tv Washington Journal Bradford Kane CSPAN October 20, 2019 6:34pm-7:36pm EDT
president. host: we will look for your reporting at cq onaljournal.com and at roll caufment this program also available on the web at c-span.org. thanks for tuning tonight, on q&a, american university distinguished professor of looks atlan kraut policies on migrating immigration. >> nativism, anti-immigrant sentiment, xenophobia is not different from what we have seen in the past. while it seems to us to be peppered with acts of violence and ferocity, there have been other acts of violence, anti-immigrant riots, before the civil war, in the 1880's. there have been a lot of moments in american history when the
anti-immigrant sentiment has been translated into true ugliness. announcer: watch tonight at 8:00 p.m. eastern on c-span's q&a. with author bradford kane. we will discuss his book, pitchfork populism, the forces that shaped and election and continue to change america. good morning. let's define populism. in the book, you talk about it as a movement of this engine -- disenchanted people who are motivated. is that populism? just alet me go back bit. there is a long history of populism in the united states. there has been economic populism.
there was the populism of the 1800s. i would also note the progressive party, teddy roosevelt in 1912 had an amazing agendas it was a populist agenda. it was fascinating. it got enacted over many years. populism isform of not actually populism. normally, it's based on elevating the people, elevating the masses. in this particular case as was really inn 2016, it's the case of donald trump, he motivates his base to empower him rather than him empowering the masses. host: once the difference that youhe populism identify here and the populism from the past?
is there a literal difference between the two? is trump taking advantage of something from the past and reshaping it for himself? is this completely new? guest: where there is consistency over the years is the level of the people. recognized inump 2016 was there were a lot of disaffected people, they felt from the economic crisis they had not elevated from the rubble of those years. there is discontent with both political parties. donald trump saw that. he used mention globalization and trade as part of the lever for that, as did bernie sanders. usingf them were different nuances. bernie sanders is focusing on billion ears.
there is a similar route. the continuity between the 1800s and now, people are feeling discontent and disempowered and left out. they don't appreciate that and they make their voices known. is this next question, a republican thing or a democratic thing? does it cross party lines? guest: it's very much an american phenomenon. i talk about the different forces that distinguish the different trends in chapter one. national identity between individualism and rugged individual and -- individualism. there can be discontent and populist feelings on both sides for different reasons. host: you said there were 10 dynamics of politics and society. tell us what those are.
guest: the first one that sets the groundwork for all 10 is the national identity question. we see that. it goes back to our colonial days. it's deeply rooted before the united states. it, therens through are demographics in terms of the racial composition evolving in the united states. there is the importance of policy. i discuss how a lot of leaders usually govern according to principal and policy. what we see now is something that is largely a matter of personality and psychology. of the other chapters talk about the evolution of media,
the democratization of the political structure, trade and globalization, bipartisanship, a shift in voter behavior. that there is a big political divide in america right now. no one would disagree with that. is that new? is this political divide something that only occurred in the last few years? has it always been there? guest: i contend that it is all -- always been there. it is taking new forms. i am an advocate of empowerment and franchise meant and people participating in the process. at different stages in our history, different groups of become activated. right now, there is a particular group that has been dormant and found a voice and got involved
and got engaged. that's great. others have become activated as a result of that. that is how we got the outcome in the 2018 midterms when we saw a counter reaction. host: let's let our viewers join up in the conversation. if you are a republican, (202) 784-8001. democrats, (202) 748-8000. s, (202) 748-8002. (202)n text us at 748-8003. i want to read you a quote from your book. goes:uote
do you still believe that today? we are the product of our life experience, our environment. from the time he came down the elevator as candidate donald trump, when he had the words about mexicans and mexican americans that upset so many people. he showed his colors. maya angelou said when someone tells you who they are, believe them.
