tv FOX Friends FOX News May 19, 2016 3:00am-6:01am PDT
it to crash. they do believe there is a debris field and there are a lot of people headed that direction to try and find possibly any survivors. >> search and rescue underway right now. thank you so much for joining us for all the overnight coverage and you especially, heather. >> "fox & friends" starts right now. we begin this morning with breaking news overseas. an egyptairplane with 66 people on board as vanished. military search and rescue teams now investigating and so far they have been unable to rule out terrorism. >> egyptair 804 was minutes from landing at the cairo international airport. 45 minutes from landing when it vanished from the radar. >> the search for debris underway. here's the timeline to break down how it happened as we know it. the airbus took off from charles
de gaulle airport in paris at 11:09 p.m. >> the airplane was ten miles into egyptian air space flying at 37,000 feet when it simply disappeared from the radar. egyptair confirmed an automated emergency distress signal sent from the plane two hours after it crashed at about 4:20 in the morning. we'll go right to benjamin live in london with the breaking details. benjamin? >> reporter: yeah, good morning. we have been following this story all night now. and there are conflicting reports about what exactly happened. in particular, that moment where we had there was a distress call that came through from the pilot. the plane disappeared after that. but the egyptian military said there was no distress call. that the plane just went down. we are just hearing in the last few minutes that the director of greece's civil aviation
authority said that greek authorities and controllers tried to make contact with the pilot ten minutes after he left the air space and he did not respond. they continued to reach him right up until the plane went off the radar. now the plane was flying at 37,000 feet. the weather was clear. this plane, the a-320, made a trek last wednesday so it was said to be in good condition despite reports of a spotty past. the pilot himself had over 6,000 hours of flying time over 2,500 hours in this airplane. many are speculating what happened. and the search has now moved to the seabed, the mediterranean, where ships are converging of the location of a beacon which they say was set off possibly by one of the black boxes. but the first ship to reach that point, a cargo ship, said they couldn't see any floating debris. no oil slick in the vicinity.
and so where this thing came down exactly still remains a mystery. again, people are saying it was near takrit and another island. many are starting to speculate perhaps this was the work of terrorists. that's one of the great fears for cairo and egypt. and egypt is going to great lengths to say do not rush to conclusions despite the fact that the prime minister, the french prime minister said everything is on the table. and the french have already offered their condolences to the egyptians, which does indicate that they believe this plane has definitely gone down. so the search operation taking over now. they have hercules airplanes in the air, they have a number of ships heading to the area desperately hoping to find either survivors or possibly the black box. that's all we know at the moment, the desperate search going on trying to piece together the important minutes in the air between the possible distress signal and the disappearing off the radar. but this is a significant point
which suggests there may be foul play. back to you. >> thank you for that report. according to the european papers this morning, the captain of "merchant ship" saw what he described as a flame in the sky. >> that's right. but it is a busy sea space. you would think more than one person would have seen the flames in the sky, especially since this happened in the middle of the night. but more people will come forward if they did see anything today. we'll bring in the coo here and former director at the department of defense. john, i have to wonder if the u.s. is now playing a major role here underneath the wire, because we have presence all over the region, correct? >> that is correct. >> so what do you think we go first? what do you think is happening? who is coordinating? >> the french and the egyptians will be coordinating with all the assets in the region that could potentially help, not just
with the search but with any indicators through the tracking of the aircraft to understand where it may have went down, because the primary thing right now is to find where the aircraft went down and recover the transponder boxes. >> that's right. of course, it is over water and will make it tougher. >> yes. >> if something was taken on board this flight, how in the world would it have gotten through security in france? >> well, you have to look at two different scenarios because of recent events. could this have been something that was brought in by a passenger or given to a passenger after security such as a situation that happened last year in africa. the other more plausible scenario is with something place in the cargo hold more strategically place to cause catastrophic damage at that altitude. because we saw the incident with the suicide bomber trying to blow up the aircraft and he did nothing more than blow a hole in the aircraft and kill himself. whereas the cargo hold, still the not proven scenario, but widely accepted, was a
relatively small device that actually took the plane down, the one that came out last year. >> but they say there were no dangerous cargo or things taken on the plane. >> correct. this could have been a situation where somebody on the ground in paris was able to get something into the aircraft, you have to look at the ground crews right around the shift change, so the individual could have done it and easily been long gone out of the airport before anything was suspected. but that's a scenario they have to play through heavily today. >> absolutely. and paris has had its share of trouble with isis. nobody, we should point out at this point, has taken responsibility for this. i look for that coming in the next couple of hours or so. but wouldn't it also be possible, john, for somebody somewhere along the way, given if fact that this particular airplane landed in five different locations over the last 24 hours, somebody had one of the other places could have
set a timer for 30 hours in something, put it somewhere on the plane and then just waited? >> well, that is a scenario they have to look at. you have to look at every plausible scenario and then work through each one no matter how remotely possible it is that that's going to happen. and that is one of the scenarios looked at because of the airports that it flew in and out of in the last two days, some of them have more questionable security. charles de gaulle has tight security. but because of recent incidents they are definitely a target there. >> what i'm thinking of, too, is they are offering words of condolences, everyone is thinking the worst, but the term "rescue," is that still something everyone is using? is there a move now to see if there were survivors if it did go down in the mediterranean? and who would take the lead on that, the closest ships, the closest assets or the country of
france or egypt? >> two things, it would be a joint effort. it will be in egyptian waters so they would be the lead, but everyone will lend assistance, the french, if the u.s. has ships in the region that can do that, the greeks, they will help to look for that. because you have to take into consideration all extreme scenarios. and if there are passengers that survived, you have to find where they might be and rescue them no matter how remote the chance until it's proven they are not alive anymore. >> john, as a terrorism expert, what is the first thing they do? do they look at the manifest and each passenger? in your experience, what is the first thing investigators do? >> absolutely. they will look at the passenger manifest, of course the flight crew because flight crews have been indicated in events before such as the suicide with the incident in germany last year. you have to look at the flight crew, the passengers, where the flight went in and out of, the
ground crews working the particular aircraft, was there any anomalies to the situation such as last-minute adds or deletes, not just from the passengers but from the people working the ground staff, somebody called in sick and all of a sudden a unique individual was working that flight is suspicious. you go through all of that as fast as possible and thorough as possible to try to track this down. one is to solve what potentially happened but most importantly to make sure this is not something that can be repeated, whether today or in five years. you have to lock it down now. >> indeed. john rose, thank you very much for joining us right now. we are joined live in the studio, he's a pilot and aviation expert, sal, when we talk about egyptair says it has crashed at this point because they don't know exactly what happened, this is the a-320, the best selling airplane, it has an
excellent safety record, and on board at the time apparently there were three air marshals, which for this particular leg is standard. >> that's what they say is standard. i find that a little bit of overkill. >> they say nine attempted hijackings on egyptair. that's incredible. >> they are accused of being lax in security so maybe they do overkill at this point. but it is a very popular airplane. there's no major mechanical issues that we have seen over the years. it's in service all over the world, especially in the united states. >> and it is at the altitude of 37,000 feet. >> 37,000 feet is where it was. i have to believe at the point in the profile of the flight it was actually probably starting to descen d at that point. >> one minute after getting into the egypt air space, then two minutes later that is when people on the ground lost contact, it was out of radar.
is that -- >> if you are going to buy into a nefarious act, this is the perfect place to do it. we don't see a lot of accidents at 37,000 feet, cruise altitude. it was there for several hours. what could go wrong in the air at that altitude? very few things. something happened at this perfect spot on this timeline of the flight where if you were planning an explosion, that's where -- >> could it be someone on board that knows about the air space? as a passenger, most of us don't know when you are entering another air space? >> they could have had gps on board. sometimes they have the screens down on jetblue and other flights. or they could have known just the time. three hours into the flight, you know you are over water. >> apparently there was a distress signal that was sent out, automated from the airplane after it already crashed. but given the fact that -- let's
go back to the airplane at some thousand feet, if it was a fire, the crew could have called for mayday. if one of the jet engines blew out, they could call mayday. if it was a wing falling off, they would have time. but does this suggest something brutal happened? >> yes, pilots learn to use air traffic controllers as an extra person in the cockpit. if you have a problem, you do reach out to the nearest airport. some place to land or have this plane come down in a less populated area. all of that figures into a pilot's psyche at that point. none of that happened as far as we know yet. there is also automatic signals put out from a cockpit. we send a transponder to tell the radar controllers there's an emergency on the airplane. we have not heard that happened. all we heard was that emergency locator transmitter, which is an after crash activation, is what
went off and it went off either in the water or nearby. >> no tiwe know time matters, wt can we do to pick up the pinging underneath the water? what is happening right now? >> they are probably putting that plan into motion as we speak. we have a mediterranean sea that is not very deep. we have a good location, at least a general location of where that elp went off. it's not like the malaysian crash where we had no clue and still have no clue where in the ocean that airplane was. this is a little closer and we have a lot of radar in that area. italy has radar, we have military radar from the united states and sicily. and we have overt satellites. >> if there is so much radar in that area, how in the world does the plane just disappear? >> correct. i don't think it will disappear for long. especially with the amount of different countries involved. it's going to be hard to hide anything that happened out
there. so i think within a few hours we'll start to get much more information on what happened. >> it's interesting, our secretary of state was in egypt on wednesday, so i imagine that is going to make it easier to get the u.s. cooperation with some high-ranking u.s. officials there. >> that and the fact our military is there in force. the sicily bases, our ships at sea are in the mediterranean sea right now. >> as a pilot, what is going through your mind if you had to fly today and passengers as well? >> you want to know what the heck happened. because if what happened can happen again, i don't want it on my aircraft. >> no kidding. sal, pilot and aviation expert, thank you for coming in on short notice. now we'll talk to sebastian corcoran, he isser t a terroris expert, when the plane falls off radar all of a sudden, what do
you think happened? >> we have to be cautious with these events. it can take days, weeks and months to learn what happened. so we'll look at what we know. we know the aircraft lost control with air traffic control for a lengthy period. that is, in itself, suspicious. as you already noted, it was at a high altitude. also, not something we usually see with accidents, whether induced events or so forth. thirdly, where is it flying? it's flying from paris, the site of multiple jihadi attacks to egypt where we have an offshoot of isis killing hundreds of people in the last couple of years. so the destination and the origination points are symbolically important from the point of jihadis. lastly, if you look at the flight manifest, this aircraft has been everywhere in the last few days. from brussels to beirut to
casablanca, it's been to all kinds of airports where there is, let's say, put it politely, less than a fully western standard of security. put all those things together and it starts to get quite suspicious, steve. >> democrat gorka, if anyone is tough on terror, it's been general el sisi. >> you are absolutely right. if you look at isis, the number one jihadi threat outside of isis and syria, their number one targets in the region are jordan and egypt. president sisi declared war on the muslim brotherhood, which is the granddaddy of all jihadi organizations and has been fighting this isis affiliate with real robustness in the sinai. if you are a jihadi looking for a local target in the middle
east, egypt is at the top of your list, brian. >> wow, if you're looking at patterns, patterns of isis, is this a pattern, would you consider this something that maybe isis could be involved with based on history and based on the past? >> yes. so isis is a new organization, just eight or nine years ago it was an al qaeda franchise. it was al qaeda in iraq. you have all that history of al qaeda, plane hijackings, 9/11, the printer cartridge blow, all those lines. on the top of that, we have to recognize that this is the threat that wants to expand in the region, wants to take its fight to our allies and our partners. and remember, the russian jet that exploded that was taken down over the sinai, over egypt, what was it, seven months ago? that attack was claimed by isis. >> absolutely. and so -- i know it's early, but
all signs seem to indicate that it was some sort of terror attack. it is also interesting that on thursday, france's spy chief warned of an impending attack. he said, some sort of new form of attack, he was not really specific about it, regarding isis. and, of course, paris, where this particular flight originated, has been under a state of emergency ever since that attack. >> yeah, absolutely. that is hugely important. we know in several nations of europe we have seen a heightened state of alert. let's not forget how recently we had the airport attack in brussels. we had the double attacks in paris. we have got to be super cautious to wait to get as much information as possible. but if you add the pieces of the jigsaw together, so far this does not look as if this is a manmade accident that is done by the pilot or somebody else.
