tv Cavuto on Business FOX News July 6, 2013 1:00pm-1:31pm PDT
of san francisco cancelled in the aftermath of this crash landing. you know, we don't know again the nature of injuries or any fatalities but we'll endeavor to get that information for you. top of the hour, there is the wreckage of an asiana bowing triple 7, world's largest twin engine jet. this jet crash landed or crashed while landing at san francisco international airport roughly at 11:20 local time. as you can see it's 1:00 pacific time. we don't know the number of people who were on board. we don't know whether everyone got out safely. one of our guests a moment ago that has connections and former faa official, says he understood that everybody got out safely. heather, it's really
remarkable to think everybody got out safely when you look at the damage, especially the burn damage to the top of the plane, but maybe everybody got out before the fire ensued. >> heather: all of the experts that we've spoken with seem to be just completely surprised and shocked about the tail end of the plane coming off which certainly was the case. what we don't know if it happened prior to the crash landing or as a result of the crash landing. >> one witness telling ktvu the tail came off as was landing before it touched down. as our guest scott brenner appointed out, eyewitness accounts contradict each other. the faa will be on the scene conducting with the n.t.s.b. a thorough investigation. >> heather: he seemed to think that was not the case
from looking, from his perspective at the pictures that we are looking at. the distance between the plane itself where it came to rest and the tail end as they zoomed out and saw the distance between the two. he seemed to think, according to his expert analysis, or initial analysis that the tail came off after the crash. >> gregg: here you see a hole in the back of plane. the tail is in three pieces in a different section of the runway. there is a gaping hole on the back end. it's unclear whether passengers could have gotten out or obstructed in some form. we do have a report that one of the slides, the blow up inflatable slides did activate. they saw people jumping down that slide. obviously, fire retardant was used all over the plane to put out the flames. >> we also have another report from redwood city,
the fire department according to ktvu there were passengers on board who were being treated with burn injuries. that would be understandable as you look at the damage that has resulted from this crash. what is left of this plane, once again this was an asiana airlines flight on the south korean airline coming from south korea. a boeing 777. can carry 246 to 300 passengers. that according to the website of this airline which may tell us a little bit more about the model itself of this boeing 777. we heard rick speaking earlier about these types of planes. they are used for long distance flights up to 12 hours, cross-country flights. and they carry a large number of passengers. >> gregg: we are getting more details on the model. its 200. so boeing triple 7-200 and
often used in flights 12 hours or more from one continent to another. this particular model of 777 can carry 246 to 300 passengers. again, the departure was south korea. destination was san francisco international airport. video clip posted on youtube -- we'll show that to you again. let's cue that up. it shows smoke coming from a silver colored jet on the tarmac and passengers, according to witnesses, seen jumping down the inflatable. let's listen in. here is the 22-second clip.
>> gregg: you can hear the voices but that appears to be video taken by someone at the airport terminal and obviously thick black smoke. when we first started covering this story an hour ago, it was still smoking but now it is not. all flights out of san francisco international airport have now been cancelled. >> heather: just to let people know, to look at the top portion of your screen, you can see in a little red area. that is the tail of the plane. you see at the top corner. then as we zoom over closer, that was the tail and i believe the shot is going to take you across the debris field and then can see, there are three or four portions of the tail
that have split apart there. the plane itself resting just off the runway. this was runway 28 at san francisco international, 28 left. plane itself came to a rest there off the side of the runway. a triage unit has been set up next to it, as well. you can see emergency crews, investigators combing through the debris field. >> gregg: asiana is south korean airline. they are not returning calls, but one would expect them to issue a statement at some point in time. second in size to the national carrier, korean aired and they have been trying to expand their presence in united states and join the one world alliance that is anchored by american airlines and british airlines. this is a long-range plan that -- long range plane and destination was san francisco international airport. it's really unclear at this early stage just what
