tv Washington Journal CSPAN September 19, 2016 7:00am-10:01am EDT
hacking. as always, we take your calls and you can join the conversation at facebook and twitter. "washington journal" is next. host: good morning. it's monday, september 19, 2016. a weekend of violence in minnesota, new jersey, and new york has law enforcement on high alert this morning. no one was killed in the explosions in new york and new jersey, and only the attacker died in the mall stabbing in minnesota. but each happened in a very public place, and each had the potential to be very deadly. with authorities still working to provide answers in all three cases, we begin our program today on the "washington journal." simply asking to you take stock of how safe you feel in your community. are you concerned or has this type of violence in the united states become something of a new normal? phone lines are open this morning, want to hear your thoughts, democrats,
202-748-8002. independents, 202-748-8002. you can also catch up with us on social media, on twitter, @cspanwj. on facebook, it's facebook.com/cspan. very good monday morning to you. we begin with some of the headlines following this weekend's violence. here's the front page of "the washington post" this morning, three cases widen terror fears is the headline. to the front page of the "new york post" in new york, city on edge, talking about the chelsea terror attack. that's the bombing, 29 injured in that bombing on saturday night. to the front page of the "washington times" this morning, the headline there, terrorism suspected in a series of attacks, front page of the "new york daily news" this morning, simply goes with "terror." and to the front page of the "wall street journal," u.s. attacks stoke unease is the
headline there. as you're reading these headlines this morning, we're simply asking to you bring us into your breakfast table conversation. what are you talking about when it comes to how safe nuffle your community? lines are hone pen. we're going to try to stay away from speculating or get ago head of the investigation this morning. as the "new york times" points out this morning, there's a lot we don't know about these attacks when it comes to the chelsea bombing. we don't know who was responsible for the explosions. we don't know the motive behind the explosions. we don't know why the site of the explosion was selected. "wall street journal" giving us a rundown behalf we do know about these different attacks. three violent attacks over the weekend left almost 40 people injured and remain shrouded in questions, but today they fueled growing fears among authorities about terror assaults by small groups, lone wolf, or simply deranged
individuals. police said a man dressed as a security guard injured nine people late saturday in a shopping mall in st. cloud, minnesota. he was shot and killed by an officer, an off-duty police officer. in new york, authorities were searching for a bomb maker who set off a blast near a large trash container in manhattan on that manhattan street on saturday evening. it left 29 people injured from flying debris, including shrapnel. also last night, happening overnight, another device found, this one in new jersey, one of five devices found in a backpack near a train station in new jersey has exploded, while a bomb squad robot was attempting to disarm it. the elizabeth mayor said that the device exploded shorting after 12:30 a.m. this morning. the f.b.i. was leading the investigation and working to disarm the other four devices. that's one of three explosions that's happened in new jersey and new york. we're asking our viewers this morning not to get ahead of the investigation, but simply, do you feel safe in your
community? what are the conversations you're having this morning as you're heading off to begin your workweek? light of those attacks, that violence over the weekend? paul is in lake como, pennsylvania, a republican. paul, good morning. caller: good morning. how are you today? host: doing well, paul. how do you feel? do you feel safe in your community? caller: yes, we're a small town, you know, maybe a population of -- you know, a few hundred, you know? our nearest big town here is big hampton, new york, or scranton, pennsylvania, and we're probably about 115 miles from new york city. but i can understand the fear of people getting out today and going to work and sending your children out. but i think that our policemen are doing a great job, and if
we listen to them and just give them the credit they need, i think everything is ok. host: paul, what are the conversations people should have with their children as they send them off this week in school, as they're seeing headlines this morning? caller: just be alert. just be alert. and if they can have an adult maybe with the small groups going to school, if they're walking or fire a bus, just be lert on what's around you. and, you know, yesterday morning, i tried to get on -- if i could just for a second, they were -- they asked a question what we would ask the people who are running for president. and my question would be this, after the debate is over with, and you have answered all the questions truthfully would you
be -- would one or both of you be interested in sitting down with a professional and taking a lie detector test? host: all right. caller: you have a great day. host: thanks for the call this morning. we're talking about these weekend attacks. we want to hear your thoughts on how you feel about the safety of your community. brian is in clinton, maryland, independent. what's the conversation you're having this morning? caller: well, the conversation that me and my wife had yesterday is it's time to kind of like almost arm yourself, because the democrats, obama and clinton, have allowed the enemy to enter our country. they've let them come in here with open borders. you've let the islamic radicals into the country. obama wants to put 100,000 more in here. clinton says she wants to let hundreds of thousands more in our country. they're attacking us every which way they can, and it's
anybody -- if anybody doesn't believe that and you want to vote for a democrat, then this is what could happen in your community. you would have no one to blame but yourself for allowing that to take place. host: do you think -- do you think the gun debate and the immigration debate in the presidential election? you think that's now going to be a central theme? caller: well, sir, they're attacking us on the streets. i mean, what else can you do but defend yourself? the only thing you can do is arm yourself. you've allowed the private citizens of the united states to be attacked by an enemy, which the democrat party and the communists in this country have allowed in here. the police can't protect you. so what other choice do you have? if they're going to walk up to you in a mall and start stabbing you, what are you going to do, stand there and wait to call the police? no, you have to defend yourself. the american people need to fight this war themselves. but the enemy that we're fighting is our own democrat
government. host: all right. that's brian in clinton, maryland, this morning. for more information on that mall attack in minnesota, on saturday night, a man dressed as a security guard began attacking people with a knife, making references to allah and asking at least one victim if he was a muslim, authorities said, this according to "the wall street journal" report. nine people were injured, all were expected to survive. the man was eventually killed by an off-duty police officer from another community who had to fire several shots as he repeatedly tried to get up and lunge at him. the aalleged attacker was identified as a somali american, and he was claimed as a soldier who was inspired by the group's message. "usa today" in its reporting on this attack makes this note in light of that identification by the islamic state -- it was not immediately clear if they planned at tack or knew about it beforehand. isil has encouraged so-called
lone wolf attacks and also claimed past attacks that are not believed to have been planned by a central leadership. that's some of the reporting this morning. as we said, we're not going to try to get ahead of the investigation. we just want to hear your thoughts this morning as you think about your safety and your community. norma is in kentucky, republican. good morning, norma. caller: hello. thanks for taking my call, c-span. i agree with the caller from maryland. he said about everything i was going to say, bless his heart. but we do feel unsafe, even with my husband cutting the grass these days. and we need someone in office like trump to take up for us. because this has been going on for so many years that older people are terrified that even stay in our own home.
but like i said, the caller from maryland said everything i was going to say. host: norma, why do you specifically feel unsafe in kentucky? why do you feel unsafe with your husband on the lawn mower? you think something is going to nap your community? caller: well, you see new people coming in, and they look at you like they're going to jump out and do something any minute. host: what do you mean by new people, norma? ller: well, they're just next, and it terrifies the way they sandact when you go to the store. some of them walks out, they slam the door right in your face. and when you get older, you're ore terrified. you know, we're jersey living in a world right now that everything is just going crazy.
i guess it's a much stuff going on that we all live in fear. host: all right. let's go to illinois. independent, steve, good morning. you're on the "washington journal." caller: yes, i want to first thank you for letting me people. but, yeah, i live in a rural community, and i feel safe. but for the east coast, i secretary of state john he and the russian secretary of state did three or four weeks of talks to stop the bombing in aleppo, and on saturday, the united states dropped the bomb and killed 62 soldiers or whatever and injured 100.
that just ruined all the talk i believe that john kerry worked so hard for. i just don't understand what the president did in ordering the strikes. host: this is from the associated press, it's exactly what you're talking about, just want to put us all 09 same page. the headline is allied tense as syrian cease-fire fizzles amidair strike. syria's fragile cease-fire started to unravel with the fist attacks in aleppo in a southern village that killed at least eight people, violations that came as tensions between the american and russian brokers of the deal worsen following a deadly u.s. strike on the syrian government forces --
host: with this unraling -- caller: how come nobody in the media had covered that and, you know, john kerry worked so hard for this, and it's just like a slap in the face. and i really don't think that we have the intelligence to because we isil, don't speak the language and our ulture and basically country country are kind of like white or, you know, we don't -- and we're 6,000 miles
away. host: all right. let's go to john. we're talking to our viewers this morning in light of those attacks over the weekend, that violence, the bombings that happened in new york and new jersey, that stabbing in .innesota john, a republican. what was your conversation like this morning? caller: well, in answer to your question, i don't believe that anybody honestly feels safe in our communities anymore. our border down here is a sieve. a lot of folks don't see local news. a lot of folks don't see the front line, as it were, of the damage caused by the present policies of our government. our communities down here are overflowing with all sorts of refugees, illegal immigrants and so forth. our infrastructures are
overburdened to the point where police can't even respond anymore. the thing that i would tell anybody, you know, listening at this point is this. when you head to the polls, when you head to make your vote , the one thing that i would remind everybody is this -- i go back to the question that ronald reagan asked, do you feel that you're better off now than you were four years ago? my question is, do you feel better off now than you felt that you were eight, 12 years ago? the decline, the true decline in the response by our government to the present situation is pathetic. and people don't -- host: if people feel that way, what can they do? caller: you mean the general citizenship? host: yeah. caller: well, what they can do is study their candidates. you take a look at hillary clinton, for instance, and the record speaks for itself.
when people honestly don't pay attention, when they don't listen, and when they are turned out of the process that's going on right now, these are the very people that are responsible for the situation that we're in right now. if you're not an informed voter, then you're not a voter. you need to study this. and i'm going to say this once, mr. trump is the best possible option that we have at this point in time when it comes to true leadership. we never would have had to deal with this if we had a different administration in there. host: we're taking your calls, getting comments as we talk about this violence in minnesota, at tax in minnesota, the bombings that happened in new york and new jersey.
peter king was on "face the nation" yesterday morning, was asked about that bombing in chelsea in new york city. here's a bit of what he had to say. >> whether or not this turns out to be overseas terrorism, necessary particular terrorism, any terrorism at all, it's another wake-up call as to how vulnerable we are, and it's so important for the police and f.b.i. to be given the tools to do what they have to do. >> if new york can be had, a city that's been on top of this issue obviously since 9/11, what more can be done? doesn't these things just happen, part of the new normal? >> i don't think we can accept it as being part of the new normal. go to the larger debate, why the n.s.s. is important, it's why surveillance of communities is important. why we can't allow over concern about civil liberties to get in the way of solid law enforcement. let's not let political correctness stop the police and f.b.i. doing the investigations.
i've used an example many times. when you're going after the mafia, go to the italian communities. irish communities, when you're looking for the west, and right now if the islamic terrorism, we go to muslim communities. host: members of congress talking about the violence over the weekend. here's a democrat from california, on the new york city explosion, a bomb in new jersey, and eight people stabbed in minnesota, god bless the hands of law enforcement that toil away to keep us safe, his comment on twitter yesterday. and brad sherman, also of california, democrat, says clearly the new york city bombing was terrorism. we need to investigate the motive of of the terrorist. some discussion about using the term terrorism in light of the explosions in new york and new jersey. in the "new york times" article that talks about what we do and don't know, one of the questions that is posed is was this an act of terrorism?
they write, on sunday, the governor, governor cuomo said there's no ed of an international terrorist connection to the explosion, and that no groups had claimed mr. responsibility. still he cautioned it was early in the investigation and said that whether it was an act of terrorism depended on how the word was defined. a bomb exploding in new york city is obviously an act of terrorism, he said. the mayor called the explosion an internal act, that from the "new york times" much we're getting your thoughts this morning on the safety of your community, how safe you feel. dawn is in maryland, an independent. dawn, good morning. caller: good morning to you. i'm maybe about 15 minutes from baltimore and d.c. i feel perfectly safe. i think what's going on here, the i'll the say president, he made a comment, he said a couple of issues are
going to be on the ballot. he mentioned one would be fear and one would be hope. right now, i think there's so much paranoia out there that i ink we basically are kind of -- i think we're feeding into the fear narrative, and i totally reject -- donald trump said he's going to be the law and order president, so i think you got a lot of paranoia, paranoid people out there, if i said it right. host: do you think some of the fear and paranoia becomes more justified for those individuals in light of what happened this weekend, a stabbing attack that the islamic state has claimed some sort of responsibility for , and these ex-plogse that are still being investigate -- and these explosions that are still being investmented? caller: personally, no, i don't, because i could almost
see it coming. i could see it coming, because basically a lot of your callers, i hate to say it, but the way they're talking, they actually want a police state. they're talking like they want a police state. that won't fare well for ertain people in this country. i totally reject it. i'm definitely not going to fall into that trap of fear. most of the country, you know, they want a and law order people. if they want one, then i guarantee they'll regret it if he becomes the new president. host: all right, don in maryland this morning, talking about the presidential candidates. both talking about these incidents over the weekend. hillary clinton in her statement saying i strongly condemn the apparent terrorist attacks in minnesota, new jersey and new york. i pray for all of those who are wound and had for their families. once again, we saw the bravery of our first responders who run
towards danger and help others. she went on to say their quick action saved lives, officials are working to identify who are behind the attacks, and we should give them the support they need to finish the job and bring those responsible to justice. we will not rest until that happens. they should defeat isis and other terrorist groups. donald trump also tweeting about this as well in a series of tweets. one of them he notes trnl attacks in new york, new jersey and minnesota this weekend, he's thinking of the victims, their families and all americans. we need to be strong. he also said saturday's attacks show that the failed obama, hillary clinton policies won't keep us safe, i will make america safe again. under the leadership of kobe and clinton, americans have experienced more attacks at home than victories abroad, time to change the playbook.
