tv Conflict Zone Deutsche Welle March 16, 2019 5:30pm-6:00pm CET
find out. experience and explore the cultural heritage site. w world heritage place sixty. of the. populace politicians have made fresh gains in the european union this time in the stonier where a far right nationalist party more than doubled its vote in recent parliamentary elections my guest this week here in tallinn is martin helm a deputy leader of the conservative people's party of a stone despite calling for blacks to leave the country he insists he's not a racist what is he then.
welcome to comfort zone and happy to be here you almost doubled your support in recent elections and you did it by pressing on fears and trying to. enlarge people's fears about being replaced by a black so black invasion that's not true. not true what you just said first of all we almost tripled our affection in the parliament that almost doubled your seats from seven to nineteen and. we are not peddling on fear we are. another daily digitas people are being replaced with negroes that's for sure neither the chairman of the budget with immigrants with immigrants in the segments and i don't think so but it doesn't tell us very myself an opinion piece he wrote for power levels does it and doesn't
really even matter because doesn't matter words matter of that well the point being that we don't want to be replaced with foreigners who's replacing you last year we saw for two consecutive years we have seen a very large influx of ukrainians russians belorussians mainly through work visas but also illegally we have seen tripling of the. exaggerated the slavs comeon hold you no no no in july last year your party chairman told a stone in public broadcasting that twenty two thousand ukrainians were coming to his throne every year yes as the interior ministry pointed out in response to that claim the actual figure was around five thousand six hundred a year no doubt that. as the interior minister says we don't even know because this is the official and also the figure that is the official number but they don't even know how many people come in illegally and it is there you know no you know there
are no but but we have and so you exaggerate it almost for an hour but we have an estimate which says that we have and we have we can extrapolate numbers from workforce from tax offices we have a general number which is somewhere between twenty and thirty thousand in one ear and also another number we have seen disputed by the gov. it's the government. that is have access to the thirty percent of the vote is one of the big yes actually we do have access to statistics and we gathered that statistics from different sources. this is one of the privileges of being in parliament you can. write. questions to different ministers to different offices and ask to to sticks and you put the numbers together but also i want to give you a number we've been told that there is no immigration to a stone and no no sizeable immigration to estonia from the third world. well it's
it's small compared to let's say finland sweden germany but within two years we have had a tripling of nigerians in estonia let's look at the facts here with by march last year let's look at the immigrants have been allowed into a stone order to the e.u. quota so the governed by march last year the government had accepted two hundred and six migrants and that time and even eighty eight of them weren't even in the country so nasty much you had to cope with the massive figure of one hundred fourteen immigrants brought to you to see of the good list quota system so on the basis of these figures you claim indigenous astonied ends up being replaced by black people not just by bad as it turns out and as i said for there are two things we don't as a class but i'm just talking about the migrants well it doesn't make any difference to us this is a guy explosion and sorry this does not make any difference whether they are from
hugh crane or from nigeria it's a matter that they are not estonians and you exaggerating well if you. don't know we are not in the union to set a cap on my reasons are usually two arms of government is lying or not the government doesn't know what its doing but is approved most of the human easy to say government like government does and has admitted on numerous occasions that they don't even know how many people have come from ukraine over the past few years they just don't know and then they say but officer figure is here well sorry the official figure doesn't cut it but i wanted i wanted i want to stress an important issue isto the up together with latvia is a country in europe with the highest number of immigrant people we have once third time me. it's one third one third is not a stone yours now this is the backs you particularly noticeable. listen to no doubt
people said it in twenty thirteen if you're black go back and i want to stone me and to be a white country these were your words in turkey thirteen television talk show here . but we were roundly condemned by other politicians including the human rights group here in parliament but eighty percent of stern as. there was apologists own eighty percent of estonians agreed with that statement so take it as it is conveyed to present the statement you would have been you would have won the elections you don't win the elections you. did very well but i want to us about the status of this visit. and what. we will get to the racism issue but this was back when i wasn't a politician in an elected office i was a talking head in a commentator show you have a sense your views have you know exactly so what's the relevance of the know the