happened. all we know that one witness telling a local television station that the tail came off just before touchdown. that may be contradicted by other witnesses and you want to listen to the flight recorder and that will tell you some. if the pilots got out alive. we don't know of any fatalities yet. that would be critical. >> at least one official comment coming from the faa saying that while the sequence of events is unclear. it does appear the plane landed and then crashed. a love the information that is coming to us really is coming from eyewitnesses and rick folbaum is standing by. you have been following some of what the witnesses say and new reports coming in, comments that they are posting on social media. >> it was inevitable that
twitter would play a role in this of getting the stories out there. people that were involved in this awful accident today. i want to point out, we showed that ureport photograph that was sent to us by a viewer. you could see the top of the airplane still fully intact while people were being brought off the airplane. evidently there was some time for the first responders to get people to safety. that is good news. you couple that with some of the tweets i've been reading, especially from one passenger on the plane named david. he tweets, i just crash landed at sfo. abbreviation for sfo airport. tail lifted off, most everyone is fine. i'm okay. surreal he tweets. he goes on and another post that says, fire and rescue people all over the place. they are evacuating the
injured. haven't felt this way since 9/11. one more tweet, lots of aist activity. friends, don't call. i'm fine. most people are totally calm. we are getting other tweets from fire and rescue agencies in southern california saying that some of the non-critical patients have been transported to local hospitals. there are reports of one critical person, one critical passenger who is being treated for injuries we don't know the extent of those injuries. fire and ems and they were going through the plane and doing another counted just to make sure that everybody was accounted for. so we're able to get a couple more details, some more nuggets. we'll continue to follow the social media. >> gregg: associated press is filing very quickly information from a reporter who says unnamed eyewitnesses said the plane
was teetering as it approached the runway. they saw the tail of the plane hit the runway, the nose of plane was in the air higher than the tail. so that would seem to suggest that the tail came off after hitting the runway and not before. again, these are early eyewitness accounts. they may contradict one another. they play be inconsistent. the people -- here are more notes from the reporter, associated press. people walking around the outer edge of white foam surrounding the plane. debris scattered on the runway. when the reporter pulled into the parking lot he is could see smoke streaming from the plane. a long line of emergency vehicles pulling up to the runway. several eyewitnesses including some with binoculars saw the come out
but didn't see anyone get on them. the view of the plane was obscured for a long period of time by smoke. >> heather: i want to bring this to our viewers. this, of course, the official or some official comments coming from the faa and then we'll bring in our john scott who is standing by. john, you can listen to this, as well. the flight according to the faa, saying so far the flight that crashed was asiana airlines, flight 214 scheduled to arrive in san francisco, 11:26 from seoul, south korea. it crashed upon landing on run away 28 left. investigators -- runway 28 left. but they said 219 were on board but they can't confirm that and the tail number of the plane. we also are being told by the faa at this point, runway 28 and left and
right are closed. and perhaps the entire airport is closed, as well. jon scott joining us. john, you are a pilot yourself. are you looking at these pictures and what is your reaction? >> i am. i want to make it clear. i only fly a single-engine propeller driven aircraft. that is different than boeing triple 7 but there are some commonalties you can see just by the debris field that has been left behind on this plane. first of all, let me state at the beginning, commercial aviation is incredibly safe. you can fly millions of miles before you see an accident of this type. it's also a truism and here is the shot i wanted you to see. look at the debris field. runway 28 "l" and 28 "r"
are built on rolling jetties that protrude out in body of water san francisco bay. that is salt water. what appears to be piece of aircraft and what looks like, aircraft debris. it looks to me like this pilot simply brought this plane in too low. that was almost scraping the surface of the water with the tail will it came in. and it impacted that rock jetty there is end of the runway and that is probably what tore the tail off and i saw landing gear lying alongside the runway in one of photos. it's on the video we've seen. so, it's also true of big jets, take off and landing are the most dangerous and you don't have a lot of room for error.
