tv Americas Newsroom FOX News July 11, 2013 6:00am-8:01am PDT
>> gretchen: brian -- >> steve: it was an accident! >> it was reckless. he should have known that your actions could have caused damage. >> steve: this in the after the show show. >> gretchen: thanks, arthur. martha: hello, everybody. with this fox news alert the george zimmerman trial heads to closing arguments today. the jury could get this case as soon as tomorrow. as we saw, even more high drama in the courtroom. the star witness was a dummy. gregg: i'm gregg jarrett in for bill hemmer. things got heated when judge debra nelson pressed george zimmerman over whether he was
going to take the witness stand. >> mr. zimmerman have you made a decision whether you want to testify in this case? >> not at this time. >> how long do you think before you make that decision. >> may we have an opportunity to speak? the case isn't concluded yet. >> i understand that. and i asked mr. zimmerman if he needed more time to talk to his attorneys and if he does i will afford it to him. mr. zimmerman, now much more time do you think actual need to discuss this with your attorneys. >> on mr. zimmerman's behalf. >> i'm asking your client questions, please, mr. west. martha: that was something yesterday. there is a lot of questions about that exchange. we'll get into that a little later with judge janine. the jury and the spectators were riveted when the attorneys on both sides reenacted a what
their side believes happened on the night trayvon martin was killed. zimmerman's attorney mark o'mara whod what he says is how trayvon martin pounded zimmerman's head into the pavement. the prosecution says there was no way zimmerman could have grabbed his gun. we'll get significant arguments about it attorneys in this case before they close and we are waiting for a critical ruling by the judge. >> reporter: it's about the critical jury instructions the 6-woman jury will take with them into the deliberations room sometime friday afternoon. these could include the second degree murder charge and lesser
offenses which if convicted could send george zimmerman to prison in florida for many years. we are still on the seal, so the court -- now we are seeing the judge sit down. we are seeing judge debra nelson taking her seat. attorneys about to argue whether the facts of the jury instructions include lesser offenses. the jury instructions clearly explain what is meant by burden of proof, beyond a reasonable doubt and the rules of deliberations. clearly zimmerman is charged with second degree murder but he could be charged with manslaughter. >> what george did was an intentional act. the reason why he did it was self-defense. that doesn't suggest a manslaughter charge would be appropriate. >> reporter: the 9-member
yuri, 6ors and 3 alternates. the alternates don't know they are alternates. they will be told tomorrow when the 6 jurors will be sent into the deliberations room. at 1:00 sharp eastern time is when prosecutors, the state of florida will make its closing arguments in this case. expect that in about 2 hours. martha: what do we expect to hear in that closing argument? >> reporter: prosecutors are going to have to hit hard on that first initial police car george zimmerman made on the night of february 6, 2012 when he was following trayvon martin describing him to the police dispatcher as suspicious or on drugs. that's when he uttered two phrases involving curse words. he said these a holes, they always get away, and as the prosecutors pointed out, f'ing
punks. the possible curer to says these phrases exhibit ill will on the part of zimmerman and those are necessary for a jury to convict of second degree murder. martha: the closing arguments are going to be fascinating. we know mark o'mara is not at the table. he's work on his closing argument. he has been a strong force for the defense. we'll get to watch that play out this afternoon. lot to come in sanford, florida. gregg: george zimmerman is charged with second degree murder. the state has to prove that trayvon martin is dead and the death was caused by a criminal act of zimmerman and there was even all of killing of martin by imminently dangerous act on the
part of the accused demonstrating depraved mind without regard for human life, ill will and spite. so there are a lot of different element associated with that. we'll be explaining that a bit more. martha: we'll see the defense rest then it will be on to the closing arguments, and then the jury will get this case perhaps over the weekend. zimmerman is claiming self-defense. if he's found guilty of second degree murder he will face a mandatory minimum sentence of 25 years. the charge is a first degree penalty. , 25 years a prison and $10,000 fine. >> raise your voice. >> and not your hands. >> we need to stand together as one. >> no cops, no guns.
>> four patience will be tested but law enforcement has your backs. >> no need to act up. >> let it roll off your shoulders and not off your back. >> let's make the choice and raise your voice and not your head. >> law enforcement does have your back. gregg: this video clip titled raise your voice, not your hands. zimmerman's attorney says he is concerned for his client's safety. martha: was the judge -- was judge nelson out of line with zimmerman's defense yesterday when she kept going directly to zimmerman and asking him, do you want to take the stand in this case. but what can we expect when she charged the jury with their instructions whether she'll give them the option of choosing lesser charges against zimmerman. this is a crucial decision.
judge janine shapiro weighs in later in the program. i weren't wait to hear what she has to say. greg * a stunning look into the outrageous spending habits of the federal government, its own watchdog, the gao, the government accountability office says it's literally flying bliewnld. it finds federal agencies wasting $100 billion in bogus payments last year. the report is not even finished yet. stuart varney is the host of varney and company on the fox business network. it's mind boggling that you could waste that much money. how do they do it? >> reporter: how many times have we sat here and looked at government waste? all the way from shrimp on a treadmill to salin solindra.
it was revealed in testimony before conscious yesterday. this does not include the pentagon. this other government operations and they are still counting. that number will go up. here are some of the thing the government wasted the money on. only one-third of managers could say whether they will had their program evaluated in the last five years. and they could not come up with a full list of all federal programs on a single page or a single booklet. they couldn't come up with a unified list of where the money is all going. he said he wants more leadership from mr. obama and more conscious am oversight. that's how you stop this waste and fraud and he says his department needs more money. he's down to the lowest staffing level since 1935, he wants more money to conduct more audits.
