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tv   Tucker Carlson Tonight  FOX News  December 8, 2016 4:00pm-5:01pm PST

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because i have an exclusive interview on sunday with donald trump. we talk to him in trump tower on saturday. why will go on trump force one. couldn't be more excited. that's sunday but "tucker carlson tonight" is next. >> time for a fox news alert. president-elect donald trump is taking his thank you tour to des moines, iowa tonight. and as soon as the president-elect steps up on the stage to the microphone we will, of course, bring it to you live. but right now welcome to "tucker carlson tonight," the show that is the sworn enemy of lying pomposity, smugness and group think. well, less than two weeks a group of 538 people will officially choose the president of the united states. they're called electors and they are specified in the constitution. most of us assume they are mere conduits for the will of voters and will cast their ballots consistent with electoral college results and in some states they don't have to do that. they can do literally whatever they want. texas is one of those states and that's where we find
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christopher, a republican elector who says he will not vote for donald trump. christopher joins us from dallas. thanks a lot for coming on tonight. >> thank you. i'm happy to be on your new show. >> thank you. i assume this election was over and that trump won and you are saying no. >> that's correct. december 19 is when the election actually happens. >> right. >> i'm actually surprised you didn't know that but that's when electors actually cast their ballots and that's when we will find out who is president. >> right. i guess and, of course, i'm aware of that. it's in article 2. it's in the 12th amendment it's well known the electoral college. the idea that the result could change based on electoral -- the meeting of the electoral college in two weeks i'm not aware that that could happen and i think most people who cast their ballots last month assumed that the result they woke up to was the one that would stand. and you're saying no? >> well, we have had multiple electors at different times in our history who have not voted either as the party wanted
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or as their region wanted. the last, i think it was in 2004 may have been, my mistake when a democratic elector flipped john kerry and john edwards. >> by mistake. >> 1976 would be more applicable where current washington state senator mike padden said rather than voting for jarbled ford he would make a pro-life statement and vote for president reagan. there are certainly times where that's happened. >> here's the problem i have with it and i think most people would. had an awful lot f people vote. i think it was around 128 million people voted overall in this election. 62ish, for donald trump. and here you have 538 people saying or at least in your case one person saying my vote counts more than any of yours and i'm going in a different direction. it seems undemocratic is the point i'm making. >> it may be undemocratic but it's certainly exactly what the founders established. they wanted an electoral college per alexander hamilton to say no when it
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was appropriate for a candidate that they felt it was not preeminently qualified to be president. >> that's not seen anywhere in the constitution as you know. there is no reference to the mostly cloudies of electors in the constitution. >> not in the constitution, certainly. >> not in the constitution. so who are you going to vote for? >> i'm not sure who i'm going to vote for. in the op-ed i published on monday i said someone like john kasich. i'm still looking for someone with executive and legislative experience. since the op-ed i have had electors from across the land call me on the phone. we have had interesting conversations. when the topic of who to vote for comes up, the name that keeps trickling back to the top is john kasich again and again. >> he says he doesn't want to be voted for. again, what gives you the power to do that? the whole point of the system is that you are standing in by proxy for millions of your fellow citizens and doing their will and you're saying, in effect, i don't care what you think, i'm doing what i want even though my job is to stand in for you.
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if you see the point. >> well, i disagree with the point. it's not to stand in for someone else. there is no constitutional assumption that electoral college is simply a rubber stamp. otherwise, they would have simply said the state would award those values though those candidates. again, it's not in the constitution, but certainly in federalist 68. founding fathers had an idea they were worried about a demagogue taking over office. simply winning by the mob mentality. and it hasn't happened. we have been lucky in america thus far. this year is different. >> i get you don't like trump and i think that's totally fine if you don't like trump. a demagogue is a scary prospect from either side. you really want a country run by 538 people who are accountable to no one? that's what you are proposing. wife is that better? >> well, i'm not proposing. >> yeah, you are. you said i have authority vested in me by i don't know, i don't know where your authority comes from. i don't know how you became an elector and, yet, you're
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saying, you know, just on the basis of my own conscience i'm going to control the destiny of 330 million. that seems as scary as despotism to me. >> i understand your point. at this point i was elected at the republican state convention. i can't speak to the democratic party in texas or other states for either party. in my case i was elected. so there is some account being. >> where's the accountability? >> well, the accountability is you are elected by a body through a process. >> there is no accountability? nothing has to me -- there is no accountability because you can vote for whoever you want and no one can do anything to you. you can't be fined you can't lose your honor job. there is no accountability, right? >> i guess that would depend the brush back you are looking at. >> what would the accountability be. >> there has been a number of political threats saying your political career is over you can't run for office again. things of that nature.
