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tv   The Journal Editorial Report  FOX News  December 22, 2013 12:00pm-12:31pm PST

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say merry christmas, everybody. >> merry christmas. >> this week on the journal editorial report, federal judge slams the nsa surveillance program, and an obama-appointed panel called for major changes. so, how will the white house respond and will america's safety suffer? plus, pope francis, "time magazine's" man of the year, make something waves for his economic views. why some conservatives aren't happy. and an op-ed in our very own paper exposes a nasty rift in the democratic party. rum runs aren't the -- republicans aren't the only ones divided. welcome to the journal editorial report. a federal judge ruled this week that the national security
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agency bulk collection of phone records likely violates the constitution. calling the program, quote, almost orwellian. the ruling came days before a white house appointed panel released its own critique of the nsa and its activities and made some potentially dangerous recommendations for running -- reining it in. so, joe, you read this point and the nsa report. so, tell us first about the opinion. how powerful is it as a legal document, taking on the constitutionality of this program? >> it's not very compelling, paul. since 1979 supreme court decision, smith vs. maryland, metadata, phone records, information about information, has not been a search under the fourth amendment. >> according to the supreme
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court. >> ruling by harry blackman, who was no conservative, certainly, and if you entrust your data to a third party like a phone company or credit card company, you have no rome expectation of privacy. >> why did leon then say, that precedent -- he is a lower court judge -- why did he say that supreme court precedents doesn't apply right now? >> he said technology has changed so much that the case no longer obtains, but smith vs. med wasn't about how or how much metadata the government collects, whether it's the local police or the nsa. it's simply the fact that your metadata is not yours. it belongs to the third party. >> i think someone should file a lawsuit against amazon and american express on exactly the same basis. every day of the week we all convey enormous amounts of privacy to these web retailers,
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and nobody seems to complain.that. in fact there's much more intrusive -- >> the argue wouldn't be made, that's not the government. they don't have police powers. amazon and american express don't have police power. >> the issue is not just the government doing it. people worry about what will we done with the information, and given the story of target stores, you're information is in more danger in the private sector. >> the nsa has no police powers. just gathering reames of information, for possible clues that they would pass on -- say, someone is calling from pakistan a known terrorist is calling a number in utah, ten times, in a span of two weeks. they pass that on to the fbi which would look into it. get awater to -- >> have to get a warrant to do that. >> yes, police gathering tips. >> what best this report by the president's appointed panel, with basically came out and
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said, do away with that bulk collection effort, and did some other -- would put really significant restraints -- mott process restraints -- bureaucratic restrains didn't on these programs. >> it was unilaterally disarm surveillance. >> you think it's that serious. >> goes much farther than even the white house thought it would go. president obama called these wise men after edward snowden basically released all of the -- the nsa's playbook, and they came back and said, you have to curtail the meat a data program, change the way that a special court, a secret court, allows intelligence agencies to look into -- to follow up leads and curtails the president's powers to surveil overseas, especially to spy overseas. >> no other country has anything like that in terms of restraints, joe. on foreign intelligence gathering. as i understand it. >> it's very difficult to create
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rules for this kind of regime. the nature of anti-terror defenses is that you never know what you're going to need in advance. it's always, we need this information immediately. and we need to find it very fast. so, the idea that we're going to create a set of constraints before hand is really -- >> what about the argument, dan, that he libertarians in particular -- on the left and right -- that this is big brother. this is the intrusive state. and it is, as judge leon wrote, almost orwellian with this vast capacity to listen in on everything we do. is this an irrational fear or just something we have to come to live with, with some restraints in the -- on the government. >> i guess i would put it this way. those of us who live here in new york city in 2001, what happened on 9/11 was rather orwellian, i would say.
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and if you are al qaeda, which still exists, and you are seeing that the united states is issuing a report like this, and it's going to sue, at matt just suggested, you have to be happy. mike rogers, the house intelligence commitey, and dianne feinstein, senate intelligence committee, both said al qaeda is getting much more sophisticated in the weapons weapons and tech anythings. they have not gone to sleep and the question is, is the united states going to sleep? >> matt, the question is, where is the president on this? he accepted the report without comment. said we'll think about it. but it seems to me he has been voting present on this entire debay. he just doesn't want to defend or seems reluctant to defend the very powers he has been using for five years. >> his base obviously wants him to curtail this back. sort of -- in terms on the right, at the same time, he has been successful in preventing any terrorist attack on u.s.