gregg: i remember stories 20-30 years ago about the pentagon paying $500 for a hammer and $200 for a toilet seat. there was no accountability it was free money to them. now, you find out the gao believes the army is so disorganized it doesn't even know how many people it's paying or whether their salaries are accurate. >> reporter: the army, pentagon, defense forces, they were not included in the statement yesterday. that's another set of waste and fraud or waste certainly. this is just $107 billion worth and rising of fraud, waste ban other areas outside defense. nothing changes. gregg: this is what happens when people in congress spend other people's money. if they were spending their own money -- >> reporter: may i quote
margaret thatcher? the problem with socialism is pretty soon you run out of other people's money. martha: we have a new snapshot on the unemployment situation. unemployment applications were up last week. the weekly numbers have been consistently below $375,000 which should signal we are in a steady hiring period which is a good thing and we know weekly data can be volatile in the month of july because auto dealers shut down their factories. you have schools closed and that can cause temporary fluctuations in those numbers. but that's what it looks like this week. gregg: boston mayor on bombing suspect dzhokhar tsarnaev pleaded not guilty to 30 counts including use of weapons of mass destruction. federal prosecutors are deciding
whether to pursue the death penalty for the 19-year-old. the government says he and his older brother tamerlan plarnlted the two bombs at the boston marathon. the older brother was killed days later in a shootout with police. >> to the right. to the left. martha: the irs taxpayer funding as lawmakers look to slash the agencies budget in a fairly significant way. gregg: the white house has a message for critics of the plan to delay the implementation
calling them willfully ignorant. martha: the 911 calls have been released from the passengers who were inside the asiana flight. >> we just saw a plane crash and there are a bunch of people who need help. there are not enough medics. there is a woman on the runway who is pretty much burned severely on the head and we don't know what to do. >> we do have help on the way. >> she'll probably die soon if we don't get help. spiriva handihaler tiotropium bromide inhalation powder does not replace fast-acting inhalers for sudden symptoms. tell your doctor if you have kidney problems, glaucoma, trouble urinating, or an enlarged prostate. these may worsen with spiriva. discuss all medicines you take, even eye drops.
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the sand. martha: after months of information about wasteful spending about it irs congress wants to cut the irs's budget $3 billion. opponents say they are trying to use the irs, they have become a political play thing for republicans. let's bring in the chairman of the committee. this is obviously an area the public is -- i with say the polls show they are very supportive of reining in the irs. it's not anybody's favorite agent sit many fair to say.
given what we have seen with the scamming of conservative groups and progressive groups as well. i think that there would be broad support to cut their budget somewhat. are you going too far here as the democrats say and overreaching? >> i don't think we are going too far at all. when you look at it, it's clear the irs betrayed the trust of the american people. it's not only targeting groups to single them out and bully them and harass them and wasting taxpayers dollars to have lavish conferences producing line dancing videos and paying bonuses when most americans don't even have a job. we are trying to get their attention and say unless you spend the money you have more correctly, unless you clean up your act you are not going to get any more money. they asked for a billion dollars more.
we said you have got to spend the money you have in the first place and we are going to give you a cut and put in place some safeguards to make sure this doesn't happen again. martha: it's shocking when you look at the $12 billion budget and the irs would have the gall a lot of folks would say given the spending we have seen. they are saying we are so short staffed we can barely manage what we have to do on our workload. that's tough for people to swallow when they see this expenditure going on. >> they were asking for more money for their enforcement division yet they were taking money out of the enforcement find and putting on lavish conference. one conference cost $4 million all by itself sp. they paid a quarter billion in bonuses the last several years and they say we need more money, we say you need to clean up your
account. act. we are going to hold you accountable. martha: the question is can you? they see house republicans outraged about overspending then it gets to the senate and nothing happens. nothing every changes and everybody's budget goes up in the end and nobody gets fired and lois lerner gets paid for the summer. >> they still have $9 billion. one of the things we say not only did we cut your budget but we put some restrictions in there. we say no more bonuses unless you sit down and justify those things. no more videos, no more conferences. martha: do you have democrat is support for those ideas? >> we'll have to pass this through the house with a vuch can majority. then we'll go to the conference. they wanted $440 34eu40 millionw money to implement obama-care.
one of the things we say is you can't use any money to implement the individual mandate. people don't trust the irs. and yet they want $440 million more to implement the obama-care. martha: we'll see how it goes and thank you for talking with us today. gregg: chilling 911 calls from the passengers up side that san francisco airport plane crash, the desperate pleas for help. martha: the forward hood shooting suspect making a disturbing revelation. what this could mean for his case after 13 people were killed on that bloody november day. >> how did you get out of it? >> i was able to stand and run. stand and get out. is a was going out the door to it, i saw my soldiers on the
martha: a former army psychiatrist charged in the attack at fort hood speak out during jury selection. he told the jurors he supports the taliban and sharia law. the judge had to remind him several times to rephrase his questions and avoid mentioning his beliefs. hassan faces execution or life without parole if he's convicted in the rampage that left these people dead and 3 dozen of his
gregg: amazing how couple that young man was. were the efforts to get people off the plane -- it didn't begin immediately, right? >> that's right. initially after this plane bounces and skidded count runway, the pilot told everyone to stay in their seats. it wasn't until after one of the flight attendants noticed flames were erupting outside the plane did the evacuation begin. it turns out three night attendants were ejected from the plane when the tail section broke off. they survived but two passengers died. a pilot said a flash of light temporarily bliernd him just as
the plane descended. the ntsb looking into what that light could have been? >> could it have been a lacer? we don't know what it could have been. that information was relayed to us by the pilot. we need to look into it. >> reporter: investigators say they are trying to figure out if automated equipment inside the cockpit may have contributed to this crash. whether it may have malfunctioned or whether it wasn't properly monitored by the pilot. gregg: some of the passengers returned to the crash site last night? >> reporter: a number of survivors were bussed out to see the wreckage. many were dressed in all white attire, a traditional sign of mourning in many asian cultures.