the a-320 has an incredible record. this airframe is just 12 years old. that's nothing when you look at commercial airliners. so right now i would be very, very suspicious. >> yeah, i think the whole thing is interesting, only 66 people on that flight, that is half full. so they are not looking for maximum casualties but looking for the headline, if it is terror. >> right. so remember, terrorism is fundamentally about spreading fear. if you want to spread fear as far and wide as possible, you look for symbolic targets. that's why 9/11 it was the twin towers, the pentagon and the third target was the capitol. so symbolism is important. hitting an egyptian airliner flying from a western nation they have already targeted like paris to the most important regional target of egypt, that
really -- that ticks the boxes from the perspective of the jihadi about the symbolism he needs to achieve in a targeted attack. >> you have made this your life's work. you go to other countries and train them what to look for as far as terrorism is concerned. what is happening behind the scenes right now? >> right now we are going to see a complete breakdown of everybody who was in contact with that aircraft over the last weeks, whether it's professionals that are flying it, maintaining it, servicing it, the ground crew, the passengers, that is what they are going to be going through with a fine-tooth comb. on top of that, now we are in the age of the internet, we are going to be having what is called the scrubbing of social media. they are going to be looking for any indication of somebody taking responsibility. >> all right. dr. sebastian gorka, thank you. coming up next, egyptair has a long list of crashes and
hijackings. so what can we learn from the previous disasters? we'll talk to a reporter doug lezader who is a pilot as we try to figure out what happened to egyptair ms-804. ♪ if you have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis isn't it time to let the real you shine through? introducing otezla, apremilast. otezla is not an injection, or a cream. it's a pill that treats plaque psoriasis differently. some people who took otezla saw 75% clearer skin after 4 months. and otezla's prescribing information has no requirement for routine lab monitoring. don't take otezla if you are allergic to any of its ingredients. otezla may increase the risk of depression. tell your doctor if you have a history of depression or suicidal thoughts, or if these feelings develop. some people taking otezla reported weight loss. your doctor should monitor your weight and may stop treatment.
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pretty safe and around since the '80s. there are all kinds of a-320s flying around the world, especially in the middle east. so it is not unusual to have a lot of a-320s flying around. as far as the airline itself, egyptair has had incidents, most of them involving a hijacking, which is part of the region in which it flies. so we don't know what role the airline or the aircraft itself may have played in this, but again, a number of people have said this, the fact that you have an airliner go down from apparently cruising altitude of 37,000 feet raises all kinds of questions. investigators will no doubt look at security procedures both in france and in egypt to figure out exactly who handled this aircraft, kind of the chain of custody, if you will, throughout the course of the past few days to figure out who it may have come in contact with. but there are a lot of mysteries here, but the history of the aircraft is pretty good.
the history of the airline does involve incidents that relate to terrorism. that's a concern here moving forward. back to you guys. >> doug, do you remember back in, i believe it was 1999, an egyptair flight that originated in los angeles was bound for cairo. eventually it went down in the atlantic and after months of speculation and investigation, they figured out that the pilot actually committed suicide. >> yeah. the good news in this circumstance, if you can find any good news here, is the fact that we have an isolated area. and if there is an electronic beacon going off, they should find the crash site quickly. but if this broke up while going down, it could be a huge debris field. >> which could be why radar saw it disappear. thank you. terrorism is not ruled out yet in the egyptair crash, so what should american airports be doing this morning to keep us safe? a former senior intelligence
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♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ here is what happened overnight, an egyptair flight disappeared from radar over the mediterranean sea. >> it happened 174 miles from the egyptian coast shortly after entering egyptian air space. the plane was flying at 37,000 feet. 66 people were on board. no americans were on that flight. >> and we are learning that the greek authorities spoke to the pilot and the pilot did not record any problems. minutes later the plane was gone. >> amena asheroff is joining us live from cairo. good morning. >> good morning. the egyptian authorities on all fronts including the prime minister, the army spokesperson,
the minister of civil aviation are urging the media to be careful when reporting about this crash. they are asking people not to jump to conclusions. of course they are scared and do not want people speculating saying this is related to terrorism. egypt has taken many hits in this regard and this was only to worsen the country's situation. also, they have gone out to say they have not ruled out terrorism and are still waiting for the investigation which they are conducting together with the french and the greeks. also, a press conference will be held at 1:00 p.m. cairo time to update people about the recent developments. and this comes after the egyptian army has dispatched flights over the area, which the plane allegedly has gone missing, to be able to search for the debris or any clues of what might have happened. world leaders have been contacting egyptian president abdel fattah el-sisi. and egyptians are just waiting
after the news now. many have gone on twitter and facebook and other forms of social media to express their grave concern and disappointment. this is the third event in this year that has plagued egypt and it is very likely to affect the country's economic situation. and it's already ailing sector. >> egypt is not view in a positive light, how hard is it to cover any story there? >> it's quite difficult because there are a lot of restrictions on the media and, you know, the egyptian authorities are also always issuing statements telling the people to be careful, so people are scared to cover anything that is not directly given to them by the state authority. so this creates a sort of confusion because even among the state authority, there are a lot of different reports about what exactly happened in this situation. >> okay. all right. amina ashrof, thank you.
jp is here with us, an aviation expert, there was no distress call but a distress signal was sent out. apparently automatically by the airplane? how does that work? >> there would not be an automatic signal from the airport unless it was from the cockpit recorder or elt. >> what is elt? >> it's an emergency signal coming from the cockpit recorder or the flight recorder when it hits land or is in the water. that's the automatic function they may be eluding to. but the fact there is a discrepancy whether the pilot spoke and said verbally i have an emergency or did he dial in and emergency code in his transponder. very different. >> jp, what is amazing is they say as planes get more advanced it is easier to fly, but because they are so advanced maybe the pilots aren't as resourceful as
earlier pilots were because they haven't been forced to do as much hands-on work, is that correct? >> you're being very kind. basically it comes down to the point of pilot confusion between an aircraft flying beautifully 98% of the time. what you're talking about is the pilot confusion that comes about with a full-blown emergency where the pilot now has to go to manual skills that have been lost due to the computer. and there is also a computer pilot interface that has been creating confusion. and that is a problem. >> you keep using computers but you lose your instincts by what you see. >> you lose your instincts and scans. when in a full-blown emergency like the malaysian aircraft that went into a thunderstorm, there's a point in time when you try to take over manually and this computer cascades down to where you fly it manually. but then at a certain altitude the computer takes over and fights the pilot for command.
and that -- you don't have that much time. >> we don't know if this happened, but this is a lot of times when things start going haywire, that's when human beings take over. >> yes. in this particular case, you're right about the problem that exists in the airlines and 447 coming up from south america required a whole different training report with air france. but in this particular case, if the aircraft blew up in flight, it doesn't necessarily mean there was a bomb. it could have been a catastrophic explosion decompression that fractured the aircraft and also incapacitated the pilots. >> when we talk about the pilots, the captain had 6,275 flying hours and the co-pilot almost 3,000. is that a lot? >> well, for european airlines, yes. more importantly, that captain had 2,000 hours plus in that exact aircraft. basically in almost all the aircraft, even the new ones, it's about the thousand mark when you begin to feel
comfortable really in the airplane and maybe complacent. as far as i'm concerned from what i see on that, at 6,000 hours, however you got them, but the 2,000 hours very significant. that's good. >> so it sounds like the air crew knew what they were doing. and it is a very safe airplane. so what does your gut tell you? >> my gut tells me that this aircraft disappeared from radar at about near where you would start the descent point to cairo. airplanes don't just disappear from radar. this thing is driving along 5,000 miles an hour. it's transmitting on a transponder but air traffic controller is reading that. now, a catastrophic failure fails that transponder, it doesn't fail the primary radar that is actually sweeping and painting with the reflectives. so however this airplane blew up in flight, because it must've
blown up in flight or incapacitated the pilots, you would still have debris coming down and a wide dispersal. very wide. >> so the radar could pick that up unless the pieces are too small. >> you are never going to get pieces, if not chaff, aluminum foil coming down. you are talking an airplane of a fairly decent size. >> do they know something and are not telling us? >> from my experience in flying in egypt and air traffic control in those areas, yes. because in any case, right now, right now at this moment, air traffic control could tell you, yes, we were speaking to him and he declared an emergency. they can tell you that right now. it's on tape. but they are not going to because of the restrictions from the government. >> so jp, thank you so much. stay close, we'll look to chat with you again throughout the broadcast. >> my pleasure. meanwhile, we'll change gears a little bit to bring in steve rogers, former intel officer at the fbi international
joint task force. steve, welcome to the couch from the green room. steve, sadly, when we get a chance to see you, it is tragedies like this. you have heard a lot of speculation throughout the night, you have looked at your own analysis, what do you think? >> steve said something very significant this morning and i have not heard it said anywhere. he said this aircraft landed in four or five different locations before it got to charles de gaulle, we are talking catastrophic failure regarding the aircraft but there could be a catastrophic failure regarding security. i was just thinking it was only de gaulle airport but this string of airports this aircraft lands, there was a failure in security, if, in fact, it's a terrorist attack. >> and because the plane went on a crazy route back and forth across the mediterranean. somewhere at one of the -- somebody at one of the lesser secure airports, the worker or somebody else, could have planted something in the
airplane, put it on a timer, set it for 24 hours, 36 hours, 12 hours -- >> good point. where are the dogs? where is the technology? all the equipment that we say worldwide is now in place to prevent a tragedy like this, now what we must be thinking in the united states is, we're going to have to check every single aircraft with those dogs, with the technology we have to make sure that there's nothing in the baggage departments, on the aircraft, et cetera. >> should we be doing that already? >> should have been done. >> but they don't? >> we don't know. we don't know at this point. but it's going to have to be done now. >> well, i just say this, donald trump just tweeted this out and said this, looks like yet another terrorist attack. airplane departed from paris. when will we get tough, smart and vigil. >> when are we going to get tough? it goes back to a guest earlier that talked about what we are doing with isis in the mideast. you have to decapitate them. mr. trump said we have to cut the head off of isis. we have to respond to terrorism
with strength. hopefully, if the time comes, he'll be able to do that. >> and we'll see this as terrorism. >> we don't know. what we do know is what we don't know. we won't know until the black box. that will tell it all. >> looking at the manifest, what do you make of that? >> there's a widespread of people from different countries. it is hard to say they were targeting one country. but keep in mind, targeting one country, usually you send a message to the country. but what is interesting to me, isis or no organization has relaid responsibility for this. it could have been a lone wolf. >> it just takes one. unfortunately, three kids were on board, three infants. >> tragic. there were 30 egyptians on board. steve, stay here. in the meantime, we are looking at the radar and things like that, tell us, it happened in the dead of night, but what was the weather like last night for this particular flight?