what we have seen since then, we can go through a long list of examples from charlottesville to the children in cages at the examples, many other that is something that seems to be his message. host: you called the election of a political earthquake. guest: it was a perfect storm. the economic crisis, the aftermath of that. there was disaffection with both political parties. there were feelings about the candidates. . number of factors combined it's important to note that according to reporting, donald trump didn't think he was going
to win the election. he was surprised. the interesting thing is what happens going forward. i would contend that the population that became involved will remain activated and involved. so will other communities and demographics and constituencies. will it take the same form it's taking right now? i believe it will not. it would be foolish on the other hand to think this was just a chapter and we move on from it. everyone, we are all proud to be americans and all americans deserve to be respected. it would behoove anyone going forward to recognize political forces that are out there and speak to them in addition to other forces, not excluding some and unifying. host: you say that the
population that has been activated, they will continue to be activated. are we talking about people who voted for president trump? they didn't vote before? you expect them to continue to vote now? what is that population? guest: i don't see it as a monolith. all, different people do different things for different reasons. basically, a lot of people were republicans for decades and will be. that's not really who i'm referring to there. i'm referring to what donald trump sought, disaffected people who thought they were ignored by both democrats and republicans. that they got involved, will they stop being involved? i don't think so.
whether you are a democrat or republican, you need to be mindful that there are people who have these particular points of view or needs that need to be addressed. host: what impact do you see pitchfork populism having in the 2020 race? directly, whatou impact do you think it will have on the 2020 election? sure, the thing for need for unity and recognizing that we cast a wide net in the united states. that still doesn't mean you compromise values. it's possible to holger values while at the same -- hold your values while not excluding the concerns of other people. some of the people who were activated by donald trump have been calling for economic opportunity.
there is a need for more job skills training in the united states. for recognizing the economy has shifted from what has been a generation earlier. we do have to do more in terms of making sure people have a route toward prosperity. host: let's let some of our collars join in. let's go to albert who is calling from chicago. good morning. caller: good morning. i would argue that the pitchforks that are out today are not the result of populism, but the result of demagoguery. tru populism did not produce pitchforks, it produces hope and a feeling of what can be achieved when we come together.
that is my comment. that very much dovetails with my thought in terms of the national identity, individualism . on the -- it's very clear donald trump is on the individualism side of that and he is taken that to another level. being in the electorate, being a whatituent observing that, you are saying is part and parcel of that. individualism at one level is something -- i should say both individualism and collectivism are equally core elements of the american psyche and our history. when they go so far that it becomes transactional behavior and becomes consistent policy set forth and decisions are
based on the whim of the individual who holds the keys, that's when what you are saying can result. that can be problematic. to a caller in palm desert, california. i am pretty sure i butchered your name. go ahead. i am with the republican party. i came to this country when i was very young. aboutmy education political people. i don't like the socialists. that is very close to commonness. this is the best country on the whole planet.
i speak four languages. content with where we are now. i love this country. i love my american flag. i want president trump to finish the job. want outsiders, keepver really wanted to this. does with china and the middle east, i love the way he is working. guest: i think that's very important point about capitalism and socialism. it dovetails with the concept of
digitalism -- individualism and collectivism. capitalism and socialism have been intertwined historically, going back hundreds of years. for people who strongly articulate the views of capitalism, many of them are also receiving medicare or oficaid or are beneficiaries cooperatives for their technology services or are getting veterans benefits or disability benefits. all of this is finding the right yes on theween capitalism site we want to make sure people have the opportunity to fulfill their dreams in whatever way and at the same time we have a social safety net. that is part of the american community. host: david is calling from pennsylvania on the independent line. caller: thank you for taking my
call. him for thisnk essential book. mym sitting here with grandson. he is four months old. what is going to have the greatest impact on his life and his generation's life? guest: a combination of a number of things. this book was written out of patriotism. 2016, you we saw in could see in the united states there was a divide. throughple were going the stages of grief while others felt like they won a lottery ticket. it was a question of how we find a way to find some unity and
