tv After the Bell FOX Business April 4, 2016 4:00pm-5:01pm EDT
ones really cheap. david: great to see you, ross gerber. >> great to see you. liz: second day of the quarter. [closing bell rings] lifetime highs, vodafone, travelers, mcdonald's. david and melissa are here after the bell. melissa: stocks sinking into the close. i'm melissa francis. david: and i'm david asman. and this is "after the bell," at this hour, less than 24 hours away from voting in wisconsin, a state that could play a huge role in the fault turf campaigns both for democrats and republicans. three out of the five candidates making a big push on final day where every vote is crucial. new wisconsin poll showing donald trump is gaining on ted cruz. while hillary clinton and john kasich focus on on the big fight for the big apple, clinton aiming to stop person bierne recent winning streak.
trying to shore up early support in the state of new york. melissa: it is the final day of campaigning before voters head to the polls in wisconsin. donald trump just wrapping up his second rally of the day. the done and will hold another event late they are evening as he tries to woo voters in the badger state. fox business's blake burman in madison with the latest. how is the final push going for him, blake? reporter: this is when it is nice to have the private plane, melissa. donald trump just finished up in the far northwest corner of the state. a five-hour drive from where we are in madison. the northern and western part of the state is expected to be huge for donald trump should he eventually carry wisconsin across the finish line for himself tomorrow. he did fire a shot though, a little bit of a warning to the gop and its leader reince priebus just moments ago, talking about if trump if he is not treated fairly he is keeping his eyes on things especially after the meeting last week in washington d.c. here is trump
moments ago. >> somebody said he is a nice man? i said yes. are they going to treat you fairly? i have no idea, but i will let you know in six months but my eyes are wide open, all right? and i'm representing a tremendous number of people and we are not going to be taken advantage of by people. reporter: meanwhile ted cruz here in madison the state capital earlier today. was talking about a potential brokered convention as well. that is of course if nobody is able to secure the necessary 1237 delegates and he says he feels if it gets to that point the nominee would either be himself or donald trump and no one else. here was cruz. >> this fevered pipe-dream of washington, that at the convention they will parachute in some white knight who will save the washington establishment, it is nothing less than a pipe-dream. it ain't going to happen. if it did, the people would
quite rightly revolt. reporter: of course both campaigns are trying to avoid that at all costs. 42 delegates are in play here in wisconsin. tomorrow, david and medical mely things shake out, most likely whoever wins wisconsin will get all or most of those 42. as for john kasich he picked up and left town. he was campaigning in new york earlier today. back to you. melissa: interesting stuff. down to the wire. blake, thank you so much. david? david: so donald trump, he is still behind cruz in wisconsin, could he win the nomination even without winning wisconsin? he thinks he can. here he is with greta. >> if you doesn't win wisconsin can you get to 127 delegates? >> yes i think i can because the polls came out in new york where they really know me best. nice think about it, you saw the new york polls, i'm through the roof. people know me best are giving me fantastic -- they deal with me. they had to live with me
unfortunately for them. david: polls tighten ad bit in wisconsin but cruz is steadily ahead since trump began attacking governor scott walker and conservative agenda in the state. what happens if he loses tomorrow? david drucker, washington examiner, senior correspondent. great to see you. could trump lose wisconsin and still get the 1237 delegates before the convention? >> he could but i think it gets exceedingly difficult for him. it is true, he will win new york and win it sizeably, but if you look how delegates are laid out between now and june, there is a good chance he misses it. cruz winning wisconsin is not just important for delegates but important for momentum. where the voter psychology does not become trump the inevitable but trump the candidate competing with ted cruz for the nomination. david: if it goes to the convention, he is setting up, he has a staff developing working up a team to win even if contested thing.