a series of tweets from donald trump yesterday on what happened over the weekend. want to get your thoughts, got about 20 minutes left in this segment, just opening our phones. want to hear the conversations happening at your breakfast table this morning. in west virginia, a republican. good morning, bud. >> good morning, c-span, i enjoy your show. my comment is that we are letting our enemies in and oing all wars. every terrorist that comes in, they come in and setting up their own little military, and once they attack they're in trouble, and we're just seeing a part tv right now. but i think we should close the
borders on everything. in my area, i'm safe. we got enough guns in our area, we're safe. it's a rural area. but i fear going into harleston. host: are you taking your own safety into your own hands, but when you say guns, is there enough of a police presence? caller: there is no police in our area. police is 30 miles away. but i don't know a person that don't have, you know, something to defend themselves with. but if i go into charleston, the city, or huntington, i fear, because anything can happen. i look for anything to happen at any time in those areas. because any time we're at home, and we are at war, and they're going to come in here any way
they can, and attack us any way possible. like i said, i think our borders should be closed, and our drugs, there's so many drugs coming in across the border. just our area, yes, there's a lot of drugs in our area. other people have died, of overdose. i mean, we got to protect the united states first. host: gotcha. let's go to charlotte, north carolina, a democrat. albert, good morning. caller: hi, good morning. host: how do you feel about the safety of and you your family in charlotte, north carolina? caller: well, originally i'm from charlotte, north carolina, but however, right now i'm in washington. i can't remember how the airport felt yesterday. the security checks and the terror people, i mean, you can just feel the tension with your
own hands. the things that i most remember was i got hungry, saw subway, and i was approaching it. as soon as it was completely empty, the people were not talking to each other, no one was making conversation. and -- host: albert, you're going in and out. we'll try to fix that line. timothy is in wilson, north carolina, an independent. timothy, good morning. caller: yes, good morning, thank you for taking my call. you know this war on terrorism is really pitiful. and i look at our government, and it just saddens me. every time there's an attack, the g.o.p., they attack obama. it weakens obama every time. we're at war. we're supposed to be pulling together. that's number one, we're never going to get a handle on this thing unless we come together.
bombing isis over there and defeating them over in syria is going to do nothing about what's happening over here. you can kill every one of those guys over there. host: how do we come together? we're not going to defeat this until we come together. what's the first step? caller: well, we have to come together and be behind the president. you cannot attack the president every time isis attack us. when they attack us and they're really winning by us attacking ourselves. so every time they can pull off something over here with some person over here that they have influenced, you know, do a bombing or whatever, and they jump all over the president, saying he's not tough enough on them, which they know is a lot, because we we do over in syria is not affecting people over here. these people are being rid calized through the internet and everything. now what's happened is that a can of worms and the whole problem with this isis thing
was caused by the g.o.p. they all stood behind george bush when he went over there, went into iraq, went into all these countries and destabilized them, put nobody in there. now, when he did that, it left nobody in charge of the government. so it created a vacuum, and that's how isis and all these other people got in and started taking over and started doing stuff. now, just a minute, let me finish. host: go ahead, timothy. caller: ok, thank you. then it was predicted that this would happen. he predicted that we would go over there and he wanted a jihad. now, what we did was played right into his hands by going over there, destabilizing everything. now, i noticed that they investigate hillary or her emails, nothing was investigated but all these lies to get us into this thing. they had american people fooled. everybody's gotten away with
it. and it's ridiculous when they can go and eviscerate hillary day after day over some little emails, when this right here has just about broken our economy. host: can i recommend you go back and view a recent interview we did with congressman walter jones of north carolina. he speaks directly to some of these issues you were talking about and the united states reasons for going to war in the first place. we did an interview with him last week about a display he has outside of his office to sort of remind himself about his decision to authorize the war in iraq. so recommend you take a look at that. timothy, you mentioned president obama. here's the president's secretary of homeland security, jae johnson, his statement yesterday in the wake of the violence and the attacks over the weekend, he said the department of homeland security is actively monitoring and participating in the investigations in new york and
new jersey. he talked about the upcoming united nations general assembly taking place in new york this week. he noted that back in june, this was designated as a national special security event. that means that thousands of d.h.s. personnel, led by the secret service, are deployed to new york for the security of that event. he said any area in new york city associated with that event will therefore be subjected to an extraordinarily high level of surveillance and security this week. as we said, we're looking for updates, and we'll bring that to you as it happens. but we don't want to get ahead of the investigation. one note, something happening this morning, the a.t.f. and the f.b.i. are raiding a business in elizabeth, new jersey. few details are known, but video shows several agents and law enforcement officers on the scene of that raid. it's unclear if it's connected to the suspicious device that exploded near a train station in elizabeth very early on monday morning, while a bomb squad row bolt was trying to
disarm it. a few tweaks this morning as we're having this conversation. jan writes in, i don't think anyone should speak about it until the investigation is over. they have no idea of who and why. edwin christian says people remember it was the republicans who have eroded our right to the patriot act and even more with the freedom act. and one tweet says i empathize with the caller from texas. they have been overrun for years. they said nothing about what was happening there, and this is the consequence. to want hear your thoughts this morning, as we ask this question, are you feeling safe in your community today as you begin your workweek after the weekend's violence. john is in texas. john, good morning. caller: good morning. how y'all doing? i feel perfectly safe. i live in spring -- actually the woodlands, which is part of spring. i mean, i feel fine.
i don't have any problems, and i'm pretty sure people catch on pretty quick. i mean, there are cameras everywhere in new york, and you say there's a raid going on in new jersey right now. they're going to catch these people, and i don't go to the mall that much, but there's a woodlands mall, about 10 miles from my home, and i feel perfectly safe. i have a dog. i mean, i have neighbors that are from mexico. there's a doctor and a family with three kids. and they're perfectly fine. they keep the yard in great shape. they have a pool. they're swimming all the time. i don't have any fear at all. i'm not worried about it at all. host: when you see reports like this of a stabbing at a mall in minnesota, a bomb going off in chelsea and injuring people, do you take it in stride now?
is this something like a new normal in the united states today? it seems like it's not something you're overly concerned about, i guess is what i'm saying. caller: well, it's a difficult question. i mean, i don't think it's the new normal. i think it's maybe going on another four, five years, i don't know. i can't predict something like that. but it's unfortunate that these people are being radicalized. these people are probably from the united states. i would bet that they were born re, and they list -- host: we'll wait for nor investigation before we start speculating. caller: that's true. i'm not too worried about it. i have neighbors from all over the world. i don't go up there and ask them where they're from. a gentleman on the other side of me has a big beard. he's a white guy. i don't know if he's a muslim or not, but he has a huge beard. i don't go around and worry.
i walk my dog every night, she's about 18 months old, and she barks the minute anybody comes along, within 1,000 yards of my house. host: do you think it's time people got to know their neighbors more? caller: absolutely. i know most of my neighbors, well actually, i don't know my guy next door, other than he has a daughter, and i know they have a dog, and he has a beard and keeps the yard nice. there's really no mean for me to know them. but you're right, people should get to know their neighborhoods, absolutely. host: john in texas. michael, delaware, line for democrats. you're up next. go ahead. caller: how's it going? thanks for taking my call. yes, i'm actually originally from new jersey. i visit new york regularly. i'm down doing work in d.c. right now. feel absolutely safe. i appreciate you reiterating that we don't know what's happened yet, and yet people
still immediately jump to terrorism. we don't know if this is anything about people being radicalized or if it is just a mental health issue. if that's what people like, it's fear and people with mental health issues might be drawn to that. but we have no idea. host: that topic, this from "usa today", discussing that word and had we use that word terrorism. the story by thomas frank in "usa today," several experts, including a former new york city police commissioner, said yesterday that the explosion that injured 29 people on a manhattan street was clearly an act of terrorism, and they were perplexed that mayor bill de blasio called it only an sbenl act --
host: that's the story in "usa today," if you want to read more. we can talk about that debate, but as we said, we'll try not to get ahead of the investigation. let's go to maryland, independent. adam, good morning. caller: hello. good morning, c-span. i want to say a couple of things real quick. first of all, we cannot play into these. they obviously want us to -- we cannot do that. because the moment we do that -- host: adam, you went out for a moment. we can't do what? caller: sorry am we cannot play into these people's hands.
we cannot play into fear. this is exactly what they want. the numbers in terms of killings, they want fear. they want us to react and do something irrational or maybe put our boys at their doorstep so they can take their shot. that's really their motive. secondly, i want to comment on peter king's comment real quick. for him to say that we have to give up our civil liberties for safety, that is the main issue am we cannot give up our civil liberties. that's what makes us us. the united states is nothing without civil liberties. we'll turn into another russia. host: what do people on the other side say to that comment? do we then have to live with explosions? do we have to accept that that's going to happen in the future or stabbings in malls? what would you say to somebody who says that to you? caller: i think, of course, you know, we shouldn't allow these kinds of events to happen,
definitely, there's no combe that. however, we cannot -- two or three -- this is exactly what they want. we cannot play into this. of course, this shouldn't be the norm, but we have to look at our foreign policy and see how that affects the whole grand scheme f. our foreign policy is to be overseas and fight in two wars for 15 some odd years and spend trillions of dollars when our nation itself is in trillions of dollars of debt, you know, there has to be a cause and effect. if we're there, something's going to happen here. what we need to do is change our foreign policy, elect the right people who are willing to extend hands of friendship rather than bombs in the middle east. what need does saudi arabia have of billions of dollars in weapons? it's time we bring ourselves in, and consolidate. there's no reason for us to be involved in the middle east like that. also, thirdly, this is the final point i want to real real quickly. i am a member of the muslim
faith. i practice that practice. i practiced it since the day i was born. i want to tell everyone here that there's absolutely nothing islamic about the is lake i am state. i want them to be called a butcher state or something else, something even horrific, there's absolutely nothing islamic about that state or whatever the hell that is, to be honest, i'm so furious about this whole situation. i'm afraid not of my safety in general, from these terrorist attacks. i'm more afraid of myself, of the backlash that i would experience. you know, i work for a federal agency. we do some very important work. i've been with them for years. we are muslim people, your doctors, we're engineers, we're scientists, we're nuclear scientists. we are involved in something, some very high level, you know, expertise in this country, and it's really disheartening for
me to experience these kinds of -- not that i have any experience, but it's disheartening for me to see these things on tv and people say, these people, these people are different, people are mixed, i'm afraid they don't treat me right. there was a caller from kentucky mentioning something like that. what do i do? i was born and raised here. where do by? do i go back to some country that i don't belong to, i don't have any -- i don't have any connection to their culture? what do die? religion and culture are two different things. it's proven from the documents that our boys found in iraq that the so-called islamic state is using their religion purely to convince people to join them. that's all there is to it. there's nothing else islamic about them. hey use verses out of context. they apply those and use them, to people whose minds are broken because they don't see any future, they'll apply those
verses on them and say, hey, look, if you do this, gull to heaven. it's easy for someone to die and go to heaven, because you don't have to live, you don't have to pay bills or raise a family. host: all right. that's adam in laurel, maryland. want to get to as many calls as we can. dane is in lansing north carolina, democrat. good morning. caller: yes. i feel safe here at my home, because i'm in a rural area. but what's wrong with our ountry today, they need to force the law, the judges do on this, automatically that they have something obama happens in these places without a second trial or anything. and at the top of one of our law enforcement officers shoots one of them and kills them, give him a bonus. and that way we can be took
care of. we won't have that trash in this country. and taking care of it. the 9/11 deal, that's what all this is about, when bush tarted it. host: now to north carolina, a republican. good morning. caller: good morning. how are you this morning? i just want to make a comment. what we need to do right now, shut down the borders completely. and if this was a terrorist attack because nobody really liked this, obama don't want to admit to it, but if it was, then we need to declare war on him, because as long as are allowed to keep attacking this country, you're going to keep letting more and more refugees in, this country is going to end up like the middle east. there's going to be bombings. there's going to be killings every day. as for myself, i don't care what laws they pass, i'm buying a gun. i feel safe where i am right now. i have family that lives in new york. i have a son that works on the
buildings, work in the elevator. now i have to worry about every day whether they're going blow these buildings up. everybody needs to call the congressman and white house and tell them to close down the boreders and secure our country. this cannot keep going on like this every day. host: i want to ask you about the editorial board's opinion in the "new york times" today, as we show some of the video that's been out there from the moment after the explosion in new york city. they said the editorial board said that on sunday morning, governor andrew cuomo said, as mr. de blasio said the morning before, there's no indication linking this to international terrorism, though whoever did it wanted to spread terror. the editor boorl said the right response is to stay vigilant and reasonable, to clean up the damage, care for the injured, look out for one another, and to elect leaders who will address the challenge with sanity and good judgment and
avoid the wrong responses, which they say is a police state, an overreaction that would be equally damaging in its own way by adding to the intolerance and suspicion that can foster radicalization and hatred. what do you think about that? caller: well, you know, it's like, i don't believe that -- like the man said before, we have a lot of doctors, and they're very good doctors, so i'm not condemning any type of race or anything like that. as far as, i mean, we need to draw together as a community and watch what's going on. if you see something suspicious, turn these people in. if you see something walking around, eyeing a building and it doesn't look right, then call the police. but all i'm saying is, until this thing is resolved, they got to close down the borders. if you don't know who's coming in and you're not 100% sure, and isis even said a couple of members ago, they said they're going to infiltrate with the refugees and sneak in with them. i don't have all the answers, but i know, right now, the only
way to keep us safe is to shut down the borders, and i know if hillary clinton gets in, it's going to get worse. host: one other editorial, this from the "wall street journal," they end their editorial, which is titled another terror weekend, by saying no matter the motivations for these attacks, they show how the daily lives of americans have been altered by the reality of modern terrorism. americans know that anyone at any time, anywhere can become a target, and that is why they expect their political leaders to focus on preventing attacks, not merely deploying them after the fact. alexandria, virginia, independent. go ahead, ken. caller: good morning. thanks for taking me call. a lot of people are calling in with the fear of terrorism, but i think they use it as an american issue. i've been in federal law forcement for years, and there have been over 500 people of color that have been killed in chicago this year alone, regardless by whom, they are americans. if you look at the amount of resources utilized just to
investigate the preliminary investigation of this act, where no one was killed, no one was murdered, kind of makes you wonder why don't they deploy the national guard or the f.b.i. or more resources trying to protect americans, not just concern with the ideology of terrorism, because isi si, those groups, none of them have an air force, a marines, an army. ey have no real access to us as far as their weapons and concerns. i'm very curious as to why people don't apply the same reasoning and rationale to saving americans, regardless of where they live or what color they are. thank you. host: our last caller in this segment of the "washington journal," we'll try to keep you updated if there's other breaking news on this, but we're going to move on to other topics this morning, as the investigations continue. i'm sure we'll talk more about this later this week. up next, a monday morning
roundtable. we'll discuss the census bureau's recent report on poverty in the united states and discuss why the poverty rate saw its sharpest decline in nearly 50 years. later, dave levinthal will join us to discuss presidential fundraising and spending during campaign 2016. that's all coming up this morning on the "washington journal."