the ntsb wanted to give them a plans the see the wreckage before it is removed. but a lot of repair:work needs to be done and it will be several days at least before airplanes are able to use that runway. martha: a torrential downpour causing this. mudslides. gregg: new fallout over the administration's delay of a key part of the healthcare law. we'll debate that next. hey! did you know that honey nut cheerios has oats that can help lower cholesterol? and it tastes good? sure does!
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gregg: the white house is defending the delay of a key part of the healthcare law claiming the critic are willfully ignore rant. >> anyone who suggests there is anything unusual about the implementation of a comprehensive law are sticking their head in the sands. it's not serious. gregg: doug schoen, former
adviser to bill clinton and monica crawley. some could argue what jay carney knows about the law could be written on the head of a pin. if you read the section it says the mandate shall begin january 1, 2011. courts universally held that the word "shall" is mandatory. it cannot be changed by the president. is the willfully ignorant person here jay carney? >> i don't want to characterize jay carney but i will characterize we did. shall means will. there is no right for a president or the executive to unilaterally delay implementation of legislation that has been passed. we have separation of powers.
a democrat like tom harkin expressed the same sentiments. purchase right, carney is wrong an owes the american people an apology. gregg: if i understand carney's argument he's saying other presidents have fund or changed the law. isn't that a little bit like saying other people have robbed banks so it's okay for me to do it. >> citing previous bad behavior to excuse the current bad behavior? is that what they are relying on? the word shall in any law is a command. and if this president wanted to change the law he needs to go back to congress. he can't unilaterally decide what part of the law he wants to implement, what part he doesn't, what part he wants to delay. that's not how our constitutional republic works. gregg: just because the president says it's delayed doesn't make it so.
these businesses are still legally bound by the law that's is applied january 1 of this next year or be penalized. i wouldn't be surprised if businesses file a lawsuit for declaratory relief. go to a jj and say, we are getting whipsaws. i want you to declare who is right and who is wrong. >> if you are the general counselor ce to of a major corporation and you have the legal responsibility much providing healthcare. that's not enough comfort for a corporation to make decisions involving hundreds of millions of dollars. i expect those lawsuits to be filed very quickly. gregg: federal appeals court judge and now constitutional law professor at stanford michael mcconnell says it's not only
lawlessness what the president is doing, he is breaching his constitutional duty to faithfully he can cute the laws. and he also calls it an abuse of power much like caning james ii. fair -- just like king james ii. fair analogy? >> this is not the first time this administration has acted lawlessly, and recklessly. what was striking about carney's comments is he was dismissing critics as willfully ignorant. but what he didn't understand was he's attacking his fellow democrats. jay rockefeller who helped write the bill said it's so complex it's incomprehensible. tom harkin has raised questions
about whether the executive has the authority to do this. dick durbin is begging the republicans for help in trying to implement this help. it's the democrats turning on each other because they realize how politically toxic and unworkable this is. gregg: the fox news poll shows obama-care is pretty unpopular. and eight makes people feel worried. is this what happens when you pass a divisive highly partisan law that affects every american because it retools 1/7 of the u.s. economy? >> absolutely right. people want to move much more slowly or to just stop implementation of the law. they are more worried about their healthcare, more worried about less coverage and higher costs. bottom line, it's a disaster.
martha: more than 200 years after his death our nation's first chief executive is getting his own presidential library. what many the significance of this new george washington library? >> reporter: this is the first time scholarship on the nation's first president will be combined in a single facility where researchers can access source material. what you are seeing is a computer animation showing what the facility will look like when it's different. it's called the fred w. smith national library for the study of george washington. it includes 100 book owned by washington and 500 document and letters written by the president. it including his own personal copy of the u.s. constitution. it will be on the ground of mount ever northern, the house
and farm 10 miles from washington, d.c. where the president lived and died. while mount vernon is a tourist attraction the new library will be open only to researchers. martha: i was just at mount ever man two weeks ago and i thought is there a george washington presidential library. thank you, steve. good report. that will be great. that with us amazing. gregg: george zimmerman's murder trial moving towards closing arguments. judge janine on the case. >> that judge was way out of line. the defense had not rested. and what in the world was us she badgering him for and not talking to the lawyers. she had no business asking that particular question then. no business. she waits to the even of the defense case. but doing that in the middle of
march there are the george zimmerman trial prosecutors and the defense are set to determine what the instructions to the jury will be. also whether the jury should consider lesser charges and second degree murder. many legal observers think the judge crossed the line in this heated exchange with the defense and zimmerman. watch this one more time. >> have you made a decision, sir, whether you want to testify in your case? >> i object to that question. >> overruled. >> have you made a decision whether you want to testify. the court has a right to
determine whether the defendant wants to testify. mr. zam zimmerman have you made a decision as to whether you want to testify in this case. >> no, not at this time. >> how long do you think you need before you make that decision? >> may we have an opportunity to speak. the case isn't concluded yet. >> i understand that. and i asked mr. zimmerman if he needed more time to talk to his attorneys and if he does i will afford it to him. mr. zimmerman how much more time do you think you will need to discuss this with yours. >> on mr. zimmerman's behalf. >> i'm asking your client question, please, mr. west. >> i object to the court inquiring of mr. zimmer on his decision whether or not to testify. >> your objection is overruled. mr. zirm man i will give you more time to discuss this with your attorneys, thank you very much. martha: that was something.