even cruz, you mentioned in a piece today cruz is working very hard to get some arizona delegates if it goes to second or third ballots? >> that's correct. and it's true trump is putting together a team of experienced republicans that have done this before and that are going to try to help him navigate these delicate elections. what a lot of people don't understand you win delegates on first, second or maybe even third ballot in event of contested convention, where they're bound and forced to vote for winner of their primary or caucus but after that they can vote for whomever they want. what ted cruz and his grassroots organization have been very good at working delegate elections to get delegates placed loyal to him. that is what gives him a leg up in potential contested convention. david: david, i understand the kasich left the state. he is going back to new york now but i was really kind of shocked to see a one-on-one -- when kasich is put against hillary
clinton, in wisconsin, he is by far the winner and does much better than any other republican candidate. is that significant? >> well, i think it is an interesting hypothetical. and john kasich has consistently been the republican, at least the republican left in the race that does the best in potential general election matchups. i think one caveat though i would put to that, nobody really attacked john kasich. nobody tried to go after hits positive approvals to bring him down where ted cruz, donald trump, some. candidates that since exited race, had a ton of advertising put against them. so i would take that with a little bit of a grain of salt even though he is theoretically a strong candidate in november. david: trump has not let the guns fly in hillary's direction as yet. he is too focused on republican nomination. david, good to see you, appreciate it. >> same here. melissa: change of tone for donald trump? the republican presidential candidate hurling insults at his opponents throughout the race but is he planning on dialing it
down a bit? >> and i said, my tone is going to change as soon as i finish victory. i have two left. we had 17. now we have two left. yes, tone to me matters. being presidential matters. melissa: here to weigh in howard kurtz, fox news media analyst and "mediabuzz" host. when you watch that bite, what do you think? >> i think i heard this from donald trump a number of times including in interviews with me. he trying to make a pivot to disciplined, restrained candidate, somebody gets under his skin, he can't help himself, he retreats i have to beat everybody first and then i can be more presidential. melissa: do you think he thinks he would need to do that now? it has been a difficult week. a lot have made the idea that he alienated too many women and he needs to do something like, what if now was the time he sat down and was a softer donald with say, megyn kelly?
>> sure. megyn already said she would be happy to have him on the show. when you go back two or three weeks attacking megyn kelly, attacking, retweeted that picture of senator cruz's wife heidi was a mistake a word he almost never uses. thpivot may have started couple weeks ago but it's a long campaign. the question if he tones it down does he lose the thing got him here, which is his ability to poke the i eye of media establishment, political establishment and his rivals. melissa: i think somebody is calling you there to give you magic word. >> sorry about that. melissa: that's okay. it happens to everybody. is it possible to thread the needle? seems like now in wisconsin he is falling behind and maybe he is pushed it a step too far. if ever he was going to try to unveil the softer donald, this might be the time. in your expert opinion is there a way for him to dial it back just enough he doesn't lose what
got him here in the first place? >> yeah. i think there actually is. trump has shown himself capable of being restrained in some debates, in the sub assistant stiff to aipac and foreign policy reviews to "washington times" and "washington post." have been picked apart. memo i think was leaked on eve of wisconsin, the media are horrible and pathetic attacking him. he had a bad week mostly because of self-inflicted mistakes including those shifting answers on abores. so this is really pivot point with wisconsin up tomorrow and whether or not trump can repair his image with women who don't like him or are turned off by his style. melissa: it is interesting. feels like we're at turning point for him one way or the other with this particular primary. howard, call back, whoever that person is. tell him you were doing something very important. >> i will.
david: they should know. they should know. group of more than 100 media organizations publishing results of massive leak of million 1/2 documents about the world's most powerful sovereign leaders and offshore cash stashing and tricky final dealings. jo ling kent with the story that is makes a lot of waves around the world. reporter: the justice department investigating a 11 1/2 million documents leaked in anonymous dump leaking offshore accounts of rich and powerful. international consortium of investigative journalists they go back from 40 years from a panamanian law firm known for helping create shell companies for their money. they allegedly reveal current and former off who are shoulders of 100 government officials and politicians around the world. one part after document details in $2 billion in transactions launderedded through banks and shadow companies by associates and friends of russian government vladmir putin. russian government said the
documents are targeting putin and upcoming elections, not offshore activity. chinese president's xi jinping's brother setting off -- and that will not help the campaign. soccer star line nil messy, that they owned a megastars enterprises shell company to evade taxes. bleacher report says messy is suing. david cameron's late fare create ad holding company and allegedly amassed a fortune in protected account. asked whether the british prime minister's family had the offshore money. cameron's spokeswoman said it's a private matter. white house is aware not commenting. french president hollande commending the leak. it will help france track down people who evaded taxes. david: jo ling kent, thank you very much. melissa. melissa: europe on high alert after new disturbing details
emerged on an isis sleeper cell. this is according to "the wall street journal." at least 22 isis fighters are still on the loose in europe with apparent ties to the same terrorists behind the attacks in paris and in brussels. david: meanwhile still overseas, the first wave of depo has bee gun as part of a controversial european union plan to curb flow of refugees many coulding into europe. greece is now saying 200 men, women and children back to turkey on ferries but a total of 50,000 migrants and refugees are still stranded in greece after the e.u. and balkan border closures. only those who arrived after march 20th will be detained for deportation. melissa: the u.s. navy stopping a massive iranian arms shipment that included thousands of weapons including ak-47s, rocket propelled grenade launchers. we'll tell you where it was going and who it was for. david: the war of words is heating up between bernie sanders and hillary clinton.