>> tonight on "the communicators," the deputy director at george washington university's center for cyber and homeland security, and the vice president of the middle east research institute discuss how isis and other extremist groups use social media to radicalize and recruit followers and how the u.s. and other nations are trying to reduce that trend. aum i think we're seeing an explosion of the use of social media to recruit, particular until america, individuals to isis. so they're used on social media, like twitter, which was a platform of choice for a number of years, now telegram, where they're largely concentrated. you see these individuals in the u.s. who aren't finding like-minded people at the mosque community centers and are reaching online to find those radicalizers. >> you want depth. you can religiousity. you can have that. you want bloodlists, you want revenge, you want whacko kind of ways of killing, you have that as well.
it allows them to bypass television, bypasses the regular media. >> watch "the communicators" tonight at 8:00 eastern on c-span2. >> for campaign 2016, c-span continues on the road to the white house. >> we all want to get back to making america strong and great again. >> i am running for everyone working hard to support their families. everyone who's been knocked down, but gets back up. >> ahead, live coverage of the presidential and vice-presidential debates on c-span. the c-span radio app, and.org.org. monday, september 26, is the first presidential debate, live from hofstra university in new york. then on tuesday, october 4, vice-presidential candidates, governor mike pence and nor tim
kaine, debate at longwood university in farmville, virginia. and on sunday, october , washington st. louis in st. louis hosts the second presidential debate. leading up to the third and final debate between hillary clinton and donald trump, taking place at the university of nevada-las vegas on october 19. live coverage of the presidential and vice-presidential debate on c-span. listen live on the free c-span radio app. o watch live or any time on emand at c-span.org. >> "washington journal" continues. host: at our desk this morning, we're joined by robert rector of the heritage foundation, and olivia golden of the center for law and social policy. we're having a discussion on the new report on poverty in 2015. olivia, we'll start with you. that report showed the largest single year decline in the poverty rate since 1968. total poverty number of people in the united states in poverty
now at 1999 levels. we'll go into the details of that report. but what do you think are the biggest reasons for that drop? guest: the big headlines, as you say, is improvement as a result of the economy reaching across a large swath of americans, the economic recovery. in addition to overall poverty dropping, child poverty dropped, which is something we follow in particular from about 21% to just under 20%, so still one in five kids. so a big reason the economy, the economic recovery is reaching a much larger share of americans. there's also a lot of good yuse in that report about public programs, the accompanying report on health insurance shows big improvements in the share of americans who have health insurance, the number without is down by four million from last year, so that's a big positive, the contributions of public programs like snap, food assistance, and the earned income tax credit keep people out of poverty.
i think the one other topic, which i'm sure we'll get back to, is that while there's been a very important positive impact, there are still big disparities in poverty. so child poverty remains at unacceptablely high levels, young adults, kind of america's next generation, so getting the economic benefits fully to parents and to young children i think is an agenda for maintaining the momentum. it's very good news, though. host: certainly issues we'll discuss during this hour roundtable this morning. but robert rector, you played a key role in crafting the 199 federal welfare reform bill. what do you see as the big drivers of that poverty rate coming down now to 13.5%? guest: well, it's clearly the economy, there's not much change in policy here. but i think we need to put these numbers in context, and they are very good. i mean, very sharp, one-year drop. but it's a one-year drop
following seven years of extremely bad news. and so, overall, for the last eight years, the numbers here have been very bad. and we have -- we actually have a higher poverty rate now than we did before the beginning of the great recession in 2007. that's rather remarkable. to t's a one-year drop, but have a significant change, you have to have drops that occur year after year after year. that rarely has occurred in our system. it only occurred in the 1950's and 1960's, and then it occurred during the period of welfare reform in the boom economy in the 1990's, where, for example, in that period, poverty among single mothers with children dropped eight percentage points over four, five, six years and went down substantially on a structural basis. here we have a one-year drop, but we're actually worse off than we were when barack obama came into office. host: can you talk about that one-year drop and whether some
groups did better than others, urban versus rural or along racial lines? guest: i think it was all really good news, all across the board. i mean, it was great. i'm very happy with that report. but again, one year doesn't make much difference if it's been going up, and actually poverty was rising during much of the obama administration, again, g a lot, but we're worse off now than in 2007 when bush was in office, and that is really due to a very, very mediocre economic performance over the long term. maybe we have a change here, but one year does not a party make. host: well, i want to discuss how we keep this from becoming a one-year blip, but also want to invite our viewers to call in. different phones line,, if you make under $25,000 a year, phone number is 202-748-8000. if you make $25,000 to $50,000 a year, it's 202-748-8001.
$51,000 to $100,000 a year, 202-748-8002. if you make over $100,000 a year, 202-847-8003. if you didn't catch those, we'll keep the numbers up on the screen so you can start calling in. olivia, how do we keep this from becoming a one-year blip? guest: that's a freight question, and i would highlight that it is very -- it's very important that the president broad his policies, but also the broad economy have brought us back from the great depression. i totally agree with robert that going further is now crucial. to keep the momentum going, i would say there are several things we need to do. they're both building on success and going in some additional directions. first, what we've seen over these last years is that a big public program, like food assistance, like the earned income tax credit, have really done their job, but the private economy has taken a long time
to improve the circumstances of low wage workers. and when you look at what's going on for children and their parents right now, it's still about low wage work, both low wages, but also two few hours. you see a lot of people still working part-time who want to be working full-time. o we need both policies that affect things like their scheduling and minimum wage, as is happening in a lot of states and localities. we also need strong investment and good jobs. you'll hear a lot of conversation about infrastructure, for example, which is about that. we need a big investment in child care. that's a big issue right now that affects parents' ability to work and children's ability to succeed. and then we need to focus on some other things, filling in some gaps in the safety net, the earned income tax credit, helps low-income mothers and parents a lot t. doesn't help adults without kids as much. that's an example. we also focus a lot on affordability of higher education, because right now to
get a good job, you need at least some kind of post-secondary credentials. so that's the kind of things we need to do to build on success and keep it going. host: robert rector, agree? guest: not exactly. i think it's important to, fist of all, understand what these numbers say and what they don't say. they're very misleading. these are pre-welfare numbers. the welfare state is not counted here so. if a family receives $12,000 or $14,000 a year in the earned income tax credit, food stamps and so forth, that's not counted as income. last year for families with children, we spent $221 billion on cash, food, and housing for those families. that's twice what is needed to eliminate all poverty in the united states. the census bureau counted only 1/10 of that as income for purposes of poverty. if you accurately count all the benefits that they're getting, then the poverty rate is cut really by by 2/3. but you rarely ever see those numbers, and we get these
confusing pitches like look at how much poverty we've got. we need to spend more on welfare, but then it's not counted, so it can't possibly have any effect. host: i'll give our viewers the numbers. the poverty threshold from the census bureau in 2015, it's $12,000 a year. for two people, $15,000. three people, $19,000 a year. for a family of four, $24,000 a year. and for a family of five, $29,000 a year is the official poverty threshold from the 2015 report. you say those numbers not including a whole lot of things that these individuals are getting. guest: patriot much the whole welfare state is cut out of these numbers. when you add the welfare state in, what we need to do is basically have a system that combines the individuals' efforts to support themselves with a welfare state that complements and reinforces that. it's the welfare state doesn't do.