judge gentlema>> i'm going to te and i'll tell you why. i sat on the bench and tried murder cases as a judge. the defense said we are wrapping up. there was no question yesterday was going to be the last day. you have a judge who has the right for two reasons to to make sure they don't waste any more time that she scheduled -- this is a sequestered jury, she wants to move it along and she has the right to speak to a defendant and ask whether or not he made a decision to testify and whether he needs more time. why? because at some point this defendant may say i had an ineffective assistance of counsel taken wanted to testify but they wouldn't let me testify and i didn't know i could have testified. she is protecting the record in the recent there is a conviction. and enough of this criticism of the judge. she said to him do you need more
time. there is no question it was the last day. i'm going to take her side. she runs that courtroom and she has been running it pretty well. martha: she wanted a personal reaction from him on the record. from zimmerman. she looked into his eyes and said do you -- >> she had that right as i have the right with a defendant in a murder case to say to him do you intend to testify. do you know you do not have to testify. do you need more time to decide whether you are going to testify? that's her right. martha: let many move on to the issue of lesser charges. having watched this entire trial play out. everybody at home has the same question. second degree murder, is that too high a bar? and is it incumbent upon this judge to say to the jury you may also consider aggravated battery. you may consider manslaughter cases. you have other options other
than what the state set for you at second degree murder. >> the state when they made a decision to charge murder 2 decided there was i will ill, hatred or spite. having listened to that evidence i don't know that the jury is going to agree with the prosecution. now the judge is faced with the question of offering a lesser charge. the judge certainly can do that here. it is within her right to say to the jury if you don't have enough for the murder 2 you can go down to man salute are. the defense was smart in fighting that. they don't want to compromise. they want it was murder or it was self-defense. martha: is it inkem bent upon her to give them that option? >> if she believes there is a reasonable view of the evidence that would support a manslaughter she has to give them that charge.
but his act was intentional, it was not or reckless. she would be within her right in not giving manslaughter. martha: we heard the testimony from one of the police detectives that when she shared the information with george zimmerman that trayvon martin died he was shocked. could you say he did not have an intent to kill. he killed as a result of his actions and therefore manslaughter charge is valid? >> the standard is the depraved mind with ill will, spite or hatred and he caused the death. not that he intended to cause the death. but for murder in the second degree ... martha: what about for manslaughter. this an unintentional murder. >> he caused the death. that is murder 2. manslaughter is simply that he caused the death without ill
will or spite, without intent. there is a reasonable view of the evidence that they might say this is manslaughter. defense wasn't want a prosecution and to get on their knees and hope the judge will give it. martha: great to see you. great to have you here. it will be an interesting day in this case. you can catch judge janine right here on fox. she'll have a full wrapup of everything of course. gregg, we'll see what happens. it will be an interesting day. gregg: we are also keeping an eye on wall street. interesting day there. look at this. we are 20 minutes into trading and the dow jumped up 132 points. the s & p rising after the fed signaled it will for the near term continue the stimulus bond boying program. and inside a mudslide.
fires like this because they say burning wood is dirtier than a diesel truck. >> not to be able to come to the beach and have a bonfire anymore. >> reporter: that's what they propose, banning beach fires because burning wood pollutes the air. >> one fire pit emits as much as one average diesel truck on the road driving over 500 miles. >> reporter: fire pits allow thousands from los angeles to san diego to enjoy roasted march mall ohs. they say burning wood causes carcinogens that injures health. >> the microscopic particles are
doing damage to me, my children. >> it may not be the greatest thing. but what happens when we put out all the fires at the beach, what next? >> bonfire supporters say they cause less pollution than leaf blowers. still officials say the air need all the help it can get. >> the proximity of people breathing that wood smoke will have a benefit. >> reporter: they backed off a total ban. pits near home will be banned. the extra dig may continue for a few more years. you got some s'mores with those marshmallows? >> i do. but we are going -- graham
martha: new bombshell allegations from a government watchdog group. judicial watch uncovers document that they claim that show a division of the justice department was sent to help organize protests against george zimmerman. the justice department says that is not so. we'll report on this. we'll tell you allhe angles when we talk to the president of judicial watch and we'll read a statement from the other side about what they are saying. key parts of president obama's healthcare law continue to implode, senate republicans now pushing to permanently delay implementing a land mark provision for all americans, big
step going on. this is a brand-new hour in "america's newsroom." i'm march that mccallum. gregg: i'm gregg jarrett. the white house decided to delay the implementation for companies to 2015. >> anything we can do to delay the impacts of this on the american people is a good thing. so while we all acknowledge delaying the employer mandate for a year is a good thing. the individual mandate is set to kick in january 1 of next year. that will affect average mayor cans with a $1 door1,200 tax in. martha: they wanted to dismantle this healthcare bill.
