. and it is taking a toll on our community. you cannot put people in prison, teach them nothing, then release them and tell them to do good. it doesn't make any sense. you don't have to be an attorney or a rocket scientist to know that. the system is broken since its inception. the design is flawed. now people are speaking about it, but they are speaking about much ause it is not so racial one. if you are poor and you can't put up a defense your chance of going to prison is hot. look, i may be guilty as hell or innocent as
hell. that is so true. that is the truth and the reality of it. the people that we release from prison are going right back boil, that is starting to into everyone's neighborhood. everyone must take notice to this and do something about it. is,n't care whatever it have these real conversations at the water fountain. what you do, who you vote for does have an effect. speak up. we all will be here in new york and we will leave it to the next generation. how do you want to leave it? right? you wanted to be the greatest country in the world, and also -- prison in the world? it can't be. we can't say that there are one point something million people worthy of being banished from society. , stillrtest attorneys
some of the most thoughtful, eloquent and smartest people i ever met were right there in number onh a prison their chest. very smart man. we don't know how they would benefit from society. that the show men or women are in prison forever won't have the groundbreaking medication that can cure cancer, for something that can contribute to society. some people are placed in new situations simply by the democratic -- demographic, by where they are born. i thank you all for your time and i really appreciate you coming out today. thank you all. [applause]
i'm director of city programming at cleveland and today we're enjoying a friday jarrett adams, attorney and co-founder of life after justice. q&a. about to begin the we welcome questions from veryone, city club members, guests, and students or those of at the public library. if you would like to tweet a question please tweet it at the and our staff will try and work it into the forum. we remind you that your to tions should be brief, the point and actually questions. today, the microphones our outreach fellow fay walker
and office assistant wesley allen. the first question, pleas lease >> i'm a retired school teacher and so often students would come have the f me that same story you have. that are frustrated and have falsely accused of something. brand ofstion is, what hasher say to a student who or ped believing in himself herself, to keep her eyes on the prize is just ready to give up. a teacher you say to to try to help that student? question.ou for your teachers have one of the most society, for in real. the attention span of kids, you know, are like, so i would encourage you to do
this. you, as a teacher, have, in some effect on a an student's life than their parents because you're around and and see them so much you can't give up. if they give up, it's one thing ut you can't give up encouraging them. can't.st it's a full-time job. it really is. thesere you take a lot of stories home with you as a teacher and it weighs heavily on your heart but you have to encourage them, continue to encourage them and tell them stories. only young black man who has been able to overcome the odds. know, i don't get as much airtime as if i was a that, or something like there are stories that you can find to continue to encourage push kids to continue to forward. i really don't have, you know, the concrete answer for you than to say that, look,
until it elieving becomes true. so continue to have faith and to push forward. you again for your question. [applause] >> did you go back to jail and speak with your cell mate? know, actually, you know, away, you e passed to , and it was hard for me find like him and where he went strange, it may sound when you're in prison, you're not known by a name. i.d.just have numbers on an so you don't know people's full name, government name and stuff like that. around in letters and trying to contact him and stuff like that. letters did of my make it to him.
-- he, you know, a person didn't care about being known or anything like that. wanted to say his peace and quite honestly most of the time i was in there with him, he grumpy ole man. for real. i wasn't able to have as great a relationship with him as i to.ted and specifically, when i got out, there was just so much that deal with, getting out and starting a new life. you one example. i go down to get my i.d. been tol, who have ever go get an i.d., you know how those lines are, right? it's ridiculous. go down to get my i.d., and i'm in line for about an hour. like, okay, you can get your i.d. birth d like a certificate or social security guard. i don't have one. go over there. line for two hours.
you can get your birth need your , you just i.d. it was stuff like that i was dealing with, trying to into society.ck it took my focus off of thanking him the right way. sure, i'll make sure his memory lives on because i won't stop telling that story. you for your question. [applause] >> do you find that immigrants are particularly vulnerable ecause they are in a strange place, they don't know the language or the laws. oftentimes they don't have the money. what have you seen? >> i can tell you, from two in pectives, from being there and being out now as an attorney. absolutely they are vulnerable. not only ulnerable to just, you know, access to justice but also, victims of crime. are they going to report to, right? a lot of studies out on immigrants who come into this make a living
and send back to their family. of, are taken advantage slave wages and all types of -- in prison, what i found was, there were people who they spoke english and were sentenced to serve time in prison and instead of being to ased, they were released a county jail awaiting extradition back to their country. that was another head scratcher for me a because now as i'm attorney i'm asking myself, right? not only as an attorney but a contributing member of society ho pays taxes, why are we spending money to lock them up and send them out of the country? what sense does that make? it makes no sense at all. so i saw a lot of that. very disheartening because, when you think of depict nd the way we people that have handcuffs on, when you see people on the news, arrested, you don't ask yourself, i wonder what he was accused of, or i wonder, you know, if he has a good attorney.