but if, for example, you take a single mother with two kids who's earning the federal minimum wage, and most mothers earn more than that, but she only gets doesn't do. but if, then from her earnings around $14,000 a year. she's way below the poverlt level, but she also is going to get $7,500 in cash from the tax credit system. she's going to get food stamps. she's going to get medicaid. and when you add all those things together, her income is actually well up over $30,000 a year, even putting the medical assistance aside. she's more than 25% above the poverty level. but that's not reflected in these numbers. host: the argument that poverty is overstated in the united states? guest: this is a very accurate measure, or patriot accurate measure for measuring poverty without welfare, ok? when you count welfare, the actual poverty rate is cut by about 2/3. and the question really for policy is how do we put together a welfare system that doesn't displace people's efforts to support themselves, but complements those and
brings those efforts together with a welfare state to make people better off. host: olivia, and then we'll get to calls. guest: the the census bureau dos calculate with and without, i called the supplemental poverty measure. that shows the same pattern this goes the rate for children from over 19% to about 16% when you count those programs. from one in five to one and six great the children are still the poorest. the overall rate goes up a little bit when you count those programs. if you are going to count benefits people get through the tax system, you also have to count what they pay. even low income workers pay payroll taxes and other things the senses has to do to make it accurate. it isn't true that they hide the information. it is out there. two things i would headline, the first is that i totally agree with what robert is saying, which is it is a huge success of public policy of the earned income tax credit and nutrition
assistance enable a low income mother to both have an incentive to work and to stabilize her family better than she would alone. when i think is not in his example of a mother with a couple of kids working full time is that it is a dream for most single moms to be able to work full-time. be able to pay for childcare care to do that, which is an enormous expense. typically about the same as housing. public programs to support childcare, but they only get to about one in six eligible kids. increasingly low-wage work has problems with being able to work full-time. people get far too few hours. the system helps a lot, but there remain gaps to fix it entirely. host: poverty in the united states is our discussion. olivia golden is with the sector for law and poverty. robert rector. jesse is in muskegon michigan
for those to make under $25,000 a year. thing about poverty has gone down, i don't believe it. just because they have this campaign going on now, i retired in 1979. an hour.ing $9.99 -- nine dollars any five cents an hour. back in 1979. -- $9.95 an hour. back in 1979. this thing about poverty is going down is not true at all. you ask the senior citizens out $600 or $700o live a month. you asked them if poverty has gone down. we had these same comments last week when these numbers came out. robert rector, this concern that
people don't believe the numbers. they are not seeing poverty going down. guest: there clearly are people that are still in hardship. i also would sympathize with what he said among lower skilled workers, wages have really been flat for about four years. that's a real problem. the reality is, when you look at this broad population, where we're seeing around 40 million people are poor, we also have data on what those people alike. the typical household among the senses is identifying is poor as cable tv, has air-conditioning, has a computer, has internet, has an automobile, has a cell phone. if you ask them, were you hungry at any point during the year, 96% of these poor parents will say our children were not hungry during the year. that's all government data. it doesn't mean that these
families are walking on easy street, they are struggling. but they are struggling to pay the cable tv bill and the air-conditioning in the computer bill and the internet bill. and keep their car running and things. it's very different than the normal image we project about poverty. that's very important. if we were to back up to the larger issue, we really have singing since the beginning of the war on poverty is a decline in the americans ability of low-income americans to support themselves above the poverty pressure threshold without reliance on welfare. that's particularly true for families with children. that was lyndon johnson's original goal of the war on poverty was to make families self-sufficient, so they didn't need welfare. we had a complete disaster for 50 years in that regard. host: i will let you respond. income in the united states also part of this report that was released last week. they put the numbers out there. median household income in 2015
was $56,516 in the year, an increase of 5.2% from the 2014 income. it's the first increase since 2007. maryland's and the district of columbia, have the highest median household incomes. the city with a median household income of about $40,593 a year. guest: i just want to say to jesse that i think two things are true wants. one is that someone more people have been reached by the economy than last year. that's the good news. the second thing, which you are highlighting and is absolutely true is that there's a long way to go. i think your point about wages staying low is particularly important. some local communities and states have been passing a moment wage increases. that needs to happen at the federal level. in addition to wages, as i mentioned earlier, a big problem for struggling families and individuals is scheduling. example, people getting
eight hours this week, 15 hours next week, wanting to work full-time and wanted to put together low-wage jobs, but not getting enough security about their hours to do it. those are big issues we have to address. i think there's lots more to say about the kinds of damage that poverty and low income do. i expect to see that in your daily life. we know a lot from the research now about the consequences, particularly for children, of growing up in families where food is constantly scarce, and people are stressed out about it all the time. warehousing is just overwhelmingly expensive and low income people are moving, they are doubled up, they are evicted, they are sometimes homeless. and where the adults in the family are constantly under stress, try to juggle work and parent their kids. both things are true. there has been improvement, there's a lot further to go. host: let's go to the line for those making over $100,000 a year. minor in salt lake city, utah. caller: it's only taken me 20
years to speak on c-span. host: thanks for calling. go ahead. you have your time now. caller: it's truly amazing. perhaps to comment that the reason that the poverty -- i has dropped below can't remember what the amount was. because it could have taken eight years of the obama administration to accomplish it. i think i would basically agree with that, that we've had eight years of extremely lackluster performance, and poverty was going up during much of that time. when we were supposed to be in an economic recovery. if you look over that eight year , it's a very dismal perio
d. we had higher poverty today than we did when george bush was president. not much of a recovery when you have that. his is one year of good news. it's counteracted by seven years of particularly bad news. guest: i think i would say the president came into office with the deepest recession since the --at depression, branded it prevented it from turning into a great depression and then worked with and often hostile congress, not only to easily affect of that immediate recession, but also, to accomplish some other things. with the report shows is not only the success in terms of poverty, and other improvements that you can very directly linked to public policy. highlight health insurance. the affordable care act and the fact that only 9% of americans are now without health insurance. that's the lowest uninsured share ever.
intriguingly, the report also looks at how that relates to policy by looking at states that have taken advantage of the full array of opportunities in the aca, the medicaid expansion. advantage have taken of the policy have done better for their citizens in terms of health insurance. you can really see the policy affect in this report. host: it might be a good time to when viewers, what is the center for law and social policy? guest: a nonpartisan anti-policy -- anti-poverty organization. we work at the federal and state level to improve the lives of low-income people. i spent much of my career both leading public programs and working in research on those issues. host: and robert rector at heritage? guest: heritage foundation is a think tank that promotesguest: free markets and strong values in society. i try and promote a welfare state that promotes work and
marriage as the keys to self-sufficiency and well-being. while supporting those things for those that need it. we don't believe in simply endlessly handing out more and we don't think the conventional welfare system is actually helping anyone. those thehe line for make under $25,000 a year, mark is waiting in california. caller: good morning. my hope you bear with me. there isn't one of these problems you are talking about that doesn't exist and couldn't be done without if we just have people in charge are supposedly the ship who showed a national sense of integrity. i've lived under that line you're talking about for most of my life. i'm a veteran that's been betrayed. i've been betrayed by my nation, whether or not the rest of you want to recognize it very you are being betrayed by the two parties and it doesn't matter how good the person in charge or involved is.
as long as they belong to either one of these two parties, they sold us out. and let me say this. for all of you smart intellectual college degree individuals out there. why can you see what i see -- why can't you see what i see? there isn't one of our problems that can be made better by just voting a third party individual and office. because the other two parties sold us out. please, take this message to heart. 40% of your home was out there are veterans. 25 years ago, it was 30%. these two parties couldn't rectify, the people we claim to honor all the time. some of us can't even get paid for our time in service, yet alone -- let alone what happened to us. host: robert, do you want to talk about the policy proposals of the various presidential candidates and what might be most effective here? guest: i do think one area
that's very important, we talked about stagnant wages for those workers. one of the major reasons that we've had stagnant wages for low skilled workers now for decades is the massive influx of low skilled immigrant labor this driven those wages down. in many cases, is driven people out of the labor market altogether. that's a very important issue. if you bring more and more people in who, for example, are immigrants without a high school degree, they compete with the least advantaged, least skilled american workers. wages go down substantially for that group. some of them just leave the labor force entirely. that's a disaster. from's really no gain this. we shouldn't be using the immigration system to push the wages of our least advantaged american workers down. many to turn that around. a policy thatt: may be the most effective? guest: we are nonpartisan, but i will identify policies from
president obama and the state. i would highlight that president obama made a very strong proposal on childcare in 2017 budget, which the congress did not take up, which would've made sure that low income parents could get help paying for child care, which interviewed spoke to children doing better and to parents economic stability. guest: if i could back this up, if you look at child poverty all the way back to 1950, all the way back to the korean war, to the present time, child poverty dropped only during the 1950's and 1960's, they remained constant. it dropped in the 1990's due to a strong economy and welfare reform. for example, the poverty rate among civil parents at that time dropped from around 40% down to 30%. a very dramatic drop. i believe largely because of that welfare reform. otherwise, all we do is to spend money and basically have welfare
replace wages to a considerable degree. what we need to do is -- i think it's a problem that both parties have unlearned the lessons of welfare reform under the clinton presidency. but we had there was a requirement that at least apportion of the single mothers should work in exchange for benefits they got. we had dramatic long-term drops in top -- and poverty. much larger than what we're talking about today. ,hat went on year after year surges in employment. not because we were taking welfare away, but what we were saying in order to get welfare, you have to also take steps to help yourself. well for theally beneficiaries, it works well for the taxpayer, and society in general. both parties have walked away from them. tereus,t's bring in who's been waiting in fayetteville, new york on that line for those whom it between
$51,000 and $100,000 a year. go ahead with your comment. you have to stick by your phone. go to connecticut for the line making under $25,000 a year. good morning. caller: thank you. i make way under $25,000 because i had to go out on social security -- on disability, rather, it is of a back problem that was not diagnosed. struggle, honestly, but in doing better because they know what's wrong with me and i'm getting some therapy for it. but i agree that we need to continue on this progress. stamp, get a single food and what has helped me is, they program -- qmb
program, quality medicare beneficiary program. it doesn't have anything to do with president obama. it was started around the time us, they offered it to since he's been in office. but the medicare program. and very quickly, i don't have to pay my premium every month. and now, they've come out, the state of connecticut has come out with a dental program, it's the first offered under medicare , in fact, dental is very important to me because i need a lot of dental work. like 61 credits towards a
bachelor's degree now that i'm getting help for my back. i will be able to have the care. chair -- dental i can do something to supplement my income and finish my degree. honestly, you need to do something in this country. i follow politics every day, and then i agree with the lady that -- she says she's nonpartisan. something --o these other republicans, they keep using redistribution of wealth, and they are not for any programs that will help people. host: i wanted olivia golden, you're shaking your head during the qnb program. -- qmb. guest: thank you for your
comment and your commitment to going back to school and returning to work. i wanted to comment that the importance of health care and access to health care in order to be able to work is a really central lesson from the research. of the reasonse that the affordable care act and the medicaid program matters so much. i want to underline that. i wanted to take a moment to link them back to the point that the conversation of moment ago about one specific welfare program, called tanis, temporary assistance for needy families. when people talk about welfare reform, that's what they mean. i implement to that program in the clinton administration and then studied it. i would say is that unfortunately, when you look today, it is barely exists. it has not been successful in the way to the supplemental nutrition assistance program, medicaid, and the earned income tax credit have been. and that's for a bunch of reasons. one big one is that it was a cap dollar amount at the beginning. i the beginning, it did what
was saying, it provided more money for child care assistance, spendoney for states to on work support. now, states aren't spending it on any of those things, they're balancing other parts of their budget to a large degree. it has other challenges in it too. theuld just highlight that evidence we have from researchers fits very much what you just said, that for families to succeed, they need health, nutrition support, they need to stabilize their lives. and then he jobs that offer them decent wages and hours. olivia golden was the assistant secretary for children and families of the u.s. department of health and human services from 1993 to 2001. guest: two different roles during that time. guest: if i can of his eyes at heritage foundation is also a nonpartisan organization, but it very interesting. if you go back all the way to 1970, the only time in which child poverty actually fell in a substantial way, particularly poverty for parents with during
welfare reform. but that's rated a failure. that's a failure. it's the only time when poverty substantially goes down in a drops from around 40% for single moms down to 30%. and that's because the welfare recipients were required to work in exchange for the benefits, work increased, and poverty went down as a result of that. 90% of the american public believes that able-bodied , food,uals who get cash housing from the government ought to be required to work with prepare for work as a condition for getting that aid. int of the welfare state which we spend $1 trillion in year does not have that type of work requirements. in fact, it discourages work. and that's what we can spend and spend and spend on these systems and things don't get better. host: 25 minutes left, a lot of folks going to chat. olivia golden, i will give you john in greenbelt, maryland on
the line for those who make over $100,000 a year. i'm calling in response to the veteran living in poverty. i like to thank him for his service. from the opposite end, and highly educated with a phd in physics, and i just over $100,000 a year. i completely agree that both parties can't solve the problems or choose not to. and a sold out the working class, which is why you have obama and ryan in the establishment vote that's trying to push the transpacific partnership. and all these things that are going to help the working class. third-party is the way to go. guest: thank you, john. i'm not credit, and, we are a nonpartisan organization. but i just want to pull out one other comment, one element of your comment which was your phd in the higher education that you said is contributing to security. one of the interesting things there is ak at is very broad research agreement at a bipartisan agreement that to
get a good job today, you need at least a credential beyond high school. you need at least a community college credential recognized by employers. but there are enormous -- another way that poverty holds people back is that low income young people and adults going back to school face enormous barriers and being able to afford school. not just tuition, but also more than half of people in school, in secondary education today our independence, trying to pay for themselves, often raise kids. we think that part of the solution is also making it more affordable for people to get that education and improve their own circumstances. host: the caller brings up paul onn, programming note c-span, speaker paul ryan will be at the economic club of new york speaking today at 12:30, talking about how to create opportunities for the next generation in that speech. will be carrying that live
here on c-span if you want to watch. robert rector, i give you michael in maryland for the line that makes between $25,000 to $50,000 a year. caller: thank you for c-span. i agree with the and lady. the thing about it is elections have consequences. when obama took over, he's been he triedn everything to do to make this better. republicans denied and every thing they did, they attached crazy stuff to it, it's been one big waste of time. but then to turn around and talk about how bad things are, they did nothing. absolutely nothing to further the cause. ,his man was the winner, he won and i understand how politics go. theirs, but when you see a party that's done nothing, absolutely nothing to help the conditions, and then have the nerve to turn around and talk about how things are?