if you are coming in too slow or too low and you need power, jets take a little more time. it takes a little more time with a jet engine to develop power, develop a thrust that will get you back up in the air higher. if the pilot found himself too low, 20 feet too low on final approach, even if he hit the gas he may not have had time to get that tail up in the air. planes come in tail low anyway. they will be hanging low -- you know that from observing them. it's part of the dynamics of flight. they come in tail low and touchdown obviously hopefully on the main landing gear. it looks to me this one was too low with the tail practically scraping the water and it impacted that very edge of runway 28. 28 "l". >> heather: we're being
told 28 "l". >> gregg: there is debris in the water, john. it looks like it just hit the jetty. >> yeah, i think he brought the plane in too low. most airplane accidents are caused by human error. there could be other causations here, other factors, may have been a gust of wind or something, microbursted that caused the plane to lose at feud in a hurry and the pilot couldn't adjust to it. the debris field is dragged all the way. you see those things that look like tepees. those are the marking points, the wheels are not supposed to touchdown until you are beyond those tepees. usable runway. beyond the teepees. clearly this plane was
shedding pieces for hundred yards or so before it got to the usable runway. >> gregg: you hear pilots often say these commercial jetliners are so sophisticated and computerized, they almost fly by themselves. what about on landing, is it all done manually by the pilot or computer assistance? >> there would have -- they could have done a computer assisted landing. this is probably a little bit beyond my expertise but do i read a lot about aviation. i know if you are going to land in the fog which is frequently present in san francisco, you are going to have an auto landing system that can practically put the plane on the runway by itself. it is also true -- i've talked to commercial pilots about this -- once you are in the air at altitude
flying a plane is about as exciting as driving a bus. most pilots, only sort of fun part of the flight where they get to do some flying and not on autopilot is usually at takeoff and landing, so if they have the opportunity to land or in this case perhaps pilot may have allowed his first officer to handle the landing because that gives him time as pilot in command and gives him one landing he can notch in his log book, they like to land. that is what they are pilots for. >> heather: i want to ask you something. as we take a look at the shot. if we pull up a shot of the plane itself. we had a ureport shot where you could see initially at least, there appear --
there is fire only one would side of the plane. it allowed the emergency chutes to be deployed on one side and passengers able to exit. looking at the plane at this point after the fire, there appears to be a hole in the side of the plane, as well. it's towards the front of where this fire was and then it spread back. does that tell you anything in terms of the landing itself what perhaps caused the plane to then catch fire? these airplanes are inkredly robust. it's a testament to boeing engineers and the safety and redundancy that is built in modern aircraft. it was clearly a catastrophic land weigh all kinds of forth and the fuel is stored in the wings of
these aircraft as well as there may be belly fuel tank as there was in the twa flight that exploded near long island. >> heather: what is in front of the wing there? it's actually detached from the plane there and there is a hole? >> i'm getting that is fire consumes a house, when a fire breaks out in an aircraft. it is eventually going to spread. that is probably what happened if it spread and created that hotel that you are talking about. again, they make these things with fire resistant materials as much as possible. the fact that most aircraft accidents actually are survivable. that is little known statistic but most aircraft accidents are like this one, you have an aborted takeoff. if you can get off the
plane in the first minute or two, it appears it that way, you can survive. >> gregg: the evidence would suggest to you, john, this is plane that landed short. >> tail low is the best description. >> gregg: short of the runway and too low and there is the shot. that may prove to be the money shot of evidence here. you see part of the debris is literally in the water. >> it would appear that some part of that plane, the underbelly came in too low and hit those rocks, that must have been a shock to those folks on board. at that point, i'm guessing that the landing gear, if that wasn't caused by the gear itself, the landing
gear would have, it would have bounced down on to the gear, would it been very tough landing but gear is designed to take a lot of shock and saved a lot of lives. i'm talking based on the pictures that i see in the n.t.s.b. is already at one of their teams there. they will take six months probably to come up with a cause for this accident and it will be very thoroughly reviewed. just looking at the debris field, it looks like to me the tail end of the plane came in way too low. >> gregg: jon scott, many, many things for your insight into this much appreciated. we'll be talking to you again shortly. >> thank you. >> heather: let's bring in jim hall the former chairman of the n.t.s.b. thank you for join understanding. understanding that the n.t.s.b. has announced they are investigating obviously, you are looking at the same
pictures we are handgun at. hopefully you heard john scott talking it would appear to him that the plane came in very low. the tail end of the plane just scraped along the runway there. does it appear to be what happened to you? >> well, i have not had an opportunity to look at any television pictures yet. from his description i'm sure, he is describing as accurately as he can. >> heather: you haven't had a chance to look any pictures. have you spoken to any colleagues or any initial reports as to what may have happened? have you heard anything that we have not heard so far? >> no. as the former chairman n.t.s.b. you learn quickly not to speculate in matters like this. board will do a thorough investigation and we'll