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electors will take that into account when they vote. they also will consider the future of the country, not just their own personal self-interests. >> but isn't the country supposed to be governorred by its population? i mean there are hundreds of millions of people in the country. they had the opportunity to vote. every adult over 18 had an opportunity to vote. more than 100 million of them did. they have made their preference clear per of the rules and you're saying i don't care what they did. go ahead. >> i was going to say let me make sure you heard rite should be governed by the population. we wouldn't have electoral college we would have national popular vote. >> electoral college reflects of course the results in the states. it's not pure democracy but it still representing the desire of 128 million people. not 538 or in your case one. here's my last question to you. you describe yourself and i'm think quoting as a moral
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elector. you're suggesting that people who are voting for trump in the electoral college two weeks from now are immoral? >>. no i'm saying i'm taking a conscious decision to consider who i'm voting for. i don't think donald trump meets the test to be qualified to be president. >> why frame it in moral terms? >> what other terms would you prefer? >> i don't know. political terms? preference? i mean, i like this guy. i don't like that guy. instead you are bringing it to a moral level. making a moral choice. implication is others aren't. i'm saying why even frame it that way? i mean, it prescription the conversation to a different and much more heated level when you say i'm making the moral choice, which is what you're saying. >> well, i am making a moral choice. i am choosing to examine his examinations. there are probably other people may be doing the same thing and coming to a different conclusion. that's fine. would he say that i we have electoral college to cast these votes. >> what do you think would happen to the country, to the social fabric and disability stability of the
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country if the election were taken away from trump in the electoral college. >> that's a great question. my answer is the electoral college is part of the constitution it falls under the rule of law. so if mr. trump gets 270 electoral votes he will be president. if he doesn't and no one gets. it will go to the -- the rule of law will exist. for mere to vote against mr. trump or for someone else is a legal vote. but to suggest insurrection as a. >> of course i'm not suggesting insurrection. i'm merely saying if you tell mee people in the end it's not a democracy and a small group of unelected people like you get to make the choice. they're going to freak out. i'm just noting that if that's the way it works. christopher, thank you for joining us. >> thank you for having me on. have a great day. >> iowa is the third stop of president-elect trump's thank you tour. peter doocy is on the scene. is he everywhere tonight in the packed arena. peter, what's requesting on? >on -- going on.
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>> we were here this summer in the same exact room when the now president-elect donald trump and the now vice president elect mike pence came to des moines trying to win the state that four years earlier had gone to president obama. they did win iowa. they did win the election and about an hour from right now they're going to come back to say thank you. they're going to be joined by this state's governor terry branstad before he leaves des moines for china if the senate confirms him he is set to be the next u.s. ambassador to china. and on the way here, the president-elect stopped off in columbus, ohio, on the campus of ohio state university where he met for about 40 minutes, we're told, with some of the victims of that recent stabbing spree as well as some of the first responders who stepped in to help them and he spoke very briefly about what he heard on his way to the airport. >> these were really brave people, amazing people. the police and first
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responders were incredible. the job done in particular by one young gentleman was incredible. i got to meet him. and he was very brave. >> there in columbus, the president-elect actually landed and then later took off from john glenn international airport and he also spoke very briefly about the long-time senator and legendary astronaut. >> of course senator john glenn today, the passing of -- to me, he was a great american hero. truly great american hero. i met him on two separate occasions liked him. always liked him. but he was indeed an american hero. >> earlier this evening we also got official word that andy puzder is the president-elect's pick to head up the labor department. puzder became well known he last few years outspoken advocate against raising the minimum wage as the ceo of the company that carl's jr.