sanders winning five of the last six states. can this momentum propel them through wisconsin to new york and beyond? >> don't tell her this but i think if we win here, win in new york state, we're on our way to the white house. melissa: wow, another deadly crash for amtrak. the rail line get as billion dollars from the government. some say that is not enough. steve forbes was on board this weekend's train when it crashed in pennsylvania. >> you felt a sudden halt. it was like somebody in a car hitting the brakes and easing up and hitting the brakes. within a matter of seconds, it came to screeching halt. coffee was in the air. cups are flying.
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the sanders campaign accusing clinton of dodging a debate in both candidate's home state of new york. >> we offered dates which they refused. you offered gma, offered a debate during gma on friday the 15th. i'll be there. >> one of the debates propose was the night of the ncaa finals. didn't make sense to me. melissa: that is classic. fox news's ed henry is here with the latest on campaign trail. david: that is true. one of the clinton's option do it tonight. and you've got how many millions of people will be watching -- people are not watching fox business of course are going to be watching this big basketball game. it brings to mind where we started this campaign where hillary clinton was having debates, dnc saturday before christmas. i was at that debate. everyone else is in church or a mall, somewhere not watching a debate. melissa: right. >> this gets back to the question do they want people to pay attention to the democratic
primary battle or not. to do it on "good morning america," george stephanopoulos, i know him well, got in trouble with donations to the clinton foundation. not sure bernie sanders would like that. i don't mean to make light. it is kind of bizarre. melissa: right. >> just broke a few minutes ago. hillary clinton raised $29.5 million in the month of march. why is that significant? bernie sanders raised $44 million. she saw "the wall street journal," this is phenomenon where someone losing among delegates, looks likes he is done and she is wrapping it up, looks like she is raising more money, suggests the money, enthusiasm is with sanders but she has the delegates. >> is amazing because the news keeps saying this isn't a real race. this is a fake race on the democratic side because she has all the superdelegates wrapped up. >> right. melissa: she raises so much more money, idea of a morning debate, kind of a funny idea, at first-hand sounds like throw away, would be totally different audience than anybody --
>> did you but you don't have a crowd i assume. is it in the studio. melissa: people don't get up early. >> are they watching debate or getting kids ready to go to school or to eight 7:00, 8:00 in the morning. some of that is bizarre. here is bottom line. bernie sanders desperately wants a debate a slip-up, something that will shake up the race a little more. he is this close but he can't quite get the math to work. if there is a one more debate, hillary clinton slips up on wall street maybe he has a shot, but she has the math. melissa: he didn't take aadvantage of the debates. i didn't want to hear about your email scandal. he didn't take advantage of that. >> he missed golden opportunity. "new york times" has a big outtake with the sanders camp. people inside the campaign are saying number one, sanders himself screwed up last year in 2015 not campaigning enough. he might have won iowa and some other close states. they also say, they always deny this publicly but in private maybe they messed up not going after email issue.
it is not about emails. it is about trust. melissa: he said it is issues oriented. it is an issue. ed henry, great to have you in studio. david? david: donald trump is making the bold prediction about the economy but it is nothing to celebrate. take a listen. >> what i said is we're going into a massive recession. buff i also say if i'm president that is not going to happen because i'm going to straighten things out before it happens. david: coming up, harry dent and moody's chief economist john lonski take different sides on trump's warning. you want to hear that. jeff bezos blue origin rocket sticking another landing and sticking it to elon musk. more on that coming up. at ally bank, no branches equals great rates. it's a fact.