you immediately say, i wonder did or she did, right? and i found out that many of people that i met in prison, they have families, too. too. were fathers, they were brothers, too. getting ot of people deported. some of their sentences were over and it was one of these would tell methey oftentimes, look, man, you think it's violent over here. violence in w venezuela, and they would come over here, and circumstance have it, they would end up in prison and they would be to the same country that they flee. many of them would do it over and over again. definitely a long topic and ssue, but thank you for your question. >> how are you doing? you just wondering where found the drive and courage to keep going after you got out of just be one ofto
those people to go back. did you ever receive an apology defensive the wronglys or anybody who accused you of the crime? >> great question but they don't court.ze in that's not what they do. i had a chance to speak to my attorney. and, you know, look, he didn't -- he failed to case.tigate my i'm accused of a rape, following someone up some stairs, it's around the es all school who could have placed me somewhere else and just totally accusation. a false he didn't hire an investigator. he didn't go and investigate. witnesses or any do any of this and i was so upset for him for so long, when got a chance to actually hear he, too, i heard that is human, and he made a mistake ball. dropped the and it happens. he practice of law is just that. it's the practice.
some lawyers shouldn't be lawyers. and some lawyers try their and they make mistakes. we're all human. we are. you're our say shop. sunday to answer specifically the encouraged ut what me. if i can get you all to see the and creases on my mother's forehead in that rison, in that visiting room, being told that that's it, you can't hug the son you gave birth visit is over, calls, just, the whole everything, right? one se i'm not the only there. she's out but she's in prison in spirit. ridiculous shows about what happens in prison, and she's thinking that this is to her son in
prison, i owed her and i was somehow, some her way. what encouraged me. yours may be different. maybe what you hear from me will encourage you to go on and be but ust great, extraordinary, right? because you can do it. you can. just remember me, man. i may have my aarp card and be remember, look out for ole me. throw me a bone. for your question. though. >> thanks for your presence and lessons.us some i had one question about your cell mate but now i have another one, only one question. your perception of having been in jail and you made some omments about drugs, possession, do you think if we treated all of drug possession charges. ot necessarily trafficking put ges, as diseases and didn't
into prison those people, do you be a great ould improvement or drew an opinion on that and when is your book out?g >> thank you for your question. i do. i'm an extreme notetaker so i taking notes in prison and i take notes here, i'm a bit of a nerd, i read everything. a study in norway of how they run their prisons, right? of them running their prisons is more so like how it should be. in prison, no doubt, you can't get out and leave but it prison, look like a right? and it goes to my point that i'm making. people up like animals, feed them like animals, tell en release them and them to be human. it doesn't make sense. all.oesn't work at and, you know, the thing that are in prison, a lot
they are prison, there because they have different vices, different types you know, abuses and things like that right? many of them are substance right?, many of them are selling drugs to feed their own habit. any of them are robbing, killing, and stealing to feed their drug habit. we're punishing people, we have this extreme glutton for punishment in society, right? we don't just put people in prison and say that's punishment. all the way them until they die. you can't do this, can't do people are going to prison and they are not being treated, right? being treated at all. they are people who come and eyes,are right before your they are suffering from withdrawals, of heroin, right in the cell with you, if that's mate.ell not being treated at all. and when you don't treat people release them back into the
same community that they come from, same things happen. you, youite honest with can get whatever drug you're looking for in prison, whatever it is, right? of them do drugs in prison as well. we have to separate people who there for nonviolent crimes from the people who are there telliolent crimes and i'll you why. if you're raised in a house full yell, you'll raise your voice without knowing. so if you're in prison with a people who are violent, you will be what as a result? violent. the one who is handing out the violence or the violence. and the entire -- the entire rehauled.ds to be but it has to be a want by that has all the money in our society, right? 1%.h, yeah, 1%. it has to be a want to change that. an advocate for changing
what goes on inside, right? ecause if you change what's going on inside, you change the umbers of the people who are inside. if over -- if it's like over -- 70%, i'm not around sure of the recent study, but just think about this. in half of the people prison have been there before, right? that means they have been to prison. we call corrections. they have been released, and they came back. analogy.e another imagine this, 50% of the cars that were produced by, i'm not company, i don't want them mad at me if they see a car t just imagine if company produced cars and on verage, 50% of those cars came back, after they left the stop.tion line, it would something would be done. the sn't it been done with prison system, right? i mean, the answers may be is it because of the