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and hardyees. expanded again. retired four star general james stopped boy months after he was vetted as a running mate for hillary clinton. on his way out he said the conversation went well. another visitor this morning being considered as a possible secretary of state was the former ford and boeing ceo allen tha malaly. ford and company he used to run is now the target of the recent president-elect. tucker? >> peter duesy, as always on the scene reporting the news. thanks a lot, peter. two members of congress are locked in a battle on twitter over something that happened on this show. wisconsin congressman sean duffy said this while talking about the recount effort in wisconsin. listen. >> we only have one county that's hand count the votes. that's deign county home of
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madison, progressive liberal communist county of madison. they are taking as long as they can. >> well, congressman mark pocan is a democrat who represents deign county, madison, he tweeted this in response. quote: demanding an apology from congressman sean duffy for calling madison communist. a place that doesn't believe in democracy and freedom on fox news. duffy fired back with this quote, the pc crowd is humanerless by those offended by communist comment i will accepted a therapy dog to your safe place of choice in madison. the feud continues here now congressman mark pocan. thanks for joining us. >> sure. glad to be here, tucker. >> it's pretty funny you have got to admit the therapy dog thing. why were you offended by what congressman duffy said. >> what's even funnier the people in madison have so much humor in madison sending dog by twitter hey i want one of these. taking it in a pretty good spirited manner. wisconsin we have been unique among the states. our delegates, democrats and
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republicans have always worked very well together. we are a medium sized state. one of my best friend in congress reid rebel represents freon bay a republican. what i don't want to see happen when i visit high school this summer and the first campaign ugly campaign. i don't want people to think it's okay to insult cities and people and that's how you get elected to higher office. it should been treating people with respect. sean was wrong. 47 counties are actually doing hand counts. 13 more partial hand counts somehow he decided attacking madison was politically useful and i think sean should be big enough to just say hey, i made a mistake, let's move on. you know, i guess news is slow and we're talking about this. >> i don't know. i agree with a lot of what you just said. wisconsin is a great state and madison is a cool town i think. it is kind of funny. at its core you are offended because he called the town communist. i want to take seriously for a second there are communists and meet in
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madison. i looked up what they believe. kind of interesting to learn here is -- standing up for the american worker, for the american people, coming together for a fair, national environment in terms of labor. here are their goals. affordable housing for all. public works to help the unemployment. unemployment for those seeking work. nationalization of industries banking and automotive. reliable mass transit and sustainable environmental policy. are you against any of those. >> tucker, so you know more about the madison communist party than i do and i have been there since 1928. 175 total votes under 300,000 cast went for the candidate who represents the communist party. i don't know if that makes us a communist county when 300,000 people went a different direction. we deliver the third or fourth largest amount of republican votes in the state of wisconsin. >> i know. what about those -- i mean leaving the titles the same. that's the communist party wisconsin's platform. do you disagree with any of it? >> i don't even know if there is a communist party in wisconsin. again maybe they have a website. i know a lot of 13-year-olds
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who have websites. the reality is wisconsin is the economic engine for the state and last decade 73% of new jobs have come from madison. i don't know if that's exactly the way i look at communists. i always think of that as state-run businesses and stuff. we have a vibrant private sector. we have a lot of republicans, independents and democrats. i don't know if it does any good to trash the second largest city in your state so you can make an incorrect point like he did about one county hand counting when there are 37 others. >> what i'm trying to get to is -- i think you could argue the most popular personal figure in the democratic party this year was bernie sanders who is a socialist. self-described democratic socialist. what does that mean, exactly? what -- how is that different from a liberal democrat and how is that different from a communist as described here? >> wisconsin, uniquely, probably the most popular republican in wisconsin is fighting bob la falit. we are generally very nice.