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recent weeks indicating iranians are pouring more funds into their military ventures now that they can sell more of their oil thanks to lifting of sanctions under nuclear deal. iranians are selling more than 2 million barrels of oil a day and buying a lot of weapons with the money. joining me fox news military analyst, general jack keane. general, good to see you. yemen is kind after proxy fight where iranians are on the died of the rebels and saudis on the side of the government. i guess we're on the saudi side, right? >> absolutely this is pattern of behavior iranians followed since the islamic state of iran was formed in 1980. they use their proxies to conduct terrorism and also to be fighters, to overthrow regimes. they did it successfully in lebanon. they supporting the assad regime in syria. they are supporting their own interests in iraq using proxieses of iraqi shia militia.
now in yemen we see them using houthis. this has been a successful campaign for them for 35 years. they are taking the gloves off. they are bit again. david: are we in danger of getting sucked into a proxy war? this is the third shipment we've seized. >> we're doing absolutely right thing here. kudos to the navy and intelligence system, i'm certain helping to feed them, central intelligence agency, et cetera. clearly stop arming their proxy is big deal. we clearly want yemen to stablize. we were forced to retreat from yemen, david. we had a special operations base there we were conducting operations against isis and against the al qaeda. we had to close our embassy and close our military base and leave. now we want this government returned to power and stablize it. but listen, the message here the nuclear deal was struck in july of last year.
since that time the iranians have taken their gloves off. they have returned to their previous behavior and their behavior is, strategic goal they stated since 1980. that is to dominate and control the region. go ahead. david: i was going to say, irony is that the nuclear deal we signed on to, gave them a lot more money to play with. some of that is clearly being used here. i just want to ask you to respond to one thing because we had general mike flynn on, bret baier did on a show we did friday. he said something pretty provocative about our commander-in-chief. i want to play that sound and get your reaction. go ahead and play the sound. >> i think he sees the military actually something that is more dangerous to the world. i think he looks at us, i actually do, i think he looks at the united states military and sees it as threatening application around the world than actually as a useful tool. david: now that is pretty
provocative statement, general. do you agree or disagree? >> yeah i agree in part. i think the obama doctrine, if you want to call it that, he has looked at the role of the united states differently than any president we've had since world war ii, whether democrat or republican. he does not see, that the united states should be operating in a world to assist and lead global security and global stability and help also to create economic prosperity. the military is part of that. but his overall strategic policy is one to pull the united states back from its traditional leadership role in the world. that is truly what has happened the last several years. david: general jack keane, thank you very much. appreciate it. >> good talking to you, david. melissa: another really troubling story that we're watching, united nations under fire. this as an american-based advocacy group says 98 girls in central african republic have reported that they were sexually abused by international
peacekeepers. a u.n. spokesman says the team has been sent to the region to gather more information about the allegations. wow. david: that happened before. we have to watch that one. calling on kasich to get out of the race, that is what ted cruz and donald trump has been doing pressuring him to throw in the towel but the ohio governor standing tall. the feud between the two candidates coming next. >> rules are the rules. if you want to win, win at the ballot box. melissa: plus golden state workers are getting a raise but critics are concerned it will hurt small business. details on this coming up. "$7.9" [ beep ] but you'll be glad to see it here. fidelity -- where smarter investors will always be. if only the signs were as obvious when you trade. fidelity's active trader pro can help you find smarter entry and exit points and can help protect your potential profits.
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melissa: ted cruz is joining trump's claim that positive john kasich is taking away their votes by staying in the race but kasich is tuning them out. >> i'm dropping in. i'm not dropping out. why would i get out when i'm the only person, number one who beats hillary in the fall? they just did a oral in wisconsin, i'm up 14 points on hillary in wisconsin and i'm going to lose in wisconsin. melissa: the ohio governor is hoping to appear on ballot at possible contested convention but competitors say the odds are not on his side. fred barnes, "weekly standard" editor and fox news contributor. great to see you. i love how everyone think's
john kasich's votes are theirs. everyone foes if only he would get out i would have a clear shot. what is your take? >> i think trump has a better case. kasich vote is moderates and independent, not hardcore conservative vote. so they would be more likely to go to trump but at least some of them, maybe a majority could go to trump and some to cruz. trump has gone to the republican national chairman and said you need to order kasich out. well, it doesn't work that way. kasich can stay in as long as he wants. he is not going to be on the ballot in the first vote because he won't have, unless they change the rules. right now it says you have to win eight contests, caucuses or primaries in order to be on the ballot in the first vote for the nominee at the convention. he won't be there. he is hoping that, as he said, that something magical will happen. melissa: yeah. it would literally have to be magical at this point because it is so unusual that we would see someone staying in, almost as a
spoiler because he is, you know, has to win more than 100% of what's left in order to win. go ahead. >> i don't think it is fair to call him a spoiler. he is not really in there for that purpose. melissa: okay. >> he is in there because he thinks that magic happens when the convention opens. i've been to all the conventions since 1976 and including 1976. i have never seen magic happen. this could be the first time but i haven't seen it yet and i don't think it will happen when we get to cleveland in july either. melissa: so what do you think is going to happen? you bring up how many you have been to. it does seem like we're ahead heading towards a very unusual one. what do you think is going to happen? >> i think donald trump will be a little short of the majority of the delegates and he will begin negotiating before the convention starts. he will see other people mo have delegates.