people who usually fill the prison system? black and brown thing? is it a poor thing? something. we do know that. thank you for your question, though. >> hello. over here. -- my fiance has been in prison for 13 years for crime that his best friend committed. they both passed polygraph tests. his ased on innocence, and best friend admitted he was passed.and also we have always fought for his innocence, for his freedom. hasn't been one year that we haven't filed something, any or whatever, but recently, the innocence project here in ohio decided to with his attorney to file his new trial motion and we innocenceplication of pending with our local conviction integrity unit. once last year,
sat on it for nine months and this enied it but after article was written by kyle swinson, they decided to reopen case, initially reopen his becauset i think it was of the attention, from the article that, you know, brought that decision to reopen and investigate his case. you s the family members, know, how do we keep -- how do we create more attention on cases when all the evidence is there, it's as clear read this, you would say to yourself, why is this man still in prison? even started a petition and we got a thousand signatures but stopped. so how did your family keep fighting for you after so many years? it's been 13 years for us and we got to s like -- this point with the innocence project, which is awesome, but to bring more attention to his case and make
more people aware of the injustices that are happening to him and so many others. how do the family members keep create that attention? >> yeah. >> we've written celebrities and everything, too. you for your question. i'll make sure i give you my information before i leave so we an talk further, but to be honest with you, that's a question that my mother and ints could answer better than could, but i will say this. oil, queaky wheel gets the you know. so you have to continue to beat that drum until the attention, comes, and listen, we cannot forget about the power in our hands now, with these cell phones, with social media, and you don't have to wait for someone to write a report. become your own author and write these blogs and on inue to spread them social media and tag people. tag the president of the united people and continue to beat the drum but he also writef has to continue to
out and, you know, wait for justice. look, the unfortunate thing about prison and being in look, it really doesn't go slow. one e you know it, christmas will turn into eight. before you know it. it's one of these things like, the best thing for me to do when i was in there was every day t each and i was going home the next day. that was one of the things that sane.me it was like reverse psychology for myself. so i can just imagine what ou're going through because i know what it was like to speak on the phone with my mother uring prison calls and see her on visits and stuff like that. so i would definitely repeat what i said earlier. faith and continue to reach out to as many people as you possibly can. average i was sending out 50 letters a week, on average. i'm only supposed to get 10 doing a week but i was
writings and legal work for people. 50 stamps. many of the letters wouldn't change besides the date. hello, it's me again the and i was mailing the same people. took a long it tie. i was in prison for five years before the innocence project so it took a lot of reaching out, and now, more than back in 1998, there was no google. google didn't come out until 1999. there was no emails, cell phone, and stuff like that. going to tweet and facebook like do it with the purpose and with the cause. thank you for your question. >> i'll make sure i give you my information, okay? >> this is going to be really a follow up to that question. time i've read or heard about a person like yourself found innocent or being exonerated, it seems that there extraordinarily sloppy ob done on the police and the
prosecutor's side of investigating and making any eal effort to determine what happened. now, i appreciate the pressure assistant ght on the prosecutors, or district where ys, depending on you're from, to achieve a conviction but from your vantage point do you have any as to changes that could be made on the onsecutor's side and perhaps the police side to see that in ers such as yours are, fact, properly investigated? >> thank you for your question. that's a great question. i actually have been giving it some thought. the relationship between the police and the prosecutors as close as they are. they should not be able to work hand-in-hand. prosecutors should not be able to become investigators, and back to a prosecutor. shouldn't be able to go into a room and question a suspect as
with seen so many times prosecutors. you shouldn't be able to go tell a police officer how to question how to obtain stuff. we have created a criminal system, a system in itself that pits sides against one another. it's a n't care if spitball contest, whatever type of contest it is, you don't care anything besides winning. and when you do that, justice is robbed. so my suggestion would be, we need to have a separate entity the police and the prosecutors. an entity where -- you don't to know the name of a person to find out whether there is enough evidence of guilty. to definitely don't need know the color of a person to find out if there is enough evidence for guilt. don't need those things. there should be a room with open-minded people who get evidence, who look at evidence, whether or not it goes to trial. nd the prosecutor and the
police should not be able to hand job that evidence into they wantfit whatever it to fit. way.hould never be this it just shouldn't. in the end, when you get out, if convicted, gfully it's a thing called immunity, so ou can't even sue the prosecutors and the police unless you catch them doing egregious, meaning that, they were actually dropping the murder weapon at or something like that. how do you do that? most of the cases of people convicted, they have been there for years before technology was out. and now science is advancing now with dna and all types of stuff to get people out but nce you get other you can't even punish the people who did it to you because many of them police prosecutors and officers are now judges, are now captains of the force and stuff like that. winning.about it's not about justice at all.