and also, actually, early this morning, what is the weather going to be like for the search? >> well, this time of the year is a pretty dry time out there. it's a dry climate, a lot of people travel to places like greece during this time of the year because the weather is so quiet. so we have no reports of storms out there over the past 12 hours. we had clear skies. excellent visibility. and no reports either of any clear air or turbulence that could affect the plane. now, temperatures there are about 70 degrees fahrenheit. so that shouldn't be an issue either. and water temperatures are relatively warm. just about the same in the 70s. something to note, though, it is a pretty deep ocean out there, mediterranean sea. it's pretty deep out there. you're talking several thousand feet deep. so that could play a factor. >> if there are survivors, it is 70 degrees? >> yes, i think they could last for more than ten hours potentially over water. i'm not 100% sure as far as how long they could be there before they start suffering from hypothermia, but it is not a cold water. >> big picture, if someone says this has to be weather-related,
you don't see it. >> i don't see it. >> you don't see any weather activity to cause this? >> no. >> maria, thank you very much. so steve, given the fact it was not weather, given the fact that the airplane has a great safety record, then you start looking down the list -- it looks like it could be -- >> it could be. the totality of circumstances at the end of the day will determine that. if it was a terrorist act, we have a real problem with security at our airports worldwide. and we have to look at what we are doing here to make sure that is not going to happen here. >> brian, you just mentioned that donald trump tweeted -- he just tweeted out in the last couple of minutes, looks like another the terrorist attack. airplane departed from paris. when will we get tough, smart and vigilant? great hate and sickness! it is 18 minutes before the top of the hour. coming up, what happened aboard that doomed egyptair flight? it is still a mystery at this hour. our next guest leah gabriel flew
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breaking news, an egyptair flight totaling vanishing from radar. here to weigh in, a former navy pilot and fox news correspondent. good morning, leah. >> good morning, guys. good to see you. >> interesting, out of the cairo airport, families were supposed to pick up family members for the loved ones never arrived. >> this is a horrible situation for them. after moving to this location, the search and rescue, trying to find the remnants of the plane and trying to find any indications of what actually happened here. >> you have a serious of things
happening. coming from egypt to paris, you would say, okay, here we go again with egyptian airlines or an egyptian airport. but when you look at something like paris, you feel pretty good going to charles de gaulle airport. >> we saw the recent attack in paris and brussels. this region has become more volatile. it's important to look at the entire region. when you look at egypt, look at the sinai peninsula, they have an isis affiliate very robust there. just back in july this group claimed to have shot an egyptian ship, egyptian navy, the sixth largest in the world, lots of vessels there, they have been threatened by terrorist organizations including one related to isis recently. so you have to look at the whole region. and turn east and look at the naval port that russia has off the coast of syria. we have seen russian planes do interesting things recently, buzzing different types of
ships, u.s. navy ships, you don't know what is happening in the area, but there's a lot of hostile activity. >> he brings up the scenario of something happening in security in paris, but what else can happen? >> 37,000 feet something goes off radar, no distress call, the plane most likely disappeared meaning something catastrophic in or out of the plane. a bomb is likely unless something happened catastrophically in the structure of the airplane. and something outside of the airplane could have taken it down. we hear it could have been shot down by a surface to air missile. there are a lot of militaries, navies, they are operating in the waters that have capabilities of shooting aircraft down. >> we saw the tragedy of the ukraine an passenger jet flying over the hostile region when it got shot down for erroneous reasons. but would you believe that we would be able to see the video from satellite images should a rocket have been fired at that
plane? >> i think there will be a lot of different intelligence input coming in. u.s. navy is there, we have six stationed at naples, we have a lot of assets in the navy. i flew in and around this area. there will be signals of intelligence and satellite. a lot of different images coming in. but i want to point out a miscalculation could have occurred. it's happened in the u.s. it's not somethingic lie ii i remember, but back in 1988 this happened. it is a scenario if you want to consider everything, that could have happened from one of the navies operating in the mediterranean as well. >> wouldn't we have heard from them, hey, we are sorry we have done that? >> i don't think you would have heard that by now. i think they want to cover it up. depending on what country it was, yeah, i mean, i don't think that -- >> russia said they shot down the passenger plane.
>> i know the egypt army and navy are out there, obviously they have been deployed. greece is joining in on the search. france is pledging votes to assist. what about the u.s.? >> i spoke with a search and france is pledging planes and ships to assist. what about the u.s.? >> i spoke with a u.s. navy spokesman who told me that if navy ships are in the area that it would be normal for us to get involved in the search and rescue effort. i haven't gotten an update from him yet. this morning as to whether, we have ships on scene. from my experience in the navy, it would be shocking if we were not either there or on our way there to assist in the sonar and the search and rescue in general. >> what about the mediterranean sea, is it really busy even in the middle of the night? >> yeah, for navies, merchant activity. i think something will turn up pretty quickly here. >> lea gabrielle, that would be great. thanks. still ahead, egypt's economy already in turmoil, can they handle this crisis and what does it mean for the migrant problem hampering europe in general?
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well, we have a fox news alert, egyptair flight 804 crashed over the mediterranean sea into the sea, that is. with the country's economy already in bad shape after dealing with this -- the refugee crisis in egypt, what can we expect now? let's turn to stuart varney, the host of "varney & co." he joins us right now to explain. explain this regarding the refugees. >> i think this destabilizing egypt even more. it's already on shaky ground economically and politically. an incident like this further destabilizes its which i think this will encourage the refugee crisis. that's already hitting europe. i think that gets worse with every incident of this type. remember, egypt is just right
across the mediterranean sea from southern europe. just like libya, just like the other countries of north africa. if you destabilize that whole economy and i think this will, you further put pressure on more refugees to leave in their boats and get across the european -- across the mediterranean. >> i don't know if you saw our reporter from egypt, they have been cautioned by the government already not to say terrorism. because it's already had a detrimental effect on the country on tourism. they thrived on tourism for decades and no one has gone there for for years. >> and they will be hurt more. >> and security is so tight in paris because it's affected their government and their economy they can't afford for things like this to happen. >> it destabilizes the whole security in europe. this took off from charles de gaulle airport in paris. i don't know where it was before then, brussels or casablanca.
but the whole idea of the secure european airport is thrown into doubt by incidents of this kind. i also think that may be good politically for donald trump. >> why? >> he's already tweeted out saying this is probably terrorism. i believe that's the nature of his tweet. he's the guy who's saying, hands off, keep muslims out, temporarily, whilst we figure out who comes in. incidents of this type is surely a plus for donald trump. >> sure. and the other problem is in this country, we have a security problem with the tsa people can't get through the lines. >> but there is that too. >> only going to get worse. >> only will get worse. >> bring a cot. stuart, thank you. coming up on a thursday, we continue with our breaking story. while you were sleeping a passenger plane flying from paris en route to cairo disappeared midair, went down in the mediterranean. what went wrong? we're live in paris coming up next.
7:00 here in new york city on a may 19th. we're following breaking news from overseas. an egyptair airliner flight 804 with 66 people on board has vanished over the mediterranean sea, lost from radar. investigators not ruling anything out at this point including the possibility of terror. >> it was flight number 804 flying from paris to cairo when it dropped off to radar. we are just learning that the pilot never reported any problems. the search for debris and possible survivors, there were three children on board, now under way. >> okay. the airbus is an a-320, took off from paris, charles de gaulle after 11:00 local time on wednesday. children and infants were on board as well as seven crew members, three air marshals which we're told is standard.
>> the jetliner was ten miles into egyptian air space which some people think is suspicious. it was flying at 37,000 altitude when it dropped off the air. an automated distress signal was sent from the plane two hours later. so far we have not heard of any m mayday. >> 30 egyptians, 15 french, nine other nationalities. no americans on that flight. >> let's get the latest. greg palkot has been tracking the breaking details live outside charles de gaulle airport in paris. we seem to go to you all the time, greg, when something like this happens. what are you able to find out? >> reporter: well, brian and gang, this is what i was about to say. here we are from paris again, with bad news again. what that news really is, well, we're looking at right now. we are in front of terminal 1, the egyptair gate is right behind us. this is where the ill fated
egyptair flight 804 left a couple of hours ago and just in the past hour we have heard from french president hollande. he's the highest level official we have heard from yet and he confirms the sad news, that yes, the plane has crashed. probably all aboard lost. 66 people, you have noted 56 passengers including three children. but he came right fast after that with some more information. and that is the truth in his words will come out. the paris prosecutors office announcing it is investigating this crash not necessarily because it is terror related, because for sure there's a huge french stake in this. it left from the french airport, it's a french airplane, airbus, also 15 french passengers on board. as you mentioned. we also heard there were egyptians on board as well as europeans and other people from
around the world. let's quickly go through what happened very briefly. you have been mapping it out, but we're getting new information. for 3 1/2 hour, it was in the air going from paris to cairo. the plane apparently according to new reports was just finishing going through greek air space and being talked to by greek air controllers and ten minutes later, there was nothing to be heard from the plane. ten minutes more, it enters egyptair space and then its drops 37,000 feet. it drops, disappears from the radar screen. just as it enters the egyptian air space and about 175 miles from egyptian territory. the question is -- what will the paris prosecutor's office be looking at? a-320 is a solid plane, a work horse plane, but certainly a technical reason, a human error could be behind it. but also as i'm sure you have been noting, terror will be looked at as well. there are reasons for sure to
attack this plane. france has been the target of isis. we have seen that again and again. this was identifiably a french target. egypt has been the target of isis or an arm of isis which is operating in the sinai peninsula in egypt. they too could have been involved and in fact we saw another plane last year with isis taking it down. so those will be looked at very hard. the plane too we have learned was back and forth, back and forth five times without any kind of a layover between egypt and europe and africa. certainly an opportunity for something to go wrong. but we must caution once again we do not know what caused it. terror is one thing. certainly being looked at. technical reasons, human error, are all being looked at right now. it's all open and for the grieving families here in paris as well as those in cairo, they're watching, waiting and wondering to get some kind of word or confirmation about what
happened, guys. >> greg, thanks so much. that's the latest from france where we know now -- we'll check in with greg throughout the broadcast, that french president has said this. unfortunately, the information we have confirms to us the plane came down and is lost. >> that's right. and that is why the french prosecutors have also launched an investigation. not based on the fact they know it's terror. they want to know what happened. >> that's right. >> all right, let's bring in john lucic, a licensed commercial pilot and a former state criminal investigate. also, an aviation expert and terror expert, dr. sebastian gorka. >> author of "defeating jihad." >> john, let's start with you. what do you think happened? >> the most probable thing is terrorism. if you hear the reports coming out, flames in the sky, but remember air france, 447, out of rio de janeiro, that airplane was still falling apart in the
sky. acars was coming out -- >> what was coming out? >> the acars system. they got data. if a pilot is having a problem, he's 30 or 40 minutes out of cairo he would start descending. they didn't see a descent in altitude. they see it disappear. no message is being sent. it had to be a catastrophic failure because of the flames report, i have to think it blew up. so the most probable cause because of all the problems that egyptair has been having is got to be terrorism. >> dr. gorka is a terrorism expert, he's written a book about this. do you agree with john, dr. gorka? >> i'd be cautious. i would say what are the signs? at the moment the pieces of the jigsaw puzzle look as if it could be terrorism for multiple reasons.