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soil. >> why wouldn't he mention that? >> we haven't had another attack. other than the tsarnaev. >> he has not been able to speak out and defend the program. the key phrase in the report is potential risk to civil liberties but there's a very real risk and growing risk from al qaeda, which is now spreading from poise to africa and that is something he has to explain to the people. >> thank you all very much. when we come back, pope francis, the economist? time magazine's man of the year, angers some conservatives with his recent writings on inequality. our panel joins the fray next. i'm overhe hill. my body doesn't work the way it used to.
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inequality and denunsation of so, called trickle down economics is not sitting well with many economic conservatives. we're back with dan, mary, and james. so, we have the all catholic panel here. so, your theology is in order, gentlemen and mary. dan, what do you think about the impact? before we get into the specifics. the largest impact and impression that pope francis has made. >> well, you know, as catholics, we all speak latin, and -- the title of the letter was -- the joy of the gospel, not the joy of economics. and popes have always been concerned with the tension between materialism and spiritual life and the idea there is -- in the modern world there is excessive materialism, and they've always tried to strike a balance. i think it isn't just pope
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francis but his predecessors have had a tendency to deeply criticize capital him because they associate it with materialism. so they get into areas where they may be a little over they're head. but you have to understand, his concerns are with the moral life of people living in a capitolist world, and i think this pope has a particular gift for handling the religious side of that equation, and as he goes forward i think that's probably what we'll see more of him doing. >> another thing that made an impression, certainly on me and on millions of others, his humility and the degree to which he has shed the trappings of the grandure of the office and making calls to regular people and that sore of thing, and focusing less on the majesty of the church and more on its pastoral mission to serve individuals and salvation. has that made an impression on you? >> for sure. from the first moment that he was elected, he -- and he was
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attacked in argentina by certain people on the left. one of the things that elevated him was the fact he had really walked the walk there. as a cardinal in the could have been in the social circle and everybody, and everybody to a man said that this is a guy who spends all his time in the slums, with the poor, really walking the walk. he lived in a humble way and really lived his mission. >> let me read you, though, a passage here, and this gets into the economics -- from the pope's statement. some people continue to defend trickle down theories which assume that economic growth encouraged bay free market will inevitably succeed in bringing about greater justice and inclusiveness in the world. this opinion, which has never been confirmed by the facts, expresses a crude and naive trust in the goodness of those wielding economic power, and in the work little of the prevailing economic system. mary? how do you respond to that? >> there are two big problems with that. first, the idea that the market
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and market economics has not proven to lift people out of poverty? is, i would say, completely wrong. but secondly, later on in the document, he also says that since we can't trust the market, we have to rely on the state to defend the common good. and this is my real problem with the -- his points on economics. it's fine to say, you know, that he needs to shepherd the flock from materialism, but to say we can get closer to christ by engaging in this coercion by the state and forcing us to give and so forth, is completely contradictory to what i understand about christianity. >> through the ministrations of trickle down government. >> right. i would say that based on his experience doing his ministry in argentina, a very big government corporatist system, can understand cynicism if you think that's how markets work, if you think that is what the market
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is. but i do think it's amusing watching much of the media, which spends a lot of time pushing religion out of the public square, saying that religious teachings have nothing to say about public policy, embracing -- >> an interesting guy. ought to bring him in. but i think people do have that impulse. i want to be careful because there are parts of this document that liberals will not like. he criticizes spirit spiritual ity without faith. and redefining marriage from a mere emotional satisfaction and reconstruct it and modify it as will. so there's a lot of things that liberals may be offended by. >> are you disappoint in the economics -- >> yes. i was quite disappointed.