not.just you see i'm passionate about that. boggling.nd thank you. [applause] the wildlycomment on popular serial popcast. ind of a similar situation, where the lawyer didn't do her job. >> yeah. >> is that going to help project?e >> i actually was in prison with stephen avery. was in wisconsin and the show is about a case from wisconsin, and i didn't personally and stuff like that but when you're in prison you bounce around from prison to prison so i in the with stephen avery. i don't know enough about the into guilty or innocence or anything like that but i do know this. and get my own niece or nephew out of school uncle.m their so how on earth can the police go and get a kid out of school, in the police station, basically question them or hours, then take them back
to school and later use that as evidence to charge him and his crime?ith a like how -- if we want to preserve the criminal justice system, they should be given a new trial. that's what they should be given. new trial. if there is enough evidence and you fell like they are guilty evidence ld be enough to find them guilty fairly without using evidence that was of factured by way intimidation and just straight -- just taking advantage of people. taking advantage of people. for you all who have seen this a murder, you know in detail what i'm talking about, for those of you who some of the evidence used in the case, there was a kid who was basically, you know, for hours and ed ours with no parent and no lawyer in this police department, being questioned by people forquestioned a living and had been doing it forever.
as evidence to convict him at the trial. it's heart breaking. his kid is in prison right now basically, it's a de facto life sentence he has with all of he's in pri. i'm glad that they exposed this there is another point that i want to make about the show that i think is missed. stephen avery was wrong glikted, he was released after 20 years dna proved that he didn't commit this rape and i think murder or something like that. so he's was a rape released from prison. and the crime that he's in jail like a year ned after his release or probably shorter than that. from prison, with and he's staying at an uto body salvage yard, a junkyard, isolated, reminiscent of what?
prison. you're also isolated in a prison. he wasn't given mental healthcare. mental sn't a evaluation, no screening, no nothing. bad., our you're released, you didn't do it, you didn't commit the crime these released in conditions of god knows what. living by ler yard, himself, and now he's arrested and in prison for murder. topic inld be a bigger itself. like i said, i don't know the evidence of the case but i do the fact that he was released without no one talking to him. anything, you of know, anything, whether it's arriage or whatever it is, you might need to talk to someone from time to time, and it's like and, released from prison you know, it's like nothing so that case is just mind boggling. for your question,
thoug though. [applause] me.hank you for having really appreciate it you. c-span..org you can watch our political programming at any desk-top, laptop or mobile device. here's how. name of a e in the speaker, review the list of search results and click on the program would you like to watch, refine your search with our many search tools. most 're looking for our current programs and you don't want to search the video lie brashgs our home page has many current programs ready for your viewing such as today's washington journal or day.vents we covered that cspan.org is a public service of your cable or satellite provider. if you're a see span watcher check it out at cspan.org. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp.2016] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] secretary clinton is better
[applause] >> all right. the tone for the conversation, we have so much talent, each and every one of spend this entire evening talking to you, so we're going to get into a number of today.ent topics i want to try to hit on as much as we possibly can, which means 'll sometimes move the conversation along. please don't write a song about me, like i don't want the next to be this indian boy -- i don't need that. all good. so, but just, you know, if i -- us having a real conversation here. the other thing is i don't want panel.o be like any other i would like to get as deep as possible into some of these people hat a lot of skirt around. a lot of the panels like this, people may mention something
and just move on because it's controversial. but i want you to be able to be about, you know, about what you think and how we can start moving the conversation forward. how we can start looking at these same conversations differently. like to actually start off a lot of these types of dialogues, with a question of do. you do what you and it is -- it's such an important question because we have a pretty good familiarity with what you do but one thing sit the that none of us can ever tell you. it's the one thing that you can us.h and i would like to do it in a little bit of a different format it off. kick i would like for one person to what they do and i would love if you tell it orough some sort of antidote somebody who has influenced you in your life to just quickly get whoever the d then
next person will be, i would like to you build off of something that the person before said. so, you know, whatever it is, you say, oh, when you said this, made me think of this. perfect. so starting off with why you do hat you do and why these conversations are so important you know,sonally, is, the first time my mother was a one an airplane was way ticket from new delhi, chicago, illinois. she was there to go meet my dad, arranged marriage supposed to be her knight and shining armor. she went over there and i always my dad had a small studio apartment with two roommates, a ockroach and