allowances that when you are being paid as a talking head you are allowed to say things out or actually you're expected to say things out in a more upfront say well obviously you want us to be a few of us black go back and that's the human rights group in parliament pointed out at the time a call to treat dark skinned people differently from others is an ambiguously racist view of what is racism in europe nowadays is the replacement of indigenous people that is pure racism and we don't have to agree to that you described in the interviews and we were on the grounds of the no i don't know we don't we send you on change your views if you're black go bad as i just explained to you there is no difference to us whether they come from ukraine or nigeria or from any other part of the world i wouldn't like a stoner to be replaced with swedes either i just don't want or i want estonia to be estonian and that is as simple as that and if people say that
a refusal to partition. hate in an ethnic. collective ethnic suicide is racism then that word has no meaning left a massive influx of immigrants you said would lead to pillaging and raping of a stone in town as it is migrants can i just ask the question how many migrants from shown themselves to be rapists and religious as you've suggested been way out what a bunch of outweighing were even with the tiny numbers that you just pointed out we have two cases of syrians in jail right now for trying to in light their wives so into so it's turned their bits to two you've tired that is that is what i show and raping and pillaging is one percent of the danger is wrong does it in ny do to know that there is a massive massive problem with criminality in sweden finland germany u.k. but also qualifications by what other figure that is brought in by immigrant must in only paint in their brushes what is what what are the figures what are the
percentages of migrants who are involved in drama i don't know of others i do but i don't have each of us rogers but in sweden in norway the rape ratios have gone up thousand fold that's not a phenomena thousands of old who says a grown up without the numbers figure out there is a norwegian statistic says to us your. painting strange facts i mean do you know do you just come out you pluck numbers out of thin air it's a big lie do you it's a bit old you know i pluck the figures from the government i give the guy you can trust their government oh wow ok so you know i'm just the girl you have your alternative facts or you don't have doesn't just like doesn't trump i don't trust i don't just think that you should trust the government there is a reason why opposition exists and that is to hold the government to the standard you are going the government to fit is what numbers you point that out to you are
like the trump playbook of. putting your own facts forward i lace based on like trump that's a specific speaking of donald trump your holding on to your hands for a billion dollars in military one but you know why why should we bother with you do you know the budget the united states. spends on military aid in one year tell me it's fifty one fifty two billion a year no it isn't that's another forty years and it's forty seven forty eight billion i checked that fact as you well know forty seven forty eight billion over the last forty years they spend a lot of money on the are there now it's not out of mind it's only fifty five it is fifty thousand billion by our account i don't know we don't you're doing your accounting then your accounting is wrong this is this us state department figures. this is the number that our military experts have told us this is the number that doesn't always necessarily leaves united states because they usually support their
allies. basically buying their own military equipment from their own military complex and then giving it to their allies or even more so by bit buying new military equipment to the united states army and giving the old one to the allies one show why surely doesn't have to leave united states why why should the us give you money when black american troops in the. back in twenty fifteen were racially abused on the streets of york not true not to go back to your grandparents and nigeria not this was the comment that was started and this was a fake news this has been proven to be a fake news total fake news yes so it was a fake news and it was fake news when you had madison one of your people said oh if they're worried about being. on the streets they should wear their uniform so this is not an mass not sampras's i know that's not big news that was
a comment taken out of context everything is taken have context is because the media is extraordinary hostile towards us so now you have the victims i know you know we can be turning up where our target was something that you said maybe it's a little bit we as a victory is this in there of disinflation county because if the fighters will never pick to fight us but fighting for their stone and people are you fighting for a stone in people by trolling and using false names for articles i mean one moment you're the victim of press heris minton press lies and now we discover that. you're setting up fake facebook accounts and trolling. there was a one that specificity is no no matter how little christina and i answered that there was one single particular case of one of our members sending an article an opinion article to