marco rubio will have delegates and in particular. there will be talks and negotiations. trump says he is the greatest negotiator in the world. we'll find out how good of a political negotiator he is. he is obviously a good negotiator in real estate deals. and so that will be the first effort. he will try, he will be close and he will try to get, negotiate with somebody and get more delegates and win on first ballot. melissa: fred it, will be interesting to imagine what he could possibly offer. he and marco rubio did not part ways on best terms this time at all. you would think it would be worth it to marco rubio to thwart trump almost at every turn, except, i mean there is always an opening with everyone. what cooffer him? >> the vice-presidency? how is that? that is certainly big thing. i would think he wants somebody who is younger even though little marco. and somebody, with a much broader appeal to hispanics and so on. there is always that. i don't know whether trump at
this point since he does his campaign, makes his decisions day by day whether even thought about what negotiations might be like but there is plenty you can offer if you're odds on to be the republican presidential nominee. that gives you a lot of power. >> interesting times for us, fred barnes. thank you for coming on. we appreciate it. >> i enjoyed it. david: the day before the crucial wisconsin primary, where's hillary? she is in new york. in fact she has only been in wisconsin a day or two in the past six. has she conceded the state of wisconsin to bernie focusing on new york? more let's go to democratic strategist, former aid to senator chuck schumer, he knows a few things about new york, chris hahn. >> great to see you david. david: why is hillary even in wisconsin today? >> looks like the polls in wisconsin will have bernie winning it but very small victory for bernie, right? they will basically split the delegates in wisconsin but she can really put him away in
new york if she focuses her efforts here and comes out with a strong win in new york. remember, wisconsin is open primary where people of independent and other parties can vote in the democratic party, same as republican party primary. in new york it is a closed primary. bernie has shown no ability to win closed primaries. david: bernie says there is something called momentum. that he will pick up momentum in wisconsin, particularly if he wins it big and that will carry him to a win in new york city. take a listen to what he says. >> if there is a large voter turnout we will win here. if we win here we'll have a bounce going into new york state where i think we can win. if we win in new york city state between you and me, i don't want to get hillary clinton more nervous than she already is. [laughter]. she is already under a lot of pressure. david: and remember, again, new york i understand is the prize, but if he gets wisconsin big, more money will come in and as we've seen, hillary got
29 million in the last month, in the month of march which is great but bernie got 45 million. >> yeah. david: that is a huge beat of hillary. >> yeah. money is not going to be bernie's problem. bernie raises money on line in very small chunks. never going to be his problem. won't be her problem either. his big problem in new york there is a strong democratic organization in new york and hillary clinton was part of that organization for many, many years. and a lot of people part of that organization remember her terms in the senate very fondly. she was a very good, very active senator from new york. worked across the state of new york. i don't see an avenue tore him to win. david: just, chris, think for a moment, how could bernie win new york. >> i don't think he can but if he could win, hypothetically, david, reach out, had a plan, attracted some far left people of the party. the problem the far left people of the party here in the state of new york, they like hillary clinton.
i don't -- he didn't come close to beating andrew cuomo in the party. i think that bernie sanders ceiling may be a little higher than she did. david: chris hahn knows new york well. chris, thank you very much. appreciate it. >> thank you. david: melissa. melissa: meanwhile as hillary clinton continues to campaign the questions about her email server still loom large. clinton says she is cost that the fbi will find no wrongdoing as they investigate the use of a private e-mail server during her time as secretary of state. >> has the fbi reached out to you yet for an interview. >> no, no they haven't. back in august we made clear that i'm happy to answer any questions that anybody might have and i stand by that. >> are you concerned this isn't going to wrap up before the convention? >> no, i'm not because i don't think anything inappropriate was done and so, i have to let them decide how to resolve their security inquiry but i'm not at all worried about it.