establish some understanding of what's going on and be able to keep everything together. of my roots, in the beginning, i put forth a number of principles which are my core principles. there is no such thing as anyone person being objective. we are all impacted by her own life experiences. i put forward what my guiding principles are in there. host: the book is called pitchfork populism. why open court -- why "pitchfork?" guest: i was sharing the concerns of the people who became activated. the manifestation of the concerns brought to mind when
you see certain rallies or epitaphs being thrown for people get nullified, it creates an image of the frankenstein movie, where you see people gathering with its forks and torches to storm the castle. that would be the image behind it. who iset's go to ann calling from maine. caller: i want to talk about ballot box populism. i want to talk about voter suppression. i would like to give a shout out to four directions, they empower native americans and helps them claim their voting rights. you can inspire, you can do all
of these wonderful things. you can register voters. at the end of the day, the republicans absolutely are lawless from county clerks up to the supreme court. they are disenfranchising americans. that's not only suppressing the vote of people who want to vote arere registered, people targeted and don't bother to register. when the head of the league of women voters, which is a nonpartisan group, has her own name stricken from the ballot republicans, we are in serious trouble. proceeds from the bulliesf the maga hat
at trump rallies to the head of this iseme court, disenfranchising voters and being lawless. it's a problem. there is a long ugly history in the united states of exclusion from voting of , thething from poll taxes jar of jelly beans from a long time ago. more recently, it's quite disturbing in contradiction of the voting rights act. there are a number of states that have passed restrictions. things like which id is acceptable, in texas you can show an acceptable form of id. card, but an unacceptable form was your student id.
those tools are being used. whenis administration, former attorney general jeff sessions was in control of the department of justice, they scaled back everything from their preclearance which went before the courts. that changed administratively and judicially. there have been a number of -- enforcement has been downscaled. everyone should be able to vote and encouraged to vote and it should be made as easy as possible for everyone to vote. host: steve is calling from bangor, maine. good morning. caller: this is a good discussion. you say pitchfork populism. i see it more like scorched-earth populism.
the democrats and republicans want to turn back anything the other side has enacted, that not just change it, eliminated, decimated. it, decimate it. betterlling to give up pay, better wages, health care in order to manifest my populism against democrats and liberal thought. i will live in poverty to support this president. is that something new? is that consistent? guest: i appreciate your insight on that. as i see it, things are become more contentious over the last
30 years. each action,at for there is a reaction. there has been a snowballing process. the thing we don't know is whether this established a new or fastcontentiousness forward and look back to this. will this be a transitional. when we try to aggregate what each other did? everything got ratcheted up so intensely that at a certain your point about the back and point -- fourth is clear. there is hope. host: let's take a question from our social media.
this comes from ralph in new jersey. the united states had been a leader in globalism. now we see populism here and in other countries. model post-world war ii outmoded? can we move back to greater international cooperation? the world is more intensely networked than ever before. that is a reality. years, we haveee pulled back from a lot of our engagements, checking out of ,rees, disparaging -- treaties disparaging our allies. it is partly a question of diploma. it's the reality of economics, travel, our lives are intertwined.
people have families in different countries. interdependence is very much inculcated throughout the world now. the fact that there has been this drawing back, that is not sustainable. host: bill is calling from new jersey on the independent line. good morning. caller: good morning. am i still on? host: go ahead. caller: i don't know about populism. i think one of the reasons why people vote for a person, he has common sense. le other side, they have a ack of common sense. they are talking about medicare for all. they are going to get rid of the
insurance companies. right now, i am on medicare. medicare plays -- pays 80%. if there is no private insurance, medicare pays 80%. if i have medicare for all, i have to pay the other 20%. if they are going to pay 100% for all, that will never happen. it's impossible. you wind up having doctors working for a lot less money under the present medicare and private insurance. they are talking about taxing the rich people. that,d of talking about if you want to do
something to get money from the rich people, make it so social security is taxed no matter how much you make. makinge big sportspeople $75 million a year. social security out of their money and their employer had to pay half, you would get money from the rich. taxing the wealthy is ridiculous. i appreciate your point about common sense. i believe it's very important when looking at the current political landscape, you look at it not in terms of policy, boil that down below that to values. what do you believe in?