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people to our neighbors and friends kind hearted. i don't want to see the new normal becoming you trash people or you trash groups of people because it worked during the campaign. >> but, hold on, no, no. i agree with you. and i -- okay. but i'm just asking, dig down a little bit, saw that as an epitaph as insult to madison, why? what was offensive? >> he said we were undemocratic in doing the recount. i can tell you, tucker, in one county in my district if i can tucker, the number of votes cast was a different number than the total number of votes that were added up by among all the candidates. showed more votes than actual ballots cast. that's why we do recounts. in madison they are working 14 hours a day to get the recount done. >> that's all great nrgets end this isn't like a huge issue other than he decided it was a reason to attack the second largest city in the state. >> i get it. stop the speech for really quick. is it an epitaph to call
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someone a communist? let's get right to it? is that a bad word to you. >> i think when you call a town a communist when 375 people voted for that it's silly border line stupid. given the reputation we have in wisconsin, we don't want to start going down that line. i mean it's fine maybe in other parts of the country. >> it's stupid but not absolutely bad to be communist. just incorrect description of madison? >> i think the fact that we're having this entire conversation, tucker is a little bit silly. better people in madison are spawngedding what kind of therapy dog they want. i think that's the real conspirator of madisonened a we are the role economic in the state. sean should know better. i think he does know better. >> i'm not here to defend you. i'm just saying ideas matter. clearly people's ideas about how to run government are changing dramatically. i'm trying to get a sense of where the new normal is. >> there is not a communist upswell. what i hope the new normal
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is we get back to where we treat people with respect. you can disagree without being disagreeable. that's the wisconsin way. and i just want sean to be a part of the wisconsin. >> i still don't know why calling someone a communist is disrespectful according to you. >> saying we are undemocratic simply because we are doing a recount and he said we are the only one when there is 47s counties. he was wrong and decided to attack. this doesn't, you know, make a lot of sense. and i think the fact that instead of saying yeah, i'm wrong. he said we will get you a therapy dog. so i love the fact that everyone is sending pictures of what kind of therapy dog they want. >> you should get a dog. i appreciate your coming on and explaining that thank you for joining us. >> absolutely, thank you, tucker. now it's time for twitter storm or nightly forecast of social media's most powerful weather pattern. tonight, film maker michael moore is trapped in a thick cloud of denial over donald trump's impending presidency. so what does a man like moore do? call for chaos, of course. here's what he tweeted. we're quoting.
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disrupt the inauguration. the majority have spoken. by northeasterly 2.7 million votes and counting, silence is not an option. but it never is, i guess. moore's call for disruption did not sit well with some of his fellow twitter users. almost jing go wrote this if had you an ounce of honor you would add peaceful. what do you care you live in a giant mansion. project 102 tweeted this california and new york do not run this country. the founders brilliance saves us again. and finally sarah set quote, um, yeah, that's not how it works. next time pick a more authentic candidate. that's tonight's twitter storm. and what's next for the republican party? what can the g.o.p. learn from donald trump's win? my next guest has five very specific lessons that are fascinating. please stay tuned for that donald trump's thank you tour continues tonight in des moines, iowa. waiting for the president-elect to take the stage in just minutes and of course we'll be there live.
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president-elect donald trump will speak in ghoip, iowa in just a minute. you will see it here live on fox. what's next for republican? donald trump's election was a complete surprise to everybody, of course. but it was especially surprising to the republican leadership here in washington. the question is have they learned anything from it? daniel greenfield the front page magazine is here to help. he wrote a very smart piece entitled five lessons for republicans from trump's win and he joins us now. this is one of the most interesting pieces i have read in a long time. i want to put them up on the screen and ask you about them. these are the lessons, you think. find your natural base. here is the first sentence.
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the g.o.p. is ashamed of its base. it doesn't like being associated with the very voters who made 2016 happen. its autopsy last time around search for ways to leave the white working class mind. i guess three sentences but right on target, i think. why didn't they figure that out? >> >> because they didn't want to figure it out. they were out of touch with a lot of their base. very desperately trying to be more liberal and appeal to people who hate republicans who happen to be their friends. that turns out it doesn't work. it's a dead end. actually try to appeal to people who like you who actually might agree with you. >> but if you don't like your own voters, how you can represent them? >> >> they're doing a very bad job with representing republicans. that's one of the things that the trump's election has been a wake-up call on them. you actually have to connect with your base. you have to find your base. and you have to stop worrying about whether or not liberal will like you. liberals will note like you. if you actually lock back, the more moderate republican
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presidential candidates, mccain and romney had far more trouble than republican candidates like president george w. bush and ronald reagan. and, of course, trump who democrats and rabidly hated. >> yeah, that's true. number two, media and celebrities don't matter. first sentence. the first rule of republican politics is to look in the mirror and ask are we trying to be democrats? so you think the instinct among the republican leadership to say how can we imitate the other party? >> there has been a sense that we need to duplicate the successes of the democrats. we need to duplicate what they've done and in many cases we actually don't need to do that because we are dealing with very different bases with very different electorates. so, for example, trying to appeal to the media, trying to win over the people at "saturday night live," trying to win over bicoastal that doesn't work. we need to stop worrying
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about what celebrities think of us. we need to stop thinking of ourselves for competing for the very same urban that the democrats are voting for. we have a different base and different demographic. we need to play to our strengths instead of trying to play to our weaknesses. >> what if katy perry came out against you? i mean, you couldn't be elected president? >> yeah. it's absolutely hopeless. you have to care what the cast of hamilton thinks about you. >> that's a god point. and finally that's what we have time for, i would urge you were our audience to read your piece. money doesn't matter. what do krispy kreme, crump and cosco have in common they don't advertise. all of us thought money made the difference. the guy with the most money in the end wins. not true. >> the consultants get paid very well for the money. when it comes to actually connecting with voters, having a product that people are excited about, having a candidate that people are excited about easily beats just having a huge war chest of money that you expend on
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the same old people who go on to win the same old lixzs. >> that's one of the insights that people here just mocked as stupid but turned out to be. i can't state how much i enjoyed the piece. >> thank you so much for having me on. >> did vladimir putin throw this election for trump? that's becoming an article of faith on the left. of course he did. there is no other possible explanation. even the leading democrat on the house intelligence committee believes that happened. we talked to him on the show last night and the fallout continues next. yeah, so mom's got this cold.