melissa: she's not worried. state department says it will suspend its own internal review whether clinton had mishandled classified information, in consultation with the fbi. so there. david: meanwhile history in the making today in california. governor jerry brown signing legislation to make the golden state the first-in-the-nation to raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour. fox news's jonathan hunt is in l.a. with the latest. reporter: the most popular state in the nation is now the official leader in the ongoing battle over the minimum wage. the first to lay out a definitive plan for moving to $15 an hour. now that rate won't actually be reached until 2022, with incremental increases in beginning in 2017 with a 50-cent hike from the current level of $10 an hour. as he signed the plan into law governor jerry brown said it was simply the right thing to do. >> it's a matter of economic justice. it makes sense and will help our
entire state do much better for its citizens. reporter: nearly one in three california workers, some five 1/2 million, will be affected by increase but critics worry about pressure it will put on small business. california chamber of commerce and the state's restaurant association both warned increases are too much too fast. and critics say it could be devastating for small businesses in particular. >> you may have a situation where you raise this rate, where everybody has to make a minimum rate of $15 an hour, then all of sudden businesses laying off people and there are significant job losses. instead of having two people for $15 an hour, you have one person for 15 and the other person loses his job. reporter: critics doesn't take into account wide economic disparities across a state as large of california. it is now law. $15 is on the way. supporters hope other states will follow california's lead. back to you.
david: thanks, jonathan. 2.9%. that is the profit margin of most of these small franchise restaurants and burger king. 2.9%. if you double the salary, they lose their profit margin entirely. they go out of business. melissa: they either cut back hours or raise prices. david: it will be interesting. melissa: former al qaeda explosive experts released from guantanamo bay despite the risks they could return to the battlefield. plus a deadly train derailment. new questions why these accidents keep happening despite billions of dollars of federal funding. >> we got off track. there was big explosion. there was a fire. the window burst out and some people were cut up.
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amtrak is getting enough federal funding of course. fox news's doug mckelway has the latest. reporter: good afternoon. occurring less than a year after, not far from that devastating amtrak derailment that killed eight last year, yesterday' crash is not going to engender confidence in amtrak safety improvements. work vehicles repairing track are supposed to be intensely supervised and regulated. no train is allowed to operate on tracks that are underactive repair. in fact the "the philadelphia enquirer" septa, a commuter rail line which leases some amtrak rails was alerted to track work being done in that area but was told it would not interfere with trains. we now know that was wrong. ntsb investigators are trying to find out why. >> as of now we have recovered the event data recorder, the forward facing video and inward facing video from the locomotive to send to the laboratory in washington, d.c. most of our team has arrived on scene and we
will be looking at mechanical, operations, signal, track, human performance and survival fracktores. reporter: in the aftermath of last year's crash there was great emphasis put on what is called ptc, positive train control. a three-part system of sensors in trains on rails and dispatch office which can override human error to slow or stop a train. ptc is also supposed to incorporate work vehicles. late last year, amtrak announced ptc was in operation throughout the northeast corridor but it did not stop this crash for whatever reason. ntsb investigators could be months ironing this one out. back to you in new york. melissa: doug mckelway, thank you for that. david: all they need is more money, more federal money. melissa: always. david: we are learning more from detainees just released from gaun town prison.
two of al qaeda's explosive experts were transferred to senegal. they are believed to fought coalition forces in tora bora in afghanistan. remember that? there are now just 89 prisoners remaining at gitmo. melissa. melissa: walt disney company says thomas stags will leave the current position as chief operating officer. effective may 6th, he will remain employed by disney aspects advisor to the ceo who is of course bog iger through this fiscal year, with about two years left before eiger steps down, disney board will broaden scope of the progress. david: predicting a massive recession, why donald trump claims he is the economy's only hope. >> it is going to be a mess. you can not continue to lose the kind of billions and billions of dollars on every single thing we do.