what is right? that is the starting point. you were talking about health care. that discussion goes directly into health care. you get health care if you can pay for it? because you are human being, you have a right to health care. that's were values come in. will there be a public option that is popular? there are a lot of possibilities out there. in the case of medicare for all, you mentioned that in terms of instead of supplemental insurance, it would cover everything. as for the practicality of that, if the system were established where corporate contributions to health care, everything went
in some cases, the motive is more nefarious than just making money, reaching to deliberate deception of propaganda that poisons the well of popular prison -- popular opinion. that makes it sound like you are directly pointing a finger at social media. how is this affecting our political system? all, robert of mueller's report, that documents a lot of those practices. there is the good, the bad, the ugly with the evolution of media. on the good side, it's empowerment. people who didn't used to have a voice, the media was controlled by a few very wealthy people.
they held it themselves and controlled the message. today, that's different and that's a beautiful thing. anyone who wishes to become involved can become involved. host: the more voices the better. guest: the downside is there is no curator. are some things that are not fact-based. what i tried to do was put forth a number of recommendations to impose some degree of consumer protection in the media. that is needed. is that what we call fact checking? does that fill the role you are talking about? what is yourlso source? one of the things in particular are sources.
it's problematic when foreign sources are trying to manipulate the u.s. popular opinion. one of the suggestions i have art documenting sources and who in the united states would validate that. when you talk about u.s. politics, it needs to be based on what americans think. host: how do you maneuver around or make sure the first amendment doesn't get involved when you're trying to figure out who can say what and what should be believed? don't you run into problems? guest: there are liable and slander laws -- libel and slander laws. untrue,ngs are patently when it's a question of foreigners partnering with a disclosurea or
of sources. we can have transparency. host: let's go to peter who is calling from florida on the democratic line. good morning. caller: good morning. i am largely in agreement. mediaeally tired of the in general using the term "populist" in the way they use it to refer to donald trump. with texaseement hightower, he repeatedly asserts that true populism is anticorporate. movement that came about in this country at the turn of the 20 century by the -- 20th century against the rich and powerful, the railroad industry at that time. it is an asserts
anticorporate movement, the opposite of what trump is. trump has benefited corporations tremendously with tax cuts and other measures. about comforting the comfortable and afflicting the afflicted. he is not a populace. guest: i am very much in agreement. i consider him to be a faux populist. he is not a populist. normally, a populist empowers the people. he motivates the people to empower him. going back to your other point about anticorporate, the word itself means the people. it's all about the people. corporations
basically limiting the freedom and taking advantage of the people, everything you said is exactly my point. host: let's go to michael who is calling from tampa, florida. caller: good morning. kane. to say hello to mr. the last caller was interesting. blocksorn and raised 12 from the capitol in washington dc. i'd move to steinway boulevard. however, i don't think it's archie bunker on steinway boulevard. a guy growing up in new york, i think it's more frank sinatra is the image. that's the culture of new york. big business, wall street, all
of that. trump wants to run it like one big international corporation. populism, that's questionable. i just think he has some sympathy. americans whofor are the underdog. media has that the racist,about him being he would not have had a friend like don king. he would not have had that friend. host: go ahead and respond. guest: i appreciate your point about frank sinatra.
iis mostno doubt that he famous line is i did it my way. that is on point with donald trump. i hope he doesn't try to sing that. host: the next caller is from aurora, indiana. caller: we've got a complete mess. takeemocrats want to everything the working people work for. talked about how much money they want to take from the rich. these guys create jobs. america is under siege by the democrats. they are taken away all of our want to give us everything free, which will never happen. will never happen because god says the world would be destroyed by fire.