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well, we're stating for donald trump to begin speaking tonight in des moines, iowa. part of his thank you tour. as he tours the country, democrats are still trying to figure out exactly what happened last month. how did we get here in the most obvious explanation is agents of the vladimir putin regime stole the election. even ranking democrats on the house intelligence committee believe that including the ranking democrat his name is congressman adam schiff and we talked to him last night. >> let me just ask you one final question. you can look right into the camera and say i know for a fact that the government of vladimir putin was behind the hacks of john podesta's email. >> absolutely. the government of vladimir putin was behind the hacks of our institution. >> of john podesta's email. >> not only in the united states but also in europe. >> you know what? you're dodging. lock and say i know they did john podesta's email they hacked us. >> and i think that ronald reagan would be rolling over. >> ronald reagan. >> you are carrying water
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for the kremlin. >> i'm not carrying water. look, you are a sitting member of congress on the intel committee and you can't say they hacked -- >> -- you're going to have to move your show to rt russian television. >> you know what? that's just so beneath your office because it is so dumb and you are being do you police tis. i'm asking you did they hack podesta's email. >> when you launch insults like that. >> you said i was carrying water for putin, that's pretty hilarious. >> you know, when you essentially are an apologist for the kremlin. >> one last time, congressman, look in the camera and say they hacked john podesta's emails we know vladimir putin's government did that we know you can't. you are hiding behind weasel words. >> i can't. >> say they hacked john podesta's emails. >> >> you know they can't do it. done, won. >> break this all down democratic strategist julia. it's great to sigh. >> it's so good to see. >> you here is the assessment from the director of national intelligence. this is from august 7th
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about these rarous hacks not just body's email but including it he said. this the hacks are consistent with the methods and motives of russian directed efforts: i believe that. that's very different from saying we know for a fact that putin's government hacked john podesta's emails. my only point to the congressman was when you sit on the house intelligence committee you ought to be precise about what you know and what you don't know. and democrats are trying to explain the election results by saying the government of putin did this, my point is they don't know that and they shouldn't claim they do. >> there is two things here, right? one thing is you allege that democrats are making the excuse that donald trump won because vladimir putin hacked into emails. i'm a democrat. i don't think that's why he won. secondly from that though, it seems to me from both sides of the aisle, including the chairman of the republican chairman of the house homeland security committee senator lindsey graham, all of them believe, including democrats and republicans in a bipartisan manner that the russian government, with the direction potentially of
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vladimir putin but some level of the russian government happened to hack into our emails. and to the fact that they did interfere in our election which is why both sides of the aisle are urging both this administration and incoming administration to do something to punish them. and that's very separate from whether they actually affected the outcome of this election. i don't think donald trump won because john podesta's email was hacked. i do believe, based on what our own government has said and both sides of the aisle have said, we're privy to the intelligence that in fact the russians did have something to do with hacking into these emails. and to the dnc office of john podesta. >> this is why this is disenginous on the part of. >> you tell me. >> we have seen series of hacks into all kinds of government institutions including the state department and the pentagon and the personal email of the cia director, the white house. there is almost no institution in washington that hasn't been hacked, probably in some cases by the russians. also the chinese. yet, you haven't seen any kind of response like this. we have sat passively by as