the destination, cairo, the origination point. paris. both very symbolically important for jihadis. yes, the height at which it occurred and most suspiciously of all, the fact that the greek air traffic controllers lost contact with the crew long before the plane dropped off radar. that is very suspicious. if you add those things together, the high -- the loss of contact, the destination point, it leans towards the likelihood of a terrorism attack, but we must be cautious. >> hey, listen to this, j.p. the greek officials confirmed the aircraft was in egyptian air space when it made sudden swerves. could be that in reaction to the hit, could that be the pilot doing that in today's era of automation? >> it could be the depressurization and then you have the aircraft going in the
sky. so yes, that would be plausible. i would hesitate to say the greek atc from what i have read, handed them off to the egyptian air traffic control. as i stated before, egypt atc could clear up one definite thing -- did you have control, did they check in with you and he was still a few miles -- about 50 miles away from the start of the descent point. i'm not really heading toward the terrorist business of blowing that aircraft out of the sky because the explosive decompression can cause a maj majmajor limit ace of the communications of the aircraft. so there's weight, but likely -- like he just said, i'm cautious about laying it right on terrorism. >> i don't see that as -- i don't see it as a probability. i didn't say that it was terrorism. i said it's most likely
probable. >> it's also -- isn't it suspicious though just the fact that it was ten miles into egyptian air space? it had been flying all across europe for the last 24 hours. suddenly, ten miles into it, boom, it's gone. >> off the screen, not descending or anything. and it's -- nobody can explain but what makes it worse we're dealing with a government that doesn't want to release anything an that's a problem. >> our secretary of state landed there wednesday obviously not knowing this tragedy was going to take place. they didn't let the press go with the secretary of state because they don't want the press asking the egyptian government about any questions. the government is a good friend to us, but not necessarily to the press. but dr. gorka, in the big picture remember what happened when the russian airliner went across the turkish border they
took it out. i'm not saying that happened here, but could they have taken it out by mistake? is that possible? >> governments have the capacity to do this. you can't do that with a shoulder launched missile. it's flying way too high. 37,000 feet. but again, if you look at the circumstantial evidence, this is, you know, suspicious. the a-320 very reliable airframe. this particular plane is only 12 years old. that's nothing in terms of aircraft longevity. on top of that let's not forget the russian airliner that was blown out of the sky over sinai, over egypt just seven months ago which afterwards was claimed by isis. so again, we have to wait, we have to get more evidence. but if you have to make a call right now, it is very suspicious. >> that russian aircraft being blown out of the sky has not been definitively stated. the russians have stated it, i heard president obama give the
possibility, but no one has come up with any explosive residue on any report that i have ever seen that tells me that that russian aircraft was in fact blown out of the sky. >> and john, that's going to be one of the problems going forward because this plane fell into the mediterranean. so, you know, forforensically, trying to figure out what went wrong is going to be hard. >> once we got the black box we'll find out what went wrong. you'll get residue off of that. >> someone will say they saw something. a captain saw like a fireball in the sky. we'll hear from more people, aren't we, that came out. this happened in the middle of the night, if there was a fire or an explosion, people saw or heard something. >> you certainly would. if it was a missile similar to the one that can reach up to 65,000 feet, yes, that would be seen and would be spotted on
satellites. >> who's the book? >> the book missile is the one that took out -- >> the russians. >> the malaysian aircraft over the ukrainian. >> who would have that in that neighborhood? >> that's exactly what i would say, it's very huge, it's a truck. so you'd have that on a ship or could have it as a weapon similar on one of their destroyers. you could have an accidental discharge of a weapon of that type. i lower that probability. i'm not so much in haste to stand there and say, yes, it was an inadvertent launch of a missile that took this aircraft down. that's a little bit of a stretch for me. >> the treasure trove of information is going to come from the voice cockpit reporter and the flight data recorder. >> if they had time to speak. if they had time to speak. if they did not have -- it was a catastrophic failure where even in the explosive decompression, they have no time to put on their masks -- >> you'd hear that.
>> you will. >> if you're on plane that high up, the internet is still working at that point. >> you're dealing with satellite. >> but i'm talking about passengers on the plane, writing to their loved ones back home, sending e-mails will that come forward eventually? >> you wouldn't have time. it goes up to 37,000, you have 30 seconds of cognitive skill. in a minute, you're unconscious. all over with. >> but if it was a fire, you'd have time to put out a mayday. >> yes. if there was a fire on board, the pilots would have time to radio that. no radio at all. acars didn't send anything out. that tells me it was some type of quick, catastrophic failures. >> pilots will historically flight the airplane all the way down to the ground and be transmitting and talking because that is our training. nothing came out of this individual. nothing. which means all communication, all electricity, pilots
incapacitated, all finished in one blow, gone. >> dr. gorka, france's spy chief warned of an impending action or attack on thursday. some sort of new form of attack he referred to it as, coming perhaps from isis. do you think these two events could be related? >> they could be. there's nothing to say that they can't be. look at what we have had in the last few months. we have had double attacks in paris. we have had brussels. look at the manifest of where this plane has been. it's not unusual for an egyptair flight to do this. but this plane has been everywhere in the last few days. brussels, eritrea, casablanca, some are not up to western standards of security. is there something new being smuggled on board that aircraft, that's a distinct possibility. >> when you pressure isis instead of going down, they lash out, hence, they can progress -- they're making progress in
mosul, they start bombing baghdad. every time they feel like they're being pressured and pushed into the corner, you get some type of eruption. could be san bernardino, it could be brussels. >> right. so brian, absolutely right. we're squeezing them or our local allies are. they're losing some territory so what do you do? you have to prove your relevance. an attack of this nature could have a great way to have a cheap propaganda coupe to re-establish themselves as the jihadi masterminds. >> let me ask you a question. as dr. gorka detailed this flight had been all over europe and africa as well. what is the standard operating procedure and when they take the equipment off, do they send the dogs in? >> there was no cargo reported
on the airplane. they're looking at not only the places but also the crew. remember it wasn't long ago that a flight attendant tried to smuggle 70 pounds of cocaine on a plane through l.a.x., right? it could be with the crew, the passengers. could have come through any one of the ports. these are areas to explore in order to find out what happened. but again, i have to reiterate, i think most of the important stuff going to come from the black box. >> what do you say to passengers getting on international flights today or pilots flying planes? >> you have 100,000 flights a year, 37 million a year on the airlines and you have one incident, 1 in 100,000 in a 24 hour period so the probabilities are on the side for a very safe flight. sit back and relax and enjoy the flight. >> one is way too much as it is. >> right. >> more than just one. >> look at what's going won the russians who are on vacation leaving egyptian, and the malaysian flight we're still
looking for debris. this seems to be happening a lot and i'm wondering why it takes so long to get answers. >> well, because we have to find the airplane, number one. we have absolutely no witnesses because they're all dead by now. most likely. most probably. no one in my estimation is going to survive coming out of the explosive situation at 37,000 feet. >> i mentioned this earlier, i think it was back in 1999 an egyptair flight took off from los angeles and over the atlantic and went straight down because the pilot committed suicide. if this was a suicidal situation, would it have been talking -- >> well, the plane would have been descending. i believe he locked the pilot out of the cockpit and then dove it down. that wasn't the case here, at 37,000 feet no longer, gone. >> which makes you believe --
>> the aircraft does not descend on its own. the pilot does not say, i'm descending. no, he has to get clearance to descend which means he has to communicate and he's communicating with egypt atc. >> but if he was committing suicide -- >> he doesn't care about breaking the rules. >> no, he doesn't. even if he shuts off the transrespotran transponder, that's only secondary. primary radar would be pinging all the way down. >> and the one pilot smashed in a mountain. >> yeah, germanwings. >> too many innocent people are getting hurt for a political statement. >> what went through your mind, dr. gorka, with all your experience? >> instantly, you know, what i do is i try and teach our armed forces, our agents, to understand the enemy. if you read the jihadi manuals,
if you read isis's magazine, they are very clear. you will target high concentrations of civilians who are unable to protect themselves. they want symbolic effect. they want fear to spread as wide as possible. that's why we saw the kinds of attacks we have seen. in paris, at the stadium, at brussels, at the airport. so, you know, this -- if this is a terrorist attack it fits perfectly into the mold of spreading fear and attacking those who cannot defend themselves. so again, let's wait for the evidence, but when i woke up this morning, i said, oh, dear, this fits a pattern and it is a jihadi pattern. >> right. he's right. you know what? our top leaders can't even say the words islamic terrorists. >> i haven't noticed. is that true? >> how is this going to affect
the political season? >> these type of people have innovative ways to attack the west and what they're looking for is any chance -- because you get a big bang for your buck. >> sure. >> that may be said in this tragic circumstance. so they look for these type of things and of course they are pushing on these magazines that he's quoting the lone wolf. take it on to yourself. don't work with a cell. just go out and do it and create panic. >> look at the last few years. >> real quick. >> look at the last few years, we had the shoe bomber, richard reid. we had the liquid bomb plot out of the u.k. and then the printer cartridge plot. your guest is absolutely right. >> underwear bomber. >> terrorists -- underwear bomber, thank you, brian. they are innovative. our challenge is to outthink them. >> very clever. >> dr. gorka, john and j.p., thank you. coming up as we have reported egyptair has a long list of crashes. and hijackings.
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we are back now with the fox news alert. egyptair flight 804 flying from paris en route to cairo, vanished from radar early this morning. on board 66 people. the airline has a history of crashes and hijackings so what could we possibly learn from past? >> joining us now is fox news's doug luzader who is also a licensed pilot down in d.c. good morning, doug. >> good morning, guys, they have to look at a number of things, obviously who was on the aircraft. but also the aircraft itself. type of aircraft, and the airline. as far as the type of aircraft, that airbus a-320 has been
around for a long time. there are thousands of them currently deployed around the globe. they're used for a lot of intermediate hops throughout the middle east and that kind of thing. egyptair has had some issues, there's no question. in fact the bbc has a report that back in 2009, e.u. investigators had some issues with -- what they referred to as quote safety issues. those were cleared up within months and there are a number of hijackings involving egyptair aircraft. one of the reasons why they're looking at the passenger manifest so closely. also, looking at airports not just in europe, but airports that this aircraft may have visited throughout the middle east and especially in cairo. back to you guys. >> all right. doug luzader, thank you. just for a second, that airbus behind you that is -- i read this morning it's the best selling airplane in the world, in its class.
with a terrific safety record, right? >> yeah, got a great safety record. it has been around for a long time, so they have been able to ferret out a lot of early issue, no doubt about that. we say thousands of them. you know, some of them are getting a little bit long in the tooth, but certainly i still say -- still safe to fly. that's one of the things they have to consider here, when they look at the aircraft involved in this. >> as a pilot, these pilots had a lot of flying hours under their belt. 6,000 for the captain and the captain had more than 2,000 hours on this type of plane. so he knew what he was doing, right? >> yeah. that's right. and plus, they were on what would generally be considered the easiest part of the flight which is at cruise altitude. i mean, your heart rate starts to go up as you go through takeoff and landing, but cruise is pretty easy and safe. that's what's so unusual about that. >> 45 minutes still left on that flight. >> just ten miles though into egyptian air space.
doug luzader, thank you. coming up on a thursday, more on the fox news alert. investigators now say the doomed egyptair flight made a sudden spin just before dropping off the radar. our next guest lea gabrielle flew jets for the navy. she weighs in on the possibility of a terror attack, next. and here in the u.s., a hot debate over whether to get rid of the tsa and replace wit the private security company. is now the right time? that's charmin ultra strong, dude.