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i think part of what wore seeing here, paul, this is the first step forward of a rookie pope. popes have always traditionally been very careful about the way they describe these sorts of things, and francis, when he has cardinal in argentina was very outspoken. he is finding the modern media will define his views for him if he isn't more explicit, and he wasn't clear about these issues in this letter. i think that if he steps back, he'll see that a pope has to be a little more careful about choosing his words. >> i think the pope -- we don't listen to him for his views on tax rates but we listen to him as he is trying to save souls. >> the danger is that he -- these sound bites are taken by people who would defend the state. >> mary, thank you. when we come back, a "wall street journal" op-ed exposes a nasty split among democrats. is economic poppism a dead end
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well, a battle is raging inside the democratic party over an op-ed we published "wall street journal." two democratic veteran operative argue that economic populism is a dead end for their party and elizabeth warren, bill deblasio agenda willing not play well out of massachusetts and new york and now the campaign is on to purge these infidels from the liberal ranks. so, it was written in hour paper, these are not conservatives by any step of -- stretch of the imagination. what heresy did they commit? >> first of all saying that
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voters across the country might not be as liberal as people in new york city and massachusetts. depalacios -- >> do you think? >> the greater sin may have been saying in public, social secures is actually paying out more than it's taking in. you're not allowed to say that. i also think -- maybe a bit in the anger is the forum they chose. they were not exactly keeps this win the family of democratic discussion, so that's -- the fact it was in our pages rankled some people on the left. >> is economic populism, mary -- this is part of the reaction, deblasio in new york, taxing the rich, barack obama, ran in 2012 on taxing the rich, elizabeth warren made this her main theme. is this the dominant argument within democratic circles the days? these guys are pushing back against? >> certainly the obama style of
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democracy and for the democratic party is certainly that model. i think this is a really healthy conversation to have because basically it shows there's still some sane people inside the democratic party. i was amulessed be the fact that -- amused by the fact that it thought they had to out the author -- >> elizabeth warren, on the banking committee, sent a letter to several big institutions saying please disclose which think tanks you're giving money to as if somehow by having banks finance the think tanks corrupt what they say. >> then we fine out the center for american progress has an equally long list -- >> a liberal think tank. >> exactly. so it reveals -- a very healthy discussion to have because we're going to get a lot on the table here about what is really behind this feel-good populism. >> the arguments on social security in particular that the two gentlemen made in our newspaper goes back to bill
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clinton. that was a kind of argument democrats we are having in the 1990s. now basically in the minds of some democrats, you can't raise those issues. >> let's talk about that. you have bill clinton democrat and now barack obama democrat. they're not the same thing. ronald reagan said he didn't leave the democratic party. the democratic party left him. we're finding out there are liberals who are traditional and now progressives, the left wing of the democratic party, and these people are not singing from the same hymnal. i have been talking more and more about traditional liberal democrats who say i'm going independent. this is not my party anymore and i just can't really sign up for it fully. i think the democrats will have a real internal debate going forward over just what that party stands for. a lot of people represent what those guys wrote and they're being pushed out. >> the liberals and progressives
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say, we're actually winning elections. we won the presidency twice on the agenda. bill deblasio, elizabethway, other populist democrats are win. >> the most recent ones they won in new york and massachusetts massachusetts barack obama -- is that a formula for anybody or was there something special and historic about his campaign. you're not seeing it on msnbc among the louder members of the party, but you notice as far as i can tell the donors are not fleeing. you did not see a bunch of senators condemning them and renouncing all ties to the group. there were some who backed up a little under pressure. but basically elizabeth warren was not successful in getting senate democrats to embrace her view of basically an antibusiness agent. >> briefly, mary, who is going to win that debate? >> i think the center left will win. the perpetual motion machine that barack obama sold people is
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starting to come unglued. >> okay. mary, thank you. we have to take one more break. when he come walk, hits and misses of the week. this is the quicksilver cash back card from capil one. it's not the "limit the cash i earnvery month" card. it's not the "i only earn decent rewards at the gas station" card. it's the no-games, no-signing up, everyday-rewarding, kung-fu-fighting, silver-lightning-in-a-bottle, bringing-home-the-bacon cash back card. this is the quicksilver card from capital one. unlimited 1.5% cash back on eve purchase,
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time now for our hits and misses of the week. dan, first. >> i think we have to give a miss to barack obama on the nuclear arms negotiations. it looks like they're getting bogged down -- >> with iran. >> with iran. i'm sorry. the united states and iran cannot agree on the wording of the interim agreement. the french government criticized the negotiations again today, and on thursday a bipartisan group of senators introduced a bill to re-impose sanctions if if the talks fail. the talks are looking like mr. obama's agreement with putin >> but the president threatened to veto the bill. >> a hit for more obamacare accountability in the states than washington, dc. this week, the director of the
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minnesota health insurance exchange was forced out after taking a two-week vacation to costa rica while the state-base ed exchange flownerred. maryland's exchange director was forced out after a vacation in the cayman islands, kathleen sebelius due for some time off? she some hit the road. >> matt. >> in the spirit of the season i want to give a hit to president obama and for foreign policy move. this week, he announced he would not be attending the opening ceremonies of the sochi winter games in russia. this is a snub to president putin who is really putting a lot on this coming, out party. but this an overdue corrective in america's all-too indull gent policy toward russia. >> hear hear. if you have your own hit or miss, dial it at -- follow us on
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twitter. i know you are at jer on fnc. that's it for this week's show. thanks to you for watching. merry christmas. see you right here next week. little over 24 hours to go before a critical obamacare enrollment deadline. hello. glad you're with us. welcome to america's news headquarters. whether you are using or all those navigators out there to help you enroll, tomorrow night is the cutoff to sign up if you don't want a big gap in your health insurance coverage and insure that you are covered under the new health law come january 1st. doug mcle way is traveling with the president on vacation and joins us from honolulu, hawai'i. doug, is the president still planning on signing up for


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