he has talked about people on the streets. everyhat we've got in country. i never thought i would see a day when our children wouldn't be safe at school. it's the people. guns don't kill you. it's the people behind the guns. democrats know nothing. they are stupid. host: go ahead and respond to that. guest: first of all, i believe in science. that the more we focus on the science of things like the climate crisis, the better off we will be. the consequences will only be worse the longer we put off the inevitable change in our
regulations and conduct so we can sustain things. the most important thing i hear in your comment is it's a generational difference. if you look at what we do for we be ok in 2020? when you look at the climate impact and the transition of jobs and the economy, it's about the next generation. what do you do for sustainable growth for the long-term future of america? if we don't adapt, we suffer. many people are talking about things that can be growing pains as we try to adapt to future circumstances. we need to spend more time in detail on that transition. host: we spend a lot of time talking about pitchfork populism
and the executive branch. just affect doesn't the executive branch. it affects the legislative and judicial branch. how are they affected? longer-term,ly for it time in the white house has a limit, whatever date that will be. the impact in congress can be longer. the interesting thing in the 2018 midterms, we saw what happens when a lot of americans who are upset about the pendulum, we saw the swing the other direction. there are still because of gerrymandering and where people are concentrated, there will be some people who believe in the
trump point of view who will remain in congress. there are certain districts where that point of view will continue to be aired. the bigger impact is in the judicial branch. with jeff sessions, when he left , he appointed 80 judges, federal judges. between cam and the new attorney general, we are well over dashcam and the new we are welleral, -- over 100. host: do you see the pitchfork
populism we've been talking about, we've seen movements come and go before. we saw the occupy wall street movement, the tea party movement, is this fading anytime soon? fading, in you say don't see it being the most prominent. i don't see it being as prominent as it is today. once again, these are americans. sauce fore secret politicians going forward is to recognize these are all issues and to adjust accordingly. jobsxample came up about and the economy. more has to be done that transition to be able to accommodate those dislocations for certain workers and help with job skills training. that's and it sample -- an
example of how it remains. to to john go calling from west virginia. good morning. caller: i hope everybody is good. i'm not in a very good mood. i'm really ashamed to be a democrat. i want to give california and new york a warning. you don't tell me what to do with west virginia. i've got a warning for nancy pelosi and all the democrats. i am never going to vote democrat again ever. they fixed it. they opened my eyes up. i'm not a socialist.
i am not a baby killer. i'm not voting to anybody close to that. i can't wait till the republicans take over congress. they don't do nothing except stall. think of how good this is doing right now. respond.ahead and guest: this ties into our previous discussion. it's important to accommodate where there is economic pain. when you go back to what robert byrd and jay rockefeller did for supporting they were innovations and transitions.
they were doing what they could to be able to make accommodations for west virginia's. i think we can achieve a balance. host: one of the things the caller brings up is a democrat in west virginia is not the same as a democrat in california. a republican in new york might not be the same as a republican in mississippi. those national parties represent a lot of diverse people. continue to be the same party when you have people in different parts of the country who believe in different things? guest: the democrats and republicans are a sickly -- basically big tents. they are coalitions. i believe it's a mistake to talk about them as monoliths.
there is a question of local issues. there are local needs and sensibilities. part of it is geographic and income-based. part of it is demographic-based. the more one pays attention to , you make sure that people are supported within different groups. that's how we are better off serving people. alan callingalk to from washington dc. timer: i have a hard believing that last caller was ever a democrat. i see that on c-span quite often. there are third rail issues that intrigue hasalace been subduing. i will give you one example. demandeding fathers
bankruptcy rights in the constitution. those protections have been stripped from student loans. there are 55 billion people with student loans. 30 million of them are headed for the fall. nobody hasissue handled in any way. if you want to talk about a sleeping populist giant, look at the student loan problem. donald trump had better get his arms around this. he used bankruptcy laws quite effectively. to him to turn a blind eye 55 billion people who are cosigners, that's a lot of voters. that. i appreciate i think you've touched on something emblematic with the administration. one of the biggest problems approach transactional
and his style of what he's doing appointees,rs his including his cabinet and down the line to also do things that don't necessarily respond to the people and don't respect regulations and laws. an example is student loans. when you look at what betsy devos has done in the department rulescation, there were thecourt orders in terms of case of the for-profit schools that went bankrupt, the department of education continued to collect student loan payments when they were not supposed to. your point is very well taken. that remains a big problem. there is a lot of attention paid to the burdens of student loans
and we see solutions. host: you talked about the 2016 primary. the debates were informative, not so much about the issues but about the dynamics that motivated the electorate. the efforts to appeal to those constituents. even as the debates provided car crash moments which were amazing, they illuminated the electorate's appetite. are you watching the debates this year? is there anything like that? thet: it's by no means same, but absolutely. you see based on what the candidates are saying, you can see who they are speaking to and what their concerns are.