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then disappearing at 10,000 feet. >> wow, new information. benjamin hall is following this breaking news for us from london. >> well, that information is just breaking now and news that francois hollande has confirmed that the plane has crashed. and that paris investigators said they'll be finding and checking everyone who had contact with that plane before it left. as you said, the greek defense minister now saying the sudden swerve took place just before it dropped 22,000 feet and if we can go back and look at the time line briefly, that fits in quite well, 2:48 in the morning, the greek air space controllers contacted the pilot who said, quote, he was in good spirits and contacted the controller. then later they could not get ahold of the plane and then 12 minutes after that the swerves happened and the plane went down. those 31 minutes between
speaking to him and the plane going down is important. and now ships are converging on a beacon in the ocean. they said it's a security beacon, may have been activated by one of the black boxes but the first ship to get on site said there's no sign of debris or floating parts of the plane or an oil slick. so that search continues. still, we have had no confirmation of a sighting of that plane. it does seen as if something strange happened because at 37,000 feet, the weather was fine. the pilot was well experienced. the plane had had a maintenance check last wednesday. the swerve and the sudden descent is pointing to foul play. many of the family members are waiting at the airport. and they have not been told anything yet, and they're -- there are distressing scenes at the cairo airport as they wait. here is the one main thing, cairo and egypt are the focus of this. they have been hurt -- in their economy by recent terrorist
attacks. that's what isis seeks to do. they seek to tear away the economy of the country and egypt has been shattered by recent events. this is what this will flight will do, whether it's terrorism or not, this will hurt egypt. very, very sad news for everyone involved, for everyone involved and for aviation. see if a device was smuggled on board or something happened that's what we know at the moment. >> go back into your report for a moment. you were talking -- benjamin, that is to say. you said that a bunch of ships had converged on the area where they believed the plane went down and they can't spot a trace of it? >> yeah, that's right. immediately the first ship on the scene was actually -- it was a cargo ship passing and they were asked to go to the site. they're the ones who have radioed back. we have their communications, they said there's nothing there at the report. there were conflicting reports about where it was. some said 130 miles from crete and others from a different
island. so they are heading there now and of course they have asked for lots more help. we know that the six fleet is based in naples, the u.s. six fleet. but nato has a lot of warships in the area for the migrant crisis at the moment, so perhaps they'll be sending ships to help. and greek ministry is asking for satellite imaginary. they need help in whatever way they can get. no sign of it yet. >> seems impossible. let's bring in lea gabrielle, a former navy pilot and a fox news correspondent. and paul violas, the ceo of the violas group international. it seems impossible to me that if something does explode in the air that there wouldn't be any debris on the water? or that radar wouldn't pick up on some of the debris at least. >> well, you know, its depends on which type of radar. ship to surface radar might pick up on pieces of the radar and it
depends on what type of radar you're talking about. the radar that looks at it as it's flying and being pass off in air space it would be look agent the larger piece of metal in the -- looking at the larger piece of metal in the sky,it it that way. and then exploding into little pieces it might disappear off the radar or drop really fast. but this new information about it potentially dropping, we will be getting more of it. >> it's, you know, daytime there now. >> when i was deployed, we actually lost a pilot. he crashed and while we were deployed we never found anything but an oil slick. that was an f-18 that went down -- no, i'm sorry, we didn't even find an oil slick in that particular place so it's possible for planes to essentially disappear. i have don't think that's going to happen here. i think we'll see some debris. >> just early. >> it's just really early, yeah. >> sky news there, their contributor, chris mcgee says this. they are told two circumstances that will prevent a pilot from contacting air traffic control.
one, human intervention and the second is something has occurred on the flight deck that they told -- you just handle the plane and the last thing you do is pick up the phone. >> absolutely. you know, you'll hear this again and again. you navigate and aviate and keep it from crashing, that's what that means in that situation. nav gate, where you're pointing it at and then the last thing you do is talk to the people. but there's another scenario that could have happened, that's also if you have lost your communications. if you lost your ability to communicate. >> right. with two pilots one could be communicating and the other is flying the plane. >> right. but in this type of scenario, if something major is happening in the cockpit you're not worried about talking unless the people on the ground can help you. if you land the water in the water think captain sully, well in the mediterranean you want to get the people know where it's going down. if it's catastrophic, no time for that. >> paul, apparently there is -- according to european media, a
merchant captain said he saw a flame in the sky. at least one eyewitness, although the greek defense minister said that the plane fell 20,000 feet, spun sharply and then disappeared. it sounds to me like a bomb. given the fact that the security at charles de gaulle airport is pretty tight, but also given the fact that the plane made five earlier stops in the day, you have to look at every one of those airports that plane was at in the last couple of days, don't you? >> no question about that, steve. when you look at the access control to the aircraft and how many people have access, we talked about this earlier in the break. we have to look at ourselves and just how vulnerable we are here in the united states to something like that. the more touches and peoples to the airport, the longer it was on the tarmac, no question. >> and the catering guy, the gasser. >> right.
>> after the plane that blew up, they had a bunch of isis people on staff and we had to let them go. do you know what the big story in america is the size of the tsa, the lines, the missed flights. the airlines are complaining the tsa is saying we don't have the money. what would privatizing do? >> when we look at the privatization, we'll look at a much more efficiently run organization and people that are held accountable. the other part of it, what concern me the union involvement with respect to tsa and the lack of efficiency being instilled in people in lieu of more efficiency. >> why do you say privatize? >> it's cost beneficial for us. we'll spend less money, we'll get better money. the knowledge and the skills and the ability of the people that will bring in is greater than it is today. i'm not denigrating the tsa staff. but at the end of the day, we have to take a look at where they're from, what their background is and did you leave
flipping burgers yesterday and now you're checking i.d.'s at the airport? that concern mess. >> every time there's a liquid plot, we can't bring water on. there's a shoe plot, we have to take our shoes off. >> when are we getting ahead of the curve instead of behind it? >> you have to look at the recent instances, in 2014 a stow away from california to hawaii where someone got in the wheel well. another one on june 15th. the aircraft from johannesburg to london. you have to look at the security on the tarmac. what the perimeter is like around the aircraft. are there holes in the fences, security cameras, who's watching the cameras? lots of places for error. >> absolutely. this begs the question -- are we conducting good, solid vulnerabilities assessments at the airports today and we're not. >> you said during the commercial break that we're
next. >> yes. no question. >> why? >> the way that we look at this, and anybody that specializes in counterterror will tell you the same thing. these are called vulnerability tests. they're hand picking and cherry picking certain markets that they know they have a high probability of success. and they are going to iron out the wrinkles. we saw here, ainsley, in the united states, and you know this better than i do, we saw here in the united states prior to 9/11 that al qaeda cherry picked airports to see where we were weak. it's a simple vulnerable test. that's what they deer nothing and that's what we'll see coming here. >> the problem, paul, you know with the headlines about these hundreds of people in the tsa line, what happened in brussels? it was before the tsa lines. if you have hundreds of people out at the airport in chicago, near the street, all those people are vulnerable. that's a big problem. >> they don't have to get on the plane. >> no, they don't have to get on the plane. when we start to take a look at what happened here, what we're
looking at here, it begs the question was there ordnance on the plane? >> there was no cargo -- >> excuse me? >> no cargo and nothing hazardous they said. >> allegedly. >> there's what say said. >> allegedly. >> don't forget, if an airplane blows up in the sky it could be something internal to the plane or external and there's a lot of militaries in the region. it's a hostile environment. you have russia, you have the egyptian military which has been threatened by extremist activity. the greek navy. you have naval assets that have the ability to miscalculate. >> they have missiles. >> yes. >> they have people on -- shooting the surface-to-air missiles -- >> remember the flight it was an electrical problem and they thought it was a missile. >>n't be line, we don't -- bottom line, we don't know. >> we'll find out. the jury is still out. >> all right. thank you very much. >> always a pleasure. all right, coming up the
investigation into the missing plane just beginning but with no plane how do they start? former cia operative mike baker takes us inside the complex process that lies ahead next. nexium 24 hour introduces new, easy-to-swallow tablets. so now, there are more ways, for more people... to experience... complete protection from frequent heartburn. nexium 24hr. the easy-to-swallow tablet is here.
so that is the aviation minister of egypt right now, addressing to the media and telling them everything that he feels it's okay to tell us about what just happened to that egyptian airliner that was en route to egypt from paris. in fact, let's listen to a little of the translation. >> -- has disappeared from the air navigation system around 2:40 p.m.o time. this was an airbus 320. 320.
60 business class seats and there were 56 passengers in total and seven colleagues -- seven crew members. the last contact between the plane and the control tower was about 2:30 a.m. and after that the air plane was off the radar. about 2:50 a.m., we made sure that we were not able to contact the plane. the nationalities on the plane were 30 egyptians. one british. one belgian. two iraqis. one kuwaiti.
15 french, one baby, one from sudan, one from chad, one from portugal, one from algeria. one from canada. the person that we want to concentrate on when this happened we wanted to make sure there was a number to contact the families of the passengers of all the nationalities, to be in touch with them in cairo. and we have reserved a hotel for them so that they can relax and we will provide all of the means of comfort for them. and the same thing for the passengers and the families of passengers in france. they will receive free tickets
in order to come to egypt and stay here in egypt as long as necessary. our team members have experts amongst them. and we will respond to the needs of the passengers of the people as much as we can because this is not a matter of hospitality. it's a matter of doing our job. this is just a resume of the facts or a summary of the nine press releases that have been released so far and now i could answer your questions. what are the means of looking for the plane? right now in egypt we are looking -- >> all right. we're listening to a live press conference from cairo. the egyptian aviation minister is stating some facts that we
have already been privy to and have relayed your way. we're going to monitor it in the control room and if he has any other news, we will bring it to you immediately. meanwhile, former cia's mike baker. the greek defense minister said that the plane fell 22,000 feet spun and then disappeared. something happened. >> something happened and the problem we have with this incident and every other problem like this in the past it's very unsatisfying. we don't know really much at all. we're piecing this together and everybody wants an answer. >> will we -- a week from now -- >> a great question. up -- back in 17 years from egyptair lost plane. people off of massachusetts disappeared and we don't know what happened. and remember the wild speculation and theories that
came out of the malaysian situation. you know, people want an immediate answer. that's not the way it works. the experts are looking -- there's a maintenance people are looking at maintenance issues. and security people are looking at security issues. they're peeling apart the tracking of the plane. prior to paris it was in eritrea, tunis, casablanca. you can't discount terrorism, but you don't want to jump there right away. you have to look at everything. that's the problem. it's a heavy list. >> here's the thing. airplanes particularly this one this is the most popular flying airplane in the world. it's got a pretty good safety record. planes just don't fall out of the sky. >> no, absolutely not. this plane, you know, has not got an excessive number of hours on it. but again, all i can speak to, because everything else is speculation at this point. all i can speak to, what are they doing at this point to consider the possibilities of
terrorism? well, we're looking at all communication, all the intercepts from terrorist targets. was there any chatter or talk about this leading up to this -- >> what are your sources telling you? >> you know, i'd be lying if i said my sources were telling me anything. people don't know. and that's, again, i keep going back to the same thing. the rush to say that this arm -- oh, i'm worried this is a terrorist incident you can't do that at this point. >> you say you have to be careful not to speculate because we don't know. if you look at the facts you have experienced flight captain, experimented captain who has flown more than 2,000 hours in the airbus just like this. if you look at the people on board, terrorist experts are saying you have one person from each of the different countries that could be red flags. so unless there's a lone wolf it's not maybe something that was calculated and planned in
advance. do you look at all the facts? it seems so bizarre that a plane could disappear and go off the radar without it being terrorism. >> if you look at all the facts, investigations follow certain protocols and processes. that's going on right now. so they're looking at all of the passengers. they're looking at everybody that was on that plane. they're looking at all of the people that had access to this plane. whether it was in kcasablanca, tunis, everybody had access. you're doing what you can with the facts that are available. and also the evidence that you had prior to this, other incidents and with what the terrorist targets or likely targets, isis or al qaeda, were engaged in and what they were trying to do. we know they'd like to target something like this, but we don't know. so you build your investigation on facts otherwise, you don't have an investigation. >> here's the question. we're the best at it. who is going to lead it? meaning no americans on the flight. we're concerned it will tangentially affect us.