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for example a lot of our key trade secrets have been stolen by the chinese military and people accept it as the status quo. now, when there is a suggestion that it helped hillary lose, people freak out when they said basically nothing before. >> all right. well, tucker, i can't speak for the entire democratic party because i'm not the party spokesperson i will speak for myself and as a liberal. when mitt romney said in 2012 that the russians were the largest geopolitical threat to the country i said amen. i said i agree. i think vladimir putin and the government that he runs is a geopolitical threat and not just to us but with every enemy that we have. whether it's syria or iran or i could go on and on with what he is doing interfering with europe is a geopolitical threat to us. mitt romney was 100 percent right. and so if the chinese are hacking or if the russians are hacking, we need to retaliate. we cannot sit idlely by. if this is what spurs us to finally do, this that's great. i wish we would have done it earlier. i don't think the russians
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were -- go ahead. >> okay. as someone who watched the iraq war foment and then begin on the basis of bad intelligence, pardon me for my skepticism when i ask precisely of the ranking member of the house intelligence committee do you have proof? do you know this before we put retaliate, can you prove it? he calls me an agent of vladimir putin for asking the question. >> tucker, i watched this. >> i have seen this movie before. >> i watched that entire segment he did look into the cam rand said you knee vladimir putin did it. >> i beg your pardon. look at the tape he did not say that he said hacked into our american institutions i asked him on the air and off i said do you have evidence that he hacked into john podesta's emails that was the pivotal question in this election. no. don't allege it or imply it because there are big stakes here. >> tucker with all due respect you have to admit that if evidence all points tore it and you did is a spoke gun you can deduce from certain intelligence. we are not accusing him of -- oh my god, god defend
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he would never doing like this. >> you are saying we should quote retaliation and i'm just saying having seen this again and again and again, other agendas at work pushing us toward retaliation, maybe we have an right or obligation to say what do you know? you be quieted you are a putin. >> we have had great conversations. >> i didn't say that. >> i don't think you are an agent of russian television. i will say this. [ laughter ] >> i don't even watch rt. >> i have never ratcheted rt. i heard they are interesting. let's put it that way. but i will say this. vladimir putin is not a good agent here. and if you're saying that you don't think because there is no smoking gun that they hacked into us, then what you are basically saying is that you will not trust any intelligence whatsoever with respect to anything. that means that you have no trust in our institution, tucker. if that's the case, then nothing. >> i don't know. when you can predict the fall of the soviet union accurately, when you can tell me whether iraq has
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weapons of mass destruction in large quantities, that builds trust. >> okay. >> when you fail i have questions. that's all i'm saying. >> that's fine. have you people like mike mccullough who says republican of the homeland security committee. people like lindsey graham republican senator no means in the tank for the democratic party. if all of them agree there is a great likelihood very probable likelihood that the russians hacked in and you are saying i need a smoking gun, you are never going to have vladimir putin go on tv like usama bin laden used to with a newspaper saying today i hacked into the dnc. >> as the father of a 19-year-old son it's going to take more than that. >> i don't think we should go to war with rushing shah. we have ways to retaliate without your son or mine going to iraq. >> thanks. >> general john. one of the most military
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experts in washington here next. plus president-elect trump just landed in iowa. when he speaks we will go to stay tuned. mething better than warfarin, i'll go for that too. eliquis. eliquis reduced the risk of stroke better than warfarin, plus had less major bleeding than warfarin. eliquis had both. don't stop taking eliquis unless your doctor tells you to, as stopping increases your risk of having a stroke. eliquis can cause serious and in rare cases fatal bleeding. don't take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. while taking eliquis, you may bruise more easily... and it may take longer than usual for any bleeding to stop. seek immediate medical care for sudden signs of bleeding, like unusual bruising. eliquis may increase your bleeding risk if you take tell your doctor about all planned medical
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or dental procedures. i'm still going for my best. and for eliquis. ask your doctor about eliquis. marie knows that a any occasion feel more special. so she makes her pie crust from scratch. and sprinkles on brown sugar streusel.