can they achieve that? >> do they have the votes? probably not. but they do have the moment. because there are a lot of problems with obama-care and the implementation. the employer mandate being pushed back a year. there are provisions of the law that are being delayed by hhs because of one reason or another. and republicans are sensing this gap. to shoot the gap and make it an issue and try to do what they have been trying to do for a long time which is reveal this bill. they don't have the votes but they do have the momentum. there is a null everrability on the administration side. on the democratic side democrats are saying the employer mandate delay not a huge deal. i heard a senator saying only 4% of businesses have more than 50 workers don't provide inn and on 4% of those businesses would be affected.
republicans, many of them saying this is a political move to push back some of the toughest measures, some of the thing that sting past the 2014 election so you can have your dessert now and eat the things on your plate that you don't like later. >> it make you wonder when you look back at the statement by max baucus that it was a train wreck and kathleen sebelius saying it's tougher to implement than we thought. when you get to the individual mandate we wonder if they will be forced to decide on their own that pushing it through is too onerous, that things will start to crop up in the middle of an election cycle that could be problematic for democrats to stand behind this. >> it clearly will be problematic for read state or purple state democrats to defend this law in an election year in 2014 and there are several of them up for reelection in 2014
who may affected by this battle. but the administration -- a lot of people looking eight and the analysis of it. they want to get as many people signed up as possible. so even if there are bumps in the road in implementation that people are signed on. once you have something you are signed on to it's tough for washington to take it away. then you run the risk if the obama-care overall doesn't work out as planned you may have democrats calling for single payer and where that goes i think is yet to be seen. >> reporter: you have a lot of them saying we thought that would be easier all along. that's the way we should have gone and it opens up a whole can of worms. it's must see and it's on fox news coming up tonight. gregg: highway horror in colorado. a torrential downpour causes
flash flooding sweeping cars off the road. one of those cars belongs to a video editor. he says he looked down for a minute and when he glanced back up a giant black wave of mud sweeping his car down the highway. remarkably no reports of injuries. my next guest was inside that car and shot the video. john, first of all, explain why you were even there in the first place. >> a misplaced sense of duty. gregg: what does that mean? >> i'm a reporter. we heard there was a flash flood warning up the canyon near the
burn scar. a year ago there was a horrible wildfire up in the foothills near colorado springs. that's why there was a flash flood because the wildfires burned off all this vegetation. any time that it rains, hard at all, we get huge flash floods. it happened a week ago. we got word there was going to be a flash flood. gregg: so you basically drove into danger to get the story. it's a pretty aggressive thing to do. and inherently dangerous. did you -- was there a point in time you thought we are not going to make it out of here? >> you know, on honest i didn't have a lot of time to think. it happened so incredibly fast
that it was really surreal. and looking back i mean -- it kind of is amusing because i was -- even when my car was swept off the side of the road i was slamming on the as if that was going to help anything. obviously in retrospect that's not the thing to do. you have to have a sense much automation almost. but -- gregg: how did you get out of it? > >> after probably a few hundred feet being swept down the road, my car seem to have stopped somehow luckily and sat there for probably half an hour while the floodwaters just kept pouring down on either side of my car. finally i got tired of sitting there and climbed out of the
driver's side of my window of my car up on the roof of my car and jumped across onto the onramp of the highway. gregg: no injuries? nobody died? >> not that i have heard of, no. gregg: incredible videotape. a dangerous situation, obviously. thanks for being with us. appreciate it. martha: the wildfire responsible for the deadliest tragedy for u.s. firefighters in at least 30 years is now contained. we are learning that is video back from june 30, that arizona fire trapped and killed 19 of our most elite firefighters in this nation just a couple week ago. they died protecting the town of yarnell. the first funerals for the fallen firefighters in an
incredibly moving ceremony. thousands of people in attendance including vice president joe biden. gregg: the judge in the george zimmerman trying hearing arguments on whether to include any lesser included charges, anything less than second degree murder. how will she eventually rule? this as the former police chief in sanford, florida makes bold accusations against his former boss. he says he was fired. straight ahead. martha: a potentially firey confirmation hearing for victoria nuland. plus this ... >> i was doing the right thing like anybody else would have done. gregg: a true american hero comes to the rescue after a disabled man falls on the subway.