who leads? >> well, we talk about with malaysia, with that situation. we offered, we kept offering support and the malaysian government doesn't want it, so it's entirely down to the egyptian authorities who they accept help from. >> egyptian authorities even though it was coming from france. >> right. egypt has their primacy over this. it's in their air space so they decide who -- they'll take the lead. because it's a nationalist issue. they'll take the lead on this, do they take support from us or the french? they're taking support from the greek authorities because of the search effort in the mediterranean. >> can we trust them to tell us the truth if they take over the investigation? >> are they good at this? they're good at it. are there others that are better, yes, we're better at it, the french are better at it. if they're smart, they will accept the support. why wouldn't you? but there's a national sense of pride sometimes that gets in the way. >> let's talk about just the act
in there are so many bad people out there who want to do this kind of thing. and they figured out ways to make bombs so small you could put a bomb that could take down a plane like that in a coke can, couldn't you? >> yeah. look, we took -- it took a long time with lockerbie. all those years ago. it took a long time for that investigation. >> that was over decades. >> exactly. but for us to piece together what happened there and how that bomb was put on board that plane. >> somebody sat near one of the wings supposedly with a bomb. >> it was an incredibly heavy lift in terms of that investigation, and so it's just gotten worse in terms of the capabilities of the enemy to be able to do this. to be able to secret something on board. the biggest issue becomes access. who has access, how good is the vetting of the personnel who have access to service those
planes? in the various locations. and it varies wildly from airport to airport. >> absolutely. catering companies like everything else they're looking for cheap labor. yeah, we looked in your background, go ahead. >> take a box, yeah, you can get on there. so there's -- here in the u.s., i mean, in other -- you know, countries our allies, u.k., elsewhere, france, you know, they have got it locked down pretty well but it's not foolproof. you know, so doing that due diligence, doing that vetting on airport personnel, and then continuously vetting it. not just a one-time issue. you have somebody working for you for two or three years but you don't know their background is still, maybe something's changed in their lives. >> thank you, mike baker. >> by the way, here's what donald trump tweeted out about an hour ago. he says, look, it looks like yet another terrorist attack. airplane departed from paris. when will we get tough, smart and vigilant?
great hate and sickness. and we know he doesn't always type this, but he yell it out. we have been down this road before and that's usually where it leads. >> we don't want to speculate, but a lot of the experts have said it's very suspicious that this plane has flown over land for the majority of the flight. as soon as it gets over water and it enters into the egypt air space, ten minutes after that's when this happened. that's when the plane totally disappears. so it's very suspicious. >> it's -- and to your point, about having it disappeared, this image is of ships that were dispatched to the area each one of those blue boxes depicts a difference vessel. and they converged on the exact area and so far as benjamin hall reported from london, our european newsroom, they haven't been able to find anything at this point. >> so that's an image of all of the -- >> the response. >> the ships that are out there
looking for debris? >> absolutely. >> there were a lot of them on that screen. they haven't found anything. >> absolutely. >> that we know of. they could have picked up something. we have not had it relayed yet. >> keep in mind, egypt said that they -- there was a distress signal received but it does appear as some of the experts we have talked to on the program, it wasn't from -- it wasn't activated by a person. it was activated by the airplane. some of these signals in the black boxes, et cetera, can be activated when they come in contact with water or after an accident. >> you know, so far we know this. the last contact with the plane was ten minutes before it vanished. and we do know that there was -- they say the pilot had not sent a distress signal before the plane disappeared so it was out of his control. >> there's a story out of paris that because the flight did originate at charles de gaulle and it was taking off in the 11:00 p.m. hour, apparently a family -- a family with five children went to the wrong
terminal and apparently some airport worker there at charles de gaulle made sure that, you know, kept the plane -- made sure the family was able to get on that particular plane. the airport worker who did that is devastated because it looks like that family -- >> how many kids did they have? three kids were on the flight is what we're hearing. >> maybe two were larger kids because this report said five children. >> meaning -- there were two infants on board and one child. >> yeah. >> these by the way are images of the families getting together and finding out what they know. the airport officials. >> the paris prosecutes have already opened an investigation. of course it's too early. there's a lot of speculation going on, but it does seem as if it probably was some sort of terrorist attack because keep in mind the plane fell 20,000 feet in a matter of seconds, spun
sharply and then just disappeared from radar. >> how does the plane just disappear? an airbus, they're huge. >> gigantic. >> into the water. mediterranean not that deep so they might be able to get it. >> if you look at security out of paris, the reports say there was no special cargo on board. no notification of anything dangerous, no dangerous goods that were on board either. >> all right so once again, if you're just waking up this morning, egyptair ms-804 an airbus, a-320 crashed. that's officially how they have depicted it so far in the mediterranean. it vanished over the mediterranean a couple of hours ago. it took off from paris at 11:00. egypt says they received no distress call, but there was a distress signal at 4:06 local time. no mayday. >> that's right. the flight is 804 as steve was
saying, flying from paris to cairo in the middle of the night. took off at 11:00. it was supposed to land four hours later, about 45 minutes before it got to egypt, cairo specifically, that's when it disappeared, totally disappeared in the sky. the radar did not pick up any signals that the plane -- that there was any problem on board. >> no. the global fleet is 6,600 -- it's one of the safest planes around. among the 66 in the air, three are children. two babies, so this is really bad. and could have been worse if that plane was packed but it was not. >> right. yeah. how many -- i wonder how many that flight does carry. hundreds. only 66 on board and this included the crew members. >> keep in mind, the flight took off at 11:00, and a captain of a merchant ship in the area in the mediterranean at that time saw a flame in the sky. a united kingdom terror chief
said that with the lack of a mayday, certainly it was some sort of a brutal event. greg palkot is tracking details, he is outside charles de gaulle airport in paris where this particular egyptair flight originated. >> absolutely, guys. a lot of development in the last hour since we last talked, we'll try to go through it all for you. french president hollande has been on national television and he says and i quote, no hypothesis is being ruled out including and he said this -- including the hypothesis of terrorism. he said that the truth will come out. he had the highest ranking official to confirm the terrible fact that this plane -- this egyptair flight 804 went down, down in the mediterranean sea presumably 66 people meeting their end. what he also said and what
french officials are saying is that yes, the paris prosecuting -- prosecutor will be looking into this and just in the past hour or so, a report coming from the respected figaro newspaper has said that concerns about airplane airport workers with ties to islamists is real. there have been some workers fired from positions here at the airport and this is one area that is being looked at. also, egyptian officials not ruling out the possibility of terrorism and we have this gripping new analysis coming from a greek aviation official in the past hour. he described what happened to the plane, that it was up about 22,000 feet. it turned to the left 90 degrees, it turned to the right 360 degrees, and then went down. down, down until they lost
contact with it at 15,000, 10,000 feet. i spoke, guys, with a gentleman by the name -- the most respected air analyst here in europe and i said, what does this mean? all we can say now is that the plane was destabilized, i put the terror hypothesis to him. could somebody with a bomb or a knife could have caused this? yes, that would have destabilized it. but mechanical failure could have caused it too. so it's an open mind. people are not going one way or the other. it's too early, but we should have more clues as the day and the night and tomorrow goes on. back to you guys. >> all right. greg palkot live in paris, thank you very much. all right, let's bring in retired air force pilot and fox news contributor, we saw him at 4:00 in the morning and he's been helping out the channel, lieutenant general tom mcinerney. also, we like to bring in scott
brenner -- >> former faa. >> yeah. senior official now with rosemont strategies. general, what do you think is the most telling bit of information that you have learned over the last two hours? >> well, this is terrorism and i'm saying that because we had a catastrophic event at flight level 307, 37,000, and i think what we're going to find is that it's a cookie cutter by isis of what they did with the russian airplane. they put a bomb -- coke bottle sized in the rear tail. if they check the baggage people, it was around the shift change and i'll bet that one of them is going to be missing. so the tail severed and it's such a violent maneuver that the pilots do not have a chance to do mayday call. they'll find if they ever find the tail that it will be back behind the main fuselage. >> does that explain the swerve? is that what you're saying, that explains the swerve? >> yes.
>> because the tail is blown? >> absolutely. once that tail goes it is such a violent maneuver. nobody -- the pilot can do mayday. they're trying to control it. they don't know what happened. and it's catastrophic. >> dr. sebastian gorka also joining us who's made it his life's work to travel around the country and teach everyone about terrorism and what the signs are. do you agree with the general? >> look, as i have said already, if you put the pieces together that we know already, it is very, very suspicious as the general said. the height of the altitude, the catastrophic nature, the a-320 is not known for suffering catastrophic failures. the source of the flight, the destination and i think the most suspicious thing is the fact that it went to all of these different airports in the last few days. including many airports in north africa that are not known for their tight security.
so, you know, we do all kinds of great stuff with passenger manifests and the clearing of the individuals who fly the aircraft or the cabin ground, but it's the ground access. the people who maintain it, the people who put on the bags, that's a very serious vulnerability for any western -- >> anybody who feels it's terrorism it was donald trump, the presumptive gop nominee. he put out a tweet that says it looks like yet another terrorist attack, airplane departed from paris. when will we get tough, smart and vigilant? great hate and sickness. mr. brenner, let me ask you, i know it's just speculation about whether or not it's terrorism. given your background with the faa if it wasn't terrorism how else would that plane -- what other cause could you summon to explain how it fell out of the sky? >> right, normally when we get into these situations it's only a couple of things.