a left leaning newspaper which trashed our party and he wanted to prove that a left leaning newspaper would publish anything that trashes us without any regard who sends it or who it is and without know without any background checks and he was right any other trolling no one has any proof that we are doing any massive trolling what my mom had to do where you had to lie about it when it first came out the party did know about it the pi lied about they said not untrue the party was not informed about and they said it wasn't true here because we could have said we don't know. nothing so you lied about it no we didn't lie about it the ethics ombudsman to the istana public broadcaster called this fraudulent activity he said if any attempt is made to influence public opinion under a pseudonym this can be justified on the grounds of freedom of expression prove this fact public decision i will be on the agree with them but i know my business because people write on the pseudonyms all the time people write and all the time
doesn't make it. well if we all do it why we are singled out but where there is no proof and there is no real there is no real operation on our part to have a massive army of trolls what we do have is a very motivated and quite large. number of people in facebook who supports us wholeheartedly and do it under their own name in january you called on the police to do more to contain all the people who were attacking and threatening the whole party. do you think we shouldn't do think we shouldn't report and then try and warned you mind if i think that we're the ones who shouldn't report death threats and you warned you might take measures into your own hands what do you mean well for instance we have to we actually have had to hire bodyguards for top people in public events because we're not sure that the police
can handle it you've been associating with the so-called soldiers of odin not an immigrant group founded by man it was we have to have. yes well first of all what i want to say about soldiers over the and. this is not a group that this is a bogeyman for the left. they have done nothing wrong why should they be demonized but we have no official ties to the whatsoever they have appeared in the number of rallies attended by your party torchlight procession the markets this is a public where this is a public awareness why shouldn't they be their fair patriots walked in forces no human order no no we don't have to be sixteen the prime minister thought so he said in the republic of his stand there know and order is in force by this tony and police self-proclaimed gangs don't increase the stone in people's sense of security in any way rather the opposite well it was
a political debate where the prime minister and then prime minister was trying to score political points but again. something you would never know never was this is something that everyone does that's my point but demonizing patriotic people who are concerned very concerned about the public safety is it below a prime minister you demonize judges to demonize no i don't demonize as i tell you oh i do so don't see why we should use who do politics human who did that three talent circuit court judges women female judge should be fired should be fired absolutely wanted their heads to roll here that's an expression of this because the judges allowed a same sex marriage to be entered into the register a little it directly breaking a stone in law by doing that and you set out to threaten them i set the they sure were significantly and so threatened i said do these people are no judges they have broken the law and they have actually done something much worse they have wandered
into the territory of parliament and they should not be allowed to continue being judges you know as i said i don't throw democracy want more democracy i want to go around threatening people that you disagree with i want to through this through time reasons why you really think that. churches should be able to break laws and make laws that they like then we have a very different opinion what the democracy your blinds were condemned by the chief justice of the supreme court and the president both condemned your statement here you remove the march liberals you it doesn't matter does it doesn't but of course it does and it is so liberal that automatically wrong because they let you all know that magically bush ition they like the decision but their decision was a political decision judges should not be making laws this is breaking the separation of powers they are absolute they are a disgrace to the office and you didn't mind the fact they were women the world is
you you said i want a threat to be heard from this rostrum i want their heads to roll because it cannot be that some women this is very dismissive of women that some women come together and just change dystonia northwood you've reacted different judges have been men no problem i don't so you cannot show no the show i mean i would probably have used some other dismissive but my contempt towards those people is still the same the contempt was enlarged by the fact that there were women was no that's your opinion that's not that's. you just assume it. your face says something else you are i want to protest this i were married man i have four daughters not us that i have to do one thing on the other gotta do with only daughters i have two sisters i have utmost respect for women i have never haver
cheated women with anything but respect but i do not like when judges think laws into their own hand. you had a good election results matter how many but in the end it still wasn't as big as you wanted was it not as close you didn't you didn't win the election you overestimate your appeal i don't think we expected expected or ever expressed that we expected to win the elections even by scaring people people are scared anyway let's go look at the first week in january this year your father the party chairman warned of a dire international plots to the set of confederation of leaders we're aiming to turn the united nations into a world government by twenty thirty this is what dung trump stands against this is what we stand against this we do this is nonsense that someone who doesn't have a shred of evidence to show that you have to do not read the market treaty the markets treaty basically says that everything concerning gratian should be at the prerogative of the united states. and i do nations so this is love the government