we were losing hundreds of thousands of jobs a month. host: we got your point. robert rector, which was great? -- would you agree? guest: i don't want to be for the republican party, which is done badly by abandoning the principles of reform it, but if you go back to 1970 when richard nixon was president, the only time when poverty actually dropped was right after the welfare reform passed by a republican congress and signed by bill clinton, and now as a bad by ms. golden policy. all these other policies simply spent more money and created more dependence by essentially displacing work and marriage and replacing it with welfare. and that's why poverty didn't go down, it's weisel's efficiency and the ability of families to support themselves without reliance on welfare has asked a
gotten a lot worse since we started the war on poverty. a generoushave system. and let me emphasize if someone is making even the minimum wage in the united states, we come in to a parent like that and offer at least $10,000 in additional benefits through the earned income tax credit, through food stamps, to supplement their wages, so they will not be in hardship. i'm willing to say that's a good choice. but we shouldn't beginning people simply handouts without requiring if it's an able-bodied recipient, without requiring them to engage in constructive behavior to make themselves more self-sufficient. when we do that, when we require work or preparation for work, in fact, poverty goes down and the well-being of the families and children go up three unfortunately, the left in the united states oppose welfare reform under bill clinton, and they continue to wish to essentially run a work free welfare system that simply costs
more and more money without actually benefiting the poor. because a family sitting alone, living on welfare check is going to be poor, and has multiple factors that push it towards the social margins. not a good policy. something that i think is not accurate, what robert said, back to the caller. low income families today are working at very high levels. about 70% of children in ---income families live with 70% of children in for families -- in poor families, live with someone who is working. extraordinary levels of work for mothers and their children in early years of life. wages areely, because too low and because of the insecurity of hours, many of those parents can't make ends meet. programs likelic
snap and food assistance and medicaid in health insurance, you heard how important health was, like the earned income tax credit support work. all of the research suggests that what they do is help people stabilize their lives, so that they are able to work and to move up. unfortunately, there are some exceptions to that. in the program the roberts talking about has unfortunately shrunk so much in its value that it isn't really helping people in the same way it needs to. overall, the issue isn't that people aren't working. they are working. isn't that they don't want to work. it's that full-time work at decent wages that can support a family is hard to come by. guest: we have a paradox. if all of these families are working, then they have enough from work and welfare to be above the poverty line. and even if you are making just the minimum wage. there's a contradiction there. guest: typically, it is hours of work. host: we can go back and forth,
but a few tweets on highlight. viewers are having this conversation on twitter, @cspanwj. marie says every taxpayer is overburdened with having to support the increased number of non-workers, and they said i thought welfare was supposed to be for a set amount of time, now generational. if you want to join the conversation, it happens every day, @cspanwj. cat is waiting to join the conversation on our program. in los angeles, california for those you make between $51,000 and $100,000 a year. go ahead. caller: this is an interesting conversation. homelessness was 9300 and los angeles, in 2013. now in 2016, it's over 14,000 homelessness. in los angeles, the area where i
live, you see increased homelessness and the houses go just a few blocks away, for $800,000. can you imagine having homelessness in an area where the houses go for over $800,000? you see women, black women, panhandling out. this was never before seen. citys angeles, it's one that's the mac up for illegal immigration. and we never discuss the interrelatedness, the interconnectedness between illegal immigration and its impact on the economics and the labor force. particularly black america. these policies coming out of d.c. for the last 30, 40, 50 years are not working. because our citizens should not be homeless. i sort of want to piggyback on what the veteran said. i don't agree with the two
callers that said obama is doing a good thing and the policies should be better -- no. the system is not working. for american citizens. host: you are not in your head for part of that. -- nodding your head for part of that. guest: one out of 10 of these children are the child's -- children of illegal immigrants. they all get welfare benefits. and importantly, the surge of a limo -- illegal immigrants. we have 7 million illegal immigrants employed in this country. roughly half of them do not have a high school degree. i absolutely agree that the coming intoigrants compete with the least skilled, lisa vanished american workers has driven down wages and also has driven many workers right out of the labor force entirely. particularly black male workers. that's basic economics.
less want the wages of skilled workers to go up, we don't want to flood the labor market with illegal competitors from abroad. we should get that illegal immigration under control. if you just enforce the current law -- it's unlawful to hire an illegal immigrant. as a system called e-verify that could eliminate at least half of the employment of illegal immigrants in the united states, freeing up for million or 5 .illion jobs each year if you want employment and wages to go up for people who have a high school degree or less, the most important thing you can do is stop illegal immigrants and enforced the law that says the businesses cannot cheat and hire illegal immigrants for less than you pay an american worker. it's a bad system that's creating poverty and hardship. we should stop it. host: olivia golden, a quick response. guest: there are a lot of
researchers who see enormous positive economic impact from immigration. i want to focus on the citizen callern, who the mentioned. and note that those kids, the children of immigrants, a very large number of documented immigrants as well as some undocumented are a core portion of america's future. than they areess entitled to. and that's a problem. we need to make sure that those kids grow up secure. one mention of the homelessness portion of the comment. because i do think that the enormous issue and i'm glad you highlighted it. housing is very expensive. and one of the ways that low income affects children, particularly, but also adults is instability in housing, being evicted, being doubled up and being homeless. babies being one-year-old is actually the common agent homeless children. and has terrible lifelong consequences. left, james and
towns river, new jersey. the line for those you make under $25,000 a year. go ahead. caller: good morning, "washington journal," listeners. i would like to bring up the fact that my democratic party runs the country, you look at the history of the country, they always run the country better. that's a fact. anytime republicans run the country, we go downhill. dwight eisenhower good republican president. antiunion president, between him and george bush, it went down to about 9%. it even helps the rich people in this country. but the republican party for some reason can't figure that out. and i don't know why. the number one thing american voters, when you go to the voting booth and you want to
change things, you can do it overnight. vote democratic. it's that simple. that's james in new jersey with his thoughts. let's go to want in hayward, california for her thoughts on the line for those who make between $25,000 and $50,000 a year. caller: thank you for that last call. it's extremely important. spend that money on tax cuts for the rich and tax cut for the job creators. and in the heritage foundation, give me a break. give me a break. the instruction of congress cannot pass any jobs bills. do confirmorm, you it, was sent to the president, whether public and party. clinton did sign it, but tax rates for trump and for the rest of the rich is not going to do
anything for us. wanda in california. guest: if i could just go back to the earlier points. academic literature that says having large number of illegal immigrants without a high school degree has beneficial effects. it reduces wages. and the wage loss occurs among legal immigrants. wages go down the matter what you say, and you are giving a benefit to those employers want to cheat a deliberately hiring illegal immigrants rather than u.s. citizens. what we need to do is have a system that has a strong economy, overtaxing business doesn't do that. business remain in force. we don't want to suppress the wages of disadvantaged workers
by massive illegal immigration. we want to have a welfare system that says when you have a job and you still can't make enough to get your family above poverty, we want to help you through a system of welfare that complements your efforts and piggybacks on top of your efforts. on welfare reform under the republicans in her new gingrich and bill clinton, we reformed only one of 80 welfare programs. the rest were untouched and the rest don't have time limits. they don't have work requirements. pulling basically welfare recipients down. olivia golden,, you have joe in annapolis, maryland for those who make over $100,000 year. go ahead. caller: thank you for taking my call. i think the last several callers talked about -- no tax cuts for the ritz. -- for the rich.
that half of the people who work and pay federal taxes pay no income tax. and there are a lot of other people who don't work at all, and pay no income tax. you have to pay a tax to get a credit. i make a little bit more than $100,000 a year, but there's not a category for people above that. 200 thousand dollars a year or $300,000 year, but with the property taxes and social security taxes and the federal tax, i bring home just about half of that. oneke to quickly highlight great flaw -- fraud on the american people. the social security system, everybody who works pays antics of the people at the low end. they get there's a security taxes back with the earned income credit. they essentially earn or receive security, a social pension, having never paid into the social security system and people of higher end say maybe you can find us is that of
circumstances where someone pays 50 years of the top rate, that person gets the cap benefit of about $29,000 a year. someone on the low-end that works and pays taxes on minimum wage gets the benefit may be one third or 1/5 of that. the richer person paid 100 times more into the so security system. it's not a net for the people at the bottom, it's a wealth transfer system. that's my comments. guest: i want to make two points. first of all, thank you for your thoughts. in terms of payroll taxes, you are absolutely right that all americans pay them and that for people who get the earned income tax -- all workers pay them. for americans with kids who get the earned income tax credit, one of the ways it works and provides a work incentive is that you don't get all you are able to get, a supplemental low wages and be more secure.
and ideally, work your way up. that's an important positive for my perspective. it needs a work incentive for people to work more. one of the gaps in the earned income tax credit is that it doesn't do very much for people youngt children and for workers, including, for example, a father who might be trying to help support his kids that don't live with him, but he's a very low-wage job. i would argue that it's a plus to be able to give people that incentive and the research suggests that it leads to more work. i want to make one other point, which is that you know that even at $100,000 a year, it's very hard for you in the community and you live in to do all the things you would want to do. i want to encourage everybody who is watching to think about somebody who is trying to raise and and $18,000 or $19,000 as robert said even with $30,000 in the low income category.
think about what that means. i talked to somebody last summer about the specifics of her circumstances, working 25 hours a week as a security guard, wanting to work more, trying to pay for an apartment in the d.c. area on that. she's been addicted once and was a risk of that again. trying to keep a car running because she was trying to in addition to working, go to trinity college to get a credential that would let her do better. it's very hard work working in low-wage jobs at inadequate hours and trying to raise kids or better yourself. i think that is the headline here, we should be motivated to enable the workers to do better. it will be better for all of american if we can do that. int: joe was waiting baltimore, maryland on the line for those whom a between $51,000 and $100,000 a year. ahead. one of the things i have been noticing people talking , ast raising minimum wages illegalhesis, i'm
immigrant, now a citizen of the united states. i believe that illegal immigration is definitely an issue that needs to be addressed and controlled. issue, the minimum wage raising the minimum wage solves nothing. because it's not the amount of money that you make, is how much you bring home with the money you make. , if they to the market pay you $20 an hour but you cannot bring what you used to bring a $10 an hour, you have gone no place. this is what is happening. things to be considered. haveion and regulation become so burdening too small businesses that it drives the small business to cheat. host: we got your point, joe.
important to recognize what someone who is making the minimum wage actually gets. people would say look, here's a single mother, let's say she's making the federal minimum wage, which is around $7.25 an hour. she's making less than $14,000 a year. how can she possibly survive on that? the reality is, she gets another $10,000 or $11,000 of cash through the earned income tax payments during her kids essentially get free school lunch and breakfast. states, she and her children are both going to get medicaid. when you have that together, she has an income that of over $30,000 a year. , but the last thing we want to do is raise the minimum wage, making it so that woman can't have any job at all because you priced her out of the market, which is an absolute disaster. we have a very, very generous
system that takes basically any parent who works even 1500 hrs a year, that three quarters of the year, and want to count welfare, which we usually don't do, they're going to have a family income that's well above the poverty level. what we need to do is make sure we have more jobs for them and we have to take the parents that don't work at all and say look, if you are getting food stamps, you're getting housing benefits, we want to continue to assist you. but we are going to require that you prepare for work or do community service in exchange for the benefits we give you. when we do that, employment is going to go up and poverty is going to go down. the kids are going to be better off. that's the key to welfare reform 20 years ago. unfortunately, the left opposes it has tried to unravel it for 20 years. ed in greenbelt, maryland on the line for those to make under $25,000 a year. no ahead. caller: good morning, c-span.