it's either human error, mechanical error or something to do with the weather. these are work horse airplanes and we have the safest aviation system in the world. so i really doubt that it's something that went wrong with the aircraft. i'm a little kind of suspicious of the bomb issue, simply because from my working on these issues for a couple years now they usually let the bombs go off as soon as they hit at cruising altitude so they can get the biggest explosion. they don't want that plane to run out of fuel or get low on fuel and then have an explosion that may not have the same impact. >> there's an issue with that, there's an issue with that. if you are isis, if this is truly a terrorist attack one of your biggest targets is either jordan or egypt. so if this is a jihadi attack, you could actually hypothesize they want that plane in egyptian air space to send the message to cairo and to president el sisi
we're taking you down. you want to explode that device as soon as possible. but not if you want to send a message to egypt and the primary target of the jihadis in the region. >> so scott, are you saying -- okay, it's not the airplane. are you saying it's not a bomb in which case what would it be? >> no, i'm not saying it's no a bomb. that's one of the possibilities. the third thing i would look at is the handing off of egyptian air space. i don't know about egyptian radar capability, but as we saw with the malaysian airplane, if you turn off the transponder you can make that plane go very dark. you may have an issue where a pilot has decided to take over this aircraft or again it was a night flight so someone may have gotten past a lot of sleeping passengers, got through the door and taken over the aircraft, turned off the transponder and then turned it in some direction and crashed it in hopes that nobody would be able to find it quickly. i think that's why you see such a time difference between when it lost radar and then when we
started to hear the first beacons pinging. >> are their aircraft doors re-enforced as they are in the united states? >> i'm not aware of that. >> you talked about how -- the plane was in north africa, a place where maybe security is not as tight as it is in paris and maybe someone put something on the plane in another destination and then we read that the plane was inspected on wednesday, which was yesterday. as a passenger, is there any way we can look at the history of the plane we're about to get on and find out when it was inspected, where it has been the days before, before -- or in between the last inspection and us getting on the plane? >> well, the fact is -- look, the inspections have nothing to do with this issue. >> why? >> because those inspections are maintenance inspections. and in 35 years in the air force, and i have never seen a case -- there was one case in the twa where they attributed it to a fuel ignition. but the fact is, i never saw an
airplane at level altitude and i was carrying bombs and ammunition my whole life that would explode like that. that's when you look at the patterns of behavior, look at what happened in baghdad yesterday. what isis is trying to do by taking that government down. as sebastian said, they wanted to take down president el sisi and destabilize. now, look, trump who's got great skills, he's got a chap who i know used to work indirectly for me by the name of sam clove us, his national security adviser, a former pilot, he gets it. when you fly airplanes you know they don't blow up in midair. because you have a degradation of something going on, this was catastrophic. so that's why i'm pointing in that direction. i realize governments want to do that. but trump's got the right
intuition. >> our secretary of state in egypt, he landed yesterday. we have a keen interest in what happened, and we have -- we're humanists, we want people to survive their flights and land when they're supposed to. what message would you have if you're secretary of state kerry, you're in the eye of the storm. what can we do? >> well, i'd be very frank with you. i think he's part of the problem. we have let isis go on for far too long. it's still an inspiration to those jihadis, the radical islamists. the number one target is raqqah, half the size of the pentagon and we haven't touched it because we're worried about civilian casualties. let me tell you, we are making huge mistakes and this administration is frankly enabled isis to prevail. >> scott, let's go back to -- as they try to figure out
forensically what happened. tell me about the images and the satellite and the radar that are out there. you know, you made the point earlier we don't know exactly egypt's capabilities. but you know, we've got eyes in the skies out there, don't we? >> we do. and we do have heavy radar coverage out there. some of the radar tracks that are being reported, i want to wait to see if those are confirmed. but, you know, when you just talked about the investigation, this is something that makes me nervous because a lot of times countries who rely on tourism really don't want anything -- any kind of -- >> bad news. >> negative press on what has happened. so if we have egyptian authorities investigating an egyptian crash sometimes we may not get to the truth as quickly as we can. going back to the malaysians, it took us a long time to get to the -- to get the malaysians to acknowledge that everybody was looking in the totally wrong part of the ocean. when they knew on their radar
tracks that it was in the totally different direction because they were afraid to admit that their radar was not capable of picking up that aircraft. >> wow. incredible. and plus, you know, egypt has a tourism problem. they have the reason to come, however, when the muslim brotherhood wins an election you might want to go to hawaii instead. then you have a general take over and try to bring some semblance of order to the country, they become friendly with us. however, they have not been friendly to freedom of speech because they're worried about consolidating power. in the big picture, sebastian gorka, i'm wondering what this does for egypt, because after all, this is the same egyptair airline that allowed a psychopath to hijack it with a fake bomb because he wanted to visit his girlfriend. >> right. they were hurting. the hotels were empty, the tourists weren't there. this is the primary income for that nation. you're absolutely right. but to go back to the previous question, you know, if we want
to be serious about the threat, we would need a government, a secretary of state and a president who declares war on these jihadis and says we will do whatever it takes to help our local allies. jiptd is the -- egypt is the most important nation locally in the fight, followed closely by jordan. we have turned our backs on them. we have enabled the isis phenomena to get stronger and stronger. so this is a real opportunity for the white house, but unfortunately, i think we are not going to see them exploit this in a way that it should be exploited for the safety of all our nations. >> dr. gorka, as far as the investigation is concerned, how do you track down if something did happen on this plane in a country where it was a few days ago -- how do -- >> it was just in tunis. >> right. how do you tap into that and to investigate this properly? >> well, classify, there's two major avenues for such investigations.
number one, do the link analysis. you have to analyze every single human being who could have access to the aircraft, on the ground, in the air, working for the companies and working for the airports. even if the mediterranean is shallow you have to reconstruct the airframe. you have to piece by piece dredge it out of the water. reconstruct it and try to locate where that detonation occurred. if there was a detonation, it has to be reconstructed on the airframe. chemical analysis, physical analysis. that's the two large areas of any investigation of this nature. >> can you trust it will be done though? will the governments work together to get to the bottom of it? >> if you look at the malaysia airline incident, it is problematic to say the least. let me leave it at that. >> i remember jim kallstrom had to do the same thing with the twa, rebuilt it and fished it out of the ocean. >> brian, here's what i think, and sebastian's got it right.
the fact is, that bomb was not put on in tunis or tunisia or anywhere else. it had to have been put on at charles de gaulle because for the very reason that sebastian said. they wanted to put the impression on the egyptian leadership. egyptian country, and that's why they they wanted it to go off as it approached or was in egyptian air space. and ideally, and it was done very well, it went into the water. which makes the debris field extremely difficult to put back together and very time consuming. it's a fair question. >> sure. >> will they do it correctly? but it removes a lot of finger prints. >> it sure does. once again, if it was indeed a bomb. scott, we understand airbus has already off -- offered up any technical assistance they could provide and we know that a number are investigating. have they started looking into the backgrounds of the flight
crew? of the people on board? and who would do something like that? >> again, we would have to rely on the egyptians to do the initial investigation. i mean, this is an airbus aircraft and so airbus will be involved. but only for the technical aspects of this. they won't really -- they'll see the equipment after it's pulled out of the ocean, but won't be involved at all at looking at the background of flight attendants, pilot, so on. >> but by international law, every nation that touches that aircraft actually has rights to deal with this incident. by international law, by the toronto treaty, anyone who had a passenger of their nationality on the aircraft, anyone who owned the aircraft and any nation where the plane originated or was going to has the right to investigate this case. so we should see a huge multinational effort because there was a brit on board, france is going to be hugely interested and of course egypt.
>> 12 different countries represented then. >> so regarding the black box reporters who, scott brenner, would analyze that? that could have information on it. >> that's always a sticky subject because not everybody has the capability to read those to the full extent. so hopefully, the egyptians will pull the back box and hand it over to the french who have good equipment to do this. if they don't, they could destroy the tape or lose information. >> we know they have to put someone in the ocean to pick up the pings to find the actual box and then get it and i would imagine that we could play a role in that. i can't imagine them not tapping into us. >> all right. scott brenner, tom mcinerney, sebastian gorka, thank you. a guy hijacked an egyptair
plane, so what can we learn from this? we'll talk to doug luzader, he's a pilot as well. he's up next. [engine revving] [phone buzzing] ♪ some things are simply impossible to ignore. the strikingly designed lexus nx turbo and hybrid. the suv that dares to go beyond utility. this is the pursuit of perfection. hello new coppertone sport. it's reformulated to feel lighter on your skin, but still protects and stays on strong.
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though was fake. the real auction was private and was for prequalified bidders only. it comes after zimmerman failed to sell that gun twice last week because of phony bids from fake accounts. crazy video shows a police cruiser slamming into another car, causing another to spin out of control. this happened in florida. so the officer blowing through a red light while chasing two armed robbery suspects. both a cop and a female driver was injured. paramedics had to pull a woman out of her car with her broken arms. one was driven to tears. >> and i hope no one goes through that.
>> well that officer was ticketed for failing to yield. in the meantime, police say they'll review that incident and make changes that are needed if they're needed. the woman and lawyer say they'll sue the city if changes are not made. those are your headlines. back to you. >> thank you. now back to the fox news alert. the egypt airplane with 66 people on board disappeared not long before it was scheduled to land in egypt. they have a history of hijackings and mechanical concerns. >> doug luzader who is also a pilot join us right now. >> good morning. it's interesting to hear the civil aviation minister saying look, this isn't a car, this is an airplane, it has maintenance records. the a-320 has been a very safe aircraft for a long time. it is ubiquitous, especially in this region. you can't rule out a major mechanical failure at altitude, like they can't rule anything
out at this point. but you look at the airline itself, air egypt, operating under that name since the early '70s. they have had some issues, in fact the bbc reporting that back in 2009 i believe e.u. investigators brought up some safety concerns about some maintenance issues involving this airline. they were quickly addressed within months. but there have also been a number of hijackings. this raises security questions not only involving the airline, but airports in general in egypt. we saw these concerns really brought to the head in the wake of the metrojet crash. so that's another thing they have to consider here. looking at the airline. the airports there. how this specific plane operated. and what its maintenance history was. back to you. >> such a good point. doug, you touched on this. you see a lot of the airbuses over there. people fly them all the time. in your personal history when is the last time you ever heard of an airplane according to the
radar falling 20,000 feet, spinning sharply 90 degrees to one direction and then turning 360 to the other direction and then just disappearing from radar completely? >> you know, i'm not an investigator, i'm not going to pretend to be. >> i know. >> but i'll tell you this. you could have a few things go wrong at altitude. you could have an engine failure. >> don't you have more than one engine? >> you have more than one engine and you have asymmetric thrust at this point. the other engine quickly compensates, but this could be indicative of a major failure of the fuselage, for instance. you could have part of the tail section break away in which you lose all control, but that's very, very unlikely to happen during cruise. >> that's right. all right. doug luzader, thank you. apparently, we also reiterated this earlier, three air marshals on board and the pilot did not respond to any radio calls.