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martha: we have breaking news in the zimmerman trial. judge nelson will allow lesser charges to be introduced in the instructions to the jury. this is a very big development and it is not what the defense wanted. phil keating joins me live from sanford, florida. what can you tell us about what just happened? >> reporter: the state of florida, the prosecution abandoned having the aggravated battery charge. what the state wants the judge to include in the jury instructions are second degree murder. felony third degree murder and a lesser charge called man salute are. the defense doesn't what the lesser charges in there. it's not final yet as a ruling by judge debra nelson whether this will be a consideration for the jurors of second degree murder, lesser offense or second degree murder that alone. the defense attorney don west
said they believe the state charged george zimmerman with second degree murder and they should move that beyond a reasonable doubt or george zimmerman is not guilt are you. he if the yuri convicted george zimmerman of manslaughter or felony third degree murder he can still serve up to 13 years in a florida prison. the position by the defense is it shouldn't all or nothing. the state is qualifying why they think these lesser offenses are aapplicationable in this case. number one the individual trayvon martin is dead and the defendant is in the courtroom charged with a crime, that is george zimmerman. and the consequence ofa. >> the felony is the third part, and the prosecution team explained they are getting that in by using the term child abuse
because trayvon martin was un18 year old on the night of even if 26, 2012 when he was walking home from 7-eleven and george zimmerman first spotted him as suspicious, followed him, called the police and initiated what of course ended up with one gunshot to the heart of the unarmed 17-year-old trayvon martin. the attorneys are trying to iron out their persuasive argument whether the judge will grant these two lesser offenses. third degree felony murder and manslaughter. that ruling should come down in quick order. martha: they are still deciding. the jury is not in the room. this is the process of the judge and the two side arguing over what instructions will be give to the jury. let's bring in gregg and ask you, gregg. in terms of these charges, are they appropriate, the third
degree murder felony they are proposing? gregg: third degree i kind of doubt. it requires some knowledge on the part of the accused that trayvon martin was under age and clearly he didn't know trayvon martin. as to manslaughter i would imagine that prosecutors argued, judge within look, manslaughter is essentially neglect le jones or reckless behavior. did they argue using a gun under the circumstances is negligent behavior? i it's excessive force. to use a gun with a kid armed with skittling is reckless behavior? did they make that argument? >> they did not make that specific argument. however the fact that a gun was used by george zimmerman, not in dispute by either side. however, when it come to let's say the jury actually convicted
in the deliberations room george zimmerman of manslaughter and did not go with second degree murder. manslaughter is up to 15 years in prison. but because of the gun being involved here that is an enhancement charge, an enhancer as they say. so that could make the term being anywhere between 10-30 years if george zimmerman was convicted of manslaughter with the enhancer of a gun being utilized here. gregg: interesting arguments happening inside the courtroom. it's always a gamble when the defense wants one charge or nothing at paul. here it looks -- or nothing at all. buff it looks like the judge is going through a lesser included of manslaughter. martha: george zimmerman was asked again a direct question by the judge with regard to that. are you aware that your
representation is for second degree murder and for no lesser charges and he said yes, i am. she said are you okay with that? you understand your attorneys are pushing for only second degree murder charges? if he's convicted of is a life changer to be sure for george zimmerman. they are putting all their eggs in that basket and he told her he was okay with that. >> they have to make sure there is an he wilthereis -- is an ele courtroom so later in a conviction he doesn't argue it was a mistake from my lawyers. so she asks the defendant to make sure he is make a knowing and intelligent waiver. martha: he could push for a mistrial or retrial if he can prove he didn't know where o.j. was claiming that he didn't know
that he could have made a plea deal that would have been lesser. let's take a look at what we spoke about. this just happened moment afoe with the judge and george zimmerman. >> you also understand it's been indicated today that the -- your attorneys are going to argue in their closing argument to the jury that it's manslaughter or not guilty, those are the only choices. >> second degree murder. >> i misspoke. second degree murder or not guilt i with these wanted those as the only choices. >> yes, sir. >> you are in agreement with that. >> yes, your honor. >> has anybody promised you to get you to make that decision in. >> no. >> has anyone threatened you. >> yes. >> you are doing that freely and voluntarily? gregg: intelligent, knowing and voluntary. martha: we are going to take a quick break. stay with us.
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speak one>> we're live in the courtroom. judge for nelson moments ago making a critical decision to the benefit, it would seem the prosecution. it won't just be second-degree murder charge, the jurors will have an option of considering a lessening inclusion of manslaughter. second-degree murder is indifference to human life or
ill will in spite. but this manslaughter is a lot less than that, essentially reckless behavior. culpable negligence. consciously doing an act that the defendant must have known could have caused death or great bodily injury, reckless behavior. you had to know you were doing something so reckless that somebody could die. this gives jurors an option. the prosecution is asking for other options which would include a third degree felony. we're joined now, the defense did not want these jurors to have a choice, did they? >> absolutely not. this is not good news for the defense. a prosecutor who not only has the opportunity to have the jury rendered a verdict on murder, but now manslaughter.