by twenty thirty don't make any sense of well you know i'm dane don't make any secret of their desire to pull power to you know there are lots of people who do lots of things you said that of one of government by twenty third this is a baltic ferry oh no we are you know many of of us we are sovereign ists we are against any attempts to take away power from the nation states you talked about a plot there isn't a plot is that how do you know of how do you know how can you be sure of what you are the ones who talk about it so you chuck any old nonsense into the mix and expect people to believe it there's no plot you haven't won a shred of evidence for that do you have to defy everything i have been i think the entire history of the united nations shows you that they are bent on taking power so it's an intention. isn't the reason the patients matter don't or isn't the real
plans where they come from then in reality a stone millions don't seem to care much at all about your plots and conspiracies do the coding to canda more published in the most last november the top fear among almost twenty percent of those polled was that radicals in populists come to power in one second and the third fear was i'm talking about this and you know what our second try says one is those who cared about mass immigration twice and the second was immediately. right third third ok but the first close said state of the facts and right i can't remember any poll that was done in november but the point is that immigration was all also in top of those concerns who don't share your views about a lot of things the e.u. for instance you know views about the e.u. . conducted showed that a massive seventy five percent of the stone ians agree that the showing an area has
more value to some disadvantages for your maybes are you making a simple mistake we don't go by the polls we do what we do because we believe in it . and we mobilize enough people to support our course and we don't care who is against us what matters is what the support for us is of course when we get twenty percent there are eighty percent who don't vote for us but that's the logic of every party the one who just won the parliamentary election after seventy percent of the seventy something percent is against. you're out of touch with the mainstream then aren't you we are the mainstream and we don't really we are the industry minister of our king of the e.u. accused of using years of becoming totalitarian hasn't it hasn't it why do people like personally most people don't like european union that all look modeled on love really seventy one percent were very or fairly optimistic about the united surge. under sixty six percent agreed the e.u.
was a place of stability in the troubled world that sounds very much as though they like and who who commissioned that poll you're a barometer exactly yeah those are not only negative there's a lot of negative unionised as like us and there they do like us there is a consistently also nothing was i wrong no no no but you get on there are those who watch you why do you question your economic figures. not there's no doubt about them or the twenty seventeen. member of the european union your g.d.p. grew by a massive four point nine percent that's a good result inside the e.u. . but inside the e.u. has been good for your economy not a question as of course it hasn't i mean really the point nine percent growth in g.d.p. isn't a good result that you didn't notice to twenty percent drop during the two thousand and nine and ten twenty percent. and what you think out of other countries doesn't
but now does it now and your opinion has no business when you have to hark back to the g.d.p. growth this european union this fall prevented france it's european union has nothing to do with one of the fastest growing we can't have it all of the way in you're going to have your harking back to figures ten years ago here but ten years where you are in the middle of a class where the recession i saw two thousand and seven there was a very good global year for growth as well i mean you can't have it both ways we were in your opinion in ten years ago and we were we were a country the most with the most horrid loss of g.d.p. everybody lost yeah but they lost most everybody we were the we were the worst in the indian people. but let's bring in economics to say you really want to say there is a. european union is stable in your mind so they're saying we we see a different world you say it's like the soviet union exactly which is exciting to those countries know was included here that lived i saw him to refresh to happen to
remember the soviet union and i had some particular smiles and says no it isn't who haven't lived under the soviet rule might not recognize the trends but the trends are unmistakable marjon oppression that characterized the soviet union did not we do not know if you really wanted to murder in the pen. nudity pin because she was saying the wrong things in public this is precisely what happened this is going to. come to her house the house. is the same and the handsomest the. exactly did you do have you not noticed the people have been put into prison prison in your opinion or for hate speech this is censorship this is the same as it was in the old i was the one who argued with us our wars in the countries marked and how it's been good to have your. i.q. time's up.
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