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>> what i said we're headed for a massive recession but i also say if i'm president that is not going to happen because i'm going to straighten things out before it happens. it is going to be a mess. david: mainstream economists have been slamming donald trump for suggesting that we're heading for deep recession but those economists have been proven wrong in the past so could most of them be wrong again? and donald right? joining me, harry dent, author of the demographic cliff. john lonski, moody's chief economist. harry, who is right, donald or the so-called experts? >> donald is right on this one. we're in a bubble. one peaked in 2000, 2007, and now looks like 2015.
uptrend lines are broken which almost always means curtains. where i disagree with donald this, will happen so fast like 2008 he will not be able to change ahead of it. the primary causes are more this overstimulation than just, you know, losing jobs to china or something. david: john, let's give it to the experts because they have failed on numerous occasions. they failed to judge the subprime mess properly. they said interest rates couple years ago were going down. everyone of them said that everyone of them was wrong. so who is right on this one? >> what bubble? this has been the dullest economic recovery since the second world war. we haven't had the opportunity -- david: economically speaking but he is talking about the market i think for now. >> stock market. market is overvalued -- >> since late 1990s, than it is today. it is somewhat overvalued today. i don't think it is dangerously
overvalu. we have low interest rates for a purpose, that is because growth is so slow. one of the reasons we have growth so slow and will remain on downside because of depth graphic change. david: harry would agree with you. >> that we agree on. david: harry, i want to ask about donald's solutions. his tax plan is pretty good in terms of lowering a lot of tax rates, lowering number of tax rates we have. certainly lowering the corporate rate, trying to bring back that capital, you don't think that would be enough to prevent a recession. >> corporate rates makes sense but republicans tend to think, at certain times it's right, if we lower taxes companies will borrow more and consumers spend more. that is not true. consumers overborrowed in the bubble boom. companies overexpanded in the bubble room. countries like china overexpanded beyond imagination. we have excess capacity, excess debt. cutting taxes not the right thing. cutting costs and hunkering down
for this. investors need to get out of high-risk invests like stocks. they are overvalued, mark my words. david: john, there is so much capital overseas. there is $2 trillion overseas. if that money was put to work in direct investments wouldn't that be tremendous boom for the economy. >> it would but i'm not sure that will take place. demand isn't there. we need to develop new products so we can create new needs among consumers. that would perhaps provide a rational for bringing this money overseas home. one thing not to be overlooked however, is that these vast hoards of cash held outside of the united states serve as a type of safety net for u.s. corporations. they lessen the risk of some bursting of a credit bubble. david: would still be nice to have it here. final question, i just have 10 seconds. what is going to go down first, the stock market or the economy? >> stock market almost always leads the economy. david: okay.
harry and john, great debate. thank you very much. melissa? melissa: one small step for jeff bezos. one giant leap for mankind? blue origin attempting to get a leg up in the space race. we'll give you all the details. e*trade is all about seizing opportunity. so i'm going to take this opportunity to go off script. so if i wanna go to jersey and check out shotsy tuccerelli's portfolio, what's it to you? or i'm a scottish mason whose assets are made of stone like me heart. papa! you're no son of mine! or perhaps it's time to seize the day. don't just see opportunity, seize it! (applause) these little guys? they represent blood cells. seize it! and if you have afib - an irregular heartbeat that may put you at five times greater risk of stroke - they can pool together in the heart,
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melissa: jeff bezos taking a big step forward in the space race. watch this. his company, blue origin successfully landing his rocket for the third time over the weekend. that is amazing. david: the company claims it reached a new high altitude of 340,000 feet. during the flight it took a quick restart, mere 1000 meters above the ground meantime. you know who is jealous as hell about this. melissa: elon musk? david: mr. elon musk who has
been trying desperately to nail these landings out in the water and failing terribly. i guess he is getting better about the failures. melissa: this is the close, the key to reasonable rockets. that is what they're looking for. david: that does it for us. "risk & reward" starts right now. >> if we can win wisconsin on tuesday, we're going to blow them out the rest of the way. we're going to win new york big, we're going to win new jersey big. numbers for new jersey are through the roof. numbers came out from cbs are through the roof. we're going to win all of this stuff. >> wisconsin is a battleground. wisconsin is on the national stage. entire country is looking throughout the state. we have rick perry and lindsey graham and jeb bush and carly fiorinaand wisconsin's own governor scott walker. >> the key for us is to aaccumulat