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>> waiting for donald trump to spike at the end of the her as part of his thank you tour. there is still lots to talk about. who will be secretary of state for example. that list appears to be growing as the days go on. one plom meant name on that list is retired general david petraeus. is he indisputably talented and wildly considered a hero. some say is he unfit for the job two. kind of people in washington those who pretend to know more than they do and those who know a lot more than they will ever tell. our guest right now is in the latter camp retired colonel bill cowen. great to sigh tonight. >> nice to be with you, tucker, thanks for inviting me. >> what i'm trying to assess the character of anyone for military role i always call you first. in our conversation you essentially said you think petraeus is a very occasional man but probably not the right pick for what reason? >> well, first off, i
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respect and admire him. i know his career pretty well. i have met him a couple times. he doesn't know me but i recall meeting him. i was in mosul right after the invasion when he had the 101st airborne division up there. he really did a wonderful job everywhere he went. he is certainly qualified to be the secretary of defense. but, tucker. he gave classified information away. highly classified information away to somebody who wasn't supposed to have it, who didn't have a need to know. that included the names of covert operatives. it included sources and methods of intelligence operations that were being run and he did it for the number one trick in the spy book and that is sex. he got sex for what he did and because of that reason. not that i think he would do it again but because of that reason, tucker, it's a slap in the face for the hundreds of thousands of men and women who have access to top secret intelligence and never give it out to anybody. >> so i mean, colonel, i think a lot of people in washington without the knowledge that you have
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assumed maybe that he was being set up or there was something else going on behind the scenes and the information that he passed on to paula broadwell was actually not that significant. you're saying it was significant? >> i think it was. you know, to the point that he had one of his aids there make sure whatever she wrote didn't include any of that highly sensitive information but in his own floating of guilty, for a misdemeanor charges he ended up getting, he testified in there that they gave out the names of covert officers and of the kinds of intelligence operations that were being run which would mean sources and methods. paula broadwell we know she wasn't a soviet spy. we don't know what she did with all of that information. i wouldn't mean to imply she did the wrong thing with it other than help her write this book. all of that doesn't matter. what matters is we all sign an agreement when we go into these keep classified programs, highly classified programs. we sign an agreement with the government actually to never disclose any of that information to an unauthorized person. and the vast majority, 99.99% of the men and women who have access to that
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information don't disclose it, tucker. general petraeus, for all of his good qualities and traits he did. here's what i think and i have a loft admiration for president-elect trump and the people is he putting around him. the president doesn't come from that national security background. and i dare say there is not a chance he would have nominated somebody who had the financial irregularities in his past or continued to violate building code, you know, regulations and rules and regulations. he wouldn't take somebody like that and put them in a high level position. so coming from the perspective that myself and others do, we see what david petraeus did as an egregious violation and on that basis alone, although he may not do it again, he shouldn't have an opportunity to take the job. >> colonel cowen, thanks a lot for that perspective. >> thank you, tucker. >> sad news tonight the first american to ever orbit the effort astronaut and u.s. senator john glenn has died at the age of 9 a. glen entered history when he orbited the earth. already a hero from the service of the pilot in
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world war ii and korea at one point he flew next to baseball legend ted williams. he entered politics representing ohio in the senate for 24 years. he also ran for president twice as a democrat. though glen was not done in 1988. nasa announced he was once again going into space. october 29th of that year he became the oldest space traveler ever he was 76. the mission was over he was given another hero's welcome his second ticker tape parade in knox. his career followed from beginning to end almost. >> he is one of the few legitimate american heros of our time. >> people say i'm at this age suppose to be a couch potato. the thing to do is to go out and fill full your dream and ambitions at whatever age. >> john glenn, astronaut, fighter pilot, senator, dead at 95. president obama says he knows what's to blame for the rise of isis. we'll tell you who is to blame. it's not him by the way. just so you know.
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plus, the president-elect is getting ready to step up to the microphone in iowa. we'll take you there the second he does. don't go away.re ♪ straight years, and it's still recommended today. use as directed the market.redict but through good times and bad... ...at t. rowe price... ...we've helped our investors stay confident for over 75 years. call us or your advisor. t. rowe price. invest with confidence.