i'm a phd scientist and i have to disagree with your guests from the heritage foundation. i had six-figure salaries years ago, up until 10 years ago. but the fact is that jobs are simply not there. and the fact is that immigrants are not responsible for my plight. the reason why i can't find jobs today. i spent time in europe. germany, for example. who apply the industry to invest great we don't invest in our people. we don't invest in our engineers and scientists and all those people who don't have the jobs that are simple and not there in this country right now today. the fact is that jobs are simply not there. , they arel immigrants not responsible for my plight and the reason why i can find jobs. like i used to. host: that is added in greenbelt, maryland. one minute each. i agree that investing in
jobs themselves and in some of the supports that enable people to succeed in jobs, like childcare is really important. investing in affordable access to higher education. i completely agree with you. i completely agree that immigrants and their children are key part of our future. we need to enforce labor rules, but we need to make sure that our generation of children and young adults today is able to succeed. we have growing research on the consequences of poverty and growing research on the success of some of the programs like and childcareaid subsidies in helping people stabilize their lives and raise their kids to be more successful and move up at work. we should act on that and continue the momentum from a very positive one year census four. nost: there is little or evidence that suggests giving people more welfare and making them more dependent, breaking families apart, which the welfare system does -- we've
increased the number of simple parents from 10% of all families with children to 35% today. those are disasters. the welfare system is implicated in that. pushing people out of the labor market by giving them a welfare check and said is a really bad thing. those of the policies we are doing. we are undermining wages and driving people out of the labor market due to a massive inflow of illegal immigrants. we have a welfare state that rewards people not to work and actually penalizes couples when they do get married. those are all bad things. we don't want to do away with welfare, but welfare should be helping people to rise up, rather than making them dependent. host: you can check out rob records work at heritage.org olivia golden is with clasp at classp.org. up next, we are joined by dave levinthal with the center for public integrity. presidential
fundraising and spending in campaign 2016. later, we focus on electronic voting machines and the security of electronic voting system in the united states. our guest will be thomas hicks of the u.s. alexis -- election assistance. that's coming up on "washington journal." ♪ >> the smithsonian national
museum of african american history and culture opens his door to the public for the first willsaturday, and c-span be live from the national mall starting internet clock a.m. eastern for the outdoor dedication ceremony. speakers include president obama , county museum director lonnie bunch, first lady michelle obama , former president george w. bush and mrs. laura bush, u.s. supreme court chief justice john roberts, congressman john lewis, and smithsonian secretary. ceremony forning the smithsonian museum of african american history and culture live saturday morning at 10 a clock a.m. eastern on c-span, the c-span radio app, and c-span.org. the communicators, she misuse, deputy director at george washington university center for cyber and homeland security and alberto fernandez, vice president of the middle east research institute discuss how isis and other extra missed groups use social media to radicalize and recruit followers
and help the u.s. and other nations are trying to reduce that trend. next you seen the explosion of the use of social media to recruit particularly in america, individual sciences. the use of social media like twitter, which was a platform choice for a number of years, now telegram, where their largely concentrated. you see one and two individuals in the u.s. who aren't finding people in mosques and committee centers, they are reaching online. >> you want religiosity, you can have that. you want bloodlust and revenge, you want wacko ways of killing, you have that as well. it allows them to project a complete package in a way that bypasses television, bypasses the regular media. it's accessible for all people. host: watch the committee get it tonight at eight akaka eastern on c-span two. communicators
tonight at 8:00 eastern on c-span two. , tracking levinthal campaign fundraising and spending. under eight weeks ago -- to go until election day. about the total money that's going to be spent with the presidential election and the congressional elections trade all combined, what sort of numbers are looking at? guest: our estimates are a lot less reliable this time around because of the donald trump factor than they would be in a more traditional election with more traditional candidates, for better or for worse. to the point of how expensive this is going to be, just by way of background very briefly, in february of this year just from the presidential race alone, you had an election that was already crossing the $1 billion mark by virtue of the incredibly ,ompetitive primary particularly that the republicans were running with the multitude of candidates they
had. but also because of the hillary clinton versus bernie sanders situation. when you add that on to the many months that have transpired since then, we are already talking about a presidential race that easily is going to exceed $2 billion in spending. could be more than that. and then lumping all the congressional races, house and senate, you have some very competitive senate races, whether it's in ohio, pennsylvania, or florida in the matter. it's all going to be right around if not a good bit more than it was four years ago during the 2012 presidential race, which was well past the $6 billion mark. a lot is going to depend on exactly what donald trump does. donald trump has been a lot less money than mitt romney did in 2012. because donald trump has run a very different campaign than mitt romney ran. alone, it's messing with the predictions that we would traditionally have. host: with all those billions of
dollars, what are the big edge of items for presidential campaign and a congressional campaign? is it still commercial tv airtime? guest: that's a big portion, you are certain to see that more now. hillary clinton has been incredibly aggressive in this via her campaign or the super pac's, these groups that can raise and spend unlimited amounts of money advocate either for hillary clinton or in many cases, go and attack donald trump. those cans organizations are spending millions upon millions of dollars every week and have been doing so for quite a while now. primarily to attack donald trump. there are some withering ads that are out there right now. donald trump, on the other hand, has set for much of the campaign that i have a self-funded candidate, the billionaire, rep. holding: to anyone. for quite a while during the course of the campaign, that held true in the sense that his campaign was largely funded by donald trump. when we moved into the general election scenario and the
general election phase of the campaign, he began to change in the way his fundraising operation ran. he's been getting a heck of a lot of support from super pac's. he's also been raising a lot of money from individuals, people who are not named donald trump. and by that, in the past couple of months, he's been playing catch-up. he has less money and his presidency campaign than hillary clinton does, which may seem completely counterintuitive because donald trump is so personally wealthy. but roughly he has injected around $60 million of his own money into his own campaign, which falls well short of some of the predictions that before he became a presidential candidate, donald trump himself said that he would pour into a race if he ever did become a presidential candidate. one of those numbers was $600 million. $60 million is a lot different than $600 million. lines, if you want join the conversation talking about campaign fundraising and
spending and all the billions of dollars that are being spent the cycle. a democrat, call (202) 748-8000. republicans, call (202) 748-8001 . call (202)s, 748-8002. is actuallys to spending the money, are the candidates and outside groups about equal in the spending? our candidate fundraising far outweighed by the shadowy groups we hear about? it depends on the race we are talking about. the presidential level, the candidates themselves are spending a considerable amount of money. , that be in the end outside groups are going to be catching up. but the candidates themselves have really been leading the way both for hillary clinton and for donald trump. there is one caveat to that, which is the super pac called priorities usa action. the super pac it was created to help barack obama in 2012 run his reelection campaign and supported him with incredible
amounts of money and was beating up on mitt romney and effectively acting as his surrogate among super pac's. they shifted and went and began to support hillary clinton. even before hillary clinton was an official nominated candidate for officially declared candidate. they have been instrumental in spending and raising money on hillary clinton's behalf in support hillary clinton. that's the biggest, baddest super pac of all the presidential level. when you get to the senate level in the house level, it really depends on race as to whether the candidates themselves on the outside organizations are spending more or spending less. it's a mixed bag. mentioned priority usa, i have an ad from them so our viewers can see with that money is being spent on to produce. [video
clip] the leastmp: i'm racist person there is. look at my african-american. all lives matter. his grandmother in kenya said he was born in kenya and she was there and witnessed the birth.
ok? he doesn't have a certificate. you are living in poverty, your schools are no good. believe me. host:
their super pac supporting donald trump. [video clip] hillary clinton: we came out of the white house that broke come into. >> it didn't last long. wall street insiders, corrupt dictators. the clintons are now worth nexus $100 million. -- in excess of $109. host: dave levinthal, you've research on this.
guest: put that group and a lot of playing catch-up. the irony here is that hillary clinton early in her campaign fourthat she would have hillary clinton has been outspoken on the stump about eforming the campaign finance system, about advocating against united states and supreme court decision that really changed the way that ampaigns are run and waged in terms of outside money pouring races.mpetitive
hillary clinton advocated for reform, wants constitutional amendment to overturn citizens united, which would be a very difficult thing to do, but that is another point. the same time, she has been beneficiary of outside money, the kind of money united by the citizens decision and from groups like prior action, another one called action, super pac. merican bridge, 21st century and even before hillary clinton was a canidate, she had a super for hillary pac, which raised millions upon millions of ollars, sometimes from places difficult to trace in order to infrastructure in weight for hillary clinton when he did become a canidate and benefits her immediately and was out of the gate. donald trump doesn't have an analogous organization, a super pac that was there aiting for donald trump to diidate. canned can it was driven by donald trump. how it isnd politics,
being raised and spent, our topic for the next 40 minutes levinthal. kelly is up first from georgia. go ahead. yes, thank you for taking my call. will tell you i placed my first vote when i was for bill clinton. democrat., i became a i will tell you how i spent my money this year. the always supported republican party. but this year, i decided even call from the er republican party, i had a call marco rubio, i live in georgia. i decide third degree year to money to the trump campaign. we have told the republican arty as upset as we are about obama policies, we are more so t with our own party, therefore, as of this year, i'm giving money straight to the party as far as down ballot races go, i know purdue ballot this year,
but from this point on, i will the canidate that i support and as far as the epublican vote from this point on, we will remember those people like paul ryan, that the time they could find the hot mic, tofs say something our nominee and not defended his own party. we will plorable and not forget that he did not stand announce and support his people.y's >> what sort of amounts are you money in? >> sir, i can't each report it not about to 'm tell how much money i give to the trump campaign. or in the undreds thousands, kelly? >> sir, i don't tell how much. even, i'm going to tell
buti'm adorable deplorable, not about to announce on national t.v. how much. for a trump pay hat, i'm not about to tell you how much money. this, aruba ou campaign, paul ryan's i get an e-mail every single ay, from portman, from paul ryan in his primary, i give calls me where the rnc almost every single day wanting support, but i'm not about to money i how much give -- within your right. seeing a lot of small donations this cycle more than sual because of the can diidates or larger don'tinations, what are we see amounts? thing bernie
sanders and donald trump have in common, both donald trump and bernie sanders received amount of money and support from people giving small dollar amounts. liketo define small dollar in quotes, something $200 less. if to the caller's point, if you make a donation, you or i were a donation to a political candidate, more than $200, that would be public they would report, our name, city, occupation, matter of public record. we've been finding the and donald trump leads hillary clinton in this regard, leading from small donors, people giving $10, $50's, $100, even if it is money, show t of support and affection for that candidate, that they support.
the caller, we talked to a to thatf people similar caller who support donald trump and have asked them this very why do you support donald trump, who is a billionaire? he could his entire campaign if he wanted to. down to, i feel strongly for him and want to show him support. a show of moral fortitude, i t going to be something feel is important for me to do n. fact, a lot of people have donations because they bought a "let's make america great" hat. $25. sometimes they didn't even ealize when you get a "make america great again" hat, you are making a campaign contribution if you buy through trump's website. even democrats who got them as a inadvertently made a donald trump.
host: allen, good morning. think i'm in my 60s, i voters under 50 have no recollection of the existence of federal policy starting in the doctrine andirness equal time rule. both of these were ended under during the reagan administration, 30 years ago. e have a generation who has grownup since that ended and have no recollection of what media was like before. change is thathe opinionated false statements that get made by roadcast personalities or guests or candidates that would trigger for an opposing viewpoint or equal time or '87 are now allowed to pass unchallenged and stream of of the factoids people have to verify n their own and very often not
verified. another result of this, people like trump, who were because of sheer extremity are getting more free hours of air time and there is the broadcasters to give equal time to opposing viewpoints, so they are now attracted by political view or him taining aspect to give more than his fair share of air time. i think the time estimated he billion in free air time just up to the last spring broadcasters found he was drawing viewership. i think we need to educate the the changes in policy that are 30 years old and have a discussion about maybe some rule like this because we're now suffering from that.quences of >> allen, thanks for the call. levinthal ime, dave has an article and been tracking ads in the 2016 race.