it means there is a possibility of a compromise verdict, they can say the state did not prove murder, but we think they may have proved manslaughter because a 17-year-old is dead and he just had skittles and iced tea. the prosecution continues to argue for even more charges. the more charges the prosecution can get the judge to submit to that jury as lesser included charges, the worse it is for zimmerman. make no mistake, manslaughter can have a high as murder two. this is not a good day for the defense. greg: so much has been written by legal experts the prosecution can't win this case, they have a much better shot of it now because the jurors could simply decide with respect to self-defense it is all about reasonableness. was it reasonable for the accused to fear imminent bodily
injury or death? they could say it was completely unreasonable for him to fear that, and they could conclude it was reckless for him to use deadly force, excessive under the circumstances. that would be manslaughter, wouldn't it, judge? >> as you say so clearly, it is about a culpable state. it was getting his head bashed against the sidewalk, but he does not need stitches or any kind of medical attention. he is walking without assistance. he is talking, he is able to communicate. and so the jury will say what we have got here is a guy that wasn't that injured, was he reasonable? >> quick question for you, because mark o'mara came out yesterday and said manslaughter does not fit because we have
argued our client was trying to save his own life because it was going to be him or the other guy. he had intent to defend himself, and that is what happened. >> and mark o'mara is a very smart guy. self-defense applies to the murder two, it can apply to anything else. there is reasonable view of the evidence that this act was reckless and culpable mental state problem. greg: all right, judge jeanine, thank you very much. we continue to follow what is happening in this courtroom and sanford, florida. martha: the makings of a unique confirmation hearing on capitol hill. lawmakers expected to get answers about benghazi and what happened as they have an opportunity to consider a promotion for a former state department spokeswoman who was involved in the discussion that evening. ambassador john bolton on that
greg: the former chief of the sanford police department is now speaking out. claiming he was fired for refusing to arrest george zimmerman saying i had one of the city commissioners come to me on two different occasions and say all we want is an arrest next line to them you can't do that, you have to have probable cause to arrest somebody that was related to me they didn't
care if it got dismissed later. i don't do that. joining me now, david webb. michael joins us, former prosecutor and adjunct professor. gentlemen, good to see you both. the city manager ended up signing "i have come to the decision to make this decision." he is the guy who fired bill lee. is that a wrongful termination? >> it looks like a wrongful termination and for a number of issues that have now come to light, the employer request judicial watch went after. there's a department of justice, community relations service, they were there not only paying
for rallies to support the rallies against zimmerman, but they were exerting pressure, they had their upcoming convention in tampa, they were working with the ncaa cp the number of officials, and they were basically fostering a political environment and the had a choice to make so this definitely has indication of a wrongful termination. greg: the police department, law enforcement that makes decisions on probable cause and prosecutors who prosecute, since when does the city manager get involved? >> i can speak from two different hats. i'm a former mayor myself in new jersey and we have a city manager in the former government. he felt the chief breached his trust of the community no doubt tremendous amount of overtones of this case. it appears he ignored the low
threshold of probable cause and ignored his investigators. greg: how would a city manager know that? he is not a lawyer, not law enforcement, no experience in that. he is making a political judgment. he doesn't know that. speaker can't assume every decision he made was political. you have a young man killed and he didn't have a weapon. truthfully being unarmed is more than probable cause and an arrest should have been effective. greg: david, look, they testified during the trial and was forced to admit he is the one who screwed up the identification of the 911 voice calls, he should have fired himself.
>> those actual proof of something that was done wrong. there was no proof even in light of somebody being shot, trayvon martin being killed, nobody had known all the facts of the incident played out at the time, but we have to go back to the political makeup of what happened since this incident in february of 2012. without a doubt there was politics. we now have a track, fax, employer request, e-mail records. >> i'm concerned below standard like probable cause was no doubt matt when a young boy was emphatically accepting a self-defense argument despite only best hitters signing an arrest should take place. greg: how do you overcome the fact that local prosecutors, even local prosecutors thought there should be no charges here.
>> exonerate somebody who self defended himself but on the streets of a young young man without a weapon but a handful of skittles and is dead. that is probable cause. looking at domestic violence cases if a woman has a bruise, the protocol is to make an arrest and that the court sorted out. greg: is another case in florida. 69-year-old black man shoots a 41-year-old white man chooses the stand your ground law. he waits for the police, calls his attorneys, back at work on monday. the similarities in this case is he was underneath the 41-year-old man holding him, choking him. and then shot him. similarities, i different outco. >> he delayed justice by the 40
days. >> are kind of arguing against yourself if you say it is the courts because politician got involved. thank you very much michael, good to see you both, will have to do this again. >> watching interesting moment play out in court because you have don west making efforts to prove that the request to consider other charges now including third degree felony charge, this has been sprung on us, we have not had chance to react to be ready for this and he thinks that is "outrageous." >> you say it is certainly consistent with the way the court proceeded since april, certainly disingenuous as well, this is outrageous. it is outrageous the state would seek to do this at this time in this case. if the court wants to recess for several hours so we can research
and review these cases, draft a memo of law, we can do that. we are entitled the to respond in a meaningful way. but it is hard for me to imagine the court would take this seriously. certainly the court wasn't provided with the case law either or given any hint that this is where this was going to go. >> in all due respect to that statement, the court hasn't been provided a lot of things that have been requested until late in the evening until the last minute or i requested of it. that in and of itself is not an argument and i do not want to go there. the scope the argument of the instruction. >> i'm not prepared to make an argument, this was e-mailed to me. in the set of instructions the state has been working on for months and months just to spring
it on everyone at the last minute. he has fully formed, organized argument based upon the case law i guarantee you he did not come up with between yesterday my want of aggravated assault and this morning when i now want third-degree murder based on child abuse. really? the court sitting right there apparently proving of this. >> that is not upper argument. >> is not fair to me, it is not fair to mr. zimmerman, mark o'mara or the court for this to happen like this right now. i need time to sort this out if the court is going to give any consideration to this remarkable suggestion by the state that somehow third-degree murder based upon chapter 827 violation in the child of these statutes
could somehow when trayvon martin is shot straddling george zimmerman, pummeling him that somehow george zimmerman was engaged in child abuse. martha: quite a moment. he is arguing that the lesser charges are a scramble to come up with alternatives for this jury because perhaps they feel they have not reached the verdict set upon them in the second degree murder charge. what do you think? >> the happen sandbagged honestly because it was well known the prosecution was going to seek lesser included. we knew which ones they were, this is a surprise and the defense is saying wait a minute, we never knew for one moment
they were going to argue i third-degree murder charge based on child abuse because his under 18. as i read the statute, don west has probably not had a chance to read it yet, the prosecution has to show the prosecution new trayvon martin qualified as a child and there is no evidence he knew that. >> they thought he was older than he was at the time, so a lot going on here. we will take you right back to this on the other side of the case.