almost certainly terror attacks many terrorism experts in europe are already -- >> yeah, leah said if you're flying the plane and trying to get control of the plane, you may not pick up the radio to call air traffic control. >> first thing is to navigate before you communicate we have heard her say. all right, coming up on a thursday, there are reports that the plane made several spinning motions, swerves, just before going down. first to the left 90 degrees and then to the right 360 degrees. lea gabrielle who used to fly in that air space will join us next. plus, the former commander of nato said this crash has all the hallmarks of a terror attack. he's going to explain that next. ever. the all-new audi a4, with apple carplay integration. wheall i can think abouthit, is getting relief. only nicorette mini has a
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flight 804. >> we are learning that flight with 66 people on board swerved, then dropped from 35,000 feet to 15,000 feet, it disappeared at 10,000 feet. joining us live from london with new details is benjamin hall. >> good morning. we have been listening to the aviation minister and he said this could have been anything, not to jump to conclusions, but we are hearing that the russian intelligence service, one of the heads there, has said in most likelihood it's a terror attack. that coming from the russians. nevertheless, the search continuing around the island of karpathos and asking for more assistance from the satellite imagery which they think will help them to explain what happened. at the moment, ships converging on that beacon which we know went up down, emergency signal being sent up. and planes are in the air and the greeks have said there's a submarine on stand by. now to go over the time line briefly again, 12:48, greek
airport controllers spoke to the pilot and he was quote in good spirits. he even thanked the controller in griese. 39 minutes later they tried to reach out to him and he did not respond. they tried to reach out to him on emergency frequency, still nothing. and then 12 minutes after that, the plane took the swerve one way, and then the other way, and then a sudden drop, that's where we lose the plane. from 37,000 flight, you could expect the plane perhaps to disintegrate. so they're looking on the mediterranean at the moment and they cannot see any debris or oil slicks floating. meanwhile, the families waiting at cairo airport terminal 1 have not learned anything. we're learning the people on board, so many countries are getting affected by this, but still this information about what happened. the search is continuing and of course egypt as i said earlier
trying very hard to say don't jump the gun, but the russians are saying most likelihood a terror attack. >> benjamin, real quick. i know you're on the ground all this time as isis took root. can you tell me the anger they have towards egypt? >> well, egypt has had a battle against isis, particularly in sinai. the al qaeda affiliates pledged allegiance to isis. the egyptians -- el sisi they have fought alongside the u.s. to root them out of here so they see them as the army against themselves. so egypt is as much of a target for isis, no doubt about that. >> they don't like them. all right, benjamin hall live in our european newsroom, thank you. let's bring in lea gabrielle, a former navy pilot and a fox news correspondent and also we'll bring in a supreme
allied commander from nato and walid phares, adviser. >> we have heard that the russians say it looks like terror to them. walid, we'll turn to you, because terror is your business. what do you think? >> well, the events are clear. there was something that has happened at the altitude of 35 and another one happened at the lower altitude, 15,000. on the other hand, the french have engaged and ordered an investigation. egyptians are careful and now the russian -- the russian agency is talking about the possibility of terrorism. if you add those three, then my assessment is that we are going to be seeing indication that it could be terrorism. >> admiral, when you talk about the cooperation between the europeans, the u.s. and the middle eastern nations, where are we in terms of cooperating towards the common cause? >> brian, here in the united
states we're better than we were, our interagencies are beginning to work together better. but in terms of international cooperation unfortunately within europe and these european union countries are not connecting and working together as they should. i do agree, all indications point to terrorism at this point. it's early days but if you look at the type of target that they have gone after in the past, you look at their strategic position at the moment, they need a big event. they're being pushed back a bit in raqqah. you look at the pattern of events here that lea can talk to you from the aviation perspective, you have to kind of lean toward terror at this point. >> due do you agree with that? >> i want to report that i spoke with a senior navy official who tells me that the u.s. navy is not yet involved in the efforts, but they're talking to all the players. as far as you know what this could have been, i think we need to recognize a very different picture has been painted in the
last hour or so. that's about the turns that the aircraft made that are reported. that paints an entirely different picture because initially we were hearing that the aircraft completely disappeared from radar at 37,000 feet. that's very different from an aircraft that's turning to the left, turning to the right, 360 degrees descending. so the important element i'm waiting for is what is the time that that happened in? that's going to give us a lot of information. now if we know there was some time involved for when that aircraft was turning, when it was descending that's going to indicate a struggle in the congress pit. it could be a a suicide bomber in the cockpit or they're fighting the plane because it's doing one thing, they're doing the other. that changes a perspective for a lot of us aviation experts because initial reporting was it just disappeared at 37,000 feet. this is different. >> such a good point. walid, let's talk a little bit about -- and you're an adviser to trump and he put this treat
out earlier this morning that said looks like yet another terrorist attack. airport departed from paris, when will we get tough, smart and vigilant? great hate. great sickness. some suggested that it's terrorism, it looks like terrorism, although lea has a great point, there could have been a struggle in the cockpit. remember there were a number of airport workers from the airport at charles de gaulle in paris who had their credentials revoked because they were working for isis. >> absolutely. this is something we have been warning about for years. the jihadis tried to get penetration of every single institution they can go into. the paris airport had incidents. the london airports. the two london airports have had incidents. this is the pattern of how jihadis, are they isis or al qaeda or on their own would like to penetrate and very quick decision by the french authorities to launch an
investigation. inside the paris installations. >> admiral, let's talk about all the countries that are involved. you have obviously the egyptian army and navy out there with the fighter jets and ships. greece has joined in on the search as well as france, that's pledging boats and planes to assist in the search as well. what about the united states? lea said her contacts are saying that hasn't happened yet. will that happen? >> it will happen. the u.s. six fleet has a number of ships on station. at the moment they're involved with nato operations working with the migrant crisis in the aegean which is proximate to the location that the aircraft has disappeared. i think you will see rapidly see the u.s. involved. we need to look at better technology. this is biometrics, constant vetting of personnel, there's a lot that we can do together to alleviate and prevent this kind
of incident. >> you know, we had the aviation minister of egypt giving a press conference before. he's concluded and he said he think has the plane was taken down not by a mechanical error. but by an act of terror. so not by technical failure. admiral, having said that, could an act of terror also be labeled, do you think in the vernacular in the world of the military jargon could that alsoa surface-to-air missile? >> i think that's highly unlikely. certainly the technical means to get a missile up to that altitude is present on some military warships. but the idea that a military warship would be co-opted and then launch a missile to take down a commercial airliner, highly unlikely. if one had done so by accident as part of an incident or an exercise, i'm certain that would be reported by now. that is one that i would leave
off the list of possibilities. >> sure. and lea gabrielle, let's go back to your point earlier about how there could have been a struggle in the cockpit. you know, given everything, the swerves first to the left of 90 degrees and then the swerve to the right at 360 degrees we don't know how long it took the plane to go down 20,000 feet. but, you know, when you start to look at stuff like that, the possibility that it was a bomb, maybe it's people inside, what are your sources telling you right now regarding the possibility -- and brian mentioned -- we had been talking earlier about missiles and the stuff like that the gut instinct of people you're talking to are saying what? >> i had to go back to what they were saying earlier, the picture that was painted initially was 37,000 feet, poof, it's gone. that is very diffent from all of a sudden now we're hearing, okay, so there were some -- there was a picture painted for
us as this aircraft was descending very, very different story. back to you know the missile theory that's been raised, i mentioned it myself. more likely something if that like to were to happen, it was a miscalculation. not a ship that would have taken over. i think that's a lot less likely of a scenario now that we know that this aircraft was in so-- some sort of descent. it just didn't disappear. >> there's if general mcinerney scenario, if there was a coke bomb, it would have blown off the tail and what would have been the reaction if the tail is blown off, admiral? >> it would become instantly unstable in air. the pilots would presumably to try to fight it as lea knows. but if your tail is gone, your aircraft is going down. >> absolutely true.
i want to bring up the point now that this is point where we have some information a little bit more information. and people start to really kind of come up with their own theories of what happened. and when you don't have all of the information as we don't right now, you can start to kind of piece it together if your own mind. we saw this with the missing malaysian aircraft. it will be some time before we know what happened here. >> right. we know there were three air marshals on that particular flight. thank you. >> air marshal army. >> a bunch. in the middle of the night. coming up the egyptair crash has many people on edge, especially those flying shortly. should you be afraid? that's next. nexium 24 hour introduces new, easy-to-swallow tablets. so now, there are more ways, for more people... to experience... complete protection from frequent heartburn. nexium 24hr. the easy-to-swallow tablet is here.
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45 to 42% edge over hillary clinton. this is a national poll that we conducted. trump bouncing back from an 11% deficit just two months ago. in the meantime, trump is getting ready to respond to claims that he's in tax trouble. "usa today" said he's in the middle of 100 tax lawsuits and disputes stemming from his various companies. then on the other side of the aisle a war of words taking place. bernie sanders campaign now hitting back after dnc chairman debbie wasserman schultz criticized how the senator handled the rowdy supporters at the nevada convention, when people were throwing chairs and going nuts out there. here's what his campaign manager had to said. >> debbie wasserman schultz has been throwing shade on the sanders campaign since the very beginning. >> those are your headlines. now back to more breaking news. >> thanks, heather. the egypt air crash has many
americans on edge, especially those who are flying today. should we be afraid? our medical a-team and author of "false alarm" dr. marc siegel is here. people are fearful today. rightfully so. >> especially if terrorism is goal, because the whole goal of terrorist is to scare everybody. we think we're next. so we say, oh, we're getting on the a-320, are airbuses safe? they're incredibly safe. over 88 million hours of airbuses in the air. it's such a low risk. you have a much higher risk on your way to the airport in the uber or a taxi cab where the guy has a wild look in his eye. much more likely you'll get into the accident on the way to the airport. >> so you're saying it's safer in the sky than on the ground. but just the random nature of this. the people who happen to be on that particular flight, where if
it was terrorism there was a guy who decided to take down the plane that day. >> that makes it a lot worse because we worry about loss of control. we worry that we're going to be next. we worry that we're not the pilot. well, how about trusting the pilot, that helps. your pilot may have had military training. most airbuses have over 2,000 hours. there are studies that show, steve, you can release the love hormone called oxytocin by caring about the person next to you or envisioning a scene. envision the couch here. think about us. how much love and caring we have for each other. think of a child birth in your life or a loving moment. that releases the hormone that's your antidote to fear. it's the loss of control, turbulence makes you think of it. takeoff, landing, you're ultimately safe. >> 24 hour news has a lot to do with the fact that maybe we're overreacting. if we had to wait until 6:00 for tom brokaw to hop on the air to
review some flight we heard about on the radio, that's a lot different. but we're able to bring you instant updates from around the world and video you never thought you would see. >> we are causing the problem. we're doing what we have to do. this is a hugely important political story. it's what we have to do. we've doing a great job. doing a great job of it here. problem is, people watching it think is my plane flight safe? that's -- and it is safe. by the way, something like taking a valium or a xanax or having a drink, not a bloody mary, that's not the cure. the prevention is the cure -- >> especially both at the same time. >> if you have to do it, do one or the other. if you're on a flight and feeling extra nervous, you have to have a glass of alcohol to calm down. it's the problem that you feel you're going to have a panic attack. you have to beat it in advance by diverting yourself. read a book on takeoff. hold the hand of someone next to you. do not give in to fear. >> right, you should know that person before you hold their hand. that's my feeling.
>> use the hand wipes. >> dr. siegel, thank you. coming up next in other news we'll take a little bit of a break from this, facebook accused of promoting liberal stories. and blocking conservative posts. mark zuckerberg just met with conservative journalists. one of them is tucker carlson. so what happened? tucker promised to tell. but first, let's check in with martha to find out what's going on at the top of the hour. >> so of course, breaking news and continuing coverage of the crash of the egyptair flight as we start to get more information on who was on that flight and what we know about the terrorism environment surrounding this as well as the mechanics of this aircraft. 66 on board. reaction from world leaders, from presidential candidates, weighing in on this as well. and new polls that show donald trump leading hillary clinton in the presidential race. what a race this has been. bret baier, walid phares and catherine herridge will weigh in when bill and i see you at the top of the hour.
this is a fox news alert. just in, according to defense sources greek authorities spotted two floating objects, 50 miles from where that plane dropped off radar. we'll bring you the latest. but for now -- >> we have other news. in other news, facebook accused of promoting liberal stories and blocking conservative posts, mark zuckerberg just met with conservative journalists including tucker carlson. what happened? >> it was interesting. they're worried that conservatives don't trust them. part of the reason that conservatives don't is because mark zuckerberg talks about his liberal politics in the public and i think it taints them in people's minds. if everyone has the same background and the same cultural
assumptions it will affect your news coverage. they think that's reasonable. some of the conservatives asked tough questions and others sucked up basically. >> like who? >> you know, well known talk show hosts that would be asking tough questions. >> who said what? >> well, they're subject give -- >> are they going to change anything? >> yeah. try to move as much as they can over to the algorithm and take out the human element -- >> did he admit the curators -- >> no, he did not admit that intentional bias occurred. he did admit that people in silicon valley are liberal. why don't you hire mormons, bring in people with a different cultural background and you'll make wiser decisions. they said that was a good idea. i don't know if they'll do it. >> never thought of that.
the other story is the curators were told, they said they were told to rip out the stories of mitt romney and put the others up. the damage is already done. unless they investigate who the curators are -- he can't say the stories are not true. >> they called everyone who worked there at that time and their issuing a report which will be made public. >> and sheryl sandberg was there. >> i like her. i didn't have strong feelings about her. >> i read her book. i thought she was incredible. >> waste of time, glad you went? >> i thought it was interesting as heck and it was deeply revealing some of the people who attended. i will say that. it was really revealing. some people are very odd by billionaires and it shows. >> i have to wait for the commercial to find out -- tucker, thank you. >> i'm not impressed by that. i have to say. >> we'll step aside, be back in two minutes. soon.
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objects near the site where egyptair flight 804 disappeared on radar a couple of hours ago. >> thank you for joining us. we'll continue our coverage on the fox news channel later on today. >> in the "after the show show," tucker carlson. by the news is breaking on this they are day, may 19. egyptian officials saying egyptair flight ms804 was possibly a terror attack. the plane vanished in the middle of the night. i'm bill hemmer. martha: i'm martha maccallum. let's look at what we know so far. the egyptair flight was minute away from landing in cairo when it suddenly disappeared from radar. it took off at 11:00 local time and