eliminate through a process of elimination come up with a probable cause. remarkable thing about this, evacuation tests for the triple 7 in seattle before it was put into service. and it passed with flying colors. so the built for the passengers to evacuate obviously was key to whatever is going to be hopefully a positive resulted in terms of that. >> it passed all initial safety tests. does that tell you that perhaps this was pilot error in terms of the tail independent of the plane coming off which we are seeing from these pictures and fire that followed that? >> the ntsb will send a full team to look at everything from the structure of the aircraft to the power plants, to
operational issues. i'm sure there are folks on their way there now from the los angeles field office of the ntsb. they will be on the ground and n the interim period of time, emergency responders in san francisco who are well-trained for incidents like this will secure the site. so the crash investigation can begin as soon as the investigators hit the ground. >> heather: and in terms of the time frame for that investigation, when can we expect to get some answers as to what caused this? >> well, the board's obligation under congressional direction is if we find -- if the board n.t.s.b. finds something that is safety note, they will immediately put out a recommendation. full report will probably take 12 months and i would imagine might include a public hearing on this
accident. >> heather: thank you so much for joining us. we appreciate it. former chairman of the n.t.s.b., good insight. >> gregg: joining us now with his insight, is captain chuck nash, former navy pilot. we are looking at a debris field that extends from just short of the runway, literally in the water all the way down the runway to where the plane came to a rest. does it look to you as though -- we were talking to jon scott. his analysis seems to make perfect sense that given the damage that we're looking at, the damage to the jetty itself, this shy of the water this plane came in too low and too short? >> that is exactly what it looks like. and your previous guests it will take some time to figure out what caused this accident. the impact that you are looking at right there, is
not what caused the accident. what he is talking about what caused that aircraft to come in so low or have such a high sink rate not only did they land short of the runway but as the camera points out you'll see yellow arrows painted on the runway. that is not actually the runway. those yellow arrows are indicated ago displaced threshold. you don't land there. air eogs continued right up to see in the black, you will see as the camera pans out and arrow pointing toward the bottom of the screen. then the runway starts. so what that says don't land anywhere there. you don't land on the displaced threshold. he.
>> what did you mean when you said high sink rate? >> what can happen if -- normally whener coming in you maintain a little bit of excess air speed and right toward the end you raise the nose and what is called a flare and that flare breaks your rate of descent. that is why you have real nice touchdown where the passengers will clap because it's such a sweet, soft landing. that is gracing it on. if you fail to break that descent or get the nose up too high and you can't brake it and come on with power to save that, if you miss that and that rate of descent is too much for the power to brake it, you wind up coming down like a coke machine. it appears what happened, the debris field is -- he hit the tail section, the
edge of the aircraft hit the brick wall short of the displace threshold. the airplane started coming apart. he doesn't have a rudder so it's difficult to control the lateral direction and keep it on runway because he doesn't have a rudder to do that. off the runway he goes into that field off set from the runway. >> gregg: we're getting lots of reports from witnesses who say they saw the plane then flip on landing. some describing the landing as sort of a cartwheel. does that make any sense to you? >> it does because if you hit with the tail first, that is going to take the front end of the airplane and slam it to the ground. when it does it's going drive the landing gear up into the wings or break off the landing gear. it looks like one of
landing gear is 500 feet up the runway on the right-hand side. when he came in clear from the debris field he was lined upright of center line, landed short. the tail struck the nose slammed down. at that point, it's just forces working. if there was any yaw rate at all, that will be accelerated and the airplane will cart wheel. sometimes it can cartwheel and if the wings were to hit a ditch it could flip the airplane over. that would have really been problematic for people getting out. >> gregg: stick with us just a moment. it's bottom of the hour right now. i want to bring our newest viewers up to speed on what happened. an a flight from seoul, south korea crashed while landing at san francisco international airport forcing passengers to jump
down the emergency inflatable slides to safety. it's not immediately known how much how many people were on board or nature or extent of injuries. we have no word on fatalities. federal aviation administration is saying this was a flight 214, all they are saying it crashed while landing on runway 28 left at 11:26 pacific time this morning. we've showing you a video clip on youtube and shows smoke billowing from the jet and this still photograph which appears to depict people having left the plane before the fire ensued. captain nash, that is excellent news, but the fire happened after some people -- we don't know how many -- got out of the plane? >> yeah, and that is one of