>> we are keeping an eye on zimmerman, but we also want to get to this story very significant today as well. the department of justice is now responding after government watchdog groups obtained documents they claim showing arm of the doj was involved in helping to organize anti-george zimmerman protest last year.
he is of course on trial for murder after shooting teenager trayvon martin. judicial watch said got the documents through the freedom of information act. take a look at a few of these. what their business was, the name of the organization is an arm of the department of justice. from march 25 to the 28th of 2012 right after the murder became public they spent more than $1100 in sanford, florida, to work marches, demonstrations and rallies related to the shooting and death of an african-american teenager. and then they got this coming april $1300 to provide technical assistance, conciliation and on-site mediations by demonstrations planned in sanford as a result of the trial but the doj says the community relations service was in sanford, florida, filling the mandated mission which is to be a peacemaking arm of the department of justice.
let's talk about this with the president of judicial watch. welcome, good to have you today. when you go through this, they are saying we have done this in many different situations, this is a peacemaking, the department peacemaker for immunity conflict and tensions arriving from differences of race, color and national origin. they say this is a rolling of operated for a long time, we were concerned about the situation in florida when we went down there to provide that help. >> by their own admission they went down to organize a protest, and the protests were for the prosecution for mr. zimmerman and support of mr. martin. that is fine. people have a first amendment right to protest, but some of those protests were racially charged involving people like al sharpton and the department of justice going down there in the organization that would show up at these meetings with doj
jackets and hats on looking more like storm troopers than facilitators and peacekeepers. so the idea department of justice was mediating force here is false. a protest against zimmerman, some of the meetings they help promote and facilitate led to the firing of police chief which is quite controversial. you have to wonder if the prosecution, which wasn't taking place, that is the reason for the protest that took place subsequent to the protest. >> let's go back to this. they claim when you go through the documents you have got through the freedom of information request there is only one section that refers to providing any support for anything that was going on in this region in terms of these protested the only time support shows up as a travel voucher that says to provide
intraregional support for protest deployment indicates they are supporting other staff, not the actual protest that were going on and you deleted the word to make it sound like they were providing direct support for protest, which is not true. >> they can look at the press report. i don't know anything about anything being deleted from those documents. it is not like we are hiding anything. seven the department of justice organizing a police escort for students to fit in as a police chief of stanford office seems to be a bit more, the mediation, this is not being neutral, it is promoting one side of a controversy in a racially charged way.
>> what evidence do you have that they were on one side. a justifiable concern given all the attention that this case got, the president himself came out and talked about it. let's take it would be back hot this moment really was. >> if i had a son, he would look like trayvon. they have a right to take the seriousness it deserves and get the bottom of exactly what happened. >> that is trayvon martin's parents. what do you make of that statement and does it support or deny the claims were making about their work here? >> suggest the president is pressuring the local authorities to commit prosecution on
zimmerman. his department of justice employees go down there, helping organize the marches. the press reports show supporters of the family were clear in that they perceived justice to be there for them. the idea that someone mediating stanford with politicians who pressured the prosecution of mr. zimmerman mediating with the support of the prosecution is somehow seen as neutral is just bunk. >> thank you very much. the doj says they were there as a peacemaker. we report, you decide. gregg: we will show you what just happened moments ago, the defense claiming george zimmerman has been victimized by a surprise, a trick. wthey will show it to you in jut
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gregg: the prosecution has decided to ask the judge in addition to second-degree murder also include third-degree murder under the age of 18 and thus it would arguably be child abuse, but the defense says wait a minute, this is a surprise. take a listen. >> the facts support a third-degree felony murder with the underlining felony being child abuse. it is permissible under the statute. i'm not going to give you hours. i don't know how many lawyers
you have working for you on this case. anothenot as a room downstairs f people. >> this is who we have as lawyers on this case, everyone else is a volunteer. an intern who has really done a marketable work but we cannot rely on nonlawyers to the kind of work necessary right now. this was a trap, doesn't the court realized this was a trick? >> my intention is to get through the jury instructions because if we have any arguments, i would like to get them resolved and then we will come back to this one. i understand your argument, we will come back to this one. gregg: and the judge admonished west for using the word trick or trickery. the defense is basically saying we need more time to research this. i'm looking at his statutes, to appear to be somewhat vague and
ambiguous whether george zimmerman new trayvon martin was under the age of 18. he wants to look at the case law that interprets the intent of the statute to know for sure. we will wait and see what happens. >> we will see that comes up. he wants to tell you what is going on with the dow. it went through an intraday high this morning. all this is euphoria after ben bernanke signaled they may not turn off the spigot of money anytime in the near future. we will be right back with a lot more. every day we're working to be an even better company -
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having a good time on your vacation. >> we will see you back here tomorrow. >> writes now brand-new stories and breaking news. >> the 911 calls out for the moments just after the flight crashed in san francisco, the passengers begging for help. plus, unmanned drone now able to land itself at sea. is it the beginning of a new era in warfare? in a breakthrough in the boston strangler case. we'll tell you about it "happening now." good morning to you on this thursday. jenna: asterisk any details about the moments before the deadly asiana plane crash in san francisco. the panic and chaos that unfolded in the aftermath. authorities releasing dramatic