you learn a lot about the united states of america with every opportunity. in 2016 a republican debate where they talk about health care. people shouted out from the audience that was not sympathetic. that is not something you would see at the democratic debate. there are other dynamics that come out. the more you watch, the more you learn. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak my own opinion. trump in 2016. i will vote for him again in 2020. i think he is a populist. for america first. there is nothing wrong with that. charity begins at home.
at immigration, you can see where he stands on those issues. he is not a racist. one of the previous speakers mentioned boater suppression. votergree with that is -- suppression. getting an id, showing a valid id to vote, i don't think there is anything wrong with that. i believe that is talked about. student can get -- if you go to get a drivers license, you will be asked if you want to register to vote. you can do that as well.
you can say you are a citizen. students showing up with student ids, that makes it very difficult to know who is who. host: go ahead and respond. guest: i believe it's very important to boil things down to values. values, ifld trump's they married with yours, i understand your point of view. when you talk about america isst, one of those areas branding and marketing. he does an outstanding job of branding. what does it mean? he looks at slogans and he will not define it. if it's a america first or drain others,p or plenty of these are branding slogans.
seeneeds to drill down and what is he doing about it? what does this translate to in my life? with regard to where donald racism, weon the will disagree. from guy is calling florida. --ler: host: i think we lost guy. good morning. caller: hello? host: you are on. go ahead. caller: i wanted to talk about america first. it's not just a donald trump slogan. if you listen to democrats, they
do not use that term. they say that. i am retired. i have medicare, i also have a supplement. i still pay for my medicine. someone thateside is not a u.s. citizen, can't even speak the language and they can have big bags of medicine and never pay a penny. worked all ofnd my life. afford my medicine when i get in the office. think that is upsetting a lot of people. for the people that think the border should be opened up, it can be opened up. all you have to do, we have laws for it.
sponsor and say i will this family for 10 years. i will be responsible for his medicine, for his or her living expenses. i will take care of them. whenund out what happens he offered to send these people to the states that wanted them. i would like to know what you think about that. is it right for america? i am 77 and i am still working. i am still paying taxes. how theu tell me democrats figure it's ok for an american not to be able to even though they're working to afford their medicine when they have to stand there and watch people that don't work?
guest: i am very sorry about your situation with your medication. that goes to the heart of something we discussed earlier about the social safety net. it is not serving you. have i hear you loud and clear. first, thatamerica was not defined by donald trump. us believe what we wanted to believe. i get your point. we should be first taking care of americans, and i believe that is something that we can all agree, but for example when you include the question of immigration, while americans are
compassionate people, we also -- our country was built by welcoming people. of course that is a shorthand, it is more complicated than that. i feel for you and our concerns. the secret for america first might be strengthening the social safety net. host: we would like to thank bradford kane author of " pitchfork ," live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. monday morning, we will preview the week ahead in washington. then, a member of president trump's reelection advisory board discusses the impeachment inquiry and campaign 2020.
be sure to watch "washington journal" monday morning. join the discussion. "washington journal" mugs are available on c-span's new online store. the washington journal mugs and see all of the c-span products. ♪ the house will be in order. >> for 40 years, c-span has provided america unfiltered coverage of congress, the white house, the supreme court, and public policy events from washington, d.c. and around the country so you can make up your mind. 1979, c-spanble in is brought to you by your local cable or satellite provider. c-span, your unfiltered view of government. house leaders paid tribute to
marilyn congressman elijah cummings, who died early thursday morning. memorial,r led the followed by speaker nancy pelosi and minority leader kevin mccarthy. this is 20 minutes. mr. hoyer: today, my colleagues, is a sad day. it is a sad day for us. it's a sad day for this institution. and it is a sad day for america. we have lost a wonderlyful human being. -- wonderful human being. a good and decent human being. a human being who made a difference. for this institution, for all of us who knew him, were his friend, for his constituents, and for all americans.