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>> time now for the warm and fuzzy part of the show. the friend zone. we invite friend on the set to be nice to them. tonight we are joined why jillian turner. fox news contributor and associate at jones group international. she works at the white house and national security council under both george w. bush and president obama. and speaking of the current president still in office. he now has a new explanation for the rise of isis, the intel community let him down, he says. listen. >> the rise of the islamic state surprised you. it took you and the administration by surprise? >> the ability of isil to
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initiate major land offenses that was not on my intelligence radar screen. >> so, the right answer is yes, i was taken by surprise. he has to shift blame to the intel community. i have to say not the first president who was mad at the intelligence community distrustful of cia or unhappy with the reports he has received. i mean that is a theme you see. >> yeah. it's also a two-way street. you know, there's the report that came out of the republican leadership in the congress earlier this year. they investigated and found that junior folks over at centcom's intelligence arm were getting pressured by their seniors to be optimistic in their delivery when it came to the war on isis and how we were doing. the point there being that it takes a whole lot of trust and a whole lot of working together on both sides there in order to make that intelligence relationship work. it's not as simple as a product being delivered and it's 100 percent right or
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wrong. intelligence delivery to a president is more of a dialogue. >> there are so many layers though beneath the president from which this stuff bubbles up. you'll never get down and find out where it came from. really you can't. how do you trust it? and this is going to a question for president trump when he takes office. how do you get that these briefings are right driving, et cetera? >> you have to as the commander-in-chief and the president, you have to really be an advocate for -- this is what my personal take on this. you have got to be an advocate for diversity of opinions. you can't try and stove pipe this stuff. you have got to really encourage people who disagree with you. you have got tone courage and i don't mean in political discussions. >> of course. >> you have got to encourage the junior analyst with a lot of promise and experience in the field to come forward and really tell what you they're thinking. i think that's something a lot of presidents don't really take on. >> i mean, you say diversity of opinions. if you didn't go to harvard you should be quiet, don't you think? >> well, obviously. >> did you go to harvard? >> no.
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i went to columbia. >> columbia. how -- i always wondered since you are here, how did you wind up going from bush to obama and what were the differences? >> the reason i went seem alsoly from one to the next is because i was not a political appointee. i worked at the national security council which was 70 to 30. >> there you are 2006. >> oh my god 2006. yet, i look 25 years younger. i don't know what's going on. because i was not a political appointee, the obama transition folks. there's my brother and my dad, asked me to stay on when they came on board. so, i switched from one administration to the next. it was a very strange, surreal experience working through that transition was one of the more confusing things i have ever been through in my life. >> did you notice a distinct difference in management style and priority? >> oh, in everything. in management style, in priorities. because of the new policies, right, entire offices at the national security council
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virtually disappeared overnight. for example, the iraq affairs office that we had because president bush was running a ground war in iraq which ended somewhat abruptly under president obama's tenure at the same time he also decided to surge with 30,000 more american troops in afghanistan. so that policy office greatly expanded. there was a lot of sort of things on the ground inside the white house that changed virtually overnight. had you to kind of get your mind around that. >> so basically ideology drives policy from day one you're saying? >> i don't know -- if you call that ideology. for president obama, you know, ending the iraq war and bringing the soldiers home was something he campaigned on. so, it was more of a you can call it ideology. you can call it a policy priority. but i think that those kinds of decisions have very real consequences for the way the president's staffed his white house. that's something you really feel when you have worked on in two administrations especially going from one party to the other.
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>> two so far and we will leave it there. jillian turner thanks for joining us. >> thank you, tucker. >> donald trump going on stage in des moines. you will see it here live when he does. we'll be right back. the north and the south are mine. all seems beautiful to me. and i finally found our big idaho potato truck. it's been touring the country telling folks about our heart healthy idaho potatoes, america's favorite potatoes, and donating to local charities along the way. but now it's finally back home where it belongs.
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and now today in pomposity we can do every night but we try to restrict it to one night. what's the most palm pus thing have you ever heard? politics is a noble profession that might ma i have been ironic. obama saying no foreign planned terror attack since he has been in office. false. heather wrote this: that
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would be bad. tomorrow choose your onus is back. tweet us a story. trump coming up now but first to bill o'reilly. stay tuned. >> "the o'reilly factor" is on, tonight: >> the script to what we're doing is not yet ready remember, this has been a great, great movement. the likes of which they have never seen before. >> president-elect trump continuing his victory tour. he is in iowa tonight. we are there live. >> this man is already accused in a fatal hit and run in louisville. he was allegedly deported from the u.s.a. eight times. >> another disgraceful illegal crime story. two more innocent americans dead. we'll have details. >> political power used to bring pressure upon a privately held corporation that has a fiduciary duty to ma

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