public integrity dot orgfthey want to see your work tracking the t.v. ads and the map, where taking see the ads are place. to the caller's point. guest: the caller is right, a great ump has been beneficiary of free media advertising, not advertising per for donald trump, it largely served as advertisement campaign, him himself, or his policy to the point he described them. hillary clinton, her campaign almost under the gun when it comes to having to spend on ck of a lot more money paid media, paid television, paid radio. host: exactly. the 30 second spots and spots, i'm not a media historian, but we live in time than even 10 years ago, cupull out your cell ipad is find video contents, print content, any politics, tent about
coming from politicians irectly, coming from various media outlets, be it what it may, thousands of different you can get some kind of political content about, candidates, hillary clinton or donald trump. it is such a split and divided landscape, you just don't ave abc and cbs and nbc and couple of options and newspapers that you're able to get radio, ed locally and yet it is just his vectored so much beyond that it is very and for example, the federal election commission, a government aigence that he we closely, they strug welthis mightily trying to pass or proposeegulations ones that would speak to the changing ic and digital media landscape that has befuddled election regulator necessary terms of content. is paid
what is something that should be regulated versus something that be? should everything we passor all or should open regulation? these are open will not be t decided during 2016 and probably not soon after host: head to barbara in alabama. you are on with david levinthal. morning, thank you for taking my call. yes, i would like to say quickly all hillary clinton, we know where she is getting her and shefor her campaign is being bought off. washington. owned in donald trump self-funded his ampaign and that is, you know, that to me tells me a lot about the candidate. one thing i want to mention, thatthe lady said, i think cruz, paul k, ted
ryan tis disrespectful they do their candidate. they didn't even go to the commission. what about the thousands that trump.ted donald they mean nothing to kissick, people are the way looking at it. that is truly disrespectful and that -- >> barbara, you touched on this already, more effective in the versus the general election or do you think it is work nothing both? add to the point about donald trump self-funding, he his argely self funding campaign during the primary. but if donald trump is to say he self-funding his campaign now, not something he says anymore, it would not be
true, he is not self-funding his roughly and spends numbers will change soon, we will get a new dump of data raiseing andn fund spending. >> when does that happen? >> coming up late tomorrow night, it will detail this in greater detail. overall donaldg, trump personally injected not -- e half of what the money in total that his campaign has raised over the course of the donald trumplately has been putting in a couple million dollars every month of a heck of a lot of money to a lot of people. ut in the context of political campaign, specifically presidential campaign, we're nine-figure deal, that is margin of how much money raise.ll need to much of donald trump's monsecoming from individual people making small dollar donations, in some cases donations.ng larger
donald trump is now benefiting rom what is amounts to tens of millions of dollars from money he himself doesn't control, his but coming control, from supportive super pacs, groups that raise and spend as money as they want to and are putting up television ads or o prog motional activity for donald trump's campaign. those are really hard numbers when it comes to funding of trump's overall campaign effort and it marks a shift in way donald trump philosophically approached his self-fundedom a more molel, which was true to a large extent to something more or less operating like a traditional been gn and has even committees with republican national committee and has the more traditional operation. host: lan caster, california, is waiting. good morning. yes, i had given
donation. campaign $40 when she became ill, i thought, i want her to know i care for her. i want her to know that i want her to know that there is the desert of hillary a backing clinton. i sent $225, which is a lot for but i was glad to do it. hope that the reason i like her is because she cares, she me.es for people like she ld and 80 and also cares about children. i just think that is so beautiful. just, she has always cared about children. hen i see children, my heart goes out to them, too. just i'm not very good at i s, but anyway, that is why
cherish hillary clinton. >> and with her donation cycle, i want to hear your reason, your questions fundraising, n campaign spending. dave levinthal is our guest for the next 15 ments. democrats 202-748- 8000. independents 202-748--8002. line for independence, you're up. >> i have a couple questions to ask. doing, dave? guest: doing great. caller: isn't the fcc, and the group that picks moderators, be a debate coming up, to hillary clinton, they have not donated any money have not trump, they donated any money to the green party, i forget her name, have donated any money to gary
johnson. host: mark, the commission on and the fcc,debate where do you get your nformation from, mark? caller: from the facebook from i eral groups that participate on facebook on that. y second question is -- host: take that point, mark. i want dave levinthal to weigh in on that. sure, just to clarify, the commission that oversees presidential debates is nonprofit organization. they in fact do take ontributions to fund their efforts to stage the debates that are going to happen at the presidential level. three of them and one vice presidential debate. they don't give money to candidates per se. hey have no role in the debates, especially in terms of bunting, the federal election money ton doesn't give any candidate, it is their role to disclose ility
money being used to run laws ins, they regulate the country that deal with elections, but it should be note commission on presidential debate doeses take monfreprivate sources, in some nonprofit, other nonprofit organizations, it has been story tions, this is a that is kind of undertold, i think. i don't think a lot of people what goes into the operation. it is controversial in the sense if you are uirement gary johnson supporter, jill is really rter, this going to be a situation that is etrimental to their campaigns, because under the current rules, the way things are set up for of te, have you to get 15% the vote in a variety of polls n order to qualify for the debate and neither gary johnson met the threshold for the first debate. you will see hillary clinton and johnson, ump, no gary
no jill stein in the first debate. dubious if gary johnson will qualify for the second or third. repeat re looking for a f 1992, when ross perot was on the debate stage with george and bill clinton, you will not get that initially. we will carry the debateos c-span, watch them with us. gregory from pennsylvania. good morning. caller: good morning, sir. hello.it -- host: we're listening, gregory, go ahead. caller: very good, sir. it disturbing hillary clinton and donald trump have one thing in common, that is connections.l support with muchly rate. very given the fact huge amount going campaigning and the
forces would at include foreign sources, would indicative of some in other ychosis? grievous and taking money for their campaign. do you see any reflection and occur to me and why is it addressed more you, sir. thank levinthal. guest: no question hillary clinton and donald trump have foreign ections with entities. the ry clinton, through clinton foundation, the clinton foundation has taken money from of foreign sources, some came at the same time hillary clinton was serving as state, the top
diplomatic official in the united states. his has been something without going into the gory details of herhas been problematic for in a political context as she runs her campaign. donald trump, on the other hand, has numerous business interests all across the world. is were ion there donald trump to become president, how would he of ntangle himself from all those foreign financial interests that he has? he will.hat he says that won't be a problem. itwill either pull away from or otherwise not be involved in having direct financial interest operations he of has across the world and a number of different countries, easier said than done, because he has so many different companies and organizations and donald trump a way in his own brand. donald trump is a brand and those companies are largely donald trump. host: the viewer's call, there are rules against foreign entities giving
onations to candidates in u.s. elections, how did the sec nsure that doesn't happen? guest: they check and go line by the campaign. usually that works, not always does it work. e just wrote a story in the last week, my colleague, michael beckell, identified a contribution, a man from canada, not a u.s. citizen, doesn't have a contribution to a candidate, it was part of a bet, in fact, curead the article, he made a contribution campaign. trump's the trump campaign didn't pick p on it, federal election commission didn't pick up on it and the donald trump campaign gave it back. of this -- host: from you going through the ndividual filings? guest: from the individual filings. that is not to say something can't be found on hillary side.on's
one contribution that will be things slip times through the cracks and as a result tis possible for foreign campaign.o into a now donald trump immediately, once he was notified of it, gave money back and says, no, we'll not take that money, of ourse, but it is always there that things are not there. it should be noted that you can non-u.s. citizen and make a contribution to a campaign, but you have to have permanent legal status. in other words, you have to have a green card in order to do it. citizen of ust a japan or china or india or you a, name any country, can't go online and make a contribution to a political candidate without the aforementioneds status. have been talk withing dave levinthal. new jersey. tyrique, good morning.
caller: good morning. i'm a hillary supporter. enough and i take to illary because she has faults, but the other candidate, mr. trump, is like the republicans get away with anything. the stuff that he says is rhetoric, it's hate mongering because just a shame he's tearing our world apart, he's tearing us apart. a kid, when you are kids, you don't know about sxhat rouble, but when you got somebody feeding you that and putting it in your ear and everybody, this person is take thanksgiving, this person is taking that, that is what you get. get a pot that blows up and everything goes to pieces. a shame that real republicans just don't stick up, few, but most
of them haven't. the same thing. host: thoughts from newark. connecticut, ven, an independent. pete, good morning. caller: good morning. three comments, my first comment, i never contribute to campaign fund and i've been voting at the elections for the is one.years, that i think it is waste of money and through with their promises anyways. if hillary nt is, clint spoke against special interest and tried to get the on the problem, why does she accept the money in the first place? and the third had, every year when we make our income tax, they ay, would you like to contribute $1 to the campaign fund. involved and is
what do they do with that monsne host: all right, answers from levinthal. guest: second two questions. an er one, people have option, they can make a campaign a tribution or not make campaign contribution, nobody is compelled. areopting ople who out. if you take the most extreme example of people opting out, if we were have thanksgiving conversation a year ago, john, more about talking the koch brothers or casino adelson and how much they were expected to pour into the presidential race super pacs and other organizations that would be supporting presumably the nominee.n they are nowhere to be found at he presidential level and any effort with the koch brothers eing put forth are being put forth at senate level, putting all cash into trying to make hang on to ublicans
the campaign. had a different situation in 2012 and the koch's and other republican-leaning donors were behind mitt romney at that point. the caller's other point, public funding of campaigns, this ystem used to be a big deal in presidential politics, people check the box on taxes and give be y and the fund would created where you effectively had meshing funds. candidate wanted public funding for their campaign, it would be matched money they raised and that would be something available to them. candidates began opting out in when barack icular obama didn't opt into it. john mccain in 2008, he said, all bets are off, i will take as much money as i to, the public system is
dead. neither hillary clinton nor the d trump opted into system. for viewers who want to learn more about that, we spent 45 a viewer segment about the history of that system. c-span dot org, find it in the archives of this program. there, viewers. want to get to before you leave, waiting in een cathedral city, california. democrat.ing, caller: good morning. i just called to say that i'm hillary clinton. mistakes, she's not perfect, i know that. but no one is perfect. tried to help people in this country and other places, too. it takes a world, okay. it takes the world to live. city or one state or one country. very nald trump is
frightening to me. he and his campaign people, they and they lie directly into the camera. behooved a lot of the things that have come out of his be h have been proved to lies. that is frightening. could be resident, we in a world war and life on this would nder donald trump change. host: that is the last caller. dave levinthal, have you done a t.v. ads intracking the 2016 election and point on ers to that article public integrity dot org. eight weeks to election, what looking into? guest: to the caller's point, lies, , transparency, issues that both hillary clinton has been lobbying on donald has been donald trump lobbing at hillary clinton. here was a head-to-head
comparison of donald trump versus hillary clinton on the tried f transparency, we to take nine measures and empire on y rank them side by side who is doing a better job. i welcome people to read that. dramatic in the campaign. oth candidates bottom line, fairly secretive when you measure them against historical precedent. may do better against donald trump on some issues, not all issues. you look at medical records, john mccain released history s full medical and now we're debating about whether hillary clinton two-page letter is better than donald trump's one-page letter about history. very of issues like that, much going into the final few weeks, being talked about a ton. to the question of how much do we know about candidateand se with the media coverage, a lot of people when we talk to them seem to e america,
think that both candidates cards yet.wn their host: who is more transparent, or trump, question mark, find it at public integrity dot org. author of hal is the the story, he's been our guest for the past 45 minutes. thank you for your time. you down the road. up next on "washington journal," segment,y "your money" we'll talk with thomas hicks about voting machine security. is with the u.s. election assistance sxhigz he'll be at our desk in a few minutes.
>> we all want to get back to making america strong and great again. > i am running for everyone working hard to support their families. down, e has been knocked but get back up. [cheers and applause] of the , live coverage presidential and vice presidential debateos c-span. s c-span. s c-span. s c-span. c-span. presidential debatess c-span. c-span.
>> "washington journal" continues. "washington nt of journal," we take a look at how your monseat work in a different federal money program. are talking about federal spending to secure voting machines. e're joined by thomas hicks, chair of the u.s. election assistance commission. unfamiliar with the eac, how long have you been around and what is your snigz the actdent bush signed in 2002 and the agency was up and run nothing 2003. agency has given out 3.3 reform to states are electoral process. we help state necessary giving hem best practices and the administration of elections, but e also in charge of the voluntary voting system guidelines, which 47 states out
follow.ow it is voluntary system that go intoes integrity of the voting the ss in terms of guidelines set for standards for the machines themselves. billion given out since the agency was founded. hat is the form that money takes to go to each state? guest: most money has gone of voting acement equipment and allocation developed on two different tracks. normal, just this is amount of money that you will get. there is also calculation based population. host: what was the money intended to do? you define security of voting ng system and machine? guest: money was more than security of the voting systems themselves. administration of elections and many of the problems that were seen in in 2000 were looked at to be alleviated. the major piece that the for the machine necessary terms of
machines e that the are secure, making sure that verified for voter accuracy, to make sure that the who have disabilities can vote independently and privately, but for the most are four or five different types of machines still out there. machines, there are dre machines with paper rails, there are punch card machines, optical scan machines and even states that use plain ballots. host: dre machine, what does mean? >> announcer: direct electronics, people vote on. why five different machines, if there is one you would recommend to a state that works than another? guest: no, the system is derent ralized what may work in new hampshire may not work in washington state or california. instance, washington state, colorado and oregon all vote by
mail. allow for, send out ballots to electorate and they the ballots back. host: map from ballot pedia different voting equipment in each state, the various colors of the states hey are representing a different kind of voting machine. for example, florida, they have includes ipment that paper and -- paper ballot and don't have a that paper trail. two different type of systems used there. you powant to peruse that map k state and go to ballot pedia dot com. voter security, voting machine security with thomas hicks of assistance.n for specifically talking about
voter security machine security cycle, is one of the five systems better? guest: i wouldn't say one system the other, an depends on the state and what sort of thing guess about making votes.out the the overall function of the machines should always be to be ble to cast your ballot and have that ballot counted accurately. we wouldn't say one is better than the other. basically like driving a car. you might have a car, you know, place better to get some than the other? it may be, but it depends on what you're looking for. we can always have a better type of machine and this is why we're reforming voter system guidelines now. guidelines were basically 2007, but that was before the iphone came out. voluntary ng our voting system standards now, working with the national nstitute of standards and technologies and we just had a meet thanksgiving past week to talk more about that. guidelines ave completed by the end of next
ear because it is a long, extensive process. host: we're coming up on election in november. land security talked about cyber security on election systems. here is a bit of what was said. i do think that we should carefully consider whether our election system, our election process is critical infrastructure. like the financial sector, like the election , rocess contributes to -- there is vital national interest in our election process. i do think we need to consider it should be considered by my department and others infrastructure, which has several implications. t becomes very much a part of our focus. host: thomas hicks on that
esignation and what that would mean for the job that you do? guest: so we've had a few calls with secretary johnson to talk about this issue. he secretary of state participate and the f.b.i. has participated in it. we want to make sure we're doing that we can to not elude, not erode voter confidence. so i think that there's a little terms miscommunication in of -- in that states are for help able to ask or making sure their systems are secure. if there are -- the homeland ecurity is able to go in and provide resources to the states to allow for them to have their making sure r they're secure, the states should be asking for it. think that making it a national of infrastructure is something that
homeland security has to really think about. is this a situation where you think homeland security is more concerned than the states run the system? guest: absolutely not. absolutely not. the states have been thinking about this issue for months on and we've worked with various states to ensure that speed with their security. we even have on our website and distributed to many of the states, 10 things to know about managing aging voting equipment. so, we've allowed for states to systems, make sure they are up and running. oddesting and post-election sxit ensure the machines are functioning the way they should be. an ways equate it to in older car, you can, if you have an older car, you will be able car, you rive that want to make sure the maintenance is up to date, make sure oil is changed and tires running, you make sure the fluids are topped off
that.ings like that is what we're saying. host: are you confident those 50 differents and the 50 states are ready to go and will to function correctly in this election cycle? guest: 50 states and five territories. there will be problems there are over 200,000 pieces of voting the country. there will be issues that occur, whether or not -- i believe that election officials have been working very hard to ensure those -- that equipment does well f. they do fall down and if they do go down, i think that the election -- the election officials have contingency plans election will the function smoothly, as well as it can. host: thomas hicks, here to take your calls and questions as we end our program today. he'll be here until 10:00. call now. fort myer, n north
florida. a republican. good morning. to c-span and ou thank you mr. hicks for being there. four years ago we had a of situation, we had the scanners and i have a photo in my phone i just looked up. 10:15 p.m. and the photo shows he ballroom, we live in a retired community, people have scanning stuff in their lap and ball room.und the probably more than an hour away night.oting at 10:15 at four years before that, we had electronic machines and they thrown out because they said no paper trail. it seems to me if you have entire electronic voting machine, it wouldn't take a technology to put a card in there that sent out answer or toll to various places to ensure there was no the ing going on that electronic machines were so much better, the filling in oval every single time. we had people here that -- old
removed by be ambulance because the process and on, again, it was 10:15 people hadn't voted. there were people here well voted 1:00 that hadn't yet. believe it or not, the lady in county f voting in lee is running for re-election, i think that is an awful lot of nerve. put paper ey have trail on electron machines that we had eight years ago? thank c-span? guest: thank you for that question. an lieve that florida makes independent decision on which machines they think is best for their electorate. that i would basically say to you is that one thing alleviate line system having more people working at the polls. it doesn't really matter what machine you're using if you don't have enough poll workers. we're announcing five inners of a contest that we've held on what states and which jurisdictions have the best and
rightest poll worker activities. we'll do that this afternoon at eac.gov. are saying and asking for, because we need almost a to serve as teers, poll workers across this country. and if you have that time, i say to make sure that you o out and you serve as a poll work worker. the other thing i would say and this doesn't directly answer but this week, at the end of this week, 45 days actually election occurs. at that 45-day marker, states out oing to be sending ballots to military and overseas voters so they can get their back here in time for the election itself. is last piece i would say that the machines that you're describing of having a paper it do not actually help those people whoa have isabilities to be able to verify and cast their ballots.
one thing that came about with of the voter act was to make sure that individuals who not left ilities are behind, they can vote independently and privately. ut one thing we're looking at with voluntary voting system guidelines now, is what new use to make itwe more easily -- make it easier to vote and make sure the vote is secure and accurate leaving that we're not our disability friends behind. so thank you for that question. host: and out with a report on voting machines that will be use third degree cycle, stats from report, many of today's voting machines were designed and built in the 1990s. will be using machines at least 10 years old this year. initial cost for replacing nationwide could exceed another billion dollars. we're talk withing thomas hicks the u.s. election assistance commission about voting machines security. and voting folks waiting to talk to you in
kentucky. line for democrats. good morning. caller: good morning. thanks to c-span for taking my call. question is, vote electronically and the votes are tabulated and sent automatically electronically. agency doing to prevent hacking what kind of firewall to prevent hacking from russia and other places? thank you very much. guest: thank you for the question. coming down to kentucky last november to watch state elections. one thing that i felt secure votes as the way that the are actually tabulated and that he votes are not sent electronically over the intern sxet one thing i want to make here is i'm clear on that no system that certified by the ac, is hooked up to internet. as long as states do not use hook up machines to the internet, there is no way to
ack the machines using the internet. lots of cars come with different features and voting machines come with a number of features. as long as features are turned making sure mend the features are turned off, here will be no hacking of the system by anyone. election officials have thought and they've prepared for this long before we had foreign ut the nationals attacking the dnc or our voting pects of systems. ventura, e in california, a republican. good morning. caller: good morning. little d listening a while ago. you mentioned how much money allocated. was it in the millions or billions, can you repeat that? you. guest: sure, 3.3 billion was to the states nt
help fix programs. ost went to purchase of new voting equipment tis statewide data base set up for voter new ruleos , provisional ballot and other as well. host: what was your question, nne? caller: he said some went toward administration, how much went oward administration, instead of equipment? guest: administration of equipment, poll worker training basically other things like everyone might not see. a lot of people see voting workers and poll don't see other aspects as in voter registration list or the set up.es caller: administration would be people for those job? $3.3 billion he would that be?
say : when i administration, i don't mean democratic or republican administration going on with presidency, i mean administration of the systems themselves. the states, when they get that funding, we audit all this money, we want to make sure moneys are not being used for political means, they are of the betterment election system themselves and voters are getting the value for money. ost: dennis, line for democrats. go ahead. caller: good morning, i'm alling from lee county, florida. yes, we did have problems back n the last couple of cycles, but most of those have been ddressed and to the gentleman in north fort myers, we do have a paper ballot. that do not want to be standing in long lines, there is early voting here. if you don't want to stand in line at all, call up the lee
they'll ections and send out two registered voters ballots and mail it out to return postage on it, all you have to do is fill it out properly and send it back them. as far as i know, i haven't heard of anything as far as any or any abuse here in lee votes., as far as maybe 10 people in the last country, roughout the there was abuse, but there was all i've ever heard. people, it is your right to but if there and vote, you don't want to stand in line, absentee mail-in ballot is available to you nationwide. saying evious caller that the need for paper trail was contributing to the line n. of paper trail, jody on twitter writes not having paper
suggest recount vote mistake we made before we had the paper trail, is what t bad history, she's asked. anything you want to touch on? guest: no, i think the caller on the nail in saying there are multiple ways o cast a ballot during the election season and one thing pushing eac has been for this month, october and worker , is poll appreciation. but one thing that is occurring ext week is national voter registration day. we encourage people to look at their registration to ensure registration is up to date and it is accurate and that if that they don't really want to have a machine that trail, cugoe a paper out and, like this caller said, for the bsentee ballot states that have no excuse absentee balloting to vote election day. for a few more calls.
the numbers if you want to join in, democrats 202-748- 8000, 8001.licans 202-748- 202-748-8002. venice, florida. desiree is a republican. good morning. caller: hi, good morning. thanks for taking my call. want this to sound or sarkastic, but face the truth, the integrity of the is obviously important. ut this, we weren't so concerned eight years ago in the election when there were double more than ple voting vaded there was darth voted, scoobey-doo voted, dead voted. are these machines going to prevent that from happening? is focus -- i have my
thoughts of why cyber security part is be fog cussed on now. get w where they are withing that, but down to the states, el and all the it doesn't, it doesn't matter whether you punch in the people that are monitor these things are letting in and be go counted. how is that going to be prevented? fraud?ow to fix election guest: one way to prevent this, serve as a poll worker yourself that if you see folks who are basically trying to stuff the ballot box, which i really don't actually happening, i don't think i have seen votes by or mickey mouse. host: are there statos election fraud? going to say it never happens, we have 100 ballots, eople casting but there are thing necessary place to prevent election fraud,
weically like making sure if have more poll workers, we can integrity hat we the of the system is seen from the inside and therefore have you in it.nfidence so the i believe that this is that is l issue actually happening, but i think that, you know, i want to take seriously f. there are things and you know of these folks who are casting ballots, need to report that to the proper authorities. host: who are the proper suspects fist somebody election fraud? who can they call? guest: election officials, the department of justice. if you commit election fraud, that is a crime. also, i want to make sure that we put on the record here, intimidation is also a piece of voter fraud. if you are preventing people ballots or basically questioning someone because you feel they are not a citizen or that they're not eligible just because of the way
are things k, those in terms of intimidation, you gets not things the eac into, that is department of justice. i would say that we want to those folks k to about those issues. host: woodbridge, virginia, independent, go ahead. aller: when is national voter registration day? guest: september 27th. caller: okay. like to address, i've seen on television and lines atces long, long voter -- at voting day. wondering, is there any way this can be remedied? where in le don't have to stand line for hours in order to cast a ballot? one thing a caller addressed earlier, vote by absentee ballot. that absentee ballot, i suggest if you want to are at now to ensure there no long lines at the polls,
for st absentee ballots, states that have that voting. for the state of virginia, i an excuse has to be for it n. woodbridge, if have or to journ tow dc to work if you can't stand in line for hours on end, i would say you talk to the prince william county registrar's you get d ensure that the information that you need to cast your ballot ahead of election day. in the ballot back in so you don't feel if you are nothing line stand for multiple hours. hudson, k to florida, florida, loretta, line for democrats. good morning. good morning, thank you cspan. i'm 80 years old and worked on election boards through the years. i started out when they had nothing but paper ballots counted by hand. years, they developed
system the automated with the little clicky tab that candidateown for each and now in my home state of down here, they have the paper ballots that you through a ey are put reader. i saw on facebook not too long thing where the card that reader was into the altered. they tried it -- they had a test of eight people. they tried it two or three times the way ver came out those people voted. i'm more concerned about that having having illegals vote o dead people voting. since i worked with computers for a long, long time, i know it can be done and i wonder how it you.e fixed? thank guest: one thing i would suggest
is talking to your local because the cial, local election official, state, all want the ral, same thing, confidence in our election process. thing that i'm very confident in is security of those machines. machines are put away and and e before election day on election day, they are out secured are still being and one of the things you should be aware of is that most of things that you are seeing on the internet comes with the hered access to machines themselves. have it down and untethered access to a machine, ki get into that, break into it alter any sort of votes to it. those machines used on election have that unfettered access. republicans go
ahead. it was stated earlier that the machines, the way they there is d so forth, so forth. and there is backup, if not backup for the voting electronically, there be two servers nvolved and taking those votes to make sure that there is no voter fraud or wherever involved. guest: so that i'm answering hearing your i'm correctly, you're basically saying that these when people vote these votes go on to electronic server, that would mean they are going over the internet, these votes that are done here in the united states n those voting equipment are not hooked up to the internet. they are not sent lectronically, there is no servers involved.
question?t answer your does that answer your question? really.not those servers fthey are located those votes and going electronically, where do a server? guest: votes are not transmitted electronically. one common misconception, people see vote totalos election day, those are official totals, those are not official totals, official totals are done days later, where the votes are physically taken back central accounting places or where they are done. how pends on the state, they do counting. but they are not done over the internet. host: electronic systems where people use them around the that where is all of ompiled and how does that work when they are compiled, are you
concerned about whatever central compiled in? guest: right. ne thing i went to california this past june for primary. that each s is individual machine after the election, a tally is taken from the machine. are basically calculators. you take the tally from the back e and you take that to the central place of where ou are going to count or have those tallies counted . places bring the tallies back or if they have paper rails or things like that, but the machines themselves spit out some sort of tally and then that done. way it is host: back to florida one more time. pam, homestead, florida. democrats. caller: i have a question about security on these i have a quest security on these things. voting, you actually fill out your ballot on an
electronic reader. they are supposed to have a paper trail. did they ever pull anything at random to find out if the votes on the paper are the votes being tallied by the machine? guest: yes. when you do in audit of the election system at the end of the election, then they take a few of those votes in audit the system itself. host: sort of a quality control process? guest: yes. host: how many states do that? guest: it depends. i do not have the exact numbers. host: dimitri from oakland, california. i am at listening to you, but you are not offering any solutions to our problems. what problem in particular? caller: the fraud that is going on.